Wolfwalkers Deireadh (ENDGAME)

[Delta]

A) the timing of the kill when delta subbed in is so incredibly WIFOMy and at this point I wanna say fuck it, I don’t even want to go that route today because I think mafia is baiting us
B) the numbers don’t make sense with 3 mafia and a 3p. Especially if stick’s role is what she says it is. What even is that kind of role called? I’ve never heard of it
C) [VOTE: Stick] aubergine

man I saw the kill and was like 'ah I'm just here to entertain at this point ;O;'

[Delta]

@MartinGG99

why'd you switch off Stick when she claimed 3p?

[robyn]

out your person, @Stick

@Delta what are your reads as of right now?

[VOTE: wigly] aubergine

[Delta]

out your person, @Stick

@Delta what are your reads as of right now?

[VOTE: wigly] aubergine

I think Porscha could be a wolf & if so, Wilgy could be as well for how he reacted to me EOD?. I do believe his SOD though & said I'd reread him if LC flipped v which happened so eh

I think Stick has to be 3p looking at numbers and the situation we're in

Outside of that I am v curious about Martin's EOD and Scotty in general since I didn't see much of him yesterday, same w Baker

[robyn]

out your person, @Stick

@Delta what are your reads as of right now?

[VOTE: wigly] aubergine

I think Porscha could be a wolf & if so, Wilgy could be as well for how he reacted to me EOD?. I do believe his SOD though & said I'd reread him if LC flipped v which happened so eh

I think Stick has to be 3p looking at numbers and the situation we're in

Outside of that I am v curious about Martin's EOD and Scotty in general since I didn't see much of him yesterday, same w Baker

ignore porscha today or i’ll chop you myself. 3 days 3 ml’s means some of the top posters are scum. especially if there are 3 fucking wolves

solve inside the active players

fmpov wigly is basically lockscum

[Delta]

out your person, @Stick

@Delta what are your reads as of right now?

[VOTE: wigly] aubergine

I think Porscha could be a wolf & if so, Wilgy could be as well for how he reacted to me EOD?. I do believe his SOD though & said I'd reread him if LC flipped v which happened so eh

I think Stick has to be 3p looking at numbers and the situation we're in

Outside of that I am v curious about Martin's EOD and Scotty in general since I didn't see much of him yesterday, same w Baker

ignore porscha today or i’ll chop you myself. 3 days 3 ml’s means some of the top posters are scum. especially if there are 3 fucking wolves

solve inside the active players

fmpov wigly is basically lockscum

Can get you on that, run me through your thought process though? I'll read through it in the morning \o/

[robyn]

out your person, @Stick

@Delta what are your reads as of right now?

[VOTE: wigly] aubergine

I think Porscha could be a wolf & if so, Wilgy could be as well for how he reacted to me EOD?. I do believe his SOD though & said I'd reread him if LC flipped v which happened so eh

I think Stick has to be 3p looking at numbers and the situation we're in

Outside of that I am v curious about Martin's EOD and Scotty in general since I didn't see much of him yesterday, same w Baker

ignore porscha today or i’ll chop you myself. 3 days 3 ml’s means some of the top posters are scum. especially if there are 3 fucking wolves

solve inside the active players

fmpov wigly is basically lockscum

Can get you on that, run me through your thought process though? I'll read through it in the morning \o/

i plan to

also what’s your read on me

[baker]

[VOTE: Stick] aubergine

please dont hammer too quick

[robyn]

[VOTE: Stick] aubergine

please dont hammer too quick

no hammers this game, stick is third party

[baker]

we are not skipping with a 3p claim, this should be better

[baker]

[VOTE: Stick] aubergine

please dont hammer too quick

no hammers this game, stick is third party

i support the wigly push since they have been pretty bad with their votes but we are not letting another day go without a non-town chop

[robyn]

i believe that stick is third party and that if we chop her the game is lost

there is also mechanically 3 mafia alive

3/5 or
3/4/1

parity and well, stick has been playing like a third party and i believe her claim. she hasn’t bothered to solve or even look towny.

and if it is 3/4/1 and we chop stick it’s a loss

[robyn]

i would not chop stick here, and if she is 3p the chop is a loss on the spot

[baker]

i believe that stick is third party and that if we chop her the game is lost

there is also mechanically 3 mafia alive

3/5 or
3/4/1

parity and well, stick has been playing like a third party and i believe her claim. she hasn’t bothered to solve or even look towny.

and if it is 3/4/1 and we chop stick it’s a loss

these are good enough reasons to vote out stick. if they were truly townsiding they would have done more earlier. this narrative of stick being tied to a townplayer makes no sense in a 12 player game, we are killing stick today because they would have outed the name if they had any towny motives

[baker]

12p

3v9 only makes sense if we had less vanillas but apparently we have a lot of them

and you are telling me we are 3v1v8? that would be a real bad design

[robyn]

12p

3v9 only makes sense if we had less vanillas but apparently we have a lot of them

and you are telling me we are 3v1v8? that would be a real bad design

i'm as pissed as you are, i don’t think i’m gonna play many more syndicate games in the near future. but yes they can be that unbalanced

by play and attitude i genuinely read stick as third party, it is probably 3/1/8 which is gross

but i cannot in good conscience chop stick today when she will townside today

[baker]

also lack of night kills could mean:

mafia hit night immune = this means we are dealing with a far more dangerous role if a 3p exists
or
mafia has arsonist/poisones and will get 2-3kp tonight
or maybe
it could be a lost wolf carrying out the nk and its not factional, that also explains MR death after two nights of no NK


skip could work but honestly we should just chop stick and hope for a 3v2 tomorrow at worst. we could tinfoil the setup whole day too idm but i dont think we lose here as long as dont chop town

[robyn]

also lack of night kills could mean:

mafia hit night immune = this means we are dealing with a far more dangerous role if a 3p exists
or
mafia has arsonist/poisones and will get 2-3kp tonight
or maybe
it could be a lost wolf carrying out the nk and its not factional, that also explains MR death after two nights of no NK


skip could work but honestly we should just chop stick and hope for a 3v2 tomorrow at worst. we could tinfoil the setup whole day too idm but i dont think we lose here as long as dont chop town

chopping stick is probably losing, do not do that.

[MartinGG99]

It is now D4. This is effectively a LyLo phase, town must lynch correctly to continue. While there is in theory a sequence of events that would allow the game to continue with a no lynch, it is very unlikely.

I'm taking this as MYLO-but-effectively-LYLO, which implies that we kinda have to not vote Stick

because if we assume we vote out the 3p and mafia NKs a town, next day phase that leaves us with 3 town vs 3 mafia in which case they just win

there's a hypothetical that Stick is lying about 3p and is mafia, but i doubt that is the case given the underlined wording as well as Falcon's flip:

One night, you have the ability to determine if one player is a Puritan or not.

[MartinGG99]

there's a hypothetical that Stick is lying about 3p and is mafia, but i doubt that is the case given the underlined wording as well as Falcon's flip:

hypothetical namely being a mafia role that would be powerful enough to do an extra kill

[MartinGG99]

B) the numbers don’t make sense with 3 mafia and a 3p. Especially if stick’s role is what she says it is. What even is that kind of role called? I’ve never heard of it

I could see it being supported as sort of a counter-balance to the lord protector's cop ability

kinda like a town miller except they don't know they're effectively town, just gotta protect this one person who is town

Chance I'm wrong but speaking as a host with several game's worth of experience (both good games and bad games hosted) I can see it

[MartinGG99]

@MartinGG99

why'd you switch off Stick when she claimed 3p?

I was bored at the time with a stale state of solving and so my prerogative was to make things interesting

things that people would react to and we could possibly solve/advance things off of

which that did end up happening, though I just didn't anticipate the night-kill along with LYLO

also LC just had to go at some point

[MartinGG99]

I like how people are demanding the 3p to out whoever they're meant to townside with.

As if that's something the town (instead of the wolves) ought to be concerned about.

If the 3p has to wolf-side then its very likely that we've already lost here unless Stick doesn't know they have to (or even are) wolf-side(ing).

[MartinGG99]

i believe that stick is third party and that if we chop her the game is lost

there is also mechanically 3 mafia alive

3/5 or
3/4/1

parity and well, stick has been playing like a third party and i believe her claim. she hasn’t bothered to solve or even look towny.

and if it is 3/4/1 and we chop stick it’s a loss

these are good enough reasons to vote out stick. if they were truly townsiding they would have done more earlier. this narrative of stick being tied to a townplayer makes no sense in a 12 player game, we are killing stick today because they would have outed the name if they had any towny motives

if Stick has a wolf-side objective then the game becomes 4v4

except that would cause a tie and ties since Lord Protector's death cause a no-lynch

consider the fact that the host said that was unlikely @baker

[MartinGG99]

I'm exaggerating with the reasoning a bit. A wolf-siding Stick doesn't know the whole wolf team nor can wolves talk with stick.

But that's a very easy fix. Wolves out themselves and force tie. They NK, and next day wolf votes equal town votes and they can do whatever they want unless Stick is not wolf-siding.

[MartinGG99]

I also have a decent suspicion as to who Stick has to protect and I'm fairly sure whoever they're protecting is town.

So like I'm never voting Stick here. That's GG if you guys are right and we have to vote out Stick (alongside the wolves) to win, which I don't think is the case.

[MartinGG99]

So like I'm never voting Stick here. That's GG if you guys are right and we have to vote out Stick (alongside the wolves) to win, which I don't think is the case.

Well, GG in the sense that if the town doesn't consolidate.

To which I am saying I am not consolidating on Stick.

[robyn]

So like I'm never voting Stick here. That's GG if you guys are right and we have to vote out Stick (alongside the wolves) to win, which I don't think is the case.

Well, GG in the sense that if the town doesn't consolidate.

To which I am saying I am not consolidating on Stick.

thanks for towntelling

what’s ur wigly read

[MartinGG99]

So like I'm never voting Stick here. That's GG if you guys are right and we have to vote out Stick (alongside the wolves) to win, which I don't think is the case.

Well, GG in the sense that if the town doesn't consolidate.

To which I am saying I am not consolidating on Stick.

thanks for towntelling

what’s ur wigly read

I'd hate to consolidate that guy. He's had me fooled a fair bit if he's mafia, only thing I could really poke at him for is that his entrance today was like my attitude last day phase. Which gives him credit for replicating that preety well, but I do slightly fear he can replicate it out of pity rather than actually feeling it as town.

Frankly I'm a bit sus of you for prodding Stick about who they're protecting, and that I haven't really read you since d1, so it doesn't help that you're voting Wilgy lol.

[MartinGG99]

GTH would be something like

robyn, delta, porscha

but those two last ones I've not reviewed in depth since the replacements and I could see myself swapping out for Baker if he is stubborn about Stick -- I kinda expected him to know better

maaaaaybe scotty as well, but almost certainly not with baker as off the top of my head a wolf team with Baker and Scotty would've had some really good theater in order to exist

[robyn]

So like I'm never voting Stick here. That's GG if you guys are right and we have to vote out Stick (alongside the wolves) to win, which I don't think is the case.

Well, GG in the sense that if the town doesn't consolidate.

To which I am saying I am not consolidating on Stick.

thanks for towntelling

what’s ur wigly read

I'd hate to consolidate that guy. He's had me fooled a fair bit if he's mafia, only thing I could really poke at him for is that his entrance today was like my attitude last day phase. Which gives him credit for replicating that preety well, but I do slightly fear he can replicate it out of pity rather than actually feeling it as town.

Frankly I'm a bit sus of you for prodding Stick about who they're protecting, and that I haven't really read you since d1, so it doesn't help that you're voting Wilgy lol.

because if it is 3/8/1 and they are supposed to protect that person, that person is almost always town

[robyn]

besides MR suspected wigly, and you suspected him last cycle? what changed

[MartinGG99]

then, like, why can't they just out that when they become a majority wagon? or when they think it'll soon be past the point of no return? we'll know that either someone's wrong in their reading or is being a wolf if they're voting a plausible town from that fact

idealistically I'd like to think the latter

if we just reveal now everyone will avoid it like the plauge and we won't get any further information from it, assuming anyone even pushes the to-be-protected person

[robyn]

then, like, why can't they just out that when they become a majority wagon? or when they think it'll soon be past the point of no return? we'll know that either someone's wrong in their reading or is being a wolf if they're voting a plausible town from that fact

idealistically I'd like to think the latter

if we just reveal now everyone will avoid it like the plauge and we won't get any further information from it, assuming anyone even pushes the to-be-protected person

what's the point? this day won't be active at all and i'd like stick to out it immediately. otherwise as baker mentioned they aren't townsiding. i'm gonna assume baker/you/stick/stick's +1 are all town and voila

scotty/wigly/delta is probably the team in that case because i don't think delta is stick's +1 or they'd be more active to chainsaw the delta chop

[MartinGG99]

besides MR suspected wigly, and you suspected him last cycle? what changed

I never suspected DrWilgy?

like

d1 a bit of suspicion but wrote it off as nit-picky or whatever
d2 overall town
d3 preety likely town
d4 spooky entrance (don't ask me what spooky specifically means I don't care to define it) but otherwise town

if I were to vote DrWilgy it'd be because there's a level of likelihood that a town is dead-set voting there in which case I'm obligated via LYLO to hail-marry with them and hope he's somehow mafia and fooling us all

I do recall maybe talking about DrWilgy a bit d3, but I'm guessing I may have misspoke or mis-wrote what I typed rather than actually suspecting him.

...come to think of it didn't MR say to hedge on me and to look at me closer today? If you're weighing his opinions shouldn't you be suspecting me a bit here or something or was what I said earlier so obviously town resulting in you dismissing that suspicion?

[robyn]

besides MR suspected wigly, and you suspected him last cycle? what changed

I never suspected DrWilgy?

like

d1 a bit of suspicion but wrote it off as nit-picky or whatever
d2 overall town
d3 preety likely town
d4 spooky entrance (don't ask me what spooky specifically means I don't care to define it) but otherwise town

if I were to vote DrWilgy it'd be because there's a level of likelihood that a town is dead-set voting there in which case I'm obligated via LYLO to hail-marry with them and hope he's somehow mafia and fooling us all

I do recall maybe talking about DrWilgy a bit d3, but I'm guessing I may have misspoke or mis-wrote what I typed rather than actually suspecting him.

...come to think of it didn't MR say to hedge on me and to look at me closer today? If you're weighing his opinions shouldn't you be suspecting me a bit here or something or was what I said earlier so obviously town resulting in you dismissing that suspicion?

i think i have you confused for someone else, probably delta, your post didn't say anything ai about him

also yes MR did say that, but i think you're town atm, and your posts surrounding not chopping stick and giving the exact reasons i had with the extension that baker should know better included

i also don't like that you're suspecting me in lylo. but i also think that you were giving gth reasoning and that you didn't particularly solve much yesterday because you understandably lacked information

[robyn]

mmmmmm fuck

[MartinGG99]

then, like, why can't they just out that when they become a majority wagon? or when they think it'll soon be past the point of no return? we'll know that either someone's wrong in their reading or is being a wolf if they're voting a plausible town from that fact

idealistically I'd like to think the latter

if we just reveal now everyone will avoid it like the plauge and we won't get any further information from it, assuming anyone even pushes the to-be-protected person

what's the point? this day won't be active at all and i'd like stick to out it immediately. otherwise as baker mentioned they aren't townsiding. i'm gonna assume baker/you/stick/stick's +1 are all town and voila

scotty/wigly/delta is probably the team in that case because i don't think delta is stick's +1 or they'd be more active to chainsaw the delta chop

Eh, I think it'll be active.

You're posting.

Scottys still posting like he usually does.

DrWilgy 1-posted but I suspect he'll come back if his behavior and investment d2 and d3 is anything to judge.

Delta made 40-ish posts last day phase. They may very well make the same.

Baker I can imagine probably not being as present, but dude promised he would be more active after new years or something I think.

I'm here. I might not be eternally here but I'm preety sure I'll be dedicating at least 8 hours (actively, not just passively reading the thread while away) to this day phase, more if I think I need it to land a correct vote and definitely consistently across the whole day phase.

Porscha could maybe be part of activity concerns.

Stick's probably going to have some activity? Idk. Its a 3p with a protection goal, so they might not have as much incentive to be active. But judging from past day phases I would assume they're going to be reasonably active.

[MartinGG99]

granted I suppose we could be having completely different standards of activity come to think of it

[robyn]

sorry i haven't eaten and i'm being really poor with my words, activity isn't what i meant. i meant more like the game won't progress as much as it normally would until stick outs the pseudo-clear. then we'll get to know if stick is townsiding or wolfsiding, so on so forth

i also realize that i'm only solving in 3/1/8 worlds and i forget my own reasoning why

i'll post after i've eaten

[MartinGG99]

i'm gonna assume baker/you/stick/stick's +1 are all town and voila

you know what actually re-reading this that doesn't sound too bad ngl

[MartinGG99]

there's two ways to solve and it didn't occur to me earlier

just find 4 towns

or just find 3 mafia

and asking for the reveal earlier can be preety useful for the first case, maybe a bit for the second, but I would idealistically think revealing it later helps with both better

[MartinGG99]

just find 4 towns

well, including yourself ofc

[MartinGG99]

yeah I think that's how I should solve the game

try both ways and if I don't arrive to a conclusion find out where I'm having problems and then focus on those people

[robyn]

but I would idealistically think revealing it later helps with both better

idealistically it helps if outed earlier imo

[Scotty]

I also have a decent suspicion as to who Stick has to protect and I'm fairly sure whoever they're protecting is town.

So like I'm never voting Stick here. That's GG if you guys are right and we have to vote out Stick (alongside the wolves) to win, which I don't think is the case.

I feel like there’s a bit of confbiasing, because in the scenario where stick is wolf…they just name someone not on their team and call it a baked apple pie.

So I see Martin and Robyn defending stick here. Interesting.

Wilgy is playing the ‘I got nothing’ card.

Delta is someone I’m just going to listen to today
Hahahahahahaha I hate this game

[Scotty]

then, like, why can't they just out that when they become a majority wagon? or when they think it'll soon be past the point of no return? we'll know that either someone's wrong in their reading or is being a wolf if they're voting a plausible town from that fact

idealistically I'd like to think the latter

if we just reveal now everyone will avoid it like the plauge and we won't get any further information from it, assuming anyone even pushes the to-be-protected person

Realistically, if we think stick is who she says she is and her partner is town, wouldn’t outing that person help narrow the POE?

[Scotty]

then, like, why can't they just out that when they become a majority wagon? or when they think it'll soon be past the point of no return? we'll know that either someone's wrong in their reading or is being a wolf if they're voting a plausible town from that fact

idealistically I'd like to think the latter

if we just reveal now everyone will avoid it like the plauge and we won't get any further information from it, assuming anyone even pushes the to-be-protected person

what's the point? this day won't be active at all and i'd like stick to out it immediately. otherwise as baker mentioned they aren't townsiding. i'm gonna assume baker/you/stick/stick's +1 are all town and voila

scotty/wigly/delta is probably the team in that case because i don't think delta is stick's +1 or they'd be more active to chainsaw the delta chop

Wow your scum team is….wow

Your takes are flat out opposite of mine today and I feel like that’s a bad sign

[Scotty]

I am unmoved in thinking stick is lying about her alignment. The whole thing reeks of a gambit trying to save her own ass at end of day yesterday and now that we’re in lylo, she has some cheerleaders to help her along.

This isn’t to say I think Martin and Robyn are her partners but like

[Scotty]

Someone either walk me back from the edge on this or push me off