Firefly, The Game [GAME OVER]

[DharmaHelper]

Spoiler: show

Dragon D. Luffy
2
3%


Voters: Owner of a Lonely Heart, ColinIsCool

In case DDL is bad.

I don’t know why I voted for him tbh. I guess I interpreted his behavior differently from you and I have reservations about your case but it’s not bad.

I kinda think the scum would have been less likely to campaign as captains because it might open them up to being lynched more easily (possibly, idk, that might not be an accurate understanding of the rules) but then again that might be me projecting my own feelings had I been in that position.

I think Epi looks like he did as town in Retro. Golden as well but I think Nova is townish too. Guess what motherfuckers, I’ve vacillated back to calling everybody town again

Owner sketched me out a lil too

Owner sketched me out a lil too

Tell me more. :P

I take it back, your ISO was cleaner than I thought and I’m not voting a new player D1 anyway

Colin thoughts:

"Kinda" this "maybe" that. Very nebulous thoughts and suspects (again, apart from "Enrique bad" which seems to be the one suspicion Colin is willing to hold for more than an hour) He said "others" pinged him a bit but if you can find evidence of that, God bless. If I had to put a number on it I'd say 55-65% chances Colin's bad.

[DharmaHelper]

DH, why are DDL and Nut suspects for voicing the same suspicion I did in a similar manner, but I’m not? I can see a scum piggy backing on any potential wagon so long as they don’t have to stick their neck out too far but we three pretty much seem to be saying the same thing, so why do I get a pass?

Because I haven't had the time to read you specifically yet.

In hunkering down and reading Colin I've noted that apart from "Enrique bad" he tends to waffle on who he suspects and trusts. A weak Enrique vote and a sporadic nature don't ring civ to me, necessarily but I do suspect the people following such a dumb case more than the guy who made it.

If the case I have on Enrique is dumb, how dumb is Enrique’s case on me?

I'm glad you asked.

[ColinIsCool]

DH you can’t just quote stuff I say and say it’s bad, like I did to Enrique.

[Epignosis]

It's hard to make out.

It's easy!

Find someone who is attracted to you, and build up a relationship. As you get closer, your significant other will likely offer signs that he or she would be interested in more physical interactions. Always make sure your breath is fresh and that you don't have any food stuck in your teeth. Tongue is optional, but don't overdo it.

[ColinIsCool]

Quoting this so it’s not buried.

Not that I’m No Uing, but I am really amazed at how easily you’re willing to trust him after all that cool stuff happened in FWWM.

[sig]

It's hard to make out.

It's easy!

Find someone who is attracted to you, and build up a relationship. As you get closer, your significant other will likely offer signs that he or she would be interested in more physical interactions. Always make sure your breath is fresh and that you don't have any food stuck in your teeth. Tongue is optional, but don't overdo it.

[Enrique]

I'm ok with a lynch on Mac rn but it also feels like bait. Mac is making it too easy.

Enrique is actually trying not to be lynched and I don't think he's actually succeeding.

didn't see anybody mention me until my catch up rn but ok

[DharmaHelper]

I feel like a lot of the ongoing discussions are dead-ends. GTH I don't think DDL is bad, he's just being really clumsy lol. Mac is laying pretty low, but we did just start and I don't think his activity so far is indicative of alignment. Glorfindel is all over sig for what looks like nothing to me but... I remember Glorf's first game, and I believe the talk about his meta. sig has been fine.

Got a funny feeling about speedchuck but he hasn't been around a lot and I don't want to contribute to a possible pile-up. Leaving a placeholder vote on Colin for now for no good reason.

If Ifs and buts were candy and nuts, huh Enrique?

This is the post that has everybody at half-mast ready to get their lynch on. As things go its not the most suspicious thing that's happened today. Much like Colin, very indecisive and straddling the fence as to what Enrique actually thinks. Not a civ quality, I would think.

Enri's putting his thoughts out there, but he's hedging his bets way too much here and way too early on in the day phase. I don't like this post, but I don't think its a slam dunk either.

[Dragon D. Luffy]

Nutella because in the process of me writing this post, she posted and tipped her hand a bit maybe:

I have to agree with Colin on Enrique. Felt like he was just saying stuff to say stuff.

Haven't sorted out where I am on Golden/Nova yet. Which is kinda weird because usually I'd be on Golden's side in a heartbeat, but I'm not feeling it so far.

"Just saying stuff to say stuff." = Mafia.

*incredibly cool backflip onto a stage filed with notes*

Spoiler: show

My bonds with Luna and TH are special and inviolable

I really have not thought about this very much I guess that would make sense

/\

This is what I meant but was too lazy to explain.

Of the five currently-tied players, I'm not super enthused about Golden and TH, mainly because I find them fairly hard to read, and both of them seem to be campaigning heartily. Then again, they'd probably want the mantle of captain regardless of alignment.

If people think that they can easily catch Golden and TH if they turn out to be scum, then by all means, vote for both of them. Unfortunately, I don't think I can, so either of them being captain makes me a little nervous.

*Pastes this post into my INH Scrapbook of Mysteries for future scrutiny*

Aw now I have no votes. And someone who's not even playing has one.

I just realised TH offered jobs to all three people I publicly said I was offering jobs to

This after he deliberately voted in a way that pushed me out of top 4 when he voted.

Before I overreact, opinions please. Would town TH deliberately bait me?

My crew picks have nothing to do with whatever you're doing. I've got #squad #goals

This is a #TownieTurbup.

Sup sacks. Sackdougall here to show you my sack.

Golden and Mac team up with Goldman Sachs and get gold in sacks

Seems like an awful lot of "saying stuff to say stuff" to me but what the hell do I know.

In context, Nutella's "Saying stuff to say stuff" is about Enrique giving 'scumhunty' positions in a 'player salad' manner, in other words, acting like he's contributing because he needs to look good.

Your quoted nutella posts are fluffy, but fluff is not what she was talking about. There is no fake substantiality to Nutella's quoted posts there, which is what Enrique is accused of.

[DharmaHelper]

DH you can’t just quote stuff I say and say it’s bad, like I did to Enrique.

I ...

*interpretive dance routine*

Didn't.

[Dragon D. Luffy]

In context, Nutella's "Saying stuff to say stuff" is about Enrique giving 'scumhunty' positions in a 'player salad' manner, in other words, acting like he's contributing because he needs to look good.

Your quoted nutella posts are fluffy, but fluff is not what she was talking about. There is no fake substantiality to Nutella's quoted posts there, which is what Enrique is accused of.

/\

This is what I meant but was too lazy to explain.

(Sorry previous post broke)

[Dragon D. Luffy]

Anybody wanna parse why DDL said he didn't want civs to fall into an easy lynch but hitched his wagon to a two word case against Enrique

Why, I wonder? Maybe he thinks the Enrique wagon is legit?

[Epignosis]

Update:

Civilians

DharmaHelper
Glorfindel
Golden
OwnerofaLonelyHeart
sig
Turnip Head

[Enrique]

DH, why are DDL and Nut suspects for voicing the same suspicion I did in a similar manner, but I’m not? I can see a scum piggy backing on any potential wagon so long as they don’t have to stick their neck out too far but we three pretty much seem to be saying the same thing, so why do I get a pass?

Because I haven't had the time to read you specifically yet.

In hunkering down and reading Colin I've noted that apart from "Enrique bad" he tends to waffle on who he suspects and trusts. A weak Enrique vote and a sporadic nature don't ring civ to me, necessarily but I do suspect the people following such a dumb case more than the guy who made it.

If the case I have on Enrique is dumb, how dumb is Enrique’s case on me?

I don't have a case, Colin, I specified it was a placeholder vote and you had a violent reaction. Your case is bad because it turns out people laying their cards on the table and giving their takes on the ongoing conflicts is good actually.

I absolved DDL as being clumsy but I think he's using that as a crotch at this point. This is the exact wagon he was warning against, no way you make that vote and that post in such close proximity and don't feel like you have anything to reconsider.

[Dragon D. Luffy]

I see no way that Golden isn't town in this game.

Be careful, that is a dangerous path to take.

So why is MacDougall and DrWilgy voting to lynch him? Not a good look for either of them.

Agree with this though.

[Enrique]

The idea that I've been trying to deflect a lynch is also pure fiction conceived while I was away ftr

[Enrique]

I feel like a lot of the ongoing discussions are dead-ends. GTH I don't think DDL is bad, he's just being really clumsy lol. Mac is laying pretty low, but we did just start and I don't think his activity so far is indicative of alignment. Glorfindel is all over sig for what looks like nothing to me but... I remember Glorf's first game, and I believe the talk about his meta. sig has been fine.

Got a funny feeling about speedchuck but he hasn't been around a lot and I don't want to contribute to a possible pile-up. Leaving a placeholder vote on Colin for now for no good reason.

If Ifs and buts were candy and nuts, huh Enrique?

This is the post that has everybody at half-mast ready to get their lynch on. As things go its not the most suspicious thing that's happened today. Much like Colin, very indecisive and straddling the fence as to what Enrique actually thinks. Not a civ quality, I would think.

Enri's putting his thoughts out there, but he's hedging his bets way too much here and way too early on in the day phase. I don't like this post, but I don't think its a slam dunk either.

The first two "buts" aren't for me, they're answers to the discussions on Mac and Glorf. Mac's activity being NAI and me believing Glorf's claim. Not me being indecisive.

[DharmaHelper]

Me after stirring up all kinds of shit today

[Dragon D. Luffy]

Not that I’m No Uing, but I am really amazed at how easily you’re willing to trust him after all that cool stuff happened in FWWM.

Or Image Mafia for that matter.

[ColinIsCool]

DH, why are DDL and Nut suspects for voicing the same suspicion I did in a similar manner, but I’m not? I can see a scum piggy backing on any potential wagon so long as they don’t have to stick their neck out too far but we three pretty much seem to be saying the same thing, so why do I get a pass?

Because I haven't had the time to read you specifically yet.

In hunkering down and reading Colin I've noted that apart from "Enrique bad" he tends to waffle on who he suspects and trusts. A weak Enrique vote and a sporadic nature don't ring civ to me, necessarily but I do suspect the people following such a dumb case more than the guy who made it.

If the case I have on Enrique is dumb, how dumb is Enrique’s case on me?

I don't have a case, Colin, I specified it was a placeholder vote and you had a violent reaction. Your case is bad because it turns out people laying their cards on the table and giving their takes on the ongoing conflicts is good actually.

I absolved DDL as being clumsy but I think he's using that as a crotch at this point. This is the exact wagon he was warning against, no way you make that vote and that post in such close proximity and don't feel like you have anything to reconsider.

I have zero idea what you’re trying to say in the first graf re: “cards on the table” or in the second with DDL. I don’t care what DDL does so long as he doesn’t ping me and he looks mostly legit so far — defensive, but he was forced there long ago.

The post you made was just ... bad. DDL and nutella and speed’s characterizations of it (I think speed?) said everything I didn’t substantiate, which is my bad, but no point hammering it in.

But I will grant you that it is one post, on top of a vibe, but vibes have been wrong. My vote is pretty placeholder too. If not you, where should I be looking?

[Dragon D. Luffy]

DH, why are DDL and Nut suspects for voicing the same suspicion I did in a similar manner, but I’m not? I can see a scum piggy backing on any potential wagon so long as they don’t have to stick their neck out too far but we three pretty much seem to be saying the same thing, so why do I get a pass?

Because I haven't had the time to read you specifically yet.

In hunkering down and reading Colin I've noted that apart from "Enrique bad" he tends to waffle on who he suspects and trusts. A weak Enrique vote and a sporadic nature don't ring civ to me, necessarily but I do suspect the people following such a dumb case more than the guy who made it.

If the case I have on Enrique is dumb, how dumb is Enrique’s case on me?

I don't have a case, Colin, I specified it was a placeholder vote and you had a violent reaction. Your case is bad because it turns out people laying their cards on the table and giving their takes on the ongoing conflicts is good actually.

I absolved DDL as being clumsy but I think he's using that as a crotch at this point. This is the exact wagon he was warning against, no way you make that vote and that post in such close proximity and don't feel like you have anything to reconsider.

It's not like I think this is an amazing case but it's definitely the best one I've got.

And definitely better than a whole day of uncommited "I think DDL looks bad" followed by a 2-3 vote wagon on him at the end, which is what I was worried about. Or on someone else, for that matter.

Now it feels like we are making progress, even if I'm not sure about it being the right direction.

[Dragon D. Luffy]

The idea that I've been trying to deflect a lynch is also pure fiction conceived while I was away ftr

I actually used the wrong wording in there.

You weren't trying to deflect a lynch, because the lynch didn't exist.

You were trying to look like town. So I guess "avoid" is a better word.

And that is not the basis for my case on you, it's just something I compared you with Mac for.

[Dragon D. Luffy]

Point is, it didn't seem like anyone as making any effort on building credible cases before.

Now I'm seeing that effort.

This is good. Our chances of lynching correctly on Day 1 went from like 1% to something like 30%, according to a calculation I just pulled from my butt.

[Marmot]

There's a lot of posts here, what should I do?

[Epignosis]

There's a lot of posts here, what should I do?

Whatever you do, don't post any pictures or songs.

[Enrique]

Quoting this so it’s not buried.

Not that I’m No Uing, but I am really amazed at how easily you’re willing to trust him after all that cool stuff happened in FWWM.

This is an appeal to emotion with nothing to say about this game.

DH, why are DDL and Nut suspects for voicing the same suspicion I did in a similar manner, but I’m not? I can see a scum piggy backing on any potential wagon so long as they don’t have to stick their neck out too far but we three pretty much seem to be saying the same thing, so why do I get a pass?

Because I haven't had the time to read you specifically yet.

In hunkering down and reading Colin I've noted that apart from "Enrique bad" he tends to waffle on who he suspects and trusts. A weak Enrique vote and a sporadic nature don't ring civ to me, necessarily but I do suspect the people following such a dumb case more than the guy who made it.

If the case I have on Enrique is dumb, how dumb is Enrique’s case on me?

I don't have a case, Colin, I specified it was a placeholder vote and you had a violent reaction. Your case is bad because it turns out people laying their cards on the table and giving their takes on the ongoing conflicts is good actually.

I absolved DDL as being clumsy but I think he's using that as a crotch at this point. This is the exact wagon he was warning against, no way you make that vote and that post in such close proximity and don't feel like you have anything to reconsider.

I have zero idea what you’re trying to say in the first graf re: “cards on the table” or in the second with DDL. I don’t care what DDL does so long as he doesn’t ping me and he looks mostly legit so far — defensive, but he was forced there long ago.

The post you made was just ... bad. DDL and nutella and speed’s characterizations of it (I think speed?) said everything I didn’t substantiate, which is my bad, but no point hammering it in.

But I will grant you that it is one post, on top of a vibe, but vibes have been wrong. My vote is pretty placeholder too. If not you, where should I be looking?

I stand by my post. Taking a stance on thread discussions is not extra or fluff, and it wasn't "wishy-washy" the way it's presented. I have concrete opinions and takes and I haven't been trying to be ambiguous about them. This isn't new to me either, this is how I play most games.

DDL hasn't had a stellar game (which I'd hardly say he was "forced" into) but you could still say he was just being clumsy on wording or dragged down by a couple of bad posts. He just keeps going, though, as if we're supposed to understand he's off-bounds now. I don't like it and I may just end up voting for him. I don't like speedchuck in this game either and I don't like this whole ass misrepresentation of how I'm participating.

[Marmot]

There's a lot of posts here, what should I do?

Whatever you do, don't post any pictures or songs.

How about pictures that move?

[Dragon D. Luffy]

There's a lot of posts here, what should I do?

90% of it is crew related stuff. Pick a crew and skip that banter. Actual mafia play started about 6 pages ago.

[Enrique]

The idea that I've been trying to deflect a lynch is also pure fiction conceived while I was away ftr

I actually used the wrong wording in there.

You weren't trying to deflect a lynch, because the lynch didn't exist.

You were trying to look like town. So I guess "avoid" is a better word.

And that is not the basis for my case on you, it's just something I compared you with Mac for.

Weird how when you use the wrong wording it advances your cases in totally predictable ways.

[Dragon D. Luffy]

The idea that I've been trying to deflect a lynch is also pure fiction conceived while I was away ftr

I actually used the wrong wording in there.

You weren't trying to deflect a lynch, because the lynch didn't exist.

You were trying to look like town. So I guess "avoid" is a better word.

And that is not the basis for my case on you, it's just something I compared you with Mac for.

Weird how when you use the wrong wording it advances your cases in totally predictable ways.

<insert picture of villain petting his cat>

[Marmot]

There's a lot of posts here, what should I do?

90% of it is crew related stuff. Pick a crew and skip that banter. Actual mafia play started about 6 pages ago.

Will you be on my crew?

[Dragon D. Luffy]

DDL hasn't had a stellar game (which I'd hardly say he was "forced" into) but you could still say he was just being clumsy on wording or dragged down by a couple of bad posts. He just keeps going, though, as if we're supposed to understand he's off-bounds now. I don't like it and I may just end up voting for him. I don't like speedchuck in this game either and I don't like this whole ass misrepresentation of how I'm participating.

I don't care if you want me to stop playing my way.

I'm gonna play fast and loose because that's how I have the most fun playing mafia. And sometimes it even catches scum.

[Dragon D. Luffy]

There's a lot of posts here, what should I do?

90% of it is crew related stuff. Pick a crew and skip that banter. Actual mafia play started about 6 pages ago.

Will you be on my crew?

Only if [mention]Lunalee[/mention] invites you. She's the captain.

[Epignosis]

There's a lot of posts here, what should I do?

Whatever you do, don't post any pictures or songs.

How about pictures that move?

Definitely not. And certainly no pictures of drinks.

[Golden]

That’s a big load of baloney right there, nova.

1) I danced around nothing. I’ve been direct about what I’ve been seeing. It’s your choice whether to engage in my suspicions of you or not, I don’t have to ask a specific question of you or @mention you to get your attention. That’s a completely arbitrary standard you’ve decided to apply, just to paint me as not genuine.

2) The motivation is clear to me - to control who is on what crew, who’s available for a nk, who’s available for a lynch. I’m far less controllable. If I pick an entirely town crew, and prevent them being lynched, then I get a strong advantage over the mafia. If I pick well, I can effectively prevent myself being nked.

3) You say you saw it coming... I could tell. That’s why you came at me the way you did to begin with. I called you out and instead of addressing my suspicion, you went as hominem - going after my choice of grammar instead of the accusation. There’s nothing much to your reasoning for your votes. Your turn on me was because apparently you liked me early and liked me less later, but you didn’t manage to give a single reason for either of those things. You’ve been waiting for me to vote before you do much of anything, just so you can defend the vote instead of actually engaging in the original suspicion too deeply.

Your response post then is trying to make out like my logic doesn’t track when you’re all over the place.

I particularly like this sentence from yo: “you’re getting too hung up on the captain votes, when I don’t think it should be a priority.” Of course you wouldn’t think it should be a priority if you’re reading it down. But I hate that deeply. If you don’t think the mafia tried to manipulate that vote in some way... we’ll i just don’t believe you.

Day zero and day one is where mafia slip and think they can get away with it. They protect their own, help each other out and pass it off as unimportant. The very fact you set out to overtly break the tie and then did it with absolutely no post history to back it up is part of why I find yours in particular the most suspicious - because what mafia would be so bold, huh? It has its own inherent wifom.

As for me wanting to be captain - on that one, at least, I’ll admit it’s NAI. I’d want it either way. But I wanted it here because of how badly day zero reeked of manipulation.

1) Oh, you danced around it all right. I engaged your suspicions twice, and you've asked me questions every time. You dropped it every time afterwards. I can't do anything more than that.

2) Nice then riddle me this, why did I not break the tie between you and Glorfindel if you think me and my team were dreading having you as captain? While you're at it, elaborate on my motivation on voting you first, then voting for people with no votes, and finally going with 3 of the 5 tied.

I agree that it's weird but I don't agree that it is suspicious/bad. I think you're being pretty opportunistic trying to paint it as such, that's why I saw this coming after your 2 mentions of my votes.

3) Is explaining my thought process on how I voted, not addressing your suspicions? I would think that is one way to ease them, since you think there are ulterior motives behind them. Nah, I'm not going after your choice of grammar, you're just full of it.

I never said the Mafia never had tried to manipulate the votes, nor elect one of theirs. I said that what I did was in no way some grandiose manipulation, as you'd like to paint it. I think it's pretty dumb to think so.

Lol, yeah sure. The Day Zero mafia manipulation of captain votes, and Nova the bold. Thank god you're here to save us from it.

Somehow me bringing it up again and again and you ‘knowing’ this vote was coming also equals me ‘dropping it’. Can you point out a post where I dropped it? You’re making out like I’ve moved on from you or accepted your answers.

Your entire response has been over the top attack on me, not the case. I think that’s because you’re bad and you don’t have a substantive reason for what you did.

[Golden]

Btw novas apparently been expecting me to come at him for ages and says I’m bad because I do but there’s no particular stated suspicion nor even a vote for me to back it up. Just attack as defence.

Pretty standard stuff.

I had a bad feeling about how you've been trying to paint my votes for captain. It read as you dancing around an opportunity, and trying to find suspicions where there are none. I wanted to see if you'd commit, and go for my lynch before I strike back.

You did. Bad move.

Bullshit. Your entire case on me is that I was hesitant or something, but you call your own non-engagement ‘standard stuff’.

You had absolutely no intention of calling me out as bad unless you felt you had to.

My suspicion is not something I’m ‘trying to find’ and I invite anyone to go back and read. There’s several people who broke a tie against me over the course of time but Nova did it twice (once with the vote removal, another time by voting for others) and his reasons are generic as generic.

Nova, you’re making out like my suspicion is not real. You broke the tie against me twice and you’re making out like this has no legitimacy. You are not prepared for trying to no u me.

[DharmaHelper]

See why I wanted Golden on my crew?

[ColinIsCool]

I don’t know if I’ve ever seen scum DDL.

[Golden]

Btw novas apparently been expecting me to come at him for ages and says I’m bad because I do but there’s no particular stated suspicion nor even a vote for me to back it up. Just attack as defence.

Pretty standard stuff.

I had a bad feeling about how you've been trying to paint my votes for captain. It read as you dancing around an opportunity, and trying to find suspicions where there are none. I wanted to see if you'd commit, and go for my lynch before I strike back.

You did. Bad move.

"Dancing around an opportunity" is a good way to put how Golden looks to me, too. Like he's chasing a victim card that doesn't really exist

I deeply hate the dismissal of this.

Tell me TH, do you think the mafia would not have tried to manipulate the captain vote in any way?
If the answer is that you do actually believe the mafia would try to manipulate it, doesn't that leave legitimate victims of the manipulation?

Same questions to Nova.

People should see past the fact it's me. I'd be breathing down the neck of anyone who was left in my position as a result.

[DharmaHelper]

Right now I have Colin or Nutella or v. distant 3rd DDL pegged as the SK

And I don't think Golden/Nova is Civ/Civ.

[Golden]

Day zero and day one is where mafia slip and think they can get away with it. They protect their own, help each other out and pass it off as unimportant. The very fact you set out to overtly break the tie and then did it with absolutely no post history to back it up is part of why I find yours in particular the most suspicious - because what mafia would be so bold, huh? It has its own inherent wifom.

I'm not sure how to feel about this. On the one hand, I've seen players that never do this. On the other hand, I'd seen it happen all of once. On the third hand, we have a whole paragraph of justification for the nova case ending with "it's WIFOM."

You've seen players do it all the time, I'm just describing it in a different way. Any time people go back and do interaction isos, I guarantee you the best meat is day 0/day 1. It's where I spend my most focus.

[speedchuck]

Tell me TH, do you think the mafia would not have tried to manipulate the captain vote in any way?
If the answer is that you do actually believe the mafia would try to manipulate it, doesn't that leave legitimate victims of the manipulation?

I'm not TH. You can wait to answer this.

In what way do you suppose mafia WOULD manipulate the vote, and why? Give me some game mechanic backing for you suspicions.

[speedchuck]

Day zero and day one is where mafia slip and think they can get away with it. They protect their own, help each other out and pass it off as unimportant. The very fact you set out to overtly break the tie and then did it with absolutely no post history to back it up is part of why I find yours in particular the most suspicious - because what mafia would be so bold, huh? It has its own inherent wifom.

I'm not sure how to feel about this. On the one hand, I've seen players that never do this. On the other hand, I'd seen it happen all of once. On the third hand, we have a whole paragraph of justification for the nova case ending with "it's WIFOM."

You've seen players do it all the time, I'm just describing it in a different way. Any time people go back and do interaction isos, I guarantee you the best meat is day 0/day 1. It's where I spend my most focus.

There was one time I saw a town hunter call out the entire scumteam, as a group, on page 2. The scumteam openly admitted they were caught. Nobody took it seriously.

[Dragon D. Luffy]

I don’t know if I’ve ever seen scum DDL.

Good recent example here: http://www.mafiathesyndicate.com/viewto ... =28&t=1584

[Dragon D. Luffy]

Tell me TH, do you think the mafia would not have tried to manipulate the captain vote in any way?
If the answer is that you do actually believe the mafia would try to manipulate it, doesn't that leave legitimate victims of the manipulation?

I'm not TH. You can wait to answer this.

In what way do you suppose mafia WOULD manipulate the vote, and why? Give me some game mechanic backing for you suspicions.

Straight up voting for their teammate, or taking the vote away from a civ who is threatening to take their teammate's place.

I think if I were bad, I wouldn't try too hard to secure the captain spots by voting for teammates, but I would risk one or two if I could, because there's a lot of WIFOM to shield me.

[Golden]

The thing that ruins this for me is that I also did roughly the same thing nova did, but I ended up changing my vote so that's okay I guess

I didn't love it. I wrote your name down but then crossed it out when you switched. But I was highly aware that I could have made you feel like 'town speedchuck' would have voted for me.

Look, if people think I'm actually barking up the wrong tree they should say so. But I'm not taking this from the people I'm accusing, they would say that. I'm interested in objective opinions.

I don't think I'm wrong about nova. Even if I have the motives wrong, nova's defence is all about how my reasons for suspicion are bad, even while his behaviour itself and the way he has handled me comes across as worse than the original offence imo.

[Dragon D. Luffy]

Especially with the 4 vote thing. Voting for 2 civs/2 baddies or 3 civs/1 baddie is really easy.

[Golden]

Tell me TH, do you think the mafia would not have tried to manipulate the captain vote in any way?
If the answer is that you do actually believe the mafia would try to manipulate it, doesn't that leave legitimate victims of the manipulation?

I'm not TH. You can wait to answer this.

In what way do you suppose mafia WOULD manipulate the vote, and why? Give me some game mechanic backing for you suspicions.

You're limited to your crew at night. You'd need some control over the crews to make sure you aren't all in the same place.

[Dragon D. Luffy]

The thing that ruins this for me is that I also did roughly the same thing nova did, but I ended up changing my vote so that's okay I guess

I didn't love it. I wrote your name down but then crossed it out when you switched. But I was highly aware that I could have made you feel like 'town speedchuck' would have voted for me.

Look, if people think I'm actually barking up the wrong tree they should say so. But I'm not taking this from the people I'm accusing, they would say that. I'm interested in objective opinions.

I don't think I'm wrong about nova. Even if I have the motives wrong, nova's defence is all about how my reasons for suspicion are bad, even while his behaviour itself and the way he has handled me comes across as worse than the original offence imo.

I agree with the point you are making, I just think there is enough reasonable doubt to give me pause. That, and knowing civ nova is also fond of OMGUS.

[Golden]

Day zero and day one is where mafia slip and think they can get away with it. They protect their own, help each other out and pass it off as unimportant. The very fact you set out to overtly break the tie and then did it with absolutely no post history to back it up is part of why I find yours in particular the most suspicious - because what mafia would be so bold, huh? It has its own inherent wifom.

I'm not sure how to feel about this. On the one hand, I've seen players that never do this. On the other hand, I'd seen it happen all of once. On the third hand, we have a whole paragraph of justification for the nova case ending with "it's WIFOM."

You've seen players do it all the time, I'm just describing it in a different way. Any time people go back and do interaction isos, I guarantee you the best meat is day 0/day 1. It's where I spend my most focus.

There was one time I saw a town hunter call out the entire scumteam, as a group, on page 2. The scumteam openly admitted they were caught. Nobody took it seriously.

It's where people aren't ready to believe they can be caught yet, but also they aren't sure what people think of their teammates yet and so they're more awkward handling them. They're more risky in the early stages.