Game of Champions 2020 [ENDGAME]

[Kylemii]

I'll offer disenfranchisement (wipe someone's vote) to Michelle tonight. Again, no reason for me not to. Just letting you know in advance

it's really up to you obviously but lost restriction would probably be less dangerous in this game state I think :0

[Alison]

I'll offer disenfranchisement (wipe someone's vote) to Michelle tonight. Again, no reason for me not to. Just letting you know in advance

it's really up to you obviously but lost restriction would probably be less dangerous in this game state I think :0

Already gave that to Made.

[Dyslexicon]

Syn?

?

?

[Dyslexicon]

I think we still yeet nobody?

[tutuu]

kyle can u steal michelle's power coz i think she's gonna use it on me tomorrow

[Alison]

nope, I don't think so

Oh, I thought he was, but I can't keep track. In that case, Alison still makes some sense here. And then it also makes sense HK with a useless power died in front of me and LC.

This argument is bad.

Mafia has strong incentive not to kill off my bargainees because I said I was protecting them. Mafia has strong incentive not to piss me off because there's a decent chance I'll be a kingmaker during F3 if they survive that long. You're also assuming that I'll only target non-bargainees if I inherited the mafia kill (which is not a mechanic I've ever seen on the syndicate btw, and didn't happen in radiohead, shadow corridors where the original Gambit Demon occurred, etc.). If I was a hostile 3P here it would make more sense to kill off investigatives even if they're bargainees, because then the rest of the town has no way to get mech info on each other and will eat themselves until I win anyway.

[Justplayingitcool]

kyle can u steal michelle's power coz i think she's gonna use it on me tomorrow

kyle has already tried stealing michelle's power

[Justplayingitcool]

@Kylemii

why did you hide tutuu again when LC said he wasn't going to use his ability?

[tutuu]

nope, I don't think so

Oh, I thought he was, but I can't keep track. In that case, Alison still makes some sense here. And then it also makes sense HK with a useless power died in front of me and LC.

This argument is bad.

Mafia has strong incentive not to kill off my bargainees because I said I was protecting them. Mafia has strong incentive not to piss me off because there's a decent chance I'll be a kingmaker during F3 if they survive that long. You're also assuming that I'll only target non-bargainees if I inherited the mafia kill (which is not a mechanic I've ever seen on the syndicate btw, and didn't happen in radiohead, shadow corridors where the original Gambit Demon occurred, etc.). If I was a hostile 3P here it would make more sense to kill off investigatives even if they're bargainees, because then the rest of the town has no way to get mech info on each other and will eat themselves until I win anyway.

thats only if ur a hostile 3p with the "last woman standing" wincon

if ur a hostile 3p that said the truth about ur wincon then ur incentivized to kill non-bargainees and win the game today/tomorrow

[tutuu]

kyle can u steal michelle's power coz i think she's gonna use it on me tomorrow

kyle has already tried stealing michelle's power

wot? it didnt work? why not? when did he try?

[Justplayingitcool]

i believe alison, sue me

[Dyslexicon]

This argument is bad.

Mafia has strong incentive not to kill off my bargainees because I said I was protecting them. Mafia has strong incentive not to piss me off because there's a decent chance I'll be a kingmaker during F3 if they survive that long. You're also assuming that I'll only target non-bargainees if I inherited the mafia kill (which is not a mechanic I've ever seen on the syndicate btw, and didn't happen in radiohead, shadow corridors where the original Gambit Demon occurred, etc.). If I was a hostile 3P here it would make more sense to kill off investigatives even if they're bargainees, because then the rest of the town has no way to get mech info on each other and will eat themselves until I win anyway.

The arguments for anyone being scum here are pretty bad.

In any case, we will know way more tomorrow if we just don't yeet.

[Dyslexicon]

i believe alison, sue me

Who do you not believe?

[Justplayingitcool]

kyle can u steal michelle's power coz i think she's gonna use it on me tomorrow

kyle has already tried stealing michelle's power

wot? it didnt work? why not? when did he try?

A few days/nights ago. I guess it didn't work because it is technically a day ability

[tutuu]

i believe alison, sue me

then whos evil lol

[Justplayingitcool]

i believe alison, sue me

Who do you not believe?

Nobody

[tutuu]

at least 1 person AMONG US is LYING cuz ppl are DYING

[tutuu]

and its NOT ME

who is it?

i suggest we all close our eyes and whoever is the evil doer to raise their hand. we will close our eyes so they are incentivized to raise their hand coz they will be safe.

[Alison]

nope, I don't think so

Oh, I thought he was, but I can't keep track. In that case, Alison still makes some sense here. And then it also makes sense HK with a useless power died in front of me and LC.

This argument is bad.

Mafia has strong incentive not to kill off my bargainees because I said I was protecting them. Mafia has strong incentive not to piss me off because there's a decent chance I'll be a kingmaker during F3 if they survive that long. You're also assuming that I'll only target non-bargainees if I inherited the mafia kill (which is not a mechanic I've ever seen on the syndicate btw, and didn't happen in radiohead, shadow corridors where the original Gambit Demon occurred, etc.). If I was a hostile 3P here it would make more sense to kill off investigatives even if they're bargainees, because then the rest of the town has no way to get mech info on each other and will eat themselves until I win anyway.

thats only if ur a hostile 3p with the "last woman standing" wincon

if ur a hostile 3p that said the truth about ur wincon then ur incentivized to kill non-bargainees and win the game today/tomorrow

If I'm a hostile 3P that said the truth about my wincon then I still win if I kill investigative bargainees because town will eat themselves with no mech info I'll win by having Kyle alive at the end of the game. Or even play as "last woman standing" and win with 1 bargainee (myself) to 0. In contrast if I leave investigatives alive just because they're bargainees then they'll mech solve the game and I'll get exed out of paranoia.

If you wanna call it WIFOM go ahead but don't pretend like "HK killed -> Alison is hostile 3P", that makes no sense.

[Dyslexicon]

Syn is the one who is the least present and feels the most out of synch feelings wise. I don't know if that means anything, but it could. He also quickly had a reason for calling both Wilgy's and Michelle's action scum motivated when I questioned how it would make sense as scum.

That's my biggest case on Syn.

Which may be my biggest case. And if it's Syn, we know tomorrow.

[Dyslexicon]

Mafia missing the kill would probably be grand for them, is the ironic thing. I would probably be in a jpic paranoia hell right now if so, since I blocked him.

[Dyslexicon]

I guess ....

.... it's Syn?

[tutuu]

SYNNNNNNNNNNNNNNN WAS IT YOU ALL ALONG????? I KNEW IT WAS YOU @Syn

[Dyslexicon]

Or it's LC who had protection from Kyle's investigation in one way or another. And he lied about Ted's targets (for some reason). That would also make Wilgy getting my role make sense. Which is, as far as I know, the only missing piece of the puzzle. (If we don't count the mystery of why we spend our time torturing our brains like this in the first place..)

I mean... we're really grasping at straws here, I feel.

[Hyena]

I just had a thought. @Dyslexicon How much do you trust Kyle right now?

[Dyslexicon]

@Long Con Why did you decide to track Tutu btw?

[Dyslexicon]

I just had a thought. @Dyslexicon How much do you trust Kyle right now?

Probably the most of all. He literally killed Nanook and outed Ted.

[Hyena]

Kyle's the one who's doing the bargaining for Alison now, correct? And he's also responsible for Tutuu being off the polls, right?

[Alison]

If you exe a non bargainee and hit mafia, I lose 4/4, unless tutuu accepts my bargain.

If you no exe and mafia kills a bargainee, and they're outed tomorrow like has been planned, I lose 3/4 even if mafia is a non-bargainee.

If you no exe and mafia kills a non bargainee and is outed, I win 4/3 if they're a non bargainee.

If you exe a non bargainee and hit town, and mafia kills a non bargainee, I win 4/3.

If you exe a non bargainee and hit town and mafia kills a bargainee I lose.

So no matter what I should rand my protect between bargainees (probably weighted by how juicy a kill they are for mafia) tonight. If tutuu would kindly accept my bargain, I have more assurance of winning, otherwise my win condition is essentially determined by the actions of other people (if you choose to exe/nightkill bargainees or non bargainees)

[Hyena]

I just had a thought. @Dyslexicon How much do you trust Kyle right now?

Probably the most of all. He literally killed Nanook and outed Ted.

How scumread was Nanook at the time he died? If I recall correctly, Nanook was a top wagon the day before at one point and was heavily scumread? Should we be giving Kyle a lot of towncred for that?

[Dyslexicon]

Kyle's the one who's doing the bargaining for Alison now, correct? And he's also responsible for Tutuu being off the polls, right?

Kyle only bargained with Alison once from stealing her role, I think. Alison is the one doing the bargaining.

And yeah, Kyle removed Tutu from the poll today. To be fair, Tutu is green checked.

[Alison]

I'm gonna be kinda tilted if we no exe, mafia shoots a bargainee and is outed and I lose after carrying the town as 3P.

[Dyslexicon]

How scumread was Nanook at the time he died? If I recall correctly, Nanook was a top wagon the day before at one point and was heavily scumread? Should we be giving Kyle a lot of towncred for that?

Yes. I give Kyle a lot of town cred for that.
I also think Kyle has been super towny in all reactions all game. His checks on LC and Tutu follows a progression as well. It's not just something he made up to get Ted, he softed it all the days leading up to that. Kyle is probably the last person I'd go for here.

[Justplayingitcool]

I just had a thought. @Dyslexicon How much do you trust Kyle right now?

Probably the most of all. He literally killed Nanook and outed Ted.

How scumread was Nanook at the time he died? If I recall correctly, Nanook was a top wagon the day before at one point and was heavily scumread? Should we be giving Kyle a lot of towncred for that?

He was close to being chopped at one point that day phase. A few people including myself asked for him to be shot

[Hyena]

Kyle's the one who's doing the bargaining for Alison now, correct? And he's also responsible for Tutuu being off the polls, right?

Kyle only bargained with Alison once from stealing her role, I think. Alison is the one doing the bargaining.

And yeah, Kyle removed Tutu from the poll today. To be fair, Tutu is green checked.

Oh, so it was only for that one night?

@Alison Can you confirm this? Are you back to directly making bargains with people, or does Kyle permanently have that power now?

[Hyena]

How scumread was Nanook at the time he died? If I recall correctly, Nanook was a top wagon the day before at one point and was heavily scumread? Should we be giving Kyle a lot of towncred for that?

Yes. I give Kyle a lot of town cred for that.
I also think Kyle has been super towny in all reactions all game. His checks on LC and Tutu follows a progression as well. It's not just something he made up to get Ted, he softed it all the days leading up to that. Kyle is probably the last person I'd go for here.

Okay, okay. I actually did forget he was the one responsible for finding Ted.

[Dyslexicon]

If you exe a non bargainee and hit mafia, I lose 4/4, unless tutuu accepts my bargain.

If you no exe and mafia kills a bargainee, and they're outed tomorrow like has been planned, I lose 3/4 even if mafia is a non-bargainee.

If you no exe and mafia kills a non bargainee and is outed, I win 4/3 if they're a non bargainee.

If you exe a non bargainee and hit town, and mafia kills a non bargainee, I win 4/3.

If you exe a non bargainee and hit town and mafia kills a bargainee I lose.

So no matter what I should rand my protect between bargainees (probably weighted by how juicy a kill they are for mafia) tonight. If tutuu would kindly accept my bargain, I have more assurance of winning, otherwise my win condition is essentially determined by the actions of other people (if you choose to exe/nightkill bargainees or non bargainees)

If we bag a mafia via mech, we could easily just not exe them until you have enough bargainees as a thank you. I'm totally for that. By then we know you are not the one we are looking for 100 %. You also still have a protect.

[tutuu]

@Alison if i accept ur bargain today and we yeet non-bargainee mafia today we all win

so help us find the mafia and i accept ur bargain?

[Alison]

Kyle's the one who's doing the bargaining for Alison now, correct? And he's also responsible for Tutuu being off the polls, right?

Kyle only bargained with Alison once from stealing her role, I think. Alison is the one doing the bargaining.

And yeah, Kyle removed Tutu from the poll today. To be fair, Tutu is green checked.

Oh, so it was only for that one night?

@Alison Can you confirm this? Are you back to directly making bargains with people, or does Kyle permanently have that power now?

Yeah, I choose the bargains now.

[Dyslexicon]

So it has come to this. Syn and LC are not my top suspects. And by top suspects, I mean about a 3 on the scummometer. =p

[Hyena]

Kyle's the one who's doing the bargaining for Alison now, correct? And he's also responsible for Tutuu being off the polls, right?

Kyle only bargained with Alison once from stealing her role, I think. Alison is the one doing the bargaining.

And yeah, Kyle removed Tutu from the poll today. To be fair, Tutu is green checked.

Oh, so it was only for that one night?

@Alison Can you confirm this? Are you back to directly making bargains with people, or does Kyle permanently have that power now?

Yeah, I choose the bargains now.

Okay, okay. Thanks.

Well, there goes another theory, lol.

[Dyslexicon]

Alison, I understand that this is super annoying if everything is as you say.

But please understand that town is also in a real bind here. And as I see it, we have the tools to be extra careful if we just chose to.

[Justplayingitcool]

@Alison if i accept ur bargain today and we yeet non-bargainee mafia today we all win

so help us find the mafia and i accept ur bargain?

i don't think you should accept as power is useless

[Hyena]

So it has come to this. Syn and LC are not my top suspects. And by top suspects, I mean about a 3 on the scummometer. =p

Of those two, I'm heavily leaning towards LC being more town. With that said, I plan on rereading at the very least Syn's ISO later tonight.

[tutuu]

@Alison if i accept ur bargain today and we yeet non-bargainee mafia today we all win

so help us find the mafia and i accept ur bargain?

i don't think you should accept as power is useless

the power doesnt matter? its about whether we trust alison and increase her chance to win or we distrust alison and decrease her chance to win

didnt u just say u trust alison

[Alison]

@Alison if i accept ur bargain today and we yeet non-bargainee mafia today we all win

so help us find the mafia and i accept ur bargain?

Fine.

Non bargainee mafia we can exe today are michelle, syn, hyena, JPIC.

JPIC only scum if ninja or if there's 2.

Michelle not scum unless the scum team is crazy.

Syn we have no mech on iirc.

I can't remember the mech on Hyena but I think there was some.

[Justplayingitcool]

@Alison if i accept ur bargain today and we yeet non-bargainee mafia today we all win

so help us find the mafia and i accept ur bargain?

i don't think you should accept as power is useless

the power doesnt matter? its about whether we trust alison and increase her chance to win or we distrust alison and decrease her chance to win

didnt u just say u trust alison

i do, but I don't think we should as there isn't incentive for town. If it was a doc then go for it

[tutuu]

this is why i hate 3ps i abhor kingmaker-esque situations like this where win conditions can be dubious and its up to people to bargain and plea about giving the win to who or what and stuff

[Alison]

You also don't lose anything by it and you avoid screwing me over after I helped you out. Like if I help you catch the mafia today, you exe them and she doesn't accept then I lost despite heavily townsiding and that would be a dick move.

[Justplayingitcool]

@Alison if i accept ur bargain today and we yeet non-bargainee mafia today we all win

so help us find the mafia and i accept ur bargain?

Fine.

Non bargainee mafia we can exe today are michelle, syn, hyena, JPIC.

JPIC only scum if ninja or if there's 2.

Michelle not scum unless the scum team is crazy.

Syn we have no mech on iirc.

I can't remember the mech on Hyena but I think there was some.

If I'm a ninja, I would have to be in a team of two. I outed I was roleblocked before dizzy claimed and there was still a kill.