Fargo Mafia [Game Ends]

[BoKnows]

kza up to dirty tricks

[Long Con]

Kill Villagers Always

[Long Con]

oh damn it's a Z

[Strawhenge]

@BoKnows and @Long Con, are you guys not scum or not town? It's okay to tell me, I'll keep a secret.

[Long Con]

@BoKnows and @Long Con, are you guys not scum or not town? It's okay to tell me, I'll keep a secret.

How do I know I can trust you with that information?

[Strawhenge]

@BoKnows and @Long Con, are you guys not scum or not town? It's okay to tell me, I'll keep a secret.

How do I know I can trust you with that information?

Look at my face. Would this face lie to you?

[Hally]

i finished iso’ing oddmerta and have confirmed that he doesn’t have a single villagery thought or post in his iso. there is nothing i can point to and go “odd is trying to solve the game.” the few reads he’s given look fake. his tone/attitude could perhaps be construed as villagery but i think they’re just his personality and NAI. i don’t see any reason why he’s a villager

[BoKnows]

@BoKnows and @Long Con, are you guys not scum or not town? It's okay to tell me, I'll keep a secret.

pinky promise not to tell anyone? if you do check the spoiler!!! NO ONE ELSE CHECK THE SPOILER

► Show Spoiler

deez nuts

[Sloonei]

i finished iso’ing oddmerta and have confirmed that he doesn’t have a single villagery thought or post in his iso. there is nothing i can point to and go “odd is trying to solve the game.” the few reads he’s given look fake. his tone/attitude could perhaps be construed as villagery but i think they’re just his personality and NAI. i don’t see any reason why he’s a villager

@Oddmerta should respond to this

[BoKnows]

i finished iso’ing oddmerta and have confirmed that he doesn’t have a single villagery thought or post in his iso. there is nothing i can point to and go “odd is trying to solve the game.” the few reads he’s given look fake. his tone/attitude could perhaps be construed as villagery but i think they’re just his personality and NAI. i don’t see any reason why he’s a villager

thank you.

[Strawhenge]

i finished iso’ing oddmerta and have confirmed that he doesn’t have a single villagery thought or post in his iso. there is nothing i can point to and go “odd is trying to solve the game.” the few reads he’s given look fake. his tone/attitude could perhaps be construed as villagery but i think they’re just his personality and NAI. i don’t see any reason why he’s a villager

Interesting. When I looked at him when he was leading in votes on D1 (or tied with KZA at the time, I forget), nothing screamed town but I also couldn't see any reason to call him scum. I should take another look.

P.S. What's 'NAI'?

[BoKnows]

nai = not alignment indictiveteive

[Sloonei]

Well that's a hell of a way to start a new page! Yeehaw!

Tell me about Oddmerta, ted and Esooa.

i thought his first few posts were pretty wolfy when i was itt

afaict he has trouble finding an actual tunnel for genuine reasons and from his iso I can't glean that he's actually reading the thread and assessing stuff like a villager would

from the few games we've played, i don't expect him to talk about someone like sloonei being scum and then voting somebody random like jpic, he seems to me more like the theory conspiracy guy. doesn't seem like he's using his votes in order to gather INTEL from his scum reads (especially sloonei)

the LC read I believe was straight up stolen from spf's call on alison - and that was probably the only villagery thing that i was willing to call slightly villagery in his iso, but it's most likely nothing

i don't like to type a lot of words, hope this manages to sum it up decently

My only thoughts on Odd so far is that he blatantly misrepresented me and said I dismissed day 0 reads which is not what I said at all. When I called him out on it, he has not responded.

I am scanning JPIC's ISO to try to flesh out a read on him one way or the other. I think this early post is a good look. He seems to be genuinely a bit miffed at Odd's treatment of him, but not in a hellbent or defensive sort of way. Just annoyed. I think that sort of response to suspicion, pure annoyance, is more likely to come from a civilian than mafia.

Pure coincidence that this involves Oddmerta immediately after Hally brings him up.

[Long Con]

@BoKnows and @Long Con, are you guys not scum or not town? It's okay to tell me, I'll keep a secret.

How do I know I can trust you with that information?

Look at my face. Would this face lie to you?

Ok... ok. The truth is, I am town. I even have a nice little town role that's fun and cool. Last night, I tried to target Alison with it, but I got blocked by... it was Esooa, right? But I tell ya, I got POTENTIAL. Believe in me.

[Sloonei]

General question that I've already floated at least once already: what do we think the team sizes are?

[Long Con]

General question that I've already floated at least once already: what do we think the team sizes are?

I think assuming 4 and 4 is sensible.

[Strawhenge]

@BoKnows and @Long Con, are you guys not scum or not town? It's okay to tell me, I'll keep a secret.

How do I know I can trust you with that information?

Look at my face. Would this face lie to you?

Ok... ok. The truth is, I am town. I even have a nice little town role that's fun and cool. Last night, I tried to target Alison with it, but I got blocked by... it was Esooa, right? But I tell ya, I got POTENTIAL. Believe in me.

[record scratch]

You tried to target Alison with something and the so-claimed doctor blocked you from doing it?

[BoKnows]

General question that I've already floated at least once already: what do we think the team sizes are?

lobby of 22
2 x 4 or 1 x4, 1x3, 1 3p

[Long Con]

@BoKnows and @Long Con, are you guys not scum or not town? It's okay to tell me, I'll keep a secret.

How do I know I can trust you with that information?

Look at my face. Would this face lie to you?

Ok... ok. The truth is, I am town. I even have a nice little town role that's fun and cool. Last night, I tried to target Alison with it, but I got blocked by... it was Esooa, right? But I tell ya, I got POTENTIAL. Believe in me.

[record scratch]

You tried to target Alison with something and the so-claimed doctor blocked you from doing it?

Yeah. Crazy, right?

[BoKnows]

actually almost 36% of the lobby being scum seems high. 2 x 3

[Sloonei]

General question that I've already floated at least once already: what do we think the team sizes are?

I think assuming 4 and 4 is sensible.

I do not. Given that both teams can apparently kill each night (based on Night 1, at least. That may not actually be the case), I think 14 vs 4 vs 4 can make for a very quick and unfair town loss.

[Hally]

esooa is not a doctor. she stops all abilities from targeting her target. she’s like an alien/jailer i think

[Long Con]

General question that I've already floated at least once already: what do we think the team sizes are?

I think assuming 4 and 4 is sensible.

I do not. Given that both teams can apparently kill each night (based on Night 1, at least. That may not actually be the case), I think 14 vs 4 vs 4 can make for a very quick and unfair town loss.

Or they could eat each other. But I'm not balance-master.

How do the numbers affect the hunting on the base level?

[Hally]

https://wiki.mafiascum.net/index.php?title=Alien_(role)

i believe this is what @Esooa is claiming

[Strawhenge]

Alrighty then.

@NANOOKTHEGREATANDFEARSOME
an ISO by TaStrawji P. Hengeson

POST-BY-POST NOTES

Spoiler: show

• À la Jay, I too took this openscum post non-zero seriously, but not much above zero. I never know what to make about these openscum shit. I'm sorry if I'm misusing this term but to me it's one of the classic WIFOMs. And I've seen town and scum use it at almost equal frequency. All this did was catch my attention.

• Suggests that Esooa is not town, but in a could-be-joking way. I sense this'll be a theme, from what I remember seeing.

• On D0, has bantered with Oddmerta three times, with a tone I recall seeing between scummates in past games. Without knowing either player's meta, this is pure spitballing on my part, but I have noted it.

• Seems to be kinda serious about one piece of Oddmerta banter: dismissing D0 reads being scummy. At the moment this feels less important wrt Oddmerta, and more important wrt Marmot. We'll see how those two interacted.

• Sort of buddies up to tutuu, and I can seriously not tell if it's serious. There's a lot of this: not being able to tell if serious.

• Makes the softest comment on SPF's read of Jay and Sloonei both being villagers. Up until this point, nanook has only made jokey or half-jokey comments to Sloonei and has referred to past games with Jay. Nothing about the current game. Says he disagrees with SPF's take, but does so with very soft tone.

• As Hally mentioned whilst I wrote this ISO, nanook's comment about ted here does indeed look like scummates distancing themselves.

• Claps back at Jay for having nanook in his POE. Says nothing but, 'You're wrong, I'm town.' Vaguely reminiscent of Long Con's reactions to Mac. If you missed that in my LC ISO, I simply don't like the tone, and don't trust it.

• Another traded barb with Oddmerta. At this point nanook has traded barbs with a few people, but Oddmerta is the most frequent one. Hmm.

• Makes two non- or half-serious posts about suspecting or voting for someone: KZA as an omgus for voting tutuu, and, at TSP's idea (hmm), Jay for not townreading him.

• Marmot interaction alert: nanook responds to Marmot with a brief synopsis of what Marmot missed so far. Mostly a nothing-read, but what's interesting here is that nanook actually responds seriously, with actual info. Throughout the whole interaction.

• His only actual read so far is on KZA for KZA's reactions to votes. I can't back up or refute nanook's take, because I don't have meta on KZA, but this reads as an actual earnest comment on the game. My gut says they're not aligned, even after nanook made that aforementioned jokey post.

• Tells Jay that asking about 'mafia motivation' is a stupid question. Initially reads as deflection against follow-up on his KZA vote. Then Jay literally rephrases the same question ( ) and nanook is like, 'Nah, I'm not really suspicious of him, but I am kinda tho, but I'm not, he just kinda looked suspicious, but that doesn't mean I was suspicious of him, he could be totally suspicious tho.'

• Marmot interaction alert: And it's another mostly nothing-read. Marmot openscums and nanook says, 'so much power, uwu'. I could WIFOM myself into my grave about openscum bullshit but I won't waste my time or yours.

• It would seem that nanook thinks playing mafia is scummy. Okay.

• I don't get his response to Mac here, about thinking Bo is town. Like, I literally don't get it. He says Bo 'can't manage this game as mafia' but then says Bo is a good mafia player, and that he just saw him win as mafia? Legit confused.

• He does waffle a bit on that though, saying that Bo might just be in his blind spot. There are town and scum reasons for him to do that.

• Okay now the whole Bo thing is getting weird. He now 'desperately' wants Hally, a brand new sub at that point, to TR Bo so that nanook isn't the only one TRing Bo. Weird post. I don't like it.

• Says he doesn't believe in scumreads ( ), but if he did, he'd probably idk say maybe TSP or like, oh, right, probably KZA, but idk, you know, probably not, but like, probably. Say, I have a sudden craving for waffles.

• Says a big wad of nothing when Sloonei asks him how he felt about Marmot's handling of him. Hmm.

• Says, 'Well, I dunno, I just kinda did,' when asked why he snuck in a vote for TSP.

NANOOK + MARMOT
Sloonei did his breakdown of it here, but I also kept track of it. It was a bunch of nothing. If they're scummates, they distanced themselves. But in conjunction with nanook's general demeanor, it's hard to tell.

NANOOK + JAGGEDJIMMYJAY
Cast light aspersions on Jay for being Jay, rebuffed Jay's questions. Not usually what I've seen townies do in response to Jay being Jay.

NANOOK + MACDOUGAL
Sparred with him a little but kept his distance. They didn't interact much. He gave Mac cancer of the scrotal seam, though. That's not good.

IN SUMMATION
Nanook doesn't look incredibly great. I've seen throughout the thread, and in direct response to me asking about it, that Nanook is just this way regardless of alignment. I'm curious about this claim that he doesn't want to make, that'll clear him. I'm always wary of such claims anyway. He stays squarely in my scum-lean pile, but I think there are better chops to get to first.

[Long Con]

esooa is not a doctor. she stops all abilities from targeting her target. she’s like an alien/jailer i think

I thought she was like a superdoctor. She doesn't just protect, she prevents the targeting from even happening.

[Long Con]

https://wiki.mafiascum.net/index.php?title=Alien_(role)

i believe this is what @Esooa is claiming

Oh right, I asked about that, but I don't recall a confirmation.

[Strawhenge]

https://wiki.mafiascum.net/index.php?title=Alien_(role)

i believe this is what @Esooa is claiming

I've never played with this role. Interesting.

[Sloonei]

General question that I've already floated at least once already: what do we think the team sizes are?

I think assuming 4 and 4 is sensible.

I do not. Given that both teams can apparently kill each night (based on Night 1, at least. That may not actually be the case), I think 14 vs 4 vs 4 can make for a very quick and unfair town loss.

Or they could eat each other. But I'm not balance-master.

How do the numbers affect the hunting on the base level?

This is true, but I would not bank on it, and I think cross-team violence is less likely to occur in general because nightkill targets tend to be the players that are the most cleared, so that's not an occurrence that I think should be given supreme weight when balancing any game.
4 & 3 or 3 & 3 remain the guesses I'm most comfortable with. The powers in this game seem to be many, so I'm not quite sure what that does for balance either.

[Hally]

i want to clarify btw that i’m not saying odd is necessarily a wolf. it’s not like i can’t see him as a villager. i’m simply saying the seemingly unanimous free pass he’s being given does not seem warranted given his iso and i don’t really think he should be getting v read right now. if anyone has arguments to the contrary i’m all ears though

[Long Con]

i want to clarify btw that i’m not saying odd is necessarily a wolf. it’s not like i can’t see him as a villager. i’m simply saying the seemingly unanimous free pass he’s being given does not seem warranted given his iso and i don’t really think he should be getting v read right now. if anyone has arguments to the contrary i’m all ears though

But his trooperness is going to give him general yeet invulnerability until a few more POE folks are gone. I think that's a reality that could preclude a deep analysis of him that could lead to a yeet decision.

[BoKnows]

i want to clarify btw that i’m not saying odd is necessarily a wolf. it’s not like i can’t see him as a villager. i’m simply saying the seemingly unanimous free pass he’s being given does not seem warranted given his iso and i don’t really think he should be getting v read right now. if anyone has arguments to the contrary i’m all ears though

I wish odd would do more give his position in this game

[Strawhenge]

Alright, I'll do some more ISOing the morning. Beddy bye for pop-pop.

[Long Con]

i want to clarify btw that i’m not saying odd is necessarily a wolf. it’s not like i can’t see him as a villager. i’m simply saying the seemingly unanimous free pass he’s being given does not seem warranted given his iso and i don’t really think he should be getting v read right now. if anyone has arguments to the contrary i’m all ears though

I wish odd would do more give his position in this game

His position in this game is his avatar. He is a barking dog chained to Alison's throne. That's how I pictured it before, before troopers became suspectable again.

[Hally]

if i was to play devil’s advocate with myself re: odd i would say that a wolf might do more to give the passing appearance that they care, whereas odd doesn’t seem concerned with looking like he’s solving. i don’t know if i care about this kind of argument but it exists

[Sloonei]

i want to clarify btw that i’m not saying odd is necessarily a wolf. it’s not like i can’t see him as a villager. i’m simply saying the seemingly unanimous free pass he’s being given does not seem warranted given his iso and i don’t really think he should be getting v read right now. if anyone has arguments to the contrary i’m all ears though

I wish odd would do more give his position in this game

Yeah, this is ultimately where I fall on Odd. He's been handed a very nice platform to join in and help us solve the game, but he's done absolutely nothing with it. If nothing else, Radiohead showed me that he's capable of being engaged in the solving effort.

But as I say this, I have to ask myself if this is a reason to town read him: if he's mafia, then he's resisting the collective effort to drag him into the towncore. Why not just pay along and capitalize on all this goodwill?

[Oddmerta]

I'm here to make scum jelly

[TonyStarkPrime]

im slightly tipsy and i have to be up at 8

[Sloonei]

I'm here to make scum jelly

How do you intend to make this happen?

[Hally]

i want to clarify btw that i’m not saying odd is necessarily a wolf. it’s not like i can’t see him as a villager. i’m simply saying the seemingly unanimous free pass he’s being given does not seem warranted given his iso and i don’t really think he should be getting v read right now. if anyone has arguments to the contrary i’m all ears though

I wish odd would do more give his position in this game

Yeah, this is ultimately where I fall on Odd. He's been handed a very nice platform to join in and help us solve the game, but he's done absolutely nothing with it. If nothing else, Radiohead showed me that he's capable of being engaged in the solving effort.

But as I say this, I have to ask myself if this is a reason to town read him: if he's mafia, then he's resisting the collective effort to drag him into the towncore. Why not just pay along and capitalize on all this goodwill?

yeah, this is kinda what i was getting at above with him not seeming to care about how he looks

[TonyStarkPrime]

lost poker tonight. raised with A10 of clubs preflop, guy calls with A4o, can tell he's weak. flop comes 4 8 10 two clubs, I have top pair top kicker and a flush draw. he shoves, I call. 4 on the turn. no improvement.

[Oddmerta]

I'm here to make scum jelly

How do you intend to make this happen?

It's already happening my dude

[KZA]

im slightly tipsy and i have to be up at 8

How do you intend to make this happen?

[TonyStarkPrime]

im fifty fifty between the alarms and the all nighter

[Sloonei]

I'm here to make scum jelly

How do you intend to make this happen?

It's already happening my dude

I do not think it is.

Look at this situation. Nearly everyone in the thread wants to trust you. You should be in a very good position. We have a strong POE forming, we already chopping one mafioso and feel generally quite good that we are heading toward another. You seem to have mechanics in your corner. This should give you an excellent platform to use your voice in the thread. If you are worried about dodging a nightkill, I'd venture to say that that need not be a concern: we have at least two confirmed civilians who are currently being much, much more vocal than you are. I am not confirmed at the moment, but I am also probably ahead of you on any To Kill lists. SPF as well. So you've got a lot of cushion. You've got a platform. You've got a voice. We are all urging you to use it, and yet you are refusing. Why? Your play right now is unhelpful, and bordering on a distraction. At the very least, help us to erase our lingering tinfoil about you.

[KZA]

im fifty fifty between the alarms and the all nighter

I will join you but only in spirit

[TonyStarkPrime]

@staypositivefriend where’s your head at?

i don't carry the resounding confidence that everyone else in this game does that falcon is a villager, but i do think that he is probably just a villager. i don't currently have a reason to be concerned about him and i don't intend to tinfoil this slot unless it's proven that the consensus POE is broken.

there have been some small moments from tedextr that have made me doubt myself, (mostly just the authenticity of emotion in some of his more recent posting, but i am deliberately refusing to base my reads on that foundation) but i still find him holistically pretty wolfy. i have zero issue with his slot being resolved

nanook has been a slot that i've mostly ignored reading throughout this game, for whatever reason. i usually think that nanook's alignment is obvious as either alignment (ie: i read him as mafia immediately in the zelda mash, i read him as town immediately in bread mafia), but he's been in this weird neutral space where most of the posts that he has made have completely unmoved me in either direction. the lack of clarity that i feel about nanook's alignment indicates to me that he might just be a wolf - i am doubtful that i would have this little to say about nanook's posting if he was a villager

i haven't untangled whether or not alison being a villager also makes oddmerta a villager by default. i'm not sure if it does. regardless, i have found oddmerta's posting mildly villagery. he would probably be the top of my priority list to sort if the POE ended up being way off, but he is a slot that i'm also not very concerned about right now

i still feel that sloonei is a villager. i have very much felt myself being in line with his solving today and i have been given zero reason to believe that he's playing w/a ulterior motive. his solving is good. his lines of reasoning are good and easy to follow. his reads align with mine. i am not currently concerned about the sloonei slot

i have carried a secret tinfoil wolfread on esooa for a little while now . i know that wolf!esooa loves to subvert her meta, and i felt that her lack of investment in this game could have been an attempt to subvert her meta from fallout mafia for the sake of looking townier. esooa made a post yesterday that said: "if you want an easy reason to clear me, then just compare this game to how i played in fallout mafia!". that concerned me and validated that my worry about esooa could be coming from a reasonable place. i am also skeptical about how confidently esooa townreads me in this game, as much as i like it

even so, esooa is not on the top of my priority list to sort due to her claim, and due to the fact that i have still found her posts mostly villagery. i do think there's some truth to the idea that esooa would be more interested in the narrative and direction of this game if she was a wolf. she's a slot that i would come back to if we've wiped out the majority of the POE and things are looking bad.

strawhenge has made a couple of posts that have raised my eyebrows and pinged me the slightest bit. i still feel that they are most likely a villager based on the overwhelming villageryness of their early posting.

if i'm putting mechanics aside, then KZA is still in my POE, although not top priority. i have not sorted out whether or not alison's claim makes KZA a villager

Dom is rand. i have no opinion on his alignment and i'm skeptical of those who say they do. i have no idea. his slot should probably be resolved at some point.

i wolflean TSP, but i find myself scrambling into knots every time I try to articulate my thoughts on him. a lot of his posts just feel off to me - as though i am watching someone take a picture of another person scumhunting, as opposed to watching him scumhunt himself. i might ISO him and see if i can put some of those thoughts into words. i wolflean him.

some posts from long con have felt pretty villagery to me. i don't feel that i can comfortably take him out of my POE.

i remain fairly neutral about fingersplints. i feel that she is a plausible fit as a member of either wolf team, but there is nothing about her that particularly stands out to me as wolfy

i have found JPIC's posts significantly more villagery than in the one game where i saw him as a wolf - make of that what you will. he is in the upper echelons of my POE. not my preferred chop at all

michelle had a strong opening, and has done nothing since then that i have found particularly villagery. i think that she may just be a wolf on autopilot that is scrambling to keep up with the pace of the game. not my preferred chop but would probably sort sooner than later

i think that alison is a villager

i lean village on BoKnows. the level of comfort to his game is not the type of comfort that i feel a wolf would easily be able to replicate

i wolfread al_sama. almost all of their posts have pinged me. i have seen nothing today that changes my perspective about him. would chop.

Holy fuck, I can't read this.


I'm already reading Bleak House, and I don't have time for another Epic Novel

how are you liking it? my best ever crossword clue was for bleak house

[Oddmerta]

I'm here to make scum jelly

How do you intend to make this happen?

It's already happening my dude

I do not think it is.

Look at this situation. Nearly everyone in the thread wants to trust you. You should be in a very good position. We have a strong POE forming, we already chopping one mafioso and feel generally quite good that we are heading toward another. You seem to have mechanics in your corner. This should give you an excellent platform to use your voice in the thread. If you are worried about dodging a nightkill, I'd venture to say that that need not be a concern: we have at least two confirmed civilians who are currently being much, much more vocal than you are. I am not confirmed at the moment, but I am also probably ahead of you on any To Kill lists. SPF as well. So you've got a lot of cushion. You've got a platform. You've got a voice. We are all urging you to use it, and yet you are refusing. Why? Your play right now is unhelpful, and bordering on a distraction. At the very least, help us to erase our lingering tinfoil about you.

They want to trust me because they know I'm town

[Sloonei]

I'm here to make scum jelly

How do you intend to make this happen?

It's already happening my dude

I do not think it is.

Look at this situation. Nearly everyone in the thread wants to trust you. You should be in a very good position. We have a strong POE forming, we already chopping one mafioso and feel generally quite good that we are heading toward another. You seem to have mechanics in your corner. This should give you an excellent platform to use your voice in the thread. If you are worried about dodging a nightkill, I'd venture to say that that need not be a concern: we have at least two confirmed civilians who are currently being much, much more vocal than you are. I am not confirmed at the moment, but I am also probably ahead of you on any To Kill lists. SPF as well. So you've got a lot of cushion. You've got a platform. You've got a voice. We are all urging you to use it, and yet you are refusing. Why? Your play right now is unhelpful, and bordering on a distraction. At the very least, help us to erase our lingering tinfoil about you.

They want to trust me because they know I'm town

Yes, exactly. Do something. Please.

[TonyStarkPrime]

my nanook read scanner is permanently broken so idk