Pyre Mafia [ENDGAME]

[dunya]

i promise i'll read your post and weigh in after dinner, sloons.

[Sloonei]

I’m off to work. If I die tonight then my last wish is that the interactive ISOs I would have done still get done by somebody(s) else.

[nutella]

I have a spicy take that I will hopefully remember to post by end of night in case I die

[cayvie]

"outed wolf, earlier you were saying your heart wasn't in the game. how's your heart feeling now?"

its not related to this game

its just been something ive noticed the last 5 or so games ive played

i have never lacked enthusiasm for solving as a villager before, its a scary feeling lol.

i feel good that MJ was lynched, but getting out of struggle street is a hard one

thanks for answering <3

what's scary about lacking enthusiasm, if you don't mind me asking? is playing mafia an important part of your identity?

[cayvie]

Impressive considering I forgot you were in this game at all dunya

did you really?

[DrWilgy]

Was looking over wilgy's posts for other reasons. Found this.

Voted TSP. Still don't think I'm seeing his civ game.

Could vote KZA, Jovian, Moth or OW as well at this point.

Swingin TSP feels right as it's KZA's birthday, don't wanna vote the same direction as Bronana and OW on Jovian, my Moth read is more shaky than the others and I'm doubting my OW read.

That's salad.

"I find these players suspect or relatively unimpressive" is not player salad. Out of all these players, I think KZA was the only one I hadn't expressed prior discomfort with.

Further, the logic behind potentially voting follows right after. Your claim is bad.

Inform me why I was wrong for having these people in my POE.

[Sloonei]

Was looking over wilgy's posts for other reasons. Found this.

Voted TSP. Still don't think I'm seeing his civ game.

Could vote KZA, Jovian, Moth or OW as well at this point.

Swingin TSP feels right as it's KZA's birthday, don't wanna vote the same direction as Bronana and OW on Jovian, my Moth read is more shaky than the others and I'm doubting my OW read.

That's salad.

"I find these players suspect or relatively unimpressive" is not player salad. Out of all these players, I think KZA was the only one I hadn't expressed prior discomfort with.

Further, the logic behind potentially voting follows right after. Your claim is bad.

Inform me why I was wrong for having these people in my POE.

I said none of these things. I just said it’s salad.

[DrWilgy]

Was looking over wilgy's posts for other reasons. Found this.

Voted TSP. Still don't think I'm seeing his civ game.

Could vote KZA, Jovian, Moth or OW as well at this point.

Swingin TSP feels right as it's KZA's birthday, don't wanna vote the same direction as Bronana and OW on Jovian, my Moth read is more shaky than the others and I'm doubting my OW read.

That's salad.

"I find these players suspect or relatively unimpressive" is not player salad. Out of all these players, I think KZA was the only one I hadn't expressed prior discomfort with.

Further, the logic behind potentially voting follows right after. Your claim is bad.

Inform me why I was wrong for having these people in my POE.

I said none of these things. I just said it’s salad.

Player salad has a negative context to it and don't pretend it doesn't. It implies little to no rhyme or reason.

[Sloonei]

Was looking over wilgy's posts for other reasons. Found this.

Voted TSP. Still don't think I'm seeing his civ game.

Could vote KZA, Jovian, Moth or OW as well at this point.

Swingin TSP feels right as it's KZA's birthday, don't wanna vote the same direction as Bronana and OW on Jovian, my Moth read is more shaky than the others and I'm doubting my OW read.

That's salad.

"I find these players suspect or relatively unimpressive" is not player salad. Out of all these players, I think KZA was the only one I hadn't expressed prior discomfort with.

Further, the logic behind potentially voting follows right after. Your claim is bad.

Inform me why I was wrong for having these people in my POE.

I said none of these things. I just said it’s salad.

Player salad has a negative context to it and don't pretend it doesn't. It implies little to no rhyme or reason.

I’m not pretending it does not, nor am I telling you you can’t have those players in your POE. I am making no claim other than that this is player salad. We have had posts misidentified as salad in this game, and as a connoisseur of the dish, I have an obligation to point it out when it makes an appearance. I have no larger point beyond that. The merits and meaning of “player salad” as a viable tell are a discussion to be had separately from the observation that your post fits the recipe.

I do have a larger point in my other posts, though.

[cayvie]

Asking again, wilgy, how are you feeling? You seemed despondent near the end of d1, has that changed?

[cayvie]

*d3 obviously

[Epignosis]

The thread has been locked for one hour in preparation of the commencement of Day 4.

[Epignosis]

Well met, Exiles.

Some of you think you are on the path of liberation.

And some of you know better than to drink from that well of delusion.

This time it is KZA who has been thrust into nothingness.

And so it is done.

Spoiler: show

Ti'Zo of The Dissidents has been banished!

You are a kindhearted drive imp. However, anyone hurting your friends drives you into a rage. If anyone tries to kill your target at Night, you explode, banishing yourself and the one responsible for the kill.

What a pity, Ti'Zo.

KZA was a Civilian Exile.

Carry on.


It is now Day 4. You have 48 hours to banish someone.

[dunya]

wow thanks for getting rid of one of my suspects scummers lol

Rip [mention]KZA[/mention] you're awesome I can't wait to play with you again!

[dunya]

So 2 kinda doctors and 1 bodyguard

Interesting

[bronana]

[VOTE: tonystark] aubergine

[nutella]

kza, huh

interesting


I expected to die tbh but relieved I didn't because the thread closed earlier than I realized and I never posted my hot take


spicy pizza coming up in a few

[dunya]

Long Con not on the poll again....

[nutella]

oh i just read the role

so kza wasn't the target lol ok


if you saved me ty

[nutella]

Long Con not on the poll again....

likely a host error [mention]Epignosis[/mention]

[nutella]

oh wait no

if they saved the killer would also die

so nvm that


guess they were the target

[dunya]

oh i just read the role

so kza wasn't the target lol ok


if you saved me ty

The target WAS kza. Otherwise, the scummer woul have died tood

[dunya]

[VOTE: moth] aubergine

[Epignosis]

Long Con is back on the menu. Everyone must vote again if a vote was cast.

[dunya]

Although Long Con looks mighty tasty too tbh

[outed wolf]

gg

[nutella]

Alright here it is

I do not think the following posts are made by a town Sloonei.

Lol @ mac sticking with his tinfoil on me.

So Marcher was the headlining act at EoD, but wilgy is not to be overshadowed. At the time of Marcher's explosion (implosion?), the wagons were still relatively close (I think?) and conversation had begun to turn from "Is Marcher bad?" to "Who are Marcher's teammates?" I do not have a clear answer to the question of why Marcher acted the way that they did.

But wilgy was the second wagon yesterday, and his activity in the thread follows a more quiet and level-headed path than Marcher's, but the timeline is not dissimilar. I'd previously noted that Wilgy and Marcher were not doing much to read each other despite being counterwagons to one another (A Bad Look). Towards the end of the day, but before the madness began, that suddenly changed:

Spoiler: show

@Marcher Jovian I appreciate your willingness to explain what your mindset was earlier. That's something that people have trouble doing sometimes. But I'd also like to see evidence that you are re-assessing the votes from yesterday in retrospect. Turnip Head was banished and flipped civilian. What does that mean for us on Day 3 and beyond? Specifically, what does it mean about DrWilgy?

DrWilgy is probably being defended by mafia. No one's really defending him and no one outwardly cares whether he lives or dies. It's all been circumstancial. If we just wanted to turn around and go "Let's yeet Wilgy today" and enough people agree it's gonna happen. The one qualm I have is looking at the wagons, it's Wilgy vs. Radishes (vs. Carote) d1, and it's Wilgy vs. Turnip d2. If you're mafia and you get to pick the winner, it still doesn't rule out Wilgy LHF because mafia wants Radishes dead before he can ramp up and if they're behind yeet Turnip they probably believed the claim.

Maybe I'm just overthinking things and should just sheep Ted's thoughts and vote Wilgy.

What are your thoughts regarding the shift from wagons forming on you to wagons on me? Why is this happening if you are civ? Twice now you are the third where I get put ahead of you and behind someone else.

Because I've had a mix of people either defending me or at least calling me null but with potential, while you've done basically nothing of consequence all game. When push comes to shove, the second wagon will go further than the first.

The hell does this mean?

It means I do not remember anything you've done

At 5:10 PM Eastern time, Marcher casts a vote for Wilgy.
Neither wilgy nor Marcher are very active for a while as more people plop votes down on them for a couple hours. Then at 7:26, Mac introduces the Sloonei tinfoil.
Also at 7:26, Marcher reappears to discredit the most recent point Sloonei has raised against them. Marcher had not posted for 2 hours prior to this. They returned to shade the player called Sloonei at the exact moment that Macdougall also started doing the same.
At 7:27, Doctor Wilgy also turns against Sloonei. Literally in a space of no more than 120 seconds, all three of MacDougall, Marcher Jovian, and DrWilgy have very abruptly started three independent anti-Sloonei campaigns. None of these three had been actively opposed to me prior to this. Mac and Marcher had expressed doubts on occasion, but never with much substance or conviction. Wilgy had very vocally called me a town read until now.
To be fair, Wilgy does not jump in with both feet until 20 minutes later, but I perceived that initial question as his first step in the anti-Sloon direction. Marcher's malfunction is well under way at this point, though it's not singularly focused on me yet. Wilgy's tunnel is as persistent as Marcher's from here on out:

Spoiler: show

[VOTE: Sloonei] aubergine

AND NOW THEY ARE TRYING TO DISTANCE WTF LMAO

WE NEED TO GO DO A FLASH WAGON RIGHT &^*%ING NOW

To wilgy, sure.

Bullshit. Why am I bad? Vote economics that you contributed to?

[VOTE: Sloonei] aubergine

AND NOW THEY ARE TRYING TO DISTANCE WTF LMAO

Wait what

What do you mean wait what? It actually makes alot of sense for you to be tired of saving Jovian at this point. Even your case on OW had derived from a relation with Jovian and it's really easy to read it if Jovian is your teammate and the case was a further soft defense.

i mean you’ve insisted i’m town all game until this exact moment

Yeah, and I thought you were right about Jovian until that blurp of his. You weren't right, you were saving him and putting me as the backup.

Alright everyone. Let's preform a test here.

Instructions:
Select page one
Select Sloonei's iso
Ctrl+F Jovian
Flip through a couple of pages reading the interactions

This is a team pairing. Even several of Sloonei's posts are soft defenses when they don't need to be, while at the same time I didn't see active 'I think you're wrong about Jovian.' It's always 'Let's not talk about Jovian.' and I read him as civ. Until today where his progression is opening the path for a bus and him stepping his toes into the bussing waters. Also take a look at the damned polls, Sloonei consistently is on a vote that saves Jovian and leaves me as a backup.

I'm over this game.

Just yeet me.

No one is listening to me and I'm constantly defending myself against 'Just kill Wilgy.'

sorry

who are your top 3 vilalgers and top 3 wolves?

Village is you, OW, and Dunya.

Scum is Jovian, Sloonei, and there's an argument for Carot that's not really hashed out in my head.

Recent events have harshly shifted my perception of Jovian, Sloonei and OW. Minor changes to nutella. Dunya seems to be my constant town read.

But in fairness to wilgy, he pokes his head out of the tunnel immediately after Marcher flips:

Spoiler: show

Good.

Also while I'm at it. I think TSP also has Jovian compatibility. Not sure if Sloonei has TSP compatibility.

-----------------------------------------------------
So what can we take from all of this? It is clear that Marcher had a plan which involved splashing red paint all over me for the last ~hour and a half of the day phase. It is not clear why this was the plan. But the initiation of that plan coincided with Mac and wilgy also making their own negative pushes against me. Mac's came first but was probably the least vocal. Wilgy's actually seemed the most reasonable, and if he's town a sudden paranoia that I am setting him up for a misdefenestration after bussing my partner in Marcher is not a totally unbelievable theory. But I do have qualms about it:
- The timing, obviously, is troubling. On the one hand it is still baffling to think that this was a coordinated push against me: do three mafia members all agree to step into the thread at the same exact moment and each begin to make independent pushes against the same player all at once? That's a wackier gambit than anything I've seen in a while (except maybe that time scum LC self-voted for no reason on Day 1 ), so I have trouble accepting it. And yet, that's what happened. All three of these players went from feeling lukewarm at worst about me, to making me their primary target of suspicion in unison, but none of them acted as if they were together. Note that none of them really leaned on the others for support: they all just stated their own reasons for suspecting me and pushed their angles independently. There was no mutual validation going on.
- I was nowhere near the initiation any Wilgy suspicion. He began to object when I expressed the possibility that he and Marcher are partners. I was not the first person to make this suggestion and I was responding directly to a question from bronana (my follow-up response was delayed because I was working at the time, but it was a running thought which began with that question. Bronana is a town-read). For wilgy to turn on me specifically seems a bit unnatural. Why is Sloonei the player to pin the blame on for setting him up to fall after Marcher? My voice was one in a chorus, and was one of the later ones to join. It seems arbitrary to point at me and say that I am responsible for setting him up here. This is the second day in a row that wilgy has been Wagon #2, and I was not responsible for pushing that either day.
- I was a strong town read for wilgy all game long until this exact moment. To be perfectly clear, a civilian Wilgy is allowed to change his mind about me. I suppose this point might actually belong under the "Timing" header. Call it a sub-category of that. Wilgy had accepted me as town with unprecedented ease early on in this game, and did not budge at all from that position until the end of Day 3, at the same time that others (one confirmed mafia) started doing the exact same thing. This coincided with a similar turn against Marcher, but he kind of admits that my Marcher read influenced his own and was tied to his turn. But if we consider a scenario where both Marcher and wilgy are bad, then this team is in a rough spot: no matter which way this day goes, they're losing one of their own. And to make matters worse, people do not view these wagons as mutually exclusive: a Marcher wolf flip changes nothing about the perception of Wilgy, and vice versa. They need shake things up or they're heading for a catastrophic couple of phases, which also gives the town an extended period for cohesion. All of this is bad for a Marcher/Wilgy scum team.
The most obvious step to take is to try to disrupt the perception that they can be connected. Straightforward distancing ensues. But then what? Attention is not shifted away from them if that's all that they do. So they move it somewhere else: Marcher targets Sloonei and Lissa. Wilgy targets Sloonei and Marcher (Macdougall initiates things by targeting Sloonei, but that does not necessarily need to be part of the coordination. It could have just opened the floodgates for an opportunistic play). Other than nutella, who has the benefit of a handy and verifiable roleclaim, I am probably the "vocal" player who's had the most public uncertainty surrounding them. My interactions with Marcher and my voting record are less than stellar. It might make sense to one or two civilians to push the paranoia angle and say that I am fooling everyone. Or it might look bizarre enough that people still twist themselves into pretzels over it after one of them flips. An added layer of WIFOM comes in if both Wilgy and Marcher are wolves (and yet another if Mac is also on their team). We need to wonder if they would make such a bold and potentially obvious push like this. It's a high risk with an unlikely chance of being rewarded at all (I'm unclear on how seriously y'all are considering your suspicions against me right now), and draws a direct line between them, which is theoretically the thing they were trying to avoid.

I probably need to stop writing walls of text that end on questions, but meh. I don't have a good answer to the question of whether or not the case against wilgy is strengthened or weakened by all of this. Does a mafia team that features both Wilgy and Marcher do what they did last night? Marcher's play was bizarre enough that I wouldn't rule it out (which I suppose is also why people are still able to suspect me as well), but if they're partners then they handcuffed themselves to a radiator on a sinking ship yesterday. So, like, what do we do here?

I’m off to work. If I die tonight then my last wish is that the interactive ISOs I would have done still get done by somebody(s) else.

[VOTE: sloonei] aubergine

[dunya]

That's not spicy pizza

That's turdy pizza

Bad take.

[bronana]

I've never really understood why sloonei was townread other than "he has posted a lot" tbh.

[nutella]

That's not spicy pizza

That's turdy pizza

Bad take.

Why tho


His tone is all wrong







..........*realizes that's the same thing I said about TH*


idk. I'm not sure but he feels wrong

[dunya]

Is nanook gonna keep voting wilgy till wilgy gets banished serious non sarcastic question here

[bronana]

That's not spicy pizza

That's turdy pizza

Bad take.

Why tho


His tone is all wrong







..........*realizes that's the same thing I said about TH*


idk. I'm not sure but he feels wrong

nah i agree, he's felt a bit off all game

i don't think he's been pushing wolves either

[bronana]

was there anything specific about those posts you quoted?

[Lissa]

sup

thanks nutella

[Sloonei]

Nutella’s actually half right. I was trying to fan the flames on the suspicion against me last night. I knew I wasn’t gonna have time to do interactive ISOs and needed to make it to today.

So here we are. I’m at work again right now. Tomorrow’s the 4th of July. But I will be getting those done before too long.

[Sloonei]

That said, my big meandering post about wilgy is legit. Just pontificating.

[bronana]

Nutella’s actually half right. I was trying to fan the flames on the suspicion against me last night. I knew I wasn’t gonna have time to do interactive ISOs and needed to make it to today.

So here we are. I’m at work again right now. Tomorrow’s the 4th of July. But I will be getting those done before too long.

wolfy post breaux

[Carotenoid]

hmn maybe nutella is town

[Sloonei]

Nutella’s actually half right. I was trying to fan the flames on the suspicion against me last night. I knew I wasn’t gonna have time to do interactive ISOs and needed to make it to today.

So here we are. I’m at work again right now. Tomorrow’s the 4th of July. But I will be getting those done before too long.

wolfy post breaux

It really really is not. But idc. Imma do my thing today.

[nutella]

was there anything specific about those posts you quoted?

not sure I can put it into words beyond they're just the ones that stood out to me as not sounding like sloonei's usual tone. the long ass wall post is not the style of wall post he'd normally make, in content, format, or direction. the "lol mac" was extremely unnatural and felt like a reaction to being correctly called out. the fear of dying is obviously fake.

[nutella]

Nutella’s actually half right. I was trying to fan the flames on the suspicion against me last night. I knew I wasn’t gonna have time to do interactive ISOs and needed to make it to today.

So here we are. I’m at work again right now. Tomorrow’s the 4th of July. But I will be getting those done before too long.

nah bro

[Sloonei]

I invite the suspicion, actually. It could be beneficial.

Imma do a thing once I get settled in. Nice job today, y’all.

I am too tired to do interactive ISOs tonight, sorry team.

I’m off to work. If I die tonight then my last wish is that the interactive ISOs I would have done still get done by somebody(s) else.

[Carotenoid]

Nutella’s actually half right. I was trying to fan the flames on the suspicion against me last night. I knew I wasn’t gonna have time to do interactive ISOs and needed to make it to today.

So here we are. I’m at work again right now. Tomorrow’s the 4th of July. But I will be getting those done before too long.

What do you mean Sloonei?

[bronana]

Nutella’s actually half right. I was trying to fan the flames on the suspicion against me last night. I knew I wasn’t gonna have time to do interactive ISOs and needed to make it to today.

So here we are. I’m at work again right now. Tomorrow’s the 4th of July. But I will be getting those done before too long.

wolfy post breaux

It really really is not. But idc. Imma do my thing today.

Why not just buy a talisman from the market to protect yourself from the nk if you were worried about it? "I was being suspicious on purpose" just rings false

[nutella]

I invite the suspicion, actually. It could be beneficial.

Imma do a thing once I get settled in. Nice job today, y’all.

I am too tired to do interactive ISOs tonight, sorry team.

I’m off to work. If I die tonight then my last wish is that the interactive ISOs I would have done still get done by somebody(s) else.

is this supposed to help your case because in my view it is a point against you

[dunya]

Marches has been a vocal talking point from day 0. It was always a matter of time and Sloonei isn't stupid, he would have started proper distancing from then. He had day 0, day 1, night1, day2, night2, day3 for that.

Sloonei would never agree to the eod crap yesterday. Even if he didnt agree, it was clearly chaotic stuff to disrupt us from the wilgy connection. Like not in a million worlds. I don't do wifom for sloonei either.

[dunya]

Why is moth town pls?

[NANOOKTHEGREATANDFEARSOME]

Is nanook gonna keep voting wilgy till wilgy gets banished serious non sarcastic question here

Haven’t decided yet but

I think there’s a really good chance one of sloonei/wilgy is scum after that EOD

[bronana]

Marches has been a vocal talking point from day 0. It was always a matter of time and Sloonei isn't stupid, he would have started proper distancing from then. He had day 0, day 1, night1, day2, night2, day3 for that.

Sloonei would never agree to the eod crap yesterday. Even if he didnt agree, it was clearly chaotic stuff to disrupt us from the wilgy connection. Like not in a million worlds. I don't do wifom for sloonei either.

idk your confidence in sloonei being town is weird to me. you were already this confident before marcher's flip, still are, and idgi.

Also, he did start distancing from Marcher on d3.

[dunya]

What does every one think of LC/Mac partnership WITH Marcher. Or mostly LC?