The Flash: Battle for the Gem Cities (Day 12)

[FZ.]

I meant why did you interpret Llama's tone as more than just his opinion?

Because he came in after Dream had already more than a few votes, and said it was Dream was the right way to go. After he said before, he doesn't like info dumping, or something in those lines, I thought that he decided to finally put his own thoughts and vote in a way that won't influence us. But I forgot that he couldn't have had that information that night anyway.

But that's kind of my point... Llama doesn't want us to be influenced by his vote, but you used that as a reason to be influenced by his vote. Just seemed off to me, given the specific players that are involved.

What do you mean by the underlined bit?

I thought that he allowed himself to vote something he thought was good only when there were enough votes on her already, thus he wouldn't be actively info dumping

[Bass_the_Clever]

I'm also going to vote MM.

[Long Con]

I hope MM is The Top. Maybe the kill will go away if we kill The Top?

I could see MM mind controlling himself with a strong Timmer slant, and then controlling BR similarly, for the non-Top cred. And hey... it certainly looks like it's his day, so I'll vote MM as well.

I'd really like to know if Llama's team ever investigated Roxy. It's the key to knowing whether or not we can trust Bass, and by extension, Timmer. Llama expressed distrust of Bass after he had had opportunity to check Roxy, and that hjas always stuck in my mind.

[Marmot]

I voted the marmot for now, he said he should be back from his backpedaling trip tomorrow so that leaves him plenty of time to participate

Why did you vote for the marmot?

So what do people think of Grodd's kill possibly going to Zoom? To me it makes the most sense to keep the Arch Villains kill in-house, as opposed to giving another one to the New Rogues, unless Plunder is dead?

As for today's lynch, I'm still inclined to distrust MM and think that's where we will find our Top.

Why do you think MM is where you will find the Top?

So what do people think of Grodd's kill possibly going to Zoom? To me it makes the most sense to keep the Arch Villains kill in-house, as opposed to giving another one to the New Rogues, unless Plunder is dead?

As for today's lynch, I'm still inclined to distrust MM and think that's where we will find our Top.

This makes total sense to me. Looking back, he was kinda annoyed when we tried to find alternatives to "Timmer" during the Timmer curse, didn't he? And I have never been forced by the Top, and if that role was connected to Timmer, I think I would have been.

I am going to trust Bass, who I am like super sure is not bad. Voting MM.

Choo-choo.

[Marmot]

Bass, why do you trust timmer?

[Marmot]

Does anybody even want to help me catch baddies!!!!!

You are seriously just going to sit back and say "Gee golly, I really hope MM is the Top. I think he could be but I don't really know. Ho ho ho."??? I've been gone for 60+ hours, I come back to a mere 30 posts of discussion and 4 votes for me? I'm not letting this happen. I am not letting myself get fucking lynched because of another "I don't really know who to lynch today". This happens every single game, and I feel like I'm always the default "lynch him because he's always bad" guy.

So who actually wants to do some shit today?

[Marmot]

I'm voting timmer for now.

[Sophie]

This makes no sense. MM has been civvie minsed, open to discussion, helping with the secrets, being helpful all around and now everyone wants to vote for him? This makes no sense.
Svs, do u actually think mm is bad?
Br what do u think?
Lc i ve seen you as one who in general in this game was eager to discuss posibilities and now you just go with mm?
Fz what do u think? Devin?

Im not shocked at timmer or bass voting for him, since timmer might wannq get suspicion off him and intO someone else and im not sure i trust bass


Anyways, can we discuss before tossing votes mms way? I think its a huge mistake

[Sophie]

Ill follow mm for now and vote for timmer, and will change it tomorrow if necessary

[Draconus]

Uhh yeah. I'm glad I'm not the only one who feels this came from left field. I would like more background on the MM votes. I've voted for Timmer before so I have no problem doing it again. I should have plenty of time to check in tomorrow before the poll closes tomorrow. Hopefully more develops around this...

[Marmot]

This makes no sense. MM has been civvie minsed, open to discussion, helping with the secrets, being helpful all around and now everyone wants to vote for him? This makes no sense.
Svs, do u actually think mm is bad?
Br what do u think?
Lc i ve seen you as one who in general in this game was eager to discuss posibilities and now you just go with mm?
Fz what do u think? Devin?

Im not shocked at timmer or bass voting for him, since timmer might wannq get suspicion off him and intO someone else and im not sure i trust bass


Anyways, can we discuss before tossing votes mms way? I think its a huge mistake

I don't know if I trust Bass either. I know his gut is usually spot-on when he's a civvie. In fact, I can't remember that last time he's gotten my alignment wrong in a game. His sudden suspicion of me is startling to me.

[Long Con]

Lc i ve seen you as one who in general in this game was eager to discuss posibilities and now you just go with mm?

When I made my last post, it looked like the MM lynch was already decided, now I see that there are some dissenting voices. MM's passionate plea has actually moved me as well, this is a crappy way to go down.

Here's the case today on MM:

I voted the marmot for now, he said he should be back from his backpedaling trip tomorrow so that leaves him plenty of time to participate

As for today's lynch, I'm still inclined to distrust MM and think that's where we will find our Top.

If the host post points to the top being the new killer, my vote goes to MM, I think it's the best chance at hitting that role.

Looking back, he was kinda annoyed when we tried to find alternatives to "Timmer" during the Timmer curse, didn't he? And I have never been forced by the Top, and if that role was connected to Timmer, I think I would have been.

I am going to trust Bass, who I am like super sure is not bad. Voting MM.

I'm also going to vote MM.

There is not much there. And it's the trusty-group of Bass, S~V~S, Timmer, and Turnip Head.

Turnip Head trusts Timmer because he doesn't believe Timmer would go after Bass 1.0 if he were a baddie. Even though, if Timmer is a New Rogue, he wouldn't have known if Bass 1.0 was bad or not, TH has never wavered in his trust.

Bass 2.0 is strongly riding the cred from his claim that Roxy was Captain Cold, and subsequently he looks like Heat Wave, but Llama posted this:

I don't think Timmer is a good choice. I'm inclined to vote for Bass, actually. I don't think I'm buying his bold claims.

So, that's, like, the opposite of trusting Bass due to a confirmation that Roxy was Cold.

I don't know why Turnip Head is trusted, but if Bass and Timmer are bad, and Turnip Head isn't, then of course they'd butter him up with the trusty-family shtick. To me, Turnip Head is one of the top suspects for being The Top himself, just like S~V~S.

And S~V~S has been riding the Bass train as well, as I recall. I'll be honest here, this game has been slow and slightly disjointed due to to much waiting for the host to tighten things up, and at the same time, I've been playing over on Jesus Toast Mafia as well, so in the last 3 or 4 days I have slightly lost focus on this game. Bass 2.0 trusts S~V~S, is there any other reason to trust her that has come up? Why does he trust her? Even if he's Heat Wave, I highly doubt Golden Glider got in and subsequently connected him to an Old Rogue S~V~S, so I'm counting that out. It ain't Rainbow Raider, and I don't think they're Detectives from the way Bass and Llama don't see eye to eye.

I don't believe in any trust that comes from map BTSC. Aces tricked Roxy completely that way.

I was being lazy earlier when I said I'd vote Metalmarsh, because I saw the stack of votes on him, and it looked like it didn't make a difference. That was crappy, and it's too true that MM goes down like that far too often. I'd prefer a Bass or S~V~S lynch, and I'd REALLY love to hear Llama's opinion. He may not want to infodrop, but that doesn't mean he has to let someone go down that he knows isn't a New Rogue.

[FZ.]

At this point, the only person I feel I can fully trust is LC. All others are still questionable to me.

I agree with LC that this game has slowed down substantially, and I've lost focus as well.
I'm not sure who's against who any more.

@Host, can you update the living and dead status on the first page please?

I want to trust both TImmer and TH. I can understand why TH thinks Timmer wouldn't out Bass 1 if he's a new rogue. It makes no sense even if the new Rogues didn't have BTSC. He made a very reasonable assumption and that would hurt the new Rogues in the long run. Maybe he didn't feel the uncomfortable feelings of voting a team mate, because he could always tell Bass, he was just throwing out accusations and didn't think it would stick. But I doubt it's likely he'd do that.
That's why I trust Timmer, and I understand why TH would as well. Whether TH can be trusted is another question. The thing that's bothering me about TH is that he's not coming up with any theories like I expect him to. But I'm getting a genuine vibe from him. Still not sure.

Timmer keeps vouching for SVS. If I can trust Timmer, should I trust what he's saying? At the moment, I trust him, so I'm extending that to SVS.

Bass started out suspicious of TImmer but then came in later and said he wasn't suspicious of him any more. I wonder if he found something at night, or did he think that would make him look better?

BR this game, is not the BR I'm used to seeing, but no one really suspects her, and she was silenced. I guess I'm missing something.

Sofie's last post seemed like trying to save MM. But if he's really not bad, that would make her good. I guess that depends on MM' role.

I've never seen MM lynched, so I have no idea how it usually ends, but I don't get his playing style either. He's a complete riddle to me. I don't find him helpful either.

Then, there's Sonjey. Could he have been a missing killer and that's why they inherited Grod's kill?

Did I miss anyone?

[Bass_the_Clever]

I don't know why people assume I'm Heat Wave. The reason I think Roxy was Captain Cold was because who was night killed by Captain Cold.
LC you did a lot of the decoding so I'm surprised you can't figure out who I am. I really think timmer is playing for a civvie aligned win I also think MM is scum. When MM flips bad I would lynch Sophie next then I would go ahead and take a real good look at LC. Well those are my thoughts so now you guys can lead a lynch on me if you want.

[Long Con]

I don't know why people assume I'm Heat Wave. The reason I think Roxy was Captain Cold was because who was night killed by Captain Cold.
LC you did a lot of the decoding so I'm surprised you can't figure out who I am. I really think timmer is playing for a civvie aligned win I also think MM is scum. When MM flips bad I would lynch Sophie next then I would go ahead and take a real good look at LC. Well those are my thoughts so now you guys can lead a lynch on me if you want.

Interesting. I haven't tried to figure out a different role for you because I was just assuming you are Heat Wave and were just discreet about it. If you really aren't Heat Wave, then pick a number between one and ten to make me trust you more.

[Marmot]

I don't know why people assume I'm Heat Wave. The reason I think Roxy was Captain Cold was because who was night killed by Captain Cold.
LC you did a lot of the decoding so I'm surprised you can't figure out who I am. I really think timmer is playing for a civvie aligned win I also think MM is scum. When MM flips bad I would lynch Sophie next then I would go ahead and take a real good look at LC. Well those are my thoughts so now you guys can lead a lynch on me if you want.

Lynching me would not get you what you are hoping for. You don't know my alignment, so don't count those eggs just yet.




Question for TH and timmer. We have not lynched a New Rogue since Day 2. Why do you continue to trust each other after an early bout of BTSC?

[thellama73]

I disappear for a little while and you find yourselves going down the rabbit hole. I'm voting for Timmer. I do not think an MM lynch will help anybody win this game.

[Marmot]

I disappear for a little while and you find yourselves going down the rabbit hole. I'm voting for Timmer. I do not think an MM lynch will help anybody win this game.

In my defense, I was thrown in.

[thellama73]

I disappear for a little while and you find yourselves going down the rabbit hole. I'm voting for Timmer. I do not think an MM lynch will help anybody win this game.

In my defense, I was thrown in.

I don't accept your defense. You should have known better.

[Marmot]

I disappear for a little while and you find yourselves going down the rabbit hole. I'm voting for Timmer. I do not think an MM lynch will help anybody win this game.

In my defense, I was thrown in.

I don't accept your defense. You should have known better.

This is true.

[Marmot]

At this point, the only person I feel I can fully trust is LC. All others are still questionable to me.

I agree with LC that this game has slowed down substantially, and I've lost focus as well.
I'm not sure who's against who any more.

@Host, can you update the living and dead status on the first page please?

I want to trust both TImmer and TH. I can understand why TH thinks Timmer wouldn't out Bass 1 if he's a new rogue. It makes no sense even if the new Rogues didn't have BTSC. He made a very reasonable assumption and that would hurt the new Rogues in the long run. Maybe he didn't feel the uncomfortable feelings of voting a team mate, because he could always tell Bass, he was just throwing out accusations and didn't think it would stick. But I doubt it's likely he'd do that.
That's why I trust Timmer, and I understand why TH would as well. Whether TH can be trusted is another question. The thing that's bothering me about TH is that he's not coming up with any theories like I expect him to. But I'm getting a genuine vibe from him. Still not sure.

Timmer keeps vouching for SVS. If I can trust Timmer, should I trust what he's saying? At the moment, I trust him, so I'm extending that to SVS.

Bass started out suspicious of TImmer but then came in later and said he wasn't suspicious of him any more. I wonder if he found something at night, or did he think that would make him look better?

BR this game, is not the BR I'm used to seeing, but no one really suspects her, and she was silenced. I guess I'm missing something.

Sofie's last post seemed like trying to save MM. But if he's really not bad, that would make her good. I guess that depends on MM' role.

I've never seen MM lynched, so I have no idea how it usually ends, but I don't get his playing style either. He's a complete riddle to me. I don't find him helpful either.

Then, there's Sonjey. Could he have been a missing killer and that's why they inherited Grod's kill?

Did I miss anyone?

One thing we are all forgetting about timmer going after Bass on Day 2 was the fact that timmer himself was under fire at the time. Epignosis made a case against his wife Elohcin (the player timmer replaced) on Day 1, to which Elohcin made some not so great responses, as timmer himself even acknowledged.

I do not think Soneji is a killer. He has been absent since Wednesday, so would not have been around to kill this past night period.

[Long Con]

I agree about Soneji not being The Top (or the recent killer who is strongly assumed to be The Top), but he could very well be Plunder, who we haven't seen since Night 2... possibly. These mystery killers make it a lot harder to detective.

[FZ.]

Maybe I misunderstood. I thought that the baddies inherited Grodd's killing because their kill was not used due to the killer not playing. That's why I thought it was Sonjey, and I thought now they got another way to kill. I guess I got it wrong.

By the way, since the first page is not updated, can anyone remind me who is still alive?

[Marmot]

Maybe I misunderstood. I thought that the baddies inherited Grodd's killing because their kill was not used due to the killer not playing. That's why I thought it was Sonjey, and I thought now they got another way to kill. I guess I got it wrong.

By the way, since the first page is not updated, can anyone remind me who is still alive?

I can verify that everyone in the lynch poll is alive. No more and no less than that.

13 players total, possibly 5 of them being New Rogues.

[Draconus]

I agree about Soneji not being The Top (or the recent killer who is strongly assumed to be The Top), but he could very well be Plunder, who we haven't seen since Night 2... possibly. These mystery killers make it a lot harder to detective.

I agree 100% with this. I think Soniji would be a good candidate for the next lynch.

[Draconus]

Maybe I misunderstood. I thought that the baddies inherited Grodd's killing because their kill was not used due to the killer not playing. That's why I thought it was Sonjey, and I thought now they got another way to kill. I guess I got it wrong.

By the way, since the first page is not updated, can anyone remind me who is still alive?

The way I read it: Grodd is dead, so the remaining "Arch Villain" (assuming one is alive, of course) inherits his kill. I don't know why another faction would inherit the serial killer's kill, even if their own killer is AFK. I don't think the host would mod that way, and then announce it in the host post. Then again I've never played a MR game before

[Marmot]

I agree about Soneji not being The Top (or the recent killer who is strongly assumed to be The Top), but he could very well be Plunder, who we haven't seen since Night 2... possibly. These mystery killers make it a lot harder to detective.

But there's still the fact that two parties tried to kill Bullzeye on Night 4, and llama's team was not one of them.

[Long Con]

And the way the last night post was written... it really reads like there was a Trickster-Top confluence of events.

[Marmot]

Maybe I misunderstood. I thought that the baddies inherited Grodd's killing because their kill was not used due to the killer not playing. That's why I thought it was Sonjey, and I thought now they got another way to kill. I guess I got it wrong.

By the way, since the first page is not updated, can anyone remind me who is still alive?

The way I read it: Grodd is dead, so the remaining "Arch Villain" (assuming one is alive, of course) inherits his kill. I don't know why another faction would inherit the serial killer's kill, even if their own killer is AFK. I don't think the host would mod that way, and then announce it in the host post. Then again I've never played a MR game before

From the last nightkill, it appears that a killer tried to kill the Trickster's target. As the role has been deciphered.

Tricker's abilities - "Leaves a “trap” on one player during even nights. If that player is targeted, the action is reversed"

According to the nightkill post, the killer tried to kill a player, but the action was reversed, and the knife flung back at the killer. But the killer was able to "redirect" the kill elsewhere. Hence LC's assumption that the Top (the secret role) is the new killer.

Secret Role's Abilities - ????????????????? – He may spin… really fast. Night kills directed at him will be redirected at a random player. His spinning abilities somehow gave him the power to mind control as well. Every night, he may choose a player to act as he wishes during the next day.



Anyway, I agree with LC on this one. I think the Top is the new killer as well.

[Long Con]

I just have to say... it's got to be "he can spin.... really fast." "May" is weird.

[Marmot]

I just have to say... it's got to be "he can spin.... really fast." "May" is weird.

You can may be right. :P

[Black Rock]

I'm going to vote TH, he is my actual suspect for the killing Top.

[Draconus]

Maybe I misunderstood. I thought that the baddies inherited Grodd's killing because their kill was not used due to the killer not playing. That's why I thought it was Sonjey, and I thought now they got another way to kill. I guess I got it wrong.

By the way, since the first page is not updated, can anyone remind me who is still alive?

The way I read it: Grodd is dead, so the remaining "Arch Villain" (assuming one is alive, of course) inherits his kill. I don't know why another faction would inherit the serial killer's kill, even if their own killer is AFK. I don't think the host would mod that way, and then announce it in the host post. Then again I've never played a MR game before

From the last nightkill, it appears that a killer tried to kill the Trickster's target. As the role has been deciphered.

Tricker's abilities - "Leaves a “trap” on one player during even nights. If that player is targeted, the action is reversed"

According to the nightkill post, the killer tried to kill a player, but the action was reversed, and the knife flung back at the killer. But the killer was able to "redirect" the kill elsewhere. Hence LC's assumption that the Top (the secret role) is the new killer.

Secret Role's Abilities - ????????????????? – He may spin… really fast. Night kills directed at him will be redirected at a random player. His spinning abilities somehow gave him the power to mind control as well. Every night, he may choose a player to act as he wishes during the next day.



Anyway, I agree with LC on this one. I think the Top is the new killer as well.

Ooooh, that's a good catch. I did not see this before.

[Marmot]

I'm going to vote TH, he is my actual suspect for the killing Top.

I suppose that is possible, but why do you think TH over timmer?

I also still would like to hear from timmer why he still trusts TH. TH has stated his reasoning multiple times already for the reciprocation. But looking back, here is the only real answer from timmer I could find.

Okay, so I'm looking at today like this. We don't know how many New Rogues are left, but we do know that unless a series of people have been lying profusely, The Top is still alive.

So who is The Top? Correct me if I'm wrong, but the list of people claiming to have been mind controlled so far is rabbit, MM and BR? I feel like I've missed one. Rabbit had to vote for BF, BR had to push Roxy/Aces and couldn't go against me, and MM had to put my name in everything. Is that all correct?

So first off, we can rule out the absent players, and those who just subbed in. Honestly, if someone is deliberately never posting but sending in night actions, I quit mafia, that's just weak - so I personally rule out Soniji, Devin, Dreams here. I also rule out myself, though I know some of you may not. We can rule out llama as well.

So that leaves Bass 2, Black Rock, FZ, Long Con, MM, rabbit, Sophie, Daisy, SVS, TH.

Making someone say "Timmer" is not really Sophie's style, so I doubt it's her. Bass 2.0 wouldn't have made Black Rock go after Roxy/Aces as he has been solidly in support of Roxy, so it wouldn't be him. I don't really know FZ, so I'll need others to fill in an opinion there. TH has been supportive of me all game, so I doubt this is a TH thing. I would HOPE this hasn't been rabbit's doing; he's kind of not around and has admitted he doesn't have time for the game. To not post but to send in night actions such as these wouldn't be something he did, I think. And I still think Daisy's posts around when she thought she was going to be lynched point to her being an indy of some kind.

So I'm left with Black Rock, Long Con, MM, SVS. For reasons I can't say, I personally rule out SVS from the list. I don't know her role or anything that specific, but I do not think SVS is the one laying mind controls on. She could be bad, but not The Top, UNLESS there is a mind control I'm missing... have I missed one?

Which drops me to LC, BR and MM.

For me, it comes down to... who self-targeted versus is this LC's doing? I'm going to declare that I think it is MM. BR's stated mind control was subtle and very strategic; force her to concentrate on one set of suspicions and not another. It cries out solid manipulation. Rabbit's was more simple, but still very strategic; make a case against bf. But what was MM's? Say "Timmer" all over every post. There is nothing strategic about it, at all. It's a gag act, a silly thing to annoy people and generate some chuckles.

The "say Timmer" mind control does not fit the other two. Thus, I can only come to the conclusion that that one is false.

I'm voting MM today. Things that will potentially change my mind; if someone mentions a curse I forgot that changes the tilt of my case, or if someone can show how FZ could have done all of this, mores than MM's doing it.

Somebody help me out here. Does their continued trust in each other not bother anyone else?

Remember when TH, DH, and timmer all had BTSC togehter early on? But then timmer gained BTSC with Roxy later (in the middle of Day 3 I believe)? Looking back, Roxy suddenly was not interested in lynching timmer when this happened, and turned her attention to DH instead. After hounding him for the second part of Day 3, she killed him that night (assuming she is actually Captain Cold, which both timmer and Bass have suggested).

I actually didn't see anything wrong with DH. He definitely wasn't a Detective, and probably wasn't an Old Rogue, but I also don't believe he was a baddie (so probably an Independent Rogue). Did timmer try to convince Roxy in BTSC that DH was actually bad?

Is my conspiracy wild enough yet? I fear the ideas here may be a bit far-fetched, but something does not seem right to me.



Another note. I also think that Spacedaisy was Heat Wave. Her activity dipped right around the time that Roxy was NK'd and blindfaeth was lynched (her BTSC buddies). And also, I think the role secrets of Heat Wave are concurrent with Spacedaisy avoiding the lynch on Day 3.1 (and the map shuffling thereafter).

[Black Rock]

I think TH was right and Timmer was set up. I also think TH did the set up while looking good supporting him. I think TH is very confidant and I don't trust him.

[Bass_the_Clever]

I think we are seeing the old rouges numbers coming in to save MM.

[Bass_the_Clever]

From what I know that I assume is right timmer isn't someone we shoulld vote for if you are trying to help the old rouges win..

[FZ.]

I think we are seeing the old rouges numbers coming in to save MM.

You mean new rogues?
If so, why? They are making sense. Especially BR

[Bass_the_Clever]

Yeah new rouges, my bad. Yeah I'm not sure aboout TH and I think BR is making a good case but everyone is voting Timmer not TH. The reason I think its a save is because I think MM is bad I also think Sophie is bad.

[FZ.]

Why do you think MM and Sophie are bad?

[Bass_the_Clever]

Why do you think MM and Sophie are bad?

I can't talk about why I think MM is bad. I think Sophie is bad because the way she is defending MM and the way she has played all game.

[Marmot]

Yeah new rouges, my bad. Yeah I'm not sure aboout TH and I think BR is making a good case but everyone is voting Timmer not TH. The reason I think its a save is because I think MM is bad I also think Sophie is bad.

I wouldn't mind lynching TH, but I am not moving my vote right now for obvious reasons.

[Marmot]

Why do you think MM and Sophie are bad?

I can't talk about why I think MM is bad. I think Sophie is bad because the way she is defending MM and the way she has played all game.

Well that doesn't really help your case. The only reason that you have brought forth against me has been countered, and you've already acknowledged it.

Do vote patterns affect your reasoning at all?

[Draconus]

Why do you think MM and Sophie are bad?

I can't talk about why I think MM is bad. I think Sophie is bad because the way she is defending MM and the way she has played all game.

I asked for background for this accusation when I voted for Timmer. You're saying you won't say anything to convince me that MM is the right way to go?
Atm, I'm actually considering moving my vote to TH so that MM can. Obviously at least one more player needs to do the same.

[FZ.]

Where exactly are Timmer and TH? f they don't show up soon, I'll be tempted to vote TH myself

[Bass_the_Clever]

Why do you think MM and Sophie are bad?

I can't talk about why I think MM is bad. I think Sophie is bad because the way she is defending MM and the way she has played all game.

I asked for background for this accusation when I voted for Timmer. You're saying you won't say anything to convince me that MM is the right way to go?
Atm, I'm actually considering moving my vote to TH so that MM can. Obviously at least one more player needs to do the same.

I can't, sorry folks.

[Marmot]

Where exactly are Timmer and TH? f they don't show up soon, I'll be tempted to vote TH myself

What other player are you tempted to vote for otherwise?

[Marmot]

Why do you think MM and Sophie are bad?

I can't talk about why I think MM is bad. I think Sophie is bad because the way she is defending MM and the way she has played all game.

I asked for background for this accusation when I voted for Timmer. You're saying you won't say anything to convince me that MM is the right way to go?
Atm, I'm actually considering moving my vote to TH so that MM can. Obviously at least one more player needs to do the same.

I can't, sorry folks.

I don't understand at all. You've accused me of not helping the civilians (which as I said has been countered), but you don't appear to be doing so yourself.

[FZ.]

Where exactly are Timmer and TH? f they don't show up soon, I'll be tempted to vote TH myself

What other player are you tempted to vote for otherwise?

I'm literally torn between the two sides that are forming here. I feel like I've lost touch with this game, and I'm just skating by, being influenced by anyone who says anything. This saddens me, because I don't like playing like that, but it is what it is.
Again, the thing that's making me not vote you, is llama vouching for you. I wonder now, if TH was trying to discredit llama when he asked why I'm giving his opinions so much credit

[Bass_the_Clever]

Why do you think MM and Sophie are bad?

I can't talk about why I think MM is bad. I think Sophie is bad because the way she is defending MM and the way she has played all game.

I asked for background for this accusation when I voted for Timmer. You're saying you won't say anything to convince me that MM is the right way to go?
Atm, I'm actually considering moving my vote to TH so that MM can. Obviously at least one more player needs to do the same.

I can't, sorry folks.

I don't understand at all. You've accused me of not helping the civilians (which as I said has been countered), but you don't appear to be doing so yourself.

I mean I have been trying to help. I could be wrong about you but I am 95% sure that I'm right.