Coronavirus Mafia [ENDGAME]

[Tangrowth]

I liked 112's entrance a whole fuckton, but I need to feel this out. Let's interact.

[NANOOKTHEGREATANDFEARSOME]

Now I have an actual TR on mp

[Tangrowth]

Also, my early scum read of MP was not totally a joke. I retracted it, but it did actually come back as his later posts felt wrong/forced somehow. His town meta can look beep-boopy but he's seemed a bit too far in that extreme so far and if he doesn't start doing more I'd be happy with lynching him.

His posts felt overly excited to me but I can't decide if that's just because he's thrilled to be playing with us or he's trying too hard to sound civ. He said last night he would be here more today, maybe he meant this evening. I need to hear more from him.

I think you're one of my favorite people, juliets, but the "try too hard" accusation is IMO one of the silliest that's ever been thrown at me, or in general.

If I'm scum, you'll find out through my actual content and tone throughout the game, not because of my effort. My effort is 100% a product of my availability and investment.

And I'm playing a fraction of normal MP7 right now because I'm incredibly involved in a pivotal phase of another game, and I'll leave it at that.

[Tangrowth]

I honestly think nutella's push on me is absolute garbage, and I don't mean that as fabricated because she could easily be town and it could be garbage, and I need her to specifically tell me what posts of mine sounded forced and how she thought that meant I would be scum in this game.

[Tangrowth]

I'm not getting mislynched as town in my second game back on The Syndicate in multiple years. It's never happening.

[Tangrowth]

Ok this sounds more like the civ MPlus7 I remember.

What about it specifically?

[Tangrowth]

Against my typical habits, I'm actively avoiding sharing a rainbow list right now because my reads are very much in flux right now regarding the most active posters, and otherwise more people need to be pressured before this game is over.

Hey LC, what are your reads buddy?

[Tangrowth]

Now I know sig is one of the most often mislynched players on our site, but let's talk about this post some more:

Not a fan of Nanook/Nutella interaction. But, on their own they're Null.
Radish is my first civ lean, not only was his joke funny, but he doesn't seem bad.
Speed seems okay.
MP seems weird in a bad way he cleared Nutella really quickly and is a gut bad ping right now.
Hyena seems so excited that it's tiring.
Juliet seems like her normal self
LC is a bit off, which probably means he's civ.
112, DDL, Wilgy no clue.
TSP is a gut ping.

I just did a quick skim will probably dig in a bit more later tonight.

linki: Heeeeey

What do people think of this? Is it a reasonable set of perceptions based on thread happenings?

[Tangrowth]

"MP seems weird in a bad way he cleared Nutella really quickly and is a gut bad ping right now."

This is also just... I can't even. It's like he still doesn't know how I play this game all these years later.

[Tangrowth]

[mention]DrWilgy[/mention]

I need you, friend. Let's generate some content. As soon as you get back in here, I want you to engage me specifically in your reads.

[Tangrowth]

DrWigly's entrance was fishy and I agree with Nute's quick wit about calling him on it.

Hyena is a tricky player but I think is deserving of the benefit of the doubt at least until LyLo (or later this round, your call).

Hey 112, I believe I spoke to Wilgy and said his NAI entrance is always something like "I'm (not) a doctor / X and whatever", so can you talk to me about why you think it was fishy if there is a point otherwise?

[Tangrowth]

DrWigly's entrance was fishy and I agree with Nute's quick wit about calling him on it.

Hyena is a tricky player but I think is deserving of the benefit of the doubt at least until LyLo (or later this round, your call).

My one concern about nute is how she goes back and forth between M-Plus being wolf; is it genuine, or is she mimicking townthought through her back-and-forth on him? I'm inclined to say she's town, but it's good to get something down here.

This could support my scorching hot take that I'm not sure I even believe that nutella and 112 are scummates, as this is one of the more waffly things 112 has said in her ISO. Like, there's being transparent, which I totally get, but what purpose does that underlined thing even serve?

[Tangrowth]

LC seems supradefensive.

112, how does this inform your read of LC specifically?

[Tangrowth]

I'll be back, other people should say things.

[nutella]

I feel reasonably confident at this point that LC and MR are town. I also found DDL's more recent posts towny (for reasons I believe MR described) but I also thought 112's take on his lack of enthusiasm as potentially AI made sense, so I'm more ambivalent there. I do really vibe with MR's Tony gripes so gonna move my vote there. [VOTE: tonystarkprime] aubergine

Can you expand on your confidence there?

LC has a townie mindset and I agree with MR's read of him (and also there's the arguably angleshooty feeling from his question about probable flavor-alignment correlation). MR I've been mindmelding with a lot and has shown thought processes that resonate as genuine.

Also, my early scum read of MP was not totally a joke. I retracted it, but it did actually come back as his later posts felt wrong/forced somehow. His town meta can look beep-boopy but he's seemed a bit too far in that extreme so far and if he doesn't start doing more I'd be happy with lynching him.

Which posts specifically?

Lynching me on D1 in any given game is a ballsy move; I clear myself pretty easily over time.

All of them p much lol.

And the idea that you'll look better over time just makes me want to catch you early even more, because if you're scum you'll weasel your way into a powerful position.

Like come on guys, that slot is probabilistically more likely town than not, whereas we have thread content to analyze for all other slots that may help us determine that someone has more likelihood to be scum. Not to get mathy about it but it's just all around a dumb thing to do to lynch that slot. Allow me to say it -- it's -EV.

If you're going to actually get on this line of thinking and talk about -EV plays, then tell me how lynching me D1 isn't -EV.

Yeah, no. See above.

Language is everything.

If you are sure LC is town say that. Don't add caveats. Don't theorize about him being w/w with someone then say you are "not very serious about it". The way you did it leaves it open for you to vote LC if other people do that later.

This man is motherfucking town.

Whatever the polar opposite of a mindmeld is, we have it in regards to that DDL opinion. Was a big yikes for me.

ok

[VOTE: Master Radishes] aubergine

.....Didn't you say MR was lock town

It wasn't a serious post.

And let me throw the shade back at you whataboutistically and ask: how do I know you're not playing up the 'I suck as mafia' angle in order to get people to look away from you?

Because it's true? Because I'm not worried about anyone looking at me in the first place?

Hot take: this interaction is between two scummates.

Lol I wish.

Why did you vote 112?

[speedchuck]

Also, my early scum read of MP was not totally a joke. I retracted it, but it did actually come back as his later posts felt wrong/forced somehow. His town meta can look beep-boopy but he's seemed a bit too far in that extreme so far and if he doesn't start doing more I'd be happy with lynching him.

Same

And so I ask you, which posts specifically?

All/None of them. It was the number of them that felt forced.

I saw no armor-piercing questions, no stances, no substantial accusations, nothing. I don't even remember anything worthwhile from those posts. Maybe it was just early, because your entrance today came down with hard townreads, scumteam theorizing, etc, which is a somewhat better look.

[nutella]

I honestly think nutella's push on me is absolute garbage, and I don't mean that as fabricated because she could easily be town and it could be garbage, and I need her to specifically tell me what posts of mine sounded forced and how she thought that meant I would be scum in this game.

I honestly mean it when I say all of them. It's a tone thing. It's the way you've responded to lots of different posts with something like "yeah, that makes a lot of sense" and are exuding a general appearance of being overly logical and analytical towards each and every possible angle. It's a general sense that you are coming across as a caricature of your usual meta.

[speedchuck]

I'm not getting mislynched as town in my second game back on The Syndicate in multiple years. It's never happening.

Yet when I see you and Jack and others make posts like this, I want to lynch you all the more.

Because clearly if the lynch ends up happening, you must be scum. #logic

[speedchuck]

That all said I liked DDL's latest responses in this thread too, even if they were a little 'optimal play' focused. Something easier for scum to capitulate on, but I don't disagree with him.

[speedchuck]

nutella you just might have a waffle-sized blind spot in your hunting.

[nutella]

I'm not getting mislynched as town in my second game back on The Syndicate in multiple years. It's never happening.

And I don't like this attitude either. I get not wanting to be mislynched if you are in fact town, but the way you keep saying this is manipulative and weasely. You're using your power as a respected player around here to try to squeeze your way out of being a lynch candidate, because you know that if you can survive longer you can become more and more credible in the thread due to sheer volume of participation. You're setting yourself up to powerwolf.

[nutella]

Now I know sig is one of the most often mislynched players on our site, but let's talk about this post some more:

Not a fan of Nanook/Nutella interaction. But, on their own they're Null.
Radish is my first civ lean, not only was his joke funny, but he doesn't seem bad.
Speed seems okay.
MP seems weird in a bad way he cleared Nutella really quickly and is a gut bad ping right now.
Hyena seems so excited that it's tiring.
Juliet seems like her normal self
LC is a bit off, which probably means he's civ.
112, DDL, Wilgy no clue.
TSP is a gut ping.

I just did a quick skim will probably dig in a bit more later tonight.

linki: Heeeeey

What do people think of this? Is it a reasonable set of perceptions based on thread happenings?

Yes.

[nutella]

nutella you just might have a waffle-sized blind spot in your hunting.

Huh?

[nutella]

My point is, if MP is scum, he'll be dangerous if we don't catch him early and nip the powerwolf potential in the bud. Yes, it could be argued that if I turn out to be wrong it's a net worse loss for thread productivity, but if we don't solve his slot I'll be nervous about it all game and I just know that nobody else will be on board with it after a point. It's a... sacrifice I'm willing to make.

[speedchuck]

nutella you just might have a waffle-sized blind spot in your hunting.

Huh?

DDL suspecting someone for waffley language can be valid, depending on the way they state things.

Spoiler: show

Language is everything.

If you are sure LC is town say that. Don't add caveats. Don't theorize about him being w/w with someone then say you are "not very serious about it". The way you did it leaves it open for you to vote LC if other people do that later.

Nah. His townread is still strong enough that it would look quite weird if he ended up voting LC, so I disagree. His caveats were minor handwavey waffles, which I can relate to.

You are allowed to waffle like crazy after being mislynched or almost mislynched 3875498475936547 times for that. Normal people still get a ping for it, though.

No. I don't like this coming from you. I thought we had similar styles and you understood the concept of uncertainty in reads. This is a really, really, really bad look on you.

[nutella]

Also his read of me and 112 is fake af. Like. That cannot be a real take.

[juliets]

Ok this sounds more like the civ MPlus7 I remember.

What about it specifically?

You came out firing questions off, trying to pin people down for their opinions and takes.

[Hyena]

Tony has very few game relevant posts. He's spent more time talking about spew and alex jones than actually playing. I don't have a problem with his initial ddl vote, but the fact that his only suspicions come down to ddl=bad and speed=disingenous is not great.

He did say he was playing in three games at once, but he's had time to post here. Even gut reactions would be nice, but scum don't have guts.

Yeah, I noticed the lack of game relevant posts, too. I think the main thing that had kept me from joining his wagon in the last 12-24 hours was that Long Con was on the wagon. I like him more now though, and MR has been continuing to settle into town territory in my head.

I might try to start a wagon on a lurker though (Poison in this case since Nanook seems open to them), just to see what happens.

What do you think would happen, and how would that inform your reads if the subject of your vote isn't really posting?

I never really know what will happen when I make votes like that. What I hope for though is chatter, banter, and all sorts of other reactions. I didn't vote for Poison to get a read on Poison. I voted them to get a read on other people. I wanted to see what they'd do, what they'd say, etc. It's pretty much why I like tying wagons so much, too. I already talked about some of what I gained out of it, namely the 'never more than one scum in {nutella, MR, Speedchuck}' read that no one seemed to comment on.

[Hyena]

Speaking of which,

[VOTE: 112] aubergine

[juliets]

[mention]M Plus 7[/mention], I'm not following your read on 112 and nutella. Did you think that interaction between them was distancing? What about it made you think that as opposed to just a normal interaction (assuming that's what you thought). I'm not reading either of them as scum right now so whatever you're seeing I'd like to know.

[mention]Hyena[/mention] I see your vote for 112 but I think you have talked about why you find her scummy so I'll go back to your posts.

[Hyena]

ok

[VOTE: Master Radishes] aubergine

.....Didn't you say MR was lock town

It wasn't a serious post.

Which one wasn't serious, the townread or the vote?

Just vote for 112. :P

[Hyena]

If I had a good suspect among the active players I’d be voting them

Generally speaking, one of the harder things for me to do as scum is make up reasons to scumread the town players. I also have trouble with being on the wrong side of history in lynches. It's why I like playing scum in multi-team games better than in normal games, because I can actually hunt.

What you're doing here is not hunting or committing to anything, and that skews scum.

So, like, Nanook doesn't have any issues with finding reasons to call town scum. If you want, look at Game 8 of MU Champs last year near EoD1. Nanook and I both succeeded in convincing town to vote out a cop. :3

[juliets]

@Hyena could you talk to me about your 112 read? My first impression of her today was town, mostly because her posts seemed free flowing and not thought out. What are you seeing that leads you to think she might be scum? I don't play regularly with her so I don't really have meta data.

Okay, so for 112, it's more of a gut read at the moment. I'm getting vibes similar to the ones I got from both her AND Evenstar in the champs game I played with them in last year. Specifically, it's the "Hyena's a tricky player" thing she said. Evenstar said something to that effect and pocketed me with it, so it pings me whenever I see something along those lines. It's even more suspicious to me since 112 also said she immediately townread me and Nutella from, like, page 1.

OK, here's what I'm remembering. By the way I have pulled up that WC game and am making my way through 112's posts there. It's slow going because I'm reading her in isolation as opposed to trying to read the whole game.

Is this still how you feel about her? Has anything that's happened since furthered your suspicion?

[Long Con]

Against my typical habits, I'm actively avoiding sharing a rainbow list right now because my reads are very much in flux right now regarding the most active posters, and otherwise more people need to be pressured before this game is over.

Hey LC, what are your reads buddy?

I'm generally feeling suspicious of 112 and Nanook across the day. I haven't really pinpointed for myself why, but I would join those wagons if they were a go at crunch time.

I don't suspect Mplus7, and even if I did, I am unlikely to contribute to his Day 1 lynch after I specifically called for and performed his Night 1 kill in the last game we played, Mafia is fun online social time, and I want to hang with my old friend.

I am not suspicious of DDL for the Radishes accusation. nutella sure is, but that's ok. Not really down with voting nutella.

Juliets could be an option. I don't have a townread of her.

My vote has been on Tony for too long. He could be bad, but I'd rather vote 112 or Nanook. [VOTE: Nanook] aubergine because 112's wagon is already revving up.

[Hyena]

If I had a good suspect among the active players I’d be voting them

Generally speaking, one of the harder things for me to do as scum is make up reasons to scumread the town players. I also have trouble with being on the wrong side of history in lynches. It's why I like playing scum in multi-team games better than in normal games, because I can actually hunt.

What you're doing here is not hunting or committing to anything, and that skews scum.

That’s cool.

I don’t have that issue.

... nice response.

Light scumread.

This interaction made me giggle, admittedly, lol.

[Dragon D. Luffy]

So I agree the speed on juliets was kind of dumb. That kind of arguments works on a generic mafia player but not on juliets since she is doing the usual juliets thing. That said speed is the kind of guy who makes crappy cases on day 1 just to produce reactions. I think the last two times I saw him doing that he was town? So yeah not super sus about him rn.

Nutella feels very town. Also liked 112's train of thought even if I'm not sure she is right, so she feels town too. Radishes defended it with a generic "I always do that" defense which is annoying but might as well be true.

Not reading anyone else tbh. I guess LC feels like a bit of nonpresence so I might vote there? Maybe.

Would you say that's different than LC normally?

Not sure yet. LC eventually becomes more engaging, maybe he will get there, maybe it's still to soon for it. He is not my favorite lynch target though, just was the one I had some feeling about wanting to lynch this morning, but now I'm feeling MR more.

[nutella]

I don't have any specific reason to scumread 112, but I don't have the strongest townread of her either and she deepwolfed really well in wc1 so I understand and respect Hyena's paranoia there. I probably won't be voting for 112 today unless something big happens, but she's in the back of my mind as someone to be careful about getting too comfortable with.

[nutella]

So I agree the speed on juliets was kind of dumb. That kind of arguments works on a generic mafia player but not on juliets since she is doing the usual juliets thing. That said speed is the kind of guy who makes crappy cases on day 1 just to produce reactions. I think the last two times I saw him doing that he was town? So yeah not super sus about him rn.

Nutella feels very town. Also liked 112's train of thought even if I'm not sure she is right, so she feels town too. Radishes defended it with a generic "I always do that" defense which is annoying but might as well be true.

Not reading anyone else tbh. I guess LC feels like a bit of nonpresence so I might vote there? Maybe.

Would you say that's different than LC normally?

Not sure yet. LC eventually becomes more engaging, maybe he will get there, maybe it's still to soon for it. He is not my favorite lynch target though, just was the one I had some feeling about wanting to lynch this morning, but now I'm feeling MR more.

Imo he's been a hell of a lot more engaging than you, lol. At least until you got more involved today.

[Dragon D. Luffy]

Now it's time for you people to explain why everyone and their dog is townreading Radishes because I don't see it.

Alternatively, let's lynch him.

I still think he's mildly suspicious tbh, but he is actively contributing and I want to pressure elsewhere before this EoD.

What else you got?

Nothing I particularly feel like lynching, tbh.

Just a few civ reads I already mentioned. Nutella, 112 and I guess speedchuck.

[NANOOKTHEGREATANDFEARSOME]

I don’t really TR 112 so I could get behind that TK. Certainly better than an MP kill imo

[112]

DrWigly's entrance was fishy and I agree with Nute's quick wit about calling him on it.

Hyena is a tricky player but I think is deserving of the benefit of the doubt at least until LyLo (or later this round, your call).

Hey 112, I believe I spoke to Wilgy and said his NAI entrance is always something like "I'm (not) a doctor / X and whatever", so can you talk to me about why you think it was fishy if there is a point otherwise?

mostly i didn't like his tone lol

that's all i go by when i don't have meta on page 1

i didn't think anything of you saying his normal entrance has something to do with being a doctor or not

[Hyena]

@Hyena could you talk to me about your 112 read? My first impression of her today was town, mostly because her posts seemed free flowing and not thought out. What are you seeing that leads you to think she might be scum? I don't play regularly with her so I don't really have meta data.

Okay, so for 112, it's more of a gut read at the moment. I'm getting vibes similar to the ones I got from both her AND Evenstar in the champs game I played with them in last year. Specifically, it's the "Hyena's a tricky player" thing she said. Evenstar said something to that effect and pocketed me with it, so it pings me whenever I see something along those lines. It's even more suspicious to me since 112 also said she immediately townread me and Nutella from, like, page 1.

OK, here's what I'm remembering. By the way I have pulled up that WC game and am making my way through 112's posts there. It's slow going because I'm reading her in isolation as opposed to trying to read the whole game.

Is this still how you feel about her? Has anything that's happened since furthered your suspicion?

No, nothing has happened to further my suspicion. It hasn't gotten any better either though. It's remained static throughout D1. The reason why I'm still considering 112 as an option is because I feel like I was able to read her town in the Inception game. Thus, it's not like I can't find her as town when she is town. She's just not showing she's town right now.

[Hyena]

Now it's time for you people to explain why everyone and their dog is townreading Radishes because I don't see it.

Alternatively, let's lynch him.

I still think he's mildly suspicious tbh, but he is actively contributing and I want to pressure elsewhere before this EoD.

What else you got?

Nothing I particularly feel like lynching, tbh.

Just a few civ reads I already mentioned. Nutella, 112 and I guess speedchuck.

How about me?

[juliets]

Against my typical habits, I'm actively avoiding sharing a rainbow list right now because my reads are very much in flux right now regarding the most active posters, and otherwise more people need to be pressured before this game is over.

Hey LC, what are your reads buddy?

I'm generally feeling suspicious of 112 and Nanook across the day. I haven't really pinpointed for myself why, but I would join those wagons if they were a go at crunch time.

I don't suspect Mplus7, and even if I did, I am unlikely to contribute to his Day 1 lynch after I specifically called for and performed his Night 1 kill in the last game we played, Mafia is fun online social time, and I want to hang with my old friend.

I am not suspicious of DDL for the Radishes accusation. nutella sure is, but that's ok. Not really down with voting nutella.

Juliets could be an option. I don't have a townread of her.

My vote has been on Tony for too long. He could be bad, but I'd rather vote 112 or Nanook. [VOTE: Nanook] aubergine because 112's wagon is already revving up.

LC, I know gut reads are hard to pinpoint but there must be something that leads you to vote for Nanook. It would be great if you could even just describe what your gut is saying about him.

linki: @Hyena thanks for that explanation.

[112]

Against my typical habits, I'm actively avoiding sharing a rainbow list right now because my reads are very much in flux right now regarding the most active posters, and otherwise more people need to be pressured before this game is over.

Hey LC, what are your reads buddy?

I'm generally feeling suspicious of 112 and Nanook across the day. I haven't really pinpointed for myself why, but I would join those wagons if they were a go at crunch time.

I don't suspect Mplus7, and even if I did, I am unlikely to contribute to his Day 1 lynch after I specifically called for and performed his Night 1 kill in the last game we played, Mafia is fun online social time, and I want to hang with my old friend.

I am not suspicious of DDL for the Radishes accusation. nutella sure is, but that's ok. Not really down with voting nutella.

Juliets could be an option. I don't have a townread of her.

My vote has been on Tony for too long. He could be bad, but I'd rather vote 112 or Nanook. [VOTE: Nanook] aubergine because 112's wagon is already revving up.

I've also been paranoid regarding Nanook. Thank you for choosing him over me.

[NANOOKTHEGREATANDFEARSOME]

Fwiw I’m pretty sure hyena is town

[112]

Nutella has convinced me.

[VOTE: M Plus 7] aubergine

[Hyena]

Against my typical habits, I'm actively avoiding sharing a rainbow list right now because my reads are very much in flux right now regarding the most active posters, and otherwise more people need to be pressured before this game is over.

Hey LC, what are your reads buddy?

I'm generally feeling suspicious of 112 and Nanook across the day. I haven't really pinpointed for myself why, but I would join those wagons if they were a go at crunch time.

I don't suspect Mplus7, and even if I did, I am unlikely to contribute to his Day 1 lynch after I specifically called for and performed his Night 1 kill in the last game we played, Mafia is fun online social time, and I want to hang with my old friend.

I am not suspicious of DDL for the Radishes accusation. nutella sure is, but that's ok. Not really down with voting nutella.

Juliets could be an option. I don't have a townread of her.

My vote has been on Tony for too long. He could be bad, but I'd rather vote 112 or Nanook. [VOTE: Nanook] aubergine because 112's wagon is already revving up.

I love this vote on Nanook more every time I look at it.

[112]

I feel like the scum team is largely caught at this point but I'm still not too sure who it is, which is sort of to say they're not caught, but I think in generally we're doing a good job of sorting them somehow if that makes any sense. I have no justifications for saying this.

[Hyena]

Nutella has convinced me.

[VOTE: M Plus 7] aubergine

I doubt she did. :P

---

Someone please help me wagon 112.