Arkham Mafia [ENDGAME]

[Scotty]

And hey Dom,

after combing through your posts looking for a divisive post that better illustrates what I'm talking about, I think I might be mistaken.

I took a step back and realized that what I perceived as prickly was just a stubbornness and miscommunication between us. You were riding me pretty hard Day 1, and heightened my perception of you as a bully. Taking a step back objectively, I can see your frustration from the cacophony that was Day 1 and actually relate to it. When you backed off from me in the subsequent days, I found your distancing from me as a suspect unnerving since you were gunning at me so hard early on. I'm going to back down from my initial read of you, because not only can I not for the life of me find an exact quote that can back me up.

So I apologize. This doesn't absolve you of badness, but you are no longer a high profile suspicion of mine. I read you as maybe civ, probably neutral.

Yo Scotty, who are you going to vote for and why?

Maybe you should vote for sig, my number one suspect.

Good question! I would like 'these are the mafia' for $400, Alex.

[sig]

Never mind for some reason I thought Floyd voted for MP at some point.

[Enrique]

sig, The Penguin role says he makes you do whatever he wants. I took that to be a cursing role.

I have been doing the "sig BOTD everyone always thinks he's bad" thing, but that post just got my eye super big time. It seems almost as opportunistic to me as THs case on you did on Day One.

Linki @ MP, the "just deal with it" bit. That is word for word what you said to me in some game or another lol.

The Penguin role says he makes you do whatever he wants, but I don't interpret that as being a cursing role (unless by cursing you just mean... doing whatever he wants). I'd figure he has better orders to give than "quote Shakespeare" or whatever. There's a better case for MP to have been Penguin'd than Matt, but I still buy the idea that Poison Ivy is the one giving him orders.

I love how I never agree with other people's suspicions of sig (except for zebra rip), but I still really think he's bad and he's my number one suspect

[Scotty]

In all likelihood, TH brings up good points on both Mac and BR, but I feel more inclined to vote BR based on (as TH outlined) her distinct difference in playstyle from her civ and bad game. I can very well see her catch-up posts as a strategy of looking involved while not actually being involved.

I also would love to hear Glorfindel's reaction of today, since I assume he'll come out of his coma at the EoD. I know he's been on and following along.

[MacDougall]

Well Typh voted for me so if he is Pingu I am next. I won't be concerned with him sharing my role with anybody either so no blackmail will concern me.

[Enrique]

TH has only voted for players that died on the same phase

[S~V~S]

sig, The Penguin role says he makes you do whatever he wants. I took that to be a cursing role.

I have been doing the "sig BOTD everyone always thinks he's bad" thing, but that post just got my eye super big time. It seems almost as opportunistic to me as THs case on you did on Day One.

Linki @ MP, the "just deal with it" bit. That is word for word what you said to me in some game or another lol.

The Penguin role says he makes you do whatever he wants, but I don't interpret that as being a cursing role (unless by cursing you just mean... doing whatever he wants). I'd figure he has better orders to give than "quote Shakespeare" or whatever. There's a better case for MP to have been Penguin'd than Matt, but I still buy the idea that Poison Ivy is the one giving him orders.

I love how I never agree with other people's suspicions of sig (except for zebra rip), but I still really think he's bad and he's my number one suspect

Well, cursing would be one use of the role, having recently played an LC creative role with the Trickster, he works with you on these things. But lots of people may just take the consequences. When I was targeted by a similar one on one of Epis speed games, I took the consequences.

And Thanks for the link, TH, I will look it over now.

[Enrique]

TH has only voted for players that died on the same phase

bea as well if that matters.

I don't care for this Penguin craze. I feel like a few days ago I was getting berated for thinking the Penguin should be lynched if we had him, but now we actually have some solid Mafia leads, and everyone's making up excuses for anybody else to be the Penguin? The explanations that MP got poisoned and Matt either gets fucked with a lot or is a complete goofball settle fine with me. There's no evidence for anything like some of you are claiming, so why even do this? We lynched a baddie yesterday and then stopped their kill, I think we're a lot closer to getting Nero's teammate than anything we'll achieve by randomly focusing on the Penguin today.

[Scotty]

TH has only voted for players that died on the same phase

bea as well if that matters.

I don't care for this Penguin craze. I feel like a few days ago I was getting berated for thinking the Penguin should be lynched if we had him, but now we actually have some solid Mafia leads, and everyone's making up excuses for anybody else to be the Penguin? The explanations that MP got poisoned and Matt either gets fucked with a lot or is a complete goofball settle fine with me. There's no evidence for anything like some of you are claiming, so why even do this? We lynched a baddie yesterday and then stopped their kill, I think we're a lot closer to getting Nero's teammate than anything we'll achieve by randomly focusing on the Penguin today.

If we eliminate the variables, then we are getting closer. If we are relatively sure who the neutrals are, then that allows us to deduce mafia more easily. Right?

[S~V~S]

Spoiler: show

I'd like people to consider my Mac case and also go back and reread him to form their own opinions, but in the meantime I got some juicy nuggets to add to my BR case.

As many of you remember, Day 0/1 of the Champs game was a clusterfuck where Rico pooped all over the thread. Somehow it still had fewer posts than Day 1 in this game. But this was BR's reaction to that thread in a game where she was a civvie:

What happened? I left off on page 8 and I just got back to page 20. Most of me does not want to read all of that.

Interesting back and forth between Rico and LoRab.

I haven't read the 11 pages before page 20, and I won't be unless I think I missed something important. Ricos posts don't count.

My opinion is all though Rico has been distracting and posting a lot of crap (all the way up to page 8) I don't find him that suspicious. Would he really want that much attention? I was thinking he had a neutral role, if those exist in this game.

He did have a point about LoRabs original post. Seemed easy and even her Matt points were wishy washy at best. Not the best example of LoRabs mafia play. Is she bad? or just not that into it?

BR skipped a portion of the thread and had no regrets about doing so, saying she would go back if she felt she missed something. She was still able to form reads from what she read and continued to be engaged in current events in the thread.

She even gave bea advice to do the same:

Linki: Bea I am so sad for you. I hope things get better. Honestly I think you should move forward from here and then check back on specific things as needed.

That is in sharp contrast to how she has handled this thread. I speculate that, as a baddie, BR would think that saying something like "I won't be reading the thread" would be viewed as suspicious whereas civvie BR doesn't care how that looks. So instead of saying "fuck it" and either quickly skimming or starting from the present, BR in this game attempts to:

I've decided to look at a few people to best get a feeling of the thread. I feel a little out of the groove. So I started with Scotty, which I was happy to see had under 30 posts. I wish I knew how to read him better. In a direct comparison to the last game I played with him and this game, he feels a lot more conservative and less accusational. He's playing it safe and I don't trust that.

I'm going to check out dharmahelper next.

As has been widely publicized, the DH ISO never takes place. BR's single attempt at an ISO was Scotty, a player with 30 posts who she doesn't read well and concludes she doesn't trust him.

Her next attempt:

So I am officially starting from the beginning and I can't promise that some of the shit I'll bring up is so three days ago.

This was on Page 40. BR started at the beginning of the thread and makes a bunch of posts about the first 8 pages of the game. She gets through 8 pages and calls it a night. BR never got back to this method of becoming involved which is one reason I think her heart wasn't in this exercise and she was just doing it for show. If her intentions were true, I figure she could have started closer towards the End of Day to get a grasp on what people were voting for, or she could have just not commented on every little thing in the first 8 pages, her read would have gone a lot faster.

@Turnip Head interesting point about Black Rock.

The same case could possibly be made for Sabie. Im going to check her ISO right now.

I better find this case.

Well this is an odd post. BR demands that Nero follow through with an ISO of sabie.

It doesn't make me bad just busy and disconnected, it's been hard to have my own opinion when my catch ups are coloured by everyone else opinion and it makes me sad that when I actually was trying to put myself back in the game I get told I am hollow and false.

It should be pointed out that being busy and disconnected doesn't make BR a civ either. I don't know how I feel about BR saying it's hard for her to have an opinion from her catch ups, but I know it wasn't difficult for her to have opinions in GoC where she was similarly behind.

DH asks BR about the ISO on him again:

The point I was making with my post count is that my posts for the most part aren't that superfluous or difficult to follow. and I'm not posting like six or seven times in a row or using big fuck-off paragraphs or posting one sentence per line or anything that would make a sincere re-read of me implausible.

I think I misunderstood. I will read you since you really want me to but I was only planning that at the time because I was trying to catch up through key players but I haven't bothered because I have changed tactics several times on how I am trying to attack the thread. I don't find you suspicious at this moment so I saw no point. Maybe your posts are insightful so I'll give it a shot.

This ISO still hasn't happened. If BR did not want to do an ISO of DH, why didn't she just say so? Saying she doesn't find DH suspicious but also saying "maybe your posts are insightful" gives the impression she hasn't read DH's posts so why does she think he isn't suspicious? It just feels like empty words with no real meaning behind them.

Wow. These *are* really good points. Having also hosted that game, I totally see where you are coming from here.

I think I may have read this part a bit differently than you did:

Turnip Head said:

@Turnip Head interesting point about Black Rock.

The same case could possibly be made for Sabie. Im going to check her ISO right now.

I better find this case.

Well this is an odd post. BR demands that Nero follow through with an ISO of sabie.

I read that as Nero trying to deflect your thoughts re BR. Although her response os either way.

I think I will do a quick read onher.

[Enrique]

By that measure lynching anyone gets us closer, lol.

Scotty I don't think the Penguin hunt is gonna lead anywhere. The game just started and there's a billion different reasons why MP and Matt could be acting like they are. We got a mafioso yesterday who left us with tooons of stuff to work with. I don't even agree with the case on Mac but I appreciate that Turnip Head still hasn't forgotten that. The Penguin will only get more obvious as the game goes on, if you're really that interested in lynching him. I feel strange being on this side of the argument since I've always been so anti-inmates, and you know, maybe I'd support the Penguin hunt if I felt there was any basis to it. I just don't think that's the case today.

[juliets]

In my re-read of BR I didn't find anything else to bring to the table but it did cement my thoughts that TH's case was a good one. I'll be interested to see what you find S~V~S. I've been rolling around with this lack of response hang up I have and I guess it can be said that she's had plenty of time to respond she just hasn't. I think I'm going to have to give Mac the BOTD today because TH's points meshed with my thought that Mac had done a good job at responding to the case against him. So, it's looking like a BR vote for me today. I'll wait a bit just in case something happens.

linki

[Golden]

Have to vote now. In feeling like my genuine suspects all have made good defences, and I haven't had time to consider them properly, I'm going to vote for someone who probably won't be lynched, but I'm not going to complain if they are. That's Floyd, because he isn't contributing.

This vote could easily have gone to Bass or Equivocate too.

[Scotty]

By that measure lynching anyone gets us closer, lol.

Scotty I don't think the Penguin hunt is gonna lead anywhere. The game just started and there's a billion different reasons why MP and Matt could be acting like they are. We got a mafioso yesterday who left us with tooons of stuff to work with. I don't even agree with the case on Mac but I appreciate that Turnip Head still hasn't forgotten that. The Penguin will only get more obvious as the game goes on, if you're really that interested in lynching him. I feel strange being on this side of the argument since I've always been so anti-inmates, and you know, maybe I'd support the Penguin hunt if I felt there was any basis to it. I just don't think that's the case today.

I didn't say I was out to lynch him right now. Actually, as I stated pages ago, I have no intention of lynching him right now. But eliminating him from our deduction is helpful in narrowing the search for the Pepperoni and Falcon gang.

[Turnip Head]

Have to vote now. In feeling like my genuine suspects all have made good defences, and I haven't had time to consider them properly, I'm going to vote for someone who probably won't be lynched, but I'm not going to complain if they are. That's Floyd, because he isn't contributing.

This vote could easily have gone to Bass or Equivocate too.

Were you recruited last night?

[Scotty]

Voted Black Rock for now. Otherwise it would have been Floyd or Bass, but I'll give them one more day cycle to olly olly oxen free.

[Golden]

Have to vote now. In feeling like my genuine suspects all have made good defences, and I haven't had time to consider them properly, I'm going to vote for someone who probably won't be lynched, but I'm not going to complain if they are. That's Floyd, because he isn't contributing.

This vote could easily have gone to Bass or Equivocate too.

Were you recruited last night?

Yes, but not in a mafia game. Recruited in real life.

My vote is exactly what I've said it is today. I have not kept up with the thread on this day phase at all, and I can't justify voting for a participant, even one I suspect, when I can't do my due diligence.

[Enrique]

TH, there was a post earlier that made me think about last night's recruitment.

Not here for long, but I've cleared this with the Hosts and just wanted to say:

I was poisoned Night 1, which is part of the reason I stopped caring about living.

Also, sig is my number one suspect!

He later goes on to clarify he's still poisoned, so, where did the newfound will to live come from?

[Black Rock]

I'd like people to consider my Mac case and also go back and reread him to form their own opinions, but in the meantime I got some juicy nuggets to add to my BR case.

As many of you remember, Day 0/1 of the Champs game was a clusterfuck where Rico pooped all over the thread. Somehow it still had fewer posts than Day 1 in this game. But this was BR's reaction to that thread in a game where she was a civvie:

What happened? I left off on page 8 and I just got back to page 20. Most of me does not want to read all of that.

Interesting back and forth between Rico and LoRab.

I haven't read the 11 pages before page 20, and I won't be unless I think I missed something important. Ricos posts don't count.

My opinion is all though Rico has been distracting and posting a lot of crap (all the way up to page 8) I don't find him that suspicious. Would he really want that much attention? I was thinking he had a neutral role, if those exist in this game.

He did have a point about LoRabs original post. Seemed easy and even her Matt points were wishy washy at best. Not the best example of LoRabs mafia play. Is she bad? or just not that into it?

BR skipped a portion of the thread and had no regrets about doing so, saying she would go back if she felt she missed something. She was still able to form reads from what she read and continued to be engaged in current events in the thread.

She even gave bea advice to do the same:

Linki: Bea I am so sad for you. I hope things get better. Honestly I think you should move forward from here and then check back on specific things as needed.

That is in sharp contrast to how she has handled this thread. I speculate that, as a baddie, BR would think that saying something like "I won't be reading the thread" would be viewed as suspicious whereas civvie BR doesn't care how that looks. So instead of saying "fuck it" and either quickly skimming or starting from the present, BR in this game attempts to:

I've decided to look at a few people to best get a feeling of the thread. I feel a little out of the groove. So I started with Scotty, which I was happy to see had under 30 posts. I wish I knew how to read him better. In a direct comparison to the last game I played with him and this game, he feels a lot more conservative and less accusational. He's playing it safe and I don't trust that.

I'm going to check out dharmahelper next.

As has been widely publicized, the DH ISO never takes place. BR's single attempt at an ISO was Scotty, a player with 30 posts who she doesn't read well and concludes she doesn't trust him.

Her next attempt:

So I am officially starting from the beginning and I can't promise that some of the shit I'll bring up is so three days ago.

This was on Page 40. BR started at the beginning of the thread and makes a bunch of posts about the first 8 pages of the game. She gets through 8 pages and calls it a night. BR never got back to this method of becoming involved which is one reason I think her heart wasn't in this exercise and she was just doing it for show. If her intentions were true, I figure she could have started closer towards the End of Day to get a grasp on what people were voting for, or she could have just not commented on every little thing in the first 8 pages, her read would have gone a lot faster.

@Turnip Head interesting point about Black Rock.

The same case could possibly be made for Sabie. Im going to check her ISO right now.

I better find this case.

Well this is an odd post. BR demands that Nero follow through with an ISO of sabie.

It doesn't make me bad just busy and disconnected, it's been hard to have my own opinion when my catch ups are coloured by everyone else opinion and it makes me sad that when I actually was trying to put myself back in the game I get told I am hollow and false.

It should be pointed out that being busy and disconnected doesn't make BR a civ either. I don't know how I feel about BR saying it's hard for her to have an opinion from her catch ups, but I know it wasn't difficult for her to have opinions in GoC where she was similarly behind.

DH asks BR about the ISO on him again:

The point I was making with my post count is that my posts for the most part aren't that superfluous or difficult to follow. and I'm not posting like six or seven times in a row or using big fuck-off paragraphs or posting one sentence per line or anything that would make a sincere re-read of me implausible.

I think I misunderstood. I will read you since you really want me to but I was only planning that at the time because I was trying to catch up through key players but I haven't bothered because I have changed tactics several times on how I am trying to attack the thread. I don't find you suspicious at this moment so I saw no point. Maybe your posts are insightful so I'll give it a shot.

This ISO still hasn't happened. If BR did not want to do an ISO of DH, why didn't she just say so? Saying she doesn't find DH suspicious but also saying "maybe your posts are insightful" gives the impression she hasn't read DH's posts so why does she think he isn't suspicious? It just feels like empty words with no real meaning behind them.

That's in response to a case about me and nothing to do with the sabie part. It seemed clear to me and a misrepresentation from you.

The difference between GoC and this game is timing. I had plenty of time at the begging of that game to catch up and read. Also the content of the beginning of that game was much different. This game has made my eyes bleed at several different occasions. When a game makes my head hurt I walk away.

I promised to read DH's posts but I never planned on doing an ISO the second time around. I don't think DH is bad and won't be spending the little time I have ripping apart his posts. I read DH, made an opinion and don't plan on voting for him so I left alone.

I will likely vote for Dom, he is my number one suspect and reads baddie Dom. He's much more touchy and argumentative this game and it reminds me of other games where he was bad and had the same tone.

I'm going to post this and then read the post again and see if I missed something. I have to finish cooking dinner and eat before that.

[Turnip Head]

TH, there was a post earlier that made me think about last night's recruitment.

Not here for long, but I've cleared this with the Hosts and just wanted to say:

I was poisoned Night 1, which is part of the reason I stopped caring about living.

Also, sig is my number one suspect!

He later goes on to clarify he's still poisoned, so, where did the newfound will to live come from?

I think you might be confusing "will to live" with "I just don't give a shit anymore" but that's just my read of that situation :P

[Turnip Head]

BR I was not intending to misrepresent you. You responded to two posts that were in direct response to MY case, so if you were reading/responding chronologically my case would have been the first thing you saw. You must have gone backwards to find my case. I think that's weird if true, but given the timing of the posts I assumed you were talking about Nero making a case on sabie.

I disagree with your read of Dom, I don't find him to be touchy or argumentative. He is going where his suspicions take him and not forcing any narratives. You've been clinging to that suspicion for a while now. It's really the only thing I know about where you stand.

[Bullzeye]

Still considering a Mac vote not so much for the TH case as the weird contradiction between his criticism of the Joker targeting theory and his argument that Matt must be the Riddler because he's been the victim of two posting curses in a row. Open to other suggestions though.

[juliets]

BR, one of the things i don't understand is why, if you had plenty of time to read then but not now, did you skip big chunks when you had plenty of time but didn't want to employ that same procedure when you had no time. (holy crow was that sentence long enough? I hope you understand what I'm saying)

[MacDougall]

Let's count the numbers of people who are "considering" a Mac vote.

1. Typhoony - Casts a no u after I say I'd vote for him
2. TH - My oldest and dearest scum read
3. Dom - Perennially scum reads me
4. Bullzeye - Another scum read that I voted for yesterday

A real hotpot of people who should be trusted to read me unbiased.

[Turnip Head]

Let's count the numbers of people who are "considering" a Mac vote.

1. Typhoony - Casts a no u after I say I'd vote for him
2. TH - My oldest and dearest scum read
3. Dom - Perennially scum reads me
4. Bullzeye - Another scum read that I voted for yesterday

A real hotpot of people who should be trusted to read me unbiased.

I don't know if you really believe my case on you is a reaction to you suspecting me or if you're just saying that to make yourself look better, but it's weird either way.

[Bullzeye]

4. Bullzeye - Another scum read that I voted for yesterday

A real hotpot of people who should be trusted to read me unbiased.

You could respond to my point or you could just try to discredit me as a NO U. Either works.

[sig]

I was suspicious of Mac early in this phase and did think TH made some good points, however I also liked Mac responses and his posts in general. So I won't be voting for him.

I will look over TH's case on BR in a bit, I did have a minor ping of her early on, but can't recall what it was from.

I'm also still considering a Typh vote, but I don't think I will end the phase with that vote. Besides if he is Penguin and tries to blackmail Mac, he can always find a way to tell us tomorrow and we can lynch Typh then.

Enrique's switch from hunting Inmates to not hunting is funny, are you sure you aren't an inmate Enrique? :P

Golden's vote is a slight ping, but not really I'm still reading him as a civ.

@SVS did you answer my question? If not could you please do that.
@DFaraday What are your current thoughts?

[MacDougall]

It's normal for someone to feel like someone making a scum read on them is scum. I do it all the time. My point is that when someone makes a case on someone who has a prior-declared scum read on them you always have to take it with a grain of salt. You less so than Bullzeye because you at least made a case, whereas Bullzeye is just OMGUSing his blessed little heart out. Nonetheless even if you are civ you're going to be feeling better about anything you think you see me do than if I hadn't made that scum read on you, it's the nature of the game.

Case in point you are doing it in that very post. Everything I do is scummy to you now.

Still considering a Mac vote not so much for the TH case as the weird contradiction between his criticism of the Joker targeting theory and his argument that Matt must be the Riddler because he's been the victim of two posting curses in a row. Open to other suggestions though.

So why is it scummy that I made that point but not Scotty?

[MacDougall]

4. Bullzeye - Another scum read that I voted for yesterday

A real hotpot of people who should be trusted to read me unbiased.

You could respond to my point or you could just try to discredit me as a NO U. Either works.

You as well.

You are both reading everything I do as scummy now because I have prior declared scum reads on you. This isn't alignment indicative, but it is something that should be taken into consideration when weighing up whether your opinion is worth listening to on the subject of whether or not I am bad.

[MacDougall]

Still considering a Mac vote not so much for the TH case as the weird contradiction between his criticism of the Joker targeting theory and his argument that Matt must be the Riddler because he's been the victim of two posting curses in a row. Open to other suggestions though.

See this post itself is actually a fairly horrific post.

You open up by saying still considering, indicating that in spite of the reasons you previously had not being valid to you anymore. Why? What have I done to make the TH case invalid to you, if you feel like I am scum for different reasons surely his case still has validation?

How is my "weird contradiction" alignment indicative.

How does me accusing Matt of being The Riddler, at the same time as declaring no interest in voting for him, benefit me as Mafia? What's the point.

How does what you suggested mean I am worthy of a vote?

And you're "open to other suggestions"... Cool, defer all the legwork to others. I have a suggestion, self vote.

[Bullzeye]

whereas Bullzeye is just OMGUSing his blessed little heart out.

Keep patronising me. That'll make me feel good about you.

Still considering a Mac vote not so much for the TH case as the weird contradiction between his criticism of the Joker targeting theory and his argument that Matt must be the Riddler because he's been the victim of two posting curses in a row. Open to other suggestions though.

So why is it scummy that I made that point but not Scotty?

Scotty wasn't screaming to the heavens about how ridiculous an idea it was that targeting the Joker gets you a posting curse just a day before coming out with a theory that the Riddler has to post in 'riddles' (to use a very loose definition of the word).

[Turnip Head]

Case in point you are doing it in that very post. Everything I do is scummy to you now.

To be fair you've been doing that with me all game.

But no, not everything you do is scummy to me, I opened the discussion, I digested your responses, I said I would give you some breathing room and laid off the rest of the Day. About an hour ago I said I wasn't heavily considering a vote for you because your responses made me feel less sure about my case. So I'd appreciate if you don't push the narrative that I'm not keeping an open mind about you.

[MacDougall]

Bullz and Dom, who are you looking at for a vote today?

A bunch of people really. I've already said I like some of the case against Mac/quote]

So you like some of the case? Which parts don't you like?

Which parts of TH's case actually appeals to you?

[Bullzeye]

Still considering a Mac vote not so much for the TH case as the weird contradiction between his criticism of the Joker targeting theory and his argument that Matt must be the Riddler because he's been the victim of two posting curses in a row. Open to other suggestions though.

See this post itself is actually a fairly horrific post.

You open up by saying still considering, indicating that in spite of the reasons you previously had not being valid to you anymore. Why? What have I done to make the TH case invalid to you, if you feel like I am scum for different reasons surely his case still has validation?

Never said it wasn't valid any more.

How is my "weird contradiction" alignment indicative.

How does me accusing Matt of being The Riddler, at the same time as declaring no interest in voting for him, benefit me as Mafia? What's the point.

You were making a huge deal over the Joker discussion but it's fine for you to come out with an even more absurd theory?

And you're "open to other suggestions"... Cool, defer all the legwork to others. I have a suggestion, self vote.

Yeah that's what I'm doing. I'm deferring the legwork to others because I either can't be arsed or just can't play mafia.

[MacDougall]

Case in point you are doing it in that very post. Everything I do is scummy to you now.

To be fair you've been doing that with me all game.

But no, not everything you do is scummy to me, I opened the discussion, I digested your responses, I said I would give you some breathing room and laid off the rest of the Day. About an hour ago I said I wasn't heavily considering a vote for you because your responses made me feel less sure about my case. So I'd appreciate if you don't push the narrative that I'm not keeping an open mind about you.

Don't put words in my mouth. I said that your opinion on me is devalued by the fact that I have a prior scum read on you. Not once did I say you weren't keeping an open mind about my alignment.

And it is true, and I don't care if Dom pops up and posts this smiley while italicising that point, it is true. People who make reads on those who've made reads on them need to be looked at with a more discerning lens than a regular case.

[MacDougall]

Still considering a Mac vote not so much for the TH case as the weird contradiction between his criticism of the Joker targeting theory and his argument that Matt must be the Riddler because he's been the victim of two posting curses in a row. Open to other suggestions though.

See this post itself is actually a fairly horrific post.

You open up by saying still considering, indicating that in spite of the reasons you previously had not being valid to you anymore. Why? What have I done to make the TH case invalid to you, if you feel like I am scum for different reasons surely his case still has validation?

Never said it wasn't valid any more.

How is my "weird contradiction" alignment indicative.

How does me accusing Matt of being The Riddler, at the same time as declaring no interest in voting for him, benefit me as Mafia? What's the point.

You were making a huge deal over the Joker discussion but it's fine for you to come out with an even more absurd theory?

And you're "open to other suggestions"... Cool, defer all the legwork to others. I have a suggestion, self vote.

Yeah that's what I'm doing. I'm deferring the legwork to others because I either can't be arsed or just can't play mafia.

Sarcasm under pressure is a major scum tell.

[Turnip Head]

Black Rock you made 5 posts during Night 2.

One is a reply to Dom's question towards you earlier
One is a reaction to the lynch which is cool
Two of them are about whether the host would bus or help his teammates
And the last one is a joke about the thread being gigantic

Those posts range from 11am to 8:30pm; the fourth was at 7:24pm and the last one was at 8:30 and was a response to the post directly above it. Given these facts I don't think it's unreasonable to assume you had caught up on the night's posts at that time.

What pings me is that was the Night where Enrique made a big stink about me claiming Alfred and being a liar, you couldn't have missed it.

Not everyone knows this, but I know you pay close attention to me in games just like I pay close attention to you. For me it's weird that you didn't give any sort of opinion on me one way or another at this time. It felt like you were content to let it play out without getting involved. That is not what I'm used to from civvie BR.

[Bullzeye]

Bullz and Dom, who are you looking at for a vote today?

A bunch of people really. I've already said I like some of the case against Mac/quote]

So you like some of the case? Which parts don't you like?

Which parts of TH's case actually appeals to you?

I said, earlier in the day, that I found the 'bonus point' damning because it looks so fake. Oh haha I always do X when I'm a civ and never when I'm bad (X being something that wasn't even happening). You may as well have said LOOOK!! LOOK HOW GODDAMNED CIVVIE I AM RIGHT NOW GUYS!

[MacDougall]

Bullz and Dom, who are you looking at for a vote today?

A bunch of people really. I've already said I like some of the case against Mac/quote]

So you like some of the case? Which parts don't you like?

Which parts of TH's case actually appeals to you?

I said, earlier in the day, that I found the 'bonus point' damning because it looks so fake. Oh haha I always do X when I'm a civ and never when I'm bad (X being something that wasn't even happening). You may as well have said LOOOK!! LOOK HOW GODDAMNED CIVVIE I AM RIGHT NOW GUYS!

As a civvie I can tell you that trying to make others think I am a civvie is a very important thing for a civvie to do.

[Turnip Head]

Case in point you are doing it in that very post. Everything I do is scummy to you now.

To be fair you've been doing that with me all game.

But no, not everything you do is scummy to me, I opened the discussion, I digested your responses, I said I would give you some breathing room and laid off the rest of the Day. About an hour ago I said I wasn't heavily considering a vote for you because your responses made me feel less sure about my case. So I'd appreciate if you don't push the narrative that I'm not keeping an open mind about you.

Don't put words in my mouth. I said that your opinion on me is devalued by the fact that I have a prior scum read on you. Not once did I say you weren't keeping an open mind about my alignment.

And it is true, and I don't care if Dom pops up and posts this smiley while italicising that point, it is true. People who make reads on those who've made reads on them need to be looked at with a more discerning lens than a regular case.

You said "Everything I do is scummy to you now," if that's not saying I'm not keeping an open mind about you then I don't know what it is.

[MacDougall]

Mac's response to well constructed Turnip Head case = rationally explain the actual reason for the posts that Turnip Head is applying seemingly well intention but incorrect intention to, systematically.

Bullzeye's response = and sarcasm.

[MacDougall]

Case in point you are doing it in that very post. Everything I do is scummy to you now.

To be fair you've been doing that with me all game.

But no, not everything you do is scummy to me, I opened the discussion, I digested your responses, I said I would give you some breathing room and laid off the rest of the Day. About an hour ago I said I wasn't heavily considering a vote for you because your responses made me feel less sure about my case. So I'd appreciate if you don't push the narrative that I'm not keeping an open mind about you.

Don't put words in my mouth. I said that your opinion on me is devalued by the fact that I have a prior scum read on you. Not once did I say you weren't keeping an open mind about my alignment.

And it is true, and I don't care if Dom pops up and posts this smiley while italicising that point, it is true. People who make reads on those who've made reads on them need to be looked at with a more discerning lens than a regular case.

You said "Everything I do is scummy to you now," if that's not saying I'm not keeping an open mind about you then I don't know what it is.

Apologies, I sometimes say things that can be easily taken out of context when things get heated.

In my opinion you are in a position where you are going to see almost everything I post as scummy despite your intention to be unbiased.

[Bullzeye]

Mac's response to well constructed Turnip Head case = rationally explain the actual reason for the posts that Turnip Head is applying seemingly well intention but incorrect intention to, systematically.

Bullzeye's response = and sarcasm.

Mac's responses to/about Bullzeye:

'this is a horrific post'

'deferring legwork to others... self-vote'

'just OMGUSing his blessed little heart out' as if I'm four years old.

describing basically anything I've said or done as latching onto other people's opinions and saying I lack original thought.

And you think I'm being sarcastic to you because I'm feeling 'pressured'.

[Turnip Head]

Black Rock you made 5 posts during Night 2.

One is a reply to Dom's question towards you earlier
One is a reaction to the lynch which is cool
Two of them are about whether the host would bus or help his teammates
And the last one is a joke about the thread being gigantic

Those posts range from 11am to 8:30pm; the fourth was at 7:24pm and the last one was at 8:30 and was a response to the post directly above it. Given these facts I don't think it's unreasonable to assume you had caught up on the night's posts at that time.

What pings me is that was the Night where Enrique made a big stink about me claiming Alfred and being a liar, you couldn't have missed it.

Not everyone knows this, but I know you pay close attention to me in games just like I pay close attention to you. For me it's weird that you didn't give any sort of opinion on me one way or another at this time. It felt like you were content to let it play out without getting involved. That is not what I'm used to from civvie BR.

Don't want my point on BR to get lost in this madness.

[MacDougall]

Mac's response to well constructed Turnip Head case = rationally explain the actual reason for the posts that Turnip Head is applying seemingly well intention but incorrect intention to, systematically.

Bullzeye's response = and sarcasm.

Mac's responses to/about Bullzeye:

'this is a horrific post'

It is.

'deferring legwork to others... self-vote'

You are.

'just OMGUSing his blessed little heart out' as if I'm four years old.

You are.

describing basically anything I've said or done as latching onto other people's opinions and saying I lack original thought.

You are.

And you think I'm being sarcastic to you because I'm feeling 'pressured'.

You are.

[Bullzeye]

I'm just gonna stop speaking to you because you either don't realise or don't care how ridiculously patronising you are.

[MacDougall]

Black Rock you made 5 posts during Night 2.

One is a reply to Dom's question towards you earlier
One is a reaction to the lynch which is cool
Two of them are about whether the host would bus or help his teammates
And the last one is a joke about the thread being gigantic

Those posts range from 11am to 8:30pm; the fourth was at 7:24pm and the last one was at 8:30 and was a response to the post directly above it. Given these facts I don't think it's unreasonable to assume you had caught up on the night's posts at that time.

What pings me is that was the Night where Enrique made a big stink about me claiming Alfred and being a liar, you couldn't have missed it.

Not everyone knows this, but I know you pay close attention to me in games just like I pay close attention to you. For me it's weird that you didn't give any sort of opinion on me one way or another at this time. It felt like you were content to let it play out without getting involved. That is not what I'm used to from civvie BR.

Don't want my point on BR to get lost in this madness.

Is it fair to use that point when Black Rock has already made mention of the fact that she is lost in the sea of posts?

It doesn't rescind her from being Mafia though.

[DharmaHelper]

Leaving for the night, gotta vote now. Still liking my points against MP so there you go

[MacDougall]

I'm just gonna stop speaking to you because you either don't realise or don't care how ridiculously patronising you are.

Lol please.

[sprityo]

I'll just say, you both look ridiculous