Game of Champions 2020 [ENDGAME]

[Made]

@Made what is the case against you?

i'm scummy lol

Have you been intentionally suspicious?

...yes.

[Sloonei]

@Made what is the case against you?

i'm scummy lol

Have you been intentionally suspicious?

...yes.

Why? When did you decide on this strategy?

[Thunal33]

I skimmed the first page and it was all about American football.

I jump to the present page and there's an ongoing D&D campaign.



Yep.

MR taking advantage of the less than serious state of the thread NAGL

This feels like a made up reason to scumread MR since afaik he's always pretty fluffy and I don't see how he's taking advantage of the threadstate there.

I’m sorry I drove you away hyena please come back bb ive changed I swear

Sorry. Too busy drinking more La Croix. <3 Maybe later.

I’m sorry I drove you to drinking if you come back to me I promise things will different, I won’t be toxic like I used to be

Nanook is Maf every time with this post.

In Shadow Corridors (when Falcon was town friendly 3p) he was obvtown (well, obv not mafia) pretty early on and he was aggressive in his pushes. Him pushing MR and Nanook here kind of feels like an imitation of that aggressiveness but without the prodding and more thought out reasoning he had in Shadow Corridors.

I feel like you're def playing within your scum range.


Why, MR, why?

Yeah I probably am. Why do you feel the need to keep bringing this up?

I'm worried it means you're scum

I don't think you are.

Why so cynical?

Because you're doing no more than saying like 'that's wolfy' to everyone else and the only person I recall you paying any more words to is me. And those words are just 'you're in your scumrange' which you've now brought up twice. Considering it's D0 and I'm notorious for not playing seriously this early, that's a weak read. Considering your hedgey/passive language, it's a weak read. Considering our familiarity with each other off-site, it's a weak read.

It feels like you want to appear solvy by going after a CDC buddy who has done nothing but mess about so far.

I'll grant you the hedgey/passive language, but the rest is pure poppycock.

It's your nonchalance that reminds me of a recent scum game of yours on CDC. Your nonchalance has a different flavour when you're town.

Your umbrage makes me think I'm onto something.

What's Falcon's track record for reading MR? Because this seems like partner interaction especially if Falcon is good at reading MR.

I disagree cuz I'm a unique individual with my own thoughts and interpretation of events

What is your unique interpretation and why do you have it?

Well I can't say that my interpretation is unique, as others may have it, I know not.


Alison is wolf. Her 3P claim a gambit that other players will look at her claim and think to themselves "no way Maf would do that", as you yourself have already said.


Michelle is wolf cuz she made up her read on Essoa, who isn't playing. Ya, I know what she said, its a mixup from other games she's involved in, but I don't buy it

I dislike how these are Falcon's wolfreads because they're for surface level and somewhat invalid reasons. I feel like Falcon especially didn't think through Alison's 3p claim.

[VOTE: Falcon] aubergine

[tutuu]

tutuu:

- you get the ability the following night after i bargain. So if I bargain for bus driver with someone n1 they can start bus driving n2

- thieving role steals abilities for 1 phase. So if you end day 2 voting for the tracker, then n2 you get a tracker ability. n3 you lose the tracker ability but gain an ability from whoever you voted d3, etc.

thanks!

okay, i dont want towncore people to be making deals with alison yet then, it will go to waste

i think we should form a consensus on light green town leans and go with that

im afraid of giving a self-targetting bus driver to someone who's null for everyone like long con or dizzy or w/e

towncore where are we on this? @MacDougall do u still scumread me? @nutella @Sloonei who are our consensus light green townreads

[Made]

made/jpic probably w/w yolo

if were to w/w yolo here it'd be with Nanook.

gotta commit to the bit

speaking of which I should probably bus here
[VOTE: Nanook] aubergine

[Thunal33]

Do we think mafia would be scared of Alison's 3p claim? Would mafia be more or less likely to vote Alison than town?

[MacDougall]

tutuu:

- you get the ability the following night after i bargain. So if I bargain for bus driver with someone n1 they can start bus driving n2

- thieving role steals abilities for 1 phase. So if you end day 2 voting for the tracker, then n2 you get a tracker ability. n3 you lose the tracker ability but gain an ability from whoever you voted d3, etc.

thanks!

okay, i dont want towncore people to be making deals with alison yet then, it will go to waste

i think we should form a consensus on light green town leans and go with that

im afraid of giving a self-targetting bus driver to someone who's null for everyone like long con or dizzy or w/e

towncore where are we on this? @MacDougall do u still scumread me? @nutella @Sloonei who are our consensus light green townreads

i dunno if i do or i do not i am fucky in the brainial

[Made]

@Made what is the case against you?

i'm scummy lol

Have you been intentionally suspicious?

...yes.

Why? When did you decide on this strategy?

here

J's being helpful, I don't trust it

but i really committed to the bit here

[nutella]

hm. I don't think falcon's radish read was fake or forced, but I can see the issue with the alison+michelle post. I mindmelded with him on the dumb nanook take lmao.

What made you go digging for reasons to vote falcon, thunal?

[Made]

Do we think mafia would be scared of Alison's 3p claim? Would mafia be more or less likely to vote Alison than town?

less likely if they believe the claim, more likely if they don't.

[Sloonei]

tutuu:

- you get the ability the following night after i bargain. So if I bargain for bus driver with someone n1 they can start bus driving n2

- thieving role steals abilities for 1 phase. So if you end day 2 voting for the tracker, then n2 you get a tracker ability. n3 you lose the tracker ability but gain an ability from whoever you voted d3, etc.

thanks!

okay, i dont want towncore people to be making deals with alison yet then, it will go to waste

i think we should form a consensus on light green town leans and go with that

im afraid of giving a self-targetting bus driver to someone who's null for everyone like long con or dizzy or w/e

towncore where are we on this? @MacDougall do u still scumread me? @nutella @Sloonei who are our consensus light green townreads

I’m a little too out of it to answer this right now. Remind me later and I’ll say words about stuff.

[Thunal33]

hm. I don't think falcon's radish read was fake or forced, but I can see the issue with the alison+michelle post. I mindmelded with him on the dumb nanook take lmao.

What made you go digging for reasons to vote falcon, thunal?

I remembered being suspicious of him for sort of imitating aggressiveness so I chose to ISO dive him and found him more suspicious on ISO.

[nutella]

tutuu:

- you get the ability the following night after i bargain. So if I bargain for bus driver with someone n1 they can start bus driving n2

- thieving role steals abilities for 1 phase. So if you end day 2 voting for the tracker, then n2 you get a tracker ability. n3 you lose the tracker ability but gain an ability from whoever you voted d3, etc.

thanks!

okay, i dont want towncore people to be making deals with alison yet then, it will go to waste

i think we should form a consensus on light green town leans and go with that

im afraid of giving a self-targetting bus driver to someone who's null for everyone like long con or dizzy or w/e

towncore where are we on this? @MacDougall do u still scumread me? @nutella @Sloonei who are our consensus light green townreads

I'm with you on 112/wilgy/marmot

[nutella]

made/jpic probably w/w yolo

if were to w/w yolo here it'd be with Nanook.

gotta commit to the bit

speaking of which I should probably bus here
[VOTE: Nanook] aubergine

lol

[tutuu]

alright @Alison for now 112/wilgy/marmot pool please, we will keep u updated!

[nutella]

hm. I don't think falcon's radish read was fake or forced, but I can see the issue with the alison+michelle post. I mindmelded with him on the dumb nanook take lmao.

What made you go digging for reasons to vote falcon, thunal?

I remembered being suspicious of him for sort of imitating aggressiveness so I chose to ISO dive him and found him more suspicious on ISO.

hm. I didn't get the impression he was faking any pushes

[Thunal33]

I also kind of feel like MR is scum because of Nut's read and the "suspected for the wrong reasons" feeling I got when he was under suspicion but I haven't done that ISO dive yet so I can't articulate that read quite as well.

[Alison]

alright @Alison for now 112/wilgy/marmot pool please, we will keep u updated!

acknowledged!

[Thunal33]

alright @Alison for now 112/wilgy/marmot pool please, we will keep u updated!

I'm fine with that.

[nutella]

I also kind of feel like MR is scum because of Nut's read and the "suspected for the wrong reasons" feeling I got when he was under suspicion but I haven't done that ISO dive yet so I can't articulate that read quite as well.

I saw you had some read that he and falcon were teammates but I didn't follow your logic. Falcon seemed to dig pretty deep into the push there and I'm more inclined to think he's town with a good read.

[Thunal33]

My issue with Nutella here is that I've had basically no content as is normal for me, and yet somehow she's giving a pass to other posters with similar reps (Nanook, Wilgy, et al) and apparently can't formulate any better reads on people with far more content. I am her *only* wolf read, and all I've done is shitpost as usual. My one bit of content, at a stretch, is a mild and brief back and forth with falcon where I felt he was being hedgey and forcing a push on me (and I stand by that, though I don't know it's AI for him) and that's apaprently enough to have her decide I am not only a wolf but her *only* wolf so far.

It's an opportunistic nudge and she's not disguising it well enough.

My issue with Nutella here is that I've had basically no content as is normal for me, and yet somehow she's giving a pass to other posters with similar reps (Nanook, Wilgy, et al) and apparently can't formulate any better reads on people with far more content. I am her *only* wolf read, and all I've done is shitpost as usual. My one bit of content, at a stretch, is a mild and brief back and forth with falcon where I felt he was being hedgey and forcing a push on me (and I stand by that, though I don't know it's AI for him) and that's apaprently enough to have her decide I am not only a wolf but her *only* wolf so far.

It's an opportunistic nudge and she's not disguising it well enough.

i mean keep in mind, baddies have incentive to baddie hut. There are multiple balls in play



mine is red this game

That's fine - I'm not saying I'm obv town yet or anything.

I'm just pointing out Nutella is likely a wolf.

Okay this interaction I found suspicious for MR. It reminds me of a wolf omgusing on a target that doesn't actually make sense. I find it hard to believe that MR genuinely wolfreads Nutella considering how clearly town she is today, I think he's using his annoyance at being treated unfairly to make a push that sounds more believable since he has real emotion behind it. I know I've done that as mafia even when my target didn't make sense and I know others have done that.

[tutuu]

i still think thunal is still town personally, i would go as far as to say that she is within her town meta, not that i know her scum meta, but if she is scum i think she's replicating her town game very accurately

[Thunal33]

I also kind of feel like MR is scum because of Nut's read and the "suspected for the wrong reasons" feeling I got when he was under suspicion but I haven't done that ISO dive yet so I can't articulate that read quite as well.

I saw you had some read that he and falcon were teammates but I didn't follow your logic. Falcon seemed to dig pretty deep into the push there and I'm more inclined to think he's town with a good read.

I don't usually make teammate reads but the way they went at each other for a bit then just both went their own ways feels like distancing.

[Thunal33]

[VOTE: Master Radishes] aubergine

[Kylemii]

@nutella? @Hyena? same question

what?

what's the case against you?

[Kylemii]

i will do anything to avoid reading the last 20 pages

[nutella]

I guess. I don't like that falcon voted alison, but I think he's still floating radish as a top suspect at least

[Kylemii]

at least until tomorrow

[nutella]

@nutella? @Hyena? same question

what?

what's the case against you?

idk. some people thought i was opportunistic? there might have been something else to it earlier, like i was lacking in some spark or something but i dont feel like that's true at all

[nutella]

[VOTE: master radishes] aubergine

lettuce see where this goes

still in favor of made wagon as well

[Kylemii]

oppofgungiosgic about what

[Made]

is omgus typically a town thing or a mafia thing? if it's a mafia thing, it's something that wouldn't be effected too much by the whole 2 teams dynamics, which makes it a really reliable way to scum hunt compared to finding people scum based on their reads. Shitty reads probably isn't the way to find scum until we think we've hit a pair

[MacDougall]

is omgus typically a town thing or a mafia thing? if it's a mafia thing, it's something that wouldn't be effected too much by the whole 2 teams dynamics, which makes it a really reliable way to scum hunt compared to finding people scum based on their reads. Shitty reads probably isn't the way to find scum until we think we've hit a pair

nai

[Made]

@Hyena you don't have to omgus me anymore, vote somewhere else please

[Made]

is omgus typically a town thing or a mafia thing? if it's a mafia thing, it's something that wouldn't be effected too much by the whole 2 teams dynamics, which makes it a really reliable way to scum hunt compared to finding people scum based on their reads. Shitty reads probably isn't the way to find scum until we think we've hit a pair

nai

lame

[Thunal33]

is omgus typically a town thing or a mafia thing? if it's a mafia thing, it's something that wouldn't be effected too much by the whole 2 teams dynamics, which makes it a really reliable way to scum hunt compared to finding people scum based on their reads. Shitty reads probably isn't the way to find scum until we think we've hit a pair

Depends on the reasoning and the circumstances.

[Kylemii]

@made why are you suspect

[Kylemii]

wait i already asked you, forget beam

[Made]

yo, how does town normally win multiball set ups?

like when town wins is it normaly just mafia dogging it out and town surviving or Towncore flanking both sides? what's the trick here? Ofc town always needs to baddie hunt or w/e but so do the wolves. What does town need to do that scum doesn't?

[MacDougall]

yo, how does town normally win multiball set ups?

like when town wins is it normaly just mafia dogging it out and town surviving or Towncore flanking both sides? what's the trick here? Ofc town always needs to baddie hunt or w/e but so do the wolves. What does town need to do that scum doesn't?

Hardly ever. What I've seen generally one of the teams crushes the other team first and then the members of that team are too well entrenched in town core by then to get rutted out before they're too close to wincon.

This game is probably going to be solved during night phases with smart use of night actions (and not outing yourself to be soup killed ffs). Town will need to be very mindful not to give the mafia teams any advantages, and to be ruthlessly cynical in this game. Towncoring and POE style hunting won't work anywhere near as well here. Town need to make themselves extremely hard to kill and be very smart with their night abilities.

I cannot stress enough, remember that the mafia can scum hunt, so Nutella "being out of her range" or townreading people like Sloo for engaging his townie self is not good enough reasons to town read them here. It doesn't mean they're auto mafia, but they can't be cleared for things that might ordinarily clear them. Same goes for everyone.

Faking reads is NAI in multiball so you can't catch mafia for it. Mafia are however aware of that so if you see people stuck in the mindset of hunting that way (and similar) it's >rand town in multiball. Town will mindset slip themselves town by being caught thinking like they're not in multiball. It has already happened several times.

Sharing PR reads, encouraging town to out themselves as PR, being overtly townie, making readslists, making cases. This is ALL bad here.

In fact content in the thread during the day that is AI is actually anti town. I mean that. This game should be a night action spectacle.

All of that is assuming we are indeed in multiball mind you (we are, because I don't have enough good scumreads, which means the mafia are hunting mafia).

[Syn]

yo, how does town normally win multiball set ups?

like when town wins is it normaly just mafia dogging it out and town surviving or Towncore flanking both sides? what's the trick here? Ofc town always needs to baddie hunt or w/e but so do the wolves. What does town need to do that scum doesn't?

I've played one multiball and it involved Askthepizzaguy single-handedly bending both wolf teams over

[Thunal33]

is omgus typically a town thing or a mafia thing? if it's a mafia thing, it's something that wouldn't be effected too much by the whole 2 teams dynamics, which makes it a really reliable way to scum hunt compared to finding people scum based on their reads. Shitty reads probably isn't the way to find scum until we think we've hit a pair

nai

lame

Why did you intentionally play scummy?

[MacDougall]

Our best chance of actually killing mafia in multiball is mafia killing mafia, whether by scum hunting each other, or by night killing each other. As town your first priority should be to simply make yourself hard to kill. Low profile to dodge NKs and don't be needlessly scummy.

[Made]

is omgus typically a town thing or a mafia thing? if it's a mafia thing, it's something that wouldn't be effected too much by the whole 2 teams dynamics, which makes it a really reliable way to scum hunt compared to finding people scum based on their reads. Shitty reads probably isn't the way to find scum until we think we've hit a pair

nai

lame

Why did you intentionally play scummy?

Trying to increase my town range

[MacDougall]

yo, how does town normally win multiball set ups?

like when town wins is it normaly just mafia dogging it out and town surviving or Towncore flanking both sides? what's the trick here? Ofc town always needs to baddie hunt or w/e but so do the wolves. What does town need to do that scum doesn't?

I've played one multiball and it involved Askthepizzaguy single-handedly bending both wolf teams over

Yeah like that doesn't surprise me. It was probably an MU game and the mafia were probably mostly memesters that prefer playing mashes and turbos. This is the GoC.

[Kylemii]

In fact content in the thread during the day that is AI is actually anti town. I mean that. This game should be a night action spectacle.

I've been training my whole life for this

[Made]

I mean I guess it makes sense to have a game biased towards scum as GOC. Make things tough for town on a very strong town website.

[Sloonei]

yo, how does town normally win multiball set ups?

like when town wins is it normaly just mafia dogging it out and town surviving or Towncore flanking both sides? what's the trick here? Ofc town always needs to baddie hunt or w/e but so do the wolves. What does town need to do that scum doesn't?

I've played one multiball and it involved Askthepizzaguy single-handedly bending both wolf teams over

Yeah like that doesn't surprise me. It was probably an MU game and the mafia were probably mostly memesters that prefer playing mashes and turbos. This is the GoC.

This is a No Meme Zone.

[MacDougall]

Think about it like this.

Mafia night kills are hardly ever rand. Either they will kill people who are threatening their existence (SPK) or they will PR hunt. The mafia's biggest threats in this game are the other mafia team. While ever the other mafia team exists, their game can end in a flash. So they want to kill the other team more than they want to kill town (at the start). In actuality the town faction in multiball setups on this website have tended towards looking more like large allied 3p survivors as the game has progressed, and tend towards ending up mech unable to win at a reasonably early stage of the game, often becoming knowing or unknowing kingmakers.

Those who raise their hand and push hard on wolves in this setup, LOOK like wolves to the other wolf team, even if they are not. The simple fact of being able to see a wolf makes you >rand wolf in this setup because you are in the same mindset, so you can see reflections of yourself in your opponents. Good wolves know this. These players will be among the first to die. The mafia will tend towards reading players who are hard scumreading players outside their team as town, and will tend to not mess with those players.

As town, sheep the cases you like, keep a low profile, try as best as you can to live through a phase and see where it gets you. That's my rec.

[Made]

Ight bet. I think town might still have this, it’s gonna be messy tho. Everyone read macs post and figure out what you have to do to win

@Alison add Mac