Assassin's Creed Mafia (OVER!)

[TonyStarkPrime]

LC when do you find out the power of the person you target

End of the day, after the lynch. I had up until the lynch to choose.

Hmm okay

[TonyStarkPrime]

LC we can just break while Sloonei Slooneis

[Long Con]

Ok, then I'll be back in a bit.

[Sloonei]

LC we can just break while Sloonei Slooneis

The game is basically in my hands. I'll let you guys know if I need anything.

[Sloonei]

Actually, quick question: do either of you guys have any upcoming Magic tournaments?

[Long Con]

I've just been playing Paper magic with a webcam set up with my friend, I don't have a membership for magic online or anyting.

[Long Con]

Anyway, I'm out in the workshop now, but I want to ask you guys if either of you are assassins?

[NANOOKTHEGREATANDFEARSOME]

In response to a private question: for the purposes of this game an Assassin is only considered to be a “historical” Assassins-affiliated character, not a present day character—e.g., Layla is not counted as an Assassin for the purposes of this game.

[TonyStarkPrime]

In response to a private question: for the purposes of this game an Assassin is only considered to be a “historical” Assassins-affiliated character, not a present day character—e.g., Layla is not counted as an Assassin for the purposes of this game.

So that ones solved

[TonyStarkPrime]

I've just been playing Paper magic with a webcam set up with my friend, I don't have a membership for magic online or anyting.

I’ve been thinking about getting MTGO but I usually use a Mac and I don’t want to go through the hassle of getting fake windows set up

[TonyStarkPrime]

I was prepping for MF Detroit seriously one the days before this all broke out. Got cancelled like 24 hours in advance.

[TonyStarkPrime]

*in

[Long Con]

So... we all like Magic? Maybe we're more alike than we thought. Maybe... we don't HAVE to lynch anyone!

[TonyStarkPrime]

So... we all like Magic? Maybe we're more alike than we thought. Maybe... we don't HAVE to lynch anyone!

scum

[Long Con]

So... we all like Magic? Maybe we're more alike than we thought. Maybe... we don't HAVE to lynch anyone!

scum

Takes a real scum to admit it like that.

[Long Con]

Here's the thing: Tony or Sloonei are Mafia, and it's Tony because I don't believe in a world where a Civilian's ability is to find and kill another Civilian. He tried to get me to unwittingly out myself for the easy kill by lying to the thread about his role. Tony's story is that he's a Civilian killer who gets to free-kill one of the four Mafia members.

Sloonei has to decide which is more likely, and more realistic. I'm biased by the fact that I know which version is right, but I'm trying to step back and look at it from Sloonei's perspective, and the way that it is is the way that just makes more sense. This is a Mafia ability nine times out of ten, and this game is no exception.

When I'm on a Mafia team, it matters to me a great deal to do right by them. I take it seriously, because the other team members are relying on me to do my part. Earlier in the game, I got pissed off that anything I did to try and scum hunt was only resulting in more suspicion on me, so I said "Fuck this" and self-voted myself into lynch contention. There's no way in hell that I would do that to my Mafia teammates, especially when Epignosis is on the team, with a 100% win record in 2020. I may be a selfish asshole and a big baby sometimes, but I would never and could never screw over my friends and teammates like that.

Maybe this is all WIFOM, sure, that's always a possibility in any game, but it's just not.

I'm voting for Tony now, Tony, you might as well vote for me. Let's let Sloonei hammer when he decides to end the game, that's how it is, no need to be coy about votes. [VOTE: TonyStarkPrime] aubergine

[Sloonei]

I still haven’t gone back to read earlier things, but I’ll reiterate that speedchuck’s role is a bad look for Tony.

[Sloonei]

Also, to ease the mind of whichever of you is town: if I was mafia I’d just hammer either one of you right now and the game would be over. Your vote is where it should be.

[TonyStarkPrime]

I don’t have as much to say as a final statement. The argument that LC wouldn’t self-vote if he were scum is strong, but it’s the only thing his town argument is hinging on. If you remove that, it’s an open and shut case. With the town vote, there are so many possibilities for LC to be lying about his role or for scum to just have the blanket “you decide ties” ability or it was just a failed gambit that he’s trying to turn around.

I’ll remind Sloonei that the roles were randomized onto teams, and thus the “scuminess” of my role has no bearing on if I am scum or not. And yeah, I misunderstood my role and made a big show of it. That’s not optimal play as town or scum, but if I’m scum I would have had teammates to interpret my role a little differently and I would have cared more — played a little more precisely. There’s no reasonable way to believe that I’m so flamboyant with my role if I’m scum without succeeding in my task.

LC is trying to condense this into two individual oopsiedoodles with the argument that he wouldn’t do his if he were scum while I argue I wouldn’t do mine if I were not scum. But if you look at the whole scope of the game outside of these incidents, one of us is clearly working for the benefit of the town and one of us is not. I trust you’ll find that in your review.

Vote: LC

[TonyStarkPrime]

I still haven’t gone back to read earlier things, but I’ll reiterate that speedchuck’s role is a bad look for Tony.

FG had already claimed an assassin character before I seriously started asking for characters.

[Sloonei]

I'll try to set some time aside to ISO the dead bad guyz tonight and give you guys each some time to respond to whatever I have to say. But I don't intend to drag this thing out forever. I'm just busy with Real Life Responsibilities today.

[Long Con]

I don’t have as much to say as a final statement. The argument that LC wouldn’t self-vote if he were scum is strong, but it’s the only thing his town argument is hinging on. If you remove that, it’s an open and shut case. With the town vote, there are so many possibilities for LC to be lying about his role or for scum to just have the blanket “you decide ties” ability or it was just a failed gambit that he’s trying to turn around.

I’ll remind Sloonei that the roles were randomized onto teams, and thus the “scuminess” of my role has no bearing on if I am scum or not. And yeah, I misunderstood my role and made a big show of it. That’s not optimal play as town or scum, but if I’m scum I would have had teammates to interpret my role a little differently and I would have cared more — played a little more precisely. There’s no reasonable way to believe that I’m so flamboyant with my role if I’m scum without succeeding in my task.

LC is trying to condense this into two individual oopsiedoodles with the argument that he wouldn’t do his if he were scum while I argue I wouldn’t do mine if I were not scum. But if you look at the whole scope of the game outside of these incidents, one of us is clearly working for the benefit of the town and one of us is not. I trust you’ll find that in your review.

Vote: LC

I didn't say anything about oopsiedoodles, this is slander.

[Sloonei]

I'm gonna start by being super annoying. I'm just compiling this post for my own reference. No one needs to bother looking at this, it only exists so that I have it easily on hand as I go through everything else later. I'm looking at how the three dead scum all treated one another to give myself a sense of what their strategies would have been. I've already done some of this work, but I want to look again with fresh eyes. I'm a big butt and I cannot lie.


Epi -> Turnip Head

Spoiler: show

Sloonei is town. There was absolutely nothing wrong with him talking mechanically. It's not pro anything and doesn't deter the game at all. An argument could be made that it is beneficial towards the game and lets you understand what could be going on. That newfound understanding can better your reads.

Why was Sloonei being voted for mechanical talk? Ts why are you gungho about it? I can't help but agree with Sloonei that suspecting someone over mechanical is suspicious in of itself. It's lazy and never actually feels like a genuine read. Furthermore, scum use this too much to get by with their fake suspicions. Thus why it feels lazy and not genuine.

I don’t like this post from Drago. Ironically it’s seems like something I’d post but that’s irrelevant.

Tell me more

The defense hinges on what amounts to a non-existent part of the case. It seems like Drago is more focused on earning town cred

From what I've seen, Dragomir is a civilian. I don't care that he is trying to earn "town cred." Civilians SHOULD be doing that. Noble enterprise.

The Epi I thought I knew says things like "civilians shouldn't be trying to earn cred, they should be trying to find bad guys". Has your philosophy evolved?

Multiball.

sloonei and ts being w/w is my new favorite conspiracy theory

Sloonei wouldn't be comfortable with that. He'd try if you asked, but he's not. This is not bad Sloonei and bad TS.

LC playing scummy on purpose is not his civ MO

Disagree.

The hell is Epignosis? I thought he was made of free time right now

Number one, why do you care about little me so much?

Number two, I'm in two games. Day 1 just ended earlier in the other one

I think Sloonei is good anyway.

GTH on Funnygurl? Turnip? Mac? Me?

I can do this. I have good opinions on all of you.

LC playing scummy on purpose is not his civ MO

Disagree.

Care to elaborate? I'm actually pretty good at reading him, probably the best at it, if I'm being honest

If you're the best at reading Long Con I'll leave you to it. You don't need any explanation from me.

Epi is bringing an unnecessarily hostile tone to an otherwise reasonable thread, idk what that means really just an observation

[citation needed]

LC playing scummy on purpose is not his civ MO

This is just blatantly not true. It's something I have done many times in the past, mostly due to the "you-die-you-don't-win" rule we used to go by around here... when you have to survive to win, you learn to not look TOO Civvish. I still hold the lessons dear to my heart, because dying sucks either way, and if you want to survive the night, the baddies have to believe you can be lynched.

This is true.

[VOTE: Long Con] aubergine

There is no reason you should have to explain this to Turnip Head. TH was around during that time.

I think funnygurl has too much town cred compared to her contributions. I can tone-read her as town but I wouldn't bet the farm on it. Her defense of tedextr doesn't come across as completely genuine to me, either

So what are you going to do about it?

This kind of defeatism always ends in a civilian lynch

[VOTE: turnip head] aubergine for letting defeated civilian Long Con teeter on the edge while sitting on a lame ted wagon.

I did the same thing. Why TH over me?

Feels like LC knew he would survive, or else why do that? The lynch was almost over

If I know I'm going to survive, I'm still not advertising it.

I'm not Jack.

I hate to be the person to bring it up, but it is interesting Turnip Head is looking for a team of three. I thought with 15 players it would be more likely that we are looking at a team of four.

I'm not looking for a team of three I think I found a team of three

I am trying to see how you can come up with this scum team but I do not see it. As the person most familiar with funnygurl in this game, why would I warn everyone of her incredibly dynamic wolf game? I could simply say her wolf game is obvious and that she slanks hard as a wolf- the fact that she is here at all guarantees she is town, and then rely on my own aggressive personality to shut down dissent. That does not work. Furthermore, ted posted a massive wall town casing me seemingly with the intent to make sloonei shut up. I do not believe that is partnery behavior either, as it requires a lot of effort and insight on ted's behalf, more than is required to defend a partner. I think they are just town.

I don't understand why people think effort is automatically indicative of civility.

"More than is required to defend a partner."

How much effort is required? I didn't know there were regulations in place about these things.

Are they in that imaginary book?

speed's only notable contribution d1 was a turnip head read

when he comes back and tries to throw reads, he didn't note turnip head

bad.

I have no idea what this means.

Then don't read them, that's what I did

That's what you didn't do.

I wrote things. Big things. Nobody is talking about those big things. Why is nobody talking about those big things.

link?

http://www.mafiathesyndicate.com/viewto ... 79#p598879

http://www.mafiathesyndicate.com/viewto ... 86#p598886

Turnip Head was not expecting to die, so:

I chose Radishes over Speed

TH thought it was safe to claim responsibility for breaking ties. That's something to think about.

Aveline

Whip: Can disarm one player a night.

You're a Heathenous Spy

Unless "disarm" has an unusual meaning here.

Epi hardly cares about Turnip Head here. There's a few blunt jabs and prods but absolutely none of it has legs. He pretended to grill TH, and vice versa, a couple times, but never for more than a couple of posts at a time. There is no indication that Epi would have ever considered a vote or serious suspicion against Turnip Head. Interactions were minimized.

Turnip Head -> Epignosis

Spoiler: show

The hell is Epignosis? I thought he was made of free time right now

Unlike yours truly who is still working two jobs six days a week

Sloonei is town. There was absolutely nothing wrong with him talking mechanically. It's not pro anything and doesn't deter the game at all. An argument could be made that it is beneficial towards the game and lets you understand what could be going on. That newfound understanding can better your reads.

Why was Sloonei being voted for mechanical talk? Ts why are you gungho about it? I can't help but agree with Sloonei that suspecting someone over mechanical is suspicious in of itself. It's lazy and never actually feels like a genuine read. Furthermore, scum use this too much to get by with their fake suspicions. Thus why it feels lazy and not genuine.

I don’t like this post from Drago. Ironically it’s seems like something I’d post but that’s irrelevant.

Tell me more

The defense hinges on what amounts to a non-existent part of the case. It seems like Drago is more focused on earning town cred

From what I've seen, Dragomir is a civilian. I don't care that he is trying to earn "town cred." Civilians SHOULD be doing that. Noble enterprise.

The Epi I thought I knew says things like "civilians shouldn't be trying to earn cred, they should be trying to find bad guys". Has your philosophy evolved?

Epi is bringing an unnecessarily hostile tone to an otherwise reasonable thread, idk what that means really just an observation

I think funnygurl has too much town cred compared to her contributions. I can tone-read her as town but I wouldn't bet the farm on it. Her defense of tedextr doesn't come across as completely genuine to me, either

So what are you going to do about it?

Well ideally we lynch ted first

Probably Epi. He usually does a better job of pushing his thoughts and stating his cases even when no one agrees with him

ooh. what do you think about lc now turnip?

LC playing scummy on purpose is not his civ MO

Disagree.

Care to elaborate? I'm actually pretty good at reading him, probably the best at it, if I'm being honest

It's still not how he usually plays as a civvie. I have no clue what he's doing right now, but it's very out of character.

I wrote things. Big things. Nobody is talking about those big things. Why is nobody talking about those big things.

link?

That was an awful lot of waffling from master radishes re: leetic for someone who never ended up actually changing his vote

Turnip Head was a little more outwardly critical of Epi, even going so far as to suggest the possibility of a vote at one point. But ultimately there are no legs here either. When Epi provided an excuse to vote for Radishes at the end of Day 2, Turnip obliged and abandoned the pretense of Epi suspicion.


Epignosis -> speedchuck

Spoiler: show

Sometimes you have to vote without giving a reason. You've got to tickle their balls a little.

LC especially needs ball tickling. His first couple of posts looked fun, but after he voted for Sloonei and got questioned for it his energy just died. Ever since then each post has been ineffectual defense without any of that town spark.

Sign of a happy marriage.

I'm not voting Sloonei and I'm not voting leetic.

Do better.

What about Long Con, the other person with at least two votes?

Is there a reason I should vote for LC?

I don't believe so, his behavior reads more unmotivated than scummy

Why the fuck do you have four votes?

Beats me.

What's your issue with speedchuck?

He hasn't done much of note and what he has done (jokey posts, slight ts shade when the thread climate was against the former, going after LC (an easy target) is easy for scum to do.

That doesn't concern me. speedchuck has a new baby and new work from home shit. I'm not concerned.

Right now the way you are behaving gives me the sense you want to be in control for the EOD, and all I can say is that does not make me feel so good about you. I do not think I would hang you today, however.

What's wrong with wanting that? Civilians should want that.

Townies usually have preferred outcomes and push toward those, whereas Dragomir's tone is the inverse and seems to be guiding people away from their unfavorable outcomes. It is something either alignment could do, but here I am leaning it wolf.

In other words Dragomir doesn't care about the roof.

This is the best terminology to come out of a mafia game ever.

What is?

speed's only notable contribution d1 was a turnip head read

when he comes back and tries to throw reads, he didn't note turnip head

bad.

I have no idea what this means.

he's also tryna position himself to vote me which is also... kinda... bad...

speed's name's been thrown around as a suspicion all game though. i'm not married to the idea, but i'm coming around to him being a hit

Who is he who is "also tryna?" Why is...it...kinda...bad... and not fucking awful?

Here's a fun one: A readlist based only on people's current votes:

Good votes - MacDougall, Sloonei, Funnygurl, ts account, Epignosis
Not Good Votes - Turnip Head, Master Radishes, Long Con, TSP, Ted

What makes my vote a good one?

Here's a fun one: A readlist based only on people's current votes:

Good votes - MacDougall, Sloonei, Funnygurl, ts account, Epignosis
Not Good Votes - Turnip Head, Master Radishes, Long Con, TSP, Ted

That's...completely subjective and therefore useless.

The spread is 2/2/2/2/1/1/1. How did you decide whose vote was good and whose was bad?

The target of the vote.

And yes it's subjective, it's a readlist.

I'm not sure how anyone could sincerely vote for funnygurl after her play the latter half of today. And voting for tedxstr is just wrong.

I'm voting ted. You said my vote was a good vote. What?

I should finish reading everything before I post.

I got some names mixed up from multitasking while sleep-deprived. Your vote is bad.

What about now?

Turnip Head was not expecting to die, so:

I chose Radishes over Speed

TH thought it was safe to claim responsibility for breaking ties. That's something to think about.

Aveline

Whip: Can disarm one player a night.

You're a Heathenous Spy

Unless "disarm" has an unusual meaning here.

Long Con actually voted himself the other Day phase. Any words for him?

This is lylo though

And?

Epi's practically lolcatting.

I'm more concerned with his claim. Why fake it? Why even make it in the first place, especially to lie about it and risk it being countered?

lolcatting?

What does that even mean?

obv!scumming.

No. I'm a civilian who is getting fucked because I got a shitty role that doesn't make any sense and nobody believes it.

Ignoring the last couple pages of Epi's ISO because he was exposed at that point. This is not dissimilar to his treatment of TH: he might prod speed now and again, but he shelters him from actual pressure/suspicion. The highlights are when he goes out of his way to ask leetic to explain a Day 1 suspicion only to immediately slap it down, and then when he highlights Turnip's vote for Radishes over speedchuck on Day 2, but emphasizes only that Turnip felt "safe to claim responsibility for breaking ties", making no mention of speedchuck's role in the event itself. Epi made an effort to keep each of these two partners out of the line of fire. He did not ignore them, but contact was kept to a minimum.


speedchuck -> Epi

Spoiler: show

All Role PMs have been sent! It is now D1, which will end at a majority vote or by April 2, 7pm EDT.

For somebody opposed to mechanics discussions, you're quick to point out mechanics to people like me.

This is a horrible post for Epi.

You're the second person to say this and I don't know whether either of you are serious.

Right now the way you are behaving gives me the sense you want to be in control for the EOD, and all I can say is that does not make me feel so good about you. I do not think I would hang you today, however.

What's wrong with wanting that? Civilians should want that.

Townies usually have preferred outcomes and push toward those, whereas Dragomir's tone is the inverse and seems to be guiding people away from their unfavorable outcomes. It is something either alignment could do, but here I am leaning it wolf.

In other words Dragomir doesn't care about the roof.

This is the best terminology to come out of a mafia game ever.

What is?

Caring about the roof as a tell for... caring about the roof.

Here's a fun one: A readlist based only on people's current votes:

Good votes - MacDougall, Sloonei, Funnygurl, ts account, Epignosis
Not Good Votes - Turnip Head, Master Radishes, Long Con, TSP, Ted

I should finish reading everything before I post.

I got some names mixed up from multitasking while sleep-deprived. Your vote is bad.

What about now?

Better.

Long Con actually voted himself the other Day phase. Any words for him?

This is lylo though

Epi's practically lolcatting.

I'm more concerned with his claim. Why fake it? Why even make it in the first place, especially to lie about it and risk it being countered?

Oh, judging by vote count, if Epignosis is town, then Long Con and Sloonei both need to be mafia, otherwise mafia would just hammer and win. So Epignosis is definitely outed wolf.

This argument is hilarious but I kinda agree with it.

What's funny about it?

In essence it boils down to "welp, we haven't lost yet even with throwing votes everywhere. Guess this works."

I've used the reasoning before. Lylo is funny like that.

[VOTE: Epi] aubergine I think we have like an hour left unless I miscounted days

speedchuck said nothing of value about Epi until Day 3, after Epi had punted his life away. speed makes one comment of vague skepticism about Epi's roleclaim which seems to only exist for the sake of sowing paranoia or appearing thoughtful. speedchuck could have ignored Epi's existence entirely through the first two days and this exercise would not look much different.


speedchuck -> Turnip Head

Spoiler: show

Leetic feels cornered

What's the point you're making? He's civilian because he's being pushed into a wall or is he scum because he reacts poorly?

Which one do you think I meant? If you had to guess

I don't get the point of this.

Turnip Head is town.

I'm having trouble seeing your world building. You have quite the townreads, what's the PoE?

Ted is mafia.

I'm completely the reverse on you here sloon

[VOTE: Turnip Head] aubergine

Really cool. Goes nowhere

I'm not really considering it seriously, just entertaining a reality where it exists

This bad.

Leetic feels cornered

What's the point you're making? He's civilian because he's being pushed into a wall or is he scum because he reacts poorly?

Which one do you think I meant? If you had to guess

This bad.

Something is wrong with Long Con. He doesn't usually play with this tight of a grip. Like a rattlesnake getting all coiled up. He often gets suspected early and I'm one of the first to rush to his defense because I recognize his town game but this is off-meta for him and I think he knows it

This bad.

Epi is bringing an unnecessarily hostile tone to an otherwise reasonable thread, idk what that means really just an observation

This bad.

None of these would be bad alone, but there is no good in between them.

Leetic feels cornered

What's the point you're making? He's civilian because he's being pushed into a wall or is he scum because he reacts poorly?

Which one do you think I meant? If you had to guess

I don't get the point of this.

I don't get how speedchuck didn't get the point of this.

There is no point. I see it as an avoidance of providing a direct answer. Evasive. Do you not see it that way?

ok speeds here.

if not th then which person would you also wanna see die? I dont disagree with your th analysis but the wagon coming out of nowhere along with your sudden endorsement of it is sketchy

If not TH...

I'm not entirely against LC dying, but he looks better to me now that he's been at it longer. Dragomir's not a bad option, neither is Epi or TSP. Leetic... I'm not sure why the thread turned on him after he was most towny in the first few pages. I read sloonei's reasons, but I just haven't read closely enough to catch that I guess.

Here's a fun one: A readlist based only on people's current votes:

Good votes - MacDougall, Sloonei, Funnygurl, ts account, Epignosis
Not Good Votes - Turnip Head, Master Radishes, Long Con, TSP, Ted

Turnip Head having 0 votes in this vote spread is curious. If he were town one would think scum would find his button a satisfying resting place.

What's the difference between this and TSP?

you ever gonna change your vote radishes?

Does it bother you?

yeah 'cause even you don't like it and by not placing a real vote you're not contributing to the vc

it's like you're withholding your voice when it matters

And you are creating a narrative that doesn't exist.

Try this one instead: in the middle of a dead thread where you hadn't posted in a long while, I voted you as I felt someone amongst the non-talkers was a scum. You did not make your appearance until much later. In the time since, I've been online twice: once where I focused on the wagon that I woke up to find on me, and now where I am ISOing a few of the other wagon options before re-evaluating my reads.

Why aren't you harassing TS or Epi for their single-wagon votes?

Or Turnip Head

My day 1 hunch is better than a dead wagon. [VOTE: Turnip Head] aubergine

My complaints about their empty posts are still valid, if less sure than before. And I haven't had time to evaluate the case on Radish. Work during a pandemic is awful.

If MR is scum they're scum with TH I think. FG said in one of her longer posts that that was unlikely. Conclusion: not scum?

Qualify this. What would MR be scum with TH?

In sharp contrast to Epi, speedchuck was harshly critical of Turnip Head. speed votes for TH each of the first two days and made a single substantive post laying out the case. However, I note that actual interactions are pretty light here. speedchuck is critical of Turnip Head but, at least from this side of the pairing, they don't actually interact directly all that much.


Turnip Head -> speedchuck

Spoiler: show

Does anyone have an opinion on Mikey they'd like to share? Also Mac's vote for speedchuck feels phoned it but I was townreading him aside from that

I chose Radishes over Speed

Turnip Head could not have had less to say about speedchuck. He literally says nothing about him. The only two times "speed" or "chuck" appear in any of his posts are indirect mentions based on speed's activity adjacent to other names: Macdougall cast a bad vote for speed, and then Turnip voted for Radishes when speed was the altnernative. El zilcho.

---------------------------------------------
Outside of speedchuck -> Turnip Head, this was a tight-lipped bunch. No one had a lot to say about anyone else, and most of the time they only took harmless jabs before sliding their partners into the background. Even speed's "case" on Turnip Head looks pretty subdued: he made a single substantive post and cast a couple votes, but he never sustained any pressure and neither of them made any effort to engage with the other on any level. That lack of engagement is the signature for all three teammates. My immediate reaction is that this all bodes well for Long Con.

Now I can move on to actual ISO work.

[Sloonei]

ok speeds here.

if not th then which person would you also wanna see die? I dont disagree with your th analysis but the wagon coming out of nowhere along with your sudden endorsement of it is sketchy

If not TH...

I'm not entirely against LC dying, but he looks better to me now that he's been at it longer. Dragomir's not a bad option, neither is Epi or TSP. Leetic... I'm not sure why the thread turned on him after he was most towny in the first few pages. I read sloonei's reasons, but I just haven't read closely enough to catch that I guess.

[Sloonei]

TonyStarkPrime has twelve posts and and I count only one opinion that is expressed without hedging language.

I’ve been taking the maybes and perhapses out of my emails today. It’s an overall problem.

:poop emoji:

[Sloonei]

that's not what i wanted to say!

[Sloonei]

Okay it’s not Sloonei, LC, Drago, TS
Probably not Mac, Epi, MR, FG
Could be Leetic, Speed, Ted, TH
rainbow

[Sloonei]

I think we lost our momentum after the weird end to the lynch and then 24 hours of radio silence.

Something I wanted to mention was TonyStarkPrime, none of us have discussed him. He was around at the end of the lynch but most of his contributions were about the hammer. Not much actual gamesolving from TSP yet which is quite different from what I remember in GoC where he was flinging out reads with a high degree of proficiency. He was never the loudest voice in the room in that game, but he did enough for other towns to know he was there and doing his best.

Radish town
Sloonei town
Ted town
Mikey town
Mac town
Turnip borderline
Epi borderline
Whoever I missed probably borderline
Speed scum
FG scum
Nutella scum

[Sloonei]

I think we lost our momentum after the weird end to the lynch and then 24 hours of radio silence.

Something I wanted to mention was TonyStarkPrime, none of us have discussed him. He was around at the end of the lynch but most of his contributions were about the hammer. Not much actual gamesolving from TSP yet which is quite different from what I remember in GoC where he was flinging out reads with a high degree of proficiency. He was never the loudest voice in the room in that game, but he did enough for other towns to know he was there and doing his best.

Actually this post itself is pretty iffy. Turnip Head is conscious of the fact that nothing is being said about Tony and wants to plant a flag in that so that we can't say they totally ignored each other. Tony responds with a comprehensive reads list. Bad.

[Sloonei]

Mr. Stark, why are you town?

role card
and also I like to think I haven't done anything suspicious looking and I've done some prodding and some light analysis

Beep boop™

[Sloonei]

Scum team could be Mikey, funny girl and tedextr as far as I'm concerned

It’s cliche, but rule of three

All three of these people ended up being town.

[Sloonei]

In all I think there was a more tangible effort among the three dead scum to get Long Con lynched than Tony at various points in the game. Each of them received some amount of criticism from all three baddies, but the pressure directed at Tony felt more token (see the exchanges with TH above, as well as Epi's "Tony has twelve posts..." comment).
Long Con, on the other hand, received some actual pressure from Epi and speedchuck (as well as Turnip Head's indifference to an LC lynch on Day 1).

But neither of you guys can really address any points about what other players have said about you. So I'll try to pull out posts of your own that I have trouble with.

[Sloonei]

Turnip Head is town.

Oh.

Mr. LC, you had just got done ISOing the accused Turnip and then dropped a vote on his Head, only for Sloonei to shove this obnoxious town read back in your face. You barely reacted at all. What was this response?

[Sloonei]

[VOTE: radish] aubergine

I've been thinking about it, and I'm feeling a TMI vibe from radishes, he is too sure that I'm Civ.

I see no indication prior to this exact moment that Master Radishes was a viable candidate to be lynched in Long Con's mind. Why does this vote exist? This is on Day 2, when the two counterwagons were speedchuck and Turnip Head. Epignosis and Turnip Head were also voting for Radishes.

[Sloonei]

Okay it’s not Sloonei, LC, Drago, TS
Probably not Mac, Epi, MR, FG
Could be Leetic, Speed, Ted, TH
rainbow

There are no substantial mentions of either speedchuck or turnip head prior to them being named in the four person pseudo-POE here. Tony, can you remember what went into these reads?

[Sloonei]

Here's a fun one: A readlist based only on people's current votes:

Good votes - MacDougall, Sloonei, Funnygurl, ts account, Epignosis
Not Good Votes - Turnip Head, Master Radishes, Long Con, TSP, Ted

Speed is a clever player, but I don’t think I can see him doing something like this as scum. It has a very “I’m town and here’s what’s up” vibe and it’s something that scum has to pause on the submit button and look at. Thoughts?

Seems unlikely, too on the nose. Vote: speed

Tony makes no mention of speed between these two posts. There was some suspicion prior to this, but this progression is still striking. Speedchuck goes from a suspect to "I don't think I can see him doing this as scum" to a vote recipient without explanation. Why?

[Long Con]

Turnip Head is town.

Oh.

Mr. LC, you had just got done ISOing the accused Turnip and then dropped a vote on his Head, only for Sloonei to shove this obnoxious town read back in your face. You barely reacted at all. What was this response?

It was exactly because I had just finished a bunch of work on Turnip Head. Like I said, every time I put effort into the game, it was instantly shit on. That's part of the reason I got a "screw this" attitude. I just spent an hour going through and analyzing Turnip Head's posts, and the only response is the most townread player saying "Turnip Head is town." What am I supposed to say? I just spent an hour saying what I had to say about Turnip Head. Repeat myself? I felt like a nerd who tried to be cool, but then one of the popular kids was like "Ha ha no."

[Long Con]

[VOTE: radish] aubergine

I've been thinking about it, and I'm feeling a TMI vibe from radishes, he is too sure that I'm Civ.

I see no indication prior to this exact moment that Master Radishes was a viable candidate to be lynched in Long Con's mind. Why does this vote exist? This is on Day 2, when the two counterwagons were speedchuck and Turnip Head. Epignosis and Turnip Head were also voting for Radishes.

It was a result of thinking about the game while going about my daily life. The "process" didn't happen in the thread. It occurred to me while cleaning out the workshop, and I came in and posted.

[Long Con]

I really don't envy you here, Sloon. I prefer to be in the Tony/LC position in the Final 3 than yours.

[TonyStarkPrime]

Scum team could be Mikey, funny girl and tedextr as far as I'm concerned

It’s cliche, but rule of three

All three of these people ended up being town.

well bad rule of three then

[TonyStarkPrime]

Okay it’s not Sloonei, LC, Drago, TS
Probably not Mac, Epi, MR, FG
Could be Leetic, Speed, Ted, TH
rainbow

There are no substantial mentions of either speedchuck or turnip head prior to them being named in the four person pseudo-POE here. Tony, can you remember what went into these reads?

Wanted to split it into groups of four. I don’t think I’d substantially talked about anyone to this point and Speed’s read throughout the game was mostly “speed’s just kinda here”. Don’t remember why TH was there.

[TonyStarkPrime]

Here's a fun one: A readlist based only on people's current votes:

Good votes - MacDougall, Sloonei, Funnygurl, ts account, Epignosis
Not Good Votes - Turnip Head, Master Radishes, Long Con, TSP, Ted

Speed is a clever player, but I don’t think I can see him doing something like this as scum. It has a very “I’m town and here’s what’s up” vibe and it’s something that scum has to pause on the submit button and look at. Thoughts?

Seems unlikely, too on the nose. Vote: speed

Tony makes no mention of speed between these two posts. There was some suspicion prior to this, but this progression is still striking. Speedchuck goes from a suspect to "I don't think I can see him doing this as scum" to a vote recipient without explanation. Why?

I got some negative feedback on the “thoughts” part. I think it was Epi? (Ironic) who said that they saw no reason why scum couldn’t make that post. I did a similar thing with Leetic earlier — said something like “Leetic is putting in work” and then voted for them anyways. I can express doubt.

[TonyStarkPrime]

TonyStarkPrime has twelve posts and and I count only one opinion that is expressed without hedging language.

I’ve been taking the maybes and perhapses out of my emails today. It’s an overall problem.

:poop emoji:

I maintain that I really was taking out maybes and perhapses

[TonyStarkPrime]

In all I think there was a more tangible effort among the three dead scum to get Long Con lynched than Tony at various points in the game. Each of them received some amount of criticism from all three baddies, but the pressure directed at Tony felt more token (see the exchanges with TH above, as well as Epi's "Tony has twelve posts..." comment).
Long Con, on the other hand, received some actual pressure from Epi and speedchuck (as well as Turnip Head's indifference to an LC lynch on Day 1).

But neither of you guys can really address any points about what other players have said about you. So I'll try to pull out posts of your own that I have trouble with.

I feel like the general scum team goal of “we need to talk about Tony” counts for itself. They were hoping I’d say something, they could point and say “this bad plus low participation, he’s scum”. It doesn’t make sense if I’m scum with them unless you think precisely that the lack of interaction would reflect negatively on me.
It was generic prodding because it was faked, not because it’s actual knowledge. It’s really easy to hunt someone who you know is scum.

[TonyStarkPrime]

I really don't envy you here, Sloon. I prefer to be in the Tony/LC position in the Final 3 than yours.

nah I feel powerless I don’t like it

[Long Con]

I really don't envy you here, Sloon. I prefer to be in the Tony/LC position in the Final 3 than yours.

nah I feel powerless I don’t like it

yeah, I do get you there. I've just been in his position before, and made the wrong decision, and it's just a lot of pressure.

[Sloonei]

I don't think I've ever been in this position before. I've been in 3-person lylos, but never as the lone cleared person who needs to decide the game.

I'll try to vote tomorrow so we can wrap this up. Who will I vote for?

[Sloonei]

Okay it’s not Sloonei, LC, Drago, TS
Probably not Mac, Epi, MR, FG
Could be Leetic, Speed, Ted, TH
rainbow

There are no substantial mentions of either speedchuck or turnip head prior to them being named in the four person pseudo-POE here. Tony, can you remember what went into these reads?

Wanted to split it into groups of four. I don’t think I’d substantially talked about anyone to this point and Speed’s read throughout the game was mostly “speed’s just kinda here”. Don’t remember why TH was there.

Why was groups of four the way to go?

[Sloonei]

Turnip Head is town.

Oh.

Mr. LC, you had just got done ISOing the accused Turnip and then dropped a vote on his Head, only for Sloonei to shove this obnoxious town read back in your face. You barely reacted at all. What was this response?

It was exactly because I had just finished a bunch of work on Turnip Head. Like I said, every time I put effort into the game, it was instantly shit on. That's part of the reason I got a "screw this" attitude. I just spent an hour going through and analyzing Turnip Head's posts, and the only response is the most townread player saying "Turnip Head is town." What am I supposed to say? I just spent an hour saying what I had to say about Turnip Head. Repeat myself? I felt like a nerd who tried to be cool, but then one of the popular kids was like "Ha ha no."

I apologize if my post came off as shitting on your work. I was entirely responding to you, but I was just trying to challenge your read to see how you'd respond. I didn't know what to make of this. But this explanation makes sense. Sorry.

[Sloonei]

(that was one of several fake reads i shared early on that people took too seriously)