Phenon Mafia: ENDGAME - Snuffed

[Quin]

I still have a residual town read on LoRab every time I see her thanks to Mad Max. I could see her walking down the street and I'd let everyone around me know that she's definitely town.

I was thinking about how she tied it at EoD the other day. I thought about how beautiful it would have been if the roles were reversed and she was bad while pulling that stunt.

[Sloonei]

I just started scrolling through Scotty's Day 3 posts. He said this initially:

Them MM voters lookin real good right now by the by

Well done on catching him y'all

And then went on a tirade against the two people who hammered on metalmarsh.

[Sloonei]

I still have a residual town read on LoRab every time I see her thanks to Mad Max. I could see her walking down the street and I'd let everyone around me know that she's definitely town.

I was thinking about how she tied it at EoD the other day. I thought about how beautiful it would have been if the roles were reversed and she was bad while pulling that stunt.

I remember that thought crossing my mind at a certain point too. Nothing was impossible in that game.

[Quin]

I want to shift the focus of all the discussion onto Scotty. Everyone talk about Scotty. I command it.

I have no reason to town read him. I don't know that a blank interactive analysis necessarily means he's evil since I do see those often with civilians when I take on the same workload.

But there's nothing in his posts that I have seen that say to me "oh, there's civilian Scotty". I'd lynch him. He actually just gave me shit for my tracker claim not being accountable when I believe he soft claimed exactly something very early in the game. I don't know what it was. Did that ever become a hard claim? I haven't read everything.

Some of us threatened him with votes yesterday and he said he could verify his something claim in the night if we'd just leave him alive, and then when the thread opened back up on Day 3 he said "aw phooey, i was blocked."

If double targeting isn't a thing, I'd recommend giving him another shot and if he fails to deliver...

[Sloonei]

Oh, and this:

Okay I've sat on this long enough that we've seen people comment on Wigly and others avoid doing so, despite my request.

I killed Wigly, and unfortunately he was town. Sorry Wigly, but there was really nothing constructive at all from you on D1 when I ISOed you and i figured after Sig turned up town that taking out another suspicious D1 player would give us the most info on the reads of others towards you D1 as I was really hoping I was right about you being scum.

There goes the pants.

I don't know exactly what you are claiming, but would you please clarify:
Did you get Wigly's entire role, or just alignment?

I would ask, if this is a one-shot ability (a question on its own), why did you use it on day one? But I feel like any answer to that question would provide more value to mafia than town. I say this as a person used to power-claims. Please don't answer these latter questions unless you have a very good reason for doing so.

For the record, I tentatively believe Silver Lantern on this one.

If you believe Silver, why are you fishing for more info about his role?

I'm fishing for Wilgy's role. You know, the dead guy. I feel like that much info would be valuable to town, should it be provided.
I feel like info related to the one-shottedness of SL's role or role-related reasons for killing D1 (which I wouldn't do as a vig) would be of negative value to town. This is the conclusion I came to, based on my time playing. I can further explain my reasoning, should it be required, but I don't think that's your point.

If you disagree, please say so before he replies, and explain why. And if SL disagrees (having more information than I do), then he can ignore me. Edit before posting: As he (apparently) did.

That's beneficial to both parties and you know it.

So you agree that it would be beneficial to town?

[JaggedJimmyJay]

If double targeting isn't a thing, I'd recommend giving him another shot and if he fails to deliver...

If double targeting is a thing, he can get roleblocked again. Lynch or don't, there are no hall passes.

[Quin]

If double targeting isn't a thing, I'd recommend giving him another shot and if he fails to deliver...

If double targeting is a thing, he can get roleblocked again. Lynch or don't, there are no hall passes.

If that's the case. It's not explicitly said in the rules.

[Sloonei]

Scotty is back to the top of my still-incomplete list of suspects. I say we lynch him today, unless things change.

[JaggedJimmyJay]

If double targeting isn't a thing, I'd recommend giving him another shot and if he fails to deliver...

If double targeting is a thing, he can get roleblocked again. Lynch or don't, there are no hall passes.

If that's the case. It's not explicitly said in the rules.

I misunderstood you anyway, nevermind. Anyway I still don't like to give people time to "prove" roles, especially if they don't prove alignment. Scotty should talk further about which of those things he can prove.

[Sloonei]

I feel alright about Scotty. I put him in my GTH civ list because of my suspicion of Sloonei.

I have nothing else to say about him.

Do you still suspect me?

[Quin]

I feel alright about Scotty. I put him in my GTH civ list because of my suspicion of Sloonei.

I have nothing else to say about him.

Do you still suspect me?

Don't know. I want to ask you some more stuff but I don't want to lead you on.

[JaggedJimmyJay]

Gotta go again, and I may not have any chances to vote tomorrow. I haven't felt good about Scotty all game so I'll do that now:

Vote Scotty

I encourage y'all to maintain a productive dialogue though; no hammers allowed.

[Sloonei]

I feel alright about Scotty. I put him in my GTH civ list because of my suspicion of Sloonei.

I have nothing else to say about him.

Do you still suspect me?

Don't know. I want to ask you some more stuff but I don't want to lead you on.

Ask things!

[nutella]

There was something else fishy with it as well, and I feel like I've now put myself in the position where I have to be open, which I didn't really want to be, but here goes...

I'm a watcher. I watched Jay. If marmot did what you guys are suggesting and swapped fred and jay, I should have gotten 'golden targeted fred' but I didn't. I wasn't showing as watching fred, despite the fact the results I got were for Fred. I got that no-one was targeting Fred.

It should be noted that last night I was showing as targeting the player I watched. So I've since had that confirmation.

It was a baffling result for me. I still haven't figured it out. But it isn't entirely explained by the marmot role, even if that is part of what happened.

"As the Busdriver, you may target two targets, actions affecting each targets are switched"

OK, I've checked with sprit, but looking at this again, I can see how I might be still seen as 'targeting jay' as it's just my action that is switched and not my target. That makes sense.

Huh. This is bizarre and confusing but ok.

If you didn't get MM, he didn't busdrive Fred with JJJ. You were misdirected by someone targeting you or JJJ was nexused.

But wait. I was confused about this as well. I was wondering why you wouldn't have seen that MM targeted Fred. But then I thought it might be justified by the nature of the busdriver role. Like, picking two targets to switch wouldn't show up as targeting, because its purpose is to switch who's targeted. It operates on a different level. Maybe? Idk, it could make sense to me as being like this. A "host intricacy" as LC says.

[Sloonei]

Or simply express your concerns, if you're worried about leading. I assure you that I am town.

this was @ quin. hello nutella, tell me what you think of Scotty.

[nutella]

Aaand I see that Quin already mentioned that possibility (though seemed to hardly entertain it). But anyway I'm still a little behind.

But I just saw Sloonei's review of JJJ/Marmot interactions and it was fascinating. There's some fishiness in there for sure. I am not feeling super great about JJJ right now based on that. I'll have to look into him more because there were some solid reasons I've kept a town read on him (one that comes to mind is the not wanting to kill Nacho thing, even for WIFOM, but )

[JaggedJimmyJay]

Oh yeah. I voted north-west because

[Sloonei]

which direction did we go yesterday? i was too stoked on the marmot lynch to check.

[Jackofhearts2005]

@JJJ

I can go over it again but I'd rather not. Doesn't seem worth discussing.

It's damn near impossible for Marmot to have been behind Golden being misdirected from you to Fred.

I don't think you needed to claim but since you're now (assuming you are telling the truth) vanilla, I don't see much harm in it. I already assumed you were some sort of tracker but you could have maintained the illusion of still having a power, which is probably how I would have played it. You'd be surprised how many players will admit to targeting deaders if they think they were tracked.

I could Vote Scotty

Having to do a full reset on Quin and JJJ. Too many assumptions were made today. They'd be good ISO targets.

Still not a fan of Speed's. Don't like Marmot defending Eloh from me, earlier. Not a bunch of reason to weigh in on her if she's town. Might be reaching.

Would love to hear from INH on someone besides Sloonei.

[nutella]

One thing I've picked up on in this ambitious exercise: Dyslexicon is the towniest player in the game based solely on Metalmarsh's ISO.

I disagree. I am the ultimate townie. No townie has ever towned as town as I am towning in this game.

So far I've been getting all the love Hey, at least I voted for the confirmed baddie

[Sloonei]

One thing I've picked up on in this ambitious exercise: Dyslexicon is the towniest player in the game based solely on Metalmarsh's ISO.

I disagree. I am the ultimate townie. No townie has ever towned as town as I am towning in this game.

So far I've been getting all the love Hey, at least I voted for the confirmed baddie

You're the towniest player in the game based solely on the posts in this thread.

[Jackofhearts2005]

@Nut

Just about every HCRealms have had a watcher (reverse tracker) and a busdriver.

I've never seen a busdriver ignore watchers or trackers before. I see no reason to assume it would here.

[Sloonei]

What reason is there to read speedchuck as bad? He's in my top tier of town reads at this point.

[Jackofhearts2005]

What reason is there to read speedchuck as bad? He's in my top tier of town reads at this point.

Fishing, mostly. Scotty made a fair accusatory post against him but since I don't trust Scotty.

I think the amount of culture clash I'm having with him makes my brain want him to be scum. I don't even remember Scotty's arguement that well.

[Jackofhearts2005]

Fred, what are you thinking? Who is scum? Who is town?

Don't be neutral. I will give you slack later for ill conceived arguments as long as you actually make some reads.

It'll be good for you.

[Sloonei]

What reason is there to read speedchuck as bad? He's in my top tier of town reads at this point.

Fishing, mostly. Scotty made a fair accusatory post against him but since I don't trust Scotty.

I think the amount of culture clash I'm having with him makes my brain want him to be scum. I don't even remember Scotty's arguement that well.

I glanced over some of Scotty's points and agreed with none of them, but I am conditioned to read Scotty as bad right now.

[nutella]

So what changed between your PoE list and your "no reason to town read" list?

Time passed. In the immediate aftermath of the map claims I gave Marmot a bit of a berth, and then as his posts went nowhere from that point I progressively cared less about that. Marmot was in my PoE originally anyway, I deliberately didn't list him because of said map. That's what I was trying to nudge to Nacho when he asked me.

Anyway, that one point where I gave the "nullest of null" reads on Marmot should clue y'all in that I am not his teammate. I am literally the guy who analyzes the hell out of dead scum interactions in every game I play, and that means I am very well-versed in what sells and what does not. I don't give you a useless waffle on my teammate because that does nothing to benefit me or my team -- it only leaves me open to answering questions like this later. I know better. Take it or leave it I guess.

I don't follow Jack at all in the bus driver discussion. I don't see why there's any reason to assume anything about either Fred's or my alignment. The most basic value of a re-directing role is that it prevents the civilians from handling the night phase the way they want to -- it promotes a chaotic information environment. There are a ton of different theories one could apply to Marmot's purported actions, assuming he is responsible for the target discrepancy Golden has reported, that work out for three of the four possible alignment arrangements between Fredwood and I. Town-Town, Mafia-Town, and Town-Mafia. The only one that I'd struggle to see a scenario for is Mafia-Mafia, not counting my own inherent knowledge of my alignment. Because I am me, I am generally a likely target for whatever. Doctors love to protect me, jailers love to jail me, cops love to ID me, watchers love to watch me, etc. Shit, in recent memory even vigilantes love to shoot me. Bus driving me with anyone is by default a near-sure means of making certain the role has value that night, because someone's JJJ target will get screwed up.

Even if you're discussing the matter of a cop, the idea still holds in a Town-Town scenario. The scum would stand to lose a lot if I am confirmed town by a cop, because I am a much more potent threat when I am not hindered by accusations (see: Turf Wars, Mad Max, and the latter half of ROTTK). By swapping me with a different townie a less threatening ID is assured. And that's only for a cop, which is already a speculative thing.

At the end of the day we're still talking about Marmot, perhaps the player on this roster least inclined toward actual strategy. He does whatever he wants on a whim.

Was this post supposed to make me feel better about you? Because it didn't. Especially the highlighted paragraph.

The following is a complete compilation of all interactions between Metalmarsh and Scotty in the game of Phenom Mafia:

Spoiler: show

So um.
unvote jackofhearts, I think? Am I still voting for him?

vote Scotty

Dang. Interesting.

Tbh I have still been tempted to townread Scotty though. Partially because of the role claim, even though he conveniently claimed to be blocked and couldn't prove it. The fact that he was hinting at something from the very beginning of the game makes me want to believe him. And I've had other towny feelings from him in general. So the null marmot interaction is not enough to sway me on him.

I just started scrolling through Scotty's Day 3 posts. He said this initially:

Them MM voters lookin real good right now by the by

Well done on catching him y'all

And then went on a tirade against the two people who hammered on metalmarsh.

BUT this is suspicious as hell.

[speedchuck]

What about if we just go ahead and lynch Dys, then you can figure out me and Marmot's alignment?

What is I think you're all three town ATM

I don't understand.

Your last rainbow says otherwise.

Some things have changes since my last rainbow.

If you two are scum (yes you are lumped together), you have GIGANTIC BALLS to be pulling all of this. TBH, I almost think I'm wrong about Dizzy now. Almost. Not quite.

I can hardly keep up with the posts right now.

Scotty is my most confident read too.
SL, I believe you now because of the reveal that you have more vigs. Falsifiable and unbalanced as scum. Good for my read, bad for your survivability. Protectives take note. Wish you hadn't said that.

God, I hate this post.

Speed: Silver, please tell me all your powers and Wigly's too.
Silver: No
JoH: You's scummy for asking, Speed
Speed: No, I need to know cause what if Silver is scum even though I think he's town.
Silver: Here's more about my role.
Speed: Oh, golly. Wish you hadn't said that.


Just when I was starting to think I was tunneling.

Probably more juicy stuff from EOD yesterday but I couldn't let this go.

Probably more juicy stuff related to Silver, too. His death makes sense. First mafia kill that does. Possibly, scum was afraid he was gonna shoot them soon. Worth looking into.

Catching up.

Reread ALL of my actual posts. It'll make sense.

Or, for the lazy: I asked something specific, not related to whether Silver had multiple kills. Did not want him to say if he had multiple kills specifically, as that makes him die. It made him die.
I asked if he had more info on dead guy. This is unrelated to what he revealed about killing the next night. (Which was apparently a lie anyway, but the kind of lie that paints a target on your face)

This is where I am, still catching up

[nutella]

@Sloonei: I had some thoughts on speedchuck here that gave me pause about him, even though I'd mostly been reading him as town almost to the same extent that you are. In your post about him you get up to his ISOish post about Marmot and just stop there, but what interested me was his waffling after that point.

[Jackofhearts2005]

What about if we just go ahead and lynch Dys, then you can figure out me and Marmot's alignment?

What is I think you're all three town ATM

I don't understand.

Your last rainbow says otherwise.

Some things have changes since my last rainbow.

If you two are scum (yes you are lumped together), you have GIGANTIC BALLS to be pulling all of this. TBH, I almost think I'm wrong about Dizzy now. Almost. Not quite.

I can hardly keep up with the posts right now.

Scotty is my most confident read too.
SL, I believe you now because of the reveal that you have more vigs. Falsifiable and unbalanced as scum. Good for my read, bad for your survivability. Protectives take note. Wish you hadn't said that.

God, I hate this post.

Speed: Silver, please tell me all your powers and Wigly's too.
Silver: No
JoH: You's scummy for asking, Speed
Speed: No, I need to know cause what if Silver is scum even though I think he's town.
Silver: Here's more about my role.
Speed: Oh, golly. Wish you hadn't said that.


Just when I was starting to think I was tunneling.

Probably more juicy stuff from EOD yesterday but I couldn't let this go.

Probably more juicy stuff related to Silver, too. His death makes sense. First mafia kill that does. Possibly, scum was afraid he was gonna shoot them soon. Worth looking into.

Catching up.

Reread ALL of my actual posts. It'll make sense.

Or, for the lazy: I asked something specific, not related to whether Silver had multiple kills. Did not want him to say if he had multiple kills specifically, as that makes him die. It made him die.
I asked if he had more info on dead guy. This is unrelated to what he revealed about killing the next night. (Which was apparently a lie anyway, but the kind of lie that paints a target on your face)

This is where I am, still catching up

You should probably catch up all the way.

Cause like...you might say something stupid if you don't. I've heard of that happening to some people.

[speedchuck]

I'm putting together a post right now that looks at the MM lynch a little, but leaving for Lego Batman in 35 minutes. Maybe I'll post what I have before I go.

LEGO Batman was so good!

[Quin]

Or simply express your concerns, if you're worried about leading. I assure you that I am town.

this was @ quin. hello nutella, tell me what you think of Scotty.

I'll express my biggest concern, and I feel like it makes some things too obvious to care to argue further.

Your justification for voting marmot yesterday is so close to being satisfying. The fact that it's almost on the mark is specifically what satisfies me the most. On the other hand, I have my doubts about whether what you said were all of your thoughts and nothing else. That would be less good.

Whether that makes sense or not is but I guess this is a better position for you, anyway.

[Golden]

Got a response from sprit. He made a mistake, eloh and I targeted Fred. Still not marmot though.

[sprityo]

as a note to everyone, I'm not a perfect host, so if you want me to double check something, just ask

[Sloonei]

Got a response from sprit. He made a mistake, eloh and I targeted Fred. Still not marmot though.

For the sake of clarity, could you reiterate everything you've told us about your night action so far?

[Golden]

Got a response from sprit. He made a mistake, eloh and I targeted Fred. Still not marmot though.

For the sake of clarity, could you reiterate everything you've told us about your night action so far?

Watched jay night 1, the response was originally 'noone targeted fredwood', it's now 'golden and eloh targeted fredwood'.

[Sloonei]

This seems to suggest Elohcin is a misdirector. I do not expect the Hive to have multiple misdirecting roles on their team.

[Scotty]

speedchuck:

Spoiler: show

Reads on Marmot and LC:
Marmot: light scum. He hasn't contributed much (as you said, not much reaction, but even related to other things) despite being here a good bit. The whole 'drunk' thing early day one reeked of building up trust (who would trust themselves to post as scum while drunk, I'm totes town), but IDK. I've never seen that sort of thing in a mafia game.
LC is hard to read. I'm honestly going back towards leaning town for him, because most of my issues with him are just disagreeing with his logic. I don't know his meta, but he seems like the type of person that doesn't back off when his logic is challenged. Players agreed early on in game that he was a defensive player in that sense.

Unvote
Yeah Strawhenge, it was pretty close to my feelings toward Long Con. I have trouble differentiating scum behavior from logic that I can't understand. It hurts to look at motives. I'll vote someone in the next few minutes.

Early scum read. I like this. I'll be a little nervous and say it's possible a new player to our community wanted to take a bold stance and come out bussing one of their teammates Day 1, but that's a tinfoil theory.

Spoiler: show

Dizzy has not been under enough pressure to force a claim. Claims are a last-ditch effort to avoid lynch. We haven't gotten that close to lynching him. (or anyone, and we probably need to get there)
So yeah, I get the idea, but no, it's a weird reason for SL to vote. As with all of their other votes. I don't get it. There isn't enough support to pressure a claim or a lynch on Dizzy from what I've seen.

And there will never be enough support with that mentality.

I see you are a graduate from Soneji's "why would you want records of the votes even though you don't think mafia will vote together" School of Silly thoughts.

Seriously, I have never understood this mentality of "let's not wipe our butts because we're gonna have to poop again." I do not only place votes on people who are in danger of getting lynched. I place votes as a vehicle to build pressure on someone. Sometimes it works and sometimes it doesn't, but that doesn't mean I stop doing it, any more than I stop wiping.

I am placing a vote on Dyslexicon, because I am perfectly fine with lynching her for the reasons I have detailed above. And your post really reads as trying to derail from that. Why are you protecting Dys?

My bad, I tend to look at the post with a vote in it for reasoning. I saw: "Vote Dys YOU SHOULD CLAIM, DYS"
Your earlier reasoning, regarding Dys using a strategy that didn't work last time he tried it (and how that points to him possibly trying to gain town points), is not bad.

The reason I am 'protecting' Dys, as you will see if I look through my posts, is that the idea that this was a realslip is bad. I don't appreciate votes based on that logic.
I rescind. Yours is fine. Marmot's, which I think is based on the slip being an accident, is not fine. Thus I will continue to harp on the low odds of the slip being real. It worked with Strawhenge.

Somebody please tell me what an ISO is.

I believe he is being critical of metalmarsh's vote for Dyslexicon here, as part of a larger post. I like this whole post and the discussion it is a part of from speedchuck. He puts some good thoughts into the thread, stands up for what he believes in (Dyslexicon's slip was intentional), and gets some reads out of it. Big positive marks for speedchuck here.

A big list of common suspects which includes a marmot. Nothing to see here.

Speedchuck was one of the first people to engage with me when I entered the thread and started hurling questions at everything. I liked his tone from the start. He was relaxed and open and his accounts of things appear to have been as objective as a person is able to be. He names metalmarsh as one of his top suspects (along with Scotty) in this post and also offers a comment on him regarding the Dyslexicon slip. His suspicion is looking consistent and genuine to me at this point.

http://www.mafiathesyndicate.com/viewto ... 78#p335178

This post is interesting because it contradicts itself? It, at the beginning of the post, says that logic points to Dizzy doing an on-purpose fakeslip.
Then says later in the thread that it is an accident.
Then I think they ended the day on Dizzy, despite saying they felt good about Diz in the same post.

Maybe Marmot just didn't want to be on SIG?

I don't know. Most of what bothers me about marmot's posts probably have to do with their playstyle/his low activity thanks to other games. Nothing particularly useful, I think. Would lynch scotty over marmot. Unless contradicting themselves in order to seem agreeable and unsure is a Meta-Marmot-Metal-Marsh-Mafia-Move.

More of the same. I'm gonna go ahead and slap a town read on speedchuck now, and also note that I believe Scotty criticized him earlier for never following through on his promise to ISO metalmarsh, to which I say... this post exists, Scotty.

speedchuck is town or your money back.

Did you even read what I posted? (That's rhetorical I guess since you refuse take off your rose-colored glasses). I already went through that post and said why I thought it was a bullshit "case" on MM.

[Scotty]

The following is a complete compilation of all interactions between Metalmarsh and Scotty in the game of Phenom Mafia:

Spoiler: show

So um.
unvote jackofhearts, I think? Am I still voting for him?

vote Scotty

Oh fuck no not this shit again

[Golden]

This seems to suggest Elohcin is a misdirector. I do not expect the Hive to have multiple misdirecting roles on their team.

Possibly, or else someone misdirected me.

[Fredwood]

Fred, what are you thinking? Who is scum? Who is town?

Don't be neutral. I will give you slack later for ill conceived arguments as long as you actually make some reads.

It'll be good for you.

Caught up...past few days were a cluster fuck.

Based off Marmot:
Nut and Dys

Dys has not liked the Marmot since the jump, and it never felt like bussing, we even talked about it when I gave my reads at the time. Nut led the train, based of her read. So of everyone that voted for Marmot, I'd be inclined to believe that they are most genuine.

LC: He voted Marmot early in the phase, and had no real assurances of how it would play out one way or the other. It wasn't a strong vote, but just strong enough.

Sloonei and Speed: I've had a pro town read on Speed even before last night, I just have a hard time thinking that scum would lynch scum with seconds left in the phase...I know there have been good cases made and pointing out his numerous flip-flops have and while they are compelling, I can't shake that he is at the very least was not working with Marmot, just due to the timing of the vote. A stalled phase doesn't prove that he's scum, because there's no autopsy to point to as defense or damnation.

Sloonei gets less of a pass because they were only the 4th vote, and Sloon had been rather solidly in the I don't want to vote Dys or Marsh camp, SLoon had been tunnelled on Scotty up until that point. Seeing as how Marmot basically taunted them into voting for him with 5 minutes left, and no one was going to lynch Scotty, the choices were between a suspicious INH led train or a seemingly genuine Nutella train, I think I make the same choice in the same situation. So there's 2 pros and 1 con...for a net pro read.

Dys train:
INH: Has been pinging hard because of his relentless pursuit of the whole fake slip even after I thought this was put to bed...it's annoying that it was still a thing on day 2. To me the proof all hinged around the supposed existence or non existence of evidence that Dys gathered from the whole thing, and despite the fact that Dys had been pushing hard on Marmot since the event in question did nothing to assuage INH's tunnel. Normally one could point to this as a screen of Marmot, it is possible, but this has been a running theme with him. I still read him on the scummy spectrum of things, but not solely for his relentless push on Dys. His map theory was rather odd as well.

Quin: It's hard to say, Quin just dislikes most things, I think the likelyhood of both Quin and INH w/w each other is slim, but I definitely thinks it's possible one is. GTH I think INH is looking worse then Quin, Quin just appears a bit stubborn and prone to odd leaps, kind of evidenced by their interaction with Sloonei earlier this phase.


The rest of yesterday:

Scotty: Strange play, I think. "The don't lynch me I can prove I'm town not" argument that I despise withstanding, he's pushing for the inactive player lynch as opposed to the other lynches which would give the town more information to work with. Silver is on his train, which does not bode well for him in my eyes, more of a meta thing because I trust Silver because of my experience with him. Though him throwing shade on two of his biggest detractors this day phase is an odd play for scum, but that's based on personal playstyle where I just view it as strange, so not really a pro in his defense. Silver's death doesn't help him, but on it's own doesn't hurt him. There's just enough smoke with the rest of his play to suggest fire.


Eloh: One part of me wants to say...I don't know. Coming on and asking a person at random who they vote for then voting for themselves when they get a non-commital answer is aggravating. Not from an in game standpoint, just from a enjoyment of the game standpoint. A Eloh lynch nets us no new information, but their continued existence is just gnawing at me, both from a "this has to be dealt with eventually standpoint" and from a they really just don't give a shit standpoint. I don't like casting aspersions on people I don't know, and there may be very good reasons they don't give a shit, but it's just something looming imo.


JJJ/Golden/Jack: My impression of you 3 is that one of you is scum and two of you are town. It's non-committal true, but based off personal experience and the general consensus of players in this thread, that they are rather strong players. My GTH is that Jack is most likely scum, but a lot of that was based of the Sloonei pressure earlier. Questions could have been asked, I just didn't like the questions that were asked.

Straw is null at the moment, Juliets is too new

Soneji - he comes on in short bursts and is extremely strong and aggressive, presents some boisterous remarks and then fucks off never to be seen again.

Soooo...TLDR

Top Suspects:
Scotty
INH
Soneji (SP)

Light suspects:

Quin
Jack
Eloh


Null reads: (Not necessarily because I have no read on them but the evidence could go either way)

Strawhenge
Long Con
JJJ
Juliets

Moderate Town:

Golden
Sloonei
Speed

Strong Town:

Nut
Dys

Ok...2 pages have probably Linki'd since I started typing, but I really tried.

[Fredwood]

There's blue in my Rainbow cus fuck you.

[Fredwood]

This seems to suggest Elohcin is a misdirector. I do not expect the Hive to have multiple misdirecting roles on their team.

Why would Eloh targeting me mean they are a Misdirector?

[Sloonei]

I might be willing to vote for Jay.

[Quin]

I might be willing to vote for Jay.

Speak, my child.

[Fredwood]

It's so strange to be in a game where no one is worried about a neutral killer. I mean the evidence I guess backs up that there isn't one, but still...I'm not used to not being scared of a SK.

[Sloonei]

This seems to suggest Elohcin is a misdirector. I do not expect the Hive to have multiple misdirecting roles on their team.

Why would Eloh targeting me mean they are a Misdirector?

Because Golden's report has her targeting you, but Golden did not intend to target you. It is reasonable to assume that somebody switched you with Golden's intended target (Jay), and since we have evidence that Elohcin targeted you, we can guess that she's the misdirector.

I know on HC Realms you guys have different names for different types of redirecting roles, but when I say "misdirector" I just mean any role that has the ability to change another player's target. A townie redirecting actions off of Jay makes sense because he's always a likely kill target.

[Sloonei]

I might be willing to vote for Jay.

Speak, my child.

I'm tired and on my phone, but that big post he made responding to my interactive analysis of him felt off, particularly the section nutella highlighted. He spent a good chunk of time explaining why he wouldn't do something (express a null read on a teammate) instead of simply explaining why he had a null read. He was focused on explaining why he's not scum instead of sharing his thought process.

[Sloonei]

The following is a complete compilation of all interactions between Metalmarsh and Scotty in the game of Phenom Mafia:

Spoiler: show

So um.
unvote jackofhearts, I think? Am I still voting for him?

vote Scotty

Oh fuck no not this shit again

I've shared a bunch of reasons why I suspect you and you've responded to exactly none of them.

[Fredwood]

But I wasn't misdirected, Golden was. If Eloh is a Controlled Misdirector I guess that's a possibility, but you're essentially suggesting another Busdrive, with both explanations. There's no indication on whether or not there's a MD.

With the Busdriver being in play, there's no reason to assume a Controlled Misdirect, particularly a town one, and if someone randomized Golden's result they wouldn't show up targeting me.

My guess is that Eloh has a persistent ability not a one shot. Spending the one shot doesn't make sense on a day 1 unknown player. As for a CMD...shrug...I guess only Eloh can answer that.