Phenon Mafia: ENDGAME - Snuffed

[Quin]

Spoiler: show

Stuff about the sig votes:

Golden (1st of 10) - First to voice suspicion of sig to my memory and first to vote accordingly. I can't blame him for maintaining his perspective late in the phase when sig's final contribution was essentially to plop a pointless vote on his face. I have no immediate beefs with this vote.

speedchuck (3rd of 10) - I kind of like this post. His comments about sig are more external than personal, but I think they're still meaningful. The approach is rather Slooneian, I think, in a good way. "Are there any good reasons not to lynch sig?" is the premier example of that.

JOH (4th of 10) - In his initial rainbow he had sig in the central yellow sector. Same story in the second rainbow. He questioned Golden for his sig vote when he initially placed it. I don't know why this post exists. He was critical of sig for his late arrival to the map claiming party. He does say there that this "factored in to his sig read already", which wouldn't seem to reflect in the rainbow positions or his brief dialogue with Golden. Compares him to Wilgy when he votes. The transition from "rainbow yellow" to "lynchable" isn't quite clear. The post in which he discusses map claims is the closest representation, which I would still assert results in an unclear transition. So that isn't ideal, and I could see potential for opportunism here.

Strawhenge (6th of 10) - Strawhenge voiced some confusion and then some suspicion about sig's behavior in the map claiming scenario. He ended up voting sig to help us reach the required 6 votes for soft lynch, but also voiced a preference for a Long Con vote given his previous ISO effort. I don't think this material looks especially good or bad, and I'll read Strawhenge at face value instead (I think he looks okay).

nutella (7th of 10) - She voiced some concern with sig and soon thereafter listed him very low on her rainbow. Starting here and in her next few posts thereafter she supported my suspicion of sig and expanded on her feelings. I don't think any of this looks alarming, and her content in general looks very town to me.

Dyslexicon (8th of 10) - Gave sig a little credit for a different tone to Dizzy's last experience on the site. He gave me a little crap for my reversal on sig. I think it looks authentic. Not a fan of a sig lynch, but prefers it over Wilgy. The perspective seems to worsen here. They voiced some interest, sort of in a CFD against Elohcin. Sub-null in a late rainbow. Agreed with my beef. I think the progression here looks fine, and I appreciate that Dizzy didn't care about holding consistent to their starting read. It should be noted that there may have been some amount of self-preservation here too; I don't recall the exact tally dynamic at this point.

DrWilgy (9th of 10) - I don't know if he's actually dead, so I'll check him too. His vote was participatory but not seemingly invested. "sig gon be pissed lol". This doesn't inspire confidence.

Quin (10th of 10) - He started by prodding his way into the discussion of sig, and soon after admitted he hadn't read the case. "sig is starting to feel like a runaway wagon". He participated in it 10 minutes later. This stuff makes me shrug, which is less good than some others.

~~~

Beyond the specific appearances of each vote relative to prior sig-related content, the positions of the votes within the wagons must also be considered. I tend to hate gigantic wagons like this because they're such a cozy place for scum to nestle their little heads, but I grant that it's a necessary component of a hammer game. I would call the votes that came after #6 essentially meaningless, because the soft lynch was secured. They're comparable in value to votes that weren't placed.

The sig votes that do the least for me are JOH, Wilgy, and Quin. The former two are more of an active problem though, while Quin is, like I said, a shrug.

I feel like this post displays a fair and understandable level of suspicion against me so I will address it in that light.

"This post" exists because I was trying to determine how serious Golden was. At the time, Sig had 1 or 2 short posts and little suspicion had been leveled against him. The deadline was approaching on Valentines Day. I took the Golden vote to be a "hey Sig" which I found potentially inappropriate because Sig might not answer. So then what? Unanswered iirc.

The map Spartacus thing was factored into my Sig read, making him slightly worse than a non poster. That's where I had him and why.

Sig transitioned from low yellow to orange with his non responses and Golden vote. He became like Wigly. Few posts. No posts that I liked. As stated in my rainbow, no red reads, making orange players acceotable. HCRealms tends to have votes time out for no lynch, which I loathe. So my Sig vote was opportunistic, but not in the way you mean. When my higher suspects (LC, Nacho) seemed unavailable, I pushed in the next best thing. This play style is evident in my "this post" as well as my early attempt to lynch Quin in Unfortunate Events.

This is the most legible assembling of Nacho's reads available, that I can find. He worked off of my POE and eliminated further:

Spoiler: show

Bad Guys R In Here:

Quin
Long Con
JOH
DrWilgy
Sorsha
speedchuck
Scotty
Elohcin
DFaraday
Dyslexicon
Nachomamma

Yeah it's a huge list. Don't care.

Remove me and speedchuck and maaaaaybe Quin and you're three steps closer to solving the game!
Why is Marmot a townread?

Quin
Long Con
JOH
DrWilgy
Sorsha/Sloonei
Scotty
Elohcin
DFaraday
Dyslexicon

This is the list reduced to his recommendations. It is important to state that I don't think Nacho's reads were God's Gift to Our Mafia Game and all perfect, but given my belief that there might be discernible kill motive, it's a decent way to explore that.

I've taken my prior assertions and removed some more names. Quin's color is "fading" given the "maaaaybe", and I remove him yet per my spilled brain matter. Scotty and Long Con too. I dropped Elohcin and DFaraday because if they're bad I Then given my sig vote checks, I highlight the overlapping potential problem area (orange). I'd call those two prominent suspects right now when I coalesce all of my brain goop into one bubbling soup.

I feel like this post is not a fair one and it further degrades my early confidence in you.

The theory you are presenting is "Nacho was confident in his reads so maybe he correctly read a scummer and the mafia silenced him." This is followed up with not a list of Nacho's scum reads, but a list of YOUR scum reads, which includes Nacho, which Nacho then takes himself and a few others off of and jokingly declares the game closer to being solved.

So if your theory is that I killed Nacho because he was "confident" that I was scum based on one joke response to your self described "huge" list of suspects for which you then crossed out half of...why didn't I just kill you instead? Indeed, you caught me fair and square in Christmas Mafia when you replaced in for Sock. Additionally, your town credit was waining at the end of the day, making you an unlikely doctor target. So again, if I'm killing players who I'm worried are on to me and my scumbuddies, why would I kill Nacho instead of you?

Let's dig a little deeper. At the time of your post declaring me potential scum, I had no posts. Do you think your read on me prior to me making any posts holds weight? Do you think Nacho's jokey agreement with it holds weight?

You crossed off several players from your early scum list as not likely to kill Nacho (lol) on night 1 for meta reasons. I'm doing so, you've also POEd them from the list of Nacho's (your) suspects. Yet in truth, it is an 11 suspect list in a 21 player game. Do you think that anyone would be rightly worried about being on an 11 player suspect list? Or an 8 player one?

Let's look at Nacho's actual reads and interactions with me, which you've presumably read.

Spoiler: show

Other people that could die are Soneji for his perspective on Silver Lantern who is painfully and unmistakably obvtown, and Scotty for lame presence this game when he had awesome presence as town last game and underwhelming presence as scum.

I think Strawhenge joins Silver Lantern and Fred for my "bet the farm" townreads, feel pretty good about the big three in Quin/JJJ/Golden so far although incidentally those three is where I'm the most cautious in my townreading.

Also townreading nutella and INH and probably other people to a degree less than the SUPATOWN group but more than the big three. Am sure that I'm missing things but too tired to figure out what, fading out now.

Actual scum reads from Nacho? Scotty and Sonjei. He also expresses confidence in the Dizzy train. Later, he walks back from Dizzy and Sonjei.

I give Nacho grief for the above post and we have a bit of back and forth during which Nacho expresses no real suspicion of either me or Wigly and admits that his overconfidence is in part an act/tactic and not necessarily a representation of his read confidence.

Spoiler: show

*snip*

I don't like Nachos's "okay, I've found scum" and "these folks are obviously town" posts. Like, bro, you had me fooled last game but I don't get the impression you're THAT good, know what I mean? Has Sorsha/Sonjei's problem of me only ever playing with scum Nacho (and 10 years ago over the top bulldog townie Nacho) so I can't answer "but would he do this anyway as a townie?"

*snip*

ORANGE
Sorsha
Nacho
Sonjei
That guy who looks like Scotty but isn't Scotty. Who was like "I lied about my town read"
RED
Dizzy

Jack: I'm not that good, but the reason why I'm considered as aggressive as I am is because I often use strongly worded rhetoric to make points that I feel strongly about/want people to zero in on for some reason. I'm confused why you think it's a scumtell for me when I mislynched you in such spectacular fashion last time you saw me as town and it certainly wasn't a big part of my game when I was scum unless I'm missing something completely.

Being forward and aggressive isn't scummy.

Acting like your job is done, patting yourself on the back and then coasting is. Not sure if you've actually coasted but hey, appropriate response to appropriate level of scumminess in my eyes. Minor. But more than most players at this point.

You never declared your work done when you got me lynched way back when.

Oh, that makes more sense.

Finding a silver platter slip is different from pushing through a strong scumread, the "my work is done, I'm voting scum" wasn't implying that I caught Dizzy or anything to that effect; I was merely noting that it was less urgent for me to catch up that second and was considering sleeping, but ended up catching up anyways.

Based on all of the above, JJJ, I consider you placing me as your "top suspect" and your reasons for doing so to be disingenuous.

Had a look at the highlighted for more context. First though is that this douchebag's already got 6 pages of content. Slow it down, you're busy, remember? I'm not a fan of this. It's a POE list, and the entire premise is that you go on that list until you've shown that you deserve not to be. Not having posted is a guarantee that you'd be on that list, so this is a silly argument to make.

I agree with the observation that 3J made about Jack's read on sig 'factoring into his existing read' not being reflected in his posts. I see that sig was leaning town on his rainbow list before this. My impression of Jack after being his teammate in ASOUE is that he doesn't keep he thoughts to himself very much. I'm more likely to call this a contradiction than a case of Jack just not having said everything that was on his mind.

[Quin]

I made an oopsie. Jack had sig as his top null read. I had CTRL+F'd for sig and it was highlighted. I'm slightly less wary, but I still believe in what I said about his meta.

[Jackofhearts2005]

I think there may be some insight available in this Nacho kill. Yeah, WIFOM, I don't care. Thoughts:

~ He was generally given credit more often than not, but he wasn't given the most credit. There were a few other players, namely nutella and Golden, who were town read more universally. So I don't think that's likely to be the sole motive for a Nacho kill.

~ It was only his second game on the site, and his first as a civilian. If we're in a one-mafia-team scenario here, I think the driving voice behind that kill is more likely to be someone who is not a Syndicate regular. Most Syndicate regulars on this roster would be less inclined to kill a visitor on Night 1. It's technically not "wrong", but it's lame. The reason I distinguish one mafia team specifically is that if that's the case, it's likely a larger team which would by default clue that team a little bit into their solitude. In this situation they know themselves to be mafia and everyone else to not be mafia, or at least they have a reason to believe that. This means Nacho is being offed as a suspected civilian on Night 1 in his first civilian game on this website. I reiterate: lame. People I think would look better in this are Syndicate regulars who played with him last time: Quin, Golden, Scotty, Long Con, Soneji, Wilgy, Marmot, INH, Eloh. That's too many people, but I can reduce it further by focusing on those who I'd expect to have a prominent voice in Mafia BTSC: Quin, Golden, Scotty, and Long Con. Possibily Marmot and INH.

I know that's a crapload of speculation, but it was in my head and now it's in yours. Chew on it and do with it whatever you like.

~ He was not shy about stating confident reads. He might have been on the right track with enough of them to frighten the scum into killing him immediately despite not being the most-town-read player there was.

Jay said this, but remembered about Monkey Island later. I'll put the tinfoil away for once and say that I don't believe he was lying about misremembering. With that in mind, I don't think 3J would support a kill on who he considered a visitor. It's a nice look.

Agreed.

I want to be devil's advocate and say he's making up a reason he wouldn't kill Nacho when he'd really have no problem doing it but...I believe he wanted to play with Nacho, perhaps more than I believe he misremembered the game.

I guess I need to look at the flavor again. I wasn't pinpointing Nacho as for sure mafia killed, though from a threat perspective, he'd be a better target than Wigly, who was a lynch candidate and was not scumhunting.

Still not really certain of the Syndicate kill meta (though I get that it differs from player to player). Could anyone walk me through kill target discussions/ choices in recent mafia games? Why did you kill who you did, especially on Day 1-3?

[Quin]

I'm at page 30, but I have to go out. I'll finish catching up before starting with Champs, which is going to take even longer

[Quin]

I think there may be some insight available in this Nacho kill. Yeah, WIFOM, I don't care. Thoughts:

~ He was generally given credit more often than not, but he wasn't given the most credit. There were a few other players, namely nutella and Golden, who were town read more universally. So I don't think that's likely to be the sole motive for a Nacho kill.

~ It was only his second game on the site, and his first as a civilian. If we're in a one-mafia-team scenario here, I think the driving voice behind that kill is more likely to be someone who is not a Syndicate regular. Most Syndicate regulars on this roster would be less inclined to kill a visitor on Night 1. It's technically not "wrong", but it's lame. The reason I distinguish one mafia team specifically is that if that's the case, it's likely a larger team which would by default clue that team a little bit into their solitude. In this situation they know themselves to be mafia and everyone else to not be mafia, or at least they have a reason to believe that. This means Nacho is being offed as a suspected civilian on Night 1 in his first civilian game on this website. I reiterate: lame. People I think would look better in this are Syndicate regulars who played with him last time: Quin, Golden, Scotty, Long Con, Soneji, Wilgy, Marmot, INH, Eloh. That's too many people, but I can reduce it further by focusing on those who I'd expect to have a prominent voice in Mafia BTSC: Quin, Golden, Scotty, and Long Con. Possibily Marmot and INH.

I know that's a crapload of speculation, but it was in my head and now it's in yours. Chew on it and do with it whatever you like.

~ He was not shy about stating confident reads. He might have been on the right track with enough of them to frighten the scum into killing him immediately despite not being the most-town-read player there was.

Jay said this, but remembered about Monkey Island later. I'll put the tinfoil away for once and say that I don't believe he was lying about misremembering. With that in mind, I don't think 3J would support a kill on who he considered a visitor. It's a nice look.

Agreed.

I want to be devil's advocate and say he's making up a reason he wouldn't kill Nacho when he'd really have no problem doing it but...I believe he wanted to play with Nacho, perhaps more than I believe he misremembered the game.

I guess I need to look at the flavor again. I wasn't pinpointing Nacho as for sure mafia killed, though from a threat perspective, he'd be a better target than Wigly, who was a lynch candidate and was not scumhunting.

Still not really certain of the Syndicate kill meta (though I get that it differs from player to player). Could anyone walk me through kill target discussions/ choices in recent mafia games? Why did you kill who you did, especially on Day 1-3?

In Mad Max I killed whoever I wanted because it was fun. I left two confirmed townies alive until LYLO.

[Golden]

I guess that's not helpful but I'm really confused by the vote.

Also should I hammer with at 9:59:59 I was going to refrain from voting because of the drama, but since it seems to be a mad dash just put a vote on anybody, not voting seems counter productive.

Golden, you mentioned wanting to look at people who considered throwing the hammer down on sig without actually doing so. What are your thoughts here?

Fred is actually a good example of what I mean. Dizzy was saying he wanted the day to end so he could go to bed, I find it more likely a civilian would have indulged him without caring what it looked like, than a mafia who might be worried about looking bad.

[insertnamehere]

INH calls the specific parts of Silver's post where Silver points out useless posts as also useless.

Lolwut?

If you think my opinions are useless, fine. I can't really do anything with that.

He also didn't offer any reasoning as to why my post was useless, therefore making his criticism, ultimately, useless.

[Golden]

Hey, inh. Do you have any reads you'd like to share?

[JaggedJimmyJay]

I may be gone for the phase. I'll see what I can do tomorrow. I'm okay with my Elohcin vote.

[Quin]

My immediate perspective of Sloonei is positive for a reason I will share later.

I'll expand now that Golden has responded: I appreciated Sloonei's willingness to provide thoughts like these about Golden, against the grain. To jump into the game and express a few pings about someone who is generally trusted in this thread is decent evidence of Sloonei's genuine concern about those points and his desire to state them. Mafia are generally just less likely to behave that way, especially Sloonei who I would qualify as a very careful player.

I don't agree with the pings though. I think Golden is typically willing to invoke WIFOM to explain himself; it's a mindset I understand because I share it. I don't think WIFOM is inherently suspicious, and indeed I think many players are too quick to ignore that stuff.

I don't agree with this. I don't expect Sloonei would have any concerns about throwing suspicion at trusted or skillful players. I see both you and him in the same light that way.

[Quin]

There's probably at least one scum between JOH, JJJ, Strawhenge, and Golden, but I'm gonna wait until I have a little more info to try to ferret that out. The amount of anti-alignment in these is palpable, in my eyes. I will also be looking at this later in the day.

Is there a particular reason you place these names together in this group?

1. It is my experience that, in most mafia games (esp. when town is struggling to get strong scumreads), at least one Mafioso will be very engaged. Others try to stay out of his way a bit more, or directly engage him. Either way, these selected are active players, strawhenge on the slightly lesser side because of his disappearance and sudden reversal on the fakeslip.
2. I have seen a lot of argument between JOH/JJJ, JJJ/Strawhenge, Golden/JJJ, and some other pairs. Basically, these all look to be engaged players, and none of them look particularly aligned.
3. The arguments that I've seen look very anti-aligned, but they still weasel out into being differences in gameplay style, and apologies go around. The defensive twists that turn everything on end like that worry me. It would surprise me to have THAT MUCH of this type of conflict among town. More of a correlation thing for me then causation, but enough for me to want to look at it today.
4. (Biggest reason) Gut. I do have decent townreads on these four. That probably needs to change, for me at least. That's how I feel. I'm going to try to find out what my gut is telling me before calling for lynch wagons or anything.

An idea, or a question, really:
JOH, JJJ, Strawhenge, and Golden: Who is most likely to be scum out of the other three in this group?
You're the ones that have been debating/disputing a bit, so your opinions probably matter to me.

Oh, I see how it is

[nutella]

Haven't sorted out how I feel about the jay/Quin exchange. I do think the focus on information is odd though. I'm familiar with info dumping being either pretty highly discouraged if not illegal, or with people sometimes hinting at having info but usually fairly subtly. But even with people claiming to have info, I find asking about night results in general as jjj did to be pretty weird especially when we don't even know what the role abilities are.

Not have I figured out how I feel about inh's sassy clapback defense. I'm tending to think it fits his typically zany personality, but I don't think that's necessarily alignment indicative either way for him.

Picking up dinner, I promise I'll get to that annotated rainbow eventually when I'm back at my computer.

[nutella]

Nor* have I figured out

[Quin]

Hey JOH, please tell me about your perspective of Quin.

Town. I like his observations. I like his reactions.

My one hesitation is he's much calmer and less tunnely than last game. This is better town play, it just doesn't 100% match his last pro town performance.

Still put him near the top of my rainbow list.

I'd say that there are a hundred different 'pro-town' performances you might see from me. How I approach a game (alignment aside, even) tends to have a lot to do with how I'm feeling at the time of posting. I can't really support a self-meta analysis like that on my own, but that's just how I perceive myself.

[nutella]

... Idk Q, posts like that make me less and less confident in you. That's a pretty scummy defense there. You're in danger of losing your green status

[Fredwood]

I want to see more of Dys, and I can't justify leaving it there because of gut.

But it's ok to lynch me in my first game...I'm confused as to wanting to lynch Dys so aggressively but now wanting to see more of them, and then voting for another person you haven't seen before.

You still haven't given any reason for a read, or your "gut" feeling, as amorphous as that terminology is, so there really isn't much chance for one to respond. Really, it all originated from an aside I made publicly stating my tempered reservations of your playstyle. Which I have explained twice, once to you specifically and once as a clarification to someone else that the concern was from general experience from being mislead before and not a statement about you specifically, and yet you still haven't made a rebuttal to further the discussion.

So either you're not paying attention and still taking a confrontational approach or you are now playing the "My gut" card just trying to sway the vote in the 11th hour to an unlikely lynch target. Feels a bit like CYA after pushing so hard on DYS, and now that it has soured and people are starting to get annoyed at people who are still voting for Dys, you're scrambling to get off the train you started.

Striking out the first paragraph, because that's where the misunderstandings came from.

I'm caught up to here, so it's time to revisit Fredwood.

I was explicit in my reason for suspecting you. You might be mistaking my mention of gut, which I was referring to Dys in. You never replied to me, but your response to 3J about it doesn't address my reason for suspicion at all. I felt ignored. It just elaborates on your point while changing your stance from a soft defense while simultaneously deferring based on a lack of info, to straight defense.

only reinforces my point. You defend Dys, but you're also saying at the same time 'But I don't know her, it could just be how she plays'.

I'm still not sure I follow. My "soft defense" was because I didn't view it as a slip. The whole fake slip thing had not been addressed at that point or even brought up iirc.

I think what I was saying is, I disnt see a reason outside of sheer stupidity for a legit slip of that magnitude. Additionally I didn't see a purpose to draw that much attention as a ploy for scum unless Dizzy was known as an incredibly risky player. I kind of viewed the whole thing as an exercise in drama wrangling out of a joke post.

When I was talking about deferring to others who had more experience with Diz (at that point I assumed incorrectly that Silver and I were the only new players here), so didn't know if she was known for these shenanigans and would have changed my assessment of the situation if there was more information provided.

Basically until I'm proven wrong I'll assume I'm correct in my read.

[Dyslexicon]

Catch up Quote Post

Well crap, now there's 5 mafia alive and I have 0 scumreads.

I get this reference. How do you know WIlgy wasn't scum?

I kind of love this. Observant.

It would have been easy to justify given dizzy was essentially asking someone to. I feel like this could be noteworthy. Eg, did anyone express suspicion of sig but hold back from the hammer?

I wasn't really asking someone to, as I also said it would be good if Sig showed up before day end. But it's probably true that some could perceive me to be asking for it.

Did Dyslexicon ever explain the strategic benefit of the fake slip on Day 1? Was it just a reaction grab?

I tried explaining as much as I could. Basically just trying to create content/reactions/drama (which is very much my D1 playstyle). How I do it is not as important as that I do it (which is why I found the investigation of whether this particular tactic on my homesite (which is a totally different situation) was concretely "useful" in a black/white manner not relevant). Take it as a reaction grab/spontanious play out of curiousity/personality.

Wow, I should have just put the names in colour. That's hideous.

All your scum reads are sarcasm lol.

3J asked me if my role was tampered with/redirected/whatever, and to that I refuse to answer. It sounds like an attempt to figure out what type of role I have. Why are you asking me in particular?

Why would he be especially interested in your role as scum? It's extremely unsubtle if it's a rolefish attempt.

I'm just posting as I read so ignore it if you've been asked/answered this already, but can you explain all of these pairings? Do you still believe in any number of them now?

Let's see.
Nut/JJJ - JJJ's early hard defense of Nut is unlikely between teammates.
Golden/JJJ - for the interaction where JJJ pushed Golden and Golden pushed hard back. I mean, I have been tinfoiling Golden + JJJ, but that's probably just me being crazy. Plus the back to back Sig votes reinforces them not teamed imo. Plus, I wouldn't be mad if I lost to that performance.
Straw/JJJ - Similar to the Nut/JJJ reasoning in that there seemed to be an early buddying/trusting tone between them that I read unlikely teamed. This may be weaker though.
Silver/Soneji - For RAH RAH disagreement on D1.
Speed/Golden - I actually can't remember why I had this one. o.o

But yeah. I still agree with these (provided I find the reason for my Speed/Golden thing.

I would also like to add:
Fred/Quin - for their/your interaction late D1.

I still feel behind and am struggling to weigh in on a lot of cases because I simply do not have the full context of a lot or things going on in this game. This is not a complaint, just an update on my status. The prospect of reading the entire thread start to finish is daunting and strikes me as an exhausting waste of time, so instead I'd like to ask you all for a favor. If there are any particular series of events that you'd like me to look at or any specific players deserving of my attention, please point me in the right direction and I'll start digging around. If there's anything you think should be getting more attention than it is right now, I am dancing around and begging you to tell me about it, so please use me to your advantage. I have to work tonight and don't usually have energy for huge case-making afterwards, so I likely won't be doing much until tomorrow morning but I'm better off collecting a checklist of Things To Do ahead of time.

please and thanks

I would appreciate you looking into Marmot, as I don't think he's getting nearly enough love and attention. D1 I felt I was basically the only one bothering to question him. I take it you two are familiar as I remember both of you from my first game here.

Also taking a look at Scotty would be good, since you mentioned being able to read him.

Asking Sloonei and me for my history in info-dumping games.

Your reaction to my question led me to that. You reacted in a particular way that I think can be better understood with that information available to me. I'm hoping Sloonei can give me a quick take before I expand on that.

I see what JJJ is getting at here, I think.

[Quin]

... Idk Q, posts like that make me less and less confident in you. That's a pretty scummy defense there. You're in danger of losing your green status

I figured. But you'll notice that I'm one of Jack's strongest town reads, so to defend myself that way as scum would be counter-productive.

[Quin]

I want to see more of Dys, and I can't justify leaving it there because of gut.

But it's ok to lynch me in my first game...I'm confused as to wanting to lynch Dys so aggressively but now wanting to see more of them, and then voting for another person you haven't seen before.

You still haven't given any reason for a read, or your "gut" feeling, as amorphous as that terminology is, so there really isn't much chance for one to respond. Really, it all originated from an aside I made publicly stating my tempered reservations of your playstyle. Which I have explained twice, once to you specifically and once as a clarification to someone else that the concern was from general experience from being mislead before and not a statement about you specifically, and yet you still haven't made a rebuttal to further the discussion.

So either you're not paying attention and still taking a confrontational approach or you are now playing the "My gut" card just trying to sway the vote in the 11th hour to an unlikely lynch target. Feels a bit like CYA after pushing so hard on DYS, and now that it has soured and people are starting to get annoyed at people who are still voting for Dys, you're scrambling to get off the train you started.

Striking out the first paragraph, because that's where the misunderstandings came from.

I'm caught up to here, so it's time to revisit Fredwood.

I was explicit in my reason for suspecting you. You might be mistaking my mention of gut, which I was referring to Dys in. You never replied to me, but your response to 3J about it doesn't address my reason for suspicion at all. I felt ignored. It just elaborates on your point while changing your stance from a soft defense while simultaneously deferring based on a lack of info, to straight defense.

only reinforces my point. You defend Dys, but you're also saying at the same time 'But I don't know her, it could just be how she plays'.

I'm still not sure I follow. My "soft defense" was because I didn't view it as a slip. The whole fake slip thing had not been addressed at that point or even brought up iirc.

I think what I was saying is, I disnt see a reason outside of sheer stupidity for a legit slip of that magnitude. Additionally I didn't see a purpose to draw that much attention as a ploy for scum unless Dizzy was known as an incredibly risky player. I kind of viewed the whole thing as an exercise in drama wrangling out of a joke post.

When I was talking about deferring to others who had more experience with Diz (at that point I assumed incorrectly that Silver and I were the only new players here), so didn't know if she was known for these shenanigans and would have changed my assessment of the situation if there was more information provided.

Basically until I'm proven wrong I'll assume I'm correct in my read.

The crux of my argument against you is, in essence, that I didn't like how you threw your two cents on the idea of Dys's slip (before the fake-slip became a thing) while simultaneously saying you'd defer because of a lack of familiarity. You were essentially discrediting your own argument while maintaining the ability to claim that you weren't on board after the lynch. I don't get the impression that you were seeking input from other people when you said that.

[speedchuck]

There's probably at least one scum between JOH, JJJ, Strawhenge, and Golden, but I'm gonna wait until I have a little more info to try to ferret that out. The amount of anti-alignment in these is palpable, in my eyes. I will also be looking at this later in the day.

Is there a particular reason you place these names together in this group?

1. It is my experience that, in most mafia games (esp. when town is struggling to get strong scumreads), at least one Mafioso will be very engaged. Others try to stay out of his way a bit more, or directly engage him. Either way, these selected are active players, strawhenge on the slightly lesser side because of his disappearance and sudden reversal on the fakeslip.
2. I have seen a lot of argument between JOH/JJJ, JJJ/Strawhenge, Golden/JJJ, and some other pairs. Basically, these all look to be engaged players, and none of them look particularly aligned.
3. The arguments that I've seen look very anti-aligned, but they still weasel out into being differences in gameplay style, and apologies go around. The defensive twists that turn everything on end like that worry me. It would surprise me to have THAT MUCH of this type of conflict among town. More of a correlation thing for me then causation, but enough for me to want to look at it today.
4. (Biggest reason) Gut. I do have decent townreads on these four. That probably needs to change, for me at least. That's how I feel. I'm going to try to find out what my gut is telling me before calling for lynch wagons or anything.

An idea, or a question, really:
JOH, JJJ, Strawhenge, and Golden: Who is most likely to be scum out of the other three in this group?
You're the ones that have been debating/disputing a bit, so your opinions probably matter to me.

Oh, I see how it is

Hey man,
Part of it was gut. Strawhenge isn't really as active as you. Honest. I could suspect you too, if you want. <3

As for Quin's meta, I disagree with Nutella that Quin's 'defense' of it was bad. Quin has had several different styles of play, just in this game. I'm enjoying this one.

[Quin]

There's probably at least one scum between JOH, JJJ, Strawhenge, and Golden, but I'm gonna wait until I have a little more info to try to ferret that out. The amount of anti-alignment in these is palpable, in my eyes. I will also be looking at this later in the day.

Is there a particular reason you place these names together in this group?

1. It is my experience that, in most mafia games (esp. when town is struggling to get strong scumreads), at least one Mafioso will be very engaged. Others try to stay out of his way a bit more, or directly engage him. Either way, these selected are active players, strawhenge on the slightly lesser side because of his disappearance and sudden reversal on the fakeslip.
2. I have seen a lot of argument between JOH/JJJ, JJJ/Strawhenge, Golden/JJJ, and some other pairs. Basically, these all look to be engaged players, and none of them look particularly aligned.
3. The arguments that I've seen look very anti-aligned, but they still weasel out into being differences in gameplay style, and apologies go around. The defensive twists that turn everything on end like that worry me. It would surprise me to have THAT MUCH of this type of conflict among town. More of a correlation thing for me then causation, but enough for me to want to look at it today.
4. (Biggest reason) Gut. I do have decent townreads on these four. That probably needs to change, for me at least. That's how I feel. I'm going to try to find out what my gut is telling me before calling for lynch wagons or anything.

An idea, or a question, really:
JOH, JJJ, Strawhenge, and Golden: Who is most likely to be scum out of the other three in this group?
You're the ones that have been debating/disputing a bit, so your opinions probably matter to me.

Oh, I see how it is

Hey man,
Part of it was gut. Strawhenge isn't really as active as you. Honest. I could suspect you too, if you want. <3

As for Quin's meta, I disagree with Nutella that Quin's 'defense' of it was bad. Quin has had several different styles of play, just in this game. I'm enjoying this one.

Yes please. I'm like tinkerbell. If people stop paying attention to me, I'll die.

[Dyslexicon]

Catch up Other Notes Post

1. So here's my reaction to JJJ's NK analysis:



In my experience, NK analysis is extremely hard to do and involves a lot of assumptions that if you're town you have no way of knowing. How the mafia team dynamic is and what they base their decision on and who ultimately makes that decision is highly complex and circumstantial and involves so much unknown information that it's basically pointless to speculate about it. I don't put much weight into this analysis and not sure what it's supposed to do or help us with. Furthermore, this is a closed game, making it even more speculative.

What I do think is true is that JJJ would not prefer to kill Nacho himself. What this tells me is that JJJ probably did not (intentionally) kill Nacho. It's possible JJJ is particularly devilish as scum (which I won't fault anyone for) and make this argument while having murdered Nacho with cold blood, but I find that type of argument unlikely, because it's unnecessary.

@JJJ, Why did you find it necessary to bring this up at all though, the fact that you were unlikely to kill Nacho?


2. I agree with Silver that INH's vote at EOD looks bad. I don't get much of a read on INH at all, and I find him to be particularly on the side of almost all discussion. Haven't seen him give much in terms of reads or opinions on other players that I can remember. Who here is familiar with him? Is this normal?

3. @JOH, You mentioned you had a theory of me and Straw being teamed on D1. Can you explain this more? I find it very curious given our interaction even before my fakeslip, as he seemed to get upset with me for my crude way of expressing suspicion towards him. I'm me, so I have a different perspective, but I find it odd that you would view our interaction as possible distancing. You also mentioned D1, if iirc, that you had me/Scotty as not teamed (?) Can you expand on this?

4. I'm intrigued by Golden's unsure read on Straw. I should maybe revisit my own read on him, since I did have an initial bad gut feeling. I'm also intrigued by whoever gave account for JOH being a good scum player and will take this into consideration.

5. Analysing the Sig wagon is all fine and dandy. However, I find it just as interesting to analyse the votes that fell outside of this or the ones that didn't vote at all. I don't find that any D1 mislynch is super likely to have a ton of scum in it, rather I think scum are more afraid of getting blood on their hands early in the game while town is very capable of mislynching on their own. This point can be WIFOMed, but I don't think where a particular vote ended is as important as why.

---

At this point I'm wanting to use Occam's Razor on JJJ and just say it's more likely that he's town. Even if I keep seeing things that makes me hm a bit, I can't deny that his actions seems natural and pro-town and just unlikely to be scum. I also would not be upset to lose to a scum!JJJ (maybe a dumb argument, but that's just how I feel right now). I ...don't know. Ironically the whole feeling I have reminds me so much of how I was lulled in by Moving in my first game after initially thinking he was scum. But I'm going to say that ignorance is bliss and Occam has his uses.

Sometimes I feel that Golden acts like I'm confirmed town.

I remember seeing something EOD 1 that made me more suspicious of Speed once Sig flipped town. Will look again.

Suspicions I guess on Marmot/Eloh/Speed, but maybe also LC/INH/Soneji.

---

I find it quite hard to get reads in this game, and this is just me ranting for my own sanity. I usually rely quite heavily upon meta. And it annoys me that I didn't stick to my gut feel on Sig, cause that was actually based on whatever little meta I had, but I completely forgot about it. Speaking of, I had the opposite gut on LC, in that he was town last game and this game he feels a bit different to me.

Silver stikes me as more town. The one thing that throws me off is that he will have this stubborn and aggressive discussion with someone (in which I often disagree with his logic, even if I can see where he is coming from), and then suddenly he will switch gears and just go "Alright, that makes sense now. I can see what you are saying". And it's a completely different energy. He did it with me D1 and he did it with Sloonei this day. Is this normal for Silver?
@Fred @JOH?

I feel Sloonei comes across as more town than not.

[Golden]

If people stop paying attention to me, I'll die.

Infoclaim

[Quin]

If people stop paying attention to me, I'll die.

Infoclaim

I need to be quoted in increasing increments of one every phase. Don't let my light go out.

[Quin]

I'm caught up now. Here's some stuff:

I'm not interested in an Eloh lynch. She hasn't done much more than justify her Day 1 vote, and I'm not pinged by what she had to say at all.
I don't suspect Scotty. His mention that he thinks the big talkers are circumventing is something that's been pinging around in my head for a while. I appreciate that he thinks so too.

I'm likely to vote between Fredwood and Jack, probably in that order. I could entertain 3J.

[Golden]

Sometimes I feel that Golden acts like I'm confirmed town.

Not sure exactly what you're seeing or how you mean this, but I tend to act like everyone is town. Even when I suspect someone on one hand, I don't want to ignore their perspective on things on the other, in case I'm wrong. I think I'm much better at figuring out who is town than who is bad, so this also aids my hunting approach.

[Fredwood]

So because I didn't phrase my objection as a question is why I'm at the top of your list? I mean if someone has more experience on the matter why wouldn't I defer to them...it would be illogical and boorish for me not to.

Or that I went out on a limb and defended a player I knew nothing about?

Either way I still don't get your objection, I don't see how I discredited my defense because I was still defending them.
How else would I have approached defending someone I didn't know? I wasn't interested in pursuing a lynch and thought the amount of pressure was dumb but was still being polite. If I was convinced otherwise I would have said as much, I was never convinced.

[Golden]

OK, its time I need to make a vote, so:

vote insertnamehere

If Eloh is lynched, so be it. The most persuasive reason I have against is she is an attractive vig target, and based on the flavour text around the Wilgy death I can see there being a vig in the game, so I'm willing to give that a chance to happen instead of wasting a lynch on someone who has no content to read.

INH, on the other hand, I'm used to him having strong views and declaring them, and I'm not seeing that. What's more, I don't feel as though he's engaged with criticisms, or where he has he's been simply dismissive, and I don't like the feel it gives me.

[Quin]

I admit to an extent my skepticism of 3J might just be that I'm forming this expectation in my head for what his baddie game should be like. I've gone after him twice in a game where we were both civilians for what's probably the same reason.

[Dyslexicon]

Also, I want to say that iirc I found it pretty easy to read Marmot as town that one game I played here. And this game I'm certainly not getting the same feeling. I know he's busy with multiple games, and while that is a fair excuse for not being as active, it doesn't make him town. He's still one of my top suspicions and I want to have a cup of tea with him and talk about life.

Speed still has good tone, but I can't shake the unsettling feeling that his erring in his read on me is scummy. It read like not stopping a potential mislynch, while staying clean of it himself. Arguing that my slip was not for real is simply too easy to do.

Also, the post that pinged me EOD:

sig is starting to feel like a runaway wagon.

On the one hand, duh, there's an hour left in the day and people want to commit.

On the other hand, yay, stuff to analyze tomorrow morning!

NO DOWNSIDES, LET'S RUN WITH IT YEAH

Looking at it now, it doesn't look as bad to me, as it's in response to something. But the "we should analyse this tomorrow" thing I've seen more from scum than town. But then, I think I disagree with myself a bit, since Speed was also on this wagon. So *makes farting noises*
I originally remembered this as him saying "It will be interesting to analyze this wagon tomorrow" - which would look much worse.

[Fredwood]

I could have sworn I quoted Quin's quote pyramid in my last post

[Dyslexicon]

Sometimes I feel that Golden acts like I'm confirmed town.

Not sure exactly what you're seeing or how you mean this, but I tend to act like everyone is town. Even when I suspect someone on one hand, I don't want to ignore their perspective on things on the other, in case I'm wrong. I think I'm much better at figuring out who is town than who is bad, so this also aids my hunting approach.

It's not for how you interact with me (actually thinking about it, I don't think we've interacted much? Hi.), but more so in your analysis of votes and wagons and how people are treating me, it seems like you assume that I'm town. Both with the reactions to my fakeslip and in regards to the wagon on me. I don't know what this means, it's just a feeling I had and I wrote it out.

[Quin]

I could have sworn I quoted Quin's quote pyramid in my last post

I read it. Your responses just aren't doing it for me. I'll see how your approach other stuff over the rest of the day before I decide if I want to settle my vote on you.

[Quin]

Anyway, I've spent 5 hours in this game and my champs game has been neglected for long enough. Time to stop.

[Silver Lantern]

Silver stikes me as more town. The one thing that throws me off is that he will have this stubborn and aggressive discussion with someone (in which I often disagree with his logic, even if I can see where he is coming from), and then suddenly he will switch gears and just go "Alright, that makes sense now. I can see what you are saying". And it's a completely different energy. He did it with me D1 and he did it with Sloonei this day. Is this normal for Silver?

I know you're not asking me, but I would say, no, it's not usual for me. I usually I get blinders on and just keep on arguing to my detriment. I almost did it with Soneji D1, who btw, has been inconspicuously missing today.

I am trying to elevate my game fwiw, and part of that is being more reasonable than I tend to be on my homesite. Besides, everyone here is pretty advanced so they're pretty decent at making arguments in their defense.

But to really answer your question, I stopped arguing because the other person's posts and points became logical to me in the points they were making. By contrast I didn't really get that vibe from INH's response to my ISO. Just felt like more fluff to try to counter my calling out his fluff. :/

[Dyslexicon]

I find that I have disagreed with a lot of the reasons for Quin's suspicions, but I'm still inclined to read them as town. Is this weird?

If I were to go on a limb, which I will, I'd say town:
Nut, Silver, Fred, JJJ, Golden, Quin and Scotty (very gut on the last one).

I did have town feels of JOH and Straw, but I feel these should be up for reviewing after this day (mostly by virtue of second hand info).

Would vote Marmot, INH and LC atm. Eloh, sure, but can be vigged. If she's town, another lurker lynch would suck.

Lynch INH

Wagon wagon.

[Dyslexicon]

Silver stikes me as more town. The one thing that throws me off is that he will have this stubborn and aggressive discussion with someone (in which I often disagree with his logic, even if I can see where he is coming from), and then suddenly he will switch gears and just go "Alright, that makes sense now. I can see what you are saying". And it's a completely different energy. He did it with me D1 and he did it with Sloonei this day. Is this normal for Silver?

I know you're not asking me, but I would say, no, it's not usual for me. I usually I get blinders on and just keep on arguing to my detriment. I almost did it with Soneji D1, who btw, has been inconspicuously missing today.

I am trying to elevate my game fwiw, and part of that is being more reasonable than I tend to be on my homesite. Besides, everyone here is pretty advanced so they're pretty decent at making arguments in their defense.

But to really answer your question, I stopped arguing because the other person's posts and points became logical to me in the points they were making. By contrast I didn't really get that vibe from INH's response to my ISO. Just felt like more fluff to try to counter my calling out his fluff. :/

Alright. This makes sense. And if you're town, as I suspect, I think it's very positive that you're trying to consider the arguments carefully without going too tunnel mode, while at the same time applying pressure where you feel it's due.

[Dyslexicon]

Oh, and happy birthday, LC!

[Fredwood]

Silver stikes me as more town. The one thing that throws me off is that he will have this stubborn and aggressive discussion with someone (in which I often disagree with his logic, even if I can see where he is coming from), and then suddenly he will switch gears and just go "Alright, that makes sense now. I can see what you are saying". And it's a completely different energy. He did it with me D1 and he did it with Sloonei this day. Is this normal for Silver?
@Fred @JOH?

I feel Sloonei comes across as more town than not.

Silver's way of probing for a reaction to get information. It's like if you're negotiating and you open strong to disguise your true expectations, so if someone meets your expectations there's no reason to continue strong. So if he's saying you're "orange" he probably only thinks you're yellow, so the resolution is probably a bit jarring because you were expecting to defend yourself harder. Just watch out if he decides to Roleplay, then everyone is in trouble.

[Marmot]

How does going against the grain make a player genuine?

It doesn't always. It depends upon the person and the circumstance. Sloonei had some concerns about Golden that he wanted to voice, and he did so without concern for standing opposite the general consensus about Golden otherwise -- it's not a lynch he is likely going to be able to generate on Day 2, which means there's little room for opportunism. The more likely reality is that he really is concerned, which would be a good thing. I also don't think it's likely he was deliberately pursuing a read like this one either.

Touche

Where the hell is LC?

Fred, Nut, what do you think of LC right now?

And Speed.

Asking what I think of LC, or what Fred and Nut think of me?

LC is looking better. His absence today is accounted for, and he has some towny posts to his name. An ISO might prove otherwise, but I'm at light town on him, where I was once light scum.

This is mafia, the game where everything is made up and the points don't matter.

Why are you keeping score at home? Do you have a leaderboard where you add and subtract points from players base on baddie and civvie posts?

Marmot looked bad to me early, then benefited from going after Dizzy a bit while I was semi tunneling (and semi devils advocating) on Dizzy. In hindsight, it doesn't look great. Like in Unfortunate Events, I'm seeing some chaos and messing but not a ton of hunting. Scum?

How did I benefit from going after Dizzy?

People often mafia while drunk here.

I'm generally pretty carefree with my posts, but WOW that seems like a terrible idea
To be fair, I've never had any alcohol in my system.

Thanks for the heads up there, though.

goin thru some ol' posts? that's cool...

Is magic bagging common here? (being like "Have info" or "have power role" and stuff)

What's the problem?

There are two rules to mafiaing while drfunk.

• 1) Having two drinks (shot of liquor, glass of wine, pint of beer, etc.) constitutes being drunk. User alcohol tolerance is a factor.
  2) If a player is "drunk", that player is forbidden from using the backspace key.

Welcome to Drfunk mafia!

[Golden]

Sometimes I feel that Golden acts like I'm confirmed town.

Not sure exactly what you're seeing or how you mean this, but I tend to act like everyone is town. Even when I suspect someone on one hand, I don't want to ignore their perspective on things on the other, in case I'm wrong. I think I'm much better at figuring out who is town than who is bad, so this also aids my hunting approach.

It's not for how you interact with me (actually thinking about it, I don't think we've interacted much? Hi.), but more so in your analysis of votes and wagons and how people are treating me, it seems like you assume that I'm town. Both with the reactions to my fakeslip and in regards to the wagon on me. I don't know what this means, it's just a feeling I had and I wrote it out.

Fair enough. From my perspective, it's not that you're town, it's just that the fakeslip is terrible logic for why you are bad (as became clear when you explained it and shared the link), and I don't have a lot of patience with the ongoing suspicion of the slip after that point when it seems patently incorrect to me.

Having said that, I do town read you, and I am in the habit of defending people and acting high and mighty, which is probably not the most flattering side of my personality.

[Fredwood]

Silver stikes me as more town. The one thing that throws me off is that he will have this stubborn and aggressive discussion with someone (in which I often disagree with his logic, even if I can see where he is coming from), and then suddenly he will switch gears and just go "Alright, that makes sense now. I can see what you are saying". And it's a completely different energy. He did it with me D1 and he did it with Sloonei this day. Is this normal for Silver?

I know you're not asking me, but I would say, no, it's not usual for me. I usually I get blinders on and just keep on arguing to my detriment. I almost did it with Soneji D1, who btw, has been inconspicuously missing today.

I am trying to elevate my game fwiw, and part of that is being more reasonable than I tend to be on my homesite. Besides, everyone here is pretty advanced so they're pretty decent at making arguments in their defense.

But to really answer your question, I stopped arguing because the other person's posts and points became logical to me in the points they were making. By contrast I didn't really get that vibe from INH's response to my ISO. Just felt like more fluff to try to counter my calling out his fluff. :/

Lol, see I've got in arguments with you where I got the same feeling that I think Dizzy was getting, oh brother, then it get's dropped rather easily and I'm left a bit confused. I don't really think we've ever been in a tunnel vision war because I 'think' I'm a diffuser, so contrary to current evidence, I don't meet strength with strength usually, so I usually just assumed that some of it was bluster.

[Marmot]

Jay said this, but remembered about Monkey Island later. I'll put the tinfoil away for once and say that I don't believe he was lying about misremembering. With that in mind, I don't think 3J would support a kill on who he considered a visitor. It's a nice look.

Agreed.

I want to be devil's advocate and say he's making up a reason he wouldn't kill Nacho when he'd really have no problem doing it but...I believe he wanted to play with Nacho, perhaps more than I believe he misremembered the game.

I guess I need to look at the flavor again. I wasn't pinpointing Nacho as for sure mafia killed, though from a threat perspective, he'd be a better target than Wigly, who was a lynch candidate and was not scumhunting.

Still not really certain of the Syndicate kill meta (though I get that it differs from player to player). Could anyone walk me through kill target discussions/ choices in recent mafia games? Why did you kill who you did, especially on Day 1-3?[/quote]

Nightkill analysis isn't a common strategy here. But that's mainly because nightkilled targets are janitored.

Is it a thing where you come from?

[Dyslexicon]

A wild Marmot appeared!

@MM, I'm suspicious of you. How caught up are you?

[Marmot]

Also, I want to say that iirc I found it pretty easy to read Marmot as town that one game I played here. And this game I'm certainly not getting the same feeling. I know he's busy with multiple games, and while that is a fair excuse for not being as active, it doesn't make him town. He's still one of my top suspicions and I want to have a cup of tea with him and talk about life.

I'm having a beer at the moment (surprise surprise), and I'm busy.

Hi! How're you doing? What did you want to talk about?

[Dyslexicon]

@Fred, Roger that. Silver is probably town, it's just this one thing confused me a bit.

@Golden, Alright. Well, I don't know how much AI I can read out from this, but you are charming and have a very flattering personality anyway.


Also, because the image did not work and I had a sad about it, another attempt at me reacting to NK analysis:

[Marmot]

EBWOP:

Jay said this, but remembered about Monkey Island later. I'll put the tinfoil away for once and say that I don't believe he was lying about misremembering. With that in mind, I don't think 3J would support a kill on who he considered a visitor. It's a nice look.

Agreed.

I want to be devil's advocate and say he's making up a reason he wouldn't kill Nacho when he'd really have no problem doing it but...I believe he wanted to play with Nacho, perhaps more than I believe he misremembered the game.

I guess I need to look at the flavor again. I wasn't pinpointing Nacho as for sure mafia killed, though from a threat perspective, he'd be a better target than Wigly, who was a lynch candidate and was not scumhunting.

Still not really certain of the Syndicate kill meta (though I get that it differs from player to player). Could anyone walk me through kill target discussions/ choices in recent mafia games? Why did you kill who you did, especially on Day 1-3?

Nightkill analysis isn't a common strategy here. But that's mainly because nightkilled targets are janitored.

Is it a thing where you come from?

[Dyslexicon]

Also, I want to say that iirc I found it pretty easy to read Marmot as town that one game I played here. And this game I'm certainly not getting the same feeling. I know he's busy with multiple games, and while that is a fair excuse for not being as active, it doesn't make him town. He's still one of my top suspicions and I want to have a cup of tea with him and talk about life.

I'm having a beer at the moment (surprise surprise), and I'm busy.

Hi! How're you doing? What did you want to talk about?

Anything game related. I also want a beer though, but I had the last one I had in my fridge last night.

I'm wondering if you're caught up, because I had questions and stuff and I wondered if you had seen them?

[Marmot]

I have a question for you. Why do you call me Marmot?

What are your questions for me?

[Dyslexicon]

Oh! I think it was Speed who mentioned liking the idea of janitoring roles? (Please correct me if it was someone else). This may be tinfoil, but I found it suspicious, because I totally hate it when janitoring happens. As town, I'm most bothered by not knowing the role of someone who's flipped (although now it's possible Sir Wilgy the Good is not dead after all?). Anyway, the approach of "this is a fun mechanic" is not exactly the reaction I expect from town being denied information. But, I'm me, so I don't know if this is just a me-thought.