[END] Talking Heads Mafia (RYM #90)

[RadicalFuzz]

I am not aware of what he was planning.

[Matt]

I don't either, but without infodumping, are you aware of what he did, though? (or what I firmly believe him to have done?)

[RadicalFuzz]

After reading through the roles again I can confirm I have no idea what he was/is doing.

[Matt]

Impromptu Batman Arkham session! Woot!

Good luck, town! Good luck, Fuzz! Good luck, sig! Bad luck to Rico, 3J, and Epig! :P

Linki - Okay, well, I don't want to keep talking about this. No doubt MP is tearing his hair out right now.

Peace!

[Marmot]

I think I have the gist of the suspicions against me. My interactions with all of the dead scum are atrocious. My multiple soft defenses of Mac, in addition to my literal call for a Chinese Fire Drill off of him, look bad. I understood that when I made those posts. What I don't understand is how those actions are somehow made scummier when I leave town.

I CTRL+F'd my name and quickly skimmed so if I missed something I apologize. Repeat the question and I'll answer it.

Metalmarsh you're going to look very bad soon and you know why. You are either the worst kind of civilian, who throws logical thought out the window, or scum.

Considering that you quickly skimmed the parts with your name, I don't understand how you still came to the conclusion that my thought process is illogical, and that I am the worst.

Also realize that Jay went through every player's interactions with Floyd after his flip. He pointed out your interaction with Floyd back on Day 4 or so that looks like a slip. I agreed, and looked at your interactions with MacDougall, and still agreed.

You being out of town is irrelevant (if that's why I am the worst).

[RadicalFuzz]

My point was, my actions at the time I did them seemed to cause no alarm. What day were the GTH reads where I was unanimous town? Pretty sure they were after the Mac lynch, maybe before the Floyd lynch. Why did it take until recently for people to decide my interactions with a dead scum looked poor?

And no, it's not about me being out of town. It's about the dam of trust you built for me before you turned on Niagara Falls and washed it all away.

[DrWilgy]

Fuzz wasn't here for day/dusk 0... Kinda makes me not surprised he doesn't see it due to this. Some of the pieces of the puzzle lie there.

@Fuzz... Y'know this is only my second game on syndicate (where I survived past day 2 at least). Claiming that I know infodumping rules in detail is bullsuit. Some of the explanations I gave to you outside of game on the rules came from MP.

[RadicalFuzz]

I see, I had assumed you were familiar with the site rules. That point is struck down then, replaced with tentative confusion.

[RadicalFuzz]

Actually, since I seem to lack understanding about the game, what was the point of Day/Dusk 0? Two players were elected for CEO or something, does that award them a prize? Was Dusk 0 a standard night phase before Day 1?

[Matt]

My friends are seriously irked at me right now for delaying Batman but I had to come back for a short sec...

Dr Wilgy, this isn't really a question, more of a comment.

It is curious to me that out of all the players in the game, you just happened to pick at least two scum (Floyd, MacD). I know I'm civvie, don't know about Fuzz...

Would you say your picks were just bad luck?

Anyway, out! Peace

[DrWilgy]

JJJ and I were elected ACEO, Day 0 we voted for several options that would affect the game in some way or another. Dusk 0 was not a night phase, but another voting phase, this is where we elected ACEO's

[Marmot]

My point was, my actions at the time I did them seemed to cause no alarm. What day were the GTH reads where I was unanimous town? Pretty sure they were after the Mac lynch, maybe before the Floyd lynch. Why did it take until recently for people to decide my interactions with a dead scum looked poor?

And no, it's not about me being out of town. It's about the dam of trust you built for me before you turned on Niagara Falls and washed it all away.

Scrutinizing interactions with a couple dead mafia members is easier and more revealing than trying to do it between every living player and another. It was Floyd's flip and Jay's ensuing ISO's that changed my mind. Also I'm pretty sure I have town-tunneled you up until today.

I still fail to see what is illogical in my vote and suspicion. If anything, my trust in you was illogical, as it was based on your thread-presence.

[DrWilgy]

I think someone else was responsible for that, It makes me curious about Fuzz's and your alignment though. Not too concerned about it though, it's a fine line to walk on and I don't wanna be responsible for any game breaking.

[RadicalFuzz]

When you say that "we voted for several options that would affect the game in some way or another," you mean J3 and yourself? I'm assuming these options weren't public and can't be shared, correct?

Metalmarsh I'm not talking about a full-fledged ISO of interactions, I'm talking about basic stuff. "Oh, he's only voted for one person for three days when 2 Mafia have been lynched! That's strange." Or perhaps "he called for a Chinese Fire Drill and then the Mafia member almost survived the lynch!" I had been literally asking to be scumread, but nobody spoke up. I mentioned how horrible my actions looked as I called for the Chinese Fire Drill, yet nobody cared to comment on them, whether to agree or disagree. Do you see why I invite suspicion? So that this exact thing doesn't happen. The finer points of interactions, fair enough, that takes a degree of hindsight, time, and effort not immediately available five minutes after a lynch. But calling for a CFD on a player that turned out to be scum? That should've gotten me crucified on the spot, but no match was lit. I don't believe any player citing that point cared to mention that, in addition to calling for a CFD when Mac was on the chopping block, I kept my vote on Wilgy. I neither started, nor contributed, to the counter-wagon on Diiny, that was J3's doing.

[Ricochet]

I have no idea why I voted the host, I'm voting Rico because he has a weird obsession with fabricating reads on me. I work basically until the deadline tonight so I doubt I'll be back in time to change my vote. Only thing I have read is the Rico most recent case of me. (this deadline time stinks, I work until it at least 2x a week)

So, is this basically an OMGUS or what am I supposed to believe?

What does "fabricated reads" mean? What in God's name have I fabricated? And, furthermore, "obsession"!

I'm real curious about such accusations considering the constant format in which I do reads, which is:

A) Facts (based on history; based on your posts, in this case, precisely as they were written. If you're saying this part is what I'm fabricating, it is factually inaccurate.
B) Interpretation (aka reads). What do I think of you in light of the facts. If you're saying this part is what I'm fabricating, then you are almost implying that, in Mafia, every interpretation or read is a fabrication.

Also, I like that you launch, in my opinion, one of the most serious accusations possible (the one that I'm, to paraphrase, "pulling stuff out of my ass" on you) at the very limit of the timeline in which you can play anymore until EoD. "So yeah Rico is a liar and a deceiver, I'm off for work, prolly not coming back, voting Rico, cyas". Real nice.

Cool, so I'm now one vote away from tied top wagon. What does everyone think of b24's ... gesture?

[sig]

Responses underlined

Hello sig. Since biting back at me trying to make you slip up Day 1 I've been missing from your posts and reads until:

Motel Room
Votes
Day 1 sig (Civ)
Day 2 Long Con (Mafia)
Day 3 Epignosis (Unknown Leaning civ)
Day 4 Sorsha (Civ)
Day 5 espers (Civ)
Day 6 Diiny (Civ)
Day 7 seaside (civ)
Day 8 Russtifinko (Civ)

Dusk Poll voted for Mac and Dr Wilgy just coz.

Question for the group:
Was Bea's reaction to one early, changeable vote an overreaction or an appropriate reaction?
Discuss.

Current track: Brian Eno - Sparrowfall (3) (1:24)

Long Con's reasoning was worded pretty confidently for this early in the game. Seems like a legit response. Out of the two i had more of a gut feel against long con, his confidence and his defence of.

He thinks Bea's response to LC was okay.

Commentary. How do you feel about me saying this?

It is null could reality be one teammate talking to another

I agree with Epi's random voting point, in fact this could be just as dangerous to the civilians as a no lynch for day 1.

so like if I pop a vote on sig here for piggybacking epi's point that to me seems misguided, am i all in or just having some RVS fun?

Votes since he think I'm piggybacking off of Epi only reason he gives will end the day with this vote.

Commentary. How do you feel about my Day 1 vote on you?
Suspicious you suspected LC yet followed his wagon and even offered to switch wagons if I would join.

I think your trying to get me to respond in an attempt to make me slip up and get me lynched, and it really isn't my place to tell you who has been suspicious of me that would be like building the case for my own lynch a rather silly thing to do.

well we wouldn't want you to slip up now

I don't like this post, it pings me.

I find it funny.

Sig, how would you feel about switching to Long Con with me?

I don't understand this post. He suspicious of me, yet would have switched to LC. He himself though never switches to LC and keeps his vote on me.

Well I switched the very next day immediately and after the LC lynch felt you were townier (although I can't remember why now - something to do with the Day 1 votes, might double check).

I'm not sure how I feel about this MacDougal character.

Seems genuine to me so far. What about him makes you feel otherwise?

Defends Mac still early in the game so it could be nothing, but worth noting.

Commentary. Do you think that its something that I defended mac?
Don't understand this?

I think your trying to get me to respond in an attempt to make me slip up and get me lynched, and it really isn't my place to tell you who has been suspicious of me that would be like building the case for my own lynch a rather silly thing to do.

What raises my brows about this one is that you say “make me slip up” as opposed to “make me say something that could be considered a slip up.” I don’t think civvies slip up.

Does that kind of caveat even need to be said? The latter would be the obvious read into it; actually, legitimate scumslips are very rare on RYM, and I'd imagine they are here as well. After all, the matter of who accused sig is an open record for anyone wanting to find it; it was mostly Zebra. Maybe he was afraid to admit that it wasn't really multiple people prior to motel/aokiji's pressuring? Otherwise, the only way I see even the potential for a slip would be if sig is trying to distance from Zebra, in the event that Zebra bussed him. I think that's very unlikely and pretty suicidal though; if sig was lynched and flipped scum, no one is going to go "A-ha, Zebra did bus him!" just because he made a good read on a very early game vote.

My issue with it is the mentality of not wanting to "slip up", wording aside. Town just does shit, scum are worried how they'll look. Mostly. Anyway sig's been more verbose and I guess willing to slip up in his defences so thats a thing.

Okay wait he is still giving a reason for lynching me, yet just awhile ago asked if I would be willing to switch to LC. I believe he asked this to appear more civvie if I flipped civ or if LC ended up getting lynched making him appear civvie also.

"if" you flipped civ? Also I'm not sure what the deal is about Hamburgerguy being scum maybe, but that defence of his for you there looks suspicious mate.

Yes if I flipped, interesting it is commonly accepted that HB was civ I thought. You're know trying tocast doubt on a dead player, to give a reason for my lynch.

LC's vote for Bea did strike me as fake...

I have to get ready and leave for work soon, so it's time to cast a real vote. The bea vote was actually fake. I thought, since votes are changeable, I'd make a fake case and see if I could catch any opportunistic baddies trying to latch on to it and follow the vote. It didn't really bear fruit; looking over BWT's reasons for voting bea, he is coming from a completely different angle. The truth is, bea's behaviour is pretty normal for her, and I don't suspect her much at all.

My real vote today will go to sig. Despite the reasonable explanation he had for my original suspicion of him (that he was crafting his posts too much, in a baddie way), I've found a few of his reactions suspicious. His reaction that I was "distancing" from him when I forgot he was the third player involved in an earlier discussion was bizarre, as was his assertion that I (and others) are "desperate to try and get him lynched".

sig, saying we're desperate to try and get you lynched strikes me in two ways, neither of them making me feel comfortable about you. On one hand, it's overdefensive and paranoid, and on the other, it's a way to buffalo us out of voting for you... because who wants to looks "desperate" to lynch someone on Day 1?

It's not much, but it's the behaviour I found most suspicious today, and it's time for me to lock in a vote.

Sorry for using you, bea!

Feels pressured and gross. Long Con's wording on his vote for bea was so confident. This feels like backpedalling.

Mentions LC more doesn't like him or his vote on me. Yet once again he doesn't switch from his current vote or pursues an LC vote yet.

It's Day 1. Like I've got anything else to go on.

On day 2 voted for LC switched to Choutas switches back to LC.

Commentary. Is this switch of votes suspicious to you? Or does my voting Long Con nullify your above points?

Not the time, I know, but it's annoying me. What's the floyd's deal? He's posting regularly on OT as far as I can tell so he's not exactly short on time. Even if he was it's in nobody's best interest to post one off topic thing. Probably some stupid gambit.

I get the feeling he's in a bit over his head, our Floyd.

Not much, some defense of Floyd but something that I'm probably just nitpicking at he says out floyd. Just a manner of speaking, our as in from RYM, or tiny scum slip up our as in on our team? Doubt it but figured I would mention it.

"Our" from RYM.
Okay

Day 3 starts vote on EPi for his defense of LC ends day with this vote.

still reading through but i'm putting a vote on Sorsha so that I can see where the votes currently are cos otherwise it's just radio buttons.

Day 4 votes Sorsha but, I don't quite understand why he did this.

Like I said elsewhere, this read was mostly borrowed after catching up from the weekend.

Calls out Mac for switching from Sorsha.

Like I said elsewhere, this was the most suspicious I got of mac cos that shit made no sense. Later he seemed to have his focus back and I felt good about him again, wrongly.

Matt F's theory is sketchy and I don't why he's so confident about it.

Mac's theory on epi seems more likely and more based in evidence but still just a theory. I'm not comfortable with epi - the Syndicaters are defending his style still but when he was under some attention earlier he came out and did just enough leg work to let it blow over and has returned to sitting pretty. Dunno about the SK but I have no probs voting epi.

Mac himself has mostly seemed towny to me, up until he jumped off his Sorsha wagon and started pursuing Matt F over what started as a mild ping or whatever he called it. After that it seemed like mac was in chaos mode and was less about "who is scum" and more about "what can I get away with". But I say "was" because I like how he responded to Matt F's accusation - I read some others are using this as evidence against but I see it as positive evidence.

One thing I may have missed in catch up - mac, why though are you less concerned with Matt? He's not even in your top 6 thingy atm.

Once again voices suspicions of Epi, still think Mac is towny, but has some misgiving. I can't tell if this is genuine or an attempt to distance himself from a fellow scum.

What do you think it is?
It is that of a fellow scum.

Who should we make dead, aokiji?

espers or epi.
To a slightly lesser extent, Diiny or Devin.

esper who he later voted for, and Epi who he has multiply times expressed suspicion off.

Commentary. Does this mean I was steady in my genuine suspicions or are you reading something else into it?

These elaborate scum bussing strategies that are being put forward, are they common here on the Syndicate? Because while they can happen over on RYM the most common scum strategy is just lay low pretty much. Bussing is rarely organised and generally just a self-preservation technique.

So reading all of this about how Long Con set up this big ol bus seems so far fetched to me. Remembering back to the day he was lynched, he was a contender but not the contender. I'm fairly sure that my return vote on him put him back in the lead and I know I did that from a genuine suspicion of him so I can't really get behind any of these "strategy" scenarios. He may have wanted out and told teammates not to fight it too hard but I really doubt it was a planned bus. My two cents, for the guy who is pretty sure Mac is scum cos of that idea. I still think mac is town.


Black Rock is the next major lynch contender, what's the deal there?

He thinks Mac is town and does some soft defense of him. He also mentions the BK lynch asking what is up with it.

These post really ping me

Why does it ping you? I did think mac was town and I was asking what was happening with the Black Rock reads that were starting to happen. I don't think it pings you.

It does ping me your defense of Mac, and then the vote for BK which you quickly changed is pingy.

Motelroom if you think Mac is town(you just said it), would you save him from a lynch? He's the leading vote getter. Or you're going to idly park your vote in a lynch that won't happen?

I would probably vote to save him, yes. We still have 24 hours at least though.

Self pres voting wilgy

I'll get on Epi if you go back to voting there.

Not anti wilgy atm. Out of the other 2-vote "wagons" I'd go Diiny or I guess Black Rock.

No one wants to stacks-on Choutas with me? Carn.

Day 6 votes Diiny over Mac however he then switches to BK

I could do a black rock vote. Dunno if it'd pick up enough steam

alrighty, Black Rock

But in about an hour he switches to Diiny again.
So he switches from Diiny to BK a scum to Diiny again.

What does that mean to you? How do you read that switch of votes?

He gives some defense of Floy but not much.

I've now defended two scums apparently. I'm having a baller game.

Defends himself against accusations about Mac, saying he thought he was town.

DIINY

DRWILGY

ELOHCIN

EPIGNOSIS

good

good

good

good

Why do you know think Epi and Diiny are clean what changed your mind about them?

Epi because of the way he was so firm against mac, and was correct. My suspicion of Diiny was mostly because his activity level dropped off, but when he came back his content seemed genuine.

Final Thoughts. I really don't like Motel's day 1 he voices some doubt about LC but votes with LC until day 2 when he lynches LC. I believe with Day 1 he was trying to keep his options open between Me and LC so he could switch to LC if he needed to.

Why would I have "needed to"? What does that mean?

His solid defense of Mac seems scummy to me, but he is so aggressive in his defense that it makes me pause. However, he also lynches Diiny and that was a close lynch. I think his defense of Mac makes him look slightly scummy.
Motel Room comes off as looking scummy to me, he pushes epi and diiny but in gun to head thinks they are clean, it seems with Mac's flip he dropped the Diiny lynch. I view this as a scum trying to distance himself from a teammate who flipped mafia. This along with Day 1 and his defense of Mac furthers my view that Motel room is mafia. Though I would like other peoples opinions on Motel Room before I place my vote.

If you're interested in my opinion, I don't think you actually feel one way or another about me. You are giving yourself too much wiggle room here saying I'm scummy (seriously, check that last para saying I'm scummy three times in four sentences) but then I might not be. You say that by changing my mind on Diiny you see that as me trying to distance myself from.. mac? Who is my "teammate" in this scenario?

This is weak sig. I'm not buying it.

looks like I fucked up the quoting and its too hard to get right. Putting the responses in yellow.

linki - about a million posts[/quote]


You ask questions but don't really respond to any of my points, you don't answer any of the questions such as why in gun to headdid you mark Epi and Diiny as good? You avoided actually answering any of my points and is simply trying to turn it around back to me.

For the time I will be voting for motel room I encourage others to do the same. However, if it comes down to me or another player I will switch my vote to save myself.

Motel Room

[RadicalFuzz]

I think bcornett is a strange individual. I don't think he's particularly helpful in any sense of the word, but I can't tell if that's because he's scum or if he's just not helpful.

[Ricochet]

I do plan on staying out of here today as much as possible, but since I was addressed...

Rico, I understand you replied to me. That doesn't mean I have to take your word at face value and believe it. Currently I see the most evidence against you, so that is where I'm voting.

Resume...

Matt, just so it's clear, it's not about changing your mind or anything. If youd have read my rebuttal and interpret it post-rebuttal (or at least in some sort of acknowledgement of my rebuttal) that you're not convinced, warmed up, feeling any better about me etc. it's be legit. My problem is that you say "statement A", I counter with "statement B" and then you go back (repeatedly) and furhter enforce "statement A". You go back to the same charges, as you've put them, ad nauseam, and I feel there's no actual communication between the accuser and the accused in this case. In plainer English, it feels like talking to a wall.

[RadicalFuzz]

Oh the endless joy of time zone differences, how I've missed thee.

[Strawhenge]

Broken record stopping in to vote Metalmarsh and to not get any traction on it. Bye.

[Ricochet]

Rico, what do you think of this:

Matt's trust in bcornett actually makes me think of something. This might have already been covered a time or five so sorry if it's old news but:

Brian was the counterwagon to LC on Day 2. LC voted for him in an 8-6 tally, meaning the real tally was 8-8 (barring other vote manipulation). LC can't bus his team mate in Brian in this scenario, because players would still be able to identify that the Flowers role was involved in getting him lynched.

Does this not clear bcornett, or come pretty close to that?

I feel this aspect is still open to interpretation, because:

a) LC's vote on b24 was his only lifeline left
b) except if Epig is bad, there was no genuine scumwagon on b24

If b) would be proven in any way thus far, then a) would sound like a logical move for LC to attempt, and b24 would be, as you say, closer to being cleared.

[Choutas]

Man, I sure would love to vote for Choutas today.

Why? Is his roleclaim false?

I don't know, but I do have some reasons for thinking he may be scummy scummington scummiest scummerino of the sea.

I'm outta here for a bit, but I just realized that 3J doesn't have one single vote yet.

To everyone who switched from 3J to seaside last Day Phase - What's up?

Peace out folks bbl

Oh and Choutas - Were you being funny about the "who do you suppose they targeted?" I guess I'll take you off my civvie for sure list.

It was bait.

Why did you think this was a good idea Choutas? sadly my "why" from before was ignored.

It was a good idea. I had suspicions that they would target me at night. Most people didn't respond to me and they look suss for that. The persons who did respond to me look townier to me. Now here comes a question. Why of all the billion stuff that happened that post stroke you as the scummiest? Explain.

Doc, please show me that you have any interest in baddie hunting. Choutas may or may not answer your questions, but there are a bunch of other people in this game and in recent phases you've given us close to nothing.

It's interesting how his ingame behavour could be summarized as focusing on the lesser posters to scumhunt. First it was Bcornet and the guy could get modkilled tonight. He's using the same "reply to my question" to me the same way he did with Bcornet. I believe he might have wanted to distance himself from a Bcornet lynch/modkill and he now has me as the most scummy player despite my name being off the choices for voting. This is scum behaviour if I ever saw one.
My preferences for today's lynch are sig and drwilgy.

is...

is that a NO U?

Also, my question relating to the highlighted was ignored, I asked previous, what makes you think this?

The reason why it stroke me as scummy is because you were off the lynch list. What a better time for a baddie to try to hunt out roles than when they are not able to be lynched for what they do? also there's a strike 2 in the fact that you say people that responded to this seem to be less scummy seems even dirtier. It's as if you were wanting to draw out more answers by putting out some form of reward. Strike three was stating "it was bait" as fast as you did. What was the point of this if you reveal that it was bait so soon? it kills the exercise if it was genuine, and hurts the potential for more information gain. You said that you see players that responded as less scummy, but I don't believe you gave players time to respond if that was your goal. LC did the same thing with the false bea case. What is the point, if you aren't going to maximize information gain? I mean, you didn't even need to defend your actions at that point, you were off the vote list. What was the point?

You just wanted it to be a No U I have you pegged as orange for two days at least. I still haven't voted for you so you're making things up. Noted.
Me doing what? Going after roles? Lolwut. If I act like a baddie they'll lynch me first thing tomorrow. There were already more suspicious players than me this day. Do you even read the other player's reads? Even if my name was on the poll they'd still prefer to lynch someone else on day 9.
Nobody would answer me after three pages, the thread moves fast regrettably. It still strengthened my Rico read as town. I was suspecting him in the beginning and he swayed me towards townie the last days(that post included).
This case is made out of thin air.

[RadicalFuzz]

Broken record stopping in to vote Metalmarsh and to not get any traction on it. Bye.

I feel your pain. Nobody cares for a Wilgy vote either.

I thought I understood his motivations, but I've apparently misconstrued them. I'll look at him more closely.

[Strawhenge]

Also, calling it that Jay is scum and Choutas is anti-town in some regard.

[Ricochet]

The Leftovers right now. Back on Mafia afterwards.

[RadicalFuzz]

Elo, since you're here, why did you vote for me?

[DrWilgy]

Man, I sure would love to vote for Choutas today.

Why? Is his roleclaim false?

I don't know, but I do have some reasons for thinking he may be scummy scummington scummiest scummerino of the sea.

I'm outta here for a bit, but I just realized that 3J doesn't have one single vote yet.

To everyone who switched from 3J to seaside last Day Phase - What's up?

Peace out folks bbl

Oh and Choutas - Were you being funny about the "who do you suppose they targeted?" I guess I'll take you off my civvie for sure list.

It was bait.

Why did you think this was a good idea Choutas? sadly my "why" from before was ignored.

It was a good idea. I had suspicions that they would target me at night. Most people didn't respond to me and they look suss for that. The persons who did respond to me look townier to me. Now here comes a question. Why of all the billion stuff that happened that post stroke you as the scummiest? Explain.

Doc, please show me that you have any interest in baddie hunting. Choutas may or may not answer your questions, but there are a bunch of other people in this game and in recent phases you've given us close to nothing.

It's interesting how his ingame behavour could be summarized as focusing on the lesser posters to scumhunt. First it was Bcornet and the guy could get modkilled tonight. He's using the same "reply to my question" to me the same way he did with Bcornet. I believe he might have wanted to distance himself from a Bcornet lynch/modkill and he now has me as the most scummy player despite my name being off the choices for voting. This is scum behaviour if I ever saw one.
My preferences for today's lynch are sig and drwilgy.

is...

is that a NO U?

Also, my question relating to the highlighted was ignored, I asked previous, what makes you think this?

The reason why it stroke me as scummy is because you were off the lynch list. What a better time for a baddie to try to hunt out roles than when they are not able to be lynched for what they do? also there's a strike 2 in the fact that you say people that responded to this seem to be less scummy seems even dirtier. It's as if you were wanting to draw out more answers by putting out some form of reward. Strike three was stating "it was bait" as fast as you did. What was the point of this if you reveal that it was bait so soon? it kills the exercise if it was genuine, and hurts the potential for more information gain. You said that you see players that responded as less scummy, but I don't believe you gave players time to respond if that was your goal. LC did the same thing with the false bea case. What is the point, if you aren't going to maximize information gain? I mean, you didn't even need to defend your actions at that point, you were off the vote list. What was the point?

You just wanted it to be a No U I have you pegged as orange for two days at least. I still haven't voted for you so you're making things up. Noted.
Me doing what? Going after roles? Lolwut. If I act like a baddie they'll lynch me first thing tomorrow. There were already more suspicious players than me this day. Do you even read the other player's reads? Even if my name was on the poll they'd still prefer to lynch someone else on day 9.
Nobody would answer me after three pages, the thread moves fast regrettably. It still strengthened my Rico read as town. I was suspecting him in the beginning and he swayed me towards townie the last days(that post included).
This case is made out of thin air.

Lol, but you bump me down to lynch status upon accusing you? looks like a NO U to me. Saying I make things up? when you don't read my posts? I had to instruct you to look into my posts just to get my questions answered. It's also apparent that you don't read my posts due to this:

I'm outta here for a bit, but I just realized that 3J doesn't have one single vote yet.

To everyone who switched from 3J to seaside last Day Phase - What's up?

Peace out folks bbl

Oh and Choutas - Were you being funny about the "who do you suppose they targeted?" I guess I'll take you off my civvie for sure list.

It was bait.

Anything revealing so far?

The scum would refrain from replying. You look good same with Matt.

You managed to ignore the fact that I replied. Also you managed ignored that bcornett replied.

What? Highlighted for importance. You are basically saying "there are other players with reads, so ignore me until tomorrow" Is it bad that I am wanting to look outside of the majority's scumlists? Should we not be discussing anyone who isn't a top candidate currently?

I mean... That's great for Rico and all, but you had stated "Scum would refrain from replying." and you still haven't stated what makes you think that. My best guess: you know who scum are, and you know whether or not they would reply.

Thin air? Words are simply carried by it... or computer screens... one of the two...

Someone else please chime in on my thoughts, and this discussion.

[Bullzeye]

I voted Russti again because I haven't had much time to catch up and he's still one of my top suspects. If I'm still alive/the game is still going after this weekend I will hopefully be more active but until then I can't really play, unfortunately.

[Marmot]

When you say that "we voted for several options that would affect the game in some way or another," you mean J3 and yourself? I'm assuming these options weren't public and can't be shared, correct?

Metalmarsh I'm not talking about a full-fledged ISO of interactions, I'm talking about basic stuff. "Oh, he's only voted for one person for three days when 2 Mafia have been lynched! That's strange." Or perhaps "he called for a Chinese Fire Drill and then the Mafia member almost survived the lynch!" I had been literally asking to be scumread, but nobody spoke up. I mentioned how horrible my actions looked as I called for the Chinese Fire Drill, yet nobody cared to comment on them, whether to agree or disagree. Do you see why I invite suspicion? So that this exact thing doesn't happen. The finer points of interactions, fair enough, that takes a degree of hindsight, time, and effort not immediately available five minutes after a lynch. But calling for a CFD on a player that turned out to be scum? That should've gotten me crucified on the spot, but no match was lit. I don't believe any player citing that point cared to mention that, in addition to calling for a CFD when Mac was on the chopping block, I kept my vote on Wilgy. I neither started, nor contributed, to the counter-wagon on Diiny, that was J3's doing.

Should we forgive you and forget it happened since we didn't "crucify you on the spot"?

You were okay with me reading you as town and not addressing it before (you even said you have no inclination to make a case on me). Why is it a problem now?

I did comment on your mention of the CFD. I did comment on your vote(s) for DrWilgy.



I feel like you are admitting that you are mafia, but you are displeased with us for casing you with all the wrong reasons.

[DrWilgy]

Choutas btw

[Marmot]

I thought I had replied to you with regards to Choutas, DrWilgy. It must have gotten lost in linki. Let me try to reformulate it.

[RadicalFuzz]

He reminds me of Flounder the fish.

Bullz it's Monday in most time zones and Tuesday in some. The weekend already ended. I am confused.



MM I'm trying to express annoyance. My actions from last week are perceived to be scummy when I'm out of town. The main pusher of my wagon is currently not available because of time zones. I'm not attempting to suggest you ignore posts simply because you didn't speak up at the time, I'm confused as to how those actions in and of themselves seemed to have magically become more scummy. I apologize that I've forgotten your comments on my actions. If I was scum giving up I would be having way more fun than I am right now.

And the reason I was fine with you reading me as town for seemingly no reason was because I had a reason to believe you thought I was town because of other reasons. You know exactly what you're doing with this vote though, I know that for a fact, and that's why I'm frustrated. I know that explanation sucks but I can't go further than that.

[Bullzeye]

This weekend as in the weekend that follows this coming Friday. Would have thought that was pretty obvious, I don't think the game is going to end yesterday.

[motel room]

MM I'm trying to express annoyance.

Ew phrasing. How do you actually feel?

[RadicalFuzz]

MM I'm trying to express annoyance.

Ew phrasing. How do you actually feel?

I'm trying to express that I feel annoyed...?

[DrWilgy]

MM I'm trying to express annoyance.

Ew phrasing. How do you actually feel?

I'm trying to express that I feel annoyed...?

Have you come to the conclusion that you are annoyed? plz don't be mad at me

[Marmot]

He reminds me of Flounder the fish.

Bullz it's Monday in most time zones and Tuesday in some. The weekend already ended. I am confused.



MM I'm trying to express annoyance. My actions from last week are perceived to be scummy when I'm out of town. The main pusher of my wagon is currently not available because of time zones. I'm not attempting to suggest you ignore posts simply because you didn't speak up at the time, I'm confused as to how those actions in and of themselves seemed to have magically become more scummy. I apologize that I've forgotten your comments on my actions. If I was scum giving up I would be having way more fun than I am right now.

And the reason I was fine with you reading me as town for seemingly no reason was because I had a reason to believe you thought I was town because of other reasons. You know exactly what you're doing with this vote though, I know that for a fact, and that's why I'm frustrated. I know that explanation sucks but I can't go further than that.

Here is Jay's initial ISO of your interactions with scum, and the posts that follow are my reactions to it. I believe this came about on Saturday night. The main point I took away was Floyd's slip and Jay's observation on your connection to it.

Here is a post I brought up later, in which Floyd speaks differently of the slip then what it originally looks like.

Here is the ISO I did of your interactions with MacDougall on Sunday morning.

If you (or anyone else) thinks my thought process through this was illogical, I don't know what to say, except that I disagree.

[Marmot]

MM I'm trying to express annoyance.

Ew phrasing. How do you actually feel?

I'm trying to express that I feel annoyed...?

Have you come to the conclusion that you are annoyed? plz don't be mad at me

How do you feel about all of this DrWilgy who is definitely not a doctor.

[DrWilgy]

Eloh, Motel, comment on my thoughts please.

[Elohcin]

Elo, since you're here, why did you vote for me?

The tab stays open on my computer. It doesn't mean I am actually here. But I am now. I voted for you b/c I think you are bad. Mac has a record of voting for a teammate day 1. I think there is a good chance that happened this game. Also, I would like to take away the doubt that has been placed on Rico b/c I think he is good.

[RadicalFuzz]

MM the reason I thought you were town without asking you is unable to be spoken due to the rules of this game.

Eloh basically you're lynching me half because you think I'm actually scum, and half because there's a connection between Rico and I that led you to a conclusion that if I am scum he is most definitely town? What is that connection?

[Marmot]

Anyone else have thoughts on what I've said about Chou? I'm wishing upon a star for the last answer to my questions.

*Wilgy goes to the top of a starry hill and looks to the brightest star in the sky*

Right, Choutas.

I do agree that the presumption that Choutas becoming aggressive while his name is not on the lynch list is good to observe. However, I would counter with this. His Day 6 vote looks bad (voted Diiny to put him behind MacDougall 7-5), but Day 7 and Day 8, he voted for Floyd. After having a partner get lynched on Day 6, I don't find it a good move to bus another teammate following that one, especially on Day 8 after another teammate was modkilled. Two mafia dead in two days, I just don't see it being a solid move to intentionally lose another one, even if he was under heat anyway.

So he was aggressive, but he did help lynch mafia in a close lynch poll.

[DrWilgy]

I'll comment on Fuzz as soon as I'm at a computer.

A summary would be: Fuzz is dangerous neutral in my head. Meta makes me think he isn't scum. Everything else makes me feel that Fuzz is a Sith Lord.

[RadicalFuzz]

I'll comment on Fuzz as soon as I'm at a computer.

A summary would be: Fuzz is dangerous neutral in my head. Meta makes me think he isn't scum. Everything else makes me feel that Fuzz is a Sith Lord.

I have an overwhelming desire to choke you because I know you're finding this hilarious. Does that help?

[motel room]

Eloh, Motel, comment on my thoughts please.

About the "who do ppl think we're targeted" "bait" by choutas?

Some of you guys really pounce on things at face value hey.

I'll reply when I get into the office, on my phone and it sucks

[Marmot]

Fuzz, this is the post that Elohcin is talking about.

Okay, Matt F. You asked me if Mac has a tendency to vote for his mafia team mates on Day 1. I did some research into the RYM Mafia archives and didn't struggle at all to find valid examples:

But...he didn't vote for any teammates in this game.

How do you know?

Uhm...his vote record?

O wait...

I think I get it now.

derp

Ricochet said MacDougall didn't vote any teammates, if it was not a derp and actually correct, that means that you and Diiny are both civ, since he voted for you (reywas) on Day 1, and Diiny two other times.

[RadicalFuzz]

I see. Players are using that connection as a way to check Rico and/or me/Diiny. I'm dirtier than Rico, so they're more comfortable with lynching me for this scenario. That makes sense, unfortunately.

[Diiny]

Rad, JJJ said Rico's slip isn't even why he voted you iirc.

Why didn't you push floyd on his 'do you mean the thread text' slip, despite it happening in conversation with you?

[Diiny]

I'll comment on Fuzz as soon as I'm at a computer.

A summary would be: Fuzz is dangerous neutral in my head. Meta makes me think he isn't scum. Everything else makes me feel that Fuzz is a Sith Lord.

What does dangerous neutral mean?

Tell me whether you think he's town or scum using only the word 'town' or 'scum'

[Diiny]

I have no idea why I voted the host, I'm voting Rico because he has a weird obsession with fabricating reads on me. I work basically until the deadline tonight so I doubt I'll be back in time to change my vote. Only thing I have read is the Rico most recent case of me. (this deadline time stinks, I work until it at least 2x a week)

Cool omgus, what about the case makes it seem fabricated?