Day 12 ~ 2015 Game of Champions

[Ricochet]

Never mind, FZ has voted.

[Ricochet]

Hosts: is self-targeting approved in this game?

[bea]

Yea. I'm not liking this vote. I'm switching to matt. Has nothing to do with being called out for anything. I just gotta follow my heart on this one.

[bea]

I know I'm a civ. Sorsha is likely one having survived the kill. Between Matt and Mac - even for as wrong as I was about wigly, I just feel less sure of matt.

[FZ.]

LOL. Seriously Bea? That just painted you really bad.

[Ricochet]

I know I'm a civ. Sorsha is likely one having survived the kill. Between Matt and Mac - even for as wrong as I was about wigly, I just feel less sure of matt.

What does "Sorsha is likely one having survived the kill" even mean?

Also you left out FZ. in that walkthrough.

[S~V~S]

Hosts: is self-targeting approved in this game?

I have no plans on answering this.

[bea]

I know I'm a civ. Sorsha is likely one having survived the kill. Between Matt and Mac - even for as wrong as I was about wigly, I just feel less sure of matt.

What does "Sorsha is likely one having survived the kill" even mean?

Also you left out FZ. in that walkthrough.

I doubt the baddies targeted one of their own. I did leave fz out. I'm not sure about her. She is just under matt. If he would flip bad I think she is a good teammate candidate.

[FZ.]

I think Bea was ready to throw Mac under the bus but since we all think Bea is the next to be voted off if it doesn't end there, she decided it's not worth it and that it's better to try and vote Matt in the hopes of one more person joining them at least (maybe they have additional votes).
I hope no one switches.

[bea]

Na. Bea is civ. I'd bet on that for sure.

[FZ.]

Na. Bea is civ. I'd bet on that for sure.

Then please explain to me how after all of Mac's bullshit, you still think he's more civvie than Matt? I can't fathom it.
I'm not saying Matt doesn't have his scummy moments, but we all do. Mac is really throwing everything he can to see what sticks. Didn't he say I should be the one lynched? Why is he voting Matt? I know he said both of us look bad, but he said I should be lynched first. It just seems like an opportunistic vote

[Marmot]

Hosts: is self-targeting approved in this game?

You voted and lynched yourself Day 1. So... yes?

[Marmot]

Na. Bea is civ. I'd bet on that for sure.

Why don't you like this vote?

Also, would civ bea trust civ Sorsha or civ-friendly marmotnewt?

Probably not since I want to lynch you too.

[bea]

Na. Bea is civ. I'd bet on that for sure.

Then please explain to me how after all of Mac's bullshit, you still think he's more civvie than Matt? I can't fathom it.
I'm not saying Matt doesn't have his scummy moments, but we all do. Mac is really throwing everything he can to see what sticks. Didn't he say I should be the one lynched? Why is he voting Matt? I know he said both of us look bad, but he said I should be lynched first. It just seems like an opportunistic vote

Because I think he is. And I think I know his role. And that's about as far as I can explain.

Up until he drank said crazy juice, he felt very civ to me. If he were a baddie and suppatowning, I don't think if he were bad he'd go that bat crap cray cray so close to winning

[bea]

That mess up there is what happens when I try to sneek a mafia post in while tending the oven. Lol.

[Marmot]

That mess up there is what happens when I try to sneek a mafia post in while tending the oven. Lol.

Don't drop your phone in the pizza.

[Ricochet]

Hosts: is self-targeting approved in this game?

You voted and lynched yourself Day 1. So... yes?

I meant night powers. You can't target yourself with a vote, sillytton.

[Marmot]

Hosts: is self-targeting approved in this game?

You voted and lynched yourself Day 1. So... yes?

I meant night powers. You can't target yourself with a vote, sillytton.

:P

[FZ.]

Na. Bea is civ. I'd bet on that for sure.

Then please explain to me how after all of Mac's bullshit, you still think he's more civvie than Matt? I can't fathom it.
I'm not saying Matt doesn't have his scummy moments, but we all do. Mac is really throwing everything he can to see what sticks. Didn't he say I should be the one lynched? Why is he voting Matt? I know he said both of us look bad, but he said I should be lynched first. It just seems like an opportunistic vote

Because I think he is. And I think I know his role. And that's about as far as I can explain.

Up until he drank said crazy juice, he felt very civ to me. If he were a baddie and suppatowning, I don't think if he were bad he'd go that bat crap cray cray so close to winning

Why would he do it as a civ? It makes no sense either. The only other option I can see him being is an indy. He's gone back and forth with the "crazy juice". This is not the first time in the game where his behaviour was counter civvie. I had a big fight with him regarding that 4 way tie lynch. He had the weirdest ideas I've heard of.

[Ricochet]

Na. Bea is civ. I'd bet on that for sure.

Then please explain to me how after all of Mac's bullshit, you still think he's more civvie than Matt? I can't fathom it.
I'm not saying Matt doesn't have his scummy moments, but we all do. Mac is really throwing everything he can to see what sticks. Didn't he say I should be the one lynched? Why is he voting Matt? I know he said both of us look bad, but he said I should be lynched first. It just seems like an opportunistic vote

Because I think he is. And I think I know his role. And that's about as far as I can explain.

Up until he drank said crazy juice, he felt very civ to me. If he were a baddie and suppatowning, I don't think if he were bad he'd go that bat crap cray cray so close to winning

[FZ.]

Besides Bea, if you think Mac is good, shouldn't you be trying to convince us, not just saying I just think Matt is worse than Mac? No one is making sense to me in this game.


Rico, are you asking about the self targeting because of what I said about Sorsha targeting herself and using a the save to look better?


linki: I concur with Rico's smiley. How can you possibly know his role? Did LC tell you his role?

[Marmot]

Na. Bea is civ. I'd bet on that for sure.

Then please explain to me how after all of Mac's bullshit, you still think he's more civvie than Matt? I can't fathom it.
I'm not saying Matt doesn't have his scummy moments, but we all do. Mac is really throwing everything he can to see what sticks. Didn't he say I should be the one lynched? Why is he voting Matt? I know he said both of us look bad, but he said I should be lynched first. It just seems like an opportunistic vote

Because I think he is. And I think I know his role. And that's about as far as I can explain.

Up until he drank said crazy juice, he felt very civ to me. If he were a baddie and suppatowning, I don't think if he were bad he'd go that bat crap cray cray so close to winning

If they both had BTSC with Long Con, and Long Con trusted both of them, and told one the other's role?

Nah.

[Ricochet]

Even so, I'm pretty sure you can use "I think" at the beginning of a sentence in which you develop that thought, of knowing Mac's role, further. What does it cost you to do, especially if you think Mac will flip genuine civ? It's a closed setup, so it could help us match the puzzle pieces, if the role is indeed worthwhile.

[Ricochet]

Rico, are you asking about the self targeting because of what I said about Sorsha targeting herself and using a the save to look better?

That was my attempt indeed, although if there are still two baddies, the other directing his kill at Sorsha would make this angle pointless to check.

Both sound farfetched (the baddies would have gained the most by dropping us to 5, aka quasi-lylo, so), but who knows, it's the bloody Champies!

[Ricochet]

Imma watch a movie, which is something I haven't done in three weeks. The EoD is not that intense, in order to sit throughout for another 3 hours. I'll check in sporadically.

[FZ.]

Okay, I'm going to bed. If anyone has a reason for me to change my vote, speak now or forever hold your peace.

[MacDougall]

Okay, I'm going to bed. If anyone has a reason for me to change my vote, speak now or forever hold your peace.

I do.

[FZ.]

Okay, I'm going to bed. If anyone has a reason for me to change my vote, speak now or forever hold your peace.

I do.

You're supposed to give me the reason...try to make it a good one, okay?

[MacDougall]

Okay, I'm going to bed. If anyone has a reason for me to change my vote, speak now or forever hold your peace.

I do.

You're supposed to give me the reason...try to make it a good one, okay?

If you lynch me you'll lose the game.

[MacDougall]

If you are a civ anyway. If you aren't then there's point me trying to convince you. You seem to have made your mind up at about the same time Matt did *cough cough*.

[Ricochet]

Why do we lose the game if you die?

[FZ.]

If you are a civ anyway. If you aren't then there's point me trying to convince you. You seem to have made your mind up at about the same time Matt did *cough cough*.

That's bull. There are just not many options here.
Bea is not willing to share her thoughts on your role, and you're not really doing much to change my mind. There's just so much I'm willing to give up for the game. I'm tired. I want sleep. If I'm wrong, I'm sorry. But seriously, you gave no reason for your wacky behaviour this day and night phase, and I'm sick of trying when you're really not.

[MacDougall]

Metalmarsh isn't really going to give a toss who he wins with. Sorsha appears to have made her mind up. FZ and Matt are probably the bad guys. I'd say this one is lost after this mislynch.

Assuming the kill goes through tonight that's 2 mafia, 1 civ, 1 independent left (assuming they don't kill Metalmarsh). They'll probably kill Sorsha. All signs point to them having some vote shenanigan mechanics. Even if they don't they'll vote bea together and Metalmarsh has no reason to really rock the boat and will probably just go with it since he's got bea and I at the bottom.

[MacDougall]

If you are a civ anyway. If you aren't then there's point me trying to convince you. You seem to have made your mind up at about the same time Matt did *cough cough*.

That's bull. There are just not many options here.
Bea is not willing to share her thoughts on your role, and you're not really doing much to change my mind. There's just so much I'm willing to give up for the game. I'm tired. I want sleep. If I'm wrong, I'm sorry. But seriously, you gave no reason for your wacky behaviour this day and night phase, and I'm sick of trying when you're really not.

I am trying very hard FZ. You're doing that thing again.

[FZ.]

If you are a civ anyway. If you aren't then there's point me trying to convince you. You seem to have made your mind up at about the same time Matt did *cough cough*.

That's bull. There are just not many options here.
Bea is not willing to share her thoughts on your role, and you're not really doing much to change my mind. There's just so much I'm willing to give up for the game. I'm tired. I want sleep. If I'm wrong, I'm sorry. But seriously, you gave no reason for your wacky behaviour this day and night phase, and I'm sick of trying when you're really not.

I am trying very hard FZ. You're doing that thing again.

No! If you want me to consider you not being bad, you have to give me another option for baddie beside me, who I know is a civ. You don't want me to change my vote, keep saying I'm bad.

[FZ.]

And since I know I'm not bad, the whole tie me to Matt thing is a load of crap as well.

[FZ.]

Just forget it. I'm really done caring. I'm going to bed.

[MacDougall]

FZ you say you are trying really hard but you aren't even looking past your nose. Your vote is on me based entirely by unfortunate circumstances that occurred in the last day or two and ignoring the fact that I put in serious effort for the entirety of the game less a middle section when I was extremely busy. I would say that I put in more effort this game than anyone except Ricochet.

I'm sick of having arguments without people about the quality of their "effort". Can you please stop using that as a leg to stand on, it's not fair.

[MacDougall]

And since I know I'm not bad, the whole tie me to Matt thing is a load of crap as well.

For someone who is criticising my efforts, you would expect there to be analysis of potential player combinations, analysis of posts days past pinning me as bad, analysis of who I am scum with because of past actions coming from said person if good ... something more than this push button mislynch that's being peddled.

Instead let's take the obvious option as quick as possible and watch as the "civ friendly independent" and co just follow it without thinking. At least bea has the common sense to dispute it.

[FZ.]

FZ you say you are trying really hard but you aren't even looking past your nose. Your vote is on me based entirely by unfortunate circumstances that occurred in the last day or two and ignoring the fact that I put in serious effort for the entirety of the game less a middle section when I was extremely busy. I would say that I put in more effort this game than anyone except Ricochet.

I'm sick of having arguments without people about the quality of their "effort". Can you please stop using that as a leg to stand on, it's not fair.

There's a big difference between being busy and therefore not contributing much to bringing a game to a tie between 4 people, 2 of whom were definitely good (at least I know so), and one possibly an indy. You were joking about it and making fun of it. Was that the behaviour of a busy civ? Not to mention the fight we had about the logic about a sentence you brought up about how to find baddies. i'm too tired to find it. But if you want to blame something for making me feel you are bad, start there.

And like I said, if you wanted me to consider you not bad, you really needed to think of something else. At least I'm asking questions and trying to get to the bottom of things. Other than Rico and MM, everyone ignored my LC questions. Why did Bea ignore it? Why did you? Don't tell me you're making an effort

[FZ.]

And since I know I'm not bad, the whole tie me to Matt thing is a load of crap as well.

For someone who is criticising my efforts, you would expect there to be analysis of potential player combinations, analysis of posts days past pinning me as bad, analysis of who I am scum with because of past actions coming from said person if good ... something more than this push button mislynch that's being peddled.

Instead let's take the obvious option as quick as possible and watch as the "civ friendly independent" and co just follow it without thinking. At least bea has the common sense to dispute it.

It's not obvious if you survived so far, is it? Remember in past days when I asked what people thought about Matt's tunnelling of MM? Did you answer then? No. The only ones that answered were DH and Drac. Every angle I bring up gets shot down or ignored. Don't blame me for going with the "obvious"

[Marmot]

Metalmarsh isn't really going to give a toss who he wins with. Sorsha appears to have made her mind up. FZ and Matt are probably the bad guys. I'd say this one is lost after this mislynch.

[FZ.]

Metalmarsh isn't really going to give a toss who he wins with. Sorsha appears to have made her mind up. FZ and Matt are probably the bad guys. I'd say this one is lost after this mislynch.

MM, I am counting on you to not pull a shtick here and help the baddies. Do you buy any or Mac's defense? If not, why not?

[FZ.]

Seriously, I'm now going to sleep. If I cost the civvies the game, I'm sorry. I did what I could.

Good night

[Ricochet]

I'm ready for this to be over, if this will be the sad outcome. I'm still hoping it won't be the case, but I'm ready if it will. The civs game was still practically all over for most part and the endgame was a personally frustrating sequence of plowing through some focusing in one direction, others in a second direction, civs doing countless questionable civ moves, a plejade of "I have my reasons", the hunted raining with genuine pleads, the hunters rarely taking their heads out of the tunnel to check the forecast, so basically ISO hell on telling who is moving where and for what purpose.

I maintain that my heart will be torn apart only by the following traitors and deceivers being revealed: FZ. and MM. The rest... and ending probably less than 100 posts short... I'll get over it... Eventually.

[Marmot]

Metalmarsh isn't really going to give a toss who he wins with. Sorsha appears to have made her mind up. FZ and Matt are probably the bad guys. I'd say this one is lost after this mislynch.

MM, I am counting on you to not pull a shtick here and help the baddies. Do you buy any or Mac's defense? If not, why not?

No I don't. He's again reinforcing that "Metalmarsh doesn't care who wins" between civs and mafia, when that's not true.

[Marmot]

I'm ready for this to be over, if this will be the sad outcome. I'm still hoping it won't be the case, but I'm ready if it will. The civs game was still practically all over for most part and the endgame was a personally frustrating sequence of plowing through some focusing in one direction, others in a second direction, civs doing countless questionable civ moves, a plejade of "I have my reasons", the hunted raining with genuine pleads, the hunters rarely taking their heads out of the tunnel to check the forecast, so basically ISO hell on telling who is moving where and for what purpose.

I maintain that my heart will be torn apart only by the following traitors and deceivers being revealed: FZ. and MM. The rest... and ending probably less than 100 posts short... I'll get over it... Eventually.

Are you watching a tragedy or something?

[Ricochet]

I'm ready for this to be over, if this will be the sad outcome. I'm still hoping it won't be the case, but I'm ready if it will. The civs game was still practically all over for most part and the endgame was a personally frustrating sequence of plowing through some focusing in one direction, others in a second direction, civs doing countless questionable civ moves, a plejade of "I have my reasons", the hunted raining with genuine pleads, the hunters rarely taking their heads out of the tunnel to check the forecast, so basically ISO hell on telling who is moving where and for what purpose.

I maintain that my heart will be torn apart only by the following traitors and deceivers being revealed: FZ. and MM. The rest... and ending probably less than 100 posts short... I'll get over it... Eventually.

Are you watching a tragedy or something?

Steve Jobs, so not really.

[MacDougall]

Metalmarsh isn't really going to give a toss who he wins with. Sorsha appears to have made her mind up. FZ and Matt are probably the bad guys. I'd say this one is lost after this mislynch.

MM, I am counting on you to not pull a shtick here and help the baddies. Do you buy any or Mac's defense? If not, why not?

No I don't. He's again reinforcing that "Metalmarsh doesn't care who wins" between civs and mafia, when that's not true.

I don't think you don't care, I just don't think if it really comes down to challenging the status quo you will do much. Why bother?

[MacDougall]

Well I'm at work this morning and I don't think anyone who is around can help me so whatever.

Legacy = Matt + FZ are the scum

If by some chance they fail to kill again, don't hestitate.

If not, well played you guys deserve the win as ricochet insinuated.