[END] Pet Sounds Mafia

[a2thezebra]

What is a CFD?

[DrWilgy]

Grabbin din din brb ~<3

[a2thezebra]

Anyway, considering the game has entered "hard mode" as you put it, you seem pretty confident in your read of me and pretty ambitious in convincing others that you are correct. Perhaps I let you redeem yourself too easily when I took my vote off of you.

[Marmot]

CFD - Chinese fire drill.

It involves a last-minute shuffling of votes from one wagon to another to lynch a player that was not originally expected to be lynched.

[Marmot]

DrWilgy, RadicalFuzz employed that exact same strategy in Talking Heads, stating that his behavior is bad, and that we should look at him because of that. It is most notable because he suggested a CFD one day, and afterwards pointed out how bad he looked for it. He was a civilian in that game.

Are you intentionally mimicking his behaviour? Do you have reason to defend me as a civilian?

[Marmot]

You're getting my vote as well.

DrWilgy

[a2thezebra]

As well? You're the first to vote for him today. I'm suspicious of him but you're still the better choice.

[Marmot]

I know you didn't vote for him. The "as well" was connecting my vote post to my suspicion post.

[Marmot]

I believe this is what they call an impasse.

[DrWilgy]

DrWilgy, RadicalFuzz employed that exact same strategy in Talking Heads, stating that his behavior is bad, and that we should look at him because of that. It is most notable because he suggested a CFD one day, and afterwards pointed out how bad he looked for it. He was a civilian in that game.

Are you intentionally mimicking his behaviour? Do you have reason to defend me as a civilian?

Actually no. I wouldn't propose a CFD without proper belief behind the CFD. It was Day 1, no mafia btsc had happened yet. If we were to strike them with a strategy like that, it would've been most optimal when they had no way of discussing a reaction plan. Another point, is that Fuzz stated he should look bad for suggestion of a CFD because his CFD would've saved a baddie from lynch before my confirmation as bad, putting someone who was seen as maybe civ (at the time) under the lynching block vs a confirmed baddie.

I hope others begin to speak up soon.

Zebra are you suggesting that I am confident in not getting lynched? You are mistaken. The chances of me getting lynched seems to be increasing rapidly the more I discuss. That's kinda how the game works. Mafia generally want to halt civ evolution and adaptation, and that can be done most optimally through the killing of heavy speakers. If there's a chance to mislynch me for what I say, I have no doubt they won't take it. How is it bad for me to state that the game entered hard mode? Cop is our go to role. It devastates our chances of winning since he was hit.

[a2thezebra]

This is your first post game that hints at any sort of legitimate suspicion towards anyone. You helped to elaborate on why "No Lynch" is a problem and what LyLo means, but this is your first post that could contribute to scumhunting:

But bea, Luke also played LC's game.

Hi Matt, feeling lonely? You don't have any votes.

The problem isn't that you were posting a lot with little scumhunting content, (otherwise I'd be a blatant hypocrite) the problem is that your implied suspicion of Matt F is unexplained. Personally I'm not a fan of unexplained suspicions and I don't think anyone should be.

MM, have you marked any players as "not voting for?" yet?

No. Well actually yes now, I'm not voting for FZ.

Recruitment was actually the first time I used that strategy (and tbh, it was for the lulz). It would be easier work to narrow the field in a small game like this, but probably not the best strategy.

I've mentioned this already. At the time you didn't specify why you were so confident that FZ was civilian. This post seemed to exist only to make it clear that you were sure she was one.

I'm voting no lynch for the moment, might change later

I think this needs to change, no day one votes is a horrible idea Luke11646

Bcornett is getting his wish.

Any thoughts on bcornett? Nope. Just observing a mislynch in action, not swaying it one way or another but still providing comments that are just tangible enough to avoid accusations of lurking and just useless enough to not provide any content to analyze. This post is a good example of the majority of your actions so far, or lack thereof.

I'll join you on Tranq

Again, I'm more weary of posters that avoid lurking while also avoiding explanation of their actions than I am of actual lurkers. It seems like you're just going through the motions of do this do that blend in etc. etc. If you want to change my mind you should post more original thoughts, ideas, and opinions. So far the only insight you have offered has been unexplained, that is unless you are provoked to explain it.

MM, have you marked any players as "not voting for?" yet?

No. Well actually yes now, I'm not voting for FZ.

Recruitment was actually the first time I used that strategy (and tbh, it was for the lulz). It would be easier work to narrow the field in a small game like this, but probably not the best strategy.

Why not, Marsh?

Because she confused Boomslang and Bullzeye. I saw that as a sign of a civ.

But look, you are sympathetic to the civilians and angry at the Mafia, so there's no way you could be one of them yourself:

The mafia are jerks. FZ can't rolecheck them if she's dead.

And finally...

No, I'm a vanilla civ.

How did you come up with that quote so quickly after the day began?

I looked back in the page for content related to FZ. Your post stood out.

[a2thezebra]

Zebra are you suggesting that I am confident in not getting lynched? You are mistaken. The chances of me getting lynched seems to be increasing rapidly the more I discuss. That's kinda how the game works. Mafia generally want to halt civ evolution and adaptation, and that can be done most optimally through the killing of heavy speakers. If there's a chance to mislynch me for what I say, I have no doubt they won't take it. How is it bad for me to state that the game entered hard mode? Cop is our go to role. It devastates our chances of winning since he was hit.

Thanks, but that wasn't what I was suggesting. I assumed that wasn't a rhetorical question at first but then you proceeded to explain why the answer to it that I hadn't given yet was incorrect.

It isn't bad by itself for you to state that the game is in hard mode, what's bad is that it contradicts with everything else you've posted. You don't seem like your chances of winning have been devastated; perhaps because as mafia, they haven't been.

[Marmot]

DrWilgy, RadicalFuzz employed that exact same strategy in Talking Heads, stating that his behavior is bad, and that we should look at him because of that. It is most notable because he suggested a CFD one day, and afterwards pointed out how bad he looked for it. He was a civilian in that game.

Are you intentionally mimicking his behaviour? Do you have reason to defend me as a civilian?

Actually no. I wouldn't propose a CFD without proper belief behind the CFD. It was Day 1, no mafia btsc had happened yet. If we were to strike them with a strategy like that, it would've been most optimal when they had no way of discussing a reaction plan. Another point, is that Fuzz stated he should look bad for suggestion of a CFD because his CFD would've saved a baddie from lynch before my confirmation as bad, putting someone who was seen as maybe civ (at the time) under the lynching block vs a confirmed baddie.

You still asked zebra to look at you. You reminded her that you tried to start a CFD on her on Day 1. If you think it was a good idea, and you suspect her enough to vote for her again today, why does it concern you that she's looking at me instead of you?

[DrWilgy]

Wait a second. Zebra, are you saying that you read the thread, read that I proposed a CFD, didn't know what it ment, read that Tranq had to google search it, didn't google search it yourself in the 24 hours we had between phases, and are just now concerned with what a CFD is, when it involves you?

Linki - Oh, they have, but I'm not giving up because of it. What do you expect me to do cry? I'm going to talk more, I'm going to encourage discussion, I'll do whatever I can to get those chances back.

Linki Linki - Because of how quick it was, also It bothered me that she didn't seem to be concerned with what I pointed out. Felt like a distraction, but that's my gut. I'll give it a moment to digest and see what I think again.

[a2thezebra]

Wait a second. Zebra, are you saying that you read the thread, read that I proposed a CFD, didn't know what it ment, read that Tranq had to google search it, didn't google search it yourself in the 24 hours we had between phases, and are just now concerned with what a CFD is, when it involves you?

Correct. Your case against me was that unconvincing. I didn't even care enough to respond to it and also didn't care enough to worry about whatever a CFD is to know that if it meant any kind of trouble for me and it was your suggestion to the rest of town, it wasn't going to happen.

[DrWilgy]

SO... you admit to not be concerned with discussion? because that's what you are telling me. You are saying that you are willing to let a post go, because of irrelevance? Nothing is irrelevant, somethings players would rather just brush aside or sweep under the rug. This just makes me think even more that this MM suspicion is still just a distraction.

[Marmot]

Zebra, you are reading very deeply into some of my less relevant posts that I don't think deserve to be read as such. I do apologize for not being engaged on Day 1 though. You're not wrong about that. I'll just call it a hangover from Talking Heads.

Do you disagree with my reasoning about FZ though?

[a2thezebra]

I admit to not be concerned with getting lynched based on the merit of your arguments.

[bea]

I think in my hot toddy and cough syrup induced haze I agree with zeeb's points about marshynewt.

Oh god, I need my soup to be done so I can go to bed!!
The rest of it is starting to read like Russian to me.

[DrWilgy]

Also listening to the 8bit This Must Be the Place while watching my avatar still gives me a big dumb smile, thank's MP!

linki - Don't die bea!

[a2thezebra]

I don't disagree with your reasoning MM, it just seems disingenuous to single her out the way you did. It seems like that post had some sort of ulterior motive.

[Marmot]

Wait a second. Zebra, are you saying that you read the thread, read that I proposed a CFD, didn't know what it ment, read that Tranq had to google search it, didn't google search it yourself in the 24 hours we had between phases, and are just now concerned with what a CFD is, when it involves you?

Correct. Your case against me was that unconvincing. I didn't even care enough to respond to it and also didn't care enough to worry about whatever a CFD is to know that if it meant any kind of trouble for me and it was your suggestion to the rest of town, it wasn't going to happen.

Oh I see, if I ignore your case, then everyone else will too.

[a2thezebra]

I think in my hot toddy and cough syrup induced haze I agree with zeeb's points about marshynewt.

Oh god, I need my soup to be done so I can go to bed!!
The rest of it is starting to read like Russian to me.

That's because the rest of it might as well be Russian, unless of course you speak Russian.

[DrWilgy]

I admit to not be concerned with getting lynched based on the merit of your arguments.

And why is you getting lynched based on the merit of my arguments your priority?

[Marmot]

I don't disagree with your reasoning MM, it just seems disingenuous to single her out the way you did. It seems like that post had some sort of ulterior motive.

Why does it seem like that?

Linki: I don't speak Russian.

[a2thezebra]

Wait a second. Zebra, are you saying that you read the thread, read that I proposed a CFD, didn't know what it ment, read that Tranq had to google search it, didn't google search it yourself in the 24 hours we had between phases, and are just now concerned with what a CFD is, when it involves you?

Correct. Your case against me was that unconvincing. I didn't even care enough to respond to it and also didn't care enough to worry about whatever a CFD is to know that if it meant any kind of trouble for me and it was your suggestion to the rest of town, it wasn't going to happen.

Oh I see, if I ignore your case, then everyone else will too.

It's not up to you or me to decide if my case has merit. Town decided yesterday that Wilgy's case against me was not enough for a "CFD" and perhaps they will do the same for my case against you. bea thinks I might be on to something but that could be partly because of her current state.

[a2thezebra]

I admit to not be concerned with getting lynched based on the merit of your arguments.

And why is you getting lynched based on the merit of my arguments your priority?

Who said it was my priority?

I don't disagree with your reasoning MM, it just seems disingenuous to single her out the way you did. It seems like that post had some sort of ulterior motive.

Why does it seem like that?

Linki: I don't speak Russian.

Partly because you didn't explain the reasoning when you made the original statement, partly because it seemed out-of-place for a statement to be as confident as yours was amidst your other posts that implied that you weren't feeling too strongly about anything in particular, and partly because it presents a certain amount of WIFOM in the context of FZ dying shortly afterwards.

[DrWilgy]

I admit to not be concerned with getting lynched based on the merit of your arguments.

And why is you getting lynched based on the merit of my arguments your priority?

Who said it was my priority?

If you not getting lynched isn't your priority, and discussion isn't your priority, what is?

[a2thezebra]

I admit to not be concerned with getting lynched based on the merit of your arguments.

And why is you getting lynched based on the merit of my arguments your priority?

Who said it was my priority?

If you not getting lynched isn't your priority, and discussion isn't your priority, what is?

Who said discussion isn't my priority?

[DrWilgy]

Wait a second. Zebra, are you saying that you read the thread, read that I proposed a CFD, didn't know what it ment, read that Tranq had to google search it, didn't google search it yourself in the 24 hours we had between phases, and are just now concerned with what a CFD is, when it involves you?

Correct. Your case against me was that unconvincing. I didn't even care enough to respond to it and also didn't care enough to worry about whatever a CFD is to know that if it meant any kind of trouble for me and it was your suggestion to the rest of town, it wasn't going to happen.

You did.

[Marmot]

I admit to not be concerned with getting lynched based on the merit of your arguments.

And why is you getting lynched based on the merit of my arguments your priority?

Who said it was my priority?

I don't disagree with your reasoning MM, it just seems disingenuous to single her out the way you did. It seems like that post had some sort of ulterior motive.

Why does it seem like that?

Linki: I don't speak Russian.

Partly because you didn't explain the reasoning when you made the original statement, partly because it seemed out-of-place for a statement to be as confident as yours was amidst your other posts that implied that you weren't feeling too strongly about anything in particular, and partly because it presents a certain amount of WIFOM in the context of FZ dying shortly afterwards.

I didn't know whether I should state the reason at the time. I was mainly responding to the question asked to me.

But regardless of my alignment, I do like WIFOM.

[a2thezebra]

No DrWilgy, this is caring enough to respond to it.

Boomslang, Luke is pretty new to Mafia just so you know. He's played a few games but I think he's still getting the grasp of it.

Fair enough, and I'll take that under consideration. Still, even if he's new, he's had the same chance to study the thread and its arguments as the rest of us. The vote did come after all of that naysaying, so to ignore it is still making a statement.

he's so new...are you sure he read the thread and digested it like he should have??

And I"m going to correct matt too. He's not played "a few games'" he's played one. Epi's speed game- in which he's prolly going to be lynched.

He's as new and green as they come near as I can tell boom.

That's the thing. There's no scum motivation for ignoring the arguments against a No Lynch. If he didn't read the thread, he didn't read the thread. It ain't a big deal. And if he's bad and he did read the thread, what could he possibly have to gain by trying to sway the town in favor of a No Lynch when clearly no one would support him? I'm more suspicious of those that are looking at his No Lynch post as an opportunity.

And Wilgy, Choutas' No Lynch vote is unexplained. And he's no stranger to the game. That's something to raise an eyebrow to indeed...that is until he changed it to Tranq. I think it was just a placeholder since his initial vote was rendered moot and he had no other pings at the time. I believe you're response and that you weren't trying to start a wagon so I'll switch my vote to the most opportunistic of the Luke voters, bcornett. I don't buy bcornett's reasoning at all.

bcornett24

So here's the thing about Zebra, how can a civilian "believe" something in this kind of gamestate?

What does this even mean? Even in the earliest stages of the game you either believe someone is genuine or you believe they are not. It's literally impossible for a civilian not to believe something in a Mafia game unless they obtain the information that allows them to leap from belief to knowledge.

"Choutas' No Lynch vote being unexplained" feels as if he's trying to buddy up on me, while distancing from Choutas while not committing to it. Why not implore Choutas?

What do you mean implore Choutas? I called him out and displayed my reasoning for not being convinced that what he did was scum-motivated, did you want me to put it in larger font or something?

HEY CHOUTAS WHAT'S UP WITH YOUR TEMPORARY NO LYNCH VOTE OH WAIT IT'S UNDERSTANDABLE GIVEN THAT YOU PRETTY CLEARLY WEREN'T INTENDING TO END THE DAY WITH IT AND COULDN'T THINK OF ANYONE ELSE TO VOTE FOR OK BYE

Also, he had gone in on me seeing me as opportunistic.

Indeed. Wait, I thought I was trying to buddy up on you? You can't lose sight of a deceitful narrative mid-case Wilgy every scum knows that!

Don't the concept of thinking I was opportunistic and then "believing" in me contradict one another?

Here's an idea. Maybe, as a civilian, I don't know for sure whether you are town or scum, so if I happen to change my opinion of you (and back again) it's part of a natural development of my scumhunting process that I apply to every other player in the game as well? For example, I currently have a scum read of both you and MM. But given that I don't see the sparring between you two on this page as staged, I'm more certain that I'm wrong about at least one of you then I am on my reads of either of you individually. So now my process is deciding which one of you (if not both) I am mistaken about. Hence me believing that you are being truthful with some posts but not others. Performances can be convincing, you know.

Also looking at the votes from earlier to now:
[img]nope[/img]
[img]me%20no%20spam%20in%20quotes[/img]
All 3 of my suspected mafia list were spread out, quite safely, if I had to be a judge, and now one of them had moved over to the second highest wagon, that probably won't take off at the rate that it's going. Is it so they look good not being on a possible civvy mislynch? maybe.

Well unfortunately this particular argument has now been proven not to apply to me, being on the bcornett wagon and all.[/quote]

[a2thezebra]

Wait a second. Zebra, are you saying that you read the thread, read that I proposed a CFD, didn't know what it ment, read that Tranq had to google search it, didn't google search it yourself in the 24 hours we had between phases, and are just now concerned with what a CFD is, when it involves you?

Correct. Your case against me was that unconvincing. I didn't even care enough to respond to it and also didn't care enough to worry about whatever a CFD is to know that if it meant any kind of trouble for me and it was your suggestion to the rest of town, it wasn't going to happen.

You did.

I didn't see any helpful discussion that would come from it. I felt that if I responded to it at the time that it would only distract from more helpful discussion. If anything that means my not responding to your case is evidence that I do consider discussion a priority. You don't have to agree or even believe me for that matter, but it is what it is all the same.

[DrWilgy]

No DrWilgy, this is caring enough to respond to it.

Boomslang, Luke is pretty new to Mafia just so you know. He's played a few games but I think he's still getting the grasp of it.

Fair enough, and I'll take that under consideration. Still, even if he's new, he's had the same chance to study the thread and its arguments as the rest of us. The vote did come after all of that naysaying, so to ignore it is still making a statement.

he's so new...are you sure he read the thread and digested it like he should have??

And I"m going to correct matt too. He's not played "a few games'" he's played one. Epi's speed game- in which he's prolly going to be lynched.

He's as new and green as they come near as I can tell boom.

That's the thing. There's no scum motivation for ignoring the arguments against a No Lynch. If he didn't read the thread, he didn't read the thread. It ain't a big deal. And if he's bad and he did read the thread, what could he possibly have to gain by trying to sway the town in favor of a No Lynch when clearly no one would support him? I'm more suspicious of those that are looking at his No Lynch post as an opportunity.

And Wilgy, Choutas' No Lynch vote is unexplained. And he's no stranger to the game. That's something to raise an eyebrow to indeed...that is until he changed it to Tranq. I think it was just a placeholder since his initial vote was rendered moot and he had no other pings at the time. I believe you're response and that you weren't trying to start a wagon so I'll switch my vote to the most opportunistic of the Luke voters, bcornett. I don't buy bcornett's reasoning at all.

bcornett24

So here's the thing about Zebra, how can a civilian "believe" something in this kind of gamestate?

What does this even mean? Even in the earliest stages of the game you either believe someone is genuine or you believe they are not. It's literally impossible for a civilian not to believe something in a Mafia game unless they obtain the information that allows them to leap from belief to knowledge.

"Choutas' No Lynch vote being unexplained" feels as if he's trying to buddy up on me, while distancing from Choutas while not committing to it. Why not implore Choutas?

What do you mean implore Choutas? I called him out and displayed my reasoning for not being convinced that what he did was scum-motivated, did you want me to put it in larger font or something?

HEY CHOUTAS WHAT'S UP WITH YOUR TEMPORARY NO LYNCH VOTE OH WAIT IT'S UNDERSTANDABLE GIVEN THAT YOU PRETTY CLEARLY WEREN'T INTENDING TO END THE DAY WITH IT AND COULDN'T THINK OF ANYONE ELSE TO VOTE FOR OK BYE

Also, he had gone in on me seeing me as opportunistic.

Indeed. Wait, I thought I was trying to buddy up on you? You can't lose sight of a deceitful narrative mid-case Wilgy every scum knows that!

Don't the concept of thinking I was opportunistic and then "believing" in me contradict one another?

Here's an idea. Maybe, as a civilian, I don't know for sure whether you are town or scum, so if I happen to change my opinion of you (and back again) it's part of a natural development of my scumhunting process that I apply to every other player in the game as well? For example, I currently have a scum read of both you and MM. But given that I don't see the sparring between you two on this page as staged, I'm more certain that I'm wrong about at least one of you then I am on my reads of either of you individually. So now my process is deciding which one of you (if not both) I am mistaken about. Hence me believing that you are being truthful with some posts but not others. Performances can be convincing, you know.

Also looking at the votes from earlier to now:
[img]nope[/img]
[img]me%20no%20spam%20in%20quotes[/img]
All 3 of my suspected mafia list were spread out, quite safely, if I had to be a judge, and now one of them had moved over to the second highest wagon, that probably won't take off at the rate that it's going. Is it so they look good not being on a possible civvy mislynch? maybe.

Well unfortunately this particular argument has now been proven not to apply to me, being on the bcornett wagon and all.

you seem to be rather worked up, but the larger font is nice.

First of all, nothing is impossible, secondly it is most definitely true that civs have a harder time coming to something they believe in, not a belief. beliefs are everywhere and they exist frequently, but to take a belief and believe in it are completely different things, er.. noun vs adjective per say. I have a hard time BELIEVING that civs can come to a solid belief, so that when you stated "I believe" based on what little I had said it bothered me. Why not draw out more information to solidify your belief before coming to a state of believing?

By imploring Choutas, you would have him explain the meanings behind his actions, not make a statement. It's one thing to actively question ones actions, but another to make a statement. After mentioning Choutas once, you didn't bring it up agian, why?

Yes, the opportunism came first, then I felt a sense of you wanting me to board the S.S. Buddyship. You can't lose sight of a deceitful chronology mid-case Zebra every scum knows that!

Yes, but it is naturally hard for people to change their opinions, especially with what little information we had. It's not the fact that you changed opinion that bugs me, it's the fact that you went into the state of believing from a state of suspicion.

Why bring this up in that case? you felt strongly enough about ignoring CFD. What do you think about the other two I put you with on my list?

[DrWilgy]

Wait a second. Zebra, are you saying that you read the thread, read that I proposed a CFD, didn't know what it ment, read that Tranq had to google search it, didn't google search it yourself in the 24 hours we had between phases, and are just now concerned with what a CFD is, when it involves you?

Correct. Your case against me was that unconvincing. I didn't even care enough to respond to it and also didn't care enough to worry about whatever a CFD is to know that if it meant any kind of trouble for me and it was your suggestion to the rest of town, it wasn't going to happen.

You did.

I didn't see any helpful discussion that would come from it. I felt that if I responded to it at the time that it would only distract from more helpful discussion. If anything that means my not responding to your case is evidence that I do consider discussion a priority. You don't have to agree or even believe me for that matter, but it is what it is all the same.

Compared to what discussion that we already have? do tell? what is more helpful that we have already discussed that we can be distracted from?

[DrWilgy]

Okie dokie! time to sleep. I may check the thread on my phone in a bit. Good night everyone! Talk t'ya in the morning

[a2thezebra]

The colors...I...think I might be going blind....goodbye dear town, I'll see you in the morning.

[TheFloyd73]

This is the first Ive heard of the term CFD, although, I have seen such an action take place.

Zebra, MM, Wilgy. You all have pinned very reasonable allegations on each other. I don't believe that all three of you are scum, but that one or two of you are.

So in summary:

[Matt]

RIP bcornett and FZ. Wtf I can't believe the Mafia took out the cop night 1!!

bcornett - I never got a chance to respond to you, and I'm sorry I helped get you lynched, but I thought it was super fishy how people were voting for Luke for the reason they were, considering how new to the game he is. At the time of my vote, Luke had three votes, you had two, and the other Luke voters had zero a piece (Boomslang and Floyd), so pushing you into a tie with Luke was the best option at the time, IMO.

MM - I know you moved your vote away from me, but if there's anything you want to ask, feel free.

I've read the Zebra/Wilgy/MM exchange, but I'm tired and don't think I get some of it. Even though it was explained, I'm still not entirely sure what chinese fire drill means. Can someone explain it again?

And on a positive note, my man Bernie killed it again at the debates tonight. I think my favorite part of the whole night was Hillary invoking 9/11 when discussing her Wall Street backers. Wow.

[bea]

Now I know I've had too many Toddys and night time meds because all I see is gibberish and colors.

I can't even and I have to oc tomorrow. Can someone please put things in easy for a 2 year old terms for me? I open/close tomorrow so my attention is going to get worse before it gets better...

[Choutas]

No, I'm a vanilla civ.

How did you come up with that quote so quickly after the day began?

My guess is it's a mafia bullshit post prepared in advance.

DrWilgy, RadicalFuzz employed that exact same strategy in Talking Heads, stating that his behavior is bad, and that we should look at him because of that. It is most notable because he suggested a CFD one day, and afterwards pointed out how bad he looked for it. He was a civilian in that game.

Are you intentionally mimicking his behaviour? Do you have reason to defend me as a civilian?

Actually no. I wouldn't propose a CFD without proper belief behind the CFD. It was Day 1, no mafia btsc had happened yet. If we were to strike them with a strategy like that, it would've been most optimal when they had no way of discussing a reaction plan. Another point, is that Fuzz stated he should look bad for suggestion of a CFD because his CFD would've saved a baddie from lynch before my confirmation as bad, putting someone who was seen as maybe civ (at the time) under the lynching block vs a confirmed baddie.

I hope others begin to speak up soon.

Zebra are you suggesting that I am confident in not getting lynched? You are mistaken. The chances of me getting lynched seems to be increasing rapidly the more I discuss. That's kinda how the game works. Mafia generally want to halt civ evolution and adaptation, and that can be done most optimally through the killing of heavy speakers. If there's a chance to mislynch me for what I say, I have no doubt they won't take it. How is it bad for me to state that the game entered hard mode? Cop is our go to role. It devastates our chances of winning since he was hit.

And you're the go to guy in that case? You know a word called modesty?

[Choutas]

I don't really know what to think of the Wilgy/Zebra/Marmot convos. The Marmot plays exactly like he did in TH, I lean town on him for that. Wilgy's first post that MM quoted doesn't look good. Does he always posts like that in all games? Zebra mirrors well what I saw from him in TH. He's a good player though I'm sure he's capable of doing that as scum so I''ll have to watch for the slight details that might give that away.
I'm voting for Wilgy until a better case forms.

[Enrique]

Well, jeez. So that was about the worst result possible.

I've read the Zebra/Wilgy/MM exchange, but I'm tired and don't think I get some of it. Even though it was explained, I'm still not entirely sure what chinese fire drill means. Can someone explain it again?

And on a positive note, my man Bernie killed it again at the debates tonight. I think my favorite part of the whole night was Hillary invoking 9/11 when discussing her Wall Street backers. Wow.

From what I gather, CFD basically refers to last minute wagons. Best example I can provide in a game I played was in Dr. Who Mafia last year, when someone (maybe it was me? bad memory) was about to be lynched but then at the very last minute Snow Dog got 4 votes and was lynched instead. That incident pretty much drove the discussion for several days to come.

and he did kind of kill it, but as much as I love Sanders, the man has a terrible sense of timing lol. I appreciate how focused he is on several issues, but he went off topic so many times it's really hard to call it a win.

So, alright, anyway. This has been an interesting day so far. Zebra pulled out what I think was a great quote showing MM distance himself from an FZ kill (and the Boomslang/Bullzeye confusion doesn't really cut it for me as an explanation. what is that even supposed to mean?), but MM raises a great point when he asks how she had that post so ready. It's an odd thing to pick on when nobody knew FZ would die last night. I guess it's possible she just did a search for FZ's name after the result? Actually that makes a lot of sense and I may have just talked myself into believing it. But there's more. It's also worth pointing out that I found myself agreeing with Zebra for most of Day 1, then she went and jumped on the BC train (led by FZ) the moment it took off for what I feel was very little reason. Morning comes, and FZ is dead. There's a case to be made, and Zebra isn't taking it seriously enough.

Wilgy has come out looking the best out of this convo IMO. MM can argue his CFD argument smells of WIFOM, but BC did turn out to be a civvie, so it's not like Wilgy was out there just for the sake of saving him. To me he reads as genuinely trying to find scum.

Hope you feel better soon, Bea!

[Enrique]

I'm gonna go and leave my vote on a2zebra because I need to her to take this more seriously.

[Enrique]

I don't really know what to think of the Wilgy/Zebra/Marmot convos. The Marmot plays exactly like he did in TH, I lean town on him for that. Wilgy's first post that MM quoted doesn't look good. Does he always posts like that in all games? Zebra mirrors well what I saw from him in TH. He's a good player though I'm sure he's capable of doing that as scum so I''ll have to watch for the slight details that might give that away.
I'm voting for Wilgy until a better case forms.

I'm not sure what game TH is but I think you're giving it way too much importance. Let's focus on the game we're playing, I don't care how MM and A2Z played the last time.

[Enrique]

Some observations from rereading the whole thread because I have insomnia and honestly I'd skimmed a lot:

Floyd wants to "keep posts to a minimum." This game is so small already, I'm kind of baffled this would be seen as necessary when all it does is limit discussion. I don't know if you guys feel this but there's such an urgency to getting things right straight off the bat. Like MM said, we have two more chances before LYLO. We need to get scum and get them now. And for that we need people to talk. He was also damn quick to jump on the BC wagon the moment it gained steam. BC voted for Luke and Floyd immediately followed with "*sigh* Luke, you really gotta read the whole thread before you post something." Looks dangerous to me.

Boomslang's original vote for Luke still doesn't make sense to me. No Lynch was a scum-friendly option, we established that, but do you really think Luke read the thread and despite that went for it? Luke's vote meant nothing to me. I was supportive of No Lynch before that, so was FZ (sort of). It makes a lot of sense as option, we just can't afford to go that way in this game and I don't fault Luke for casting an early changeable vote for it. I don't know what to make of Boomslang yet but I feel like his faulty logic here was too influential on the last poll to simply ignore. He did react logically when A2Z explained why his logic was flawed, so that's a point for him (but then, if they were teammates without any BTSC at that point, it'd make sense to listen to each other).

Bea is being one of the most logical players from the get go. She hasn't brought much to the table in terms of new observations, but I think she's being very fair and civvie-minded. She voted bcornett because, being fair, we didn't have many other options. I respect that she didn't try to sugarcoat it with some bs explanation.

I don't have much to say about Luke and Matt, but they were both BC voters, which as we all know turned out to be a terrible idea. Matt thought "someone in the Luke voters is bad," which is fair enough, but then he conveniently picked BC out of those. Luke seems to be barely keeping up with the thread, while Matt has definitely been around and should know what's up. I'd like to hear more from both.

Tranq and Choutas seem equally jokey so far. Can't say I have a read on either of them. Tranq is just being Tranq, good or bad I have no idea. He's a smart guy, and I think he's biding his time until he has something relevant to say. When he does, we're all gonna want to hear.

I take back my vote for DrWilgy on Day 1. I don't think he's being as predatory as simply drawing out discussion, and so far it's working. I also accused him of being dismissive of A2Z's accusations on Day 1 (which is exactly how she's behaving now, lol) but his logic is a bit easier to follow on re-read. He votes not to get a wagon rolling, but to assess everyone's reaction, and I can respect that.

For what it's worth, we all know FZ started with one other civvie name. It was definitely not Boomslang (or BC). It might have been Luke or Wilgy. Can't tell how she felt about anybody else.

In conclusion... A2Z, Floyd, Boomslang. Those are the players I want to focus on right now, in that order.

Wilgy, what do you make out of Floyd so far?

[DrWilgy]

I don't really know what to think of the Wilgy/Zebra/Marmot convos. The Marmot plays exactly like he did in TH, I lean town on him for that. Wilgy's first post that MM quoted doesn't look good. Does he always posts like that in all games? Zebra mirrors well what I saw from him in TH. He's a good player though I'm sure he's capable of doing that as scum so I''ll have to watch for the slight details that might give that away.
I'm voting for Wilgy until a better case forms.

What about it doesn't look good Choutas? Why not form a case yourself?

Also... Modesty isn't my strong suit. Maybe it's just false self inflation to prevent the depression from cosuming me, but meh, idk.

Continuing reading now...

[DrWilgy]

From a game in a half history with Floyd, it seems that he's not a frequent poster. I wouldn't put Floyd on my scumdar because of his behavior so far, but I don't want to have a LYLO situation with civ floyd at this moment. So if his contributions don't increase by the time we come close to LYLO and I'm not dead set on a better option, I would pluck him regardless of alignment.

Floyd, what makes you absolutely sure that Me, MM, and Zebra aren't on the same team?

[Marmot]

I don't really know what to think of the Wilgy/Zebra/Marmot convos. The Marmot plays exactly like he did in TH, I lean town on him for that. Wilgy's first post that MM quoted doesn't look good. Does he always posts like that in all games? Zebra mirrors well what I saw from him in TH. He's a good player though I'm sure he's capable of doing that as scum so I''ll have to watch for the slight details that might give that away.
I'm voting for Wilgy until a better case forms.

I'm not sure what game TH is but I think you're giving it way too much importance. Let's focus on the game we're playing, I don't care how MM and A2Z played the last time.

TH is Talking Heads Mafia, and Choutas's only experience with any of the three players he mentioned here.

[DrWilgy]

Good jop MM and Zebra, we have floyd convinced. Endgame here we come!! bwahahahahahaha!