Steely Dan Mafia [ENDGAME]
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juliets
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Re: Steely Dan Mafia [Day 6]
Who was at the top of her POE list? dunya and Elo? I think she posted a read where she assigned percentages to people.
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Re: Steely Dan Mafia [Day 6]
still going with this, for nowKites wrote: ↑Tue Apr 30, 2019 4:28 pmI don’t believe in mafia not sending the night kills one bit. Even if lurker mafia doesn’t post, they are almost certainly checking the thread and sending the NK doesn’t take much of your time. Besides Jack was alive when luna didn’t post, and how do we know if there isn’t a 4th member of mafia team? I am suspicious of luna but this feels like a too made up excuse to voteElohcin wrote: ↑Mon Apr 29, 2019 8:14 pmLuna was not active and there were no night kills for what, 2 nights? Then there was the narrowed lynch poll. Luna was on it and all of a sudden she had time to come in and get involved. With an active Luna there was now a night kill. I explained that if the night kill came about now that Luna was active, that I would assume those non-night kills were due to an inactive mafia luna.
linki....this whole insanification gold stuff is over my head.
[VOTE: Elohcin] aubergine
[VOTE: Elohcin] aubergine
could go for a luna lynch too
Re: Steely Dan Mafia [Day 6]
it was fun, thank you!Re: Steely Dan Mafia [Day 6]
updated version. fixed mistakes pointed out last time
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Re: Steely Dan Mafia [Day 6]
it’s fucking 3 am, I’m off to bed now
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juliets
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Re: Steely Dan Mafia [Day 6]
Here's Mata's post where she assigned percentages:
Matahari wrote: ↑Wed May 01, 2019 1:07 pm @juliets if I have a chance today, I will go back to night three and day 4 and quote the particular posts of Dunya’s, that made me feel really bad about her. She posted to Jay, and to maybe DDL, I’m not sure and the posts sounded like attempts at trying to paint Nova in a bad light. Like saying something about someone, that leaves a bad taste in your mouth about that someone. Then on night 4, after no one jumped onboard, she just as subtly backed away from it, and that’s what woke me up and I started watching her.
I may not be here so much today, so I’ll finish my thoughts in this post. This is about the point in every game where I begin rethinking. I’m aware that nobody is necessarily who I think they might be. Which makes everyone suspicious to me, all over again. Because of that, I just have to stand by my current list and not let it get drowned out by the passing of time, so to speak.
Dunya, Elohcin 80% or more, sure
Luna, DDL 70% or less sure
JJJ 60% or less sure
Everyone else right in the middle.
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juliets
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Re: Steely Dan Mafia [Day 6]
[mention]dunya[/mention] and [mention]Elohcin[/mention] can you think of any reason Mata would have said she was 80% sure you were bad?
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Spacedaisy
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Re: Steely Dan Mafia [Night 5]
This is a good catch...
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Dragon D. Luffy
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Re: Steely Dan Mafia [Day 6]
Ok I'm done negleting this game, tomorrow I'll start negleting the other game (and catching up on this one).
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Long Con
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Re: Steely Dan Mafia [Night 5]
One important factor is that no one else came forward with a reason for two nights in a row. Although I guess that it could have been a thing where my baddie teammate uses their ability to make two nights to give me some extra oomph... I would love to pull a gambit like that. Though that baddie teammate dying would reveal me. But the truth is, sadly, WYSIWYG.juliets wrote: ↑Wed May 01, 2019 3:37 pmThis is funny to me because in my tinfoiliest mind LC could be bad. LC is a gambit guy and what better, more brilliant gambit than to bus Jack with a made up role (I mean the role is really weird you have to admit) and ride the wave of being mechanically cleared until the end. Now, do I believe that happened? No, but it's still an idea that creeps up on me when I'm considering people.
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Long Con
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Re: Steely Dan Mafia [Night 5]
Why is this a good catch? When I first came to the thread, the host post was already corrected, and I saw Juliets' comment about how it was the unfortunate right thing to do, or something... I was confused as well.Spacedaisy wrote: ↑Wed May 01, 2019 8:40 pmThis is a good catch...
Re: Steely Dan Mafia [Night 5]
correctly is.speedchuck wrote: ↑Wed May 01, 2019 7:43 pm For the record, I've never seen Luna flat-out ignore a mafia game like with this one.
She probably needs to go.
I could see her as unmotivated with either alignment, technically, but there's not much else to do here.
Luna's Wins/Losses
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speedchuck
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JaggedJimmyJay
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Re: Steely Dan Mafia [Day 6]
Luna please use words that reflect your role within the confines of the curse.
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speedchuck
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Re: Steely Dan Mafia [Day 6]
Juliets and I could straight-up tell you the role, and she could confirm it with the curse
SIGNATURE:
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JaggedJimmyJay
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Re: Steely Dan Mafia [Day 6]
[VOTE: Jay] aubergine
[/quote]
My votes are lame. Sure whatever. Use emojis to tell me who that accusation does not apply to:
Dragon D. Luffy
dunya
Elochin
JaggedJimmyJay
juliets
Kites
Long Con
Lunalee
Neverwhere
Spacedaisy
speedchuck
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JaggedJimmyJay
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Re: Steely Dan Mafia [Day 6]
That's essentially what I mean. Whether I know it or not, corroboration is necessary.speedchuck wrote: ↑Wed May 01, 2019 10:42 pm Juliets and I could straight-up tell you the role, and she could confirm it with the curse
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JaggedJimmyJay
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Re: Steely Dan Mafia [Day 6]
I dunno if the above quote worked to generate a notification, so [mention]Lunalee[/mention]
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JaggedJimmyJay
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JaggedJimmyJay
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Re: Steely Dan Mafia [Day 6]
Matahari was a classic watcher. The potential exists then that she caught someone delivering a night kill. I wish we had a more conclusive way to guess at whether that occurred, but her recent energy increase could be so indicative.
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JaggedJimmyJay
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Re: Steely Dan Mafia [Night 2]
Given that Mata voiced her strongest suspicions of Elohcin and dunya, I'm going to look specifically into her handling of those two. I will focus only on posts coming after one night phase when she could have obtained any kind of information.
Night 2. Elohcin is a suspect among two others. I don't get the impression this is informed, or I'd figure on Elohcin being split into her own focused case. I don't know Mata's brain of course.
Night 3. Same list plus speedchuck. She is [arguably] the most concretely negative in her explanation of her Elohcin read. It is still hard to say that this is informed.
Day 5. She voiced suspicion of both Elohcin and dunya, and clearly intended for her focus to be on dunya. The relationship of night actions and role chatter driving Mata's read on dunya is interesting for the specific purpose of this review.
Mata's beef with dunya is expressed in a series of posts starting around that point in her ISO. She made this a bit of a personal crusade.
If Mata caught someone with their hands in the cookie jar, I think her posts point to dunya more than they point to Elohcin.
Keyword IF
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Night 2. Elohcin is a suspect among two others. I don't get the impression this is informed, or I'd figure on Elohcin being split into her own focused case. I don't know Mata's brain of course.
Spoiler: show
Night 3. Same list plus speedchuck. She is [arguably] the most concretely negative in her explanation of her Elohcin read. It is still hard to say that this is informed.
Spoiler: show
Day 5. She voiced suspicion of both Elohcin and dunya, and clearly intended for her focus to be on dunya. The relationship of night actions and role chatter driving Mata's read on dunya is interesting for the specific purpose of this review.
Mata's beef with dunya is expressed in a series of posts starting around that point in her ISO. She made this a bit of a personal crusade.
If Mata caught someone with their hands in the cookie jar, I think her posts point to dunya more than they point to Elohcin.
Keyword IF
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JaggedJimmyJay
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Re: Steely Dan Mafia [Day 6]
I'm not comfortable placing all of my eggs in that basket. It does beg discussion though and is a valid case against dunya. I am feeling inclined to swap her with Kites in my previous rainbow.
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JaggedJimmyJay
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Re: Steely Dan Mafia [Day 6]
My votes are lame. Sure whatever. Use emojis to tell me who that accusation does not apply to:
Dragon D. Luffy
dunya
Elochin
JaggedJimmyJay
juliets
Kites
Long Con
Lunalee
Neverwhere
Spacedaisy
speedchuck
[/quote]
Luna's Wins/Losses
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dunya
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Re: Steely Dan Mafia [Night 5]
Once again Jay, sets the narrative of me being bad as he did in his case and ignores a very important post made:
Mata had basically thought I scumslipped about being protected vs. roleblocked. Maybe she saw nova targeting me n3 and didn't like my quick conclusions. I dont know.
This Mata kill stinks.
If Mata is a watcher and caught me with "my hand in the cookie jar" why would she shift on me?
Mata had basically thought I scumslipped about being protected vs. roleblocked. Maybe she saw nova targeting me n3 and didn't like my quick conclusions. I dont know.
This Mata kill stinks.
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dunya
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Re: Steely Dan Mafia [Day 6]
[VOTE:
Jay] aubergine
That's twice (I've noticed) Jay ignoring my posts. 1st was when he cased me and came to the conclusion i town read jack just because he resembled world flags Jack. And now this...which is a huge deal. And maybe a third time when id explained about ddl like 500 times and he kept tagging me to state then again then dropped the discussion. Plus my other beef with him re: use of emotional manipulation on someone he knows is easily affected by that.
I want to know why he ignored that last post I quoted of Mata.
That's twice (I've noticed) Jay ignoring my posts. 1st was when he cased me and came to the conclusion i town read jack just because he resembled world flags Jack. And now this...which is a huge deal. And maybe a third time when id explained about ddl like 500 times and he kept tagging me to state then again then dropped the discussion. Plus my other beef with him re: use of emotional manipulation on someone he knows is easily affected by that.
I want to know why he ignored that last post I quoted of Mata.
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dunya
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Re: Steely Dan Mafia [Day 6]
[mention]Lunalee[/mention] Do you have gripes about speed? Or are you just saying his votes look bad?
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dunya
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Re: Steely Dan Mafia [Day 6]
I'm working 12hours today. I dont have a lot of time but I'll check on and off.
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JaggedJimmyJay
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Re: Steely Dan Mafia [Night 5]
That’s a valid point. I don’t really know what pink on a rainbow means, but it’s valid. Watcher stuff is not as conclusive as [for example] cop stuff, so I wouldn’t expect total commitment.dunya wrote: ↑Thu May 02, 2019 4:15 am Once again Jay, sets the narrative of me being bad as he did in his case and ignores a very important post made:
If Mata is a watcher and caught me with "my hand in the cookie jar" why would she shift on me?
Mata had basically thought I scumslipped about being protected vs. roleblocked. Maybe she saw nova targeting me n3 and didn't like my quick conclusions. I dont know.
This Mata kill stinks.
She flipped as a watcher and I tried to find answers pertaining to that role. This is very basic stuff that should happen for any flip of an investigative role. If I thought the argument could be closed there my vote would be on you right now.
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JaggedJimmyJay
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Re: Steely Dan Mafia [Day 6]
I’m not ignoring shit. You have a million posts. I don’t know them as well as you know them. During any two separate digs into your ISO I would be likely to find different things.dunya wrote: ↑Thu May 02, 2019 4:22 am [VOTE: Jay] aubergine
That's twice (I've noticed) Jay ignoring my posts. 1st was when he cased me and came to the conclusion i town read jack just because he resembled world flags Jack. And now this...which is a huge deal. And maybe a third time when id explained about ddl like 500 times and he kept tagging me to state then again then dropped the discussion. Plus my other beef with him re: use of emotional manipulation on someone he knows is easily affected by that.
I want to know why he ignored that last post I quoted of Mata.
You never answered me about DDL as far as I saw. So I poked and poked again. I still think your perspective of that was at best unfair.
I’m not emotionally manipulating shit either. I don’t even know what you’re talking about. THIS is emotional manipulation. If it’s the goddamned angleshoot, I literally sId that you wouldn’t do that deliberately and are an honorable player. I know you tied back to Phenon: Origins, and you’re not the first to do that, regarding emotional manipulation. It’s kind of infuriating, because I don’t see that game that way and I am NOT willing to do that as a means of winning civilian points. I have griped about that for literal years.
I don’t have time right now to say more, finals loom.
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JaggedJimmyJay
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Re: Steely Dan Mafia [Day 6]
[VOTE:
Dragon D. Luffy] aubergine
I feel like he’s just letting us all argue with each other.
I feel like he’s just letting us all argue with each other.
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JaggedJimmyJay
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Re: Steely Dan Mafia [Day 6]
I am considering a team of DDL and Elohcin. He referenced the GTH reads as one inspiration for his reduced poll. Elohcin was a majority mafia read in that exercise and he excluded her from his poll.
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JaggedJimmyJay
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Re: Steely Dan Mafia [Day 6]
Criticisms of his poll decisions in general are also more palatable given that leetic and niju are both revealed civilians.
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dunya
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Re: Steely Dan Mafia [Day 6]
i could maybe believe that re: jack, but there's no way i can believe you mistakenly missed one of mata's final posts where a "valid point" that contradicts your case exists. she didn't have a million posts. i'm sure you read her final posts when they are in reference to me. your job as mafia would be to paint me with a bad brush, and you're doing that in spades without committing. you want others to doubt me and shake any trust they have in me. you saw an opportunity after mata voiced strong concerns and you dug in with every ounce of effort. i don't believe you're genuine.JaggedJimmyJay wrote: ↑Thu May 02, 2019 6:51 am I’m not ignoring shit. You have a million posts. I don’t know them as well as you know them. During any two separate digs into your ISO I would be likely to find different things.
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juliets
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Re: Steely Dan Mafia [Night 5]
Good point LC. And like I said, I don't really believe it. It's just a thought that occurs to me in my tinfoiliest moments. You are firmly town in my mind.Long Con wrote: ↑Wed May 01, 2019 9:34 pmOne important factor is that no one else came forward with a reason for two nights in a row. Although I guess that it could have been a thing where my baddie teammate uses their ability to make two nights to give me some extra oomph... I would love to pull a gambit like that. Though that baddie teammate dying would reveal me. But the truth is, sadly, WYSIWYG.juliets wrote: ↑Wed May 01, 2019 3:37 pmThis is funny to me because in my tinfoiliest mind LC could be bad. LC is a gambit guy and what better, more brilliant gambit than to bus Jack with a made up role (I mean the role is really weird you have to admit) and ride the wave of being mechanically cleared until the end. Now, do I believe that happened? No, but it's still an idea that creeps up on me when I'm considering people.
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JaggedJimmyJay
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Re: Steely Dan Mafia [Day 6]
marina&thediamondsimnotarobot.youtubedunya wrote: ↑Thu May 02, 2019 8:03 ami could maybe believe that re: jack, but there's no way i can believe you mistakenly missed one of mata's final posts where a "valid point" that contradicts your case exists. she didn't have a million posts. i'm sure you read her final posts when they are in reference to me. your job as mafia would be to paint me with a bad brush, and you're doing that in spades without committing. you want others to doubt me and shake any trust they have in me. you saw an opportunity after mata voiced strong concerns and you dug in with every ounce of effort. i don't believe you're genuine.JaggedJimmyJay wrote: ↑Thu May 02, 2019 6:51 am I’m not ignoring shit. You have a million posts. I don’t know them as well as you know them. During any two separate digs into your ISO I would be likely to find different things.
I’m literally not committing. That is the truth. And I’m not doing it because I’m not sure. Lynching a civilian dunya right now is 101 for how a civilian team blows a lead. There are a lot of reasons to trust you.
Lynching me is the wrong answer and also exactly how civilians blow a lead. Read my posts with the purpose of finding a civilian in me and I don’t think you will struggle. Everything I have done in this game has been honest.
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dunya
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Re: Steely Dan Mafia [Night 5]
it could be that LC has a power that gives mafia 2 nights. it doesn't have to be as elaborate as another teammate doing that. and he just lies and says he red peeked jack - viola, a perfect bus.juliets wrote: ↑Thu May 02, 2019 8:04 amGood point LC. And like I said, I don't really believe it. It's just a thought that occurs to me in my tinfoiliest moments. You are firmly town in my mind.Long Con wrote: ↑Wed May 01, 2019 9:34 pmOne important factor is that no one else came forward with a reason for two nights in a row. Although I guess that it could have been a thing where my baddie teammate uses their ability to make two nights to give me some extra oomph... I would love to pull a gambit like that. Though that baddie teammate dying would reveal me. But the truth is, sadly, WYSIWYG.juliets wrote: ↑Wed May 01, 2019 3:37 pmThis is funny to me because in my tinfoiliest mind LC could be bad. LC is a gambit guy and what better, more brilliant gambit than to bus Jack with a made up role (I mean the role is really weird you have to admit) and ride the wave of being mechanically cleared until the end. Now, do I believe that happened? No, but it's still an idea that creeps up on me when I'm considering people.
chances of Jack bussing LC are more probable. chances of LC bussing Jack and Jack agreeing to it at all...0. chances that after LC and Jack's teammate Mac gets lynched on Day 1 they decide to sacrifice another teammate - negative infinity.
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Re: Steely Dan Mafia [Day 6]
I don’t feel like you’ve been listening to me in recent phases, dunya. I have felt as though you’re ignoring me on purpose. This isn’t even an accusation, seriously: am I that annoying that I cannot have a conversation? This is my perspective. It’s important because I cannot lead if I cannot be respected. That’s something that applies beyond just this game.
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juliets
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Re: Steely Dan Mafia [Day 6]
For me, like you, I can't find anything civ that Elo has done. Her last post was to come into the game, complain about mafia again, and leave with no content offered. With dunya I can see some civ looking behavior and she has tried hard to participate even though she is the busiest person I know. I could vote dunya if people would rather because Mata's accusal of her was surprising. I think almost everyone was seeing dunya as good. Bottom line, I could vote either but I'm starting on Elo for the reasons above.
lots of linki
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dunya
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Re: Steely Dan Mafia [Day 6]
where have i not been listening to you? i read every post, even your case on me (though to reply to every point would have been a waste of time especially when i've talked about most of that stuff repeatedly) and every interactive analysis you've compiled.JaggedJimmyJay wrote: ↑Thu May 02, 2019 8:13 am I don’t feel like you’ve been listening to me in recent phases, dunya. I have felt as though you’re ignoring me on purpose. This isn’t even an accusation, seriously: am I that annoying that I cannot have a conversation? This is my perspective. It’s important because I cannot lead if I cannot be respected. That’s something that applies beyond just this game.
if anything, i feel being asked the same questions implies people aren't reading me. i don't really care though, i've never been a "leader" and don't think i'll start now. but there reaches a point where i just don't have the energy.
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dunya
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Re: Steely Dan Mafia [Day 6]
please don't let this become a repeat of gossip girl. if mata was so sure i was bad, why was she swayed by my posts/arguments in the end?juliets wrote: ↑Thu May 02, 2019 8:14 amFor me, like you, I can't find anything civ that Elo has done. Her last post was to come into the game, complain about mafia again, and leave with no content offered. With dunya I can see some civ looking behavior and she has tried hard to participate even though she is the busiest person I know. I could vote dunya if people would rather because Mata's accusal of her was surprising. I think almost everyone was seeing dunya as good. Bottom line, I could vote either but I'm starting on Elo for the reasons above.
lots of linki
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juliets
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Re: Steely Dan Mafia [Day 6]
Also, re: not voting dunya, Mata's post that she could raise her to pink. Don't know exactly what pink is but it is better than being 80% sure she is bad. And lynching a civ dunya would be the wrong move as JJJ says.
linki dunya yes, this is to your point.
linki dunya yes, this is to your point.
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dunya
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Re: Steely Dan Mafia [Night 5]
[mention]juliets[/mention]
she's referencing this as my last post at the time:
dunya wrote: ↑Wed May 01, 2019 3:32 pmi don't want to claim. i think it's lame in this setup. i'll tell you this: on n3 my role failed but there was no kill. on n2, my role didn't fail and there was no kill (but after i discussed some things with epi earlier for clarification, i realized i didn't even have a role on n2 for reasons i misunderstood in my role). i don't have a night action tonight either, if mafia wanna have a go at me.speedchuck wrote: ↑Wed May 01, 2019 3:21 pmShe doesn't want to claim, but this seems kinda importantJaggedJimmyJay wrote: ↑Wed May 01, 2019 3:13 pm On one hand I feel concern that I am still here and thus need to be more concerned about being in a pocket. On the other, I think nova may have prevented my death by jailing me on Night 2 when my niju curse failed.
dunya seems to to have some other theory for that failed kill. Dunno what.
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juliets
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Re: Steely Dan Mafia [Day 6]
[mention]dunya[/mention] yes, that first post is the one I was talking about in my last post.
What are you telling me with the second post about not wanting to claim? I totally understand that.
Also. did you see my question about why mata would see you as 80% bad? Can you think of any reason or would that expose your role?
What are you telling me with the second post about not wanting to claim? I totally understand that.
Also. did you see my question about why mata would see you as 80% bad? Can you think of any reason or would that expose your role?
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JaggedJimmyJay
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Re: Steely Dan Mafia [Day 6]
dunya, basic question:
Would you expect a civilian Jay to fully trust you under these circumstances
Would you expect a civilian Jay to fully trust you under these circumstances
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dunya
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Re: Steely Dan Mafia [Day 6]
no, absolutely not. quite the contrary.JaggedJimmyJay wrote: ↑Thu May 02, 2019 8:29 am dunya, basic question:
Would you expect a civilian Jay to fully trust you under these circumstances