Who Framed Roger Rabbit? [Day 10]

#1501

fingersplints wrote:Sophie, the only reason I could see bass doing that is perhaps with his RL situation he wanted out anyways and him and his team decided it would be better for the team to have him lynched and set up LC while going down.
idk im trying to see all the possibilities

Bass was already going down when he did the slip setup. He didn't have to want out of the game, he knew Canuck was right and that people would believe her, because it was the truth.

And yeah, what baddie teams communicate by PM these days?

#1502

and okay. lets say it was a BTSC PM on the syndicate and he hit submit....how many of you, when you send a pm to someone, make an effort to put their name in the PM? And, how many of you ask a question in a PM without referencing what you are talking about? "what do I do Long Con?" nah..you would put Long Con in the "this PM goes to" spot and then just type something like, "are you reading this thread? what should I do?"

linki..will read in a sec

#1503

splints: There's only 3 baddie slots left (assuming MM wasn't a weasel, and not including Doom), but I am positive that LC, eloh, and BR can't all be bad. Of those three, I only think LC is bad, actually. BR I'm on the fence about, eloh I think is civ being snowed by LC. (Sorry, Eloh!)

Eloh: I think, because of your presuppositions about LC, you are reading his responses to the Bass situation in a MUCH more favourable light than I am inclined to do. Watching it unfold in real time, it reallyreallyreally felt like a real slip. And the fact that LC didn't think it was odd until I brought it up, and the fact that he didn't immediately try to refute it, but instead went pretty damn quiet for a pretty long time, is just not how I see a civ LC responding to that kind of ploy by the baddies. He wouldn't just take it like that and wait for others to chime in. He would stop the thing in its tracks and raise holy hell.

It sucks for him that he got dragged in to his teamies mistake, and I respect that he's doing everything he can to dig his way out....but I just don't see how the events unfolding the way they did could really point to anything else.
It was too early for a suicide gambit. (Bass had no votes, and while he was definitely being grilled by me, only one or two other people were around and listening. His lynch was not even close to being a foregone conclusion), and LC's reaction was either that he didn't notice the slip because he was engaged in two conversations with Bass at once (one in the thread and one out of it), or he noticed but tried to play it off as normal until I made a fuss about it. Then he went radio silent, and waited for someone (me, unfortunately) to bring up the super paranoid suicide gambit theory. Now he's letting that play out, and trying not to say too much in case he swings opinion back the other way.

He's in a tight spot, and giving a sly fight, but I don't think your view of him is enough. It's just not confirmable, really.

A million linkis. Posting anyways.

#1504

Long Con wrote:
fingersplints wrote:Sophie, the only reason I could see bass doing that is perhaps with his RL situation he wanted out anyways and him and his team decided it would be better for the team to have him lynched and set up LC while going down.
idk im trying to see all the possibilities
Bass was already going down when he did the slip setup. He didn't have to want out of the game, he knew Canuck was right and that people would believe her, because it was the truth.

And yeah, what baddie teams communicate by PM these days?

I prefer PM.

#1505

Elohcin wrote:and okay. lets say it was a BTSC PM on the syndicate and he hit submit....how many of you, when you send a pm to someone, make an effort to put their name in the PM? And, how many of you ask a question in a PM without referencing what you are talking about? "what do I do Long Con?" nah..you would put Long Con in the "this PM goes to" spot and then just type something like, "are you reading this thread? what should I do?"

linki..will read in a sec

This is a valid point, and this (along with what splints noted about Bass wanting out) is one of the few hesitations I have.

#1506

My reaction to Bass' post was only confusion. I don't see how you can read it any other way. And leaving the thread for a couple of hours is not how I'd try to handle the situation. I went to make dinner for myself and my kids, and then played a little Modern Warfare afterwards, and then I came back to see this shitstorm happening.

#1507

Lol, elo, bass didnt even have a vote when he commited the slip, and wasnt even getting that much flack, just canuck was mentioning him.
You are saying that THAT made him "fake a slip"(wtf?) And take LC down with him??

There was no need for bass to out himself at that point, and for u to think someone is gonna buy that outrageous theory is funny. No one thats able to think straight for more than 10 seconds will buy this

#1508

I'd better tell you now before I get accused of conveniently ditching the thread again: I have to go out right now, I'll be back in a bit.

#1509

On a completely unrelated note, this is objectively the best toy ever manufactured:

If you do not agree, either you have no soul, or you didn't grow up on a steep-ass hill.

Conversely, this is the strangest toy ever manufactured......but maaaaaaan did I lust after one when I was a kid:

I mean, seriously. Who comes up with the idea for a plush toy that requires the child to reach inside of its guts and pull out its offspring?! And how much did it suck to be the chump that only got 3 puppies?

Probably from the same brilliant minds who invented those dolls that piss themselves.

#1510

I don't agree Sophie. I believe several people were talking about a Bass lynch at the point when he decided he was done fore and wanted to take a civ down with him. And....even if you prefer PMs canuck, with 5 baddies teammates, PMs are inconvenient. And just b/c two, possibly more are dead, doesn't mean they aren't still working together and scheming. All baddies win together in Epi games. There is no reason for Bass to PM LC specifically about this situation and then reiterate his PM during his self-vote. And again, IF and that is a BIG IF the baddie team is using PMs, why would he ONLY want LCs opinion on how to handle the suspicions against him...why not send a PM to all team members? Which again rings up the fact that he mentions LC in the actual PM. Nonsensical.

linki....haha, yes...those toys.

#1511

No Canucklehead, this is the best toy ever.

#1512

Long Con wrote:
fingersplints wrote:Sophie, the only reason I could see bass doing that is perhaps with his RL situation he wanted out anyways and him and his team decided it would be better for the team to have him lynched and set up LC while going down.
idk im trying to see all the possibilities
Bass was already going down when he did the slip setup. He didn't have to want out of the game, he knew Canuck was right and that people would believe her, because it was the truth.

And yeah, what baddie teams communicate by PM these days?

People who can't pull up a chatzy on a work computer. people who chatzy is a pain on the phone. People who want an answer right away and some teammates, like you as I learned in cars, are seemingly easier to reach by PM then chat.

From your posts it sounds like we are wrong though and you are Indy :/

#1513

Elohcin wrote:and okay. lets say it was a BTSC PM on the syndicate and he hit submit....how many of you, when you send a pm to someone, make an effort to put their name in the PM? And, how many of you ask a question in a PM without referencing what you are talking about? "what do I do Long Con?" nah..you would put Long Con in the "this PM goes to" spot and then just type something like, "are you reading this thread? what should I do?"

linki..will read in a sec

I have sent a PM instead of chatzy message specifically to LC because he isn't in the chat much when BR is playing. Thats part of why it makes it more believable to me

#1514

Yeah, I think the points you bring up need serious consideration, eloh. I would actually not be averse to lynching someone other than LC tomorrow, because there is someone I'm more sure of, and because I think LC deserves a chance to make himself heard and fight for his life, rather than being blindly brought down by the mob. I wish I could see inside your brain and understand why you're so sure he's not lying to you....but I can't, so I have to weigh my trust of you, and the validity of your points about the weird syntax of the "PM", against the circumstances as I saw them play out.

I'm working on the case for the person I'd most like to see lynched now, but I don't want to post it until dawn. I'm worried that I won't be able to get enough people on board, though, because my case is entirely based on thread stuff and not info or anything, and people are (obviously) going to be very eager to lynch LC thinking that they do have "info" on him...but I am much more certain about the baddiness of this person than I am about LC (for whom there are real doubts, even if the much SIMPLER solution is that he is bad). Before anyone jumps on my head, I am by no means defending LC. I do at this point think he's most likely a baddie. But because I am even more sure of someone else being a baddie, I'm willing to give LC a day, and give myself more time to sort him out for sure.

I guess my rationale is that the person I'd like to lynch is not incompatible with an LC lynch the following day, if people still want to vote him at that time. I could actually see a case for them being teammates, but it is not a foregone conclusion.

Gah. I dunno what to do.

Linkis:

llama: I had that Skeletor! (Or one very much like him). And a ginormous Castle Greyskull. And a He-Man who lost part of his arm in an unfortunate fire incident. While I will concede that that is an excellent toy, I maintain that the slip n' slide is the superior toy because it brought me very close to death numerous times as a child, and because of that I now live with a much greater appreciation for the miracle (and brevity!) of human life, and the astonishing fragility of human limbs.

splintsy: ooh. Interesting piece of anecdata!

#1515

Splint: what do you mean about the Indy? You think eloh is Doom? Or LC?

#1516

Fair enough, Canauck. I like toys thta almost kill children, but I was pandering to our host.

#1517

Canucklehead wrote:Splint: what do you mean about the Indy? You think eloh is Doom? Or LC?

LC had said "you don't need me to win" but I'd guess that'd be more neutral then Indy. I guess it doesn't fit since it's a lms. I don't know how to explain it. that line just read weird to me.

#1518

Hey Canuck, how are you feeling about MP? I had originally considered him a potential teammate of Aces, but I was reconsidering that after the bass thing

#1519

I'm not a baddie and I'm not Doom. Stop thinking the worst of me by default, I don't always get evil roles.

You don't need me, the Civvie role that I am, to win. The idea behind the statement was, "so be it, if you cannot be convinced that this is a setup, then at least this should reveal some baddies."

#1520

fingersplints wrote:
Elohcin wrote:and okay. lets say it was a BTSC PM on the syndicate and he hit submit....how many of you, when you send a pm to someone, make an effort to put their name in the PM? And, how many of you ask a question in a PM without referencing what you are talking about? "what do I do Long Con?" nah..you would put Long Con in the "this PM goes to" spot and then just type something like, "are you reading this thread? what should I do?"

linki..will read in a sec
I have sent a PM instead of chatzy message specifically to LC because he isn't in the chat much when BR is playing. Thats part of why it makes it more believable to me

I could respond to this and refute it but it might be considered giving too much info.

#1521

Prove it Elo. If what you say is true, there is one very obvious way you can make me believe you

#1522

Elo how do you feel about llama?

#1523

So this was one of my favorites. I'd put these on, put some Boyz 2 Men, All 4 One, or a Moriah cassette in the walkman. Oh yeah....those were the days.

#1524

fingersplints wrote:Hey Canuck, how are you feeling about MP? I had originally considered him a potential teammate of Aces, but I was reconsidering that after the bass thing

MP is not specifically on my baddie list right now, but I don't feel he's definitively a civ, either. I honestly haven't spent too much time thinking about him recently.

#1525

I have a friend coming over this afternoon so I will be unavailable until this evening.

#1526

Canucklehead wrote:splints: There's only 3 baddie slots left (assuming MM wasn't a weasel, and not including Doom), but I am positive that LC, eloh, and BR can't all be bad. Of those three, I only think LC is bad, actually. BR I'm on the fence about, eloh I think is civ being snowed by LC. (Sorry, Eloh!)

Eloh: I think, because of your presuppositions about LC, you are reading his responses to the Bass situation in a MUCH more favourable light than I am inclined to do. Watching it unfold in real time, it reallyreallyreally felt like a real slip. And the fact that LC didn't think it was odd until I brought it up, and the fact that he didn't immediately try to refute it, but instead went pretty damn quiet for a pretty long time, is just not how I see a civ LC responding to that kind of ploy by the baddies. He wouldn't just take it like that and wait for others to chime in. He would stop the thing in its tracks and raise holy hell. It sucks for him that he got dragged in to his teamies mistake, and I respect that he's doing everything he can to dig his way out....but I just don't see how the events unfolding the way they did could really point to anything else.
It was too early for a suicide gambit. (Bass had no votes, and while he was definitely being grilled by me, only one or two other people were around and listening. His lynch was not even close to being a foregone conclusion), and LC's reaction was either that he didn't notice the slip because he was engaged in two conversations with Bass at once (one in the thread and one out of it), or he noticed but tried to play it off as normal until I made a fuss about it. Then he went radio silent, and waited for someone (me, unfortunately) to bring up the super paranoid suicide gambit theory. Now he's letting that play out, and trying not to say too much in case he swings opinion back the other way.

He's in a tight spot, and giving a sly fight, but I don't think your view of him is enough. It's just not confirmable, really.

A million linkis. Posting anyways.

I agree with this post.

I'll also second FS' reasoning about using chatzy on a smart phone.

I'll also note that there would have been no way for bass to guarantee LC would be there when he posted unless they were teammates. LC stays hidden when he logs in I've noticed. The intent of the Pm, if staged, would have been to speak to someone currently online in the thread. IMO. Thus why I still believe LC is a good bet. However I am willing to listen to canuck and anyone else's theories tomorrow, but I'd like to point out that if we don't lynch him tomorrow we may never have the chance to. What if the judge does, wouldn't be the first time he killed a potential baddie Mm. I would prefer to know for sure than speculate for the rest of the game.

#1527

Also the reason LC was called out could be because he was the only teammate currently online at the time?

#1528

I don't understand why a baddie with zero votes would give up and implicate a random civilian who already has had some heat off and on anyway (though mostly from rabbit :P). I do understand why a baddie would do so to implicate Doom, but I don't understand how the baddie team would know who Doom is. Can anyone make sense of this? I recognize the conceptual counterpoints, mostly put forth by Elo, but I don't understand the motivation of the baddies to do this if it weren't either accidental or incredibly desperate.

Frankly, I am still going back to Occam's Razor here, and while I think we should consider every possibility, if I had to cast my vote now it would be for LC. I don't see the likelihood for him being a civilian to be strong at this point. That said, we still have plenty of time for discussion until Day 5's end.

Canuck, I'm very intrigued to hear what your case is going to be and who it is on.

Just an FYI, folks, even though I'm on spring break this week, I've spent all of my time up until now mostly shirking my PhD duties (because I have been way too enjoying having the extra time, even if it still isn't a lot) and I have a terrifying midterm to study for as well as research and other work to do, Daisy is about to leave for Houston after this weekend, and I'm hosting Death Note and working on something else for the Syndicate that I mentioned previously, so my posting may be very sporadic for a little while. Of course, I'm a mafia addict, so, we shall see.

Linki w/ BF: I echo this sentiment.

#1529

blindfaeth wrote:I'll also note that there would have been no way for bass to guarantee LC would be there when he posted unless they were teammates.

I was the third-last post above Bass, I was obviously there. Why would you say this when you can just look at the thread and see how it went down? Unless you mean that, in the nine minutes between my post and his, he's supposed to be unable to figure out that I was there.

#1530

fingersplints wrote:Elo how do you feel about llama?

Yeah, how do you feel about me? Be honest.

#1531

MovingPictures07 wrote:I don't understand why a baddie with zero votes would give up and implicate a random civilian who already has had some heat off and on anyway (though mostly from rabbit :P). I do understand why a baddie would do so to implicate Doom, but I don't understand how the baddie team would know who Doom is. Can anyone make sense of this? I recognize the conceptual counterpoints, mostly put forth by Elo, but I don't understand the motivation of the baddies to do this if it weren't either accidental or incredibly desperate.

Frankly, I am still going back to Occam's Razor here, and while I think we should consider every possibility, if I had to cast my vote now it would be for LC. I don't see the likelihood for him being a civilian to be strong at this point. That said, we still have plenty of time for discussion until Day 5's end.

You don't have the information necessary to understand what has happened.

#1532

I'm not seeing the case on Long Con at all. It seems to be all sound and fury, signifying nothing. From my perspective, he has been a helpful fellow. He was the only one who told me what I missed when I was away for the weekend.

#1533

Thank you Llama. That's very generous of you. I actually don't suspect you like I used to, given recent events. I hope we can move forward in the spirit of collaboration and friendship... if I don't get lynched, that is.

#1534

Long Con wrote:Thank you Llama. That's very generous of you. I actually don't suspect you like I used to, given recent events. I hope we can move forward in the spirit of collaboration and friendship... if I don't get lynched, that is.

I hope you won't get so mad at me for defending you, like you did the last time.

#1535

thellama73 wrote:
Long Con wrote:Thank you Llama. That's very generous of you. I actually don't suspect you like I used to, given recent events. I hope we can move forward in the spirit of collaboration and friendship... if I don't get lynched, that is.
I hope you won't get so mad at me for defending you, like you did the last time.

Hey, I was right about you then!

That was a classic one too.

#1536

@ Eloh - Your opinion does matter to me re Long Con because I trust you. And your theory that this is a baddie plot does fit with my sophisticated baddies theory.

@ MP and Canuck - I tend to agree with you guys that the idea of Bass' post being a baddie plot doesn't make tons of sense because Bass wasn't really a target. Also, why didn't Long Con say anything for so long or start posting his indignation about being set up? Maybe it was because he sent Bass a PM and called him to the Chatzy so they could plan a response? Maybe?

I will continue to think about things. My top three possible baddies are Long Con, Sophie, MP???

#1537

This is my favorite toy of all time.

#1538

Zomberella12 wrote:@ Eloh -
I will continue to think about things. My top three possible baddies are Long Con, Sophie, MP???

are u for real? how can i possibly be teammate with LC when he was throwing my name as suspicion before his teammate outed him?
if you pay attention at what happened in the thread, you will see there is no way (and i mean NO WAY) that i could be put in a team were LC and Bass are.

In fact, after what elo is saying and how she throw my name with no logic whatsoever, its clear that in the chatzy (or pms) they are all "lets say this is a ploy and bass outing was a baddie tactic and sophie is really bass teammate" (and elo said this) "lets see if they fall for it, lol". Since some people here isnt bothering in reading the thread and realize that does not make sense at all, they might get away with it. Well, if i guide myself for what you are saying.

i do think that once people read carefully what elo is saying, they will see it makes no sense. I mean you dont even have to read it carefully, just read it and think HOW elo theories can be true. And then just think HOW the obvious theory (bass, lc and elo are teammates) is much much more logical and likely.

And then decide for yourself.

But if you keep throwing my name outhere with no logic just like elo did, i will have to think you are another one of the weasels, cause that makes no sense for someone that cares to think about this for more than one nanosecond.

#1539

Sophie, I personally think you're civ, but I don't think jumping incredulously down the throats of anyone who suspects you is doing you or, more importantly, the civs any favours right now. The baddies are obviously attempting to sow chaos and dissension, and we need to stick together to prevent that. The way to do so is by watching, waiting, seeing what happens, and discussing ALL possibilities and being willing to change our minds to stick with the people we trust. Indignant outbursts don't help civ unity, especially when they're directed at people (eloh) who are very likely civs themselves.
This kind of reactionary in-fighting is exactly what the baddies are hoping happens, because it's the only way they'll survive. If we stick together and keep our heads on straight, we will eliminate them all, in time.

#1540

Canucklehead wrote:Sophie, I personally think you're civ, but I don't think jumping incredulously down the throats of anyone who suspects you is doing you or, more importantly, the civs any favours right now. The baddies are obviously attempting to sow chaos and dissension, and we need to stick together to prevent that. The way to do so is by watching, waiting, seeing what happens, and discussing ALL possibilities and being willing to change our minds to stick with the people we trust. Indignant outbursts don't help civ unity, especially when they're directed at people (eloh) who are very likely civs themselves.
This kind of reactionary in-fighting is exactly what the baddies are hoping happens, because it's the only way they'll survive. If we stick together and keep our heads on straight, we will eliminate them all, in time.

I like this post, but not if you're bad.

Are you bad?

#1541

I just reread my post, and apologies if it sounds patronizing. That's reallyreallyreally not how I meant it. I intended it to sound more like a civ rallying cry (and an acknowledgement of my support for you and your civness), but I don't think I quite pulled that off.

Sorry!

linki: llama, I am not bad, so you may proceed with your liking

#1542

Canucklehead wrote:I just reread my post, and apologies if it sounds patronizing. That's reallyreallyreally not how I meant it. I intended it to sound more like a civ rallying cry (and an acknowledgement of my support for you and your civness), but I don't think I quite pulled that off.
Sorry!

linki: llama, I am not bad, so you may proceed with your liking

Oh good.

#1543

Canucklehead wrote:Sophie, I personally think you're civ, but I don't think jumping incredulously down the throats of anyone who suspects you is doing you or, more importantly, the civs any favours right now. The baddies are obviously attempting to sow chaos and dissension, and we need to stick together to prevent that. The way to do so is by watching, waiting, seeing what happens, and discussing ALL possibilities and being willing to change our minds to stick with the people we trust. Indignant outbursts don't help civ unity, especially when they're directed at people (eloh) who are very likely civs themselves.
This kind of reactionary in-fighting is exactly what the baddies are hoping happens, because it's the only way they'll survive. If we stick together and keep our heads on straight, we will eliminate them all, in time.

I agree with you canuck, we should stick together and think for a second, and then eliminate baddies one by one. But there are some people (maybe they are baddies, maybe civvies -like zomb, who im not sure what to think she is-) that are letting the baddies confuse them and is not even funny.
I cant wait for your case in the person you think is as baddie (or baddier) than LC

having said so, why do u think elo is civ?
im geniunely curious.
I mean, not only the ridiculous defense of LC is pingy. Have you said how she jumped in my throat right after bass outed him and LC? elo didnt even gave one explanation or evidence or quote or anything into saying i was bass teammate, she just throw it outhere and leave it at that, and the accuse me of "try to act civvie" (wtf). No reason, no quote, no previous suspicion, nothing. Just said "LC is civvie, sophie is bad instead"

if you are gonna make that kind of outrageous statement that contradict every bit of logic and everything thats seen on the thread, wouldnt you at least wanna BACK IT UP? with something? but no, elo just throwed it outhere, hoping rest of the people will get confused enough to just throw one vote to my side. Thats what baddies need to get me lynched, they are 3, they can control the votes, if they can convince maybe one distracted civvie to vote for me, they will get me lynched instead of LC, thats what they need.

So i dont see how what elos has been doing in the last few pages has been civvie minded, i dont see it all.

I mean, ask me why he suspects me and how it is that im baddie teammate, and how did she got to that conclusion in the minutes after the outing. A civvie will be able to back this statement up, a baddie will just throw my name outhere in hopes to save his baddie teammate.

sorry for the gender thing, i have no idea if elo is men/woman

#1544

sorry gor the typos, i mean "ask HIM why he suspects me"

and i also meant in the 4th paragraph "have you seen how she jumped in my throat.......?"

#1545

Canucklehead wrote:I just reread my post, and apologies if it sounds patronizing. That's reallyreallyreally not how I meant it. I intended it to sound more like a civ rallying cry (and an acknowledgement of my support for you and your civness), but I don't think I quite pulled that off.
Sorry!

linki: llama, I am not bad, so you may proceed with your liking

it didnt sound patronizing at all

#1546

If Sophie is Civ, then she is the one the baddies are loving the most right now.

#1547

Long Con wrote:If Sophie is Civ, then she is the one the baddies are loving the most right now.

Are u guys loving me in your chatroom?

Thanks for keeping me alive!

#1548

Sophie wrote:
Long Con wrote:If Sophie is Civ, then she is the one the baddies are loving the most right now.
Are u guys loving me in your chatroom?
Thanks for keeping me alive!

This is a very good setup, and you are the wrongest person here.

#1549

Sophie wrote:
Long Con wrote:If Sophie is Civ, then she is the one the baddies are loving the most right now.
Are u guys loving me in your chatroom?
Thanks for keeping me alive!

This comment alone makes me want to lynch Sophie very badly. It's the ultimate bluff.

#1550

Lynch me, then

How About Now?