[END] Bioshock Mafia

[DharmaHelper]

Lame result. RIP!

Yeah, lame. I'd hoped there was a good chance of him being bad based on his defending BWT. Apparently not.

1

I sort of had a feeling llama was being railroaded towards the end there. Will have my eye firmly on you in the next lynch though, that's for sure. I will also examine the Dex voters in a later post.

1

[thellama73]

Thanks for a fun game, everybody!

[Bullzeye]

Lame result. RIP!

Yeah, lame. I'd hoped there was a good chance of him being bad based on his defending BWT. Apparently not.

1

I sort of had a feeling llama was being railroaded towards the end there. Will have my eye firmly on you in the next lynch though, that's for sure. I will also examine the Dex voters in a later post.

1

I responded to your points about me earlier. Did you see it? Also, what do you think of the fact that Ace and Bea used your logic and nothing more to support votes for me?

2

[DisgruntledPorcupine]

Lame result. RIP!

Yeah, lame. I'd hoped there was a good chance of him being bad based on his defending BWT. Apparently not.

1

I had my doubts. I think it was mostly because his defending of BWT was made so clear. I usually think a baddie wouldn't put themselves in the clear so much in that situation, but who knows.

1

[Draconus]

Thanks for a fun game, everybody!

Sorry I doubted you llama! Thanks for leading great discussions!

[AceofSpaces]

Lame result. RIP!

Yeah, lame. I'd hoped there was a good chance of him being bad based on his defending BWT. Apparently not.

1

I sort of had a feeling llama was being railroaded towards the end there. Will have my eye firmly on you in the next lynch though, that's for sure. I will also examine the Dex voters in a later post.

1

I responded to your points about me earlier. Did you see it? Also, what do you think of the fact that Ace and Bea used your logic and nothing more to support votes for me?

2

Would you rather I just repeat everything DH said again? If someone makes a case that makes sense, why wouldn't I support it? You're actions during day two were suspicious, and DH pointed it all out very well. I'm not sure where you are going with that.

1

[Bullzeye]

Lame result. RIP!

Yeah, lame. I'd hoped there was a good chance of him being bad based on his defending BWT. Apparently not.

1

I had my doubts. I think it was mostly because his defending of BWT was made so clear. I usually think a baddie wouldn't put themselves in the clear so much in that situation, but who knows.

1

I always say the idea that a baddie 'wouldn't do' something is not a great idea because they could then do something just because people would say oh a baddie wouldn't do that he must be civvie. Obviously in this case it doesn't apply though. You were right.

3

[Epignosis]

Lame result. RIP!

Yeah, lame. I'd hoped there was a good chance of him being bad based on his defending BWT. Apparently not.

1

"Apparently not" is not a sentence. "Yeah, lame" is not a sentence (thought we might be able to argue about that one). Actually, no we cannot, and I'm not going to tell you why.

1

[DharmaHelper]

Bullz I did see your post, I'll address it in a minute. IDK what to think about Aces/Bea jumping on my suspicions. Bea seems, like I said, to be sort of wishy-washy and playing up the whole clueless thing so that is a point against her.

I was gonna just ignore DH's post about me for now because I wasn't too bothered, but then other people started latching on so I thought I'd address it a bit.

Bullz has made a few more posts than boo during D3 but they are equally as chin-scratch worthy. going to rewind a bit to D2 first though here he debates the merits of voting for Dex or Aces, but ultimately decides that voting for Dex would be too risky as he's "trying to grab himself some votes".

As you've just shown, I was unlikely to vote BWT even before he became an obvious candidate. If I'd mentioned BWT as highly suspicious and then voted Aces then I would agree that my vote looked like a save attempt.

Just because you didn't mention BWT doesn't mean you weren't trying to save him, Bullz. Oft times I stay away from bringing up my teammates when bad. Weak defense is weak.

Fast forward a bit and here Bullz says that if he really wanted to defend BWT, he would have done so. Because the smartest thing a baddie can do is openly and actively defend a sinking ship instead of covertly and subtly trying to get the votes needed for that teammate to survive.

I would have defended the ship before it started to sink. We've been bad together at least once, you surely know I try to defend my teammates when I can. It has been the death of me a few times.

I'm sure you would have done anything in your power to help a teammate. Like, you know, tie the vote.

He also says that he doubts Ace's voters (a group which he is conveniently a part of) made an attempt to save BWT by voting Aces. He states that it is just as likely that Dex voters (whom I will examine later) were trying to save BWT by voting Dex as they were tied or close for a while. Now you see why I rewound back to his D2 vote post where he waffles between voting Dex and voting Aces. Either vote would have been sufficient to save a teammate, by Bullz's own admission, yet the Aces vote carried significantly less risk.

I obviously worded that post wrongly. I meant it might not have only been Aces' voters trying to save BWT, as Dex was close as well so some could have jumped on him. Also voting for someone close to the person you're trying to save but not the closest would surely be a good way to disguise the fact that your vote is a save attempt right?

But as you said, voting for Dex in your opinion would have given him an advantage, so giving an opposing baddie an advantage wasn't something I think you would have done.

at the time of Bullz's comment and vote, the poll looked like this:
Aces had 4 votes (Hedgeowl, Spaghetti, Nev, and Boo)
BwT had 5 votes (Indiglo Elo, SD, Epig, Aces)
Dex had 3 votes (Boomslang, Devin, Dex)
So it would make more sense to put a vote on Aces at the time of Bullz's vote.

I see. I couldn't remember if Aces and Dex were tied or not at the time I voted, I thought they had been but apparently not.

Linki Nutella - interesting point about Boats there. Definitely worth a look.

Responses in yellow
2.

[Bullzeye]

Lame result. RIP!

Yeah, lame. I'd hoped there was a good chance of him being bad based on his defending BWT. Apparently not.

1

I sort of had a feeling llama was being railroaded towards the end there. Will have my eye firmly on you in the next lynch though, that's for sure. I will also examine the Dex voters in a later post.

1

I responded to your points about me earlier. Did you see it? Also, what do you think of the fact that Ace and Bea used your logic and nothing more to support votes for me?

2

Would you rather I just repeat everything DH said again? If someone makes a case that makes sense, why wouldn't I support it? You're actions during day two were suspicious, and DH pointed it all out very well. I'm not sure where you are going with that.

1

I was really pointing more at Bea there, since DH accused her of being wishy-washy and then she acted in exactly that manner. You did the same thing though, so it wouldn't exactly look good if I seemed to be giving you a pass for something I was condemning someone else for.

Lame result. RIP!

Yeah, lame. I'd hoped there was a good chance of him being bad based on his defending BWT. Apparently not.

1

"Apparently not" is not a sentence. "Yeah, lame" is not a sentence (thought we might be able to argue about that one). Actually, no we cannot, and I'm not going to tell you why.

1

Only if you want to be a grammar nazi about it!

4

[DharmaHelper]

@Bullz I will concede that bea's fly by vote is suspicious and she has been incredibly aloof. Like I said in my megapost, her own posts are rather large but incredibly lacking in content. Is that a point you, or for that matter, anyone agrees with?

3.

[Bullzeye]

@Bullz I will concede that bea's fly by vote is suspicious and she has been incredibly aloof. Like I said in my megapost, her own posts are rather large but incredibly lacking in content. Is that a point you, or for that matter, anyone agrees with?

3.

I do agree, hence my mentioning of her. She seems to waffle and frequently brought up how lost/confused she was. I suppose there's also the fact she's one of those Aces voters you like so much.

5

[indiglo]

Working on catching up, sorry for being absent and missing the vote. We had MAJOR storms move through with lots of flooding, and many power outages across the board (including myself). The power has been off and on since yesterday, but finally seems to be back on here and reliable. There was loads of flooding, but I am fortunate that me and mine are all safe and ok. My city even made the national news! I just heard Brian Williams mention it, that was weird!

Anyhoo, I'm going to work on catching up over this night period, and hope that the power will remain on permanently now.

[DharmaHelper]

@Bullz I will concede that bea's fly by vote is suspicious and she has been incredibly aloof. Like I said in my megapost, her own posts are rather large but incredibly lacking in content. Is that a point you, or for that matter, anyone agrees with?

3.

I do agree, hence my mentioning of her. She seems to waffle and frequently brought up how lost/confused she was. I suppose there's also the fact she's one of those Aces voters you like so much.

5

Speaking of Ace voters, running with the theory that those who voted Ace to save BWT also voted Thellama to discredit and perhaps embarrass Epignosis.

Epignosis (2), G.O.B. (3), boo (5), insertnamehere (6), Zany Dex (7), Ajira (9), Bullzeye (10), Devin the Omniscient (12), Matahari (15), Flyin' High (18), Elohcin (23), Dom (24)

Boo and yourself are (correct me if I am wrong) the only two who also voted for Aces. Although I haven't taken the time to sit down and dig into the Dex votes, so that too might bring some knowledge.

4.

[Bullzeye]

@Bullz I will concede that bea's fly by vote is suspicious and she has been incredibly aloof. Like I said in my megapost, her own posts are rather large but incredibly lacking in content. Is that a point you, or for that matter, anyone agrees with?

3.

I do agree, hence my mentioning of her. She seems to waffle and frequently brought up how lost/confused she was. I suppose there's also the fact she's one of those Aces voters you like so much.

5

Speaking of Ace voters, running with the theory that those who voted Ace to save BWT also voted Thellama to discredit and perhaps embarrass Epignosis.

Epignosis (2), G.O.B. (3), boo (5), insertnamehere (6), Zany Dex (7), Ajira (9), Bullzeye (10), Devin the Omniscient (12), Matahari (15), Flyin' High (18), Elohcin (23), Dom (24)

Boo and yourself are (correct me if I am wrong) the only two who also voted for Aces. Although I haven't taken the time to sit down and dig into the Dex votes, so that too might bring some knowledge.

4.

That's an interesting theory, I've never heard of someone voting a person to discredit somebody else before. Seems like a strange way of going about it. I don't know how to respond to that really other than to say that I wasn't really thinking of Epi when I voted Llama, I was thinking more of the likelihood of him being bad due to having spoken in defense of someone who was revealed to be a baddie. I'd probably have considered voting Llama today no matter who else was doing so. Does your assumption that people were trying to discredit Epi mean you think he's probably a civvie?

6

[DharmaHelper]

@Bullz I will concede that bea's fly by vote is suspicious and she has been incredibly aloof. Like I said in my megapost, her own posts are rather large but incredibly lacking in content. Is that a point you, or for that matter, anyone agrees with?

3.

I do agree, hence my mentioning of her. She seems to waffle and frequently brought up how lost/confused she was. I suppose there's also the fact she's one of those Aces voters you like so much.

5

Speaking of Ace voters, running with the theory that those who voted Ace to save BWT also voted Thellama to discredit and perhaps embarrass Epignosis.

Epignosis (2), G.O.B. (3), boo (5), insertnamehere (6), Zany Dex (7), Ajira (9), Bullzeye (10), Devin the Omniscient (12), Matahari (15), Flyin' High (18), Elohcin (23), Dom (24)

Boo and yourself are (correct me if I am wrong) the only two who also voted for Aces. Although I haven't taken the time to sit down and dig into the Dex votes, so that too might bring some knowledge.

4.

That's an interesting theory, I've never heard of someone voting a person to discredit somebody else before. Seems like a strange way of going about it. I don't know how to respond to that really other than to say that I wasn't really thinking of Epi when I voted Llama, I was thinking more of the likelihood of him being bad due to having spoken in defense of someone who was revealed to be a baddie. I'd probably have considered voting Llama today no matter who else was doing so. Does your assumption that people were trying to discredit Epi mean you think he's probably a civvie?

6

I could have probably worded that a bit clearer. What I mean is that the people who may have voted to save BWT (therefore being on BWT's team) Knew that Thellama was not in fact on their team, and because Epignosis had been given a very big boost in his cred after the BWT lynch, and given his exchanges with llama, it is my belief that the people who tried to save BWT also voted for thellama for a number of reasons

1) Easy vote
2) When llama flipped civvie, it would do a number on Epignosis' cred, knocking him down a peg and diminishing his believability in the thread. I.E "Well Epig I want to trust you but you were wrong about llama..."
5.

[Bullzeye]

I could have probably worded that a bit clearer. What I mean is that the people who may have voted to save BWT (therefore being on BWT's team) Knew that Thellama was not in fact on their team, and because Epignosis had been given a very big boost in his cred after the BWT lynch, and given his exchanges with llama, it is my belief that the people who tried to save BWT also voted for thellama for a number of reasons

1) Easy vote
2) When llama flipped civvie, it would do a number on Epignosis' cred, knocking him down a peg and diminishing his believability in the thread. I.E "Well Epig I want to trust you but you were wrong about llama..."
5.

Okay that makes more sense, I wasn't entirely sure what you were talking about at first. If you weren't accusing me of having done that I'd say you were probably right. As it happens you're at least wrong about me but I have no idea about Boo. Is there anything other than votes pointing to him being bad?

7

[DharmaHelper]

As I noted in my megapost, Bullz, boo offered an explanation for BwT's confusing post. One reason he might have done that would be to lend a hand to a team mate after a flub?

6.

[Bullzeye]

As I noted in my megapost, Bullz, boo offered an explanation for BwT's confusing post. One reason he might have done that would be to lend a hand to a team mate after a flub?

6.

Well you could say that Boo's explanation was the easiest way to interpret BWT's post if one took the perspective that it wasn't a slip. On the other hand yeah it's entirely possible he was trying to cover up his teammate's slip-up. In fact, he could even have used the explanation I just offered as an excuse after the fact. I'll be considering Boo and Bea tomorrow I think.

8

[Epignosis]

Speaking of Ace voters, running with the theory that those who voted Ace to save BWT also voted Thellama to discredit and perhaps embarrass Epignosis.

4.

I don't know about Ace. I do not disagree that there are buy guys present in late Ace voters.

I do not feel embarrassed- only frustrated.

2

[DharmaHelper]

As I noted in my megapost, Bullz, boo offered an explanation for BwT's confusing post. One reason he might have done that would be to lend a hand to a team mate after a flub?

6.

Well you could say that Boo's explanation was the easiest way to interpret BWT's post if one took the perspective that it wasn't a slip. On the other hand yeah it's entirely possible he was trying to cover up his teammate's slip-up. In fact, he could even have used the explanation I just offered as an excuse after the fact. I'll be considering Boo and Bea tomorrow I think.

8

Boo/Bea are also on my watch list, but now that they're on yours as well I'm like :o. I realize I may be entirely off track with the whole thing and nobody that voted for Aces was bad, but I just don't think I am wrong. Because I can completely see how a team would view that lynch and think "Oh well it's only X amount of votes we can totally save you.. Though that being said, often times when I make this big (*rare*) analysis posts I miss out on some things in terms of suspicions, so I will be interested and open to hearing others thoughts on non-Ace voters. If something clicks there, I may toss a vote in that direction. But I just feel too much like a dog chasing a bone at this point. I feel very confident in the points I made against you and indeed against everyone else in my big post.

7. Because mistakes were made.

Linki @ Epig - That is what I was afraid of, that certain baddies followed the llama vote just to frustrate you and get you off your early stellar game. Don't get disheartened just yet mi amigo.

7. Because mistakes were still made.

[AceofSpaces]

First of all RIP and juliets.

Dom, frankly I don't care if you liked what I said or not. I admit I back pedalled a little because I shouldn't have posted in annoyance. But that doesn't make me bad. A bad person maybe and maybe bad judgement in posting it. But not in game bad.
Why not vote for Aceofspaces who was even more forthright than I? I don't see you questioning his post!

Because he didn't say that he didn't care about allignment.... . . ... ...? You seemed a bit more extreme to me. And I don't think Aces is bad at the moment... nice subtle attempt to bring attention onto me, though.

In case anybody else thinks I was completely out of order in my comment regarding aglaminranks, may I take this opportunity to remind everyone of what AceofSpaces said.

No one look at me! Look at Aces!

I think Lizzy is probably innocent and I will defend her to my last breath.

omgomgogngh I will defend you with my life as well k innocent or guilty

Simply pointing out Aces pretty much has the same opinion as me. Look at me everyone. I'm just saying that. This Dom guy seems a bit desperate to be honest. I actually think Aces is civ too and won't vote for him for sharing my opinion.

And how was I bringing attention on you subtly actually? Bit paranoid. You credit me with far too much savvy.

Just wanted to bring this up, because it had been bothering me for awhile. Snow Dog says he thinks I am a Civ, and that *he* wouldn't vote for me. But in those other other quotes about he very strongly deflects suspicion put on him onto me. He also directly suggest people vote for me. That bothers me.

He's also voted for Lizzy for the past two days. To me that seems like a throwaway vote, so he doesn't have to be responsible for whoever gets lynched. He's peaked my interest. I just wanted to know what anyone else thought of this, or of Snow Dog in general.

3

[Epignosis]

As I noted in my megapost, Bullz, boo offered an explanation for BwT's confusing post. One reason he might have done that would be to lend a hand to a team mate after a flub?

6.

I teach English. I tend to think you are good. But this is two sentences, not three.

3.

[Bullzeye]

As I noted in my megapost, Bullz, boo offered an explanation for BwT's confusing post. One reason he might have done that would be to lend a hand to a team mate after a flub?

6.

Well you could say that Boo's explanation was the easiest way to interpret BWT's post if one took the perspective that it wasn't a slip. On the other hand yeah it's entirely possible he was trying to cover up his teammate's slip-up. In fact, he could even have used the explanation I just offered as an excuse after the fact. I'll be considering Boo and Bea tomorrow I think.

8

Boo/Bea are also on my watch list, but now that they're on yours as well I'm like :o. I realize I may be entirely off track with the whole thing and nobody that voted for Aces was bad, but I just don't think I am wrong. Because I can completely see how a team would view that lynch and think "Oh well it's only X amount of votes we can totally save you.. Though that being said, often times when I make this big (*rare*) analysis posts I miss out on some things in terms of suspicions, so I will be interested and open to hearing others thoughts on non-Ace voters. If something clicks there, I may toss a vote in that direction. But I just feel too much like a dog chasing a bone at this point. I feel very confident in the points I made against you and indeed against everyone else in my big post.

7. Because mistakes were made.

I'm sure someone would have tried or at least wanted to try to save BWT during his lynch, I don't deny that. However I know that I wasn't trying anything of the sort and just didn't want to vote him at the time. Have you considered as well that maybe one of his teammates (or both) voted for him to distance having come in too late to save him?

9

[AceofSpaces]

As I noted in my megapost, Bullz, boo offered an explanation for BwT's confusing post. One reason he might have done that would be to lend a hand to a team mate after a flub?

6.

I've been suspicious of Boo for awhile. Mostly because of how threatened he seemed by my day one vote for him. It just didn't seem reasonable to me that he would instantly think I *had* to be bad, just because I voted for him day one.

4.

[DharmaHelper]

@Aces - I think Snow Dog saying "Why not look at Aces" was a hypothetical "you're willing to consider me for X by not him for X" scenario. Like he wasn't saying he suspects you, but that you're doing what he's doing and Dom picking him out over you doesn't make sense? If that makes sense. I don't know but I would certainly be interested in hearing Snow Dog's own thoughts on it.

@Epig - I teach life bro come at me english is for chumps. I realized after I posted that I made a goofy goof and then tried to correct that goofy goof by miscounting accidentally. So now I think I'm at

6.

[Bullzeye]

First of all RIP and juliets.

Dom, frankly I don't care if you liked what I said or not. I admit I back pedalled a little because I shouldn't have posted in annoyance. But that doesn't make me bad. A bad person maybe and maybe bad judgement in posting it. But not in game bad.
Why not vote for Aceofspaces who was even more forthright than I? I don't see you questioning his post!

Because he didn't say that he didn't care about allignment.... . . ... ...? You seemed a bit more extreme to me. And I don't think Aces is bad at the moment... nice subtle attempt to bring attention onto me, though.

In case anybody else thinks I was completely out of order in my comment regarding aglaminranks, may I take this opportunity to remind everyone of what AceofSpaces said.

No one look at me! Look at Aces!

I think Lizzy is probably innocent and I will defend her to my last breath.

omgomgogngh I will defend you with my life as well k innocent or guilty

Simply pointing out Aces pretty much has the same opinion as me. Look at me everyone. I'm just saying that. This Dom guy seems a bit desperate to be honest. I actually think Aces is civ too and won't vote for him for sharing my opinion.

And how was I bringing attention on you subtly actually? Bit paranoid. You credit me with far too much savvy.

Just wanted to bring this up, because it had been bothering me for awhile. Snow Dog says he thinks I am a Civ, and that *he* wouldn't vote for me. But in those other other quotes about he very strongly deflects suspicion put on him onto me. He also directly suggest people vote for me. That bothers me.

He's also voted for Lizzy for the past two days. To me that seems like a throwaway vote, so he doesn't have to be responsible for whoever gets lynched. He's peaked my interest. I just wanted to know what anyone else thought of this, or of Snow Dog in general.

3

That's an interesting point. I think you might be on to something, but I hadn't really looked at Snow properly so I'll have to do that at some point. He could be someone to keep an eye on though.

10

[DharmaHelper]

As I noted in my megapost, Bullz, boo offered an explanation for BwT's confusing post. One reason he might have done that would be to lend a hand to a team mate after a flub?

6.

Well you could say that Boo's explanation was the easiest way to interpret BWT's post if one took the perspective that it wasn't a slip. On the other hand yeah it's entirely possible he was trying to cover up his teammate's slip-up. In fact, he could even have used the explanation I just offered as an excuse after the fact. I'll be considering Boo and Bea tomorrow I think.

8

Boo/Bea are also on my watch list, but now that they're on yours as well I'm like :o. I realize I may be entirely off track with the whole thing and nobody that voted for Aces was bad, but I just don't think I am wrong. Because I can completely see how a team would view that lynch and think "Oh well it's only X amount of votes we can totally save you.. Though that being said, often times when I make this big (*rare*) analysis posts I miss out on some things in terms of suspicions, so I will be interested and open to hearing others thoughts on non-Ace voters. If something clicks there, I may toss a vote in that direction. But I just feel too much like a dog chasing a bone at this point. I feel very confident in the points I made against you and indeed against everyone else in my big post.

7. Because mistakes were made.

I'm sure someone would have tried or at least wanted to try to save BWT during his lynch, I don't deny that. However I know that I wasn't trying anything of the sort and just didn't want to vote him at the time. Have you considered as well that maybe one of his teammates (or both) voted for him to distance having come in too late to save him?

9

I have not currently considered that possibility, though in all fairness, nobody has made a particularly educated case against anyone with that criteria (too late to save bwt, so X threw him under the bus). If someone did do that I would take that case into consideration. And considering the trend of the thread at the minute I think alot more cases and educated posts are about to crop up. I take full credit.

7.

[Snow Dog]

First of all RIP and juliets.

Dom, frankly I don't care if you liked what I said or not. I admit I back pedalled a little because I shouldn't have posted in annoyance. But that doesn't make me bad. A bad person maybe and maybe bad judgement in posting it. But not in game bad.
Why not vote for Aceofspaces who was even more forthright than I? I don't see you questioning his post!

Because he didn't say that he didn't care about allignment.... . . ... ...? You seemed a bit more extreme to me. And I don't think Aces is bad at the moment... nice subtle attempt to bring attention onto me, though.

In case anybody else thinks I was completely out of order in my comment regarding aglaminranks, may I take this opportunity to remind everyone of what AceofSpaces said.

No one look at me! Look at Aces!

I think Lizzy is probably innocent and I will defend her to my last breath.

omgomgogngh I will defend you with my life as well k innocent or guilty

Simply pointing out Aces pretty much has the same opinion as me. Look at me everyone. I'm just saying that. This Dom guy seems a bit desperate to be honest. I actually think Aces is civ too and won't vote for him for sharing my opinion.

And how was I bringing attention on you subtly actually? Bit paranoid. You credit me with far too much savvy.

Just wanted to bring this up, because it had been bothering me for awhile. Snow Dog says he thinks I am a Civ, and that *he* wouldn't vote for me. But in those other other quotes about he very strongly deflects suspicion put on him onto me. He also directly suggest people vote for me. That bothers me.

He's also voted for Lizzy for the past two days. To me that seems like a throwaway vote, so he doesn't have to be responsible for whoever gets lynched. He's peaked my interest. I just wanted to know what anyone else thought of this, or of Snow Dog in general.

3

I only think you are civ due to lack of evidence. I won't vote for you for your comment about that chap that got NKed. But if there is other evidence I might. I never tried to deflect suspicion onto you. Just defending my opinion by showing I wasn't alone. I never suggested people vote for you. Where is that written?

Lizzy isn't a throwaway vote, I believe she is bad and I am sticking to that. I also didn't join the llama vote.

1

[Bullzeye]

I have not currently considered that possibility, though in all fairness, nobody has made a particularly educated case against anyone with that criteria (too late to save bwt, so X threw him under the bus). If someone did do that I would take that case into consideration. And considering the trend of the thread at the minute I think alot more cases and educated posts are about to crop up. I take full credit.

7.

BWT's voters are indiglo (5), Elohcin (10), Spacedaisy (11), Epignosis (15), AceofSpaces (17), nutella (28), LittleTiger (29), DFaraday (32). I'm not sure there was actually a point where BWT was unsaveable looking at the voters, DF was the final one and he broke the tie between BWT and Ace, guaranteeing that BWT would die. While that makes me think DF probably isn't BWT's teammate it doesn't seem to do much else unless I'm missing something obvious among those voters.

11

[DharmaHelper]

@SnowDog

Is there anything specific apart from Lizzy's Tank Engine win giving her confidence enough to goof off and get away with it that makes you think she is bad? I will admit she fooled me in Tank Engine but I am not seeing anything definitive so far in this game. Thank you for offering an explanation about your Aces comment btw.

8.

[Mongoose]

I have not currently considered that possibility, though in all fairness, nobody has made a particularly educated case against anyone with that criteria (too late to save bwt, so X threw him under the bus). If someone did do that I would take that case into consideration. And considering the trend of the thread at the minute I think alot more cases and educated posts are about to crop up. I take full credit.

7.

BWT's voters are indiglo (5), Elohcin (10), Spacedaisy (11), Epignosis (15), AceofSpaces (17), nutella (28), LittleTiger (29), DFaraday (32). I'm not sure there was actually a point where BWT was unsaveable looking at the voters, DF was the final one and he broke the tie between BWT and Ace, guaranteeing that BWT would die. While that makes me think DF probably isn't BWT's teammate it doesn't seem to do much else unless I'm missing something obvious among those voters.

11

DF is probably not BWT's teammate, but let's look at the waves of voting. This wasn't one huge landslide of late voters (just three: nutella, LT and DF) but then there was a middle wave of voters all strung together too (Elo, Spacedaisy, Epi and Ace). I'm more interested in the proximity of those votes.

001.

[Bullzeye]

@SnowDog

Is there anything specific apart from Lizzy's Tank Engine win giving her confidence enough to goof off and get away with it that makes you think she is bad? I will admit she fooled me in Tank Engine but I am not seeing anything definitive so far in this game. Thank you for offering an explanation about your Aces comment btw.

8.

Honestly Lizzy's behaviour here compared to TTTE makes me think she might not be bad. In our btsc she was really careful about what she was saying, often checking with the rest of the team as to what was or wasn't a good idea and constantly trying to make sure people didn't find any hint of bad with her. I could be wrong, the win could have gone to her head and given her the confidence to completely change her style but from what I know bad Lizzy is way more careful than this Lizzy.

12

[AceofSpaces]

@DH

I didn't read it like that, but now that you have pointed that out I can see how it is possible. Snow Dog will just have to clear it up for me. I still find his persistence on Lizzy odd. I've yet to see any convincing reason to vote for Lizzy, other than, "she is acting weird".

Added: @Snow Dog

"Why not vote for AceofSpaces who was even more forthright than I?" is the bit where it specifically sounded like you were subtly suggesting people vote for me. But after you explained it, it makes more sense what you meant by that. One of the hard things about playing on forums is it is sometimes hard to pick up on peoples tone, so you can understand where my confusion came from there. Also, could you explain in more detail why you'd like to see Lizzy lynched?

5.

[DharmaHelper]

I have not currently considered that possibility, though in all fairness, nobody has made a particularly educated case against anyone with that criteria (too late to save bwt, so X threw him under the bus). If someone did do that I would take that case into consideration. And considering the trend of the thread at the minute I think alot more cases and educated posts are about to crop up. I take full credit.

7.

BWT's voters are indiglo (5), Elohcin (10), Spacedaisy (11), Epignosis (15), AceofSpaces (17), nutella (28), LittleTiger (29), DFaraday (32). I'm not sure there was actually a point where BWT was unsaveable looking at the voters, DF was the final one and he broke the tie between BWT and Ace, guaranteeing that BWT would die. While that makes me think DF probably isn't BWT's teammate it doesn't seem to do much else unless I'm missing something obvious among those voters.

11

DF is probably not BWT's teammate, but let's look at the waves of voting. This wasn't one huge landslide of late voters (just three: nutella, LT and DF) but then there was a middle wave of voters all strung together too (Elo, Spacedaisy, Epi and Ace). I'm more interested in the proximity of those votes.

001.

See what I found interesting, was not that, but rather that boo and Bullz, whom I pointed out are suspicious in their own individual ways, both voted for Aces on D2 and then llama on day 3. Their day 1 votes were for different people though. So in other words, I can see a scenario wherein Boo and Bullz vote for different people on Day 1 just to establish some distance, then vote for Aces D2 to try and help their teammate out of shit creek, then vote for llama together on D3 to slide into the easy vote and pull down some of Epig's cred.
9.

[Nevinera]

@Bullz I will concede that bea's fly by vote is suspicious and she has been incredibly aloof. Like I said in my megapost, her own posts are rather large but incredibly lacking in content. Is that a point you, or for that matter, anyone agrees with?

3.

I very much agree. She's been acting kind of that way the whole game - her response to the baddie-lynch rang a bit forced to me, and the timing of her vote on Aces was (as you said) very suspicious.

I intend to continue voting for her until I see something particularly convincing about anyone else - she and Bullz are the objective best bets (imo) based on vote timing.

1 (sigh)

linki DH: your Boo/Bullz scenario is compelling, I'll give it some thought also.

[DisgruntledPorcupine]

I have not currently considered that possibility, though in all fairness, nobody has made a particularly educated case against anyone with that criteria (too late to save bwt, so X threw him under the bus). If someone did do that I would take that case into consideration. And considering the trend of the thread at the minute I think alot more cases and educated posts are about to crop up. I take full credit.

7.

BWT's voters are indiglo (5), Elohcin (10), Spacedaisy (11), Epignosis (15), AceofSpaces (17), nutella (28), LittleTiger (29), DFaraday (32). I'm not sure there was actually a point where BWT was unsaveable looking at the voters, DF was the final one and he broke the tie between BWT and Ace, guaranteeing that BWT would die. While that makes me think DF probably isn't BWT's teammate it doesn't seem to do much else unless I'm missing something obvious among those voters.

11

DF is probably not BWT's teammate, but let's look at the waves of voting. This wasn't one huge landslide of late voters (just three: nutella, LT and DF) but then there was a middle wave of voters all strung together too (Elo, Spacedaisy, Epi and Ace). I'm more interested in the proximity of those votes.

001.

I'd look at early ones too. I think him defending BWT is a very easy thing to take advantage of and turn people against him with. The baddies realized that and hopped on him.

2

[DharmaHelper]

@Nev Yeah that's one thing I don't think I included in my big post that pinged me also. Bea's post seemed as you said, forced. In my mafia experience I've caught more than my fair share of baddies making such insincere posts. I will be interested to see bea's defense and her response now that she's further under the microscope.
10

[Mongoose]

@SnowDog

Is there anything specific apart from Lizzy's Tank Engine win giving her confidence enough to goof off and get away with it that makes you think she is bad? I will admit she fooled me in Tank Engine but I am not seeing anything definitive so far in this game. Thank you for offering an explanation about your Aces comment btw.

8.

Honestly Lizzy's behaviour here compared to TTTE makes me think she might not be bad. In our btsc she was really careful about what she was saying, often checking with the rest of the team as to what was or wasn't a good idea and constantly trying to make sure people didn't find any hint of bad with her. I could be wrong, the win could have gone to her head and given her the confidence to completely change her style but from what I know bad Lizzy is way more careful than this Lizzy.

12

She did say she was feeling bad, and I do believe her. If she is sick, she is not going to be running with all faculties. If it can impair your judgment to operate a motor vehicle, surely it would affect her mafia game. I'm not sure whether the difference in her playing style is really that big of a flag. At the current time, anyway.

002.

[Bullzeye]

@Bullz I will concede that bea's fly by vote is suspicious and she has been incredibly aloof. Like I said in my megapost, her own posts are rather large but incredibly lacking in content. Is that a point you, or for that matter, anyone agrees with?

3.

I very much agree. She's been acting kind of that way the whole game - her response to the baddie-lynch rang a bit forced to me, and the timing of her vote on Aces was (as you said) very suspicious.

I intend to continue voting for her until I see something particularly convincing about anyone else - she and Bullz are the objective best bets (imo) based on vote timing.

1 (sigh)

linki DH: your Boo/Bullz scenario is compelling, I'll give it some thought also.

What are you talking about re: timing of my vote? I don't think any of my votes have been badly timed. I'll grant you that my vote for Ace looks suspicious in hindsight, but I can't think what you could be referring to on the timing aspect.

13

[Nevinera]

Honestly Lizzy's behaviour here compared to TTTE makes me think she might not be bad. In our btsc she was really careful about what she was saying, often checking with the rest of the team as to what was or wasn't a good idea and constantly trying to make sure people didn't find any hint of bad with her. I could be wrong, the win could have gone to her head and given her the confidence to completely change her style but from what I know bad Lizzy is way more careful than this Lizzy.

12

I fully agree. She was kind of more absent in that game though - the carefulness may have been because she didn't have the time to pay full attention to the events in the thread.
Overall, her kind of antics aren't very effective at accomplishing any particular objectives, so I'm not going to worry about her for a while yet.

@Nev Yeah that's one thing I don't think I included in my big post that pinged me also. Bea's post seemed as you said, forced. In my mafia experience I've caught more than my fair share of baddies making such insincere posts. I will be interested to see bea's defense and her response now that she's further under the microscope.
10

I have committed that error myself, in my only baddie game, and Viper smacked the crap out of me for it :-)

2

[Mongoose]

@Bullz I will concede that bea's fly by vote is suspicious and she has been incredibly aloof. Like I said in my megapost, her own posts are rather large but incredibly lacking in content. Is that a point you, or for that matter, anyone agrees with?

3.

I very much agree. She's been acting kind of that way the whole game - her response to the baddie-lynch rang a bit forced to me, and the timing of her vote on Aces was (as you said) very suspicious.

I intend to continue voting for her until I see something particularly convincing about anyone else - she and Bullz are the objective best bets (imo) based on vote timing.

1 (sigh)

linki DH: your Boo/Bullz scenario is compelling, I'll give it some thought also.

What are you talking about re: timing of my vote? I don't think any of my votes have been badly timed. I'll grant you that my vote for Ace looks suspicious in hindsight, but I can't think what you could be referring to on the timing aspect.

13

Was there a particular reason you voted when you did? Perhaps you wanted to go ahead and get it over with so you wouldn't miss the deadline?

All in all, I think too much has already been said this game about early voting.

003.

[DharmaHelper]

Honestly Lizzy's behaviour here compared to TTTE makes me think she might not be bad. In our btsc she was really careful about what she was saying, often checking with the rest of the team as to what was or wasn't a good idea and constantly trying to make sure people didn't find any hint of bad with her. I could be wrong, the win could have gone to her head and given her the confidence to completely change her style but from what I know bad Lizzy is way more careful than this Lizzy.

12

I fully agree. She was kind of more absent in that game though - the carefulness may have been because she didn't have the time to pay full attention to the events in the thread.
Overall, her kind of antics aren't very effective at accomplishing any particular objectives, so I'm not going to worry about her for a while yet.

@Nev Yeah that's one thing I don't think I included in my big post that pinged me also. Bea's post seemed as you said, forced. In my mafia experience I've caught more than my fair share of baddies making such insincere posts. I will be interested to see bea's defense and her response now that she's further under the microscope.
10

I have committed that error myself, in my only baddie game, and Viper smacked the crap out of me for it :-)

2

In reference to Lizzy's state of mind and etc:

She is another player whose thoughts I will be most interested in after this lynch. I think as I said earlier that the game is starting to pick up in pace and activity, so whether or not she follows suit will be the deciding factor IMO. If she is in fact indisposed and or ill, I can see giving her a bit of the benefit of the doubt though. But really, recently there has been a huge dump of intel into the thread and everyone should at least touch on some of it.

You heard me. Touch the dump.

11.

[Bullzeye]

I fully agree. She was kind of more absent in that game though - the carefulness may have been because she didn't have the time to pay full attention to the events in the thread.
Overall, her kind of antics aren't very effective at accomplishing any particular objectives, so I'm not going to worry about her for a while yet.

This is true. I've not yet come to any definite conclusion about Lizzy but what I'm seeing doesn't remind me of how she was when we were an awesome baddie team together.

@Nev Yeah that's one thing I don't think I included in my big post that pinged me also. Bea's post seemed as you said, forced. In my mafia experience I've caught more than my fair share of baddies making such insincere posts. I will be interested to see bea's defense and her response now that she's further under the microscope.
10

I'm also looking forward to seeing what Bea has to say for herself. If an Aces voter has to be lynched at any point I'd say Boo or Bea are the way to go. Not that I have any personal bias of course.

14

Linki Mongoose - No specific reason, I just knew who I wanted to vote for so I cast my vote. I was expecting to be going out tonight so there was an element of not wanting to miss the poll as well.

[Mongoose]

I have not currently considered that possibility, though in all fairness, nobody has made a particularly educated case against anyone with that criteria (too late to save bwt, so X threw him under the bus). If someone did do that I would take that case into consideration. And considering the trend of the thread at the minute I think alot more cases and educated posts are about to crop up. I take full credit.

7.

BWT's voters are indiglo (5), Elohcin (10), Spacedaisy (11), Epignosis (15), AceofSpaces (17), nutella (28), LittleTiger (29), DFaraday (32). I'm not sure there was actually a point where BWT was unsaveable looking at the voters, DF was the final one and he broke the tie between BWT and Ace, guaranteeing that BWT would die. While that makes me think DF probably isn't BWT's teammate it doesn't seem to do much else unless I'm missing something obvious among those voters.

11

DF is probably not BWT's teammate, but let's look at the waves of voting. This wasn't one huge landslide of late voters (just three: nutella, LT and DF) but then there was a middle wave of voters all strung together too (Elo, Spacedaisy, Epi and Ace). I'm more interested in the proximity of those votes.

001.

I'd look at early ones too. I think him defending BWT is a very easy thing to take advantage of and turn people against him with. The baddies realized that and hopped on him.

2

Like sacrificing one baddie for the survival of all? I guess that seems plausible this early in the game. LT was already killed off out of those three, so are only left with two late voters.

004.

[indiglo]

~whew~ That was a lot of reading.

I agree with LA that a catch up can't be done in 12 minutes. (Especially after finishing mine, it felt like 3 hours!!!) So Boats may be a good place to have a little look see.

One of my other pings as of right now are (I hate to say it, and I'm apologizing ahead of time because you know I love you hard) bea. I do know that in many games (especially if she's working a lot) it can take a while to get your feet under you, I experience that as well. But so far there has really been so much wishy-washy posts and "I'm clueless" posts... that it doesn't sit completely well with me.

I thought the points made (by who, I sure cannot remember by now) about boo were interesting and worth looking into as well. So that is another ping I think is worth looking into.

Along with that I would like to look into Vomps a bit more, though now I feel more inclined to look at the other 2 first.

Also, as I read the alleged case against Llama, it did not read true to me. Now I know that's super easy to say after the fact, but Epi really seemed so laser-like and focused in his attack on Llama, and Llama remained calm and defended himself in a very civlike manner. Also Epi, for some of us, when we say "so-and-so reads civ to me" that's the quick way of saying we've noticed patterns of reliable, and logical behavior there. I personally do not choose to make long explanations about why someone may seem civ to me - because I don't like painting targets on civs. So sometimes, I might say something like "I don't think I'll be looking that way" or something similarly vague to express that I think someone is likely civ. (Now of course, that's susceptible to change as well, if it's a civ BTSC partner, for example - I will go down swinging hard in those cases as I'm sure everyone who's played much with me can attest to. )

Anyway, I know that Epi may look like an easy target now after having led the charge against Llama, but honestly something there isn't sitting well with me. I'm not placing Epi at the top of my list, but he's someone I want to keep an eye on and see what develops there.


That's about all my brain can handle for now!


Linki and such.

[DharmaHelper]

I fully agree. She was kind of more absent in that game though - the carefulness may have been because she didn't have the time to pay full attention to the events in the thread.
Overall, her kind of antics aren't very effective at accomplishing any particular objectives, so I'm not going to worry about her for a while yet.

This is true. I've not yet come to any definite conclusion about Lizzy but what I'm seeing doesn't remind me of how she was when we were an awesome baddie team together.

@Nev Yeah that's one thing I don't think I included in my big post that pinged me also. Bea's post seemed as you said, forced. In my mafia experience I've caught more than my fair share of baddies making such insincere posts. I will be interested to see bea's defense and her response now that she's further under the microscope.
10

I'm also looking forward to seeing what Bea has to say for herself. If an Aces voter has to be lynched at any point I'd say Boo or Bea are the way to go. Not that I have any personal bias of course.

14

Linki Mongoose - No specific reason, I just knew who I wanted to vote for so I cast my vote. I was expecting to be going out tonight so there was an element of not wanting to miss the poll as well.

Speaking of folks that need to speak up for themselves, I have noticed boo lingering about for a bit now. I would love to hear from him as well. His D1 vote for Aces is actually a point in his favor, as civvie boo is someone I could see sticking to his guns for the d2 vote... but that is of course just one possibility out of many.

12.

[Tangrowth]

DAY 3

Who slaughtered juliets and LittleTiger?

Poll ended at Tue Jun 25, 2013 5:49 pm


AceofSpaces
0
No votes

Ajira
0
No votes

bea
2
Nevinera (4), Lizzy (17) 7%

BoatsBoatsBoats
1
BoatsBoatsBoats (28) 3%

boo
0
No votes

Boomslang
0
No votes

Bullzeye
3
DharmaHelper (22), AceofSpaces (26), bea (27) 10%

Devin the Omniscient
0
No votes

DFaraday
0
No votes

DharmaHelper
0
No votes

DisgruntledPorcupine
0
No votes

Dom
0
No votes

Elohcin
0
No votes

Epignosis
0
No votes


Flyin' High
0
No votes

G.O.B.
0
No votes

Hedgeowl
0
No votes

indiglo
0
No votes

insertnamehere
0
No votes

Lizzy
7
Russtifinko (8), Mongoose (11), Hedgeowl (14), Snow Dog (19), thellama73 (21), DisgruntledPorcupine (25), nutella (29) 24%

Matahari
0
No votes

Mongoose
0
No votes

Nevinera
0
No votes

nutella
0
No votes

Russtifinko
0
No votes

Snow Dog
0
No votes

Spacedaisy
0
No votes

>SpaghettiEverywhere
0
No votes

thellama73
12
Epignosis (2), G.O.B. (3), boo (5), insertnamehere (6), Zany Dex (7), Ajira (9), Bullzeye (10), Devin the Omniscient (12), Matahari (15), Flyin'
High (18), Elohcin (23), Dom (24) 41%

Vompatti
0
No votes

Zany Dex
3
Vompatti (13), Boomslang (16), >SpaghettiEverywhere (20) 10%

Those terrible Big Daddies, of course! (dead, non-player, host)
1
MovingPictures07 (1) 3%
Total votes : 29

Missed the vote: DFaraday, indiglo, Spacedaisy

[Mongoose]

I fully agree. She was kind of more absent in that game though - the carefulness may have been because she didn't have the time to pay full attention to the events in the thread.
Overall, her kind of antics aren't very effective at accomplishing any particular objectives, so I'm not going to worry about her for a while yet.

This is true. I've not yet come to any definite conclusion about Lizzy but what I'm seeing doesn't remind me of how she was when we were an awesome baddie team together.

@Nev Yeah that's one thing I don't think I included in my big post that pinged me also. Bea's post seemed as you said, forced. In my mafia experience I've caught more than my fair share of baddies making such insincere posts. I will be interested to see bea's defense and her response now that she's further under the microscope.
10

I'm also looking forward to seeing what Bea has to say for herself. If an Aces voter has to be lynched at any point I'd say Boo or Bea are the way to go. Not that I have any personal bias of course.

14

Linki Mongoose - No specific reason, I just knew who I wanted to vote for so I cast my vote. I was expecting to be going out tonight so there was an element of not wanting to miss the poll as well.

That sounds pretty reasonable to me. You sound like you weren't vacillating on your vote at all. Llama really suspected bea; I know a lot of us didn't give credence to it at the time, but I think it's worth a look.

005.

[Mongoose]

Honestly Lizzy's behaviour here compared to TTTE makes me think she might not be bad. In our btsc she was really careful about what she was saying, often checking with the rest of the team as to what was or wasn't a good idea and constantly trying to make sure people didn't find any hint of bad with her. I could be wrong, the win could have gone to her head and given her the confidence to completely change her style but from what I know bad Lizzy is way more careful than this Lizzy.

12

I fully agree. She was kind of more absent in that game though - the carefulness may have been because she didn't have the time to pay full attention to the events in the thread.
Overall, her kind of antics aren't very effective at accomplishing any particular objectives, so I'm not going to worry about her for a while yet.

@Nev Yeah that's one thing I don't think I included in my big post that pinged me also. Bea's post seemed as you said, forced. In my mafia experience I've caught more than my fair share of baddies making such insincere posts. I will be interested to see bea's defense and her response now that she's further under the microscope.
10

I have committed that error myself, in my only baddie game, and Viper smacked the crap out of me for it :-)

2

In reference to Lizzy's state of mind and etc:

She is another player whose thoughts I will be most interested in after this lynch. I think as I said earlier that the game is starting to pick up in pace and activity, so whether or not she follows suit will be the deciding factor IMO. If she is in fact indisposed and or ill, I can see giving her a bit of the benefit of the doubt though. But really, recently there has been a huge dump of intel into the thread and everyone should at least touch on some of it.

You heard me. Touch the dump.

11.

Yeah, I am looking for some of our more silent players to really step up and synthesize the material. Not just say something here or there or say they agree with so and so. I know a lot is going on and lot of us are going to have the same ideas, but I'm hoping they will give us unique input.

006.