Fallout New Vegas: A Post-Nuclear Mafia Game [LEGION CONQUEST]

[Jackofhearts2005]

Oh yeah I’m also vanilla town but everyone already knew that.

[Jackofhearts2005]

Trying to decide why wChelsea would be against confirming Manny town since not doing so means we sleep and she shoots Manny.

Nanny’s voting for her, though, so I guess I’m answering my own question.

[Jackofhearts2005]

Funnily enough, the "decide the tie" vote also means that if we DO get a tie and a wolf flips the game is mechanically on auto.

I'd advise against that strategy since that would require us to exactly same-wagon both wolves, with us losing in every other scenario.

Suppose I am the wolf or there is no second wolf.

Who is the one wolf between Chelsea and Lime?

No punting allowed.

[Jackofhearts2005]

Like the main reason I want to force sleep is so Manny dies because I think Dunn/Lan is a very easy and possible solve and right now we just lose to that because Manny is refusing to do anything but Thunderdome for the sake of his ego in that world.

Ego has little to do with why i want you dead, u just have the most chances of being a wolf from my POV

Lan is town

leaves me with Chelsea/Brad/Jack/Dunn

Brad imo can only be a wolf with you

Chelsea/Brad
Chelsea/Jack
Chelsea/Dunn
Dunn/Jack

thats 3 teams with you, two with jack and one with brad/dunn.

This doesn’t really matter cause I’m not voting myself or Dunn but why can Brad not be a wolf with me or Dunn?

[Jackofhearts2005]

Like the main reason I want to force sleep is so Manny dies because I think Dunn/Lan is a very easy and possible solve and right now we just lose to that because Manny is refusing to do anything but Thunderdome for the sake of his ego in that world.

Am I sold on that world? No, I've tried to reset my reads because I know my reads have been bad this game considering I had everyone here as a villager for most of the game minus Jack.

I'm not discrediting your reads on each other because obviously I get being in that world where you don't want to move cause you TR them but that's not gonna work for me. You need to explain to me more why I should be TRing you or voting Brad.

I guess this is a logical reason for town Chelsea to vote sleep, too.

[Jackofhearts2005]

This is gonna be another one of those Jack isos everyone and leads the town to a loss games, isn’t it?

[Jackofhearts2005]

Actually I just re-realized my reasoning to townread Chelsea.

Convince me.

[Jackofhearts2005]

Quite a decent amount of the deaths at night have been kinda unexpected though?

Like there's part that makes me second guess a few things but how far do I take those things?

Yeah. Wolves shooting poe LC and Mac to eliminate the 3P team instead of consensus townreads LAN and Dunn or basically mech confirmed Manny is…certainly a thing that happened.

[Jackofhearts2005]

Honestly, @LanMisa wtf does a Jack/Lime or a Jack/Chelsea team EVER make those nightkills?

[LanMisa]

Honestly, @LanMisa wtf does a Jack/Lime or a Jack/Chelsea team EVER make those nightkills?

As far as I can tell, every single player who died during the night phases had me as lock town or close to it - ignoring TSP who was clearly Mac's kill.

Why would I shoot myself in the foot by launching players like Scotty or Seanzie like that? Or Michelle/Abigail?

What good does it do me to end the Chelsea/Mac argument by killing Mac there? If I was a wolf it would be the easiest MYLO win of my life to just leave them fighting by killing, I don't know, Dunnstral or Manny. Watch town burn itself to the ground.

The night kills have been confusing and weird as heck all game; I guess that Scotty was a normal one and that Sean was copped, but the rest? I feel like wolves intentionally just tried to spread as much chaos around as they possibly could with no sense or reasoning apart from that.

Ergo, I don't think that the kills point to anyone, but they likewise don't point away FROM anyone, either.

But I guess you can tell me post-game why you guys killed them the way you did.

[Jackofhearts2005]

The kills are like the key fucking thing.

Wolf you loses nothing by making those kills. They aren’t making you more likely to be yeeted. 0% chance -> 0% chance.

Wolf Jack absolutely fucks himself making those kills unless I’m teamed with Dunn or you.

[LanMisa]

[VOTE: Sleep ] aubergine

I don't think that this is the way to go here, but...leaving votes lying around in a situation where Mafia controls ties mechanically is a dumb idea. Either we consolidate on someone or we sleep.

Apparently both my parents only got hit hard by the sickness on their third or fourth day which in my case would be tomorrow, so... in case I really get issues and need to skip a day/need someone to take over it feels unsound to keep voting here, even if I am 95% certain Jack's just solved by POE here.

[Jackofhearts2005]

Like those kills happened because

1) There is at least one wolf in Dunn/Manny/Lan. You (LanMisa) are utterly rejecting this possibility. Fine.

2) There are no wolves in that group and the wolves want the town to think there is for a misyeet ftw.

Since you must think we’re in world 2, you should be looking at players trying to shade Manny/Dunn/Lan. There’s Chelsea. Okay. But where is her partner pushing this agenda and where are there townies falling for it?

[LanMisa]

The kills are like the key fucking thing.

Wolf you loses nothing by making those kills. They aren’t making you more likely to be yeeted. 0% chance -> 0% chance.

Wolf Jack absolutely fucks himself making those kills unless I’m teamed with Dunn or you.

I'd think I'd be aware of the former...I have no idea what your point is with regards to that.

Also, why would these kills undermine your position? I don't think that anyone apart from Mac and Chelsea and TSP have talked about you lots the whole game yet. Honestly, the way you kept fading into the background of everyone's reads makes me feel like any kill would make sense from your direction: Everyone ignored you in a similar vein from what I could tell.

[Jackofhearts2005]

I don’t want to sleep cause I think Manny is more likely than average to vote a wolf in lylo

[LanMisa]

Like those kills happened because

1) There is at least one wolf in Dunn/Manny/Lan. You (LanMisa) are utterly rejecting this possibility. Fine.

2) There are no wolves in that group and the wolves want the town to think there is for a misyeet ftw.

Since you must think we’re in world 2, you should be looking at players trying to shade Manny/Dunn/Lan. There’s Chelsea. Okay. But where is her partner pushing this agenda and where are there townies falling for it?

You need to remember that Mafia had no way of knowing that their "easy" misyeet targets in TSP and Creature would go "poof" overnight. I assume Mafia thought that killing Mac would result in enough chaos to skate by another day and then go for either of the two to finish the game. My guess is that Mafia are potentially panicked and scrambling right now - despite town being smaller their road to victory just got a lot narrower.

So there's only two ways of breaking out: Expanding the circle of potential misyeets, or go into panic mode and do nothing/hope that the villager out of the remaining three non-towncore members dies

From the three of you, Lime seemed to be stuck in panic mode and not doing much, unless I misread him earlier. You and Chelsea seem to be doing the first, like with questioning all of Manny, Dunn and me.

Funny thing is, Chelsea felt truly frustrated earlier so of the three of you I townlean her more. You... seemed to be mostly skating by all game as far as I can tell. And now you start to become active?

[LanMisa]

I don’t want to sleep cause I think Manny is more likely than average to vote a wolf in lylo

In that case it falls to Manny to make a decision on whether to yeet or to sleep.

I laid out earlier why Sleeping puts me into an awkward position with this no majority no locked votes setup with a 3AM EOD but... it's a game, ultimately.

[Jackofhearts2005]

The kills are like the key fucking thing.

Wolf you loses nothing by making those kills. They aren’t making you more likely to be yeeted. 0% chance -> 0% chance.

Wolf Jack absolutely fucks himself making those kills unless I’m teamed with Dunn or you.

I'd think I'd be aware of the former...I have no idea what your point is with regards to that.

Also, why would these kills undermine your position? I don't think that anyone apart from Mac and Chelsea and TSP have talked about you lots the whole game yet. Honestly, the way you kept fading into the background of everyone's reads makes me feel like any kill would make sense from your direction: Everyone ignored you in a similar vein from what I could tell.

Because wolf Jack can more easily take control with a bigger poe.

Like let’s say you’re right and it’s me and Chelsea. Let’s say I wanna misyeet Lime. What if Manny or Dunn, who I have claimed to townread and who are basically lock town for most players, come out naysaying those yeets? I can’t push them and frame it as a wolf protecting their partner. Nobody is gonna just start a lucky wagon on those players. I have locked myself into a world where I have to misyeet Lime (who Chelsea lol refuses to vote for).

Like really? Wtf are wolf Jack and wolf Chelsea even trying to do here?

If we shot Dunn and Manny instead, we now have two additional “misyeet” options, LC and Mac. I don’t have to deal with widely townread people derailing my pushes and town is way tf more likely to just push incorrectly because the poe is like 2 wolves and 3 non wolves instead of 2 wolves and 1 townie.

[Jackofhearts2005]

I don’t want to sleep cause I think Manny is more likely than average to vote a wolf in lylo

In that case it falls to Manny to make a decision on whether to yeet or to sleep.

I laid out earlier why Sleeping puts me into an awkward position with this no majority no locked votes setup with a 3AM EOD but... it's a game, ultimately.

Have you considered amphetamines?

[LanMisa]

The kills are like the key fucking thing.

Wolf you loses nothing by making those kills. They aren’t making you more likely to be yeeted. 0% chance -> 0% chance.

Wolf Jack absolutely fucks himself making those kills unless I’m teamed with Dunn or you.

I'd think I'd be aware of the former...I have no idea what your point is with regards to that.

Also, why would these kills undermine your position? I don't think that anyone apart from Mac and Chelsea and TSP have talked about you lots the whole game yet. Honestly, the way you kept fading into the background of everyone's reads makes me feel like any kill would make sense from your direction: Everyone ignored you in a similar vein from what I could tell.

Because wolf Jack can more easily take control with a bigger poe.

Like let’s say you’re right and it’s me and Chelsea. Let’s say I wanna misyeet Lime. What if Manny or Dunn, who I have claimed to townread and who are basically lock town for most players, come out naysaying those yeets? I can’t push them and frame it as a wolf protecting their partner. Nobody is gonna just start a lucky wagon on those players. I have locked myself into a world where I have to misyeet Lime (who Chelsea lol refuses to vote for).

Like really? Wtf are wolf Jack and wolf Chelsea even trying to do here?

If we shot Dunn and Manny instead, we now have two additional “misyeet” options, LC and Mac. I don’t have to deal with widely townread people derailing my pushes and town is way tf more likely to just push incorrectly because the poe is like 2 wolves and 3 non wolves instead of 2 wolves and 1 townie.

You've been questioning me all game and Chelsea did her best to undermine me towards Manny earlier as well. C'mon, it's not rocket science what is going on here.

[Jackofhearts2005]

Like those kills happened because

1) There is at least one wolf in Dunn/Manny/Lan. You (LanMisa) are utterly rejecting this possibility. Fine.

2) There are no wolves in that group and the wolves want the town to think there is for a misyeet ftw.

Since you must think we’re in world 2, you should be looking at players trying to shade Manny/Dunn/Lan. There’s Chelsea. Okay. But where is her partner pushing this agenda and where are there townies falling for it?

You need to remember that Mafia had no way of knowing that their "easy" misyeet targets in TSP and Creature would go "poof" overnight. I assume Mafia thought that killing Mac would result in enough chaos to skate by another day and then go for either of the two to finish the game. My guess is that Mafia are potentially panicked and scrambling right now - despite town being smaller their road to victory just got a lot narrower.

So there's only two ways of breaking out: Expanding the circle of potential misyeets, or go into panic mode and do nothing/hope that the villager out of the remaining three non-towncore members dies

From the three of you, Lime seemed to be stuck in panic mode and not doing much, unless I misread him earlier. You and Chelsea seem to be doing the first, like with questioning all of Manny, Dunn and me.

Funny thing is, Chelsea felt truly frustrated earlier so of the three of you I townlean her more. You... seemed to be mostly skating by all game as far as I can tell. And now you start to become active?

Well I didn’t think of that cause I’m not a wolf.

[LanMisa]

I don’t want to sleep cause I think Manny is more likely than average to vote a wolf in lylo

In that case it falls to Manny to make a decision on whether to yeet or to sleep.

I laid out earlier why Sleeping puts me into an awkward position with this no majority no locked votes setup with a 3AM EOD but... it's a game, ultimately.

Have you considered amphetamines?

Yes, but then I also considered "living a healthy life"

Admittedly, I am currently failing on that front as well.

[Manny]

This doesn’t really matter cause I’m not voting myself or Dunn but why can Brad not be a wolf with me or Dunn?

i alr said it multiple times, i dont think v!chels missreads w!brad this badly therefore w!brad = w!chels for me

[LanMisa]

Like those kills happened because

1) There is at least one wolf in Dunn/Manny/Lan. You (LanMisa) are utterly rejecting this possibility. Fine.

2) There are no wolves in that group and the wolves want the town to think there is for a misyeet ftw.

Since you must think we’re in world 2, you should be looking at players trying to shade Manny/Dunn/Lan. There’s Chelsea. Okay. But where is her partner pushing this agenda and where are there townies falling for it?

You need to remember that Mafia had no way of knowing that their "easy" misyeet targets in TSP and Creature would go "poof" overnight. I assume Mafia thought that killing Mac would result in enough chaos to skate by another day and then go for either of the two to finish the game. My guess is that Mafia are potentially panicked and scrambling right now - despite town being smaller their road to victory just got a lot narrower.

So there's only two ways of breaking out: Expanding the circle of potential misyeets, or go into panic mode and do nothing/hope that the villager out of the remaining three non-towncore members dies

From the three of you, Lime seemed to be stuck in panic mode and not doing much, unless I misread him earlier. You and Chelsea seem to be doing the first, like with questioning all of Manny, Dunn and me.

Funny thing is, Chelsea felt truly frustrated earlier so of the three of you I townlean her more. You... seemed to be mostly skating by all game as far as I can tell. And now you start to become active?

Well I didn’t think of that cause I’m not a wolf.

Yeah, you didn't think about it since you didn't really care about whether your perspective makes sense or not.

I see a paragon of virtue here. Locktown, Jack. Whatever made me question that earlier?

[Jackofhearts2005]

Have you considered having a six year old who sneaks into your bed and knees you in the chin to wake you up at 3 am? That and drugs is how I do it.

[Manny]

if we sleep here and i die tonight, y'all are forbidden from voting Lan ftr.

[Jackofhearts2005]

I’m totes a paragon. Not necessarily of virtue…

[LanMisa]

if we sleep here and i die tonight, y'all are forbidden from voting Lan ftr.

You need at least four people to vote with you to force through a vote here, Manny, and even then it's risky since both Mafia could last second switch if one is bussing and at least one town votes wrongly. I'd love to end things here and now but I feel like it is unwise to go for it.

[Jackofhearts2005]

if we sleep here and i die tonight, y'all are forbidden from voting Lan ftr.

Get Lan to vote the wolf in Lime and Chelsea and I won’t vote him today either.

Like if Lan and I are both town, it’s always Brad/Chelsea anyway so….Ill let you know when I’m done with those isos.

[LanMisa]

Then again the same is true in an F5 and even more so, so... rock and a hard place I guess.

[LanMisa]

Anyways, it's 11PM and I need to get up in eight seven hours...and I feel like I should not make that any shorter than it already is, considering my physical state.

[LanMisa]

Eight-seven... well, wouldn't that be awesome?

It's seven hours.

[Jackofhearts2005]

Nks do just make more sense for wolf Chelsea than anybody else. Mac was pushing her. Iirc, LC was pushing her. She is pushing the “wolves in Manny/Dunn/Lan” narrative.

It’s really hard to see past that after laying it out.

[Jackofhearts2005]

But that would leave Manny and Dunn?

Would that make sense?

Well okay Lime is also pushing a wolf of wolves in there. Mac scumread him. I don’t remember if LC did.

[Jackofhearts2005]

Jack: If I were wolves with Chelsea or Lime, we’d be doing specific things we aren’t doing! >:-(

Camera zooms out to show Chelsea and Lime doing those things without me.

I am very good at mafia.

[Jackofhearts2005]

How the fuck was Manny claimed to be a PR and he's still alive?

[Jackofhearts2005]

If I had a random guess.

And this is based off of me just staring at the poll with the 5 names on the board not at all reading isos because fucking hell my brain is fried.

I'd go Lanmisa.

Lime not knowing how many players are left itg probably means something lol

[Jackofhearts2005]

Like also comes in vgunning for Lan and discards that read based off Scotty townreading Lan. Idk what to do with that.

I'm basically Chelsea's double voter until further notice.

Does town Brad ever misread wolf Chelsea this bad?

[Jackofhearts2005]

[VOTE: Manny ] aubergine

Scotty's catchup is fine, it's really against the grain almost to such a point that it feels deliberate in a bad way but to act on this would be way too much ego for Day 1 for me. So I'll disregard that for now and trust Lime's read on the matter.

Lanmisa
Lime
Michelle
-
Jack
Abi
-
Dunnstral
Manny

Falcon I just want to play more, it's the slot you probably want to vig shoot over exeing because there's just nothing in it. The can't make lylo player until they post well. . .any opinion. (Curious as I wasn't expecting Lime and Dunnstral to also be on here. Did Dunn's LHF clause only count for D1?)

I have Longcon as a villager because they're not wolf with Mac or Scotty and if both those slots are a villager with how high volume of their. . .confidence we're in trouble. (I think Scotty's wolf equality is pretty high though) Independent of that the convo with Lanmisa felt pretty good so yeah.

I think falcon is way more likely than not villa btw.
I still think Lan is an IC
Mac and Creature can still be town

I kinda wanna kill Chels but im too much of a coward to actually push that today so i'd settle for TSP or Epi ig.

If you think I'm a wolf you can push me don't back down just because we're pals.

What in Falcon or tony's iso makes them not rand to you and why is Mac town?

What in Falcon or tony's iso makes them not rand to you and why is Mac town?

Ill wait for Falcon to start postting to re-confirm my read or back off from it.
Mac just reminds me of me my semifinals champs game and he was V there.

It doesnt really have to do with us being pals and moreso that if im wrong and i actually get u killed is probably some degree of gamelosing and if you are actually a wolf i can /probably/ get around to it later.

A shame, and I was looking forward to seeing you try to construct a wolf read on me it would've been a fun read considering my own opinion on the matter.

As for Falcon, are you saying they are doing a wolfy pattern that you're trying to see continues or you want to be sure on the read before pushing it?

Someone tell me mac is town so I can not deal with reading him, tyty

Mac's reads are bad but I don't know if he's town or not. Go read Scotty and tell me if I'm crazy for wolfrading that slot ty.

Only read page 2 but this is what I got:
One thing is her allowing people to have their read/attempting to listen to others on reads, specifically the Scotty reads from both myself and Nanook.

Her inviting Manny to try to scumread and push her feels somewhat towny to me.

Read on Falcon and Long Con post felt good in general.

This is a really weird post. Townreads Chelsea for Chelsea’s read on Falcon….which like doesn’t actually exist in these posts Like quotes where Chelsea talks about Falcon.

[Jackofhearts2005]

Overall, Like was like “whatever, Falcon can go. He’s poe and not talking” so his own read is pretty standard, makes sense for a townie, easy to fake as a wolf.

[Jackofhearts2005]

Okay that’s it for Lime. No smoking gun but I don’t see why he couldn’t be wolves in general or with Chelsea or Lan specifically.

[Jackofhearts2005]

Right, well obviously I couldn't make it. (Spending time with loved ones over mafia, worst choice of my life.)

Very interesting end results, I'll have to make personal vote counts due to how awful the layout for the ones here are.

Don't know how I feel about Mac probably being 0/3? Feels like they were wanting to chainsaw onto Brad because they know for a fact they can't incorrectly read me as a wolf without getting into a losing Thunderdome, will keep an eye on that.

Tony/Falcon/Scotty are my prime vote targets while I was reading in the night.

[VOTE: Falcon] aubergine

Falcon I just want to play more, it's the slot you probably want to vig shoot over exeing because there's just nothing in it. The can't make lylo player until they post well. . .any opinion. (Curious as I wasn't expecting Lime and Dunnstral to also be on here. Did Dunn's LHF clause only count for D1?)

I have Longcon as a villager because they're not wolf with Mac or Scotty and if both those slots are a villager with how high volume of their. . .confidence we're in trouble. (I think Scotty's wolf equality is pretty high though) Independent of that the convo with Lanmisa felt pretty good so yeah.

I'm not voting them for low posting, and I don't think anybody else is either.

I don't think anything in falcon's iso is an alignment initiative but perhaps I'm more lenient or have higher degree's for what I consider AI. if you think there's something I am blatantly missing let me know.

Falcon is top target for Chels. Later…”There’s nothing AI in Falcons iso.”

Wut?

[Jackofhearts2005]

The rest of Chelsea’s Falcon interactions don’t do much for me. I’m kinda skimming but she puts Falcon in the poe without saying anything bad about him until he’s fucked anyway, then says nobody deserves credit for the Falcon yeet cause he was just outted.

I think it’s a fair take if Chelsea had Manny as town because then it’s just Manny night info leading to a yeet but that’s not what happened.

[Jackofhearts2005]

Lan has waaaaay more interaction with Falcon than the others. Starts out pretty low on him due to lack of content and asks him a bunch of questions and comes out of it with a read like “Falcon has some pretty reasonable takes but they aren’t substantial enough to give Falcon a townread.”

When the Manny/Falcon claim thing was going down, Lan immediately sided with Falcon and said Falcon needed to claim and insisted the way he’d claim could be AI (vs me and LC saying his claim was irrelevant because there was only one way it could go down).

Overall, if I were to assume the townie in those three was the one most comfortable and consistent around Falcon, it’d be LanMisa. Idk if that’s a great assumption to make but still.

[Jackofhearts2005]

[VOTE: Chelsea] aubergine

[Lime Coke]

I kinda wanna want it to be me vs chelsea just to see what Brad does.

Very easily vote you.

[Lime Coke]

Quite a decent amount of the deaths at night have been kinda unexpected though?

Like there's part that makes me second guess a few things but how far do I take those things?

Yeah. Wolves shooting poe LC and Mac to eliminate the 3P team instead of consensus townreads LAN and Dunn or basically mech confirmed Manny is…certainly a thing that happened.

Scotty was also one that threw me off (No offense Scotty) but I don't know if he was widely townread compared to the others?

[Lime Coke]

I don't believe Manny should be mechcleared, however given it seems I'm the only one who is even considering looking at that outcome I'll just have to ignore it because I doubt even if I was 100% confident I would have enough sway to push that over, so it's better for me to solve around it.

@Lime Coke do me a favor and put all the dead PR flips in a list and post it for me. Thank you.

Sig was tracker.

Abigail double voter targeter.

Nanook was Commuter.

Seanzie...motion detector?

Epig...poison healer and something else I'm not reading that he's dead.

That appears to be all I'm not counting 3P.

[Manny]

Very easily vote you.

what you waiting for? :curtain:

[Chelsea]

The rest of Chelsea’s Falcon interactions don’t do much for me. I’m kinda skimming but she puts Falcon in the poe without saying anything bad about him until he’s fucked anyway, then says nobody deserves credit for the Falcon yeet cause he was just outted.

I think it’s a fair take if Chelsea had Manny as town because then it’s just Manny night info leading to a yeet but that’s not what happened.

I think anyone with a hint of meta on my wolf game knows I will never openly kill slots who are wolfreading me. Like, wolf me does not kill Mac there in any universe it's damn near clearing.

Would that change if I thought if he was 3p? Depends on my teammate tbf but I don't do the "obvious" nk ever because everyone always tries to use it as a breadcrumb trail and it's extremely easy to manipulate. Also without knowing who the 3rd mafia is (or should I say everyone but 1) NKA is quite frankly horrid IMO because you don't know what people value or the reasons. However, if you want to go that route look above.

I don't expect you to know this because well, we've never played together but people nearly always clear me because "I can never be a wolf with X" so if I don't have many interactions with someone and they're a wolf? It's like, pretty clearing for me. I'm 99% sure that's the reason Brad has kept his hard TR on me