Ancient Greece Mafia [CONQUEST]

[dunya]

sorry guys, had no time today. big birthday party for my best friend's son. home now. will read up and vote.

[dunya]

Good point Kyle.

[VOTE: dunya] aubergine

you know, my confidence in you waffles every time I see you vote for throwaway reasons.

[dunya]

so guys, last 3p chose a side. nova isn't on the poll.

things are juicy this day phase.

[dunya]

thanks mashy-poo. i owe ya one

I [VOTE: dunya] aubergine because her interactions with known baddies suck.

*yawn*

give me a read that goes beyond day 5 please. judge me for the bulk of my content after I got home and could actually play, not while I was away.

[Jackofhearts2005]

Spoiler: show

Yesterday Review

http://www.mafiathesyndicate.com/viewto ... 00#p438634

Marmot posts three times starting here. Doesn’t address the Speed case. Commiserates w/Scotty about Luna’s death, saying the oracle had expressed faith in Luna twice. Feels fakish. Oracle is just a single townie’s delayed reads, not a freaking copping. Soft defends Daisy from Nova.

How coincidental of Jack to start laying out reads now.

And how nice of cbob to butter him up and inflate his standing. He a teammate?

I think jack is distancing from nova and maybe speed. Can’t determine yet. I’m now convinced jack is only choosing to be “straight” because he has pressure.

who was pressuring jack

@ackofhearts2005 is your preferred lynch of the day speedchuck?

Kyle comes in with this. You could maybe read this as a dig on Scotty/TH and a defense on me and then a setup to bus Speed but they may all just be catchup questions.




Slight ding to Marmot. Null to Kyle.

I thought the Oracle's posts, coupled with Luna's reactions, were enough evidence in Luna's favor to not lynch her, or at least not in hot-potato fashion.

Also, I'm not sure I realized there was a speedchuck case at the time. Even now, I'm looking back and don't see a case against speedchuck. I do see your list of reads of everyone right before that on Day 5, but not a case.

This is Marmot’s only mention of Speedchuck since his lynch other than to say he was busable.

None of the promised interactive ISOs. Pretends my case didn’t exist.

[VOTE: Marmot] aubergine

[dunya]

I don’t see a townie that isn’t Nova removing him from the poll on purpose.

why not?

[dunya]

you have so many strong opinions about what others are doing, jack, like which sides 3ps are choosing, who would remove nova or not...all stated with quite some conviction. where's the confidence coming from?

[wolbre04]

[VOTE: Marmot] aubergine
I'll make a post soon I just woke up

[wolbre04]

QUICK @Kylemii get in my hoodie

Do you have any confidence in your reads yet?

Yeah man, as far as I'm concerned, lynching @Kylemii is a bad idea and lynching @JackofHearts2005 is a very reasonably good idea.

@dunya
@wolbre
^^
tagged for opinions

@Marmot tagged for lolz

Would rather lynch Kyle if I had to pick, jack has grown on me and is trying to gamesolve hard.

[dunya]

I voted for wolbre because why not

cos I don't think he's scum. all his posts indicate solo artist to me. his speedchuck defense was unwarranted. and if he's 3p, I don't want to lynch him.

[dunya]

QUICK @Kylemii get in my hoodie

Do you have any confidence in your reads yet?

Yeah man, as far as I'm concerned, lynching @Kylemii is a bad idea and lynching @JackofHearts2005 is a very reasonably good idea.

@dunya
@wolbre
^^
tagged for opinions

@Marmot tagged for lolz

Would rather lynch Kyle if I had to pick, jack has grown on me and is trying to gamesolve hard.

don't be deceived by Jack's supatowniness. he's one of the most underhanded and sly scumsters there are too.

[Jackofhearts2005]

I don’t see a townie that isn’t Nova removing him from the poll on purpose.

why not?

Has anyone expressed strong support for Nova?

[Marmot]

Y'all are the worst.

[dunya]

that said, the scum JoH I saw in Pirates was not a supertownposter and was a lot more reserved. Jack's been really loud and really vocal, and the more I think about it, the more I think the speedchuck bussing would have been revealed a little more smoothly than how it erupted with Jack if Jack was indeed the busser. like, the way it went down, it was kinda tacky.

[dunya]

Y'all are the worst.

[wolbre04]

Looking at wolbre & speedchuck

From D1 (Updated)

Dunya: 2- Long Con, Epignosis
Epignosis: 4 - Scotty, Jack of Hearts, Speedchuck, Wolbre04
Golden: 2 - Lunalee, Croutons
Lunalee: 2 - Kylemii, ColinisCool
Marmot: 1 - Space Daisy
Novaselinenever: 4 - MacDougal, Sloonei, Sig, Turnip
Sig:: 5 - Nova, MP, Marmot, Dom, Golden
Turniphead: 1 - Dunya

There's 2-3 scum in: Scotty, Jack, Speed, Nova, MP, Marmot, Dom, and Golden
Further narrowed down to: Scotty, Golden, Marmot, Nova, Speed

Here's a Pretty List:
Jack
MP
Dom
Speed
Golden
Scotty
Marmot
Nova

Just what I'm thinking

Speedchuck seems to be a lower-tier town read on a limited-scope rainbow list, I think. @wolbre04 can clarify this point. I am not sure why he is placed here.

Spoiler: show

MP and LC have a heated argument, spilling over from my interaction with LC. It lasts for a half hour and then both suddenly drop the hostilities and keep their votes on each other. Neither will get lynched today

I love your brain.

Agreed. This is beautiful.

Also, MP said he was moving his vote to Jack, but didn't.

A neat segue.

I have Jack, Kyle, Spacedaisy and Speedchuck as null. Spacedaisy gets a birthday pass (not for much longer). Very strange for that remaining trio wouldn't you say? I can't point at anything but my overall feeling towards them all is that they are:

a) Not their usual selves
b) Flying under le radar
c) Very nice boys

@Dom @Marmot @wolbre04 would also like your thoughts. And anyone else obviously.

A -It's really hard for me to comment on a because I'm new here so I will defer to others on that.
B - I def think they are flying under the radar (daisy is a bit of an exception, but still) and Kyle had a period where he was getting pressed. Not so much the other two for a bit, it seems
C - They haven't been inflammatory yet

No thoughts on Kyle
I could maaaaybe see jack fitting into a scumteam comp but it's a stretch for me. He hasn't been here in awhile and I can't decide whether that's laying low or just having a life
Speedchuck seemed to be actively trying to solve the game earlier so I don't have any issues with him
As you said, I'm not going to pester daisy
1. I don't know her so she doesn't want some random dude pinging her
2. I don't wanna be an ass and bother her when she's trying to enjoy her bday time

Has a chance to offer thoughts on a number of players, and the only one he paints in a favorable light is speedchuck. Also a waffley suspicion of Jack, it seems. I have obviously never played with wolbre so it's difficult to make any read with too much confidence, but this post has caught my attention, at the very least.

He’s probably bad with Speed, Luna, Probably not Sloonei, Wolfbae, and Sopapilla.

I'm not sure I understand what's going on here. This was Jack's original post:

He’s probably bad with Speed, Luna, Sloonei, Wolfbae, and Sopapilla.

The "He" they're referring to seems to be Scotty. wolbre reconstructed the post specifically to point suspicion against speedchuck and lunalee, I think. This would be an abrupt and unexplained departure from his previous stance on chuck. If I'm remembering correctly, wolbre will go back to town reading speedchuck soon. So... I really do not know what's happening here. wolbre, do you have any memory of making this post and can you tell me what your thoughts were at the time?

Rainbow list

Wolbre04 - The king and is also not indie ffs

Speed chuck
Scotty
Cbob
Jack
Kyle
Marmot
Quin
golden
Sloonei
MP
Coitus
TH
Nova
Dunya
Spacedaisy

A night 4 rainbow list. Speedchuck is his top town read. Spacedaisy is his top scum read. Townies can be wrong and we obviously still do not know daisy's alignment. If wolbre is scum with speedchuck, he went hard in chuck's defense. This is wolbre's first game here and one of his first handful of games overall, I think. Would a player in his position defend a teammate so consistently in the thread? Genuine question, I don't have an answer. Daisy's placement at the bottom stands out to me as well. She's been the quietest player in the game. Why is she there, wolbre?

Okay gimmie gth reads on:

Speedchuck
Speedchuck
Speedchuck
Speedchuck

And why is he bad?

I have him as a town read. I say pass

More of the same. I still don't see any justification for this town read.

I have speed as a town read, if I don't lynch him that makes me look bad

Oh what the hell
[VOTE: Speedchuck] aubergine

Spoiler: show

Spoiler: show

Speedchuck has not been lynched at this point. His alignment is unknown. Why is wolbre declaring that he will "look bad" for defending him? The vote is pure resignation as well. This looks like the sort of thing that is too obvious to really be bad, but at this stage of the game it would be irresponsible to let it slip by. Daisy called him out on it immediately:

I have speed as a town read, if I don't lynch him that makes me look bad

civs don't worry about looking bad, they worry about finding baddies. U Bad wolbre?

Yes

My point was that bc he was a town read for me, if I vote him it looks like bussing but idc at this point

This is not quite what wolbre said initially. Before it was "I look bad if I don't lynch him." Now it's "I look bad if I do lynch him." I am once again left saying that this is too obvious to really be bad. Could be an inexperienced scum trying to get out ahead of suspicion. Or it could be a townie in unfamiliar territory who's conscious of his appearance. I don't know. Reading new players is always difficult because they almost every game is going to present them with something they haven't seen before regardless of their alignment, so their behavior is difficult to predict. It is tempting to call wolbre bad here, but I am also wary that he is just an easily misunderstood player at this stage.

I have speed as a town read, if I don't lynch him that makes me look bad

civs don't worry about looking bad, they worry about finding baddies. U Bad wolbre?

Yes

My point was that bc he was a town read for me, if I vote him it looks like bussing but idc at this point

If you're civ, vote for who you suspect, consequences be damned. Civ's suspicions develop and change naturally. Is he a town read for you now or not? Are you voting him because you suspect him or just because someone is trying to tell you to? Also who is the he we are talking about? I've lost track...

I'm voting him because other people want us to so I'm doing it to help who I perceive as potential town leaders I suppose
He's still a town read
He is "SC"

I feel a bit better about this response. He's voting speedchuck to be a team player, deferring to other people with confident reads. I've got no issue with that strategy sometimes. And in this instance it worked out, if he's telling the truth.

speedchuck, ok. Why do you read him as town? I'm still ISOing, I haven't decided yet.

I think several of the points people are pinning him for seem pretty floppy

I don't know what this means. Wolbre, what does this mean?

yea I don't think the 2 remaining scum would have needed to defend speed yesterday. on the other hand, wolbre did it...

dunya makes this point in the aftermath of speedchuck's lynch. It's worth considering. wolbre's defense of speedchuck was not limited to Day 5 and had been consistent throughout the game with maybe the exception of that one odd post I highlighted earlier. My question today is, still, whether or not I think wolbre (a relatively new player in a totally new environment) would opt to defend a teammate so strongly as scum in his first game here. I don't know anything about wolbre's experience or whether or not that would be likely. @wolbre04 can you refresh us on your mafia history so far? How many games have you played as each alignment? If you've got links to past games others might find that helpful as well.

And last but not least, here's wolbre's GTH reads for reference:

kyle - TOWN
dunya - TOWN
Nova - SCUM
spacedaisy - TOWN
Turnip Head - TOWN
Jack - SCUM
cbob - TOWN
Quin - SCUM
Sloonei - TOWN
Marmot - TOWN

Daisy is a town-read now, whereas she was scum earlier. He seems to suspect Jack based on his interactions with Scotty and dunya, I think. And he concluded that Quin was bad after I highlighted some interactions between Quin and speedchuck, but I still am not clear on exactly why he felt that way.

I've come out of this with more questions than answers. I'd lean slightly bad, I suppose, but with caution. wolbre is a new player, and questionable behavior is not necessarily bad behavior. I also understand that this ISO is kind of sprawling and all over the map, and I don't know if people, wolbre especially, bother to read everything I say in full. But if wolbre can address any of the uncertainties about him that'd be handy. I'm looking for an explanation of thought processes and reasoning here.

To make it easier, these are my most pressing questions for you, wolbre:
What specifically made you town read speedchuck this game?
What specifically made you scum read Spacedaisy earlier, and what has changed since then?
How many games have you played before as town? As mafia?

Also, as always, updated reads and such would be handy if you've got them. please and thank you.

1. Well at the end during his wagon it was really fucking concerning the number of people that jumped on it. I was under the impression that it was unlikely it was a bus that hard, and instead a lot of people, potentially scum, trying to say "Hey look at me, I'm here to lynch scum". Earlier in the game I felt that the cases made against him were opportunistic and that he was acting like a sheep in wolfs clothing.

2. My original red read on her was largely due to the fact that other people were "done giving her the birthday pass" and letting her be awol without trying to press or consider her for a vote. My read was basically based on that. It changed once she returned and people seemed to be much more confident she wasn't scum and was no longer awol

3. Never been mafia before, I'm not used to working in a setting in this game where I have a team I am aware of and know. Been town probably 5/6ish games and SK one

[dunya]

I don’t see a townie that isn’t Nova removing him from the poll on purpose.

why not?

Has anyone expressed strong support for Nova?

I made a whole case why I thought nova wasn't scum.

[Jackofhearts2005]

that said, the scum JoH I saw in Pirates was not a supertownposter and was a lot more reserved. Jack's been really loud and really vocal, and the more I think about it, the more I think the speedchuck bussing would have been revealed a little more smoothly than how it erupted with Jack if Jack was indeed the busser. like, the way it went down, it was kinda tacky.

Gee thanks.

[Jackofhearts2005]

I don’t see a townie that isn’t Nova removing him from the poll on purpose.

why not?

Has anyone expressed strong support for Nova?

I made a whole case why I thought nova wasn't scum.

Okay fine. Or Dunya did it.

[dunya]

that said, the scum JoH I saw in Pirates was not a supertownposter and was a lot more reserved. Jack's been really loud and really vocal, and the more I think about it, the more I think the speedchuck bussing would have been revealed a little more smoothly than how it erupted with Jack if Jack was indeed the busser. like, the way it went down, it was kinda tacky.

Gee thanks.

I mean, if you're w/w it's tacky. are you w/w?

[dunya]

I don’t see a townie that isn’t Nova removing him from the poll on purpose.

why not?

Has anyone expressed strong support for Nova?

I made a whole case why I thought nova wasn't scum.

Okay fine. Or Dunya did it.

I didn't. Implying I did would have been against the rules. but I think several other people aren't sold on nova's guilt based on the colin situation, so it's not that far fetched.

[dunya]

I just don't think nova would have used it on himself if he was the ground commander on THIS day phase. was nova even mentioned on night 6? It's a bit of a weird choice tbh.

[Kylemii]

I'm content with my marmot vote I think, at the very least today I've narrowed down to my 3 biggest suspects and i find comfort in that.

[JaggedJimmyJay]

Marmot is the Helot. He may not be lynched. He may not be killed. He may not vote.

[wolbre04]

I worked a 13 hour workday last night into this morning so I'm having a hard time staying awake, I'll try to wake up around lynch but I really can't make a long post atm because I'm barely standing

[Kylemii]

I'm no longer content with my marmot vote

[wolbre04]

Marmot is the Helot. He may not be lynched. He may not be killed. He may not vote.

Ffs

[dunya]

If nova was on the lynch poll today, he'd have my vote. I haven't talked about him in a while, but he's still a strong suspect.

Also, his place in the Day 1 lynch is significant. If he's mafia, we know there was a high-stress Day 1 for the mafia team. If he's civilian, we know that mafia had a relatively easy Day 1.

I don't get this line of thinking. If he was mafia, would he have gone after Colin that hard on Night 1? Colin had better scum powers than the two remaining scum members. Nah. not buying it.

[dunya]

Marmot is the Helot. He may not be lynched. He may not be killed. He may not vote.

Good fucking time to activate, Marmot.

[dunya]

[mention]novaselinenever[/mention] - YOURE HERE. any idea why you're off the lynch poll?

[Kylemii]

I'm most comfortable with quin or wolbre I think?

does anyone have strong objections to either one of them

[dunya]

I think wolbre has done a lot of questionable things, but do we think wolbre is playing like someone on a team? someone who has btsc?

[Kylemii]

I think wolbre has done a lot of questionable things, but do we think wolbre is playing like someone on a team? someone who has btsc?

no

[dunya]

I'd need to see more from SD going forward too. I think we're relying too much on an emotional read and MP cred than actual stuff she has done, and now that the game has become smaller...we need everyone accounted for.

[Kylemii]

[VOTE: guin] aubergine

[novaselinenever]

@novaselinenever - YOURE HERE. any idea why you're off the lynch poll?

YES, I'm here. I'm catching up in the two games I've missed, as we speak. My apologies for the long inactivity.

I wouldn't know about that.

[dunya]

have you been submitting any night actions, nova? or have you been totally inactive since may 5?

[dunya]

[VOTE: guin] aubergine

hmmmm hey so what happened with your read on Jack?

[dunya]

[mention]M Plus 7[/mention] is here.

GTH who's bad and who's good.

Kyle
Quin
wolbre

out of those three.

[Tangrowth]

Hey, sorry all, I actually forgot we had an eod today! I am losing track of my days. Daisy’s sister is in town until tomorrow morning and I’ve been busy catching up on chores and trying to stay away from the computer because ive been at it so much lately. I’ll finally be able to get reintegrated properly here this coming week.

For now I need to vote and run.

[Tangrowth]

@M Plus 7 is here.

GTH who's bad and who's good.

Kyle
Quin
wolbre

out of those three.

Town, mafia, town

[Tangrowth]

Where should I vote? Why is Marmot leading?

[Quin]

thanks mashy-poo. i owe ya one

I [VOTE: dunya] aubergine because her interactions with known baddies suck.

*yawn*

give me a read that goes beyond day 5 please. judge me for the bulk of my content after I got home and could actually play, not while I was away.

well this is hardly a defense at all.

[Quin]

why are you all making me [VOTE: marmot] aubergine? you should be ashamed of yourselves.

[dunya]

thanks mashy-poo. i owe ya one

I [VOTE: dunya] aubergine because her interactions with known baddies suck.

*yawn*

give me a read that goes beyond day 5 please. judge me for the bulk of my content after I got home and could actually play, not while I was away.

well this is hardly a defense at all.

I have already talked about it, go through my iso to other players. I'm not gonna repeat old cases every time someone who isn't reading the whole thread asks tbh. I don't have that much time on my hands.

[Tangrowth]

I’m not sure Quin is bad but I’m cool with lunching anyone not in my town reads of my PoE right now, and so that means I would rather not see a dunya or Marmot result.

[dunya]

Marmot is a tree stump. get your votes off him

[mention]Quin[/mention] [mention]M Plus 7[/mention]

[Quin]

thanks mashy-poo. i owe ya one

I [VOTE: dunya] aubergine because her interactions with known baddies suck.

*yawn*

give me a read that goes beyond day 5 please. judge me for the bulk of my content after I got home and could actually play, not while I was away.

well this is hardly a defense at all.

I have already talked about it, go through my iso to other players. I'm not gonna repeat old cases every time someone who isn't reading the whole thread asks tbh. I don't have that much time on my hands.

i didn't ask though. i told.

[dunya]

why are you all making me [VOTE: marmot] aubergine? you should be ashamed of yourselves.

wow. that was effortless.

remember in MK when we were both civ and you thought I was bad cos I mislynched sig?

remember how you wouldn't let me go till you got me mislynched?

[wolbre04]

[VOTE: Queen] aubergine