Mafia Championship Scrimmage [END]

[sig]

OOOOOKAY SO I'm not CFDing onto Soneji, I'm agaisnt CFDs and wouldn't mind seeing a IWAY lynch today.

I've reviewed him, golden, and Sloonie/Matt. I'd be fine with a IWAY or a Matt lynch today. I think we would get more information from an IWAY lynch. He had a full 36 hours to make posts, and he was in the hot seat, plus this took place over the entire day and not a last minute push away from another wagon. I still think MM and Ika are mafia.

I'd rather we lynch Mm over IWAY but if there is no chance of that I'm fine and would switch to IWAY. Regardless of how IWAY flips though we should lynch MM tomorrow.

[sig]

I missed kissing?

You've got a wife no kissing for you. (Besides I don't want a smelly ole sock to kiss me better) :P

Shhhhhhhh.

How dare you? I use fabric softener.

Hmmm I see econ brand or name brand.

And I guess if like ya know youmakemeasiteadmin I'll let you kiss me.

My knucklesssss are bleeding




Dizzzy I wanna cash in on my kiss now, make me feel better.

[Dyslexicon]

OOOOOKAY SO I'm not CFDing onto Soneji, I'm agaisnt CFDs and wouldn't mind seeing a IWAY lynch today.

I've reviewed him, golden, and Sloonie/Matt. I'd be fine with a IWAY or a Matt lynch today. I think we would get more information from an IWAY lynch. He had a full 36 hours to make posts, and he was in the hot seat, plus this took place over the entire day and not a last minute push away from another wagon. I still think MM and Ika are mafia.

I'd rather we lynch Mm over IWAY but if there is no chance of that I'm fine and would switch to IWAY. Regardless of how IWAY flips though we should lynch MM tomorrow.

I was just about to write: CFD on Soneji!

VOTE SONEJI

[Tangrowth]

If you want to take me to task for a mistake - Frog was the mistake. Not Silverwolf.

And I know you're no scrub yourself. But, you know, you won't catch any implication from me that you are anything less than stellar. I think everyone in this game that I know or who I've come to know in playing this game is basically stellar. This is a next level lineup.

QFT

This lineup is awesome.

[sig]

Oh never mind there is only one vote on MM, I thought we had 3.

VOTE INAWORDYES

linki: Sorry Dizzy I hate CFDs :P

I'm going with IWAY tonight, if we are in a set up with a vig I suggest they shoot MM if not lets lynch him tomorrow.

[Tangrowth]

Morning (to those of you even remotely in a similar time zone as me), folks! Afternoon/evening/whatever to the rest of you all.

This post is entirely with regards to my schedule. If you don't care about when I'll be here, skip it.

I've been even busier this morning than anticipated, so site time will inevitably have to wait until either (1) I get home tonight probably around 6:00PM Central (giving me T minus 3 hours until EoD) or (2) sometime in between meetings and such while I'm studying assuming I get bored and can actually justify taking a long break from studying. I'd say don't count on (2), but I know how I am, so it may still happen.

Apologies for the inconvenience! I'll be sure to answer whatever questions and provide input into whatever was posted last night/today as soon as I can.

Also, I wanted to show off my new sockish avatar as a tribute to Phife Dawg (RIP) to complement what I had in my signature; this is even much better.

I thought it was a Butterfly.

That's cool, but... not near as cool as what it actually is.

[Tangrowth]

Oops, that should have been OT green. Actually, a handful of my recent posts should have been. Don't mind me. I've had a long day.

[Golden]

Oh never mind there is only one vote on MM, I thought we had 3.

VOTE INAWORDYES

linki: Sorry Dizzy I hate CFDs :P

I'm going with IWAY tonight, if we are in a set up with a vig I suggest they shoot MM if not lets lynch him tomorrow.

I think town vig would be better off taking out an enigma such as Psi or Wilgy, than someone who is participating and who we can talk about. Just my perspective. Of course, that person should always feel free to go with their gut anyway.

[Golden]

Oops, that should have been OT green. Actually, a handful of my recent posts should have been. Don't mind me. I've had a long day.

All days are the same length.

[Tangrowth]

Oh never mind there is only one vote on MM, I thought we had 3.

VOTE INAWORDYES

linki: Sorry Dizzy I hate CFDs :P

I'm going with IWAY tonight, if we are in a set up with a vig I suggest they shoot MM if not lets lynch him tomorrow.

I think town vig would be better off taking out an enigma such as Psi or Wilgy, than someone who is participating and who we can talk about. Just my perspective. Of course, that person should always feel free to go with their gut anyway.

Agreed.

[Tangrowth]

Oops, that should have been OT green. Actually, a handful of my recent posts should have been. Don't mind me. I've had a long day.

All days are the same length.

Touche.

[Marco]

@MP, I'm not planning on voting golden this phase, but I do want your thoughts on that golden post. You can do so next phase as per your convenience.

Also, how long before phase ends. At this point, I'm back to my lynch candidates of yesterday, IAWY and MM.

Feelings on Wilgy generally?

He's been at the bottom of my rainbow list since day 1. But his semi apathy towards this game and zebra's TR on him make me feel better about him. That said, if I was a Vigilante, I would probably kill him. I'm just not inclined to use up a Lynch on him until some post scum-flip associations become clear.

[sig]

oh and one more point agaisnt IWAY he voted for Wilgy and I didn't like that vote or the reasoning for it. I also don't like how Matt jumped from the MM wagon onto that. I could see a MAtt/MM team.

Current mafia team thoughts.
Ika
MM
Matt
??? Maybe IWAY
IF IWAY is mafia
IWAY
MM/Matt
Ika
Zebra/matt

I normally wouldn't do this, but with no night posting I want to get my thoughts out in case I die. Also if we have a jailkeeper/doctor pleaseeeee protect me.

linki: Fine. But, I want him strung up!

[Tangrowth]

Spoiler: show

Caught up. Sorting my thoughts:

Ika: Your point about MP and Sig having TMI is really bad imo. Neither strikes me as players that would make that kind of mistake, why are you not taking this into account? In what world does it make sense for you for scum!MP who is on a team with a mafia vig to come out and start the day with "oh, must be mafia vig then"? If that was me I would sure as hell avoid doing exactly that and be super aware that I shouldn't be supposed to know what the extra kill meant, and I'm pretty sure this applies to MP too.

Furthermare both MP and Sig have accounted for what made them think as they did. Your attempt to play this off as TMI looks like an excuse to scumread someone and have something to argue, and I think you're smarter than that.

Question: Why did you say people had said this play by IAWY was his scum meta? Noone said that iirc.
What is your read on IAWY now?
What if there actually is a town vig in the setup?

---

Thoughts on IAWY: Is this guy trying to come off as scum? Seriously, there's so much that makes me go nooooo reading his posts. The point about MP giving reads on his ISOs is just so random to me. He accounted for that when he did it, it's all explained there. It's not very hard to understand. The cop redcheck comment is just wtf. His vote on Golden looks random to me as well, he says it's because he wants to dig into his null reads, and then he completely disappears. Is he even trying? I feel like he's not reading the posts in the game either. It's almost a too scummy to be scum situation to me here. Would lynch in a heartbeat.

---

Marco: I don't know if it helps or what you are looking for, but for me I can fully see Golden's perspective regarding Frog, cause I pretty much shared it. Factoring into why I was fine lynching Frog was that he seemed to had stopped being productive (imo) and just came in and stated town should do such and such, this is the correct way etc etc, which didn't seem productive to me, and possible obstructive even - so that couple with the doubt is pretty much why I was fine lynching him over IAWY who hadn't said anything of value. Call it an error, lol.

I do see where you are coming from with your questions around Silver. I too thought Silver came across very towny, and had no problem with her intital MP vote. However, I can see town!Golden having a different view on this. It is also very different being the one in a two-way discussion like that and being someone watching it. I don't feel Silver was particularly easy to work with either if Golden is indeed town, and I think that might have intensified the situation. Your conversation about it and you calling it an "error" is just a matter of perspective and playstyle as I see it, and not very relevant. You see it as an error cause the "correct thing" is to go for scum and not town. Golden sees it as the "correct thing" because the right way to play is engaging with people to get reads, even if you are objectively wrong sometimes.

I feel Golden comes across as town in his conversation with Zebra and after. It all reads genuine to me. I don't know what else to say, but I can follow it as a town mindset. There is doubt in my mind, of course. I especially am puzzled by how Golden seems to avoid IAWY and not really giving a hard stance on him. It weirds me out a bit, but overall I think Golden is more likely town.

---

Marmot is coming across more scummy for me for lighting fire under the MP suspicion without really owning it. Does he really believe that MP and/or Sig TMI'd? (See my response to Ika). He also furthered IAWY's "point" about MP giving slight leans on content he found mostly null. It's such a non-point to me, cause MP accounted for this and the whole point was obviously to try and get some kind of read on the lurkers.

---

Regarding Soneji I still take issure with his Sig read and how he doesn't seem to consider the motivation that Sig would have in trying to get him lynched. Furthermore I feel like Sig is not the type of person who would try to strongarm a Soneji lynch at EOD if he was indeed scum, and it also seems highly unlikely to me that Soneji really would be a lynch at that point when he finally had started contributing. In my mind there was no way Soneji would've been lynched at that point.

I want something else from Soneji, thoughts on other people etc.

Wow, I've officially found my brain twin.

[Marmot]

I'm eager to vote for Zebra now for trying to dare me into voting Wilgy as I said I might. Hrm.

I dare you to vote her.

So many cats! Keep 'em coming.

I don't have a read on anyone, 'cept Wilgy, who Zebra doesn't want to lynch yet dared me to lynch him.

I didn't dare you to lynch him, I dared you to vote for him. The reason I did that was because I didn't know that you were one of the ones currently voting for MM at the time before, and so my plan was that when you voted DrWilgy giving him three votes, I would switch my vote to MM giving him three votes as well, making the two leading wagons between Wilgy and MM. Hence me referring to myself as an idiot when I realized that my plan wasn't going to work when MM suddenly had only one vote when you switched.

I don't appreciate this plot to put me in a tie.

IAWY asked about your reads and why you read everything as null, but still came up with mafia reads. This was just my research on the topic. I discovered you were ignoring null reads, which is why IAWY noticed this trend.

I don't disagree with this tactic from you. This is just an observation. But I do want to know why you chose to ignore null when giving your stamp of approval.

Because I wanted to force myself to judge the content and give an opinion. I didn't want null reads.

Alright.

I have to remind myself it was Day 1 as well. Do you have time before EoD to progress those reads? A new rainbow list will be fine, and I'll be posting one too.

You don't read my posts, do you?

I tried.

OOOOOKAY SO I'm not CFDing onto Soneji, I'm agaisnt CFDs and wouldn't mind seeing a IWAY lynch today.

I've reviewed him, golden, and Sloonie/Matt. I'd be fine with a IWAY or a Matt lynch today. I think we would get more information from an IWAY lynch. He had a full 36 hours to make posts, and he was in the hot seat, plus this took place over the entire day and not a last minute push away from another wagon. I still think MM and Ika are mafia.

I'd rather we lynch Mm over IWAY but if there is no chance of that I'm fine and would switch to IWAY. Regardless of how IWAY flips though we should lynch MM tomorrow.

What do you think we will gain from IWAY's lynch, regarding either flip possibility?

[Tangrowth]

Either way vote for Ika he is such obvious mafia and I bet he killed Silver since she can read him, which is what I've been saying for awhile. Then we lynch MM two scum down.

If ika and I are both surely scum, why not leave your vote on me to keep me at 2 votes instead of putting each ika and I at 1 vote?

Oh that's a good point, but Ika is annoying me and you aren't so I wanna see him hang more right now. However, I'd be more then willing to switch to you before EOD.

You remind me of Matt in the GoC, and that guy was scum through and through.

Can you elaborate on this?

[Matt]

Before a third person connects me and IAWY, I'd just like to say...

Nice to meet you, IAWY. Sorry you're about to get lynched apparently, while Wilgy is free to roam the town while killing us in our sleep

[Tangrowth]

MM, I will indeed be posting a new rainbow list.

[Tangrowth]

Why so many votes on Golden and Sloonei, and so few on IAWY and Ika?

I must have missed certain vote tallies. What was the tally at the time of this post, anyone know?

[Golden]

Before a third person connects me and IAWY, I'd just like to say...

Nice to meet you, IAWY. Sorry you're about to get lynched apparently, while Wilgy is free to roam the town while killing us in our sleep

I'm still considering a Wilgy lynch. My flip was to stop IAWY from vanishing from the lynch pool entirely, as it sounded like some people were angling for that.

[Dyslexicon]

Why so many votes on Golden and Sloonei, and so few on IAWY and Ika?

I must have missed certain vote tallies. What was the tally at the time of this post, anyone know?

Don't remember. I think 2 for Golden, Sloonei and 1 for IAWY.

[Dyslexicon]

Before a third person connects me and IAWY, I'd just like to say...

Nice to meet you, IAWY. Sorry you're about to get lynched apparently, while Wilgy is free to roam the town while killing us in our sleep

I'm still considering a Wilgy lynch. My flip was to stop IAWY from vanishing from the lynch pool entirely, as it sounded like some people were angling for that.

I feel there's a lot of angling around IAWY. Which makes me uncomfortable.

[Tangrowth]

Does anyone have any reads on Matt (versus Sloonei)'s behavior so far?

[sig]

If IWAY flips civ I think we know the push on him yesterday was done to save a mafia member, so I'd look into those who started the CFD and then went after me for not wanting to.

If he does flip mafia I'd say those who have done soft defense of him are mafia, as well as one of the people who pushed him day 1 (probably Ika) Also maybe those trying to push the lynch in different directions today. I think yesterday MM was hesitant to vote for IWAY and instead we saw a push on Frog, if IWAY does flip mafia I think those who pushed Frog could be mafia. I think MM didn't vvote for IWAY right away since we had two scum members yesterday not just one. (Kind off like Turf War)

[Tangrowth]

Where's Zebra, I wanna talk to Zeebs.

Zeebs Zeebs Zeebs

What do you think of the good doctor?

Why zebra? Are you town reading her?

[Marco]

I want to test my initial suspicions from day 1. It'll be hard to convince me to vote for anyone but MM OR IAWY.

[Tangrowth]

What're the thoughts on golden's reveal that he noticed MM hinting MP was PR day 1. And he scum read MM even though scum didn't attack MP last night.

Good question, I hadn't given this any thought. What do you think of it? You're more familiar with these setups.

[Golden]

VOTE DRWILGY

[Tangrowth]

What're the thoughts on golden's reveal that he noticed MM hinting MP was PR day 1. And he scum read MM even though scum didn't attack MP last night.

Golden acknowledged that all the events relevant to this topic happened on Day 2. If he is scum, he couldn't have gone into Night 1 with this knowledge.

Oh, nevermind (?) then.

[Golden]

I'm comfortable with either of these two going, and I want to see who breaks the tie and how.

[Golden]

Is deadline one hour?

[Dyslexicon]

Oh look, a 3 way tie!

VOTE GOLDEN

[Marco]

Wow, the MM wagon just disappeared.

VOTE INAWORDYES

[Tangrowth]

Ahhh, I really need to finish catching up. I'm getting tired though. Coffee time?

[Marmot]

Either way vote for Ika he is such obvious mafia and I bet he killed Silver since she can read him, which is what I've been saying for awhile. Then we lynch MM two scum down.

If ika and I are both surely scum, why not leave your vote on me to keep me at 2 votes instead of putting each ika and I at 1 vote?

Oh that's a good point, but Ika is annoying me and you aren't so I wanna see him hang more right now. However, I'd be more then willing to switch to you before EOD.

You remind me of Matt in the GoC, and that guy was scum through and through.

Can you elaborate on this?

In the GoC, I was an Independent role (Ryuk from Death Note) and had an alternate win condition to get lynched on Day 1. I made an intentional scumslip to try and get lynched, and did several other things on Day 1 to support my lynchability. Matt called me out for it, but rode this suspicion until Day 9 or 10 when I was finally able to prove I actually wasn't scum. He followed this despite me acknowledging my intentions. Matt was mafia in that game.

Sig suspected me on Day 1 for one thing, and has been spinning my actions since that time. I think he is intentionally tunneling since I was a strong lynch candidate on Day 1.

I do want others' opinions on this because I do realize my view of this issue might be skewed.

[Golden]

Wow, the MM wagon just disappeared.

VOTE INAWORDYES

It hasn't been around for a while.

[Golden]

Oh look, a 3 way tie!

VOTE GOLDEN

In that case

VOTE INAWORDYES

I don't want a tie THAT much.

[Marmot]

I'm in for the doctor.

VOTE DRWILGY

[Marco]

If Wilgy is lynched and flips town, what leads are we looking at? I feel like his flip will give us the least information.

[Golden]

Oops, I take make that last vote

VOTE DRWILGY

Didn't realise the tie was already broken.

[Golden]

If Wilgy is lynched and flips town, what leads are we looking at? I feel like his flip will give us the least information.

You seem focussed very much on the information we get 'if someone flips town'.

Yesterday, it was about it being three vs two.

This time, if its a two way battle between IAWY and Wilgy and the loser flips town, why would we get less information from Wilgy's townflip than IAWY's townflip?

[Dyslexicon]

CFD Zexy?

[Tangrowth]

i dont care about doing isos. frog said onething and hes doing the opposite of that yes?

i also never said it excused me. its jsut who i am

So you agree with my point of view that suspecting MP and Sig for assuming the kill was a scum vig doesn't make sense? Do you really se MP being that careless as to make it his first thing to mention? I find that hard to believe.

no i disagree entirely. i can see any scum player doing such thing.

in turf i let out intentional knowlgage that sloonie was a don based on the failed arrest trying to get him killed, people then went on to suspect me for it. i have seen scums slip over even sillier things.

i have seen people litarly go "this is my second scum game"

so yes i think tey are scum for that slip

You are not me.

Those people are not me.

[Tangrowth]

Where is Psi? I don't remember him posting at all today, if he has his posts have just been super unmemorable. That doesn't make for a good vote though, so let's go with the one who seems like a Beetlejuicing active lurker.

VOTE DRWILGY

You seem to show up when someone mentions your name but disappear otherwise. Can you give me any reason to think you're town for this kind of behavior? Can you give me a hottake on your reads at the moment?

Yeah ctrl F is a great tool. Idk, it's not alignment indicative as far as I'm concerned.

Golden is bad. Sloonei, MM, MP might be team?

I already asked, but why me and why those players?

[Tangrowth]

Spoiler: show

Conspiracy theory over analyzing activated:

Ignore the parts about Silverwolf and Long Con/Epignosis, I guess.

More later...

So Zexy says this after his catch up, implying that he wasn't aware of who had died yet. This would implicate that he is town.

However in the catch up I find examples that he uses present tense when he's talking about people alive - here's some examples:

Dizzy trying to push the zebra wagon after it deflated is weird. Unless he is scum with the top wagon of the time (MM) I don’t understand why scum would do that…

Actually, I said that I’ll ISO Wilgy but MP already did it for me. I agree that there is something scummish about him, also I don’t know Wilgy meta as much as MP does so I’ll trust him. Actually, were it not for Wilgy quirky meta, I would get a bigger scumread than what I currently have.

But past tense when he is talking about Epig:

Epignosis’ reason for voting Frog was bad. It was a very “easy” vote, they didn’t really analyze anything to get to that, just “I saw that single thing from a player with ~100 posts and it is scummy so here’s my vote”. I’ll excuse it since they only subbed in late in the phase, but it is not the kind of thought process I’d like to see anymore…
At 37 as of now.

He isn't talking about Silver by herself it seems.


What do you all think about this? Too detailed and paranoid? Or legit suspicion?
Had to point it out cause it's bugging my brain.

Too much WIFOM for me to feel comfortable getting anything out of it, I'd say.

[Golden]

It hasn't escaped my attention that, as a rule, I trust the people on the IAWY wagon a lot more than I trust the ones on the Wilgy wagon

[Tangrowth]

Stop it, you're hurting my town read of Zexy.

I may have done something else stupid as well, but I don't care cause yolo. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

I don't understand why people have him as a townread in general. He was active at the start, did some questioning, but not many conclusive thoughts. All null imo. And then he writes a catch up now and then and doesn't follow up for the longest time. Such skating wow.

I can't read him at all. I definitely would say "slight mafia" accurately represents how I feel about him. I hope he comes back soon.

[JaggedJimmyJay]

Day 2 ends in 45 minutes. I won't be at home so the end of night post will be boring.

[Marmot]

Based on the possible setups in play, we have a 44% chance that the civilians get a vig kill tonight, and an 11% chance that mafia still has one to use. But as we talked about already, in addition to the low odds that a civ vig made a kill last night, it doesn't make sense for a civilian to target Epignosis or Silverwolf.

Hence, if more than one person dies to night, I'd be ready to assume that one was done by a civilian.

[Marmot]

Day 2 ends in 45 minutes. I won't be at home so the end of night post will be boring.

I think you mean the end of day post.