Psych Mafia [END]

[Epignosis]

Also, you don't give another explanation for why every name was alpha except for one? How did INH's name end up being the only one not listed in order?

When stuff like this is what people focus on, this is what happens.

What should people be focusing on? You didn't chime in until exactly forty minutes before the deadline.

[Quin]

I should be disappointed, but this was good timing. I got one of my wisdom tooth out this morning and I'm too busy ...recovering (let's put it delicately) to really be invested in this game.

This was a very fun game though, thanks for hosting guys!!

[Epignosis]

Ugh. That was frustrating. An allignment checker who defends mafia and accuses civs. Sigh. Moving on.

The opposite almost detailed Downton Abbey. People with information were suspecting people they had no information on, and almost got me killed.

[Epignosis]

Ugh. That was frustrating. An allignment checker who defends mafia and accuses civs. Sigh. Moving on.

The opposite almost detailed Downton Abbey. People with information were suspecting people they had no information on, and almost got me killed.

That should said "derailed."

[timmer]

Sorry Russ, but if the criteria for civ game is "doesn't change his mind" then you will be voting me forever, I'd say. I admit freely to changing my views on people in this game. .. because that's what you do when someone presents a good case?

Considering that mm voted for Sig, I'd think that my choosing not to vote for him yesterday would be seen in a good light, not a bad one.

And as for alphabetical order, you're right, it isn't something a baddie would deliberately do. It's also not something a civ would do. It looks like an absentminded mistake. But it's the kind of mistake more likely to be made by a baddie, imo.

It's one thing to chance your mind. It's another to do complete 180s on two different players just because Epi said so, and supplementing it with SUUUUUPER weak reasoning. You threw two of your top reads in the garbage instantaneously! This is meant as a compliment - I expect way better from civ timmer.

The bolded sentence makes absolutely 0 sense whatsoever. Your vote for Wilgy is one of the most damning things you've done! You said all along you suspected sig, but you refused to vote for him because that would cause a tie and make it possible for MM to be lynched. You stated this explicitly in your post. MM turned out to be bad. Instead, you voted Wilgy, whom you had only brought up once 2 days before that - and the time you brought Wilgy up, you were defending Dom/MM from him. Dom/MM, once again, was bad. I literally cannot make myself clearer on this point.

In what topsy-turvy universe is your Wilgy vote and justification for it yesterday anything but horrible?

Again, four people voted for Wilgy, what do you think of the others?

[Epignosis]

Ugh. That was frustrating. An allignment checker who defends mafia and accuses civs. Sigh. Moving on.

The opposite almost detailed Downton Abbey. People with information were suspecting people they had no information on, and almost got me killed.

That should said "derailed."

I swear somebody has to be fucking with my posts.

[Tangrowth]

Effective immediately, Scotty 2.0 is replacing rabbit8.

[BigDamnHero]

well dont that just suck baseballs....

So I'm thinking either Shawn is really horrible at the ying/yang riddles (apologies if they are just REALLY that difficut) or else he may be as inactive as the inept cops also seem to be...

[Russtifinko]

Sorry Russ, but if the criteria for civ game is "doesn't change his mind" then you will be voting me forever, I'd say. I admit freely to changing my views on people in this game. .. because that's what you do when someone presents a good case?

Considering that mm voted for Sig, I'd think that my choosing not to vote for him yesterday would be seen in a good light, not a bad one.

And as for alphabetical order, you're right, it isn't something a baddie would deliberately do. It's also not something a civ would do. It looks like an absentminded mistake. But it's the kind of mistake more likely to be made by a baddie, imo.

It's one thing to chance your mind. It's another to do complete 180s on two different players just because Epi said so, and supplementing it with SUUUUUPER weak reasoning. You threw two of your top reads in the garbage instantaneously! This is meant as a compliment - I expect way better from civ timmer.

The bolded sentence makes absolutely 0 sense whatsoever. Your vote for Wilgy is one of the most damning things you've done! You said all along you suspected sig, but you refused to vote for him because that would cause a tie and make it possible for MM to be lynched. You stated this explicitly in your post. MM turned out to be bad. Instead, you voted Wilgy, whom you had only brought up once 2 days before that - and the time you brought Wilgy up, you were defending Dom/MM from him. Dom/MM, once again, was bad. I literally cannot make myself clearer on this point.

In what topsy-turvy universe is your Wilgy vote and justification for it yesterday anything but horrible?

Again, four people voted for Wilgy, what do you think of the others?

I think their votes are better justified than yours. How is "other people did it too" a defense?

I'll be honest - I probably was going to continue to suspect you regardless of how you responded to my case, because the case itself struck me so hard. But your reponses are doing even less to change my opinion than I imagined they would.

[Elohcin]

I don't even know what to say other than...it is so difficult to find the baddies this game. I mean, there has got to be so much going on behind the scenes with this game in secrets and what not b/c I'm lost. Maybe I should start by listing those I think I can trust...

hmm...I feel like I can trust BDH and Epi (and myself of course :P). But I am unsure about everyone else. That's pretty bad for Phase 5. I feel like that list should be longer.

[Scotty]

hey everybody!

Got a lot on my plate today, and entering in a night phase, so I'll try to make the best of it.

Haven't looked at my new role yet
Jk I'm good.

Be back with some reads

[Scotty]

Well for one thing, my new top suspicions are LoRab and Epi.

Epi is one person who I've been going back and forth on- for one, I agreed with his views on INH. For two, he's actually been the most vocal civ in the last phase, and when everyone started piling on Sokoth, it was pretty clear from an outside perspective that Sokoth was definitely a mislynch. Trust me, I was screaming. INH's voting pattern is pretty shit. But then again, so is Epi's. Why include Sokoth in talks with INH? I think INH looked much more damning, and if LoRab were to be bad, your choice to put the hammer down on Sokoth looks like someone that chose to vote there when a baddie teammate LoRab nervously exclaimed in the chat "Sokoth is onto me, let's take him down". This one is reaching possibly, but that's a scenario I want to look at the next day.

BUT

The big elephant in the room is that Sokoth- the role checker- had only one suspicion: LoRab. As soon as he flips, LoRab is quick to shoot that down:

Ugh. That was frustrating. An allignment checker who defends mafia and accuses civs. Sigh. Moving on.

Also, you don't give another explanation for why every name was alpha except for one? How did INH's name end up being the only one not listed in order?

When stuff like this is what people focus on, this is what happens.

I'm not focusing on it--but it's a question that I had and was never answered. It was not my reasoning for suspecting the Klingon, that was based on his behavior, which presented as suspicious. But being wrong about 1 player does not negate noticing small things and breaks in patterns. It also doesn't clear you from suspicion.

He hardly defended Dom. But he definitely made clear that he suspected you. Why you, of all people? The case seemed flimsy because it was. Hell, I didn't believe it either. How could he suspect you for seeming off, and not rabbit (me) or timmer? They were my primary suspects before subbing in. Timmer could still be bad, but I'm more suspicious of the info we have.

The info is there.
Guess who voted LoRab on Day 3 without a seeming reason?
Quin.
Guess what Quin got to do?
Send a role check to Sokoth on anyone that voted for a lynched civ. Guess who did that?
LoRab.

I think Quin was deliberately expressing who he was checking every night. Sokoth got a red check on LoRab, and didn't know how to say it without dumping info in the thread (such is the case with these types of games).

I will be certainly voting for LoRab tomorrow regardless of what she has to say. There's always the off chance that Sokoth is giving a blind sus of someone after getting civ reads but nahhhhh

[timmer]

I think their votes are better justified than yours. How is "other people did it too" a defense?

I'll be honest - I probably was going to continue to suspect you regardless of how you responded to my case, because the case itself struck me so hard. But your reponses are doing even less to change my opinion than I imagined they would.

How about you compare your blinkered thinking on me with what Scotty just threw down on LoRab? Because that's a great reentry into the game. Your thoughts on me, on the other hand, are completely ignoring the fact that civs make bad calls all of the time. I've followed the cases I thought were best and voted accordingly.

[Scotty]

I think their votes are better justified than yours. How is "other people did it too" a defense?

I'll be honest - I probably was going to continue to suspect you regardless of how you responded to my case, because the case itself struck me so hard. But your reponses are doing even less to change my opinion than I imagined they would.

How about you compare your blinkered thinking on me with what Scotty just threw down on LoRab? Because that's a great reentry into the game. Your thoughts on me, on the other hand, are completely ignoring the fact that civs make bad calls all of the time. I've followed the cases I thought were best and voted accordingly.

Uhh thanks.

Is this you agreeing with my case? Or just that I painted some pretty clouds in my landscape drawing?

[timmer]

I need to double check that you've got your info right about the roles etc later when I'm not working, but yes, that is me saying that you seem to be onto something. Sometimes the greatest help a civ with an info role can provide comes only after their death, when they can be seen pointing a dead, bony finger at the culprit.

[Epignosis]

Well for one thing, my new top suspicions are LoRab and Epi.

Epi is one person who I've been going back and forth on- for one, I agreed with his views on INH. For two, he's actually been the most vocal civ in the last phase, and when everyone started piling on Sokoth, it was pretty clear from an outside perspective that Sokoth was definitely a mislynch. Trust me, I was screaming. INH's voting pattern is pretty shit. But then again, so is Epi's. Why include Sokoth in talks with INH? I think INH looked much more damning, and if LoRab were to be bad, your choice to put the hammer down on Sokoth looks like someone that chose to vote there when a baddie teammate LoRab nervously exclaimed in the chat "Sokoth is onto me, let's take him down". This one is reaching possibly, but that's a scenario I want to look at the next day.

Do you suspect me or am I a civilian?

Whoopsadoodle.

INH's voting pattern is pretty shit. But then again, so is Epi's.

Tell me who does have good voting record. I'll wait.

Better yet, I'll go grab the only meaningful data regarding the voting records of living people for you:

Metalmarsh89
3
Quin (7), DFaraday (8), LoRab (10) 23%

That's it. What do you make of it?

[LoRab]

I'm not bad. Other than circumstantial evidence, what makes me suspicious?

And my post after the lynch was more that in his defense of Dom (which really did look like a defense to me), he threw suspicion towards Wilgy and Scotty 1.0, both of whom we know were civ.

[Elohcin]

Well for one thing, my new top suspicions are LoRab and Epi.

Epi is one person who I've been going back and forth on- for one, I agreed with his views on INH. For two, he's actually been the most vocal civ in the last phase, and when everyone started piling on Sokoth, it was pretty clear from an outside perspective that Sokoth was definitely a mislynch. Trust me, I was screaming. INH's voting pattern is pretty shit. But then again, so is Epi's. Why include Sokoth in talks with INH? I think INH looked much more damning, and if LoRab were to be bad, your choice to put the hammer down on Sokoth looks like someone that chose to vote there when a baddie teammate LoRab nervously exclaimed in the chat "Sokoth is onto me, let's take him down". This one is reaching possibly, but that's a scenario I want to look at the next day.

This seems like a genuine baddie skip. What say you, scotty?

[Elohcin]

not skip, slip

[Scotty]

Well for one thing, my new top suspicions are LoRab and Epi.

Epi is one person who I've been going back and forth on- for one, I agreed with his views on INH. For two, he's actually been the most vocal civ in the last phase, and when everyone started piling on Sokoth, it was pretty clear from an outside perspective that Sokoth was definitely a mislynch. Trust me, I was screaming. INH's voting pattern is pretty shit. But then again, so is Epi's. Why include Sokoth in talks with INH? I think INH looked much more damning, and if LoRab were to be bad, your choice to put the hammer down on Sokoth looks like someone that chose to vote there when a baddie teammate LoRab nervously exclaimed in the chat "Sokoth is onto me, let's take him down". This one is reaching possibly, but that's a scenario I want to look at the next day.

Do you suspect me or am I a civilian?

Whoopsadoodle.

INH's voting pattern is pretty shit. But then again, so is Epi's.

Tell me who does have good voting record. I'll wait.

Better yet, I'll go grab the only meaningful data regarding the voting records of living people for you:

Metalmarsh89
3
Quin (7), DFaraday (8), LoRab (10) 23%

That's it. What do you make of it?

What do you think of the case I laid out Epi? Instead of laughing over a potential "slip", Mr. 'My Keyboard must have a mind of its own this game'.

That should read as the most vocally civ. You sound civ, you really do. That was my reservation.

Well for one thing, my new top suspicions are LoRab and Epi.

Epi is one person who I've been going back and forth on- for one, I agreed with his views on INH. For two, he's actually been the most vocal civ in the last phase, and when everyone started piling on Sokoth, it was pretty clear from an outside perspective that Sokoth was definitely a mislynch. Trust me, I was screaming. INH's voting pattern is pretty shit. But then again, so is Epi's. Why include Sokoth in talks with INH? I think INH looked much more damning, and if LoRab were to be bad, your choice to put the hammer down on Sokoth looks like someone that chose to vote there when a baddie teammate LoRab nervously exclaimed in the chat "Sokoth is onto me, let's take him down". This one is reaching possibly, but that's a scenario I want to look at the next day.

This seems like a genuine baddie skip. What say you, scotty?

Why are you patently ignoring my case and piggybacking on Epi's semantics over a word.
What say you over the damn information I've laid out before you? You were just bemoaning you can't figure out the baddies.

Do you really want to find the baddies? Do you?

[LoRab]

Why are you patently ignoring my response to you, Scotty, and the question that it contained?

[SokothQultuq]

Good Luck to all. Well played. 8-)

[Tangrowth]

Day 5

Whose kills are as lethal as a schoolgirl's?

Poll ended at Tue Aug 09, 2016 9:43:32 pm


BigDamnHero
0
No votes
birdwithteeth11
1
insertnamehere (17) 6%
DFaraday 2.0
0
No votes
Elohcin
0
No votes
Epignosis
0
No votes
insertnamehere
0
No votes
LoRab
1
SokothQultuq (15) 6%
Quin
0
No votes
rabbit8
2
BigDamnHero (10), sig (13) 12%
Russtifinko 2.0
0
No votes
sig
0
No votes
SokothQultuq
7
Epignosis (5), Quin (6), timmer (7), LoRab (8), DFaraday (11), Elohcin (12), birdwithteeth11 (14) 41%
timmer
1
Russtifinko (16) 6%
Thane Woodson (hosts, deadies, non-players)
5
MovingPictures07 (1), Spacedaisy (2), Scotty (3), JaggedJimmyJay (4), Metalmarsh89 (9) 29%
Total votes : 17

[Epignosis]

Well for one thing, my new top suspicions are LoRab and Epi.

Epi is one person who I've been going back and forth on- for one, I agreed with his views on INH. For two, he's actually been the most vocal civ in the last phase, and when everyone started piling on Sokoth, it was pretty clear from an outside perspective that Sokoth was definitely a mislynch. Trust me, I was screaming. INH's voting pattern is pretty shit. But then again, so is Epi's. Why include Sokoth in talks with INH? I think INH looked much more damning, and if LoRab were to be bad, your choice to put the hammer down on Sokoth looks like someone that chose to vote there when a baddie teammate LoRab nervously exclaimed in the chat "Sokoth is onto me, let's take him down". This one is reaching possibly, but that's a scenario I want to look at the next day.

Do you suspect me or am I a civilian?

Whoopsadoodle.

INH's voting pattern is pretty shit. But then again, so is Epi's.

Tell me who does have good voting record. I'll wait.

Better yet, I'll go grab the only meaningful data regarding the voting records of living people for you:

Metalmarsh89
3
Quin (7), DFaraday (8), LoRab (10) 23%

That's it. What do you make of it?

What do you think of the case I laid out Epi? Instead of laughing over a potential "slip", Mr. 'My Keyboard must have a mind of its own this game'.

That should read as the most vocally civ. You sound civ, you really do. That was my reservation.

I'm not laughing, and there was nothing potential about that. You called me one of your "new top suspicions" and then called me "the most vocal civ."

For the sake of argument, let's accept your rephrasing. You say you meant I "read as the most vocally civ." That implies there exists such a thing as "the most vocally bad." Who, in your opinion, fits that description? If you contend that no one does or that there is no such thing, then what you claim you meant to say is inherently meaningless.

[Elohcin]

Epi, I think I've agreed with just about everything you've said this game, but I disagree that if someone thinks there is a "most vocal civ" then that implies they think there is a "most vocal baddie". How does that work exactly. Couldn't someone think there is a most vocal civ among the civs and then think the baddies are AWOL? Just sayin'.

[Spacedaisy]

Day 6 - To boldy go...

Frank was in town for Juliet's memorial service. He hugged Shawn and told him, "You made her very happy."

Shawn held his emotions in check and just thanked him. They hugged and parted ways. As Shawn headed to the Blueberry (left to him by Gus), a gun shot rang out. Shawn turned to see Frank crumpled on the ground, a gunshot wound to the head. There was no sign of his shooter.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------

Lorab has been killed by the Crooked Cops. She was Frank O'Hara. Her secrets have been revealed in the role list.

No one has cracked the safe, keep trying tomorrow night!

You have 48 hours to lynch someone, good luck!

[Elohcin]

So Lorab was killed (RIP). Why would they kill her when she was being suspected by some?

[Scotty]

Well for one thing, my new top suspicions are LoRab and Epi.

Epi is one person who I've been going back and forth on- for one, I agreed with his views on INH. For two, he's actually been the most vocal civ in the last phase, and when everyone started piling on Sokoth, it was pretty clear from an outside perspective that Sokoth was definitely a mislynch. Trust me, I was screaming. INH's voting pattern is pretty shit. But then again, so is Epi's. Why include Sokoth in talks with INH? I think INH looked much more damning, and if LoRab were to be bad, your choice to put the hammer down on Sokoth looks like someone that chose to vote there when a baddie teammate LoRab nervously exclaimed in the chat "Sokoth is onto me, let's take him down". This one is reaching possibly, but that's a scenario I want to look at the next day.

Do you suspect me or am I a civilian?

Whoopsadoodle.

INH's voting pattern is pretty shit. But then again, so is Epi's.

Tell me who does have good voting record. I'll wait.

Better yet, I'll go grab the only meaningful data regarding the voting records of living people for you:

Metalmarsh89
3
Quin (7), DFaraday (8), LoRab (10) 23%

That's it. What do you make of it?

What do you think of the case I laid out Epi? Instead of laughing over a potential "slip", Mr. 'My Keyboard must have a mind of its own this game'.

That should read as the most vocally civ. You sound civ, you really do. That was my reservation.

I'm not laughing, and there was nothing potential about that. You called me one of your "new top suspicions" and then called me "the most vocal civ."

For the sake of argument, let's accept your rephrasing. You say you meant I "read as the most vocally civ." That implies there exists such a thing as "the most vocally bad." Who, in your opinion, fits that description? If you contend that no one does or that there is no such thing, then what you claim you meant to say is inherently meaningless.

Great. It's meaningless. You will always win the game of attrition when it comes to nitpicky semantics here.

what do you think of my case on LoRab (since I am not planning on voting for you tomorrow anyway with someone who looks so bad)?

Why are you patently ignoring my response to you, Scotty, and the question that it contained?

My opinion of you is mostly (if not solely) hinging on Sokoth's and Quin's interactions with you, and even though I didn't see you as bad until yesterday, my race horse blinders are on. You could give me a bunch of money and tell me I've won the mega lottery and I still wouldn't not suspect you.

Linki: well shit. Sokoth prolly got that red check, and LoRab really was good.

Dammit I'm sorry LoRab

[Scotty]

So Lorab was killed (RIP). Why would they kill her when she was being suspected by some?

Yeah I have no idea, except maybe to make me look bad.

Again.

[Epignosis]

Epi, I think I've agreed with just about everything you've said this game, but I disagree that if someone thinks there is a "most vocal civ" then that implies they think there is a "most vocal baddie". How does that work exactly. Couldn't someone think there is a most vocal civ among the civs and then think the baddies are AWOL? Just sayin'.

That's rather my point. It's an unhelpful thing to say even if one were to accept Scotty's correction.

And for the sake of getting grammatical:

He didn't say "most vocal civ." There's a subtle difference. "Most vocal civ" doesn't change Scotty's original meaning, but "most vocally civ" does. The former is adverb-adjective-noun, while the latter is adverb-adverb-adjective. The former (what he said) designates me as a civilian (noun), while the latter (what he claims he meant) only describes my apparent demeanor (adjective). Those are two different thought processes.

[LoRab]

Meh.

[Scotty]

Epi, what do you think of your other suspect from yesterday, INH and his response to his accusations?

[Epignosis]

Well for one thing, my new top suspicions are LoRab and Epi.

Epi is one person who I've been going back and forth on- for one, I agreed with his views on INH. For two, he's actually been the most vocal civ in the last phase, and when everyone started piling on Sokoth, it was pretty clear from an outside perspective that Sokoth was definitely a mislynch. Trust me, I was screaming. INH's voting pattern is pretty shit. But then again, so is Epi's. Why include Sokoth in talks with INH? I think INH looked much more damning, and if LoRab were to be bad, your choice to put the hammer down on Sokoth looks like someone that chose to vote there when a baddie teammate LoRab nervously exclaimed in the chat "Sokoth is onto me, let's take him down". This one is reaching possibly, but that's a scenario I want to look at the next day.

Do you suspect me or am I a civilian?

Whoopsadoodle.

INH's voting pattern is pretty shit. But then again, so is Epi's.

Tell me who does have good voting record. I'll wait.

Better yet, I'll go grab the only meaningful data regarding the voting records of living people for you:

Metalmarsh89
3
Quin (7), DFaraday (8), LoRab (10) 23%

That's it. What do you make of it?

What do you think of the case I laid out Epi? Instead of laughing over a potential "slip", Mr. 'My Keyboard must have a mind of its own this game'.

That should read as the most vocally civ. You sound civ, you really do. That was my reservation.

I'm not laughing, and there was nothing potential about that. You called me one of your "new top suspicions" and then called me "the most vocal civ."

For the sake of argument, let's accept your rephrasing. You say you meant I "read as the most vocally civ." That implies there exists such a thing as "the most vocally bad." Who, in your opinion, fits that description? If you contend that no one does or that there is no such thing, then what you claim you meant to say is inherently meaningless.

Great. It's meaningless. You will always win the game of attrition when it comes to nitpicky semantics here.

what do you think of my case on LoRab (since I am not planning on voting for you tomorrow anyway with someone who looks so bad)?

Why are you patently ignoring my response to you, Scotty, and the question that it contained?

My opinion of you is mostly (if not solely) hinging on Sokoth's and Quin's interactions with you, and even though I didn't see you as bad until yesterday, my race horse blinders are on. You could give me a bunch of money and tell me I've won the mega lottery and I still wouldn't not suspect you.

Linki: well shit. Sokoth prolly got that red check, and LoRab really was good.

Dammit I'm sorry LoRab

Lorab's gone.

Going to vote for me now, cowboy?

[Epignosis]

Epi, what do you think of your other suspect from yesterday, INH and his response to his accusations?

I have to think.

[Epignosis]

Were I to vote right now, it would be one of three people: Russ, Scotty, or INH.

[Epignosis]

Hello Russ.

[Epignosis]

Who would kill Lorab when someone was talking about lynching her next?

I think lynching LoRab would be a huge mistake. Epi, I get what you're saying about that looking like a potential bus, but I really don't think that's what's going on here. Besides, MM wasn't lynched, so he couldn't really be bussed. (By the way, thanks for that one, by the way, YinYang). I think looking at other MM connections is a much better way to go, here.

LOL @ MM.

Somebody who had a chat with her.

OK. Read up.

Thoughts on the names that have come up, because at this moments, I don't have any suspects of my own and I've been wrong about suspicions up until now, so I'm self doubting, and I didn't have time to read back through earlier posts. Also, it's less than 2 hours, and more names would only make it easier for mafia to manipulate the lynch, assuming (like Epi) many missing voters).

MM I could definitely see as bad. Especially after the vote for Sig, with no stated reason for doing so.

Russ I would be very surprised to find out was bad.

Wilgy, I'm unsure. I'm not very good at reading him. My gut tells me he is civ, but my gut could be totally wrong.

Sig, I really don't think is bad. I'm willing to revisit that at some point, but I don't see enough evidence that he's bad at this point to change my thinking.

So, I'm voting MM, because I think that's where I'm seeing the strongest reasoning at this point.

I think there's enough evidence in sig's favor. I won't vote for him. Wilgy and MM are gone. Russ got the yellow comment. I want to explore that.

The above alongside Russ's ardent "defense" of Lorab is prima facie evidence that Russ and Lorab had BTSC at one point, and that despite the initial anonymity, Russ learned the identity of his company.

Think on that. Lorab had an anonymous chat with Russ, and she clearly trusted him (given the yellow).

Have you ever been bad and received BTSC with a civilian? That can be one of the most nerve-wracking experiences in Mafia...although I'd like to think I've gotten it down to a science.

Or you might just be like Eloh, who unwittingly outed her damn self in Death Note. Good times. *Wipes away a giddy tear*.

Russ' defense is unique.

sig never defended Lorab, and by Day 5 said she warranted a closer look. Dr.Wilgy never defended Lorab. MM was evil and may well have been caught in BTSC. That leaves Russ, who came out defending Lorab.

There are five civilians left.

Shawn Spencer
Carlton Lassiter
Henry Spencer
Abigail Lytar
Woody the Coroner

I don't believe Russ is Shawn or Carlton. I have other people in mind for those two roles. That leaves Henry, Abigail, and Woody. None of those are able to check secrets or roles. And if you are one of those roles, that narrows things down even further.

Russ got BTSC with Frank, figured out that was Lorab, and killed her.

[Spacedaisy]

Meh.

[Russtifinko]

Who would kill Lorab when someone was talking about lynching her next?

I think lynching LoRab would be a huge mistake. Epi, I get what you're saying about that looking like a potential bus, but I really don't think that's what's going on here. Besides, MM wasn't lynched, so he couldn't really be bussed. (By the way, thanks for that one, by the way, YinYang). I think looking at other MM connections is a much better way to go, here.

LOL @ MM.

Somebody who had a chat with her.

OK. Read up.

Thoughts on the names that have come up, because at this moments, I don't have any suspects of my own and I've been wrong about suspicions up until now, so I'm self doubting, and I didn't have time to read back through earlier posts. Also, it's less than 2 hours, and more names would only make it easier for mafia to manipulate the lynch, assuming (like Epi) many missing voters).

MM I could definitely see as bad. Especially after the vote for Sig, with no stated reason for doing so.

Russ I would be very surprised to find out was bad.

Wilgy, I'm unsure. I'm not very good at reading him. My gut tells me he is civ, but my gut could be totally wrong.

Sig, I really don't think is bad. I'm willing to revisit that at some point, but I don't see enough evidence that he's bad at this point to change my thinking.

So, I'm voting MM, because I think that's where I'm seeing the strongest reasoning at this point.

I think there's enough evidence in sig's favor. I won't vote for him. Wilgy and MM are gone. Russ got the yellow comment. I want to explore that.

The above alongside Russ's ardent "defense" of Lorab is prima facie evidence that Russ and Lorab had BTSC at one point, and that despite the initial anonymity, Russ learned the identity of his company.

Think on that. Lorab had an anonymous chat with Russ, and she clearly trusted him (given the yellow).

Have you ever been bad and received BTSC with a civilian? That can be one of the most nerve-wracking experiences in Mafia...although I'd like to think I've gotten it down to a science.

Or you might just be like Eloh, who unwittingly outed her damn self in Death Note. Good times. *Wipes away a giddy tear*.

Russ' defense is unique.

sig never defended Lorab, and by Day 5 said she warranted a closer look. Dr.Wilgy never defended Lorab. MM was evil and may well have been caught in BTSC. That leaves Russ, who came out defending Lorab.

There are five civilians left.

Shawn Spencer
Carlton Lassiter
Henry Spencer
Abigail Lytar
Woody the Coroner

I don't believe Russ is Shawn or Carlton. I have other people in mind for those two roles. That leaves Henry, Abigail, and Woody. None of those are able to check secrets or roles. And if you are one of those roles, that narrows things down even further.

Russ got BTSC with Frank, figured out that was Lorab, and killed her.

Wait wait wait wait. This analysis was all going so well until the very last line. The whole theory was super well put together, except that I don't see how the conclusion follows. So:

1) LoRab and I had BTSC.
2) LoRab and I trusted and defended each other.
3) LoRab was civ.
4) I am.....bad??

You're giving me way too much credit and not giving LoRab enough if you think I could pull the wool over her eyes like that in BTSC. I'm flattered, but you're flat-out wrong.

I'll be voting timmer again. I'd love to hear some discussion on him, as I put together what I thought was a pretty well-thought-out and airtight (although admittedly poorly timed) case, but the only real response I got was from him, so I feel like I'm talking at a brick wall. His behavior D4 and D5 was just BANANAS, right? And on a pretty pivotal day for the baddies, too!

Has Epi been elected President and Ruler of Casemaking here, or do other people get to have ideas worth talking about too?

[Russtifinko]

Also, keep in mind that LoRab was right to suspect MM and right to not suspect Wilgy. She's probably right about sig too, tbh. So what makes me so special that I'd somehow be bad AND the only read her gut was wrong on?

I'm especially surprised by this given that when I defended LoRab the other day, you seemed to back off.

[Epignosis]

Who would kill Lorab when someone was talking about lynching her next?

I think lynching LoRab would be a huge mistake. Epi, I get what you're saying about that looking like a potential bus, but I really don't think that's what's going on here. Besides, MM wasn't lynched, so he couldn't really be bussed. (By the way, thanks for that one, by the way, YinYang). I think looking at other MM connections is a much better way to go, here.

LOL @ MM.

Somebody who had a chat with her.

OK. Read up.

Thoughts on the names that have come up, because at this moments, I don't have any suspects of my own and I've been wrong about suspicions up until now, so I'm self doubting, and I didn't have time to read back through earlier posts. Also, it's less than 2 hours, and more names would only make it easier for mafia to manipulate the lynch, assuming (like Epi) many missing voters).

MM I could definitely see as bad. Especially after the vote for Sig, with no stated reason for doing so.

Russ I would be very surprised to find out was bad.

Wilgy, I'm unsure. I'm not very good at reading him. My gut tells me he is civ, but my gut could be totally wrong.

Sig, I really don't think is bad. I'm willing to revisit that at some point, but I don't see enough evidence that he's bad at this point to change my thinking.

So, I'm voting MM, because I think that's where I'm seeing the strongest reasoning at this point.

I think there's enough evidence in sig's favor. I won't vote for him. Wilgy and MM are gone. Russ got the yellow comment. I want to explore that.

The above alongside Russ's ardent "defense" of Lorab is prima facie evidence that Russ and Lorab had BTSC at one point, and that despite the initial anonymity, Russ learned the identity of his company.

Think on that. Lorab had an anonymous chat with Russ, and she clearly trusted him (given the yellow).

Have you ever been bad and received BTSC with a civilian? That can be one of the most nerve-wracking experiences in Mafia...although I'd like to think I've gotten it down to a science.

Or you might just be like Eloh, who unwittingly outed her damn self in Death Note. Good times. *Wipes away a giddy tear*.

Russ' defense is unique.

sig never defended Lorab, and by Day 5 said she warranted a closer look. Dr.Wilgy never defended Lorab. MM was evil and may well have been caught in BTSC. That leaves Russ, who came out defending Lorab.

There are five civilians left.

Shawn Spencer
Carlton Lassiter
Henry Spencer
Abigail Lytar
Woody the Coroner

I don't believe Russ is Shawn or Carlton. I have other people in mind for those two roles. That leaves Henry, Abigail, and Woody. None of those are able to check secrets or roles. And if you are one of those roles, that narrows things down even further.

Russ got BTSC with Frank, figured out that was Lorab, and killed her.

Wait wait wait wait. This analysis was all going so well until the very last line. The whole theory was super well put together, except that I don't see how the conclusion follows. So:

1) LoRab and I had BTSC.
2) LoRab and I trusted and defended each other.
3) LoRab was civ.
4) I am.....bad??

You're giving me way too much credit and not giving LoRab enough if you think I could pull the wool over her eyes like that in BTSC. I'm flattered, but you're flat-out wrong.

I'll be voting timmer again. I'd love to hear some discussion on him, as I put together what I thought was a pretty well-thought-out and airtight (although admittedly poorly timed) case, but the only real response I got was from him, so I feel like I'm talking at a brick wall. His behavior D4 and D5 was just BANANAS, right? And on a pretty pivotal day for the baddies, too!

Has Epi been elected President and Ruler of Casemaking here, or do other people get to have ideas worth talking about too?

You skipped several key premises in my argument.

[Epignosis]

Also, keep in mind that LoRab was right to suspect MM and right to not suspect Wilgy. She's probably right about sig too, tbh. So what makes me so special that I'd somehow be bad AND the only read her gut was wrong on?

I'm especially surprised by this given that when I defended LoRab the other day, you seemed to back off.

Can you explain how you found out you had BTSC with Lorab as opposed to anybody else?

[timmer]

Who would kill Lorab when someone was talking about lynching her next?

I think lynching LoRab would be a huge mistake. Epi, I get what you're saying about that looking like a potential bus, but I really don't think that's what's going on here. Besides, MM wasn't lynched, so he couldn't really be bussed. (By the way, thanks for that one, by the way, YinYang). I think looking at other MM connections is a much better way to go, here.

LOL @ MM.

Somebody who had a chat with her.

OK. Read up.

Thoughts on the names that have come up, because at this moments, I don't have any suspects of my own and I've been wrong about suspicions up until now, so I'm self doubting, and I didn't have time to read back through earlier posts. Also, it's less than 2 hours, and more names would only make it easier for mafia to manipulate the lynch, assuming (like Epi) many missing voters).

MM I could definitely see as bad. Especially after the vote for Sig, with no stated reason for doing so.

Russ I would be very surprised to find out was bad.

Wilgy, I'm unsure. I'm not very good at reading him. My gut tells me he is civ, but my gut could be totally wrong.

Sig, I really don't think is bad. I'm willing to revisit that at some point, but I don't see enough evidence that he's bad at this point to change my thinking.

So, I'm voting MM, because I think that's where I'm seeing the strongest reasoning at this point.

I think there's enough evidence in sig's favor. I won't vote for him. Wilgy and MM are gone. Russ got the yellow comment. I want to explore that.

The above alongside Russ's ardent "defense" of Lorab is prima facie evidence that Russ and Lorab had BTSC at one point, and that despite the initial anonymity, Russ learned the identity of his company.

Think on that. Lorab had an anonymous chat with Russ, and she clearly trusted him (given the yellow).

Have you ever been bad and received BTSC with a civilian? That can be one of the most nerve-wracking experiences in Mafia...although I'd like to think I've gotten it down to a science.

Or you might just be like Eloh, who unwittingly outed her damn self in Death Note. Good times. *Wipes away a giddy tear*.

Russ' defense is unique.

sig never defended Lorab, and by Day 5 said she warranted a closer look. Dr.Wilgy never defended Lorab. MM was evil and may well have been caught in BTSC. That leaves Russ, who came out defending Lorab.

There are five civilians left.

Shawn Spencer
Carlton Lassiter
Henry Spencer
Abigail Lytar
Woody the Coroner

I don't believe Russ is Shawn or Carlton. I have other people in mind for those two roles. That leaves Henry, Abigail, and Woody. None of those are able to check secrets or roles. And if you are one of those roles, that narrows things down even further.

Russ got BTSC with Frank, figured out that was Lorab, and killed her.

Wait wait wait wait. This analysis was all going so well until the very last line. The whole theory was super well put together, except that I don't see how the conclusion follows. So:

1) LoRab and I had BTSC.
2) LoRab and I trusted and defended each other.
3) LoRab was civ.
4) I am.....bad??

You're giving me way too much credit and not giving LoRab enough if you think I could pull the wool over her eyes like that in BTSC. I'm flattered, but you're flat-out wrong.

I'll be voting timmer again. I'd love to hear some discussion on him, as I put together what I thought was a pretty well-thought-out and airtight (although admittedly poorly timed) case, but the only real response I got was from him, so I feel like I'm talking at a brick wall. His behavior D4 and D5 was just BANANAS, right? And on a pretty pivotal day for the baddies, too!

Has Epi been elected President and Ruler of Casemaking here, or do other people get to have ideas worth talking about too?

Airtight? I do not think that word means what you think it means. You still haven't even looked at it without your blunders on.

But I'm going to concentrate tomorrow on the relevant cases, not on defending a vote that I made in good faith.

[BigDamnHero]

Ok, so there's a lot I wanna comment on, but don't really have the time/energy to do any sort of epic linki quote-back post so I'm just freestylin' this...most of which is just gonna be rhetorical thoughts I need to get out of my brain so as to free up space for more meaningful contemplations...so here goes...

First off, all these 2.0 players has my mind reeling. I've never really seen this happen before and it's causing me to make me wonder (aside from a lack of replacement players) why they are coming back in which leads me to ponder the hosts motives/rationalizations for allowing them to return in new roles. That in turn leads me down the WIFM road and consider whether they would then assign them to a contrary allignment or keep them civ (as most of them had been in their first incarnation). It also makes reading them harder since we have heard their voices before (potentially laying credibility) but now have to reevaluate those same people under a new light.

Secondly, to Scotty's point. Epi has been very vocal (though he always seems to have been in what I know of his overll play style). I've statd before I thought Epi was civ, so I really don't get the "Scotty baddie slip-up" accusations. If he thought Epi was civ, why is it a slip-up to call him "the most vocal civ?" That being said, I would put Epi in a very rare and exclusive category of mafia players who can convince anybody of anything all the while twisting the knife he stabbed in your back but making you smile as he does it I still believe 99% that Epi is civ, but that remaining 1% makes me wonder if he isn't just playing us all...after all, his theories haven't came remotely close to netting us any baddies yet...

[Scotty]

Ok, so there's a lot I wanna comment on, but don't really have the time/energy to do any sort of epic linki quote-back post so I'm just freestylin' this...most of which is just gonna be rhetorical thoughts I need to get out of my brain so as to free up space for more meaningful contemplations...so here goes...

First off, all these 2.0 players has my mind reeling. I've never really seen this happen before and it's causing me to make me wonder (aside from a lack of replacement players) why they are coming back in which leads me to ponder the hosts motives/rationalizations for allowing them to return in new roles. That in turn leads me down the WIFM road and consider whether they would then assign them to a contrary allignment or keep them civ (as most of them had been in their first incarnation). It also makes reading them harder since we have heard their voices before (potentially laying credibility) but now have to reevaluate those same people under a new light.

Secondly, to Scotty's point. Epi has been very vocal (though he always seems to have been in what I know of his overll play style). I've statd before I thought Epi was civ, so I really don't get the "Scotty baddie slip-up" accusations. If he thought Epi was civ, why is it a slip-up to call him "the most vocal civ?" That being said, I would put Epi in a very rare and exclusive category of mafia players who can convince anybody of anything all the while twisting the knife he stabbed in your back but making you smile as he does it I still believe 99% that Epi is civ, but that remaining 1% makes me wonder if he isn't just playing us all...after all, his theories haven't came remotely close to netting us any baddies yet...

I think focusing on replacements being alignment indicative is a mistake. So far, it's Russ, DF and me that have come back. We were all announced as civ at death. We replaced into roles from players that went MIa. That's all. I know I can't help what rabbit has done before me.

I would say to your Epi pout that I, again, feel as though Epi is a quandary, and is bringing cases forward, which is what the civs need. Is he a civ bringing discussion, or a Mafia steering the thread?

As for his theories not netting any baddies yet...see...this is my biggest delimma. Epi and I sorta sparred all Downton Abbey until the end: I waffled on whether or not he was bad because he was vocal and putting out arguments and they were almost all wrong. And I was convinced he was steering the thread then.
But we were both civ and we both survived til the end. Somehow.

So even if Epi is Mafia leading us astray, I want to keep looking around, there's still 2 baddies, so it would be nice to eliminate from the slew of other people before Epi. Thass how i see it.

[Scotty]

Going back to Shawn.

Either Shawn is very bad at solving puzzles or Yin/Yang are throwing Stephen Hawking-level equations at him.

Aight Russ, I'll look at timmer, since you seem to think tour case is pretty airtight

[sig]

I've been a civ with BTSC a few times, I usually leave little unnoticeable hints, and I wouldn't be surprised if Lorab was killed for having BTSC. If she trusted the player and told them who she was they'd kill her at the first chance they got.

Scotty brings up a good point on Ying/Yang and riddles. If Shawn is bad at puzzles or inactvie then it doesn't matter, but if the riddles are really that hard perhaps that can help clue us in to who Ying/Yang are?

[Epignosis]

I think focusing on replacements being alignment indicative is a mistake. So far, it's Russ, DF and me that have come back. We were all announced as civ at death. We replaced into roles from players that went MIa. That's all. I know I can't help what rabbit has done before me.

That's true...in the early phases. It is no longer the early phases. It is now numerically impossible for all three replaced persons to be civilian. Impossible. So there is good reason to scrutinize the replacements at this stage.

I've given very little attention to DFaraday. I will now remedy that.

[Scotty]

I think focusing on replacements being alignment indicative is a mistake. So far, it's Russ, DF and me that have come back. We were all announced as civ at death. We replaced into roles from players that went MIa. That's all. I know I can't help what rabbit has done before me.

That's true...in the early phases. It is no longer the early phases. It is now numerically impossible for all three replaced persons to be civilian. Impossible. So there is good reason to scrutinize the replacements at this stage.

I've given very little attention to DFaraday. I will now remedy that.

Explain like I'm 5 about that point. Why is it impossible with 5 civilians still alive?

And I'm not saying replacements shouldn't be scrutinized, but the fact that they are replacements is not an alignment indicator.

Why are you misconstruing what I'm saying, Epi?

[BigDamnHero]

Epi, what is your take on BWT? I can't seem to get a read on him. It's like I send feelers out and get NO RESPONSE back...