Harry Stephen Keeler [ENDGAME]

[S~V~S]

I had one thing, a shiny statue. Of Buddha, who is awesome. And someone tried to do something to me, and Buddha protected me, but now he's just like a tchotchke, not special. He lost his glow.

I want the baddie people who took my Buddhas specialness from me to pay, tbh.

Linki, I think you are the one not reading the thread, Zomba.

[Zombarella]

Zombie why do you think SVS wants what you have? I mean if you do get lynched I would think the mafia would just night kill her soo it's really putting a target on her

I guess they might. But the Celestials have some kind of goal to get stuff and SVS was defending me as civ until she got that stupid will from BF and she's been after me ever since. Maybe it really does say that she would get lots of money. That's not in my role at all so I don't know how that could be possible. Maybe it's a forgery or something. All I know is that she keeps reading everything that happens as Zomba is bad when I'm totally not. What other explanation is there?

[Golden]

I've played a lot with SVS, and I've pretty sure I've never seen her 'want someone to die'. I think it's a stretch to suggest SVS is a celestial and say that you can pick out half her team (rabbit? BWT? I'm not seeing these links at all!). If the celestials were after your stock certificate, it seems likely to me they would just steal it. If SVS is wrong, I think she is just a well-intentioned civ.

However - putting aside the reactive side of what you just said... I can understand the point you are making. It meshes with how I've been thinking about you for the entire game... until last nights night post.

So, what I want to understand and what I would like you to focus on is not the people accusing you, and it's not bf's will. It's the newspaper thing - do you understand why that looks bad?

[fingersplints]

Who isn't reading the thread?

Apparently you because I named at least one name in my last post.

you said "so many people". surely you can name more than one if you want to use it as part of your defense.

[Zombarella]

I had one thing, a shiny statue. Of Buddha, who is awesome. And someone tried to do something to me, and Buddha protected me, but now he's just like a tchotchke, not special. He lost his glow.

I want the baddie people who took my Buddhas specialness from me to pay, tbh.

Linki, I think you are the one not reading the thread, Zomba.

Oh don't you dare. I read that. I just don't believe it. You could just be saying that to make yourself look good.

Oh by the way everyone, when I burned my worthless stock certificate the ashes spelled out the words "SVS makes up stuff". I don't know what it means but....something to think about.

linki: Yes, I can follow SVS's thoughts, but it just relies on so many assumptions that just plain aren't true and could just as easily be explained by civ circumstances and civ behavior. Don't you think that some of what she's claiming is kind of a stretch?

[Zombarella]

Who isn't reading the thread?

Apparently you because I named at least one name in my last post.

you said "so many people". surely you can name more than one if you want to use it as part of your defense.

I am going to lump low posters in with the non-readers.

[S~V~S]

I am hoping someone else votes for Zomba overnight. I think the game rules will out weigh the item, and whoever votes for her first gets her "fortune". Which she has already said was worthless.

Linki, um no I don't. I gave you lots of BOTD.

Linki, Zomba, I don't make up stuff.

[Zombarella]

Linki, Zomba, I don't make up stuff.

Says you.

[juliets]

linki: Yes, I can follow SVS's thoughts, but it just relies on so many assumptions that just plain aren't true and could just as easily be explained by civ circumstances and civ behavior. Don't you think that some of what she's claiming is kind of a stretch?

I snipped your message for brevity. Can you offer an example of what civ circumstances and civ behavior could explain that article?

[S~V~S]

This all sounds like hysteria, tbh. A large amount of people in the thread are saying she sounds bad, and she has decided to blame me. When people think you sound bad, lots of people, that's your fault. As someone who gets suspected ALOT i hate to admit it, but it is true.

[Elohcin]

I know I haven't played with you a whole lot Zomba, but this feisty behavior is new. *snap snap*

[S~V~S]

Linki, Zomba, I don't make up stuff.

Says you.

Says me. Fucking straight.

[Epignosis]

Wll wll wll.

[rabbit8]

[S~V~S]

ct fght

[Golden]

Wll wll wll.

will will will?

I think epi wants your stuff :P

Seriously though, Zombs, you've given me pause for thought. I actually read what you said as civ.

[S~V~S]

I am walking away from this. I can give her the BOTD till tomorrow, but she has to stop talking to me like we're street gangs or something.

[Epignosis]

Wll wll wll.

will will will?

I think epi wants your stuff :P

Gldn gt th dbl ntndr!

[Elohcin]

Wll wll wll.

will will will?

I think epi wants your stuff :P

Seriously though, Zombs, you've given me pause for thought. I actually read what you said as civ.

Funny. I didn't.

[S~V~S]

No I just read it an an attack.

[S~V~S]

I had one thing, a shiny statue. Of Buddha, who is awesome. And someone tried to do something to me, and Buddha protected me, but now he's just like a tchotchke, not special. He lost his glow.

I want the baddie people who took my Buddhas specialness from me to pay, tbh.

Linki, I think you are the one not reading the thread, Zomba.

Oh don't you dare. I read that. I just don't believe it. You could just be saying that to make yourself look good.

Oh by the way everyone, when I burned my worthless stock certificate the ashes spelled out the words "SVS makes up stuff". I don't know what it means but....something to think about.

linki: Yes, I can follow SVS's thoughts, but it just relies on so many assumptions that just plain aren't true and could just as easily be explained by civ circumstances and civ behavior. Don't you think that some of what she's claiming is kind of a stretch?

Also, i am not "claiming" anything, I said about 8,000 times that it is a theory.

[S~V~S]

Like i said, walking away.

[Golden]

I don't mean all the stuff about SVS... with that I think zombs is doing all the things she is accusing SVS of doing, honestly... making big assumptions that aren't really based in much and have plenty of civilian explanations.

And actually, I just read it again. And really? Civilian roles that post to the thread? Which ones? Jeff Darrell has posted, his name was mentioned. The poet was mia. Which others could it be? And why, why, why would they report on an event that they only could have known about if they were bad?

[S~V~S]

Zomba, earnest advice~ if people are accusing you, you are better served by defending yourself as opposed to attacking others. People have a lot of concerns about you, and after an over 24 hour absence from the thread, you come back to attack someone else?

Night guys

[rabbit8]

^^

[thellama73]

Zomba, earnest advice~ if people are accusing you, you are better served by defending yourself as opposed to attacking others.

But the best defense is a good offense!

[S~V~S]

Zomba, earnest advice~ if people are accusing you, you are better served by defending yourself as opposed to attacking others.

But the best defense is a good offense!

Not when you are already under attack. Too late then. A good offense keeps attacks at bay, and prevents attacks from happening, but once attacks have started, the best defense is a good defense.

per Sun Tzu

Now really, I have to get up in like 6.5 hours lol.

[juliets]

Zomba, you never answered my question.

LizKeen, you never responded to Epi and Golden's posts about you. You made a post about Epi but it was not his case against you.

[Long Con]

I had one thing, a shiny statue. Of Buddha, who is awesome. And someone tried to do something to me, and Buddha protected me, but now he's just like a tchotchke, not special. He lost his glow.

I want the baddie people who took my Buddhas specialness from me to pay, tbh.

Linki, I think you are the one not reading the thread, Zomba.

Oh don't you dare. I read that. I just don't believe it. You could just be saying that to make yourself look good.

Oh by the way everyone, when I burned my worthless stock certificate the ashes spelled out the words "SVS makes up stuff". I don't know what it means but....something to think about.

linki: Yes, I can follow SVS's thoughts, but it just relies on so many assumptions that just plain aren't true and could just as easily be explained by civ circumstances and civ behavior. Don't you think that some of what she's claiming is kind of a stretch?

Also, i am not "claiming" anything, I said about 8,000 times that it is a theory.

Not entirely true. You are claiming the whole Silver Buddha thing, which takes a leap of faith and trust in you to believe.

[Sophie]

I kind of read zombad reaction as a frustrated civ, but i could be wrong since im often wrong about this. Is there a posdibilty she is teææing the truth, though? It reminds me of when im wrongfully accused by many (like in rr) and the frustration thatvbrings

[Golden]

Whoah, sophie, hold up on all those vowel mutations. aeaeaeae to you too!

[LizKeen]

You seem to back peddle on everything you say Liz and that is very incriminating IMO.

I don't mean to. Sometimes I go with something the minute it hits me and then later, after having time to think it out, feel a little differently. Such as the suspicion of you.

I'm less certain about LizKeen. I agree with Epi that the "case" against Vomps was basically an empty WOT, but I'm wondering if she isn't under some sort of "enthrallment" where she has to make a case on someone? I dunno if that's how that role works or not, but it's something to consider maybe?

I could be shooting myself in the foot by saying this, but I'm not being enthralled. What does WOT mean? I was making the point that Vomps posts were not at all helpful in any way.

I don't have Epi down a civvie or indy or a baddie. I think he is looking for baddies as I agree with some of his thoughts. What's your point exactly?

I have to agree with LongCon here. If you don't know his allegiance than you can't know if he's really looking for baddies. But I don't really want to start a long rehash of that b/f between you two either.

LzKn rmvd pgnss’ psts frm cntxt.

I couldn't figure out what pgnss meant. The closest I could get was prognosis.*facepalm* I posted and comment the posts of yours that didn't make me feel like you were being particularly civvie in the order you posted them. If I had posted all of your posts people would still be reading it because it would be epically wrong. Do you requote all their posts when you're trying to make a case?

I'm not sure why you would suspect me LizKeen. I specifically said - twice - that I would wait for your responses before I made any decision about whether you were a suspect or not. This just looks like a list of people who have mentioned you. But tell me what you find suspicious or questions you have about me and I will respond.

As far as I can see all my questions of you have been answered.

If felt to me as if you, Epi and Elohcin might be teammates trying to push the lynch on me. TH, I caught flat out in a lie although she will probably say it was a guess and as I stated I don't think Vomp is trying to help the civvies at all.

Liz, though you made comments on some of Epi's points in general I don't see where you answered his case or Golden's few points about you. I'm still holding out until I hear your responses.

Okay, what exactly do you want to know?

TH being quiet this long? Is there some way they could both be silenced?

If she does not post all day and TH does not who would fake it? Not sure but I doubt there are two silencer roles. Maybe an item could account for this?

Pgnss thnks Glrck trgtd smn t gv hs wll t. Th prsn h trgtd ws th Blnd Bst, Crl vn Trsslr.

*rl chck*

f Pgnss s rght, ppl shld lk fr sddn cs md gnst smn.

If that post is about my case about you it has nothing to do with anyone targeting me. I want to be very clear, I have not been targeted with anything. Unless someone used their extra votes against me. Which does worry me tbh.

So we are actually going to wait for the info dump now?

Seriously.

I was hoping whoever had those ear tubes might have something to say, but I can see 5 possibilities: either they didn't use them, got blocked, didn't hear a mafia convo, are choosing not to say to not make themselves a target or BR took them from me Night One and then got killed and they're in the hands of the mafia. BR could clear up that last one.

So we are actually going to wait for the info dump now?

We don't have to. We could just start voting Epignosis.

Clearly not gonna happen.

Maybe if someone less prolific than TH appeared silenced it might make it more believable that zomba is the one who is really silenced. However, I think I would have seen that as the baddies silencing one of their own given the situation. I am not going to vote yet though, in case something rl happened today I want to at least give her part of tomorrow to respond to whats been said.

ZOMBA IS NOT SILENCED!!! I WILL NEVER BE SILENCED.

I don't know why but this made me laugh.

Oh by the way everyone, when I burned my worthless stock certificate the ashes spelled out the words "SVS makes up stuff". I don't know what it means but....something to think about.

And you didn't say this before? That's rather frustrating/odd when I was making my suspicions of SVS known and sticking my neck out saying what I heard in the ear tubes you said nothing about this.

ct fght

And it's highly entertaining.

Not when you are already under attack. Too late then. A good offense keeps attacks at bay, and prevents attacks from happening, but once attacks have started, the best defense is a good defense.

per Sun Tzu

Now really, I have to get up in like 6.5 hours lol.

I've been defending myself like crazy!


Could someone keep decoding Epignosis? I can't always understand him.

[LizKeen]

I couldn't figure out what pgnss meant. The closest I could get was prognosis.*facepalm* I posted and comment the posts of yours that didn't make me feel like you were being particularly civvie in the order you posted them. If I had posted all of your posts people would still be reading it because it would be epically wrong. Do you requote all their posts when you're trying to make a case?

This should have read epically long, not epically wrong. And no it wasn't some Freudian slip.


Also, noone ever responded to my question about Epi's and LC's Day 1 back-and-forth about who was lying. I clearly don't trust Epi but oes someone who has played with them both have an opinion there.

[Golden]

I have decoded all the posts of Epi that I think you actually need to know. I'm only not translating those which either seem obvious or aren't fundamental.

[Epignosis]

LzKn rmvd pgnss’ psts frm cntxt.

I couldn't figure out what pgnss meant. The closest I could get was prognosis.*facepalm* I posted and comment the posts of yours that didn't make me feel like you were being particularly civvie in the order you posted them. If I had posted all of your posts people would still be reading it because it would be epically wrong. Do you requote all their posts when you're trying to make a case?

Hmm.

[Golden]

I couldn't figure out what pgnss meant. The closest I could get was prognosis.*facepalm* I posted and comment the posts of yours that didn't make me feel like you were being particularly civvie in the order you posted them. If I had posted all of your posts people would still be reading it because it would be epically wrong. Do you requote all their posts when you're trying to make a case?

This should have read epically long, not epically wrong. And no it wasn't some Freudian slip.

Also, noone ever responded to my question about Epi's and LC's Day 1 back-and-forth about who was lying. I clearly don't trust Epi but oes someone who has played with them both have an opinion there.

As far as things go, it was a pretty funny slip, though

As for LC and epi, I don't know what to make of it.

[LizKeen]

LzKn rmvd pgnss’ psts frm cntxt.

I couldn't figure out what pgnss meant. The closest I could get was prognosis.*facepalm* I posted and comment the posts of yours that didn't make me feel like you were being particularly civvie in the order you posted them. If I had posted all of your posts people would still be reading it because it would be epically wrong. Do you requote all their posts when you're trying to make a case?

Hmm.

I should have highlighted ALL there. You know how many O/T and sarcastic post there are in this game? Not to mention about one whole page of you and LC arguing about who was lying?

Speaking of rereading posts:

Epi, my thoughts right now on Liz is that she should have spent time defending against the two cases out there on her rather than give us half a case which she then said she didn't believe anymore and a recitation of Vompatti's posts. I'm pretty sure she said she had a case to present prior to the two cases against her but given the situation I think she should have defended first. I'll still hold judgement until I see her response but I'm not liking how it's going so far.

How do you feel about her Epi?

Bd. Mkng lk sh's hlpfl snc sh qtd Vmptt? Bllsht. Hr actvt rqrd lttl tm. Sh md ppl thnk sh ws nt cpble f pstng hr thghts rgrdng rbbt8, bt tht tk lttl ffrt!

If you had any idea how much time I've spent rereading posts and requoting and making comments when I'm here you would not make that comment. If I got paid for it I could the family out to a VERY nice meal.

[Epignosis]

[Dom]

I kind of read zombad reaction as a frustrated civ, but i could be wrong since im often wrong about this. Is there a posdibilty she is teææing the truth, though? It reminds me of when im wrongfully accused by many (like in rr) and the frustration thatvbrings

nah.

I couldn't figure out what pgnss meant. The closest I could get was prognosis.*facepalm* I posted and comment the posts of yours that didn't make me feel like you were being particularly civvie in the order you posted them. If I had posted all of your posts people would still be reading it because it would be epically wrong. Do you requote all their posts when you're trying to make a case?

This should have read epically long, not epically wrong. And no it wasn't some Freudian slip.


Also, noone ever responded to my question about Epi's and LC's Day 1 back-and-forth about who was lying. I clearly don't trust Epi but oes someone who has played with them both have an opinion there.

TBH if one of them is bad-- I'm leaning LC. I'm not seeing bad Epig... yet at least.

[Dom]

I voted.

[Golden]

I was/am hoping zombs had more to say today. I'm gonna be quite busy tomorrow and want to vote tonight, ideally.

[LizKeen]

Thank you Dom for being the one and only who responded so far.

Epi, did you make a post that exonerated you from being bad? Requote your own posts if so. If you are civvie I'm sure you'd like to kill me at this point just for aggravating the crap out of you. But I just don't feel good about your eye suddenly being on me today.

The people on Michigan Avenue last night were Epi, Long Con, A Person, TH and bwt so it seems likely one of them was the source? I've been trying to figure out the wording in that Night Post and I can't really decide what to make of it. I don't however think it was something Llama came up with. It feels like there's a word missing or two missing at the beginning of the sentence that starts with "A Team", probably doesn't matter but I'm just curious. I'm not sure why the mafia would say it and assume they were going to be successful on targeting SVS since there's no way to be sure a kill will go through. It doesn't sound like Jeff Darrell as it's his paper and it says a "source".


And I made a mistake earlier, before someone calls me out on it, I said there were roles that could add votes but when I was doing a role check I see it's only celestials who can actually take away votes.

[Golden]

Hey, I responded

[Golden]

The people on Michigan Avenue last night were Epi, Long Con, A Person, TH and bwt so it seems likely one of them was the source? I've been trying to figure out the wording in that Night Post and I can't really decide what to make of it. I don't however think it was something Llama came up with. It feels like there's a word missing or two missing at the beginning of the sentence that starts with "A Team", probably doesn't matter but I'm just curious. I'm not sure why the mafia would say it and assume they were going to be successful on targeting SVS since there's no way to be sure a kill will go through. It doesn't sound like Jeff Darrell as it's his paper and it says a "source".

Hey, Liz, now I don't quite understand where Michigan St becomes relevant here... but the newspaper did make Archer relevant, so I'm wondering if we have overlooked how the role of street selection could play into this.

[Golden]

Oh, Michigan st is even named in the story... this makes me think differently about it.

[LizKeen]

"An exclusive source located on Michigan Avenue"


And I'm sorry Golden, I'm either quote failing or not responding when you try to be helpful.

[Zombarella]

Zomba, you never answered my question.

The thing is, I kind of have. Since the beginning of the game. I’ve given real, actual, truthful explanations of all the suspicions thrown my way. But…here is a post I made on Mar 21

Okay. I've spent some serious time with some host PMs and I've been talked down from the ledge. For all of you who are so obviously ready to "assume that Zomba is bad" because BF (or whoever) said, "My paper says I should kill Zomba" you need to check your logic...and the roles...and the items...and Llama's host style.

For ease of reference I have posted the roles below. Where does it say that baddies are the only only ones with money? Why couldn't I be the burglar or the inventor or the wealthy gad or the lawyer or someone who actually picked a valuable item. How do you know that I didn't lie about the stock certificate so that it wouldn't get stolen?

Any suspicion of me is pure speculation based on lazy baddie hunting or a baddie plot to lynch a civ. Whoever suggested that this might be a baddie plot to throw another baddie under the bus -- what?! Why would a baddie team do that on day 1? There are literally twice as many civs as baddies and you think that they would be like "oh, who cares if we're down one right out the gate?" I was on a baddie team last game and wouldn't have made any sense at all.

Roles:

Civilians: Kill All Mafia to Win
Gilrick Sandringham - The Jack of All Trades. Extremely well read and a master of taking on others’ identities. Also completely insane. Gets a different power every night.

Patrick McFee - The Cemetery Superintendent - Can role check the dead.

Tim Waldo - The Burglar - Can steal an item each night.

Mimi LeCompte - The Reptile Queen - Can send her reptiles after people, tormenting them.

John Cooper Jarndyce - The Sensationalist - Can create a scene which will enthrall two players for a day.

Jeff Darrell - The Ace Reporter - Finds out the location of various items, which he can choose to publish in his paper or not.

Philodexter Maxellus - The Poetry Publisher - Can post poems in the thread to share his thoughts.

John Barr - The Inventor of the Barr Bag - Can put one item in the Barr Bag, preventing it from being stolen.

Sophie Kratzenschneiderwümpel - The Litigious Lady - Files lawsuits to extract items from male roles.

Simon Grundt - The Feeble-Minded Detective - Gets info but there is a 50% chance it is wrong.

Casimer Jech - The Antique Dealer - Can trade his items for others each night. If the item is usable, both parties can immediately gain the benefit.

Oliver Oliver - The Wealthy Gad-About-Town - Gives himself BTSC with another player each night.

Luke McCracken - The Cracksman - Searches for the safe or Shrik’s vault, finding a secret inside in addition to any items stored there.

Chief O’Toole - The Police Chief - Can arrest someone each night, nullifying their vote the following day and their ability to use any items.

Sato Okimo - The Japanese Lawyer - Can execute wills, stock certificates and promissory notes.


Mafia: Outnumber Civilians and Celestials to Win
Macleish MacPherson - The Crooked Doctor - Can dispense medicine that does a variety of unsavory and often illegal things.

Ivan Kossakoff - The Strangler - Can silence every night.

Carl von Tresseler - The Blond Beast of Bremen - Kills every night.

Reed Bardeen - The Millionaire Anarchist - Becomes more powerful the more votes he takes (that don’t kill him.)

Gustav Shrik - The Banker - Can store papers in his vault.


Celestials: Survive and Possess All Five Treasures of the Orient to Win
Napoleon Foy - The Laundryman - Can wash another player’s clothes to remove a lynch vote. Clean people are less suspicious.

Wah Hung Fung - The King of Chinatown - Can target one person and learn one item they have.

Li Ling Lee - The Chop Suey Cook - Can feed someone t remove a lynch vote. Food is strength.

Legga the Human Spider - The Circus Performer - Her superior dexterity allows her to dodge one night kill.

Ichabod Chang - The Chinese Thief - Can steal from someone each night.

As I have said before – I didn’t vote because I was in jail and I was forbidden plain and simple.

I can see where a few are getting the idea that the newspaper thing makes me look bad, but it’s just plain not true. I don’t know who wrote that post. Maybe it was the baddies. But I’m not one of them. Maybe it was Llama. It seems more likely to me that it was Llama that wrote that post just based on the verbiage then anyone else. Also, it doesn’t make sense for any baddie team to try to defend someone who was in so much hot water. Or to do it so clumsily. It makes much more sense to that there are just two different wills.

Honestly, Juliets, I’ve posted ALL of this before and I feel like I’m talking in circles and that everyone is just ignoring what I say and focusing on their own agenda rather than the weaknesses in this case.

To SVS – I’m attacking your case because it is weak and I think that you have an ulterior motive in pushing for my lynch. A good offense? Why am I the only one that needs a good offense? You don’t have one. I’m gone for a little while and you put all these assumptions in the thread like they are some kind of fact. It’s a catch 22. If I didn’t defend myself you would ask me why I wasn’t.

I think that we should vote for people who aren’t reading for the reasons that I’ve mentioned before. I know that this is some kind of super offensive thing to say on some other mafia site, but it’s true. Baddies don’t have to read and civies that don’t read aren’t helping. When a player asks a question about something that has already been discussed at length or even answered three posts before, that should be good evidence that they aren’t putting in effort.

Please don’t lynch me. SVS was gung ho about BF = Civ. SVS voted for MM = Civ. SVS gunning for Zomba = Civ. There is a pattern emerging. We can’t let her get away with this.

[Zombarella]

I know my previous post is long but please read it before you vote for me. This whole lynch train is built on a house of cards.

[LizKeen]

Are you going to respond to me?

[Zombarella]

The fact that so many people can get away with not playing this game might be the reason why the baddies win all time. If you only vote for people who play then all the baddies have to do is sit back and watch the civs annihilate each other. How is that fun for anyone?