[END] Turf Wars: Battle of the Hosts

[sig]

sig, what are your thoughts on Serge? Since you are commenting on the ika voters. The only time he mentioned ika is when he voted for him.

I like thellama73's in-depth post about why he thinks Luffy is a cop. I don't necessarily agree with it but that amount of perception doesn't reek of scum to me. If he held on to just the "this game is hard to win for cops" thing, I may have voted for him.

I think ika is acting like a very naughty deer caught between the headlights. I honestly don't remember the case against gleam anymore, and the one against Epignosis half-built on his meta, which I don't take stock on.

Um, someone tell me how to vote.

ika

Does that work?

I forgot about Serge, his vote does look bad in hindsight, however when he made it I didn't find it that odd. I'd be willing to vote for him tomorrow maybe.

@Golden I'm not coordinating anything with enrique or anyone I'm a civ. I viewed people as suspicious for their behavior so of course I didn't join their wagon. You can ISO me I never liked the Gleam votes and then suddenly gleam was dropped for someone else. This was odd.

linki: I also never thought he would make such a vote as a civ I'd think you who know my history would keep in mind I've been a victim of many fake slips before, so I was giving him the benefit of the doubt espacilly when the votes came so quickly. The same situation has happened to me so many times that I always view such things as suspicious and less likely to be true.

[Golden]

Golden I just don't have the patience to deal with you (misleadingly) condescending to me and calling me a mafia/cop in this case that makes the most moronic chances at every chance. Just lynch me now and it will be a valuable contribution to our meta.

As a townie that end of day was utterly epic and amazing. And we caught a baddie!

And your reaction is to say you hate changeable votes and that the lynch was crap.

How am I supposed to do anything with that BUT lynch you?

[Enrique]

That's more a reaction to the aftermath. We lynched a cop yippie-yay. You had your mind made up before this convo, don't pin it on that.

[Sloonei]

lol enrique and sig just look like they are co-ordinating a plan to take sloonei out, to me. Thats what it looks like.

Sloonei would for me be at 'confirmed civ' on the rainbow. He was first in and a critical piece of the Fuzz lynch. I will be astonished if he ends up being a cop. Astonished! It would probably be the most astonishing flip I would ever have seen! But I'm sure he isn't.

Golden you have bad, bad views lmao.

Lynch me tomorrow I don't have the time to play anyway. But Sloonei is bad, I called it already.

btw I was the first Fuzz voter

linki- as a game mechanic Golden, this isn't new

And this is another huge reason you're so suspicious. You were the first Fuzz voter, away from all the other bandwagons before the CFD was even on anyone's mind. As soon as it started you bailed. Why? What was your vote doing there if you didn't actually want to lynch him?

I was creating an unnecessary connection to my teammate on Day 2 because I fell like it.

distancing, perhaps. your level of opposition to this lynch, even after the fact, is striking considering you were so disengaged before the EoD, AND considering you were voting for the person we ended up lynching within an hour of the deadline. And you seem oddly disgruntled about us lynching a cop.

[Enrique]

Okay so lynch me, I'm not resisting. I guess I'm just some sort of imbecile who doesn't know how to scum.

[Sloonei]

Okay so lynch me, I'm not resisting. I guess I'm just some sort of imbecile who doesn't know how to scum.

The day hasn't even started yet, there's no need to be so resigned.

[Enrique]

If I cared enough about this game I wouldn't be, but I actually want it now. I get an out, y'all get insight, Golden gets out of my ass.

[sig]

Golden gets out of my ass.

Wow this is getting kinda extreme first you want me to be your slave know Golden is in your ass? :P

[Golden]

If I cared enough about this game I wouldn't be, but I actually want it now. I get an out, y'all get insight, Golden gets out of my ass.

So, undercover cop then?

[Enrique]

jesus christ...

[Turnip Head]

Enrique, why do we fall?

[Scotty]

Gotta be honest. Sig and Enrique's scrambling after that lunch is more enjoyable than the eggs I had this morning. and those eggs were damn tasty.

[Enrique]

I can't wait for either endgame tbh.

[sig]

Enrique, why do we fall?

ROLE CLAIM, but wait this means Th is really the undercover cop he will flip himself as Alfred and is role hinting to throw us off.


I think we should lynch TH, Enrique, Golden, Sig, Sloonie, and Sarge in that order.

lol your theories are crazier then Matt's I'm not scrambling maybe instead of focusing on me look at the flipfloppers or the more silent Ika voters or the people who didn't vote for either.

[Turnip Head]

Gotta be honest. Sig and Enrique's scrambling after that lunch is more enjoyable than the eggs I had this morning. and those eggs were damn tasty.

I feel like there was a missed opportunity for a scrambled eggs joke here

[Golden]

Enrique...

You had your vote on a baddie no-one was after
When everyone went after them, you suddenly tried to defend him
...all the while rejecting the explanation given in the thread
And then you are upset about the lynch afterwards

And what am I supposed to do with that? Ignore it?

[Enrique]

No, you should lynch me.

[Long Con]

I don't think it looks like a dumb-scum move, Enrique. I would say it looks like a distancing vote when there was no risk, but then you didn't want it to end up hurting him and moved it off when other votes started floating in... before it came to a point where Fuzz was a real contender. Of course, I'm just going off what I read in the last page about how you voted, I don't know the real timing because I was still quite a few pages behind when the lynch was up.

My vote was really crappy, and I'm glad that a non-Cop got the Loan Shark and made things right. I do appreciate that some are giving me the benefit of the doubt about it. I have no real defense, I cast the vote that put ika ahead of Fuzz, and I don't doubt that I will get some suspicion about it.

Gotta be honest. Sig and Enrique's scrambling after that lunch is more enjoyable than the eggs I had this morning. and those eggs were damn tasty.

I feel like there was a missed opportunity for a scrambled eggs joke here

I don't think it was missed. I think you just think it was missed.

Socky said there would be a price to pay, I don't know what that price might be but it's worth looking to see if anyone in the coming day is acting or talking noticeably stranger. This might be another indication of alignment.

Will we recognize it if it's DrWilgy?

[Golden]

I don't think it looks like a dumb-scum move, Enrique. I would say it looks like a distancing vote when there was no risk, but then you didn't want it to end up hurting him and moved it off when other votes started floating in... before it came to a point where Fuzz was a real contender. Of course, I'm just going off what I read in the last page about how you voted, I don't know the real timing because I was still quite a few pages behind when the lynch was up.

I agree. If Enrique is bad, he did nothing wrong at all.

[Sloonei]

No, you should lynch me.

Do you think the case against you is a good one?

[Enrique]

If people believe it I guess. I think I've laid out my thought process so if that doesn't convince you then w/e.

[Turnip Head]

Gotta be honest. Sig and Enrique's scrambling after that lunch is more enjoyable than the eggs I had this morning. and those eggs were damn tasty.

I feel like there was a missed opportunity for a scrambled eggs joke here

I don't think it was missed. I think you just think it was missed.

Hmmm. Maybe it just needed some more tinkering.

I voted Scotty as Funniest Player of 2015. He didn't win, but it's never too early to start training for next year!

[thellama73]

Wow, great job on Fuzz, guys. I guess the clue was in the name...

[Sloonei]

The real MVP is whoever used those secret votes.

[indiglo]

Spoiler: show

Day 2

The two families were in a chaotic frenzy. No one seemed to stand out as a top suspect for a cop hiding in their midst. Finally it seems all arguments had been laid out, all disputes had been made, all cases had been put forth and still no solid agreement. Reluctantly the family members went their way to carry out their individual business, but each passed along their final decision on who to eliminate to their respective crime boss.

As the day drew to a close, Daisy and MP met up on a street corner to discuss who held the most votes now. "So it's decided?" Daisy asked him, just to ensure they were on the same page before they took any action.

He nodded, "RadicalFuzz has got to go."

"How do you want to do this?"

"The mob didn't finish him off last time, maybe we should do it ourselves this time around..."

She nodded her agreement and the pair set off on foot towards RadicalFuzz's home. Once there, Daisy jimmied the lock and they slipped inside. It was dark inside and they moved silently throughout the house, searching unsuccessfully for RadicalFuzz. MP shook his head, "Someone must've tipped him off."

"You think he turned himself in?"

"Most likely."

At the precinct, RadicalFuzz walked in nervously and looked around. He never expected to be here turning himself into the cops, but it is the only way he could avoid being taken out by the two families.



RadicalFuzz has been arrested. He was Surveillance Specialist, a member of The Police.

It is now Night 2.

You have 23 hours to send in your night actions.

I was so sorry to have to jet out of the thread without saying anything earlier! Life caught up to me. And let me just say I squealed soooo loudly when I read this result. I was nervous, and what iffing myself all evening. ~whew~ What a relief!!! I was trying to make a positive out of what happened if it were indeed a mislynch, that we could likely learn something anyway, yadda yadda yadda.

I am trying to catch up now, but I had to say yay for this result.


Also, RIP Fuzz.

[Marmot]

Good job everyone! I missed all the action, but you guys done good. Props!

[indiglo]

Just remember, it is very possible to be town and wrong so I'm not going to automatically assume sig and Quin are Fuzz's scum mates.

Those on the Fuzz lynch look good but bussing is a thing that happens and it doesn't necessarily mean everyone on that wagon was town.

I've seen two scum wagons pop up like that together before in a game so I'm not going to assume the counterwagon to Fuzz was on town.

Anytime I've made assumptions like this before-those voting scum are town, those opposed to a scum lynch are their partners, or a counterwagon to scum must be town-I've been wrong in all situations at times. I've also been right before in those situations but I'd rather look at behavior overall to determine alignment rather than just wagon placement or behavior around a scum lynch or counterwagons-etc.

Meh'll go with my gut, though.

LC's vote doesn't strike me as ingenuine. DDL's for Fuzz, does. Enrique's original vote for Fuzz, that he suddenly backed off, feels like a distance vote gone wrong. Sig's entire behaviour around the lynch feels bad in every way, sloonei pointed some of it out.

I agree with you in principle. My opinion on who is bad and who is good lies not in who ended up voting where, but how they expressed themselves in the thread.

I like this post, I find myself agreeing with most of it.

Still catching up...

+1 there. Very much agreeing with most of this as well.

[Sloonei]

An observation about Quinny Quin Quin:
At first he was vaguely on board with the idea of a CFD, casting suspicion on DDL for shooting down the idea:

I don't like the idea of starting another wagon, when we already have 3, with less than an hour for the phase to end.

This is the PERFECT opportunity for scum to save each other if they need to.

If you don't like the current wagons then tough luck. Try to push another one earlier next day.

pingpong. I don't like this at all. We shouldn't be forced to lynch our civ-reads because there isn't an existing bandwagon for them.

But then a few minutes later the Fire Drill is under way with votes starting to pile in on Fuzzy and suddenly this is a bad idea and there's no reason to suspect RadicalFuzz:

I am not seeing a lot of reasoning behind the fuzz vote. I don't like it at all. I can't recall a single thing in the thread even being said that would paint fuzz as scum.

linki: even more 'okay fizz it is' without anything tangible to work with.

He continues voicing opposition even after the flip:

And that is why last minute lynch trains are NOT bad. They make the baddies scramble hard, and man do I think they stuffed up.

@quin - I'll have to get my ecstatic emotions in check and be more rational before I can give specifics. The best answer I can give right now is 'behaviour in wake of the shift to a Fuzz lynch'

My refusal to vote for Fuzz was well justified. I did not see any organised reasoning for the bandwagon and it looked fishy as hell. I even made a point of the lack of justification, which nobody decided to respond to.

I don't think it's true that there was "no reasoning for the bandwagon", there was actually quite a bit of reasoning going on in such a short period. Quin did not comment on any of this at the time. All of his posts during this time were just voicing opposition to the RadicalFuzz lynch, even though he appeared to be on board with the idea of the Fire Drill initially, and a couple odd posts naming Enrique a town read and me a not-town read, a stance which he has since backed off of.
I want quin to be town very much but his activity in those last minutes does not look good.

[Marmot]

Wow, great job on Fuzz, guys. I guess the clue was in the name...

Hot Fuzz?

[thellama73]

Wow, great job on Fuzz, guys. I guess the clue was in the name...

Hot Fuzz?

Why thank you, I am kind of thirsty.

[indiglo]

I honestly don't understand the grumbling happening right now.

It's like being mad you won the lottery because you picked a number you didn't mean to pick. I mean, you still won the lottery!!

Or like on Big Bang Theory when Sheldon discovered a new element, but was so consumed by the fact that his math was wrong he couldn't enjoy the discovery.


Even if it had been a mislynch CFD, we still could have learned stuff. The fact that it wasn't a mislynch is just icing on the cake as far as I can tell. We can learn stuff, plus YAY we got a cop role.




Also, I just started singing "Hot Fuzz" to the tune of "Hot Blooded". So... that's me in a nutshell. How sad. (But seriously, try it, it's fun)

[Quin]

An observation about Quinny Quin Quin:
At first he was vaguely on board with the idea of a CFD, casting suspicion on DDL for shooting down the idea:

I don't like the idea of starting another wagon, when we already have 3, with less than an hour for the phase to end.

This is the PERFECT opportunity for scum to save each other if they need to.

If you don't like the current wagons then tough luck. Try to push another one earlier next day.

pingpong. I don't like this at all. We shouldn't be forced to lynch our civ-reads because there isn't an existing bandwagon for them.

But then a few minutes later the Fire Drill is under way with votes starting to pile in on Fuzzy and suddenly this is a bad idea and there's no reason to suspect RadicalFuzz:

I am not seeing a lot of reasoning behind the fuzz vote. I don't like it at all. I can't recall a single thing in the thread even being said that would paint fuzz as scum.

linki: even more 'okay fizz it is' without anything tangible to work with.

He continues voicing opposition even after the flip:

And that is why last minute lynch trains are NOT bad. They make the baddies scramble hard, and man do I think they stuffed up.

@quin - I'll have to get my ecstatic emotions in check and be more rational before I can give specifics. The best answer I can give right now is 'behaviour in wake of the shift to a Fuzz lynch'

My refusal to vote for Fuzz was well justified. I did not see any organised reasoning for the bandwagon and it looked fishy as hell. I even made a point of the lack of justification, which nobody decided to respond to.

I don't think it's true that there was "no reasoning for the bandwagon", there was actually quite a bit of reasoning going on in such a short period. Quin did not comment on any of this at the time. All of his posts during this time were just voicing opposition to the RadicalFuzz lynch, even though he appeared to be on board with the idea of the Fire Drill initially, and a couple odd posts naming Enrique a town read and me a not-town read, a stance which he has since backed off of.
I want quin to be town very much but his activity in those last minutes does not look good.

I don't know what a Chinese Fire Drill is. Nor do I know what me pinging Luffy and me not wanting to lynch Fuzz have in common. Could you elaborate?

[Sloonei]

A Chinese Fire Drill is the thing that just happened: a sudden, surprise bandwagon at the end of a day period.

At first you criticized DDL for shooting down the idea when it was proposed. But then when it started up, you refused to take part, seemingly on the principle of the thing. It looks like you criticized Dragon, and then did the exact thing you were criticizing him for.

[Sloonei]

Also I never said the words "Chinese Fire Drill" in my post :o

[Sloonei]

Also also "Chinese Fire Drill" is one of my favorite mafia terms there is. It makes no sense but somehow it is exactly what it sounds like.

[Quin]

Alright, I looked up what CFD means, and I have absolutely no idea why you're assuming I signed up to participate in it. While I did disagree with Luffy, and I found his post incredibly scummy, I still did not approve of having Fuzz be the target of the bandwagon, for reasons I have explained. I found myself in the middle ground of this, I thought you all should have done what you liked as long as it was well justified, and I would continue to do the same thing I have always done. I think you're painting this as black and white, and that should be avoided.

After the flip, I did have to explain myself since I was under scrutiny from Golden. I thought that ika was the better lynch. It's not like my thought process went back in time and did a 180 just because I was wrong. I am, of course, glad that Fuzz was scum, but I did not think he was a good lynch at the time.

I'll finish by saying that I did see two major points of evidence used against him. It's not like I was ignoring it, I just disagreed with it and for the most part I did explain myself. The first point is where he said he wanted to stay away with the ika/Silverwolf situation. I think people interpreted that differently. I saw it as a less game-related, more personal statement to say that he disagreed with the principle of voting for someone new because reasons. I then saw his actual vote for him as independent from that. The second point being that he essentially did not speak unless spoken to. I don't think I actually did comment on this one, so you have me here, but there are a number of players who are playing that game. A number of those are the players currently lying low.

linki: whether you used Chinese Fire Drill in your post, I can't remember. But I gathered that CFD stood for Chinese Fire Drill since both have been used in the thread.

[Quin]

A Chinese Fire Drill is the thing that just happened: a sudden, surprise bandwagon at the end of a day period.

At first you criticized DDL for shooting down the idea when it was proposed. But then when it started up, you refused to take part, seemingly on the principle of the thing. It looks like you criticized Dragon, and then did the exact thing you were criticizing him for.

I never said that a CFD is a bad idea, I was just opposed to lynching Fuzz for the reasons that were given.

[Matt]

Good job Golden, SVS, and all the others who got Fuzz. Woot!

That being said, I'll probably be voting Golden again tomorrow.

[Quin]

Good job Golden, SVS, and all the others who got Fuzz. Woot!

That being said, I'll probably be voting Golden again tomorrow.

WHERES MY ISO

[Quin]

Good job Golden, SVS, and all the others who got Fuzz. Woot!

That being said, I'll probably be voting Golden again tomorrow.

If we were to pretend Golden was dead and scum, who would be your go-to lynch tomorrow?

On the other hand, if he was civ, who would you lynch?

[Sloonei]

Alright, I looked up what CFD means, and I have absolutely no idea why you're assuming I signed up to participate in it. While I did disagree with Luffy, and I found his post incredibly scummy, I still did not approve of having Fuzz be the target of the bandwagon, for reasons I have explained. I found myself in the middle ground of this, I thought you all should have done what you liked as long as it was well justified, and I would continue to do the same thing I have always done. I think you're painting this as black and white, and that should be avoided.

After the flip, I did have to explain myself since I was under scrutiny from Golden. I thought that ika was the better lynch. It's not like my thought process went back in time and did a 180 just because I was wrong. I am, of course, glad that Fuzz was scum, but I did not think he was a good lynch at the time.

I'll finish by saying that I did see two major points of evidence used against him. It's not like I was ignoring it, I just disagreed with it and for the most part I did explain myself. The first point is where he said he wanted to stay away with the ika/Silverwolf situation. I think people interpreted that differently. I saw it as a less game-related, more personal statement to say that he disagreed with the principle of voting for someone new because reasons. I then saw his actual vote for him as independent from that. The second point being that he essentially did not speak unless spoken to. I don't think I actually did comment on this one, so you have me here, but there are a number of players who are playing that game. A number of those are the players currently lying low.

linki: whether you used Chinese Fire Drill in your post, I can't remember. But I gathered that CFD stood for Chinese Fire Drill since both have been used in the thread.

What am I painting as black and white? I am connecting these things because your initial post abot DDL seemed to imply that you at least vaguely supported the proposal to seek a new bandwagon. But then you instantaneously started shooting down the wagon on Fuzz when it started up and didn't even appear to give it any consideration.
I do not get your explanation of how you perceived his vote and interaction with ika and silverwolf. I don't remember him saying anything about not wanting to vote for anyone because they're new. And then you dismiss everything you just said by vaguely referring to his vote as being "independent from that", but I have no idea what those words are supposed to mean.
The second point against him was more than he was not providing any in-depth reads, just kind of commenting on things from behind all the time and never generating anything new. You seem a bit over-defensive in that last little bit.

[Sloonei]

Good job Golden, SVS, and all the others who got Fuzz. Woot!

That being said, I'll probably be voting Golden again tomorrow.

Does not compute.

[Long Con]

Also also "Chinese Fire Drill" is one of my favorite mafia terms there is. It makes no sense but somehow it is exactly what it sounds like.

First, love the double 'also'.

Second... is CFD, like... racist?

[Matt]

Good job Golden, SVS, and all the others who got Fuzz. Woot!

That being said, I'll probably be voting Golden again tomorrow.

If we were to pretend Golden was dead and scum, who would be your go-to lynch tomorrow?

On the other hand, if he was civ, who would you lynch?

Sloonei. He was trying to lead a lynch towards me at the end there, and afterwards, gave himself a pat on the back for being involved with the Fuzz lynch.

Also, at first I was pretty put off by people voting ika because of the ika/Silverwolf thing, but while catching up tonight, I kinda feel like Wolf/ika have been trying to milk a guilt trip out of peeps.

I say this every game, and I really don't care if he's bad, can we please give sig until like, Day 4 or 5 before we lynch him? Every game he gets mislynched.

As for your ISO, Quin, haven't gotten to it. But I agree with you and Enrique that the lynch result was a bogus swap (even if a cop was got!) and I think Golden just bussed the shit out of Fuzzy.

Wilgy, he who knows Fuzz more then anyone...I've only played with Fuzz once or twice, I think he was civ every time, but he strikes me as someone who would fight harder as a mafia. I'm wondering if he just laid down and took it for Golden's sake. Is that a possibility, Wilgy, or have I reached full tunnel express on Golden now?

[Sloonei]

Also also "Chinese Fire Drill" is one of my favorite mafia terms there is. It makes no sense but somehow it is exactly what it sounds like.

First, love the double 'also'.

Second... is CFD, like... racist?

I don't think anyone ever stopped to ask China.

[Quin]

Alright, I looked up what CFD means, and I have absolutely no idea why you're assuming I signed up to participate in it. While I did disagree with Luffy, and I found his post incredibly scummy, I still did not approve of having Fuzz be the target of the bandwagon, for reasons I have explained. I found myself in the middle ground of this, I thought you all should have done what you liked as long as it was well justified, and I would continue to do the same thing I have always done. I think you're painting this as black and white, and that should be avoided.

After the flip, I did have to explain myself since I was under scrutiny from Golden. I thought that ika was the better lynch. It's not like my thought process went back in time and did a 180 just because I was wrong. I am, of course, glad that Fuzz was scum, but I did not think he was a good lynch at the time.

I'll finish by saying that I did see two major points of evidence used against him. It's not like I was ignoring it, I just disagreed with it and for the most part I did explain myself. The first point is where he said he wanted to stay away with the ika/Silverwolf situation. I think people interpreted that differently. I saw it as a less game-related, more personal statement to say that he disagreed with the principle of voting for someone new because reasons. I then saw his actual vote for him as independent from that. The second point being that he essentially did not speak unless spoken to. I don't think I actually did comment on this one, so you have me here, but there are a number of players who are playing that game. A number of those are the players currently lying low.

linki: whether you used Chinese Fire Drill in your post, I can't remember. But I gathered that CFD stood for Chinese Fire Drill since both have been used in the thread.

What am I painting as black and white? I am connecting these things because your initial post abot DDL seemed to imply that you at least vaguely supported the proposal to seek a new bandwagon. But then you instantaneously started shooting down the wagon on Fuzz when it started up and didn't even appear to give it any consideration.
I do not get your explanation of how you perceived his vote and interaction with ika and silverwolf. I don't remember him saying anything about not wanting to vote for anyone because they're new. And then you dismiss everything you just said by vaguely referring to his vote as being "independent from that", but I have no idea what those words are supposed to mean.
The second point against him was more than he was not providing any in-depth reads, just kind of commenting on things from behind all the time and never generating anything new. You seem a bit over-defensive in that last little bit.

You're painting my support/opposition to a CFD as black and white. I did not agree with a Fuzz lynch, and thus I disagreed with the CFD. I don't disagree with the concept, but in that particular circumstances, I think you chose the wrong person to lynch. I was wrong, obviously, but still.

What fuzz said was:

I refuse to touch the Silverwolf/ika thing with a 39 & 1/2 foot pole.

If he had just said 'I refuse to vote ika' I would 100 percent have been on your side. But what he said, given the surrounding conversation and his wording gave me the impression that he was taking an external view of the situation and saying he didn't want to vote ika based on reasons.

What do you think I'm being over-defensive about? I can't see anything in my post that might give you that impression.

[Sloonei]

Good job Golden, SVS, and all the others who got Fuzz. Woot!

That being said, I'll probably be voting Golden again tomorrow.

If we were to pretend Golden was dead and scum, who would be your go-to lynch tomorrow?

On the other hand, if he was civ, who would you lynch?

Sloonei. He was trying to lead a lynch towards me at the end there, and afterwards, gave himself a pat on the back for being involved with the Fuzz lynch.

Also, at first I was pretty put off by people voting ika because of the ika/Silverwolf thing, but while catching up tonight, I kinda feel like Wolf/ika have been trying to milk a guilt trip out of peeps.

I say this every game, and I really don't care if he's bad, can we please give sig until like, Day 4 or 5 before we lynch him? Every game he gets mislynched.

As for your ISO, Quin, haven't gotten to it. But I agree with you and Enrique that the lynch result was a bogus swap (even if a cop was got!) and I think Golden just bussed the shit out of Fuzzy.

Wilgy, he who knows Fuzz more then anyone...I've only played with Fuzz once or twice, I think he was civ every time, but he strikes me as someone who would fight harder as a mafia. I'm wondering if he just laid down and took it for Golden's sake. Is that a possibility, Wilgy, or have I reached full tunnel express on Golden now?

My initial vote for Fuzz was more tentative than others, I think. I was not expecting such a huge rush of votes. When I saw that 7 people had voted for him in such a short time, I thought it would be safe to at least test the waters on what seemed to be the second most popular option for the CFD. That turned out to be you. I put my vote on you and tried to gauge reactions, but everyone seemed (rightly, it turned out) intent on lynching Fuzz. I waa happy enough with this, so I put my vote back. I admit this is a point on which I can't reject that you have reason to be confused and a bit suspiciois of me on, but I think if you're only naming me (and Golden) as suspects in the aftermath lf what just happened then you're turning a completely blind eye to like 80% of the events.
I mean, look at Enrique and tell me you read him as civ.

[Marmot]

Also also "Chinese Fire Drill" is one of my favorite mafia terms there is. It makes no sense but somehow it is exactly what it sounds like.

First, love the double 'also'.

Second... is CFD, like... racist?

Not as Racist as French Fries.

[Golden]

Good job Golden, SVS, and all the others who got Fuzz. Woot!

That being said, I'll probably be voting Golden again tomorrow.

Why?

[Sloonei]

Alright, I looked up what CFD means, and I have absolutely no idea why you're assuming I signed up to participate in it. While I did disagree with Luffy, and I found his post incredibly scummy, I still did not approve of having Fuzz be the target of the bandwagon, for reasons I have explained. I found myself in the middle ground of this, I thought you all should have done what you liked as long as it was well justified, and I would continue to do the same thing I have always done. I think you're painting this as black and white, and that should be avoided.

After the flip, I did have to explain myself since I was under scrutiny from Golden. I thought that ika was the better lynch. It's not like my thought process went back in time and did a 180 just because I was wrong. I am, of course, glad that Fuzz was scum, but I did not think he was a good lynch at the time.

I'll finish by saying that I did see two major points of evidence used against him. It's not like I was ignoring it, I just disagreed with it and for the most part I did explain myself. The first point is where he said he wanted to stay away with the ika/Silverwolf situation. I think people interpreted that differently. I saw it as a less game-related, more personal statement to say that he disagreed with the principle of voting for someone new because reasons. I then saw his actual vote for him as independent from that. The second point being that he essentially did not speak unless spoken to. I don't think I actually did comment on this one, so you have me here, but there are a number of players who are playing that game. A number of those are the players currently lying low.

linki: whether you used Chinese Fire Drill in your post, I can't remember. But I gathered that CFD stood for Chinese Fire Drill since both have been used in the thread.

What am I painting as black and white? I am connecting these things because your initial post abot DDL seemed to imply that you at least vaguely supported the proposal to seek a new bandwagon. But then you instantaneously started shooting down the wagon on Fuzz when it started up and didn't even appear to give it any consideration.
I do not get your explanation of how you perceived his vote and interaction with ika and silverwolf. I don't remember him saying anything about not wanting to vote for anyone because they're new. And then you dismiss everything you just said by vaguely referring to his vote as being "independent from that", but I have no idea what those words are supposed to mean.
The second point against him was more than he was not providing any in-depth reads, just kind of commenting on things from behind all the time and never generating anything new. You seem a bit over-defensive in that last little bit.

You're painting my support/opposition to a CFD as black and white. I did not agree with a Fuzz lynch, and thus I disagreed with the CFD. I don't disagree with the concept, but in that particular circumstances, I think you chose the wrong person to lynch. I was wrong, obviously, but still.

What fuzz said was:

I refuse to touch the Silverwolf/ika thing with a 39 & 1/2 foot pole.

If he had just said 'I refuse to vote ika' I would 100 percent have been on your side. But what he said, given the surrounding conversation and his wording gave me the impression that he was taking an external view of the situation and saying he didn't want to vote ika based on reasons.

What do you think I'm being over-defensive about? I can't see anything in my post that might give you that impression.

I colored in the over-defensive part. I still am not getting your explanation of anything here, but it's also 2 in the morning and I am very tired. I particularly don't get why you're trying to justify RadicalFuzz's vote for him right now. And my Issue with your reaction to the Fire Drill is more about how instantaneously shot it down. The support you implied when you criticized DDL should suggest that you would understand and be on board with a new bandwagon starting up without much discussion or stated evidence, but then when that happened instead of being supportive of having an open mind to it, you closed the book because there wasn't enough evidence or discussion about it. You did a 180, and to me it looks like the reason your stance changed was because of the name involved.