Inception [Inception Phase 4]

[iaafr]

it actually makes sense on so many levels

[iaafr]

new theory: all the syndicate regulars are scum and everybody else is town

this is now my readslist and i will be voting according to it

top of the page

[Lady LambdaDelta]

{Epignosis, Nova, Radishes}

Take Radishes out, put in IIAF

Don't know about Nova, but also one of You/Pawn/Nanook is scum IMO, so....

[iaafr]

{Epignosis, Nova, Radishes}

Take Radishes out, put in IIAF

Don't know about Nova, but also one of You/Pawn/Nanook is scum IMO, so....

theyre actually all town

[Epignosis]

Anyway Epi's posts are performative, not informative and they're designed to seep into the nature of people's want for content.

It's IIoA. They say many words, but not much in the end.

More than that, they're doing the Bullets for Bullets tactic I outlined in my scum guide. It feels like the goal of the posts is to be unreadably long and make you skim and say generally "agreeable" things people can't exactly contest without strictly committing anywhere.

@Pawn Lelouch at some point i want your thoughts on this thought in particular

Well for starters I laugh at the idea that the posts were unreadably long and designed to skim when they barely break 2 paragraphs total for the longest ones.

Now the question here is if they actually fall under informative or not. And I know you're going to call me a fence sitter again but I'm conflicted for that aspect.

He has some genuinely good insights in some of the posts, but oftentimes he is posting one to two word answers on if he agree with a post or not without ever explaining why he thinks this. So leaves the thought process blank and let's people just think up a reason and let's our imagination do the work for him as to why he feels this way.

Some of this could absolutely be the clear laziness he felt in some of the later ones showing up, but it's honestly semi-consistent as I am reading through them all.

I town lean read him regardless of this analysis, but in regards to LLD's assertion I think one is flat out wrong and the other one is very much one that depends on perspective. Since it feels like very little to me but I am also a heavy wall poster when I am doing proper analysis so I have a self admitted bias on this front.

While the flat out wrong section is a small ding against LLD imo.

A bit of clarification:

1. The one or two word answers (usually "Okay" or "This exists" or some variant thereof) means I don't find anything of substance in the interaction one way or another, but that I found the interaction noteworthy enough that I should keep it for context and perhaps someone else might spot something.

2. There is no "laziness (I) felt in some of the later ones showing up." I did not do these in alphabetical order.

[iaafr]

i mean i know at least one of you is getting it wrong on purpose but come the fuck on

btw

[Pawn Lelouch]

new theory: all the syndicate regulars are scum and everybody else is town

this is now my readslist and i will be voting according to it

Weren't you also vibing with Epi and solidly TRing Mac?

Otherwise I don't really mind that as a POE honestly.

[iaafr]

new theory: all the syndicate regulars are scum and everybody else is town

this is now my readslist and i will be voting according to it

Weren't you also vibing with Epi and solidly TRing Mac?

Otherwise I don't really mind that as a POE honestly.

the thing

about when i post things

is that i start arguing with myself in my head

and i started arguing with myself in my head that maybe llds right on epi

and then idk all the offtopic posting and the weird attitude towards the game by all of the syndicate members in a way

its a huge conspiracy

[Epignosis]

Pawn the posts were fucking giant and in sequence of each other, it was a fucking slog to read in which I felt my eyes glazing over multiple times

any assertion that this is not the truth, and that it's not intentionally done given the way the quotes were setup feels a bit disingenuous, at best.

there are so many town players who create annoying walls who dont seem self aware of how annoying their walls are to read

epi's quotewalls were like

in the 20th percentile of unreadableness at worst

if it was intentional he couldve made them a lot worse while still having plausible deniability

[Epignosis]

Epi is a writer and English teacher. He cares about words a lot.

I care about killing as many words as I can.

[iaafr]

i have blown this whole game wide open it is beyond bastard it wasnt even randed

all the syndicate regulars are scum

[Pawn Lelouch]

i have blown this whole game wide open it is beyond bastard it wasnt even randed

all the syndicate regulars are scum

Hm, what was the ratio of syndicate regular starters to invited players? Since we should probably assume boo is technically town since he took over Spiny's slot.

Since full disclosure that would actually be a hilarious welcome game idea.

[Epignosis]

Welp, [VOTE: Dragomir] aubergine then. Not sold on a 112 lynch.

Beyond the reason supplied here, I have no idea why Radishes voted Dragomir.

There were 30 players in the game and my time is limited. I paid little attention to drago but I liked who was on his wagon more than who was on 112's. I had wanted a TSP lynch but my fellow TSP voters switched off to Drago.

Also, meta. 112's town game is full of inconsistencies and unexamined read switches. I think their round was poor, and am very willing to entertain them as scum, but I read it as a lack of effort as opposed to a nefarious agenda. Either way, I'd love to see more from them today.

Fair enough.

[iaafr]

they probably make a game of who can look townier to us

maybe they even have sub wincons

or it's multiball

[Epignosis]

One other question, what are we thinking set-up wise in terms of team numbers? I’ve seen references to 8 scum but do we think 1 team? Indies, etc. ?

I guessed 8 because 30/4 = 7.5 and you round up for large games, but that's probably not a unified team. Right now I would be betting ~6 team scum with ~2 independents, given that there were six team members in the movie plus Mal as a 3rd party plus maybe the target as another 3rd party. There could be surprises in there: I for one can't wait for someone to suddenly get hit with a train from out of nowhere

A unified 8 feels like an awful lot for the Syndicate but it’s been a while since I was in a big game so maybe I am misremembering.

The first game I hosted had two mafia teams of six and two independents.

[Pawn Lelouch]

they probably make a game of who can look townier to us

maybe they even have sub wincons

or it's multiball

Just with general theming I'd probs say multiball.

[JaggedJimmyJay]

The deadline for voting in this phase is 6:00 PM EST today (Friday), in just over 17.5 hours.

Votes will be accepted at 6:00 but not 6:01. The following timer is official: Click. I will add this to the first post of the thread.

[iaafr]

they probably make a game of who can look townier to us

maybe they even have sub wincons

or it's multiball

Just with general theming I'd probs say multiball.

I think that's why quin quoted my post about him being unaligned with tsp being interesting

there's two syndicate scum factions and they've been pushing each other all game

Mac is on dragos team I think

Mac is unaligned with Juliets and tsp

etc

[Pawn Lelouch]

they probably make a game of who can look townier to us

maybe they even have sub wincons

or it's multiball

Just with general theming I'd probs say multiball.

I think that's why quin quoted my post about him being unaligned with tsp being interesting

there's two syndicate scum factions and they've been pushing each other all game

Mac is on dragos team I think

Mac is unaligned with Juliets and tsp

etc

That could fit with some of the placements as well in terms of groupings. Nova, Mac, Epi, etc vs the others. Since remember Nova's really horrible vote, how Epi never self presed onto Drago at any point during Eod, etc.

Definitely is interesting how some of them seem divided up based around EOD behavior + vote.

[Epignosis]

Epignosis - posting quantity without quality in regards to ISOs and a D1 list I seem to recall. Was on my wagon, which could be NAI in a lot of ways but also doesn't serve as a good look for him.

Quantity without quality? I made one post for each person. If there were six people I would have made six. On what basis are you criticizing the quality?

[NANOOKTHEGREATANDFEARSOME]

{Epignosis, Nova, Radishes}

Take Radishes out, put in IIAF

Don't know about Nova, but also one of You/Pawn/Nanook is scum IMO, so....

You know I’m town, or should.

Also I’m mad I can’t collect on our bet with the restriction rules.

[Epignosis]

Lady LambdaDelta - don't remember anything from her. sorry. this is my bad.

And I don't buy this.

[112]

{Epignosis, Nova, Radishes}

Take Radishes out, put in IIAF

Don't know about Nova, but also one of You/Pawn/Nanook is scum IMO, so....

scummy post

[mention]Master Radishes[/mention] - would i still be having a bad game if it turns out a bunch more of my reads than the drago one have been right?

sorry i'm not sorry my work, boss- i know that probably peeves you - but i do have reasons for suspecting who i do and leaning town on the players i do.

[112]

Lady LambdaDelta - don't remember anything from her. sorry. this is my bad.

And I don't buy this.

lol ok

[Pawn Lelouch]

{Epignosis, Nova, Radishes}

Take Radishes out, put in IIAF

Don't know about Nova, but also one of You/Pawn/Nanook is scum IMO, so....

You know I’m town, or should.

Also I’m mad I can’t collect on our bet with the restriction rules.

And I am clearly the towniest town who has ever towned. Not a muddy as hell ball of null at all, I swearsies. :v

[112]

Epignosis - posting quantity without quality in regards to ISOs and a D1 list I seem to recall. Was on my wagon, which could be NAI in a lot of ways but also doesn't serve as a good look for him.

Quantity without quality? I made one post for each person. If there were six people I would have made six. On what basis are you criticizing the quality?

is the only thing you disagreed with in that post concerning you?

[Epignosis]

What do you think of 112, Dom and LLD?

112: tough to get a read on because there is so much that I clearly missed for there to be a huge wagon. One thing in their favor though is that if they were scum I would expect scum to sacrifice them rather than the Godfather, right? Based on content in this thread so far I am null.

Dom: felt like the civ Dom I have seen before, with more GIFs. I understood where he was coming from eventually. Tentative thumbs up

LLD: not enough content, just a lot of GIFs and complaining. Lean more wolf than not because a wolf would prob be more predisposed toward complaining if their Godfather got lynched but that’s pretty much all I got

I don't think mafia were coordinated at all Day 1. Dragomir himself was absent and had a vote on MacDougall.

[112]

{Epignosis, Nova, Radishes}

Take Radishes out, put in IIAF

Don't know about Nova, but also one of You/Pawn/Nanook is scum IMO, so....

You know I’m town, or should.

Also I’m mad I can’t collect on our bet with the restriction rules.

And I am clearly the towniest town who has ever towned. Not a muddy as hell ball of null at all, I swearsies. :v

can i see some credentials? id card?

[Epignosis]

Epignosis - posting quantity without quality in regards to ISOs and a D1 list I seem to recall. Was on my wagon, which could be NAI in a lot of ways but also doesn't serve as a good look for him.

Quantity without quality? I made one post for each person. If there were six people I would have made six. On what basis are you criticizing the quality?

is the only thing you disagreed with in that post concerning you?

Yes. With what else is there to disagree?

[iaafr]

112 are you not buying me theory

[112]

{Epignosis, Nova, Radishes}

Take Radishes out, put in IIAF

Don't know about Nova, but also one of You/Pawn/Nanook is scum IMO, so....

scummy post

@Master Radishes - would i still be having a bad game if it turns out a bunch more of my reads than the drago one have been right?

sorry i'm not showing my work, boss- i know that probably peeves you - but i do have reasons for suspecting who i do and leaning town on the players i do.

fix'd

[Pawn Lelouch]

{Epignosis, Nova, Radishes}

Take Radishes out, put in IIAF

Don't know about Nova, but also one of You/Pawn/Nanook is scum IMO, so....

You know I’m town, or should.

Also I’m mad I can’t collect on our bet with the restriction rules.

And I am clearly the towniest town who has ever towned. Not a muddy as hell ball of null at all, I swearsies. :v

can i see some credentials? id card?

Look at my avie. Can you really look at that face and say untrustworthy?

[Epignosis]

note epi and Jack both have had notscummyatallreads on nutella the whole game

maybe lld had a point and I was just blinded by her exaggeration

epis activity pattern here possibly also nagl?

I don't know what this means.

[112]

112 are you not buying me theory

that we're all town?

[iaafr]

112 are you not buying me theory

that we're all town?

and all the syndicate regulars are scum in 2 factions

[112]

112 are you not buying me theory

that we're all town?

oh, syndicate regs = wolves

seems too bastard, but i'll see if it fits.

[112]

actually makes a lot of sense even just skimming back a couple of pages

[Epignosis]

What do you think of 112, Dom and LLD?

112: tough to get a read on because there is so much that I clearly missed for there to be a huge wagon. One thing in their favor though is that if they were scum I would expect scum to sacrifice them rather than the Godfather, right? Based on content in this thread so far I am null.

Dom: felt like the civ Dom I have seen before, with more GIFs. I understood where he was coming from eventually. Tentative thumbs up

LLD: not enough content, just a lot of GIFs and complaining. Lean more wolf than not because a wolf would prob be more predisposed toward complaining if their Godfather got lynched but that’s pretty much all I got

the thing that looks bad on me in regards to the first blurb is that i was absent for eod and left my vote on someone whose flip we don't know.

explanation that i haven't given so far- it's honestly what happened, lol:
i just wasn't in the mood to be on so left for a while and did my own things. the game got into my head and i checked right before eod and saw that i wasn't leading in votes and thought it would be best not to change anything because it'd be a bad look. i understand that might be considered a wolfy mindset, but i figure that even though i'm town, i need to take care of how i look in the thread, and i felt it would've sunk me if i intervened in anything after just ducking out. so that's my confession.

Why were you so concerned with what you looked like?

To me, you being absent when you (by your own admission) could have been in the thread raising hell because lynching you would be dumb does not improve my opinion of you.

[iaafr]

ikr

[NANOOKTHEGREATANDFEARSOME]

{Epignosis, Nova, Radishes}

Take Radishes out, put in IIAF

Don't know about Nova, but also one of You/Pawn/Nanook is scum IMO, so....

You know I’m town, or should.

Also I’m mad I can’t collect on our bet with the restriction rules.

And I am clearly the towniest town who has ever towned. Not a muddy as hell ball of null at all, I swearsies. :v

I don’t push drago the way I did if he was my teammate.

[NANOOKTHEGREATANDFEARSOME]

Lexi knows this.

[Epignosis]

... if 112 is town, then Epi could still be a scum wagon.

... and he hasn't checked back into the thread since he dumped all his night stuff on us.

... and he said he wouldn't...

I'm going to bed. I will not be available until evening tomorrow.

Please someone copy my stuff. Let others see it if I don't wake up.

... is this

literally

my qualifier scumgame

post giant walls, don't reply to criticism, let everyone assume no scum would ever do that much work?

the appeal to "please save my work" smells deeply of LAMIST to me

"look at all this I've done, don't let it be lost"

did I get pocketed?

Pawn Lelouch give me a second pair of eyes here I'm having a crisis of confidence

I don't know what this means.

[Pawn Lelouch]

{Epignosis, Nova, Radishes}

Take Radishes out, put in IIAF

Don't know about Nova, but also one of You/Pawn/Nanook is scum IMO, so....

You know I’m town, or should.

Also I’m mad I can’t collect on our bet with the restriction rules.

And I am clearly the towniest town who has ever towned. Not a muddy as hell ball of null at all, I swearsies. :v

I don’t push drago the way I did if he was my teammate.

Oh I agree. There's a reason I'm going along with iaafr's theory today. It fits my POE extremely well, with you nowhere in it.

I just wanted to be cheeky.

[112]

What do you think of 112, Dom and LLD?

112: tough to get a read on because there is so much that I clearly missed for there to be a huge wagon. One thing in their favor though is that if they were scum I would expect scum to sacrifice them rather than the Godfather, right? Based on content in this thread so far I am null.

Dom: felt like the civ Dom I have seen before, with more GIFs. I understood where he was coming from eventually. Tentative thumbs up

LLD: not enough content, just a lot of GIFs and complaining. Lean more wolf than not because a wolf would prob be more predisposed toward complaining if their Godfather got lynched but that’s pretty much all I got

the thing that looks bad on me in regards to the first blurb is that i was absent for eod and left my vote on someone whose flip we don't know.

explanation that i haven't given so far- it's honestly what happened, lol:
i just wasn't in the mood to be on so left for a while and did my own things. the game got into my head and i checked right before eod and saw that i wasn't leading in votes and thought it would be best not to change anything because it'd be a bad look. i understand that might be considered a wolfy mindset, but i figure that even though i'm town, i need to take care of how i look in the thread, and i felt it would've sunk me if i intervened in anything after just ducking out. so that's my confession.

Why were you so concerned with what you looked like?

To me, you being absent when you (by your own admission) could have been in the thread raising hell because lynching you would be dumb does not improve my opinion of you.

that's ok. i don't really need your opinion of me.

[Pawn Lelouch]

... if 112 is town, then Epi could still be a scum wagon.

... and he hasn't checked back into the thread since he dumped all his night stuff on us.

... and he said he wouldn't...

I'm going to bed. I will not be available until evening tomorrow.

Please someone copy my stuff. Let others see it if I don't wake up.

... is this

literally

my qualifier scumgame

post giant walls, don't reply to criticism, let everyone assume no scum would ever do that much work?

the appeal to "please save my work" smells deeply of LAMIST to me

"look at all this I've done, don't let it be lost"

did I get pocketed?

Pawn Lelouch give me a second pair of eyes here I'm having a crisis of confidence

I don't know what this means.

Oh I forgot about answering this post. @Evenstar it should be fine, while his vote associatives associatives aren't perfect, generally he's honestly been fairly clean, especially during D1 and this is the type of game where work taking up time should be assumed try as a courtesy. While he could be scum, odds are that he's just town rather than a pocketing scum.

Though depending on if iaafr is right he might have to go eventually. :v

[Epignosis]

i understand ethics is not a science, but does it spark an idea in anyone if i call it the applied science of the Will?

It sparks disagreement or I’ve just been whooshed.

i don't mean ethics=applied science(Will) in the literal sense that it can be reduced to the application of empirically-verified scientific principles of the Will. The Will, by all definitions I know of it, is supposedly outside of the normal laws of cause and effect, and there thereby can't be any science of it in the traditional sense. To say it's an applied science with a literal implication would be nonsense.

I guess I just went through a lot of my life understanding ethics to be in the very theoretical realm; but I've recently been understanding it more as something that must be applied in some way to make any sense of itself. If there is a purpose in studying ethics, it follows that there must be sense in applying it; and there's no other means to apply it than through the application of the Will, no?

iaafr, help me out here.

You post all this, but evade my question with one of your own (that doesn't go anywhere):

Epignosis - posting quantity without quality in regards to ISOs and a D1 list I seem to recall. Was on my wagon, which could be NAI in a lot of ways but also doesn't serve as a good look for him.

Quantity without quality? I made one post for each person. If there were six people I would have made six. On what basis are you criticizing the quality?

is the only thing you disagreed with in that post concerning you?

Yes. With what else is there to disagree?

[112]

i understand ethics is not a science, but does it spark an idea in anyone if i call it the applied science of the Will?

It sparks disagreement or I’ve just been whooshed.

i don't mean ethics=applied science(Will) in the literal sense that it can be reduced to the application of empirically-verified scientific principles of the Will. The Will, by all definitions I know of it, is supposedly outside of the normal laws of cause and effect, and there thereby can't be any science of it in the traditional sense. To say it's an applied science with a literal implication would be nonsense.

I guess I just went through a lot of my life understanding ethics to be in the very theoretical realm; but I've recently been understanding it more as something that must be applied in some way to make any sense of itself. If there is a purpose in studying ethics, it follows that there must be sense in applying it; and there's no other means to apply it than through the application of the Will, no?

iaafr, help me out here.

You post all this, but evade my question with one of your own (that doesn't go anywhere):

Epignosis - posting quantity without quality in regards to ISOs and a D1 list I seem to recall. Was on my wagon, which could be NAI in a lot of ways but also doesn't serve as a good look for him.

Quantity without quality? I made one post for each person. If there were six people I would have made six. On what basis are you criticizing the quality?

is the only thing you disagreed with in that post concerning you?

Yes. With what else is there to disagree?

and what does that mean?

[Epignosis]

What do you think of 112, Dom and LLD?

112: tough to get a read on because there is so much that I clearly missed for there to be a huge wagon. One thing in their favor though is that if they were scum I would expect scum to sacrifice them rather than the Godfather, right? Based on content in this thread so far I am null.

Dom: felt like the civ Dom I have seen before, with more GIFs. I understood where he was coming from eventually. Tentative thumbs up

LLD: not enough content, just a lot of GIFs and complaining. Lean more wolf than not because a wolf would prob be more predisposed toward complaining if their Godfather got lynched but that’s pretty much all I got

the thing that looks bad on me in regards to the first blurb is that i was absent for eod and left my vote on someone whose flip we don't know.

explanation that i haven't given so far- it's honestly what happened, lol:
i just wasn't in the mood to be on so left for a while and did my own things. the game got into my head and i checked right before eod and saw that i wasn't leading in votes and thought it would be best not to change anything because it'd be a bad look. i understand that might be considered a wolfy mindset, but i figure that even though i'm town, i need to take care of how i look in the thread, and i felt it would've sunk me if i intervened in anything after just ducking out. so that's my confession.

Why were you so concerned with what you looked like?

To me, you being absent when you (by your own admission) could have been in the thread raising hell because lynching you would be dumb does not improve my opinion of you.

that's ok. i don't really need your opinion of me.

You're right. You don't. Maybe a rope is what you really need.

[Epignosis]

i understand ethics is not a science, but does it spark an idea in anyone if i call it the applied science of the Will?

It sparks disagreement or I’ve just been whooshed.

i don't mean ethics=applied science(Will) in the literal sense that it can be reduced to the application of empirically-verified scientific principles of the Will. The Will, by all definitions I know of it, is supposedly outside of the normal laws of cause and effect, and there thereby can't be any science of it in the traditional sense. To say it's an applied science with a literal implication would be nonsense.

I guess I just went through a lot of my life understanding ethics to be in the very theoretical realm; but I've recently been understanding it more as something that must be applied in some way to make any sense of itself. If there is a purpose in studying ethics, it follows that there must be sense in applying it; and there's no other means to apply it than through the application of the Will, no?

iaafr, help me out here.

You post all this, but evade my question with one of your own (that doesn't go anywhere):

Epignosis - posting quantity without quality in regards to ISOs and a D1 list I seem to recall. Was on my wagon, which could be NAI in a lot of ways but also doesn't serve as a good look for him.

Quantity without quality? I made one post for each person. If there were six people I would have made six. On what basis are you criticizing the quality?

is the only thing you disagreed with in that post concerning you?

Yes. With what else is there to disagree?

and what does that mean?

You said my posts were "quantity without quality."

In what way did my posts lack quality?

[Epignosis]

You evaded my question with "is the only thing you disagreed with in that post concerning you? "