[END] Talking Heads Mafia (RYM #90)

[seaside]

i'm really not getting what they are hinting at either

[seaside]

maybe they are privy to information we aren't

[espers]

matt's point got me thinking. looking through the tally polls, bea doesn't seem to qualify under the role i was thinking of (and the one sorsha implied). not sure what to make of this.

[Matt]

Elohcin

After looking at the roles, trying to find out wth Golden and RBZ are talking about, I noticed something and now think...

You are civvie.

[Sorsha]

Sorsha - Till next time.

Can't wait

[Matt]

Sorsha - Till next time.

Can't wait

Tbh, I might switch it up next day phase and vote Golden.

[Strawhenge]

guys im full of whiskey and cured meats

it was fun

i left without saying goodbye to anyone becuase feeligngs

ok how in ass did bea get lynched? the poll has only floyd voting for her. what

what









what






guys

[Strawhenge]

poll says shoulda been golden. then rico. then sorsha.

how bea

WHY bea

[Sorsha]

Sorsha - Till next time.

Can't wait

Tbh, I might switch it up next day phase and vote Golden.

I hope it doesn't discourage you from doing so but.... I might too. What you said makes sense.

[Strawhenge]

why isnt anyone answering me

im a person too

[Sorsha]

I thought I figured it out reading the roles. Someone said it doesn't make sense though so

[JaggedJimmyJay]

[Draconus]

Glad I'm not the only one who thinks this is why Golden was begging to be lynched.

@Matt F: just fyi, thus doesn't make me feel better about Sorsha. Not sure why it would. But I, too, may end up voting for Golden again.

[Ricochet]

I feel really pretty good about both Rico and JJJ now.

How so? What happened to your "scheme team"? You've done quite the trajectory from engaging in a must-lynch-for-honor-and-glory spat with JJJ, then calling me more suspicious than JJJ as soon as my wagon got underway and now this post-lynch reflection. Not sure I get it.

Sadly, only I voted bea prior to D3, so no messages were sent. It really sucks.

you killed bea?

:O

I didn't have to do anything with it, Golden did. Also, read her revealed role.

u voted for her and she turns up dead and you got nothing to do with it?

No. Can you read her revealed role?!

yes, you'll have to explain it to me though.
I see nothing in there about her turning up dead the next day???

Warning Sign – Whenever Warning Sign receives votes against it in a lynch cast by a member of the opposite forum, the subsequent night a message is sent to a randomly selected player of the same forum. That message notifies that player that Warning Sign received vote(s) the previous day. The number of players that receive a message is equal to the number of votes from the opposing forum that Warning Sign took.

Let's revisit what I said, then

I voted for bea, in a lynch poll, prior to D3 = I voted bea on D1
I am from the same forum as bea = her power couldn't have activated, so nobody received any notification that WS was among the voters

snip

not a fan of posts like this. it's a whole bunch of nice-looking content without making any organic stances. this isn't the sort of game that can be solved with algorithms.

i don't say that vote analysis like this can't be worthwhile but here wilgy seems to use it as a crutch in lieu of "traditional" scumhunting, as evinced by his vote for golden without other reasoning. avoiding accountability while putting forth a supertown facade.

sorry for relatively flowery language, one of those moods i guess

I agree that I'd also like an English version of how those stats were achieved, especially since, so far, they apparently failed to provide a mafia player in Golden, who looked worst from those algorithms

RIP Bea.

RBZ - Are you saying you believe Golden is a certain role based on hints he may have given? I'm looking over the civvie roles, and I guess I'm not seeing it. However, I did notice that the Mafia has a role where they can copy the power of a player they've NK'd. So whatever role you attribute to Golden, let's remember, it is possible Golden is Mafia, and K4J is whatever role you believe Golden is hinting at.

Golden - Not seeing what you and RBZ are getting at, but regardless, it doesn't matter considering the Mafia has a role which makes whatever claim you are making useless. Begging the town to lynch you when you claim to be civvie just wasted a lynch vote, when I think it could've been much better utilized against Sorsha. Luckily for her, people are now thinking she's civvie (??????).

One good thing that came out of this, which is now we can see who went after Bea hard after LC flipped. Not that that proves anything either way, but I believe will lead us in the right direction.

Sorsha - Till next time.

It would be nice to second doubt these events somehow, but I think you're missing out the fact that Angel killed K4J, so it couldn't have performed the dead role steal on N1. We've had a night skip after D2, so the earliest they can attempt to do such maneuvers (if Angel isn't again delegated the killer, that is) is tonight.

[Bullzeye]

So Golden's big scheme that we should've all gone along with or be considered suspicious was... to kill a civvie? Good work!

[bea]

why isnt anyone answering me

im a person too

You guys!!! You guys!!! I adore drunkhenge. Can we keep him?? Huh??

Also whiskey and curred meats sounds like a FANTASTIC way to spend an evening! Well done sir! I am proud!!

[seaside]

Sadly, only I voted bea prior to D3, so no messages were sent. It really sucks.

you killed bea?

:O

I didn't have to do anything with it, Golden did. Also, read her revealed role.

u voted for her and she turns up dead and you got nothing to do with it?

No. Can you read her revealed role?!

yes, you'll have to explain it to me though.
I see nothing in there about her turning up dead the next day???

Warning Sign – Whenever Warning Sign receives votes against it in a lynch cast by a member of the opposite forum, the subsequent night a message is sent to a randomly selected player of the same forum. That message notifies that player that Warning Sign received vote(s) the previous day. The number of players that receive a message is equal to the number of votes from the opposing forum that Warning Sign took.

Let's revisit what I said, then

I voted for bea, in a lynch poll, prior to D3 = I voted bea on D1
I am from the same forum as bea = her power couldn't have activated, so nobody received any notification that WS was among the voters

lol i like how you think this is all so clear and that people don't know what is going on are just idiots and repeating the same shit will make it all come clear.
i reakon there is some BSCT with you and a few others
none of those roles clearly point to anything to do with this

[Choutas]

So Golden's big scheme that we should've all gone along with or be considered suspicious was... to kill a civvie? Good work!

He had it all figured it out. HE BROKE THE CODE. Dan Brown plot copycat. Renowned curator Golden staggered through the vaulted archway of the museum's Grand Gallery.

[Ricochet]

lol i like how you think this is all so clear and that people don't know what is going on are just idiots and repeating the same shit will make it all come clear.
i reakon there is some BSCT with you and a few others
none of those roles clearly point to anything to do with this

I don't think people who don't know what's going on are idiots and I have never called anyone an idiot for anything.

Tell me what's unclear about bea's role and what I said about her role not having been activated throughout the game.

If your issue is the strange lynch that just occured - which you seem to think that I implied that I had anything to do with! - then it's not about bea's role, you have to look at another role. And I had nothing to do with bea's death, in this regard.

[seaside]

i've already asked, do i need to ask 3 times to get a proper answer or something?

[Ricochet]

I have answered every question you asked. I cannot explain by pointing it out precisely without infodumping. Otherwise I've said it, look at another role to explain bea's death. Bea's role doesn't explain her death and my comments on bea's role had nothing to do with bea's death.

[seaside]

who have you been chatting to behind the scenes? because it is obvious you have been speaking to someone.

[seaside]

u been talking to Don't Worry About the Government?
or u scum chatting to yoru team mates?
or you are the one who can view parts of the viewing room?

you must be one of them
right right, i know, no infodumping.

which is your favourite number wink wink
1
2
3

???

[Ricochet]

I am a civilian with no BTSC role. I have no contact with any other player. I am not informed from any source on these issues, I am interpreting the roles and the context of events.

I genuinely don't understand your frustration and your ways of spinning this. Everytime I tell you to look at the roles closer, you shout back that I'm not answering you anything and that I must have external info, simply because you are seemingly at a loss and I'm not.

[Matt]

I think you're missing out the fact that Angel killed K4J, so it couldn't have performed the dead role steal on N1.[/color] We've had a night skip after D2, so the earliest they can attempt to do such maneuvers (if Angel isn't again delegated the killer, that is) is tonight.

You're right, good catch.

However, and I feel like I should let this go, but Angel's role also says "Once in the game, it may borrow the power of any role the mafia has killed." By saying "once in the game", as opposed to "during one night phase", especially since roles have both Day and Night powers...do you think it's possible Angel could still activate K4J's role power after Night 1 passed, and by having that, guessing his role?

Ugh. Sounds far fetched and reaching, but I am very concerned with Golden's actions yesterday. I cannot fathom why a civvie would waste a lynch phase asking to be lynched, promising good things will happen if so, and then when it happens, the town gets hurt.

Devin - Though I did a little smiley dance with Sorsha for funsies, I never said I stopped suspecting her. She's still my numero uno suspect, but with the town not feeling it, I'm not sure what to do on that end. I know I'm up waaaaay past my bedtime, though, and tomorrow I plan on doing a huge reread of players so we'll see where we are after that.

Peace

[seaside]

I am a civilian with no BTSC role. I have no contact with any other player. I am not informed from any source on these issues, I am interpreting the roles and the context of events.

I genuinely don't understand your frustration and your ways of spinning this. Everytime I tell you to look at the roles closer, you shout back that I'm not answering you anything and that I must have external info, simply because you are seemingly at a loss and I'm not.

what album then

[Ricochet]

I think you're missing out the fact that Angel killed K4J, so it couldn't have performed the dead role steal on N1.[/color] We've had a night skip after D2, so the earliest they can attempt to do such maneuvers (if Angel isn't again delegated the killer, that is) is tonight.

You're right, good catch.

However, and I feel like I should let this go, but Angel's role also says "Once in the game, it may borrow the power of any role the mafia has killed." By saying "once in the game", as opposed to "during one night phase", especially since roles have both Day and Night powers...do you think it's possible Angel could still activate K4J's role power after Night 1 passed, and by having that, guessing his role?

Ugh. Sounds far fetched and reaching, but I am very concerned with Golden's actions yesterday. I cannot fathom why a civvie would waste a lynch phase asking to be lynched, promising good things will happen if so, and then when it happens, the town gets hurt.

There are clear obstacles I'm seeing to every part of Angel's power having been activated on N1, due to the restriction that "If it carries out the kill, it cannot perform its normal night power". Sounds like that excludes Angel from both finding out the identity of the night kill and from using the one-time power steal.

If it would have been anyone else killing K4J, I'm sure the mafia would have at least found out K4J's role. But since Angel was delegated, it seems clear that mafia was concerned with every other role being put to use, thinking they don't have any night victim to role check and possibly role steal from, at that point.

If anyone but Angel would have killed K4J, I would still question (even to the point of asking the Hosts) if Angel could have asked to steal K4J's power and received it in advance and in addition to K4J dying.

[Ricochet]

I am a civilian with no BTSC role. I have no contact with any other player. I am not informed from any source on these issues, I am interpreting the roles and the context of events.

I genuinely don't understand your frustration and your ways of spinning this. Everytime I tell you to look at the roles closer, you shout back that I'm not answering you anything and that I must have external info, simply because you are seemingly at a loss and I'm not.

what album then

What?

[Elohcin]

Sorry Bea

Elohcin

After looking at the roles, trying to find out wth Golden and RBZ are talking about, I noticed something and now think...

You are civvie.

I'm glad your eyes have seen the truth.

[JaggedJimmyJay]

Matt F, could you return to our last discussion about Sorsha when you next have a chance? I think we can hash out that read together.

[Marmot]

Apparently I missed the vote. Sorry about that. I thought Day 3 would end today.

I am still on the road, but I will catch up when I get home.

[JaggedJimmyJay]

I'm considering Rico's defensive efforts since I dropped my vote on him and that wagon took off. It's possible I became overexcited about what I perceive to be a forced link by LC of Rico with bea (indicating bad things for one of the two). I will state though that the last time this happened and I correctly snared a baddie for it (Turnip Head in light of a forced link by HamburgerBoy in RYM #86) was circumstantially a bit different and it warrants more thought from me at least while there's time for that. In case I end up dead this night phase, I'd caution players against immediately moving against him -- everything warrants another look.

I'm going to share that example from RYM #86. If possible, I'd like for people who played that game with me (especially MM who was almost victimized by the forced link along with me) to examine these two incidents together and tell me how you feel they compare. I understand though that this is a specific comparison across two separate games, so we don't need to spend a ton of time on this.

Spoiler: show

THIS IS FROM RYM #86, NOT THIS GAME

turnip is scum btw

What's your reasoning? Mine is that aside from the active day 1/inactive day 2 thing, I'm detecting more fluff from JJJ in response to him. Turnip's vote ([Post5881240]) is perfectly acceptable during the rvs, but Metalmarsh's surface questioning and then acceptance was underwhelming, and guess who didn't buy it and was in one of the best positions not to? golden8 ([Post5882839]). I feel there's at least one scum from the Syndicate, and possibly two. The only issue is that there is no way in hell that three experienced players would have this kind of interaction so early if all of them were scum, so if Turnip was scum it means that Metalmarsh ignoring most things on day 1 unrelated to Strawhenge/sleepy was likely just a coincidence.

Then there's the context of how relaxed JJJ was to just accept gwilikers' case against golden8, plus the wifom-y angle of how JJJ is accepting some of the criticisms of him, like as MP07 pointed out [Post5889104]. I mean, that kind of post from JJJ is about on par with the kind of reasoning aether used in [Post5886586].

boom. this was the post i had in mind when i told Marshy he looked better than Turnip in light of the Burger scum flip. this post makes no sense and here's why:

Burger was asserting suspicion of Turnip based on how Marshy and I treated him rather than Turnip's actual behavior. he said my interactions with Turnip were "fluff", and that Marshy was "underwhelming". so why would Scumburger do this?

to link both of us to Turnip. because Turnip looked like a likely lynch given his quietness and the growing attitude in the thread that he was suspicious. this link is meaningless if Turnip flips town, which is why i don't think he will. Burger was counting on Turnip going down before him so he could use the theories he brought up here against Marshy and i. i think the plan backfired.

if anyone disagrees with this point, please say so. because i am confident.

Now I return to the Rico/LC incident from this game and draw the comparison:

Spoiler: show

THIS IS FROM THIS GAME.

My main suspicion at this point is Ricco. First of all, he seems to be saying a lot, without really saying anything. Even when he voiced some suspicion, it's done in an "intrigued" tone, as if he's trying to avoid confrontation. If you add to that what K4J said about how he voted at the end of day 0 on the syndicate, it's another reason to not trust him at the moment.

As for rico - he seems fairly rico for me atm. I don't have a good feel for his civ vs his bad game as I've only played a few with him and tbh, I don't remember where he ended on any of them. (This is my fault not his) but his meta seems to be what I'd expect from him.

I snipped the quote for clarity. Here, bea defends Rico while not defending him at the same time. (This opinion of mine is new upon this reread, actually) If either bea or Rico turn up bad, then this kind of statement would make me look at the other.

Hello, forced link.

Someone read this and tell me both bea and Rico are bad. I don't think so. But one? LC sure seems to think so.

Hi Rico.

Terrible look. Even worse, I don't think Rico ever commented on this.

You'll observe that my immediate reaction was that LC made the same mistake in this game that Burger made in RYM #86 -- exposed his team mate (Turnip Head in the RYM #86 example, potentially Ricochet in this example) via an attempt at forcing a link between that team mate and [insert townie] (Metalmarsh in the RYM #86 example, bea in this game's example). However, LC's forced link is more blatant I grant: he outright said it instead of implying it as Burger did.

[Ricochet]

Everything about LC's bea case was scum bullsuit. Treat every detail of it as such.

[JaggedJimmyJay]

We've been fielding a ton of discussion and I think a number of players have started to develop more clear perspectives of the game -- this means to me that we have a great opportunity to utilize process of elimination cooperatively. That means we need reads lists though, whether rainbows or whatever else.

[JaggedJimmyJay]

POE is the most effective application of the teamwork I try so hard to promote in mafia games, and this setup (all civs win together) makes it possible. I hope y'all give it a chance.

[a2thezebra]

Teamwork??? JJJ confirmed scum.

[a2thezebra]

I am a civilian with no BTSC role. I have no contact with any other player. I am not informed from any source on these issues, I am interpreting the roles and the context of events.

I genuinely don't understand your frustration and your ways of spinning this. Everytime I tell you to look at the roles closer, you shout back that I'm not answering you anything and that I must have external info, simply because you are seemingly at a loss and I'm not.

what album then

What?

He's trying to get you to speak in code to reveal what civ BTSC role you have, but I don't see where he got the idea that you have BTSC in the first place. I also don't like how quickly and effortlessly he was convinced that you are civ at all, especially considering that he had no real case on you being bad to begin with. Now if he were bad, I figure he would have at least copied what JJJ said or what I said, but he had nothing at all, so my conclusion is that he didn't know who to vote for and he didn't have time or just didn't feel like catching up so he threw a vote on the most recent wagon. I still think you're bad but I also think it's eerie how little discussion is involving you now that the day is over, when before it seemed like everyone was sold on you being scum.

[a2thezebra]

This lynch is frustrating me because there's so many ways to interpret what happened.

[FZ.]

Whoa, what the hell happened after I went to sleep, and how did Bea end up dying?

Can I just say how much I hate the fact that I can never be here when the day ends Remind me to only join games hosted by non Americans.

Going to catch up.

[Tangrowth]

I apologize for the strange EoD times; my schedule has been crazy. Sloonei and I want to definitely get it earlier.

On that note, please remember that PMs for Night 3 are due by 8:00PM Eastern!

[Roxy]

Whoa, what the hell happened after I went to sleep, and how did Bea end up dying?

Can I just say how much I hate the fact that I can never be here when the day ends Remind me to only join games hosted by non Americans.

Going to catch up.

[Roxy]

Relationship between Roxy and Long Con:

Spoiler: show

Yay game - no time to play but I did vote

RBz bc weird name will prob equal an awesome player and Long Con only bc Black Rock is not playing

I have a night post to write <3

She voted LC on Dusk 0, and provided an excuse. Shrug.

Spoiler: show

LC - His initial vote and suspicion fooled me bc I thought it was srsbns until he said it was a ploy to see who would run with it. I am not sure he did this bc of the result of llama's post asking if it is normal Bea response. (paraphrasing) and it gained no traction and then looked worse after the responses or bc he was really putting a trap into action. LC is tricksy for sure and always worth watching for now I will give him the botd and keep a close eye on him.

Roxy expresses some mild doubts about LC's ruse but doesn't commit to them. I'm not quite sure what she means when she reference's llama's response re: bea as being a reason to doubt LC's claim. Roxy could you please expand on what you meant?

Spoiler: show

I am not digging the bandwagon on LC. I am still 5 pages behind but I just wanted to say - I thought it was a weak day 1 vote on Bea - I really believed he was going after Bea then when he backed off it was after llama had asked the question something like - do you think Bea's response was appropriate/" and so many chimed in and said yes bc one vote can lead to a late day bandwagon here or similar sentiments. Maybe it was a ploy to see if or what would come of his suspicion but it did seem a bit haphazard for a baddie LC. Which is why I think - would he do this if he was bad? No. I think he is a careful baddie. If he was going to try a ploy it would not have been something like this.

Ofc this is all wifom to the RYM'ers but it is true about LC. He would not be this sloppy if he was bad. No one who has played regularly with him has voted him just Wiggly who has been around for a couple of games and does not really know LC the way most of us do.


linky - FZ - Bcorn - odk bc I do not know his meta its hard to take someones word for it.

JJJ feels different this game. Is it bc of Sweden? Idk. He sure was not giving me the aggressive - JJJ supatownie at large vibe when he was here. But he is on vacation so maybe his mind is elsewhere, as it should be. Yep I am on the fence with him.

The highlighted bit about LC is about as strong an endorsement as one can offer. I've stated that I don't think it's inherently a huge issue that some people defended LC, in this case I'm inclined to wonder why Roxy used such strong language though. She expressed some doubts in the post I previously referenced, but they seemed to evaporate when LC was getting more defense from his fellow Syndicateers.

Spoiler: show

Hmmm... well, there's been lots of activity since I went to bed last night. I just read through it all, what sticks out in my mind? The Roxy thing is funny to me (though I don't like her use of someone else's avatar because it confuses me). I feel a bit of a dissonance, Roxy is getting harassed for saying she was going to randomize, and at the same time people are saying that Random Voting on Day 1 is a sound strategy. So which is it? I'm not a big fan of random voting myself, I'd rather read through and see what my gut says on Day 1 than throw a dart. Which is why I have a vote on bea.

I don't think it's that likely that JJJ, Epig and the other person all voted as baddies together. Too risky. The votes for JJJ and Wilgy seemed pretty natural to me, as I recall.

More opinions about Day 1 so far will have to wait until I look back over things again. I read through it once, but it hasn't all sunk in yet - it's a little harder for me to get a handle on things with all the players that are new to me, the new people kind of blend together.

LC defends Roxy's honor w/r/t her perspective on randomized Day 1 votes. I don't think this is a bad look for Roxy, but it isn't good either because it wouldn't be a hard post to make about a team mate. Null.

Larger post in which he explains his beef with bea pre-ruse claim

A big component of this post was LC's assertion that bea was defending Roxy. I don't think this reflects any particular way on Roxy unless we assume LC wanted to force a link between her and bea -- I am not inclined to think so because I don't think his move against bea looked like bussing. UNLESS Roxy is mafia and he wanted to smear bea pre-emptively on that front. A bit speculative.

Spoiler: show

Roxy, I'm glad to see you took your vote off me, but you're not allowed to placehold.

Why not? You were my placeholder so far should I return my vote there?

When you allow changeable votes then expect people to vote in wonky ways until we get closer to lynch time.

Still reading and thinking.

Actually, I just mean voting for the non-player option, but this got stuck in my head, probably from Recruitement, as voting that as a placeholder.

6. No self-voting, even as a placeholder. This is considered an illegal move in this game as much as voting for the non-player option.

Good eye, Rico. Roxy must be punished!

Just goofing around I think, null.

~~~

Her perspectives about LC's ruse are a bit inconsistent I think and she should speak about that. Minor negative pings.

BC after LC's case was made llama asked everyone if they thought her response was normal after having received a vote from LC. Almost every person who answered said yes it was normal - whether the case was bs or not a vote is a vote and near lynch end everyone looks for something to latch onto.

What more do you wish me to say about LC that I have not already reiterated? I stand by what I said.

[Black Rock]

I guess I screwed up when the lynch was over. I saw Sunday and thought it was tonight and went to bed. I was very tired.

[Ricochet]

I am a civilian with no BTSC role. I have no contact with any other player. I am not informed from any source on these issues, I am interpreting the roles and the context of events.

I genuinely don't understand your frustration and your ways of spinning this. Everytime I tell you to look at the roles closer, you shout back that I'm not answering you anything and that I must have external info, simply because you are seemingly at a loss and I'm not.

what album then

What?

He's trying to get you to speak in code to reveal what civ BTSC role you have, but I don't see where he got the idea that you have BTSC in the first place. I also don't like how quickly and effortlessly he was convinced that you are civ at all, especially considering that he had no real case on you being bad to begin with. Now if he were bad, I figure he would have at least copied what JJJ said or what I said, but he had nothing at all, so my conclusion is that he didn't know who to vote for and he didn't have time or just didn't feel like catching up so he threw a vote on the most recent wagon. I still think you're bad but I also think it's eerie how little discussion is involving you now that the day is over, when before it seemed like everyone was sold on you being scum.

I don't know anything about such codes, so it means he's basically using RYM methods to extract RYM-style info from a non-RYM player. I think he got the BTSC idea as a sign that I'm "knowledgeable" and that's apparently an unnerving thing and a sign of team piecing-together, but as I've told him, it's not "info", it's interpreting events and roles.

I'm not sure he has me as civ, he called me scum plenty times during this exchange.

As for his alignment, coming out of my near lynch and this post-lynch debate, I'm quite torn.

On one hand, his lynch attitude towards me gives me very mixed feelings.

-- breaking a tie and pushing me as top wagon, only to look extremely bad for this had I been mislynched? I'm leaning no baddie would want to break his neck this much
-- then again, breaking a tie under the impression that "tie = no lynch" and that's bad to happen, so he takes (or feigns) a stance that someone has to do? now that's crafty. he can come up with excuses afterwards. leaning bad on this detail
-- not reasoning ahead or in time with his vote on me? different culture, maybe, but this is an issue I always give a no-no to anyone doing it, plus it's personal because I was the target, so leaning bad
-- now, I'm not the kind to condemn any player for allegedly losing their entire content of a post. It can happen to the best of us. The internet can suddenly suck ass. If it was a trick after all, I still have plenty more details to look into and suss him for. Null read here.
-- taking the easy route out of having to explain his vote anymore by hinging on me being snappy and drumming on my attitude being a stinker? again, it's probably too personal for me to take it as anything but a cop out, nevertheless leaning bad on this detail
-- switching his vote once my wagon wanes and doing a second freaking unreasoned and undocumented (no background suspicion) on a different wagon, pushing that wagon to lynch? again, a baddie would literally be throwing himself down the stairs with this, sounds too good to be true

On the other hand, this whole "bea's role" exchange has to be some mighty bullsuit from him to be bad, vent like this, burst into such frustration, feign ignorance, cluelessness at events and roles (instead of getting his answers from his team) and try to spraypaint me in such outright manner. I'm actually leaning civ on him for this, because I can understand if he's genuinely shocked by the turnaround of the lynch and pinged by me commenting on bea's role. If that's the case (i.e. if he's civ), I just wish he'd calm down, be more open to explanations and to what he's being pointed at and stop it with the "you realizing more stuff than me about what happens can only mean you have a team behind you which provide knowledge and info and such".

[Ricochet]

I apologize for the strange EoD times; my schedule has been crazy. Sloonei and I want to definitely get it earlier.

On that note, please remember that PMs for Night 3 are due by 8:00PM Eastern!

A 3am deadline? Hallelujah, small improvement there for me.

[Golden]

This lynch is frustrating me because there's so many ways to interpret what happened.

This is ludicrous.

There is only one way to interpret what happened, you know exactly what it is, and everyone who says they want to vote for me tomorrow should be treated with utmost suspicion.

[a2thezebra]

This lynch is frustrating me because there's so many ways to interpret what happened.

This is ludicrous.

There is only one way to interpret what happened, you know exactly what it is, and everyone who says they want to vote for me tomorrow should be treated with utmost suspicion.

Wow, I wasn't even talking about you. Self-centered much?

[Bullzeye]

Whoa, what the hell happened after I went to sleep, and how did Bea end up dying?

Can I just say how much I hate the fact that I can never be here when the day ends Remind me to only join games hosted by non Americans.

Going to catch up.

Well in like a year from now when I host DBZ the times will be reasonable GMT hours (by reasonable I mean like, midnight?) and anyone who doesn't like it will just have to cry about it :P I completely sympathise with your pain.

This lynch is frustrating me because there's so many ways to interpret what happened.

This is ludicrous.

There is only one way to interpret what happened, you know exactly what it is, and everyone who says they want to vote for me tomorrow should be treated with utmost suspicion.

What if I don't want to vote for you, but don't want to go along with any future plans of yours? Y'know, since your big idea was basically to murder a civ. Tbf I'm actually having trouble figuring out exactly what happened but I have some ideas.

[Strawhenge]

This lynch is frustrating me because there's so many ways to interpret what happened.

This is ludicrous.

There is only one way to interpret what happened, you know exactly what it is, and everyone who says they want to vote for me tomorrow should be treated with utmost suspicion.

The only role I'm seeing that could possibly be what you mean is Uh-Oh, Love Comes to Town, which would mean that you 'seduced' bea to the RYM side. So, since you were lynched, bea died in your place.

...Unless I'm missing something in the roles, or I'm just not able to comprehend another possibility, then that kinda looks pretty good for Golden.

The language in the role is a bit fuzzy, though. 'In addition, if one of them is lynched, the other will die in its place. If the seduced player dies first, then Uh-Oh may try to seduce another player.' The first part makes it sound like the aforementioned redirection would happen regardless of whether the seducer or the seduced is the one to be lynched. So the first part creates some ambiguity on whether or not Golden was the seducer or the seduced—which then, in turn, creates some ambiguity on whether or not the seduced would know that they were seduced. The second sentence suggests that if the seduced is killed before the seducer is killed, then the seducer is fine. Otherwise how would it be able to seduce a new player?

[Ricochet]

What ambiguity would there be, concerning who would be who in the entanglement, if bea flipped as Warning Sign?