Game of Champions- Merged Thread [GAME OVER- SERIAL KILLER WINS]

[Epignosis]

Sloonei

Spoiler: show

What the hell are you looking in here for?

[Epignosis]

TonyStarkPrime

Spoiler: show

You know, this is like your refrigerator, where you keep opening it expecting to see something new in there.

[Epignosis]

WindwardAway

Weekend laze tis real and hit hard. I wanted nothing but study and sleep and cats and muvis tbh.

Hi ho.

Caught up to page 7 in the last hour. Gonna find another hour, later, to read the rest.

@Ricochet i know it's been a while since you last popped in, but when you catch up, I'd like to hear your take on the current wagons.

I'm curious what your thought process is, and tbh I keep forgetting you're in the game because I haven't seen anyone from West Facility mention having a read on you.

You ain't just whistling Dixie, brother.

So I'll work my way from the wagons to others, within my capability.

Wagons

Overall, I'd favor a falcon lynch over a Lemon or Monroe one. Grouping bias is a factor, cuz I've played and judged falcon down in West, whereas I know less on why the other two are wolfread or didn't catch all the details from others' cases.

Between Lemon and Monroe, I'd place Monroe within question marks, both in regards to why they've become a D3 wagon and what they've done in response.

So, falcon > Monroe > Lemon

falcon

West - pyxxy connection: none that could have been established, because they interacted with / mentioned each other a total of zero times
West D1-D2 judgement: ended D2 with a low opinion on him and down on my would-vote list; excluding pyxxy connections I considered (Porscha, Delta), he was the lowest ranked de facto. West gameplay resembled current gameplay: brief intervals of engagement, much of which was spent prodding others (with a degree of randomness, never focused) or reactive-toned defending when voted/wagoned
D3 judgement:
-- pretty much the same, tone and grasp of play have not improved.
-- noted him hitting back in rebuttal form at most of his wagoners (Sloonei's characterisations, calling MRadishes opportunistic, bark back at nutella), plus placing three others (leetic, sig, Abigail) within wolf pairings with no reasoning. so pretty much a kind of "you're all bad" howl.
-- parked defense into two main ideas: that the Western nightkills are a frame and that he is towning like mad and we fail to see it. Former boils down to wifom, as leetic also said; latter is not something I can agree with, based on what I've judged. I've read or remember no strong meta read from others on this gameplay, as it stands, being town!falcon indicative
-- meanwhile, withheld to offer townreads (apart from not wanting to vote LC and Epignosis).
-- of his votes, Abigail and Monroe were/are without discernible cause. Monroe isn't even the counterwagon to self-pres on, at the moment

Monroe
D3 judgement: only 3 posts, of which their essence is an aggro response and vote on Epignosis (for their vote / case on them); other reads (Delta ping, wouldn't wagon Lemon) all vague. It doesn't look great, of course, to drop and omgus upon the very first interaction with a player from the other group. But also not the deepest material to make a solid case out of. Hence the question mark status.

Lemon
D3 judgement: I'd structure 3 phases, thus far, of activity.
-- first phase (posts 1-3) in which she mentioned postponing activity and also a statement on the merger being a sensible disorienting moment. I think some wagoned her starting for as little as this and, without proper context if this would classify as a pattern from wolf!lemon (that I can remember), I felt it was undeserved.
-- second phase (pre legacy post), with a first wave of rebuttals (at nutella and Windward). something about wanting to sit more on it. at worst, could display nerviness in face of pressure.
-- third phase (the legacy post): quite a shift from small bites to extensive reads. rebuttal-wise, argues more than the cases on her are not solid or convincing, then also tiers the wagoners based on individual performance. if this alone (or more of this throughout D3), without suss pressure, would have been Lemon's activity, I'd probably read it well. given suss and wagon pressure, I am missing meta info on whether Lemon would as to go steroids, from feeble to opinionated, as wolf. also, a bit funny to have labeled it as "legacy", as if the lynch is a done deal.

tldr: falcon suss (with no prevailing meta info that he towns this way), Monroe who knows (startled by bad form, but tis all so far), lemon no real ping on her elaborate reply

Falcon hasn't shared any townreads?
@falcon45ca is this true?

And actually, the way Lemon said she expires D3/D4 made it sound more like she might die from a mechanical effect and not just because she might get lunched. I could be reading into it too much, though, and I know she can't confirm or deny it.

This interaction is a bit strange. There's a lot in here, but WindwardAway focuses on the one bit about falcon not saying who is good (even though falcon named me and LC).

As for the second bit, LemonFairy is still alive and it's Day 5. Everyone can put that speculation to rest.

Eh.

why are there two people with supposedly the same post restriction? sig and ricochet
could be one of them faking it, i guess

I don't necessarily believe there's a faker- a role copier is something I've implemented in the past.

Even still, this is an unnecessary post to make if Ricochet and WindwardAway are teammates. It doesn't go anywhere regardless.

I feel like cape isn't solving with the intent to root out the other mafia team, and not to win the game for town. I think it's very likely his confidence in his reads comes from knowing who he's not teamed with.
And I don't remember him mentioning Ricochet much before suddenly putting them in townreads? I'll try to check again but my flight is boarding soon.
I'm going to move my vote just in case I don't make it back again before eod.

[VOTE: Cape90] aubergine

I'd call teammate compatibility there but low.

[Epignosis]

Well that was fun.

[Epignosis]

Gambler's Fallacy Alert:

Scrappy Doo was good.

Davos must be bad.

[Long Con]

If Davos is bad, then Dyslexicon is bad, because Dyslexicon controls Davos.

[Lemonfairy]

So I'll work my way from the wagons to others, within my capability.

Wagons

Overall, I'd favor a falcon lynch over a Lemon or Monroe one. Grouping bias is a factor, cuz I've played and judged falcon down in West, whereas I know less on why the other two are wolfread or didn't catch all the details from others' cases.

Between Lemon and Monroe, I'd place Monroe within question marks, both in regards to why they've become a D3 wagon and what they've done in response.

So, falcon > Monroe > Lemon

falcon

West - pyxxy connection: none that could have been established, because they interacted with / mentioned each other a total of zero times
West D1-D2 judgement: ended D2 with a low opinion on him and down on my would-vote list; excluding pyxxy connections I considered (Porscha, Delta), he was the lowest ranked de facto. West gameplay resembled current gameplay: brief intervals of engagement, much of which was spent prodding others (with a degree of randomness, never focused) or reactive-toned defending when voted/wagoned
D3 judgement:
-- pretty much the same, tone and grasp of play have not improved.
-- noted him hitting back in rebuttal form at most of his wagoners (Sloonei's characterisations, calling MRadishes opportunistic, bark back at nutella), plus placing three others (leetic, sig, Abigail) within wolf pairings with no reasoning. so pretty much a kind of "you're all bad" howl.
-- parked defense into two main ideas: that the Western nightkills are a frame and that he is towning like mad and we fail to see it. Former boils down to wifom, as leetic also said; latter is not something I can agree with, based on what I've judged. I've read or remember no strong meta read from others on this gameplay, as it stands, being town!falcon indicative
-- meanwhile, withheld to offer townreads (apart from not wanting to vote LC and Epignosis).
-- of his votes, Abigail and Monroe were/are without discernible cause. Monroe isn't even the counterwagon to self-pres on, at the moment

Monroe
D3 judgement: only 3 posts, of which their essence is an aggro response and vote on Epignosis (for their vote / case on them); other reads (Delta ping, wouldn't wagon Lemon) all vague. It doesn't look great, of course, to drop and omgus upon the very first interaction with a player from the other group. But also not the deepest material to make a solid case out of. Hence the question mark status.

Lemon
D3 judgement: I'd structure 3 phases, thus far, of activity.
-- first phase (posts 1-3) in which she mentioned postponing activity and also a statement on the merger being a sensible disorienting moment. I think some wagoned her starting for as little as this and, without proper context if this would classify as a pattern from wolf!lemon (that I can remember), I felt it was undeserved.
-- second phase (pre legacy post), with a first wave of rebuttals (at nutella and Windward). something about wanting to sit more on it. at worst, could display nerviness in face of pressure.
-- third phase (the legacy post): quite a shift from small bites to extensive reads. rebuttal-wise, argues more than the cases on her are not solid or convincing, then also tiers the wagoners based on individual performance. if this alone (or more of this throughout D3), without suss pressure, would have been Lemon's activity, I'd probably read it well. given suss and wagon pressure, I am missing meta info on whether Lemon would as to go steroids, from feeble to opinionated, as wolf. also, a bit funny to have labeled it as "legacy", as if the lynch is a done deal.

tldr: falcon suss (with no prevailing meta info that he towns this way), Monroe who knows (startled by bad form, but tis all so far), lemon no real ping on her elaborate reply

Ricochet wanted falcon over me/Monroe.
At this point, falcon's partners probably committed to a bus already so I'd look back to people who started pushing falcon around this time.
Monroe's probably not partnered with Ricochet/falcon.

TBH Ricochet's take on me was better than most of the thread's.

Anyway, dumping the first batch.

Wagoners*

* given the VC at the time of submitting this
NB: not sure the poll reflects the vote chronology as well, but I'll just roll with the names as they appear

falcon

Monroe
-- seems to have parked on falcon just now, despite all their posts being bark back at Epignosis. I suppose it counts as self-pres?
-- just to add to their read, minus point for their recent post aimed at Epignosis, tone still aggro defensive and not the most respectable wording towards Epignosis, either

sig
pyxxy connection: labelled it as unlikely
much of what I've noted down from sig's activity is in fact case-making on falcon, arguments being that falcon is within wolf range and that the Western night kills could show pattern of clean-up in his aid. also admits mindmeld with leetic on the night kills angle. seems fine

Master Radishes
-- for someone from East, therefore info-less on falcon, vote drop was sudden, without hint of inquiry or reading into others' takes and a bit of "nuh-uh" retort to falcon calling it opportunistic (even prodding him to vote back). not ideal elements. later more elaborate, dismissing falcon's "exasperation" as outweighed by poor tone, something I do meld with.
-- had a good impression of him otherwise - active in developing reads and opinionated on enough players and events - but this on its own is a mixed bag

Windward
-- noted her more of a Lemon wagoner for much of D3; falcon switch comes down to disliking falcon's "opportunism" rebuttal at Radishes, it seems. bit cheeky to word it as "happy to join the opportunistic train". later camps reactive attitude, in principle, towards mafia lean. again, had more interest in others, but I can see how the view on falcon might have soured in time and treat the gameplay as wolf-likely
-- activity-wise, I'd rate Windward towny. ample material, not gonna develop full read at this time.

Long Con
pyxxy connection: labelled him sussworthy
-- it is accurate that LC has suss on falcon throughout West period
-- it is also accurate that his waffle on falcon came from trusting Abigail's tone/meta read, true both during West time and during D3 here
-- as far as coming back on falcon wagon, late on seems to make a read - not agreeing with his towning claim, finding his counter-suspicions omgusey. think it's adequate
-- didn't note down any pings from LC today tbh, though overall I find him a bit puzzling. his D3 is probably the better-looking phase of his activity thus far, engaged and opinionated more on the topics, but at times I also he's tagteaming others (much "starting to see this" responses), quite the buddy dynamic with Epignosis, lighthearted banter and focused replies in equal measures. ech, probably wouldn't focus on deciphering this for now

leetic
pyxxy connection: labeled him unlikely
-- pretty much wagons falcon for the nightkill angle; dismisses falcon's defense on that as wifom; don't recall him tackling any other point about falcon
-- really conflicted about leetic overall: was my topwolf pick and vote D1, the aggro-tone was prevalent; Abigail (in West) and Dizzy (in here) mentioned that this is normal leetic; then D2 he shifts into a Pyxxy Scientist (ISO'ing interactions), drop most of the prod and poke tone, a solving attitude I shared and in turned like;
-- now? I'm seeing way less of D2. announced ISOs from West D2, did not deliver; had to defend a bit re: gifting a player who flipped wolf, don't know if that's a topic of suss. informed the merged group of his Pyxxy Science findings, that's fair. couple more reads (Nanook for instance), no definitive wording. still, really slowed down performance. puzzling.

DrWilgy
-- seems to base and bank his falcon vote on lack of townspewing alone. I'd label this a tad narrowing
-- no developed read on his activity atm. word that came to mind, upon quick scroll, was "scrambled". perhaps within expectations.

This is a lot. I'll just mirror the headings.
Monroe
- "parked on falcon" - negative connotation
- aggro defensive also negative
- probs not aligned?

sig
- notes scumread on falcon
- says sig "seems fine"
- I'd lean unaligned here too because of lack of detail

Master Radishes
- vote on falcon "sudden" and "info-less" - negative connotation
- "mixed bag" - doesn't commit on a read
- could be aligned?

Windward
- noted that Wind was on me - is that negative? just scrolled up and noticed that Ricochet didn't drop a read on me although the commentary was mostly positive/neutral
- says Wind is wolf-likely but then calls her towny and doesn't make a read
- could be aligned?

Long Con
- previous suspicion on falcon, says current read on falcon is "adequate"
- says LC is "opinionate" but also "tag-teaming" and doesn't make a read
- idk could be aligned?

leetic
- what's the nightkill angle? idk
- history of scumreading leetic
- mostly negative, wolfy things but doesn't give a read and ends with "puzzling"
- could be aligned - probs the most aligned so far

DrWilgy
- what does narrowing mean? it sounds more negative than not
- no read
- idk

I feel like this entire exercise has been a waste of time
ik I said leetic is most likely aligned but that's not taking into account that the East facility probs has more of Ricochet's partners
there's also the people that weren't mentioned

[Epignosis]

If Davos is bad, then Dyslexicon is bad, because Dyslexicon controls Davos.

Yeah, I know your reasoning there.

[Lemonfairy]

LemonFairy is still alive and it's Day 5

I have passed my expiry date and I'm no longer safe to consume

[Epignosis]

LemonFairy is still alive and it's Day 5

I have passed my expiry date and I'm no longer safe to consume

I will not squeeze you and put you in my cocktail, that's for sure.

[Lemonfairy]

If Davos is bad, then Dyslexicon is bad, because Dyslexicon controls Davos.

I think Davos is a bad nut

if Dizzy controls Davos, then why is Davos still here when Dizzy has been NK'd?

[Epignosis]

I'll let LC answer that.

[Lemonfairy]

All the recent votes irk me to degree.

Radishes dropped off falcon for, what, giving him breathing space?
Sloonei is full sheeping (on Epig yet again).

Sloonei's probs not aligned
idk about Radishes (also probs not aligned but to a lesser degree than Sloonei)

these unaligned reads feel kind of unreliable though

[Long Con]

I'll let LC answer that.

LOL um, never mind then, please carry on.

[Lemonfairy]

As for Monroe, I was gonna ask what the Lime connections might be, but nutella just covered it.

nutella, what are you seeing in just four bitter posts?

squinty squint at nutella (just a little)

I have to close in an hour. Will try to finish a scan of the Darling wagoners.

Lemon wagoners probably not worth pursuing. And, in just two lines, there's nothing good looking left in there. I recall no serious push(es) from Nanook - just an instavote on sabi, due to lingering post-wolfflip, and then a tag vote right after Dizzy back and forth. Davos doesn't sound like making any trustworthy contribution all game and just plants votes. I trusted Scrappy more in West, I'd come back to whether Davos can be trusted, but not this phase, I suppose.

what does this mean? like the people on my wagon are OK and don't need to be pursued?
but then Ricochet says there's "nothing good looking left in there"??

Davos is probably not controlled by Ricochet's teammates?
there's a little shade but no solid conclusion

Epignosis wrt Delta pauses me a lot toDay.

He was chief detective on case-making Delta D2 wrt pyxxy interactions (lifelining him intermittently and starting what proved pyxxy's counterwagon chance). The thing about too many townreads was also a point.

Then the Delta wagon fizzled through.

And now Epignosis comes into the merge with just that one point about the townreads.

this looks unaligned for Epignosis

good thing about Ricochet's posts is that unlike falcon, who probably knew they were going to die, Ricochet was probs not expecting to be NK'd so there's no extra WIFOM to think about

I'm le tired.

I didn't even process Delta toDay.
Only note I had was that they noted Davos's drive-by vote on Lemon. No input.

Delta was my main pyxxy teammate profile, though. In that regard, I melded with Epig's D2 case. Signs of lifelining pyxxy into playing better and creating a cushion for a feasible counterwagon, till it proved too late. Could be.

Davos pretty unaligned too

--
I'm not about to decipher these smileys
if someone else wants to, pls be my guest

[TonyStarkPrime]

oh not only was porscha in my thread but apparently I voted for her

[TonyStarkPrime]

did I want to? that doesn't seem right

[nutella]

As far as I could tell Rico gave almost everyone most of the same emojis in the falcon analysis lol. He wanted to keep his options open I guess. I salute those delving into interactions but I'm not gonna get anything out of it

[nutella]

I don't really know where I want to next though, maybe just nanook or something. I'm losing steam I gotta get nightkilled by this point smh

[Sloonei]

How did Epi treat Rico?

Spoiler: show

The serious answer is "The people analyzing pyxxy for clues."

leetic, Ricochet, me, and...

I'm sorry I've forgotten the drummer's name.

I vote that Ricochet be permanently smiley cursed henceforth.

nutella, why is Sloonei not mafia?

His posts.


Lots of genuine perspective and progression fmpov.

Is Rico wrong or mafia then?

He didn't. But that's par for the course, it appears.

[WindwardAway]

also i get no cred bc i never said anything but i totally had a feeling cape was behind scrappy

somehow didn't expect the 3p flip but it makes sense in retrospect that he was basically actually solving at the end ah well

Ohhhh, is that what it was? I thought scrappy just dug a hole with a vig in it that killed them lol

Also, interesting kills last night

[WindwardAway]

I'm thinking DM/Wilgy/Nanook as my top SRs

DM/Nanook on one team
Wilgy on the other

only there's a wrench here because DM and Nanook have just been sitting on my wagon for the last 2 days and I don't think partners would do that
it'd be too obvious

Isn't that like, all the remaining lowposters from East Facility? Lol

[WindwardAway]

Anyway, did it have to be Ricochet?

It had to be Ricochet.

That's going to be a bitch to get through.

Time to go through their last substantial posts before the emoji-posting started, lol
There might be something worthwhile in their wallpost, because off the top of my head I don't remember them interacting much except during catch-ups.

[WindwardAway]

If Davos is bad, then Dyslexicon is bad, because Dyslexicon controls Davos.

I don't believe Dizzy controlled Davos, or Davos would've died when dizzy did

[TonyStarkPrime]

Ok. I’m taking everyone from my half as cleared until future notice. Everyone else should do the same. I am not claiming this as a deontological rule of “trying to solve games” but look if the thread gets split (as it was) you don’t put six wolves in one half and two in the other. I’m not claiming it’s 4 and 4 or anything but at this point the probability is too significant.

[WindwardAway]

My sleep schedule is probably fucked for the next few days, oh well
I wanna check something before placing my vote

[TonyStarkPrime]

I don’t remember who was on my side besides LC and Eli and leetic and sloonei but at least three of those are capable of solving the game if they want so it’s in their hands now good night

[WindwardAway]

Ok. I’m taking everyone from my half as cleared until future notice. Everyone else should do the same. I am not claiming this as a deontological rule of “trying to solve games” but look if the thread gets split (as it was) you don’t put six wolves in one half and two in the other. I’m not claiming it’s 4 and 4 or anything but at this point the probability is too significant.

Yeah I gotta agree with this, it would be a bit disproportionate to have so many mafia in West unless most of East was 3ps or something lol. And I doubt that.

[Sloonei]

Back on the [VOTE: DarlingMonroe] aubergine train, I guess.

[WindwardAway]

I still think this is mafia

[VOTE: Nanook] aubergine

[WindwardAway]

I still think this is mafia

[VOTE: Nanook] aubergine

I went through his (very short) ISO and I think it's entirely plausible he's paired with Rico, because he mentions once that he has Rico in his PoE and then never does anything about it. Like there are a lot of names there that Nook doesn't do much about. He did say he would tunnel Dizzy and he voted there, but that vote never caught on, so it would make sense that his team would kill Dizzy because they couldn't mislunch him.

[WindwardAway]

I still think this is mafia

[VOTE: Nanook] aubergine

I went through his (very short) ISO and I think it's entirely plausible he's paired with Rico, because he mentions once that he has Rico in his PoE and then never does anything about it. Like there are a lot of names there that Nook doesn't do much about. He did say he would tunnel Dizzy and he voted there, but that vote never caught on, so it would make sense that his team would kill Dizzy because they couldn't mislunch him.

Did I write that coherently? I feel like I missed a sentence somewhere.
I meant to say that it's easy for Nook to hide a teammate name in his lumpen list of "these players are sus" without having to act on it.

[WindwardAway]

Back on the [VOTE: DarlingMonroe] aubergine train, I guess.

I rather liked how they put in some solving effort earlier, but it seemed like it was specifically once they were under a lot of pressure to do so, and then once the pressure was off, they ramped down their engagement again. I think they're also a reasonable wagon today.

[Master Radishes]

I think there's a chance Nanook is town but it's for stupid raisins.

[Master Radishes]

[VOTE: sig] aubergine

I know this breaks the 'East Facility' voting rule but shrug.

[nutella]

I think there's a chance Nanook is town but it's for stupid raisins.

Which are?

[Master Radishes]

N3 was clearly Arbiter kill on Abi (a Landlord). Sabi was never a MK and so was something else.

N4 was probably a Landlord kill on Rico (an Arbiter). I don't get why a town vig kills Rico. So Dizzy was someone else, probably a townie with a personal tinfoil on Dizzy. Off the top of my head if I think of who might make that kill...

[Master Radishes]

Tbh a lot of consensus PoE slots have been correct. We should probably kill Lemon or maybe DM if we're thinking Easterners.

[WindwardAway]

I think there's a chance Nanook is town but it's for stupid raisins.

I have reason to believe otherwise

[WindwardAway]

N3 was clearly Arbiter kill on Abi (a Landlord). Sabi was never a MK and so was something else.

N4 was probably a Landlord kill on Rico (an Arbiter). I don't get why a town vig kills Rico. So Dizzy was someone else, probably a townie with a personal tinfoil on Dizzy. Off the top of my head if I think of who might make that kill...

But we've had so many double kill nights. You think we have an unlimited town vig? And in addition to that, if Abbi and Rico were both mafia team kills, that the town vig never hit anyone who wasn't town?

[WindwardAway]

In the East thread, we had a double kill on N1, then when our threads joined here we've had double kills on N3 and N4. The only time I don't think any of us saw a double kill was on N2.

What gets me is that the West thread didn't seem to have the double night kills. I would've written it off as both mafia teams killing each night, maybe one in each thread, or alternating, but that doesn't fit the pattern seen in East.

Why does MR jump to thinking it's a town vig, and not that it's both mafia teams, or if he logicked it out as I did with the east/west comparison, then why does he assume the town vig never hit mafia?

[Long Con]

Nah, the Mafia teams are alternating kills, one kills even, the other kills odd. That's what I say. The extra kills are something else.

[sig]

I can’t imagine mafia keeps hitting mafia. We’ve either got an ace vig out there or in this case dizzy had some sort of rebound when he was killed. (This was my first thought)

[sig]

I plan to dedicate some time today to the thread, I’ll barely be around tomorrow though.

I’m eyeing delta, first the case on them totally disappeared and I don’t recall seeing why, second them voting for me when I was emojied is a bit scummy.

[sig]

Also while I didn’t push Falcon I want some town credit for calling him mafia for awhile

[Scotty]

Question 2:




{CLAIMED}
Windwardaway has won a prize (Smalltown Circus/Solar System Mafia)

[WindwardAway]

Question 2:

I'm guessing that one of the answers is where the original song is sung, so...

A circus ring? @Scotty

[WindwardAway]

Question 2:

I'm guessing that one of the answers is where the original song is sung, so...

A circus ring? @Scotty

The corresponding game would be "Smalltown Circus"

[Scotty]

Question 2:

I'm guessing that one of the answers is where the original song is sung, so...

A circus ring? @Scotty

The corresponding game would be "Smalltown Circus"

DING DING DING
We have a winner! (I would’ve also accepted the on-the-nose Solar System Mafia)
Windwardaway has won a prize!

[WindwardAway]

Noice