Felt Mafia 2 [ENDGAME]

[insertnamehere]

Was anyone silenced yesterday?

I just checked and unless it was Made or SD, I think everyone posted yesterday. I doubt those 2 were silenced.

All we assume is INH was silenced day 2, and that's it right?

I wasn't silenced Day 2.

[Epignosis]

3J- LC hasn't killed you. What do you make of that?

LC- 3J hasn't killed you. What do you make of that?

[JaggedJimmyJay]

INH, you haven't said much today in response to your accusers. Why is that? Also, do you still believe Wilgy was bussed for civilian credit?

[JaggedJimmyJay]

3J- LC hasn't killed you. What do you make of that?

LC- 3J hasn't killed you. What do you make of that?

I wouldn't expect to be killed in a game where I've been a prominent lynch wagon twice in three days.

[Epignosis]

3J- LC hasn't killed you. What do you make of that?

LC- 3J hasn't killed you. What do you make of that?

I wouldn't expect to be killed in a game where I've been a prominent lynch wagon twice in three days.

One of LC's complaints against you, if I am recalling correctly, is that you were wasting his time (and he has certainly been spending a great deal of time on you). I would argue that's a prime incentive to kill you- so that he no longer feels the need to respond to your posts.

[JaggedJimmyJay]

I've been in Quin's "lynch me now so they can't save me for LyLo" position before as a civilian -- hell I felt that way in this game. Two points:

1. I think that's a decent look for Quin. Sure, he could be employing the puppy eyes to encourage the opposite of what he's saying (survival). I rarely see baddies do things like that though.

2. Quin, I don't think we have to lynch you. If you play with ferocity, your position in this game might change. If you end up in a LyLo, it will be the job of any civilians there with you to judge you with a level head.

[thellama73]

I've been in Quin's "lynch me now so they can't save me for LyLo" position before as a civilian -- hell I felt that way in this game. Two points:

1. I think that's a decent look for Quin. Sure, he could be employing the puppy eyes to encourage the opposite of what he's saying (survival). I rarely see baddies do things like that though.

2. Quin, I don't think we have to lynch you. If you play with ferocity, your position in this game might change. If you end up in a LyLo, it will be the job of any civilians there with you to judge you with a level head.

I agree with this. I'm leaning towards an INH lynch currently. I am not impressed with his apparent apathy. It smells like a defeated baddie who feels his team is doomed, which is probably how I would feel in his position.

[JaggedJimmyJay]

3J- LC hasn't killed you. What do you make of that?

LC- 3J hasn't killed you. What do you make of that?

I wouldn't expect to be killed in a game where I've been a prominent lynch wagon twice in three days.

One of LC's complaints against you, if I am recalling correctly, is that you were wasting his time (and he has certainly been spending a great deal of time on you). I would argue that's a prime incentive to kill you- so that he no longer feels the need to respond to your posts.

I think that was actually something I said, not him (can't recall for sure, maybe we both said it). In any event it's all circumstantial. Whether I'm a nuisance or not, if the bad guys feel I can be lynched then killing me would be a wasted opportunity to survive another day.

Hell, LC's responses to me were a large part of many other people reading him as a civilian until now.

[thellama73]

For the record, if I were in JJJ's position and bad, I would not kill LC. If I were in LC's position and bad, I would not kill JJJ. If I were neither of the and bad, I would not kill either of them. The continued thread-clogging arguments benefit the baddies regardless of what their roles are.

[JaggedJimmyJay]

I'm leaning toward an INH vote as well.

[Epignosis]

Dear oh dear.

I just spent a little while studying votes and scratching my head.

Finally figured out I was looking at A Mafia of Unfortunate Events polls.

[Marmot]

[Epignosis]

What I note is that two kills were placed on DDL voters, and one on someone the Mafia may have believed blocked their first go. This indicates to me that we are dealing with a strategic-minded killer.

It is also noteworthy Wilgy did try to save DDL's skin Day 1. That makes me feel less suspicious of thellama73 (not that I was suspicious, but you get the idea).

Get this: Wilgy didn't vote at all Day 2. That indicates that he was under no pressure to save 3J or Quin like he was Day 1 in saving DDL.

Strictly going by the voting data, INH looks the most suspicious. INH gave 3J a short-lived +1 lead over Wilgy Day 3. And he started the train on thellama73 Day 1. Time to see what I can see about INH.

[Long Con]

Trying to figure out why someone would kill me and why leave me alive usually gets me spinning in the WIFOM. I usually tend to operate on WIFOM level 2, but sometimes I do, as a baddie, kill the person who's dogging me the most. I have never felt much of a threat from JJJ though, since most folks thought I was Civ. JJJ is my favourite person in this game, because I'd probably be nightkilled by now if it weren't for him.

I'm seeing the INH points, and I am happy to vote that way as well.

[insertnamehere]

The best argument that insertnamehere is bad:

~ On Day 1 he took advantage of llama's aggression by whipping up a case on an easy target and assuming a perspective of confidence -- one unlike him in experience.
~ He voted too quickly on Day 1 to be relevant when the DDL wagon appeared, and his Day 3 vote made me an early counterwagon to Wilgy.
~ He abandoned his case against llama after DDL flipped mafia in an ill-advised knee-jerk reaction, thinking llama would draw a lot of civilian credibility as the DDL counterwagon.

How compelling is this argument? Mildly

I realize this is a theoretical "assuming that he's bad" case, but I'd like to respond to it anyway, as most people are beginning to assume I am anyway.

Point 1: I'd disagree that Llama is an easy target, as he's one slippery camelid. I'm also surprised that 3J's surprised that I'm capable of being quite assertive when I think someone is scum. See also: Unfortunate Events Mafia, where I ironically was much in the same position as 3J in this game, in that I was convinced LC was scum and nearly managed to get him lynched. I was civ in that game, for the record.

Point 2: I thought 3J and Llama had a high potential for being scum. I still think that. If you'd like to debate me on the merits of those two cases, feel free. I still stand by those opinions.

Point 3: *sigh*

I DID NOT FLIP FLOP ON LLAMA. I TOOK A STEP BACK AND ATTEMPTED TO RE-ASSESS AFTER THE D1 RESULTS. AFTER I RE-ASSESSED, I REALIZED THAT I STILL SUSPECTED LLAMA.

So, I'm suspiciously overconfident when I say I think someone is bad, but I'm doing ill-advised knee-jerk flip-flops when I attempt to take a step back.

Pick one.

[thellama73]

I'm tempted to replace "Supatown" in my account description with "One Slippery Camelid".

[thellama73]

So, I'm suspiciously overconfident when I say I think someone is bad, but I'm doing ill-advised knee-jerk flip-flops when I attempt to take a step back.

Pick one.

I don't think you've been overconfident this game at all. In fact, it's your milquetoast approach that I find most suspicious (apart from your voting record.) I'm not seeing the aggression you claim characterizes your play.

[Epignosis]

I still think our triple lettered friend is bluffing.

Even if he won a one-time lynch immunity, I doubt he'd use it today.

I can definitely see him using it tomorrow, though. That's partly why I want him out today.

I also don't understand the Wilgy case.

I think that last sentence is troublesome. INH said he didn't understand the WIlgy case, but he made no effort (that I saw) to learn about it and clarify whatever it was he wasn't understanding.

[insertnamehere]

I still think our triple lettered friend is bluffing.

Even if he won a one-time lynch immunity, I doubt he'd use it today.

I can definitely see him using it tomorrow, though. That's partly why I want him out today.

I also don't understand the Wilgy case.

INH, this is really the post that was marking you as "There - there's the way a teammate would try to salvage this for his teammate without outright defending him."

I thought 3J was bluffing.

I still think 3J is bluffing.

If I didn't have to worry about self-preservation today, I would've most likely voted his direction.

Wilgy is a tricksy case, and I still haven't figured out how to read him. That, plus him being an easy mislynch in a few games past, enthusiasm for the cases against 3J, Llama, and Quin, combined with my own spotty voting record made me inclined towards looking in a different direction.

I was wrong.

I've been wrong, or at least on the wrong side of the votes, for most of this game.

I don't think that makes me bad.

Even then, there are two other players who have been equally wrong: Quin and LC.

The former is moping around and weakly suggesting that we just lynch him.

The latter is shifting the blame over in my direction.

3J, LC is your mortal nemesis in this game. What do you think about him pushing my lynch?

[insertnamehere]

I still think our triple lettered friend is bluffing.

Even if he won a one-time lynch immunity, I doubt he'd use it today.

I can definitely see him using it tomorrow, though. That's partly why I want him out today.

I also don't understand the Wilgy case.

I think that last sentence is troublesome. INH said he didn't understand the WIlgy case, but he made no effort (that I saw) to learn about it and clarify whatever it was he wasn't understanding.

This was late in the day, and I was pretty sold against 3J.



It's a stupid, and ultimately wrong saying that three seperate people have tried to throw in my face, but I don't think it makes me bad.

[insertnamehere]

So, I'm suspiciously overconfident when I say I think someone is bad, but I'm doing ill-advised knee-jerk flip-flops when I attempt to take a step back.

Pick one.

I don't think you've been overconfident this game at all. In fact, it's your milquetoast approach that I find most suspicious (apart from your voting record.) I'm not seeing the aggression you claim characterizes your play.

Ha.

In past games I've been too on-the-fence for a couple people's tastes, and I've discounted a lot of Day 1 reads. That attitude, which you call "milquetoast" has gotten me mislynched multiple times since I started playing again.

Aaaand now 3J takes issue with me being assertive with a D1 case.

I contain multitudes, ya know? I ain't a monolith.

[JaggedJimmyJay]

INH, I was noting that in my experience playing with you, you making an assertive case on Day 1 is atypical. It's a less important point than your voting pattern or your behavior this phase.

You asked what I think of LC suspecting you: not much. I am a civilian who suspects you, so I must acknowledge that it is possible for LC to be the same. It's also possible that he is not and you are his chosen scapegoat. Shrug. What I note most about LC today is that he doesn't seem to be railing for my lynch -- a signal that he has allowed himself to adapt to the changing circumstances as a civilian should.

New question, INH:

When I revealed my lynch immunity, I said my desire was to force the lynch of somebody else who may be mafia-aligned. Entering Day 3, Wilgy was a perfectly viable lynch and that's what ended up happening. This means that if I am bad, I basically did this:

No guys, don't lynch me yet. Lynch my teammate first and then lynch me.

One could accuse me for not voting on that Wilgy wagon, but this hypothetical still demands that I take a very foolish risk which would have blown up in my face.

Do you still think I was bluffing?

[insertnamehere]

INH, I was noting that in my experience playing with you, you making an assertive case on Day 1 is atypical. It's a less important point than your voting pattern or your behavior this phase.

You asked what I think of LC suspecting you: not much. I am a civilian who suspects you, so I must acknowledge that it is possible for LC to be the same. It's also possible that he is not and you are his chosen scapegoat. Shrug. What I note most about LC today is that he doesn't seem to be railing for my lynch -- a signal that he has allowed himself to adapt to the changing circumstances as a civilian should.

New question, INH:

When I revealed my lynch immunity, I said my desire was to force the lynch of somebody else who may be mafia-aligned. Entering Day 3, Wilgy was a perfectly viable lynch and that's what ended up happening. This means that if I am bad, I basically did this:

No guys, don't lynch me yet. Lynch my teammate first and then lynch me.

One could accuse me for not voting on that Wilgy wagon, but this hypothetical still demands that I take a very foolish risk which would have blown up in my face.

Do you still think I was bluffing?

Yes.

I have my own reasons for why I think you were bluffing.

Mainly due to me not thinking Mongoose would repeat herself.

[JaggedJimmyJay]

What do you mean by "repeat herself"?

[insertnamehere]

What do you mean by "repeat herself"?

You ostensibly won the contest by PM'ing Mongoose the fourth time, yes?

So you won the second prize.

I highly doubt Mongoose would give out the same prize twice in a row.

[Long Con]

Nah, I was 6th, and I got exactly what JJJ said.

[Long Con]

What do you mean by "repeat herself"?

You ostensibly won the contest by PM'ing Mongoose the fourth time, yes?

So you won the second prize.

I highly doubt Mongoose would give out the same prize twice in a row.

Wait - so did you use it last night?

[thellama73]

INH is now claiming he won a lynch immunity too? Shenanigans.

[JaggedJimmyJay]

I can believe that he won a lynch immunity given that LC is claiming the same. Either neither is lying or both are.

However, the important detail is whether it has been activated for today.

[thellama73]

I can believe that he won a lynch immunity given that LC is claiming the same. Either neither is lying or both are.

However, the important detail is whether it has been activated for today.

I believe I said it before. Welcome to the deathless world of Mongoose.

[Long Con]

He did claim the 2nd slot, which jives. If he claimed 6th then I'd call the shenanigans.

I'm going into work now. I don't know who to vote for, everyone is making good points. I will do my best to vote in time, sneaking away to do so if I'm not done work on time. Good luck guys.

[Mongoose]

Effective immediately, Juliets is replacing Spacedaisy. As such, she is immune from Day 4 vote and Night 4 actions in order for her to catch up.

[Marmot]

Marmot has subbed in for Marmot. His heart is still in pieces (my poor Ponderosa) and he's still dead! Carry on with your game of mafia!

[juliets]

Hi everyone. I have been skimming the game just for fun so I don't anticipate it will take me a long time to catch up. I haven't played for several months so I am a little rusty though. Also, I don't think I'm going to be able to catch up enough to vote tonight especially since I have plans that will take me away from the thread for a good hour and a half between now and the end of day. I am aware from my skim that MP/Daisy have not posted much and that I need to give some reads fairly quickly to get myself into the game. Just give me this evening to get with the program.

[Made]

oh snap, wassup juliets.

I'm reading Quin's call to kill him as a perfect Wifom, and because of the fact that I've been there... a lot, but have never thought to call for a lynch of myself because of it, I think of it more of a moot point rather than something I can read as a point in either direction. That said, looking at vote record I think there's a stronger case for Quin rather than INH. While both records are pretty crappy, Quins feel more like attempted saves than INH's does. I'm more inclined to view INH's as unlucky gut reads based off of the fact the votes were so early. Alternatively, voting early to prevent having to vote for teammates still leads me to suspect INH, but just not as much as Quin.

Thoughts?

I'm excited to see how far the expansiveness and continuity of Mongoose's Deathless Universe stretches as we continue to play.

[JaggedJimmyJay]

Hi juliets.

That removes a vote from candidacy today. I think I'm looking at this pile then:

Elohcin 2.0
Long Con
Quin
insertnamehere

INH's immunity raises a problem, but that problem can be resolved if he tells us whether he has protected himself with it today.

[juliets]

I can believe that he won a lynch immunity given that LC is claiming the same. Either neither is lying or both are.

However, the important detail is whether it has been activated for today.

I believe I said it before. Welcome to the deathless world of Mongoose.

I'm going backwards through the thread and I have to stop here and ask what this is about. Do you really think Mongoose would have given away three Lynch immunities? That just seems, well, hardly believable. Did this happen in her other game and thats why you made this comment llama? Or did something similar happen?

[JaggedJimmyJay]

oh snap, wassup juliets.

I'm reading Quin's call to kill him as a perfect Wifom, and because of the fact that I've been there... a lot, but have never thought to call for a lynch of myself because of it, I think of it more of a moot point rather than something I can read as a point in either direction. That said, looking at vote record I think there's a stronger case for Quin rather than INH. While both records are pretty crappy, Quins feel more like attempted saves than INH's does. I'm more inclined to view INH's as unlucky gut reads based off of the fact the votes were so early. Alternatively, voting early to prevent having to vote for teammates still leads me to suspect INH, but just not as much as Quin.

Thoughts?

I'm excited to see how far the expansiveness and continuity of Mongoose's Deathless Universe stretches as we continue to play.

I'd say Quin's votes are slightly worse than INH's. Quin's Day 1 vote was a true counterwagon while INH's wasn't. Their Day 3 votes are about the same. I think Quin looks a little better at face value though.

[JaggedJimmyJay]

I can believe that he won a lynch immunity given that LC is claiming the same. Either neither is lying or both are.

However, the important detail is whether it has been activated for today.

I believe I said it before. Welcome to the deathless world of Mongoose.

I'm going backwards through the thread and I have to stop here and ask what this is about. Do you really think Mongoose would have given away three Lynch immunities? That just seems, well, hardly believable. Did this happen in her other game and thats why you made this comment llama? Or did something similar happen?

It appears plausible that she did. Three of us are claiming it now and we can't all be bad. I want to be clear on one thing though in case it isn't clear already: the immunity is given to someone the night before (can be given to oneself). It isn't automatically a self-immunity.

[juliets]

I can believe that he won a lynch immunity given that LC is claiming the same. Either neither is lying or both are.

However, the important detail is whether it has been activated for today.

I believe I said it before. Welcome to the deathless world of Mongoose.

I'm going backwards through the thread and I have to stop here and ask what this is about. Do you really think Mongoose would have given away three Lynch immunities? That just seems, well, hardly believable. Did this happen in her other game and thats why you made this comment llama? Or did something similar happen?

It appears plausible that she did. Three of us are claiming it now and we can't all be bad. I want to be clear on one thing though in case it isn't clear already: the immunity is given to someone the night before (can be given to oneself). It isn't automatically a self-immunity.

Yes, I didn't stop to think of it that way - you can't all be bad so that does argue for it being true. And I'm glad you clarified because I was indeed thinking of it as a self-immunity.

[Sorsha]

Sorry I've been absent today. It's been way too busy for me this past day to keep up. I don't even know if I'll be able to before day ends

[thellama73]

I can believe that he won a lynch immunity given that LC is claiming the same. Either neither is lying or both are.

However, the important detail is whether it has been activated for today.

I believe I said it before. Welcome to the deathless world of Mongoose.

I'm going backwards through the thread and I have to stop here and ask what this is about. Do you really think Mongoose would have given away three Lynch immunities? That just seems, well, hardly believable. Did this happen in her other game and thats why you made this comment llama? Or did something similar happen?

Mongoose tends to not like people dying in her games. It's not impossible.

[thellama73]

To Made's point, when I've made frustrated "just lynch me already" appeals in the past, I've almost always ben civ. It's something I see a lot less from baddies.

Someone has to be first, so I will place my vote on INH now. We will see if he really protected himself or not.

[Quin]

Question for Made:

Where did your suspicion for 3J go? The other day you chose to lynch him over me, and now it's either me or INH? It sounds to me like you just want to be on a leading wagon.

[Marmot]

Mongoose tends to not like people dying in her games. It's not impossible.

[Sorsha]

I find the points on inh convincing. One problem I have with voting for him though is that I agree with his suspicion on jay...

Also... Long Con- what happened to your suspicion of jay?

I know still have some catching up to do yet but I'm not understanding how jay and LC were at each other's throats for days and now nothing.

[Sorsha]

INH- did you ever answer this question?

I will say that the last second flood of Wilgy votes once it was clear 3J ain't going nowhere rustles my jimmies a little bit. Couple of folks really wanted some credit, methinks.

Which votes in particular stood out to you?

[JaggedJimmyJay]

I know still have some catching up to do yet but I'm not understanding how jay and LC were at each other's throats for days and now nothing.

You'll see it as you continue reading.

[Sorsha]

^ I find it hard to believe that INH would have asked Wilgy if he was down for a Llama lynch in thread. Being teammates, he would already know the answer to that. I feel better about INH from this ISO

Why did you say this but then keep inh on your suspect list?

[thellama73]

^ I find it hard to believe that INH would have asked Wilgy if he was down for a Llama lynch in thread. Being teammates, he would already know the answer to that. I feel better about INH from this ISO

Why did you say this but then keep inh on your suspect list?

Because that was a thousand years ago and much has changed since then.