Space Invaders [END]

[Soneji]

Got through d1 read skimming most things while staving off fatigue. Mac seems to be lolcatting and is therefore in anti-spew so whatever he says should be taken with a bag of salt. The other main thing this day is Epi vs Alison, which has progressions on both sides that suggest it's not bussing, so they'd certainly make a solid pair to put onto nutella n1.

Now I sleep

[Epignosis]

I'm fucking town

Is that an adjective or a verb?

[NANOOKTHEGREATANDFEARSOME]

That doesn’t support my narrative so I’m ignoring it

[TonyStarkPrime]

Uhm

Apologies if im tunneling, im not the best at mafia

But can u guys pls ISO tony and tell me am i crazy for thinking its an obv mafia?

you're crazy

[TonyStarkPrime]

TonyStarkPrime

#69 #71 is his entrance to the thread. It's.. weird but okay, townread Epignosis.

Then comes a lot of mechanic talk. He proposes that bottom of POE protect, which is okay.

maybe just aliens+1 bottom names in the poe protects

Not sure what it means but okéééé?

And then this happens:

That's all of the necessary mechanics talk today.

Three people don't like space movies. These should make up the bottom of the poe.

update: two of them aren't in the game

It's a bit really underwhelming. And it's not even funny.
20 minutes later on #128, mechanic talk is back. No read on anyone, if we're kind we can give #149 as a slight scum read on protocultures, but literally the minute after he "scans" the math for a townread so not sure it's worth anything. A few hours pass.

On #246 he reacts to my scumread on Epignosis saying it's town, no read on tutuu and ignoring the Long Con part. Explanation on #261 that is not really convincing and never answers me about #280

A bit later this happens:

I also think this game is sorting very easily and day 1 hasn't started yet which is usually a bad sign

usually a bad sign = usually I'm wrong about how things are going. but I'd be happy to be right

The thing is. TonyStarkPrime didn't have any reads yet? So that means nothing. Not good.
Answers my « is this a "prepare tinfoil theory" post? » of #301 in #304 but then never answer my #307 when I question him about his reads of the moment. Second ignored question. Not good.

A few hours pass again, #536 seems a tad agressive for ?? reason.
And then we go from "mac wolf" to "unfortunately this is kinda where my head is at as well" to "I don't think drago was necessarily a wolf. drago is just drago". His position is not clear despite having a couple of consecutive messages on the same slot.

#559 suspects dunya
but in a really... Nice way? As in trying to suspect someone without it being noticed? The thing I hate about this post is that it ends with "Along these lines I think 5-6 names form an immediately available poe." But no names. And no follow-up. Not good.

#596 can be read as "suspecting Alison without suspecting Alison" which is not good too.

--

IN SUMMARY:

• He has not answered two questions that were adresse to him about his reads;
• For someone who said "enough mech talk", he has a really underwhelming number of reads;
• His only consistent read is Epignosis town and is based on a "mindset thing";
• All his other reads/positions are really meh/dodgy;
• There's a recurring scheme of pretending to think about the reads he has but that no one else know and that never translate in concrete posts/actions in the thread.

CONCLUSION:
Yeah TonyStarkPrime might definitely be an alien.

i mean omgus but "might definitely be an alien" is going to get grammar scumread pretty fast. whatever. I'll check on missed questions

[TonyStarkPrime]

I don't think it's carrotte//alison.

[TonyStarkPrime]

soneji kinda wolf got a funny thing

[TonyStarkPrime]

Also, I'm a bunker and I'm always going to be defending nutella. Don't waste your defense on me.

That should say "Don't waste your defense on nutella."

On the multikill nights more people need to protect me though right?

I only vaguely understand the setup....

and if Epi's an alien...

Also, I'm a bunker and I'm always going to be defending nutella. Don't waste your defense on me.

That should say "Don't waste your defense on nutella."

On the multikill nights more people need to protect me though right?

I only vaguely understand the setup....

2 people. You'll be fine. I promise. Epi and dun got ur back gurl

This is over is an alien laser shoots nutella. That's it.

Bunkers have limited protections. After I'm spent, someone else will need to carry on in my stead (or if I get killed).

This is about setting up a network of protections so that it's clear who failed and is therefore mafia.

regardless, I think this is town

Sow doubt on Epi, then swiftly call him town anyways:hmm

We publicly make a list of who protects who. When someone dies we know who lied

okay, but I'm not going through with this unless there are at least 2 people defending Nutella and possibly 3

@linki oh yeah and bunker protects are limited. It might be best to save them until endgame and just force the poe to protect Nutella each day

The PoE are almost always going to be the ones you least want protecting the Laser.


As for the strat I think is best : I'm good with the bottom four PoE strat for n1 only, otherwise think top 3 towncore should protect nutella on odd nights, top 4 towncore on even nights. Could mix in some of the middle of the pack to preserve some of the top towncores protects, best to adjust that as we go. On that first night, the middling PoE should use their protects on the towncore. On subsequent nights the bottom of the PoE should be protecting the towncore, with probably a double up on the very top of the towncore. Force aliens to shoot into bottom or middling Poe, or have to use two kills on even nights to kill one towncore and not even the best SPK they could get.

For simplicities sake, will lay out the first three nights :

N1 : Bottom four of the PoE assigned to protect nutella, while the next three lowest PoE protect the top 3 towncore.

N2 : Top three towncore+one middling PoE protect nutella, while the bottom three to four in the PoE protect the top 3 towncore. If four double up on the very top towncore SPK.

N3 : Top two towncore+one middling PoE protect nutella, bottom three PoE protects top three towncore.

With this we can shuffle enough to have top towncore with protects left up until late. It's a small game, so I think people are overestimating how conservative we need to be with protects. By the end of n4, there can be up to 10 deaths if the aliens succeed on both their double kills. Then n5 being an odd night needs only one towncore with a protect left alive to secure nutella's safety.


Now onto d1.

I also sort of scumread the strategy given. day 1 it's just protoculture's though basically? fine I guess

[TonyStarkPrime]

oops added the epi thing

[TonyStarkPrime]

I owe Carotte 5-6 names.


the >rand alien section:

Mac
Alison
Long Con
Carotte
Rej
Soneji

in roughly that order.

[TonyStarkPrime]

top to bottom least likely to most likely. Alison/Carotte probably not w/w, Alison/Mac probably not w/w. For people who think Epi is a wolf, Alison/Epi probably not w/w. maybe Alison is just town. I'll check up, see if I can cross off any other pairings

[tutuu]

This game is easy

Apologies if im tunneling, im not the best at mafia

lol.

I dislike your "obvious" townreads with no explanation needed.

I feel like where aliens have full chat, there is massive potential to gaslight the town/Nutella into thinking certain people are "obvious town" just by repeating things over and over. Its why I hate when people just make statements like this with zero backup. It doesnt allow town to work through their logic to ascertain whether it is likely to be town or alien logic.

I dont need to put a lot of effort in to live, Im new so its unlikely I get killed day 1 in any event.

Doesnt make you an alien though. Your random aggro dismissive post style seems too... awkward for an alien to make intentionally.

Alison is town cuz she just read like 10 games over a debate of meta or some shit and made like 20 walls

Dizzy is town cuz ... idk. Ok listen buddy, i dont perceive mafia as a logical game. Dizzy also said the same. Tf u want me to say lol

I just think these 2 peeps are extremely obv town

[tutuu]

Tony u sure maf alison legit just goes on MU, finds ALL of dizzys games, skims the iso and writes a 100 page essay on a day 1 of a non-championship game of mafia?

[tutuu]

Also @ soneji calling me plan too wolfy to be a wolf

I gave up on arguing cuz no point, but my rng plan is still objectively the best. u guys are just still learning to crawl, when you think that you are learning how to walk, when your objective is to learn how to run, and thats why you cant comprehend that i fly.

[TonyStarkPrime]

Tony u sure maf alison legit just goes on MU, finds ALL of dizzys games, skims the iso and writes a 100 page essay on a day 1 of a non-championship game of mafia?

I mean

a point for Alison, I guess. I see no reason why town alison would be substantially more likely to do it than scum Alison though

[tutuu]

Its not an alison thing its a person thing

Ppl tryhard as town more often than maf in games where stakes arent that high

Most ppl view playing maf as a chore and if ur town u can do whatever u want

[TonyStarkPrime]

going and reviewing half a dozen games of meta sounds like a chore to me

[protocultures]

Also @ soneji calling me plan too wolfy to be a wolf

I gave up on arguing cuz no point, but my rng plan is still objectively the best. u guys are just still learning to crawl, when you think that you are learning how to walk, when your objective is to learn how to run, and thats why you cant comprehend that i fly.

Dunning Kruger anyone?

[tutuu]

Ur maf dude

Tf is that strawman

"Playing maf is a chore, therefore, it makes sense alison is maf and puts even more chores on herself"

[NANOOKTHEGREATANDFEARSOME]

This game is easy

Apologies if im tunneling, im not the best at mafia

lol.

I dislike your "obvious" townreads with no explanation needed.

I feel like where aliens have full chat, there is massive potential to gaslight the town/Nutella into thinking certain people are "obvious town" just by repeating things over and over. Its why I hate when people just make statements like this with zero backup. It doesnt allow town to work through their logic to ascertain whether it is likely to be town or alien logic.

I dont need to put a lot of effort in to live, Im new so its unlikely I get killed day 1 in any event.

Doesnt make you an alien though. Your random aggro dismissive post style seems too... awkward for an alien to make intentionally.

Alison is town cuz she just read like 10 games over a debate of meta or some shit and made like 20 walls

Dizzy is town cuz ... idk. Ok listen buddy, i dont perceive mafia as a logical game. Dizzy also said the same. Tf u want me to say lol

I just think these 2 peeps are extremely obv town

That doesn’t make her town lol

[NANOOKTHEGREATANDFEARSOME]

Idk if anyone ever answered this proto but yes we get flips

[TonyStarkPrime]

Ur maf dude

Tf is that strawman

"Playing maf is a chore, therefore, it makes sense alison is maf and puts even more chores on herself"

I’m just saying it doesn’t make sense. I stand by it not making sense.

[TonyStarkPrime]

Like the narrative “Alison, facing pressure, does extra work” makes as much sense to me as “Alison, out of a townie drive to do good, randomly does a deep dive on Dizzy’s meta”

[Rej]

Do I have all townreads on me? What the actual fuck

@MacDougall come rectify this and OMGUS me please I need a sense of normality

not mine, not yet

[Rej]

[VOTE: Rej] aubergine

Not towny Rej. Where is my towny Rej? Not here, cause Rej is not town.

that vote is wasted on my slot, rather vote Mac or your new fresh suspect Alison, also I don't feel threatened, I am still catching up

you always keep on saying "not towny" "not towny"...can you go into depth? if you are so sure you can already give me a micro/macro read or even two

[Carotenoid]

Spoiler: show

TonyStarkPrime

#69 #71 is his entrance to the thread. It's.. weird but okay, townread Epignosis.

Then comes a lot of mechanic talk. He proposes that bottom of POE protect, which is okay.

maybe just aliens+1 bottom names in the poe protects

Not sure what it means but okéééé?

And then this happens:

That's all of the necessary mechanics talk today.

Three people don't like space movies. These should make up the bottom of the poe.

update: two of them aren't in the game

It's a bit really underwhelming. And it's not even funny.
20 minutes later on #128, mechanic talk is back. No read on anyone, if we're kind we can give #149 as a slight scum read on protocultures, but literally the minute after he "scans" the math for a townread so not sure it's worth anything. A few hours pass.

On #246 he reacts to my scumread on Epignosis saying it's town, no read on tutuu and ignoring the Long Con part. Explanation on #261 that is not really convincing and never answers me about #280

A bit later this happens:

I also think this game is sorting very easily and day 1 hasn't started yet which is usually a bad sign

usually a bad sign = usually I'm wrong about how things are going. but I'd be happy to be right

The thing is. TonyStarkPrime didn't have any reads yet? So that means nothing. Not good.
Answers my « is this a "prepare tinfoil theory" post? » of #301 in #304 but then never answer my #307 when I question him about his reads of the moment. Second ignored question. Not good.

A few hours pass again, #536 seems a tad agressive for ?? reason.
And then we go from "mac wolf" to "unfortunately this is kinda where my head is at as well" to "I don't think drago was necessarily a wolf. drago is just drago". His position is not clear despite having a couple of consecutive messages on the same slot.

#559 suspects dunya
but in a really... Nice way? As in trying to suspect someone without it being noticed? The thing I hate about this post is that it ends with "Along these lines I think 5-6 names form an immediately available poe." But no names. And no follow-up. Not good.

#596 can be read as "suspecting Alison without suspecting Alison" which is not good too.

--

IN SUMMARY:

• He has not answered two questions that were adresse to him about his reads;
• For someone who said "enough mech talk", he has a really underwhelming number of reads;
• His only consistent read is Epignosis town and is based on a "mindset thing";
• All his other reads/positions are really meh/dodgy;
• There's a recurring scheme of pretending to think about the reads he has but that no one else know and that never translate in concrete posts/actions in the thread.

CONCLUSION:
Yeah TonyStarkPrime might definitely be an alien.

i mean omgus but "might definitely be an alien" is going to get grammar scumread pretty fast. whatever. I'll check on missed questions

Why grammar scumread? That's the only reaction you have regarding my post?
TonyStarkPrime about Soneji

Spoiler: show

soneji kinda wolf got a funny thing

Spoiler: show

Also, I'm a bunker and I'm always going to be defending nutella. Don't waste your defense on me.

That should say "Don't waste your defense on nutella."

On the multikill nights more people need to protect me though right?

I only vaguely understand the setup....

and if Epi's an alien...

That should say "Don't waste your defense on nutella."

On the multikill nights more people need to protect me though right?

I only vaguely understand the setup....

2 people. You'll be fine. I promise. Epi and dun got ur back gurl

This is over is an alien laser shoots nutella. That's it.

Bunkers have limited protections. After I'm spent, someone else will need to carry on in my stead (or if I get killed).

This is about setting up a network of protections so that it's clear who failed and is therefore mafia.

regardless, I think this is town

Sow doubt on Epi, then swiftly call him town anyways:hmm

We publicly make a list of who protects who. When someone dies we know who lied

okay, but I'm not going through with this unless there are at least 2 people defending Nutella and possibly 3

@linki oh yeah and bunker protects are limited. It might be best to save them until endgame and just force the poe to protect Nutella each day

The PoE are almost always going to be the ones you least want protecting the Laser.


As for the strat I think is best : I'm good with the bottom four PoE strat for n1 only, otherwise think top 3 towncore should protect nutella on odd nights, top 4 towncore on even nights. Could mix in some of the middle of the pack to preserve some of the top towncores protects, best to adjust that as we go. On that first night, the middling PoE should use their protects on the towncore. On subsequent nights the bottom of the PoE should be protecting the towncore, with probably a double up on the very top of the towncore. Force aliens to shoot into bottom or middling Poe, or have to use two kills on even nights to kill one towncore and not even the best SPK they could get.

For simplicities sake, will lay out the first three nights :

N1 : Bottom four of the PoE assigned to protect nutella, while the next three lowest PoE protect the top 3 towncore.

N2 : Top three towncore+one middling PoE protect nutella, while the bottom three to four in the PoE protect the top 3 towncore. If four double up on the very top towncore SPK.

N3 : Top two towncore+one middling PoE protect nutella, bottom three PoE protects top three towncore.

With this we can shuffle enough to have top towncore with protects left up until late. It's a small game, so I think people are overestimating how conservative we need to be with protects. By the end of n4, there can be up to 10 deaths if the aliens succeed on both their double kills. Then n5 being an odd night needs only one towncore with a protect left alive to secure nutella's safety.


Now onto d1.

I also sort of scumread the strategy given. day 1 it's just protoculture's though basically? fine I guess

I owe Carotte 5-6 names.


the >rand alien section:

Mac
Alison
Long Con
Carotte
Rej
Soneji

in roughly that order.

top to bottom least likely to most likely. Alison/Carotte probably not w/w, Alison/Mac probably not w/w. For people who think Epi is a wolf, Alison/Epi probably not w/w. maybe Alison is just town. I'll check up, see if I can cross off any other pairings

How do you go from "kinda wolf got a funny thing", "sort of scumread the strategy given" to putting Soneji as your most likely alien? What happened to dunya?

[Long Con]

I agree with Tony about Alison.

[Rej]

im just looking forward to this incoming proto bomb

There is much to look forward to.

Mac, why don't you vote Rej with me? I have irrefutable evidence that he is scum.

a liiiiiie, and why you suddenly want a supposed scum to vote together with you?

[Rej]

5 year old meta GOAT

[Rej]

People posting too much for a d0

I don't see any need to tell nutella what to do. I would rather nutella just kill someone.

It's not telling, just suggesting.

Vote Epignosis

(yes, I know it doesn't do anything, I just want to make it clear what my stance is from day to day)


Making a list of who protects who only gives more information to the mafia about who is unprotected. And mafia wins the game immediately if they kill nutella, so it is completely useless to know who failed to protect her the day after we lose the game. The strategy you are proposing would make it trivially easy for the mafia to win just by attacking the operator on the night where a mafia member is scheduled to protect her. And a public list of who protects who would make it easier for the mafia to know who they can safely kill since there isn't enough heals to protect everyone at once.

It is correct for town to keep when and who they are using their protect on secret so mafia doesn't know who is being protected, if the operator is shielded, and how many protects the town has left.

Why are you preemptively thinking you'll be called out for making a vote, even in a game where they don’t officially matter to the lynch?

The primary goal with the protects isn't to be blocking every shot, just those aimed at nutella. The secondary goal with the protects should be to keep the towncore alive.

Oh yea i was also thinking of using RNG to determine our protections

like idk the numbers but lets say arbitrarily say 10% , each bunker goes to rand.org or however eas the site, rolls between 1 and 100, if its 1 to 10 they protect nutella, otherwise save their shot. Obv different on even nights and as more of us die but u get the idea. Like, just think of some numbers that will give us good odds, i think its okay to slightly potentially lose the game on the first night if it means bigger chance to win in the end

That’s not what we’re doing lol

feels annoying to disparage my idea without even giving it a chance as if its something silly, and as if luck isnt already involved to a degree in mafia

This plan seems too wolfy to be a wolf, especially with the genuine seeming offense to their idea being dismissed.

Also, I'm a bunker and I'm always going to be defending nutella. Don't waste your defense on me.

That should say "Don't waste your defense on nutella."

On the multikill nights more people need to protect me though right?

I only vaguely understand the setup....

and if Epi's an alien...

Also, I'm a bunker and I'm always going to be defending nutella. Don't waste your defense on me.

That should say "Don't waste your defense on nutella."

On the multikill nights more people need to protect me though right?

I only vaguely understand the setup....

2 people. You'll be fine. I promise. Epi and dun got ur back gurl

This is over is an alien laser shoots nutella. That's it.

Bunkers have limited protections. After I'm spent, someone else will need to carry on in my stead (or if I get killed).

This is about setting up a network of protections so that it's clear who failed and is therefore mafia.

regardless, I think this is town

Sow doubt on Epi, then swiftly call him town anyways:hmm

We publicly make a list of who protects who. When someone dies we know who lied

okay, but I'm not going through with this unless there are at least 2 people defending Nutella and possibly 3

@linki oh yeah and bunker protects are limited. It might be best to save them until endgame and just force the poe to protect Nutella each day

The PoE are almost always going to be the ones you least want protecting the Laser.

All this strategy talk is hurting my brain. I'm merely glancing at these posts right now.

Drago got replaced so not expecting Mac to answer for this, but yeah trying to act lost here when everyone else is doing fine with mechanics talk, and offering up nothing else besides is a bad look.

All this strategy talk is hurting my brain. I'm merely glancing at these posts right now.

Then ignore mechanics, project town and find scum. We’ll take care of the mechanics.

Good look from Nanook to push Drago into being productive.

Drago doesnt like Spacemovies = bad

Dunya, Alison and Tutu are town GTH, nice energy.
Not excluding the possibility that a wolf is coordinating the mechtalk with others.

Tho nothing else pinged me for now. I am at work, will be properly active later on.

Toss out a few townreads, blanket shade the majority of the game thread, then dip. Whoo boy.

It is likely that there was a wolf participating in the mech discussion just on the probability that one was around to post and that it was the main conversation point, but pointing this out without giving a specific person/s that come off wolfy with their approach to the discussion is just going to sow discord.

I think we should have at least 3 people saving nutella on any given day. The rest can be up to whatever people wanna do and leave it as a mystery for the aliens to misfire. Hunting through nk is hard at this stage if we want to preserve saves. So we can do regular hunting and I think we already have lots of good content to go through.

How do we go about selecting those 3 ppl?

Tony thinks our scummiest 4 should protect her. We coordinate that itt. I understand why, but my scummiest 4 could be the whole maf team gg y'all ;p but yeah, for a day 1 strategy it makes most sense.

I think it works only for a n1 strategy, as the scum team would have to be exactly the bottom #2-5 of the PoE for us to lose there(the very bottom #1 gets blasted by nutella).

Hello fellow players. First forum game for me, I am a fairly new mafia player but have played on DM a few times and play the occasional voice/text game over discord. I live in GMT timezone so will probably be out of sync with a lot of you. I draft in word and paste into the forum so hopefully the formatting doesn’t go into the toilet. As editing posts is forbidden, I may repost if this turns out to be a problem.

Spoiler: show

The setup is new to me, so I will state a brief understanding of how this works below. If other people have a different view/better understanding, it would be great if people (or the mod) could let me know.

10 bunkers with 4 saves each who don’t know anything other than Nutella is the Laser.

4 aliens who have perfect information.

Odd nights – 1 alien KP.

Even nights – 2 alien KP till 2.

QUESTION – if player x saves themselves, or player y saves player x, and the town laser is shot at player x, does the laser go through the bunker save?

QUESTION – This is a day 0 start, so does laser get to shoot at the end of Day 0? Does it go to Night 0 or Night 1? This is important to work out alien KP and how many saves should be on Nutella.

QUESTION – can aliens no shoot in the night?

I feel like there is a mathematically optimal solution to this game for every night but I am not smart enough to figure it out.

My proposal for Night 0 or Night 1, depending on which it will be is set out below.

We want the minimum number of saves on Nutella but with some math behind it. These saves should be selected and made public by Nutella and all players who are nominated by Nutella to save Nutella should indeed save Nutella with no exceptions. They need to confirm receipt of the message and confirm they will save Nutella, or Nutella needs to re-nominate someone who has seen their request. This should be entirely elected by Nutella and not depend on people saying they will save Nutella – ie picking into Dunya/Epignosis without rnging them is bad.

The other players should make their saves or no saves in secret, but claim them at the start of the next day along with reasons. Town should never lie about their saves in the night and I am a firm believer of laser all liars in this setup.
If aliens have 1 night KP, I suggest 3 nominated saves and if aliens have 2 night KP, I suggest 4 nominated saves.
See some napkin math below which might be wrong, but lets see if I can still remember combinatronics.
1 Alien KP – need to ensure we land AT LEAST 1 town save, so this is basically any outcome except 3 aliens in the 3 nominations. This is 1 minus (4/14 x 3/13 x 2/12) = 1 – 24/2184 = 98.9% Laser lives through the night. I can accept a 1.1% loss in first night if the benefit is that we get to not waste additional bunker saves.
2 Alien KP – need to ensure we land AT LEAST 2 town saves. This gets a bit harder so please flame me loudly if there is an error in the math so we can try and fix it before we nominate saves (assuming I can get laser and town to buy into my plan).
With 4 nominations, there are 5 outcomes with the following distribution:

4 aliens: 4/14 x 3/13 x 2/12 x 1/11 = 24/24,024 = 0.1% (we lose first night with no saves on Nutella)

3 aliens, 1 town: 4/14 x 3/13 x 2/12 x 10/11 x 4 combos = 960/24,024 = 4 % (we lose first night with 1 saves on Nutella)

2 aliens, 2 town: 4/14 x 3/13 x 10/12 x 9/11 x 6 combos = 6,480/24,024 = 27% (we land 2 saves on
Nutella)

1 alien, 3 town: 10/14 x 9/13 x 8/12 x 4/11 x 4 combos = 11,520/24,024 = 48% (we land 3 saves on Nutella)

4 town: 10/14 x 9/13 x 8/12 x 7/11 = 5,040 /24,024 = 21% (we land 4 saves on Nutella)

I am okay with 4.1% loss in first night.

My current reads/leanings. Cant necessarily justify them all, because its not always rational or justifiable. Its just how their posts make my gut feel.

Alison – hard town. Thinks Epignosis is alien, and agree re full list of saves being anti town.

Bimbo – no posts.

Carotenoid – light alien read for the short intro. Good to know Mac would agree.

Dragomir – null to light town.

Dyslexicon – null to alien for no solve in 3 posts. “game” doesn’t count and I believe is just to appear non-coaster.

Dunya – started off towny, but then slips into hard alien with the later posts. Implied statement that Carotenoid is town “Can't wait to see your super shiny townies self! ”, and the hard tunnel onto LC at the start of day 0. Might be a meta thing I just have no idea but could also just be distancing. Then claims laser will be fine because Dunya/Epi will be using their save onto the laser. “2 people. You'll be fine. I promise. Epi and dun got ur back gurl”. This would be fine if they were both exactly town, but how does anyone else know they are both town? We don’t. “We publicly make a list of who protects who. When someone dies we know who lied” – this is also super alien. We should mix the saves into public and private so the aliens do not have perfect info on saves. Dunya in later posts moves back into town. My head hurts.

Epignosis – hard alien – it’s a vibe thing, cant explain it.

Long Con – Alien. Cant believe they called themselves a bunkerman instead of a bunker person. Consider myself triggered. Gets slightly town for thinking that having no saves left day 5 onward is bad but not that much. “We have to assume the aliens will try to kill nutella every night. We will non-randomly arrange protects to ensure, and insure, that she has multiple layers of protection each night. We will do this in a way that eliminates the possibility of unfortuitously picking all aliens to protect her.” Seems towny but to eliminate the possibility of picking all aliens, we need to use a LOT of bunker saves every even night. Also thinks aliens will be trying to kill the laser every night. I hard disagree and think aliens will leave the laser alone all game since its way easier to kill all the bunkers and win that way. On a meta read without ever having played with them, I simply don’t believe someone with 13k posts would think the aliens would be trying to kill the laser every night.

NANOOKTHEGREATANDFEARSOME – light town for thinking a protection scheme can/should exist. Does not want rng factors into the saves onto Nutella and prefers a set scheme TBC. The arguments with tutu re “trolling” seems town on town to me.

Nutella – LASER

Protocultures – the towniest town that ever towned in the history of townhood

Rej – thinks Dunya, Alison and Tutuu are town GTH. No idea what GTH means but I kinda like their town circle.

Soneji – null to very very light town for having looked into strategies as could have done it for either alignment.

TonyStarkPrime – Null to alien. The strategy of 4 most scummy players onto Laser is bad since if we get 3+ aliens, we insta lose. I much prefer a random 4 than we pick the 4 scummiest, especially since aliens will then try to look scummy intentionally.

Tutuu - Medium town. Wants to know if laser gets to shoot Day 0. Wants town to mass rng saves onto the laser and thinks its okay to lose a non-zero percentage on first night to increase overall town win percentage by not blowing all the bunker saves the first 4 days. I agree with this concept. Tutu thinks Dunya is light town and LongCon is town. I think its weird that Tutuu reads LongCon as town for subjectively incorrect logic, but it seems genuine.

The effort shown here, and in their many other posts, along with a solid progression on their reads puts proto as very likely town. I think the best look of all is this first post, where I would think an over eager, new to forum mafia wolf, would just think about impressing with their mechanics/math and forget to actually give proper reads but proto went above and beyond.

(ioa information over analysis is what i was looking for)

Doesn't surprise me given him saying he is new to forum mafia.

hyijifhinrjdfihbrenjdfhedsi aaaaaaaah multiquote button didn't work bierjnnfierhehuj
*take a deep breathe* it's gonna be okay
anyway

TonyStarkPrime's plan seems to be the best so far, but it's kinda risky to the not-poe-people past n1, if that makes sense. So I propose that we kinda flip it around:

- On odd nights, two top townreads (or like one top townread + 2 midlytownread that can't all be wolves together) protect nutella. And then we could do something like bottom of POE protect the people protecting nutella and all the others only self-protect if they feel the need to.

- On even nights, bottom of POE protect nutella. The rest of the players only self-protect if they feel the need to.

That way, the protection shots are used more horizontally and avoids that town ends up with no shots at the end. Also I feel like unless we specifically coordinate something specific in the thread, bunker shots should only be used on their own slot.

The odd night plan is pretty solid, but the even night is wack. You need to have confidence in there being two town protects in there on even nights. On odd nights needing just one you have more leeway to include the PoE.

I also think that nobody except Nutella should be saved, full stop. Including self saves.

How about NO! You crazy Dutch bastard!

ok, misread the OP - I thought each Bunker could only protect once. Apparently they have 4 shots. Still not enough to waste them on a mass protect of every player in the game.

Misread the OP versus misread role PM:hmm


Coming out of d0 roughly where I'm at :

Good

proto
tutuu
Dunya

Still deciding

Nanook
Long Con
Carot
Dizzy
Bimbo(don't think they posted?)

Bad

Epi
TSP
Alison
Rej
Drago/Mac


As for the strat I think is best : I'm good with the bottom four PoE strat for n1 only, otherwise think top 3 towncore should protect nutella on odd nights, top 4 towncore on even nights. Could mix in some of the middle of the pack to preserve some of the top towncores protects, best to adjust that as we go. On that first night, the middling PoE should use their protects on the towncore. On subsequent nights the bottom of the PoE should be protecting the towncore, with probably a double up on the very top of the towncore. Force aliens to shoot into bottom or middling Poe, or have to use two kills on even nights to kill one towncore and not even the best SPK they could get.

For simplicities sake, will lay out the first three nights :

N1 : Bottom four of the PoE assigned to protect nutella, while the next three lowest PoE protect the top 3 towncore.

N2 : Top three towncore+one middling PoE protect nutella, while the bottom three to four in the PoE protect the top 3 towncore. If four double up on the very top towncore SPK.

N3 : Top two towncore+one middling PoE protect nutella, bottom three PoE protects top three towncore.

With this we can shuffle enough to have top towncore with protects left up until late. It's a small game, so I think people are overestimating how conservative we need to be with protects. By the end of n4, there can be up to 10 deaths if the aliens succeed on both their double kills. Then n5 being an odd night needs only one towncore with a protect left alive to secure nutella's safety.


Now onto d1.

phew this is some wishy washy stuff, you partially have summarizes then try to reason your own opinion, you have a hard time to fit in
that PoE looks good if you flip it by 180 degree and keep Mac at the bottom

talk with me about Epi

[Carotenoid]

[mention]tutuu[/mention] I don't think that makes Alison town. By spending a heckload of time on the Dyslexicon case, she can pretend that she did a ton of scumhunting when in reality it's *one* read on *one* person. So not that great. I think Aliens are just more likely to do that, because town value their time/efficiency. Alison reads were Dyslexicon-Epignosis-Dragomir-? (iirc) at the beginning and now she townreads Dyslexicon-Epignosis. She also scumread MacDougall on not much things (especially considering the giant case she made on Dyslexicon and the interactions with Epignosis. For MacDougall it was basically "you're scum and lolcatting" and that's itttt) There wasn't really other reads. So hmn.

Also I feel like after her slip and MacDougall being welcomed by the thread with "sorry you're in a maf spot", the alien strategy was create chaos to make them forget and distance. I don't remember who said that Alison was like more harsh on MacDougall and that it might be w/w but +1 to that.

Also, funnily enough, who just said that MacDougall/Alison wasn't w/w?
TonyStarkPrime!
hmmmn

[Rej]

My PoE is:

Scum:
Mac
Dunya
NANOOK
Dizzy
Soneji(?)

Town:
TSP
Epi
proto
Alison
Carot(?)

I feel sure on these for now, I will go to sleep now, maybe I am here for more 15 mins or so, I haven't sorted the other 3 btw

[Carotenoid]

aaaah anyone that quote posts that are kilometers long without spoilers are evil

Therefore Rej and TonyStarkPrime are aliens.

[MacDougall]

My PoE is:

Scum:
Mac
Dunya
NANOOK
Dizzy
Soneji(?)

Town:
TSP
Epi
proto
Alison
Carot(?)

I feel sure on these for now, I will go to sleep now, maybe I am here for more 15 mins or so, I haven't sorted the other 3 btw

Do the question marks denote who your scum teammates are?

[NANOOKTHEGREATANDFEARSOME]

That’s a lot of bolding from Carot and bolding makes me nervous cause it’s aggressive

I’m scared of carot now so I’ll probably just sheep them provided their reads agree with mine

[Rej]

aaaah anyone that quote posts that are kilometers long without spoilers are evil

Therefore Rej and TonyStarkPrime are aliens.

I am so sorry I wish I could edit the spoilers in, but I am about to go to bed...

[Rej]

My PoE is:

Scum:
Mac
Dunya
NANOOK
Dizzy
Soneji(?)

Town:
TSP
Epi
proto
Alison
Carot(?)

I feel sure on these for now, I will go to sleep now, maybe I am here for more 15 mins or so, I haven't sorted the other 3 btw

Do the question marks denote who your scum teammates are?

Yes, does it help your PoE?

[TonyStarkPrime]

Spoiler: show

TonyStarkPrime

#69 #71 is his entrance to the thread. It's.. weird but okay, townread Epignosis.

Then comes a lot of mechanic talk. He proposes that bottom of POE protect, which is okay.

maybe just aliens+1 bottom names in the poe protects

Not sure what it means but okéééé?

And then this happens:

That's all of the necessary mechanics talk today.

Three people don't like space movies. These should make up the bottom of the poe.

update: two of them aren't in the game

It's a bit really underwhelming. And it's not even funny.
20 minutes later on #128, mechanic talk is back. No read on anyone, if we're kind we can give #149 as a slight scum read on protocultures, but literally the minute after he "scans" the math for a townread so not sure it's worth anything. A few hours pass.

On #246 he reacts to my scumread on Epignosis saying it's town, no read on tutuu and ignoring the Long Con part. Explanation on #261 that is not really convincing and never answers me about #280

A bit later this happens:

I also think this game is sorting very easily and day 1 hasn't started yet which is usually a bad sign

usually a bad sign = usually I'm wrong about how things are going. but I'd be happy to be right

The thing is. TonyStarkPrime didn't have any reads yet? So that means nothing. Not good.
Answers my « is this a "prepare tinfoil theory" post? » of #301 in #304 but then never answer my #307 when I question him about his reads of the moment. Second ignored question. Not good.

A few hours pass again, #536 seems a tad agressive for ?? reason.
And then we go from "mac wolf" to "unfortunately this is kinda where my head is at as well" to "I don't think drago was necessarily a wolf. drago is just drago". His position is not clear despite having a couple of consecutive messages on the same slot.

#559 suspects dunya
but in a really... Nice way? As in trying to suspect someone without it being noticed? The thing I hate about this post is that it ends with "Along these lines I think 5-6 names form an immediately available poe." But no names. And no follow-up. Not good.

#596 can be read as "suspecting Alison without suspecting Alison" which is not good too.

--

IN SUMMARY:

• He has not answered two questions that were adresse to him about his reads;
• For someone who said "enough mech talk", he has a really underwhelming number of reads;
• His only consistent read is Epignosis town and is based on a "mindset thing";
• All his other reads/positions are really meh/dodgy;
• There's a recurring scheme of pretending to think about the reads he has but that no one else know and that never translate in concrete posts/actions in the thread.

CONCLUSION:
Yeah TonyStarkPrime might definitely be an alien.

i mean omgus but "might definitely be an alien" is going to get grammar scumread pretty fast. whatever. I'll check on missed questions

Why grammar scumread? That's the only reaction you have regarding my post?
TonyStarkPrime about Soneji

Spoiler: show

soneji kinda wolf got a funny thing

Spoiler: show

Also, I'm a bunker and I'm always going to be defending nutella. Don't waste your defense on me.

That should say "Don't waste your defense on nutella."

On the multikill nights more people need to protect me though right?

I only vaguely understand the setup....

and if Epi's an alien...

On the multikill nights more people need to protect me though right?

I only vaguely understand the setup....

2 people. You'll be fine. I promise. Epi and dun got ur back gurl

This is over is an alien laser shoots nutella. That's it.

Bunkers have limited protections. After I'm spent, someone else will need to carry on in my stead (or if I get killed).

This is about setting up a network of protections so that it's clear who failed and is therefore mafia.

regardless, I think this is town

Sow doubt on Epi, then swiftly call him town anyways:hmm

We publicly make a list of who protects who. When someone dies we know who lied

okay, but I'm not going through with this unless there are at least 2 people defending Nutella and possibly 3

@linki oh yeah and bunker protects are limited. It might be best to save them until endgame and just force the poe to protect Nutella each day

The PoE are almost always going to be the ones you least want protecting the Laser.


As for the strat I think is best : I'm good with the bottom four PoE strat for n1 only, otherwise think top 3 towncore should protect nutella on odd nights, top 4 towncore on even nights. Could mix in some of the middle of the pack to preserve some of the top towncores protects, best to adjust that as we go. On that first night, the middling PoE should use their protects on the towncore. On subsequent nights the bottom of the PoE should be protecting the towncore, with probably a double up on the very top of the towncore. Force aliens to shoot into bottom or middling Poe, or have to use two kills on even nights to kill one towncore and not even the best SPK they could get.

For simplicities sake, will lay out the first three nights :

N1 : Bottom four of the PoE assigned to protect nutella, while the next three lowest PoE protect the top 3 towncore.

N2 : Top three towncore+one middling PoE protect nutella, while the bottom three to four in the PoE protect the top 3 towncore. If four double up on the very top towncore SPK.

N3 : Top two towncore+one middling PoE protect nutella, bottom three PoE protects top three towncore.

With this we can shuffle enough to have top towncore with protects left up until late. It's a small game, so I think people are overestimating how conservative we need to be with protects. By the end of n4, there can be up to 10 deaths if the aliens succeed on both their double kills. Then n5 being an odd night needs only one towncore with a protect left alive to secure nutella's safety.


Now onto d1.

I also sort of scumread the strategy given. day 1 it's just protoculture's though basically? fine I guess

I owe Carotte 5-6 names.


the >rand alien section:

Mac
Alison
Long Con
Carotte
Rej
Soneji

in roughly that order.

top to bottom least likely to most likely. Alison/Carotte probably not w/w, Alison/Mac probably not w/w. For people who think Epi is a wolf, Alison/Epi probably not w/w. maybe Alison is just town. I'll check up, see if I can cross off any other pairings

How do you go from "kinda wolf got a funny thing", "sort of scumread the strategy given" to putting Soneji as your most likely alien? What happened to dunya?

I mean in roughly that order is rough. I'd say the top three are all there. Dunya isn't there. No clue what happened really. I think her initial strategy was sort of pure, if misguided. Did I ever have dunya as a scumread? I need to keep better logs.

[MacDougall]

My PoE is:

Scum:
Mac
Dunya
NANOOK
Dizzy
Soneji(?)

Town:
TSP
Epi
proto
Alison
Carot(?)

I feel sure on these for now, I will go to sleep now, maybe I am here for more 15 mins or so, I haven't sorted the other 3 btw

Do the question marks denote who your scum teammates are?

Yes, does it help your PoE?

Yes

[TonyStarkPrime]

@tutuu I don't think that makes Alison town. By spending a heckload of time on the Dyslexicon case, she can pretend that she did a ton of scumhunting when in reality it's *one* read on *one* person. So not that great. I think Aliens are just more likely to do that, because town value their time/efficiency. Alison reads were Dyslexicon-Epignosis-Dragomir-? (iirc) at the beginning and now she townreads Dyslexicon-Epignosis. She also scumread MacDougall on not much things (especially considering the giant case she made on Dyslexicon and the interactions with Epignosis. For MacDougall it was basically "you're scum and lolcatting" and that's itttt) There wasn't really other reads. So hmn.

Also I feel like after her slip and MacDougall being welcomed by the thread with "sorry you're in a maf spot", the alien strategy was create chaos to make them forget and distance. I don't remember who said that Alison was like more harsh on MacDougall and that it might be w/w but +1 to that.

Also, funnily enough, who just said that MacDougall/Alison wasn't w/w?
TonyStarkPrime!
hmmmn

[Carotenoid]

That’s a lot of bolding from Carot and bolding makes me nervous cause it’s aggressive

I’m scared of carot now so I’ll probably just sheep them provided their reads agree with mine

Did I really scare NANOOKTHEGREATANDFEARSOME?

[TonyStarkPrime]

I like the bolding on names tbh it's nice

[Dragon D. Luffy]

[mention]bimbo[/mention] was replaced by [mention]Hally[/mention]

[TonyStarkPrime]

Hally!

[TonyStarkPrime]

are you an alien yes or no

[MacDougall]

are you an alien yes or no

Yesno Hally is townscum

[Carotenoid]

I mean in roughly that order is rough. I'd say the top three are all there. Dunya isn't there. No clue what happened really. I think her initial strategy was sort of pure, if misguided. Did I ever have dunya as a scumread? I need to keep better logs.

Am I alien just because I alienread you?

[TonyStarkPrime]

I mean in roughly that order is rough. I'd say the top three are all there. Dunya isn't there. No clue what happened really. I think her initial strategy was sort of pure, if misguided. Did I ever have dunya as a scumread? I need to keep better logs.

Am I alien just because I alienread you?

didn't I start my scumread on you with an "at risk of omgus,"?

but no, I was voting for you before. I read your champs game and it seems to have a different energy than you have here. Meta reads suck though, so I'm reconsidering.

[MacDougall]

Of course you are

[Carotenoid]

Spoiler: show

@tutuu I don't think that makes Alison town. By spending a heckload of time on the Dyslexicon case, she can pretend that she did a ton of scumhunting when in reality it's *one* read on *one* person. So not that great. I think Aliens are just more likely to do that, because town value their time/efficiency. Alison reads were Dyslexicon-Epignosis-Dragomir-? (iirc) at the beginning and now she townreads Dyslexicon-Epignosis. She also scumread MacDougall on not much things (especially considering the giant case she made on Dyslexicon and the interactions with Epignosis. For MacDougall it was basically "you're scum and lolcatting" and that's itttt) There wasn't really other reads. So hmn.

Also I feel like after her slip and MacDougall being welcomed by the thread with "sorry you're in a maf spot", the alien strategy was create chaos to make them forget and distance. I don't remember who said that Alison was like more harsh on MacDougall and that it might be w/w but +1 to that.

Also, funnily enough, who just said that MacDougall/Alison wasn't w/w?
TonyStarkPrime!
hmmmn

Hey this is not really a healthy behaviour.
Here :