[ENDGAME] Bullets Over Broadway Mafia

#3801

Epignosis wrote:I'm pleased to see brown was used in this "rainbow read." It's fitting.

It's fitting for you, Mr. Brown.

However, I am no Mr. Brown.

#3802

Voted.

#3803

A cursory glance at fingersplints' post history leaves me feeling pretty good about her, and there is very little chance that I'll be voting for her today.
I was planning to do a thorough casing of splints, nutella, neverwhere, and DFaraday right now but I just got invited to go on some outdoor adventures and could say no. I don't know if I'll have time to do all my homework before the deadline, but at this point my vote seems most likely to end up on Nutella or (if Nutella is able to convince me she's town) Neverwhere.

If anyone has anything to say about any of those four names, please speak up. Here's my mini rainbow rankings of the four of them, bearing in mind that I've still not done as much research as I'd like since being resurrected:
fingersplints
DFaraday
Neverwhere
Nutella

niju remains my top suspect, but her case doesn't seem to be catching on still.

#3804

Hey Sloonei.

Dem figures from da hood.

How corrupted you is?

#3805

Spacedaisy for president!

#3806

Changed vote to Sloonei.

Didn't like the response I got.

**http://www.last.fm/user/nutella23** · #3807

Sloonei, what do you think of Spacedaisy reading me as my usual town self? Considering she has played with me before lots of times and you never have.

#3808

I've played with you a bunch as well and I am reading you as bad so

#3809

Why do you expect one person reading you as town who has admitted she doesn't plan on reading the whole thread to greatly influence his decision?

#3810

Before that is taken the wrong way, if I were in SD's situation I doubt I would read the entire thread either. and I am not saying her opinion should be completely ignored. I just find Nutella saying that weird. (Unsurprising since I obviously think she is bad) Having played a lot with someone doesn't automatically mean you read them better then someone who hasn't played a lot with them.

I'd be interested to hear what SVS has to say. I don't think she has posted at all since the last day period.

#3811

I moved my vote to nutella. I think any of my oranges or reds are appealing lynch options, and I haven't been inspired by nutella's recent responses.

#3812

Sloonei, what are your thoughts on Neverwhere specifically? I saw that you'd given the GTH mafia read, but I don't recall you saying much else.

#3813

Also Sloonei, you had asked earlier w/r/t my case on DFaraday why I am so certain TinyBubbles was town.

I'm not. I am treating every player who has flipped town on death as though they were a townie. The Jekyll/Hyde character does exist, but I don't think it's advisable to make significant strategic alterations based on theories of any specific dead player being that role.

#3814

I acknowledge that I never finished the ISO I had started on Golden. I decided there were pressing matters to attend to and that my time in this thread could be better spent. Does anyone feel it would be beneficial for me to continue that task?

**http://www.last.fm/user/nutella23** · #3815

Well I see that no matter how much I try to defend myself I can't sway you guys from your tunnel vision. This always happens to me as a civ, I'm just so terrible at defending myself

Just like when I was Jacob in Biblical mafia and everyone mistakenly thought I was bad for a while. It's pretty frustrating that nothing I say will ever be taken seriously. And no one (besides Spacedaisy, thanks) ever considers my play in previous games to see that this is unfortunately how I usually am as a civ. But I wish the rest of the civvies good luck in winning this game, we had a good streak toward the beginning but now we keep lynching good guys. Once again I will recommend looking for the baddies in Neverwhere, DFaraday, Splints, possibly Metalmarsh and I'd even consider a corrupted Sloonei. Good luck.

#3816

Hey gang, let's lynch Neverwhere.

I understand the nutella suspicion and clearly agree with it, but right now I am getting a troubling sensation -- that she's a low-hanging fruit and we're walking into the same trap as Days 8-10.

Whaddya say?

#3817

nutella wrote:Well I see that no matter how much I try to defend myself I can't sway you guys from your tunnel vision. This always happens to me as a civ, I'm just so terrible at defending myself Just like when I was Jacob in Biblical mafia and everyone mistakenly thought I was bad for a while. It's pretty frustrating that nothing I say will ever be taken seriously. And no one (besides Spacedaisy, thanks) ever considers my play in previous games to see that this is unfortunately how I usually am as a civ. But I wish the rest of the civvies good luck in winning this game, we had a good streak toward the beginning but now we keep lynching good guys. Once again I will recommend looking for the baddies in Neverwhere, DFaraday, Splints, possibly Metalmarsh and I'd even consider a corrupted Sloonei. Good luck.

Three hours to go. Changeable votes. You're ahead by two.

Addendum: One.

#3818

I was just going to say that nutella's post right here at the top of this page reads as very genuine to me. I've never played with her before, so I cannot speak for anything of her past behavior, but the tone of that post felt like the right amount of desperation for a townie at this stage in a lynch. I would appreciate some confirmation on the honesty of her own meta-critique, if anyone can.

#3819

nutella is not by any means out of the woods for me yet, but that post may have momentarily swayed me to lean more toward Neverwhere.
My mind is not made up and I need to look into their posts again before I can come to a decision. I'm here until the deadline, probably.

#3820

Sloonei wrote:I was just going to say that nutella's post right here at the top of this page reads as very genuine to me.

Yep. This is one of those risky moments where a player has to make a judgment call.

You don't think she can fake this?!?!

She probably can. That's doesn't mean she is. I'm feeling moved at the moment.

#3821

Epignosis wrote:Hey Sloonei.

Dem figures from da hood.

How corrupted you is?

#3822

Epignosis wrote:Hey Sloonei.

Dem figures from da hood.

How corrupted you is?

10/10, corrupted to the bone.

#3823

Seems legit.

#3824

nutella wrote:Sloonei, what do you think of Spacedaisy reading me as my usual town self? Considering she has played with me before lots of times and you never have.

I would love to hear more about this, from anyone who has played with you before. You indicate that a number of people here have played with you. but have not yet commented on this. Who are they?

#3825

fingersplints wrote:I've played with you a bunch as well and I am reading you as bad so

Why? What specific points point you toward bad nutella?

#3826

Let's make this thread a madhouse postapalooza during this EOD. No quiet walks to the gallows, either as a prisoner, executioner, or observer.

#3827

JaggedJimmyJay wrote:Let's make this thread a madhouse postapalooza during this EOD. No quiet walks to the gallows, either as a prisoner, executioner, or observer.

Sounds fun.

Y'all enjoy.

#3828

Epignosis wrote:
JaggedJimmyJay wrote:Let's make this thread a madhouse postapalooza during this EOD. No quiet walks to the gallows, either as a prisoner, executioner, or observer.
Sounds fun.

Y'all enjoy.

POST

POST

POST

POST

POST

POST

POST

POST

POST

POST

POST

#3829

I'd have preferred it if nutella hadn't gone *poof* right after gaining a little support.

#3830

MOCK ME ALL YOU LIKE, ELOHNOSIS. I WILL ENJOY.

#3831

JaggedJimmyJay wrote:Sloonei, what are your thoughts on Neverwhere specifically? I saw that you'd given the GTH mafia read, but I don't recall you saying much else.

It's more of a gut feeling. I recall having some particularly strong lingering suspicion about her that I couldn't place my finger on while we were both around early in the game. I felt like I was close to having some sort of case on her but didn't have the time to look into it. She since seems to have left the game under some pretty rough circumstances and I hope everything is going okay on her end, but I can't help but suspect that she was scum in this game and has since abandoned her post. I wonder how this would fit in with metalmarsh's speculation about night kills.

#3832

JaggedJimmyJay wrote:MOCK ME ALL YOU LIKE, ELOHNOSIS. I WILL ENJOY.

I'll be mad with you, ravingjimmyjay.

#3833

I think Neverwhere is genuinely more suspicious than any player who is currently active in this game for the content of her posts. The period of inactivity is only icing on the cake for me. I think lynching her would represent both a move against a player numerous people suspect and a strategic shift away from the trend that has gone quite sour in recent phases (lynching the consensus suspect among players still participating).

I also hope all's groovy on the RL front.

#3834

I just discovered the two extra pages of smilies.

#3835

Hey look, Golden voted for me. I figured somebody would.

I'm going to assume my behavior on this page re: nutella is the reason and respond accordingly:

When someone makes a post that gives me pause about my crusade against them -- I am always going to allow that "pause" to be expressed publicly within my own behavior. Anything else is pure stubbornness/tunneling and I try not to play that way. I'll reference things in her post that inspired this reaction from me, even if it's largely a matter of intuition.

#3836

JaggedJimmyJay wrote:Also Sloonei, you had asked earlier w/r/t my case on DFaraday why I am so certain TinyBubbles was town.

I'm not. I am treating every player who has flipped town on death as though they were a townie. The Jekyll/Hyde character does exist, but I don't think it's advisable to make significant strategic alterations based on theories of any specific dead player being that role.

I just wanted to know you had acknowledged this possibility in the game. As insignificant as it appears, it is still the case that that role exists and we might at some point lynch a bad guy that appears good.
I would not bank on it at any point though.

Currently working on a fresh ISO for Neverwhere.

#3837

JaggedJimmyJay wrote:Hey look, Golden voted for me. I figured somebody would.

I'm going to assume my behavior on this page re: nutella is the reason and respond accordingly:

When someone makes a post that gives me pause about my crusade against them -- I am always going to allow that "pause" to be expressed publicly within my own behavior. Anything else is pure stubbornness/tunneling and I try not to play that way. I'll reference things in her post that inspired this reaction from me, even if it's largely a matter of intuition.

I can vouch that this is perfectly ordinary behavior for Jay.

#3838

Sloonei wrote:
JaggedJimmyJay wrote:Hey look, Golden voted for me. I figured somebody would.

I'm going to assume my behavior on this page re: nutella is the reason and respond accordingly:

When someone makes a post that gives me pause about my crusade against them -- I am always going to allow that "pause" to be expressed publicly within my own behavior. Anything else is pure stubbornness/tunneling and I try not to play that way. I'll reference things in her post that inspired this reaction from me, even if it's largely a matter of intuition.
I can vouch that this is perfectly ordinary behavior for Jay.

Regarding a silent vote that has been placed on him temporarily by a silent person?

**http://www.last.fm/user/nutella23** · #3839

JaggedJimmyJay wrote:I'd have preferred it if nutella hadn't gone *poof* right after gaining a little support.

Hey hey, I'm still here, just had an errand to run. Glad to see I might get another chance. I'm totally down to jump on a Neverwhere lynch, and it'll break this horrendous tie, so I'll go for it.

#3840

Epignosis wrote:
Sloonei wrote:
JaggedJimmyJay wrote:Hey look, Golden voted for me. I figured somebody would.

I'm going to assume my behavior on this page re: nutella is the reason and respond accordingly:

When someone makes a post that gives me pause about my crusade against them -- I am always going to allow that "pause" to be expressed publicly within my own behavior. Anything else is pure stubbornness/tunneling and I try not to play that way. I'll reference things in her post that inspired this reaction from me, even if it's largely a matter of intuition.
I can vouch that this is perfectly ordinary behavior for Jay.
Regarding a silent vote that has been placed on him temporarily by a silent person?

Yes, that as well.

#3841

nutella wrote:
JaggedJimmyJay wrote:I'd have preferred it if nutella hadn't gone *poof* right after gaining a little support.
Hey hey, I'm still here, just had an errand to run. Glad to see I might get another chance. I'm totally down to jump on a Neverwhere lynch, and it'll break this horrendous tie, so I'll go for it.

Why Neverwhere?

#3842

I should attempt to describe why I don't think to myself naw this is bull when I read this nutella post, as I suspect some people will.

nutella wrote:Well I see that no matter how much I try to defend myself I can't sway you guys from your tunnel vision.

This is not meaningful to me. I think it's easy to make this comment regardless of alignment.

nutella wrote:This always happens to me as a civ, I'm just so terrible at defending myself Just like when I was Jacob in Biblical mafia and everyone mistakenly thought I was bad for a while.

Same. One example of being lynched as a townie doesn't invalidate the suspicion now.

nutella wrote:It's pretty frustrating that nothing I say will ever be taken seriously. And no one (besides Spacedaisy, thanks) ever considers my play in previous games to see that this is unfortunately how I usually am as a civ.

Hey look, something is happening in my brain. And in my heart. There is an earnestness in this frustration, even a sadness, that is moving me. While part of nutella is trying to lash out at voters, another part is resigned to the a disappointing reality: I struggle to defend myself well. Is it a big pile of bullcrap?

Maybe. But when I view this post with a mind's eye on my recent exchange with her about potential disparities in her defenses versus reality, part of me felt I was being too strict. Demanding too much. Enough that she didn't have a reasonable chance to get out of my grip. I think she is conveying a mindset that can authentically progress from that.

nutella wrote:But I wish the rest of the civvies good luck in winning this game, we had a good streak toward the beginning but now we keep lynching good guys. Once again I will recommend looking for the baddies in Neverwhere, DFaraday, Splints, possibly Metalmarsh and I'd even consider a corrupted Sloonei. Good luck.

I agree with two suspects and wouldn't rule out any of them.

**http://www.last.fm/user/nutella23** · #3843

Seems Golden really wants to have a tie. :hmm:

#3844

I'm pleased that it's a tie right now. I won't be pleased if it's a tie when the deadline hits, but right now it is a very healthy thing.

#3845

I do like the way Golden has taken advantage of vote switches while silenced this phase. He has been all over the place, and I think that's more indicative of a town player trying to make proper use of his only weapon than a mafia player poking people or being opportunistic.

#3846

Let's look at Neverwhere again.

Spoiler: show

Her first real game-related post, after a bit of harmless Day 0 banter. She wordily explains her way into stating a suspicious against Hedgeowl, like she was looking for some specific avenue by which to enter into some early suspicions. She hints at being suspicious of three of the big names in the thread at the time but fails to state any reason or opinion about them, and then parrots another case which had been stated by Turnip Head earlier in the game. If Neverwhere is scum, then something like this might also help to clear Turnip Head (and whoever's replaced him, I'm not totally sure who's in for who at this point) from at least being on Neverwhere's team, as this post has the feel of a scum player seeking out a genuine case to piggy back on early in the game.

Spoiler: show

She continues to only vaguely hint at a case against SVS and cobalt, two popular names in the Day 1 discussion, and then waffles on her one definitively stated suspicion against Hedgeowl. It's understandable to lack some confidence on Day 1, but I am still skeptical of the language with which she is asserting her reads. She's, less subtly than some, giving herself reasons not to post a whole bunch in the thread. I accused a number of people of this early in the game, and it worked with at least one player (gamerguy), but I did not pick up on Neverwhere doing it as much. She does it pretty glaringly here, though.

Spoiler: show

Neverwhere wrote:
Canucklehead wrote:Thursday, June 18, 2015
9:23 AM

So I 100% lied lastnight and didn't read a damn thing or make a comment, but I'm doing so now. The wait is over, friends. Canuck is here, all is well, let your great fat bellies be soothed.
Here are my observations after reading (let's be honest, I barely read. Saying I skimmed would even be generous) Day 0/1. These are stream of consciousness notes that I'm taking as I browse, so apologies when I say shit that’s already been resolved/dealt with. Just look at it as a little extra dramatic irony in the narrative of my unfolding submersion in the game
- Lots of people I don’t recognize or know. Hi new friends! If you are at all serious about mafia, you are going to hate me. Yaaaaayyyy! *kermit arms*
- Lots of new jargon and acronyms being thrown around (gth? Iso? Yaaawwn) Looks like some of you spent too much time watching the big boys play during the Champions tournament and have become infected with their slang. Ick.
- For some reason, people are talking about the Reading Rainbow Kickstarter, and I am currently gulping coffee from my RR backer mug. I AM SOOOOO FUCKING COOOOOOOOL
- My thoughts on the perennial voting for newbs discussion: I hate and fear new people because they may be more clever than me and will steal away from me my very dear and much beloved mafia friends, so I advocate for shooting them in the face the minute they walk through the door. But that’s just me.
- Cobalt pops in with a not-so-humble brag about being MVP and having awesome instincts so we should fear her enormous mafia balls. Cool.
- Golden jumps in immediately after with a more subtle but no less eye-rolly brag about how he was sooooooo smart his first mafia game that everyone got naked and did a dance in his honour. Did everyone take an extra dose of Chest Puffing pills this morning?
- I'm in love with Gumshoe. Hi, sailor.
- Epi thinks "interesting" is a stupid word. I agree. The next time an undergrad hands me a paper telling me how "interesting" Measure for Measure is, I am going to set it alight and force them to watch their minutes of half-hearted effort burn to ashes in front of their eyes. HAHHAHHAHAHAHHAHAHHAHA. Take that, undergrad!
- Epi's analysis of LC is poorly received by SVS who is too savvy to be impressed by "enigmatic crap"
- People are now saying "interesting" a lot. I imagine this is a baddie plot to get Epi's face to explode. I wonder if it will work!
- Bwt shows up and Golden drops in an OT comment about bwt bussing a teamie that, were I being especially paranoid, I might think is laying the very first teeny seed in case bwt should need to be set-up for a lynching later…
- Epi is ON FIRE this game. His response to SVS is astute and on point
- Golden attempts to buddy up to Epi, but his buddying up to Epi is not as good as my buddying up to Epi
- I've just noticed that there is a player who has Paprika from Blue's Clues as their avatar. I will never vote for this person.
- OMG I'm only on page 5. This is super tedious and boring tbqh.
- Golden attempts to make a portmanteau about a colourless rainbow. Fails. Instead, makes a portmanteau evoking the plethora of wheat varieties available in this great nation.
- Gumshoe likes Golden's word. I no longer like Gumshoe.
- DDL (aka old me) pops in with a banal post. Yawn. Former me is boring.
- People are trying to gang up on Gumshoe, my beautiful love (I lied before, when I said it was over between us. I can't pretend anymore. Even if you do like Golden's horrible word, I LOVE YOU GUMSHOE! TAKEMENOW!), and should be prepared to face my wrath for impugning his spotless character.
- TH, our knight errant, comes pricking onto the plain with his sword directed at Hedgeowl's heart. I had no recollection of Hedgie's posts, and I just read them within the last hour, so I can definitely buy some sort of blendiness accusation there….I could also, however, buy an attempt by TH to redirect discussion away from Epi's attention suck and onto other things….
- MM votes for LC and runs.…
- Ooooh! I just replaced in! AND I CANNOT BE LYNCHED, BITCHES! HAHHAHAHAHHAHHA
- Epi strokes my ego by bringing up Roger Rabbit. I do very much like having my ego stroked, but I guarantee I will not play that well in this game. That might have been a once in a lifetime blaze of glory for me and it was fucking exhausting. For this game, I'm back to my usual MO of relying on snark and latching on to other people's suspicions to get me through this game.
- Scotty provides some nice cover for me by "speculating" that I'm neither mafia nor a civ power role. Thanks, Scotty!
- DDL comes back in to ruin my ill-gotten trust. Bastard.
- Dfaraday pops in with a post that makes it clear he hasn't really read the thread, and instead has only read a few people's impressions of the thread
- Paprika asks a lot of questions that she wants to seem important/probing….but I don't think she's hitting the analytical home runs she thinks she is
- MP WOT INCOMING!!!!! Hi, MP. Missed you.
- I basically skimmed the last couple of pages cuz I got bored.

Right now, I'd be willing to vote for Golden, SVS, Cobalt, Slooni, and maybe LC or TH.

Glancing at the poll, it seems like there are lots of people who haven't chimed in on anything (but maybe I just glossed over them in my "read through")…..Dreams? Tiny Bubbles? Who else?
Marry me.

Can someone tell me how many hours till the end of Day 1? Time zones fuck me up.

Positively reacts and acknowledges Canucklehead's first big post in the game, but doesn't offer any comment on it.

Spoiler: show

Missed the vote, and claims she would have voted for SVS, the confirmed indie. Neverwhere never gives any reasons why she is suspicious of the people she mentions, just lists them as names, and also works in a remark about/at Epi 1.0, who would soon be killed.

Spoiler: show

More vaguely-stated suspicions. It's like she's trying to win a secret "who can be the most vague?" contest in the thread. I think she's winning at this point.

Spoiler: show

Drops a vote on Cobalt (I think) on Day 2, when he was everybody's mother's top candidate, and then she leaves.

Spoiler: show

"Excuse me while I WIFOM this out." Golden presses her on her stated suspicion of him and she falls back on "odds are it will happen eventually", which is to say "there's no real reason." There has been no content thus far which inspires me to believe Neverwhere is town.

At this point she makes the "slip up" observation which has been noted a thousand times and remains suspect.

Spoiler: show

Present skepticism aside, when the TinyBubbles bandwagon first flared up, it was the lowest hanging fruit this game has seen to date. Anyone who was on that case became a major target to me. Neverwhere seemed like one of the most eager to pursue a Bubbles lynch at that time.

Spoiler: show

The vaguery continues, and the suspects continue to be the easiest ones.

Spoiler: show

"My vote's on Bubbles, but I'd be open to jumping on any bandwagon that starts up today."

Spoiler: show

Feels like a bit of an ambitiously stated early suspicion against me. A lot of people made the observation about me asking loads of questions early on, but Neverwhere was one of the few who seemed to spin it in a firmly negative light.

I'm also noticing now that she took a firm stance against G-man in the thread right away, but not about any of his game-related content; she instead calls him out for the format of his posts, a repeat of his Economics picture posts. This may suggest that she's a teammate of G-man's trying to set up some immediate distance before he goes down.

this is taking longer than i expected, so i'll post what i have for now so that it's out in the thread. Not that I expect everyone to care, but if you're considering voting for Neverwhere, here's a fragment of a case.

#3847

Neverwhere continued

Spoiler: show

Neverwhere wrote:Sorry you gott go sig, but glad we finally caught some scum!

I'm not really sure about TB being mafia anymore. Her reactions do read pretty genuine, however....

Golden -- you said that TB was playing her usual civ game and that in previous games she's had pretty spot on insticts, or something like that. However, the two games I've played with Bubbles, mafia won both time and in only one of those games did a mafia get caught and that was because of a little slip up. That is not to say I don't think Bubbles is a good player -- I do. I'm just wondering if you could elaborate as you make it sound like she was top baddy catcher....

That "we" feels a bit ambitious, as I don't recall her being on the sig bandwagon at all. In fact, a ctrl + f search of her post history reveals this as her first mention of sig's name, and it comes after he'd been lynched. She then backs down from her TinyBubbles suspicion, but not entirely as she follows up with a question about her.

Spoiler: show

I can continue to read this as possible scum teammates distancing themselves. G-man was a hot target before he even entered the game, and this is really the first firm read she's offered on anyone all game (her TinyBubbles suspicion was almost completely based on Bubbles' "I'm civ" post). She's been very vague and waffly all game with everyone, and this is by far the hardest stance she has taken on anyone to this point.

Spoiler: show

Very similar to that earlier post she made about "noticing [BR's] slip" that wasn't really a slip. Here she again latches on to a very tentative and speculative statement which might condemn another (town) player.

at this point i am fairly confident that Neverwhere is bad. I can go on, but this feels like a good enough place to end.
There are other topics to discuss.

#3848

But everyone seems to have left, rendering the discussion of other things unattainable.

#3849

The thing that made me reconsider Neverwhere as bad the most was her interaction with G-Man, but I think Sloonei has done well to show why that probably shouldn't be so important. G-Man seemed to enter the game as dead meat.

I feel more comfortable lynching Neverwhere than nutella. Anyone who follows my lead: I take full responsibility for whatever happens. I think it's the best move.

#3850

Sloonei wrote:But everyone seems to have left, rendering the discussion of other things unattainable.

Give me a topic. We can conquer the whole page if we must.

Full Games	Civilian: Mafia: Independent:
Speed Games	Civilian: Fiddler on the Roof Mafia:
Heists	Civilian: MVP: RED vs BLUE
Burglaries	Independent: The Theme Is Literally a Burglary
Special Games	Civilian: Independent:

Full Games	Civilian: Mafia: Independent:
Speed Games	Civilian: Fiddler on the Roof Mafia:
Heists	Civilian: MVP: RED vs BLUE
Burglaries	Independent: The Theme Is Literally a Burglary
Special Games	Civilian: Independent:

2014 Sockys
2015 Sockys
Miscellaneous

2014 Sockys
2015 Sockys
Miscellaneous

Who killed MM? (not changeable)