Napoleon Dynamite Mafia [ENDGAME]

#2201

Jackofhearts2005 wrote: ↑Tue Jan 28, 2025 11:59 am [VOTE: Dunya] aubergine

3/3 wagons between what I think are likely wolf partners are sexy.

Jackofhearts2005 wrote: ↑Tue Jan 28, 2025 3:21 pm Also for the record, my actual reason for voting Dunya was because 3/3 W/W wagons begs wolves to push aggressively. They're dead in the water with the status quo but if the wolves vote together, they only need to convince 2 townies to swing the yeet.

3/3 W/T wagons provides different motivation. Suppose Lime is town and Dunya is a wolf. Dunya has continually passed on actually providing a read on Lime and has gone on record as believing that I am 3P. I'm not entirely sure what wolf Lime does with that.

Regardless, he immediately and aggressively pushed me based on fuck and all so yeah, that was the point all along.

Jackofhearts2005 wrote: ↑Tue Jan 28, 2025 3:22 pm
Jackofhearts2005 wrote: ↑Tue Jan 28, 2025 3:21 pm Also for the record, my actual reason for voting Dunya was because 3/3 W/W wagons begs wolves to push aggressively. They're dead in the water with the status quo but if the wolves vote together, they only need to convince 2 townies to swing the yeet.

3/3 W/T wagons provides different motivation. Suppose Lime is town wolf and Dunya is a wolf townie. Dunya has continually passed on actually providing a read on Lime and has gone on record as believing that I am 3P. I'm not entirely sure what wolf Lime does with that.

Regardless, he immediately and aggressively pushed me based on fuck and all so yeah, that was the point all along.
ebwop

Interesting mistake there

Also this reasoning can be easily made up with this progression post to turn the votes away from dunya. That you had the second most votes at the time and moved away from dunya is still a big red flag though. Perhaps you saw a chance to stab at Lime Coke, a wolf Townie?

#2202

Jackofhearts2005 wrote: ↑Fri Feb 07, 2025 12:44 am Idk how good 6 years ago meta is but I’m proud of the setup and the jokes.

I'll take a look to see your setup.

#2203

I was supposing worlds where Lime is town and Dunia is wolf and worlds where Dunia is wolf and Like is town. I just mislabeled the first one.

You’re treating it like I just accidentally called Dunya a wolf and just accidentally called Lime town cause tmi but I was clearly talking about both possibilities there.

#2204

Fuck. There’s the slip you needed.

But I do have tmi now.

#2205

I kind of got what I needed, which is that Dunya doesn't have an aversion to distancing from her teammates and that's unlikely to have changed. She did some exaggerated distancing with nutella.

(also, cool setup. I like draft setups and fantasy theme)

#2206

Like usual this game I'm not confident Jack is mafia just because I'm voting there. This choice was even more of a knife edge choice than the last couple and it mostly came down to which bus and plan seemed more plausible for a scum team trying to win the game. I've definitely seen people make suboptimal or head scratching plays as mafia though and it's not that far fetched to think Syn might have.

I'll hear any case on why Syn bussing dunya isn't that weird.

#2207

As much as I’ve read through isos for both flipped wolves and the two mechanically possible wolves and am pretty damn confident it’s just Syn, I would read any posts where someone goes and finds Syn wolf meta.

#2208

Jackofhearts2005 wrote: ↑Fri Feb 07, 2025 1:20 am As much as I’ve read through isos for both flipped wolves and the two mechanically possible wolves and am pretty damn confident it’s just Syn, I would read any posts where someone goes and finds Syn wolf meta.

Here's the game I found. viewtopic.php?t=2630

Nothing that moved the needle a lot for me, he bussed a partner (Abigail) but was reluctant to and defended her a bit too. He townread his other partner Michelle.

#2209

wow I have zero memory of that game

#2210

like usual, probably won't be here for eod

previous legacy remains. hugs and kisses

#2211

Look, I am still top poster.

Hugs and kisses

#2212

Le petit poussin wrote: ↑Fri Feb 07, 2025 8:10 am Look, I am still top poster.

Hugs and kisses

#2213

Jackofhearts2005 wrote: ↑Fri Feb 07, 2025 12:56 am I was supposing worlds where Lime is town and Dunia is wolf and worlds where Dunia is wolf and Like is town. I just mislabeled the first one.

You’re treating it like I just accidentally called Dunya a wolf and just accidentally called Lime town cause tmi but I was clearly talking about both possibilities there.

When I start my gyroscope of suspicion I am known to come at you with a frame of mind ‘does it make sense for a wolf to do this?’ And in this case, it does make sense. To me.

I will acknowledge it’s cheap to also comment on the slip, as it were, when I myself make those *all the time* in both alignments.

But the switch from dunya to lime in retrospect is suspicions only because of the flip. There is a definite world where this could be a push to save dunya because you ‘wanted to see wolves squirm in a 3/3 tie.’ Can we at least acknowledge that?

#2214

Scenarios (without knowing the 3p wincon) if we miselim today:
5/1/1
4/1/1 Day 7 > chop either syn or jack. If they’re BOTH town for some reason, we’ll be at >
2/1/1 on Day 8, which might still not end, depending on 3p.

Alternatively, we get to D7, finally find the wolf, 3p still around and inherits the kill, then D8 looks like 2/1 MYLO.

I think we’re perfectly fine tbh if we get today wrong provided the other one in the POE is it.

#2215

Scotty wrote: ↑Fri Feb 07, 2025 9:02 am
Jackofhearts2005 wrote: ↑Fri Feb 07, 2025 12:56 am I was supposing worlds where Lime is town and Dunia is wolf and worlds where Dunia is wolf and Like is town. I just mislabeled the first one.

You’re treating it like I just accidentally called Dunya a wolf and just accidentally called Lime town cause tmi but I was clearly talking about both possibilities there.
When I start my gyroscope of suspicion I am known to come at you with a frame of mind ‘does it make sense for a wolf to do this?’ And in this case, it does make sense. To me.

I will acknowledge it’s cheap to also comment on the slip, as it were, when I myself make those *all the time* in both alignments.

But the switch from dunya to lime in retrospect is suspicions only because of the flip. There is a definite world where this could be a push to save dunya because you ‘wanted to see wolves squirm in a 3/3 tie.’ Can we at least acknowledge that?

I mean, sure. Wolves love not voting for their partners for bad reasons. But I'm still not the wolf.

#2216

But bottom line I agree. Even if I get yeeted, we should be fine. I don't want to be yeeted for selfish reasons but it doesn't actually do anything to town's chances of winning the game because we go Syn->Jack or Jack->Syn and win if wolf is Syn either way and have a second change to find out what mech we messed up on D8 ftw.

Ya'll can handle that without me if it comes to that. I'm not that worried about 3P killing people.

#2217

I was considering changing my vote when I woke up because Jack would be showing a really impressive wolf range in his play. Syn would have a good wolf range too, but it’s really hard to make that many convincing solving posts and fake town entitlement like Jack did.

I don’t really buy the slip as a slip.

#2218

If this were an MU game with their criteria for what is towny and scummy Syn would be a runaway wagon. I also got fooled for a bit by an ill advised double busser in another game because “it would make no sense to bus that much you just lose to mech”

[VOTE: Syn] aubergine

#2219

@Jackofhearts2005 @Syn

There’s this thing called the endgame question I was taught where I ask people to explain the thoughts behind their reads and votes all game. Could both of you please explain your thoughts behind every vote you made (more importantly on days 1-3)?

#2220

[VOTE: Unvote] aubergine

I kind of got stressed about having a vote on the board and it was distracting me. I’ll vote before EoD I just have to review my work.

#2221

Thunal33 wrote: ↑Fri Feb 07, 2025 12:05 pm @Jackofhearts2005 @Syn

There’s this thing called the endgame question I was taught where I ask people to explain the thoughts behind their reads and votes all game. Could both of you please explain your thoughts behind every vote you made (more importantly on days 1-3)?

Do I have to? I feel like my votes are like explained in the post I make them or the prior post like 95% of the time. Seems like busywork that is gonna do nothing for your read on me or maybe make you think I'm more wolfy so why bother? Let me know if there's something that isn't clear and I'll clear it up.

#2222

LOL that's a tall order

#2223

Thunal33 wrote: ↑Fri Feb 07, 2025 11:52 am I was considering changing my vote when I woke up because Jack would be showing a really impressive wolf range in his play. Syn would have a good wolf range too, but it’s really hard to make that many convincing solving posts and fake town entitlement like Jack did.

I don’t really buy the slip as a slip.

Jack is at the top end of wolf range, he's the textbook.

#2224

Jackofhearts2005 wrote: ↑Fri Feb 07, 2025 2:05 pm
Thunal33 wrote: ↑Fri Feb 07, 2025 12:05 pm @Jackofhearts2005 @Syn

There’s this thing called the endgame question I was taught where I ask people to explain the thoughts behind their reads and votes all game. Could both of you please explain your thoughts behind every vote you made (more importantly on days 1-3)?
Do I have to? I feel like my votes are like explained in the post I make them or the prior post like 95% of the time. Seems like busywork that is gonna do nothing for your read on me or maybe make you think I'm more wolfy so why bother? Let me know if there's something that isn't clear and I'll clear it up.

I’m not forcing you to.

How about if you explain what you thought of Wisdom on d1 and d2 and when/if your read changed on her while she was alive?

#2225

I’m at work and can’t be on phone before eod but wherever y’all land, Godspeed

Fwiw both are painted into a corner but Syn has felt the most low-key peeved about people being cleared. I know I would be as a wolf

#2226

[VOTE: Jack] aubergine

I’ll go back to the vote I made when I wasn’t so nervous and was actively rereading. That’s worked for me in the past and I know I get caught up in recency bias sometimes. By that I mean I like to townread the person who’s been posting more or more recently.

#2227

Epi wrote:Ilene

You know you're going to that dance with that boy.

Someone has to make the tough decisions. You are in charge of resolving ties. Send the Host a list (most suspicious to least suspicious) by the end of Day 1. You may continually update this list until you are dead.

Note this role says most suspicious to least suspicious, not least suspicious to most suspicious like most people do read lists. The tie breaker could be accidentally resolving ties the opposite way of their reads.

#2228

Ahhhhh i'm late juste the time to read and [VOTE: SYN] aubergine

#2229

I just made it but to late I had a v long meeting.
Thread nor locked. I would have voted Syn.

#2230

Sorry for the late post- got busy with work. Will be with you ASAP.

#2231

Who should be wrapped in some foam or something billowy?

Poll ended at Fri Feb 07, 2025 4:00 pm

Jackofhearts2005
3
27%

Voters: Thunal33, Long Con, Syn

Jibay
0
No votes

Voters: None

Lime Coke
0
No votes

Voters: None

Long Con
0
No votes

Voters: None

Roxy
0
No votes

Voters: None

Scotty
0
No votes

Voters: None

Syn
4
36%

Voters: Scotty, Jibay, Lime Coke, Jackofhearts2005

Thunal33
0
No votes

Voters: None

Shallow friends (The Host. the Non, the Dead)
4
36%

Voters: Le petit poussin, Dragon D. Luffy, S~V~S, Epignosis

Total votes: 11

#2232

There's a lot more where this came from.

Syn didn't want anymore.

Spoiler: show

It is now Night 6. You have 23 hours to submit your Night actions.

#2233

Just a note to let everyone know that I'll get to you when I can tonight. It'll be a while- I am positively drowning in work.

#2234

Thunal33 has been socked.

Spoiler: show

It is now Day 7. You have until the deadline to do your sexy thang.

#2235

RIP Thunal

Here's a fun idea: Roxy - tie breaker, Lime Coke - treestump, Scotty - VT, Jack - mafia, Jibay - 3p

[VOTE: Jack] aubergine

#2236

Long Con wrote: ↑Sat Feb 08, 2025 6:31 pm RIP Thunal

Here's a fun idea: Roxy - tie breaker, Lime Coke - treestump, Scotty - VT, Jack - mafia, Jibay - 3p

[VOTE: Jack] aubergine

That’s fun.

Sorry Syn. I ate my own socks on that one and got too tunneled

[VOTE: Jack] aubergine

#2237

If Jack isn’t it, hypothetically we could’ve gotten it wrong and Jibay is an assumed jailkeep target only. To be clear, I think it’s a very good assumption, but one can’t help but wonder what avenues any remaining wolf would have in this pickle

#2238

We got here a lame duck day ahead of us. I was really hoping yall would kill me but I see why you didn’t and I see why it’s probably LC tonight if the 3p gets killing power.

I sorta kinda want to start preemptively looking at potential win cons for Uncle Rico, specifically aligned with what Epi would do. I feel like this setup allows for inheriting a kill

#2239

Sounds wildly theoretical.

#2240

Yeah, I figure I go today.

[VOTE: Jack] aubergine

Let's spend the day trying to figure out where we're mechanically wrong.

Obviously, it could still be Roxy but I just don't think she's the wolf. What mechanically assumption are we mostly likely wrong about?

Long Con as a mason was already a shoe in but it's now been confirmed.

#2241

6 players left. Misyeet me. 5. Scum nightkills LC. 4 left.

You could go no yeet and move it to 2 vs 1 but I usually find that to be a waste of time. Especially if we mechanically confirm any of the 3 in the 3 vs 1. Wolf just shoots them.

#2242

This will be my last post of the game.

I think the reason I keep getting misyeeted is that I'm held to some very weird higher standard than like 99% of players. Idk why that is. I absolutely do not think there's anything intentional or malicious about it but it's a thing that is happening. Like I don't think I've really done anything wolfy all game. Straight up. And I'm not the wolf. POE via mech? Fine. But I've been having random near yeet wagons form on me based on literally nothing since D3.

Look at Syn's content vs mine yesterday. It's laughable that this was close, actual alignments aside. Look at my content vs Dunya D3. It's insane that I almost was yeeted over her.

Lime's initial case on me was "fuck Jack for laughing at me. I'm gonna vote for him no matter what." And then I'm called to explain my vote on Lime instead of Dunya. It's silly. It feels like gaslighting except I know better. Nobody is trying to pick on me. I'm just....inherently untrustworthy? Tonally? I don't know. I used to use it to my advantage to catch wolves out of position but lately (meaning over the last 2-3 years) I've either lost that ability or lost that wim, getting myself misyeeted EVERY SINGLE GAME. Go back and look. Literally every single game I've played in the last 3 years, I've been town aligned and I've been misyeeted. And I look back at those games and I don't see what I'm doing wrong. I'm not hard shielding wolves. I'm not leaving votes unexplained. I'm not making highly suboptimal moves that lead people to say "That must actually be Jack being a wolf because a townie wouldn't do these things." It's not anything I'm doing. It's just who I am.

And this sucks. It really does. But like...even if everyone was to honestly look at my play and say to themselves "You know what? He's right. We are unfair to Jack and he hasn't actually done anything wolfy all game" (and this will never happen), I'm still mechanically one of two players that can be the wolf and I don't think the other player is the wolf either. I think we've fucked up on mech. And it's not reasonable for me to ask everyone to buck a 10ish game trend of yeeting me for no real reason when I'm in a 2 person POE. And if we did yeet Roxy today, I think she'd flip town and we'd yeet me tomorrow.

I'm not interested in doing this song and dance two more times, so I'm self voting and leaving.

I think everyone should vote for me and then try to figure out where we've screwed up on mech. Trust that I'm not such a dick that I'd try to fool you into doing isos of mechanically cleared players if I was a wolf. But also trust that even if you say to yourself "You know what? I don't think it's Jack" after reading this, that feeling will be entirely temporary and you will vote to misyeet me in lylo. So vote me now and then solve. Especially @Long Con because you won't be around to do it after this phase.

#2243

Long Con wrote: ↑Sun Feb 09, 2025 12:29 am Sounds wildly theoretical.

Theoretics is all we got babay.

Jackofhearts2005 wrote: ↑Sun Feb 09, 2025 12:29 am Yeah, I figure I go today.

[VOTE: Jack] aubergine

Let's spend the day trying to figure out where we're mechanically wrong.

Obviously, it could still be Roxy but I just don't think she's the wolf. What mechanically assumption are we mostly likely wrong about?

Long Con as a mason was already a shoe in but it's now been confirmed.

I understand if you’re the wolf you’ve got to do whatever you can here, and judging by the your big post, there’s a lot of frustration to go around.

I dunno man, sometimes them’s the breaks. I haven’t wanted to yeet you once this game, but here we are at the school dance and we need to crown a prom queen.

TBH your last post feels like a plea from someone that reallllly doesn’t want to be yeeted, applying a veil of ‘whatever man, let’s just do it’. It could be said you’re a misyeet every game and that may be true, but I also feel like of all the misyeets, this isn’t one that needs the monologue about. At this point you could be Mother Theresa and we’d have to tar and feather you based on evidence. Sorry my dude.

Roxy is the only other one that hasn’t been implied as a mech clear for wolf and no one else has seemingly gone against the idea that she breaks ties. So

#2244

Ok, let's vote Roxy then. I love flipping then script.

[VOTE: Roxy] aubergine

#2245

Long Con wrote: ↑Sun Feb 09, 2025 1:07 pm Ok, let's vote Roxy then. I love flipping then script.

[VOTE: Roxy] aubergine

So…hypothetically..if we’re in 4v1v1, we miselim today, it will be a 2v1v1 and that very likely becomes a kingmaker scenario where town may not even win if Rico is some sort of sole survivor.

And that’s assuming Roxy and Jibay are voting consistently.

So…why would we do this?

#2246

But what if Roxy is the Wolf?

#2247

If we vote Roxy and she's the wolf it's a Win ?

#2248

Jibay wrote: ↑Sun Feb 09, 2025 2:57 pm If we vote Roxy and she's the wolf it's a Win ?

Maybe. We don't know if the third party role is hostile to the town, or can win with them.

#2249

I mean, it's not like Jack doesn't get wins. He just won, as a Wolf. Bad luck that he wasn't able to be mechanically cleared, if he's Town. Nothing wrong with his hustle.

Earlier I thought Lime Coke was hinting a red check on Jack, so I spent some time putting faith in that. That was the catalyst for the Jack-dunya tie on Day 3. I thought I had a clear LC Connection going on, but I was tilting at windmills... Yeah... Coach woulda put me in fourth quarter, we would've been state champions. No doubt. No doubt in my mind.

I have been there, Jack. I had some good games, and some truly diabolical wins, and it scarred some souls permanently. For a while, most couldn't even see me intentions unWolfily, or even better, "probable hostile third party". Pfft. Just because it's true, by the stats. I fell down into an abyss of despair. But I came out the other side. And look at me now! I get into towncores again! Players put their trust in me, and are not regretful! It'll happen to you, too. I'm always good to give you that lucky chance.

The real question is, how dickish would it be, as a Wolf, to call for mech checks like that? I don't really find it that dickish, so to appeal to the idea that you are not a dick, though true, does not necessarily apply here.

#2250

Anyway, so the mech clears.

Thunal33 wrote: ↑Thu Feb 06, 2025 3:06 pmFWIW Scotty was cleared by LPP’s n4 track. He said he was exactly as confident Scotty was town as he was that Lime was town.

Le petit poussin wrote: ↑Tue Feb 04, 2025 4:56 pm Anyway, you never kill Thunal/Lime COke/Long Con/Scotty.

Rest is free real estate. glgl

Lime Coke and Scotty are not the Wolf, and neither am I. So, Jack Jibay Roxy.

Just Don the rolechecker left. Wolf knows all the roles by now, probably. Wolf isn't going to kill Rico. On purpose.

Town has Kip (former mason), Pedro (stump), Grandma (vanilla), Ilene (tiebreaker).

And Uncle Rico.

What happens if we vote the stump? Do we get an extra day? I don't think so. We have to get a Wolf today or tomorrow, and that is at best a hopeful projection, given the unknown status of Rico. 66% chance, but brought down by Rico.

Who else needs a chain around the neck?