Beelzebub The Benign scum win

[BoKnows]

Yes being blatant is a very scummy thing to do!

Blatant = completely lacking in subtlety; very obvious.

Why would I want to be anything but blatant when I'm town?

[Gavial]

I’m also gonna need more of Marmot to be completely sold towards them but I do think there is a real good chance they are town.

Hollowkat and Esooa are ALMOST without a doubt Town for me.

Ya know how many posts pop up when you search "hollowkat" in Gav's ISO?


6.



You know how many posts Gav has? Almost 300

Alright now search how many times I mentioned LC and TSP.
I’m sure it’s less.
This is a terrible argument because LC,Hollow and TSP haven’t been the center of attention at all, except Hollow at EoD.

[Seanzie]

Pretty sure Hollowkatt/Esooa is a thing, and Hollowkatt just slipped. They probably planned to flip to me in wolf chat, and Hollowkatt forgot what order it went in.

For the love of pete, let's flip Essoa

I'm all for this, but I don't want to just hammer her 4 hours into the day. I'd like to hear what she has to say and what others have to say first.

[Gavial]

Obviously I’m going to mention the people who I’m more focused on.
It’s common sense.

[falcon45ca]

Spoiler: show

why not take votes seriously though?

I mean, votes should always be considered for their meaning. I think the word "serious" isn't quite right. Samu's vote didn't look at all like it was meant to contribute to a TK of Falcon, and rarely are early D1 votes meant in that way. Instead they are more used to generate content and reactions. Samu naked voted Falcon, and then when pressed, asked Falcon what he thinks of that. That vote looks "non-serious" to be in the sense that I don't really think Samu was thinking about TKing Falcon there. If Samu is town, it was a reaction test, and if he is scum, I don't think he would cast a vote meant to stay there this early in D1.

Doing reaction tests like that IMO is >rand town, and Falcon taking the vote seriously enough to OMGUS Samu I think is >rand scum.

basically there's a difference between "I intend to kill you with this vote" and "I wonder what happens if I vote you here". There's also "this vote is literally for laughs" but that category is generally really obvs.

Can see how ppl are getting to wolfy falcon off of that.

ok thanks. I can see how he gets to "one of falcon, seanzie, samusamu is a wolf". Seems like that's a fairly reasonable stance to take. Not thrilled with his "don't want to hit wrong" take tho, it's still early.
His second post you quote is meh to me. Can grok why you don't like it.
Third post is a throw-away in my book.

I guess I get what concerns you, so thanks, I appreciate it.

Is this directed at anyone in particular or do you just kinda think everyone who isn't you is shite?

I can't speak for DoO, but I assume it's the latter.
I do think that's more of a townie mindset for her though. I don't disagree with the points you're making about her *in general*, but I don't think they apply to DoO.

tbh I want to wolf read her for it. mostly b/c I've done what she's doing as wolf, and I've had it done to me. It's kinda effective b/c as long as you're not crossing the line from "annoyed and responding with snark and sarcasm" into "actually insulting people" it gets people who sus you to back off.

Outside of her interactions with me/Gavial what's your take on DoO? I know my read on her is currently clouded by my recent interactions.

You "want" to wolf read her? Are you wolf reading her, or no?

I wolf read AtE

Seanzie & Gavial are top scum for me.


[VOTE: VOTE SEANZIE] aubergine

spicy
why are they top scum?

Seanzie & Gavial are top scum for me.


[VOTE: VOTE SEANZIE] aubergine

spicy
why are they top scum?

Both of their reactions to Samu & I

Seanzie & Gavial are top scum for me.


[VOTE: VOTE SEANZIE] aubergine

Care to elaborate?

I found his approach to Samu's & I the most opphrtunistic

I'm taking sean out of my townreads. I was just reading through those posts again and I agree with this.

He didn't have a lot of conviction and I think it's because he was looking for an easy way to back out of the read.

soooo lets just murder seanz then
[VOTE: seanzie] aubergine

For anyone interested, here is HK's progression on sean up to his vote for sean

@hollowkatt what do you find scummy about sean?

Why aren't you voting sean?

This looks good for Sean IMO

[Gavial]

Yes being blatant is a very scummy thing to do!

Blatant = completely lacking in subtlety; very obvious.

Why would I want to be anything but blatant when I'm town?

Did you even read my post?

[Gavial]

It’s the other things that make you Scummy and you being Blatant doesn’t help at all!

[BoKnows]

Why is blatant a bad thing?

Well it’s definitely not a Townie thing and doesn’t make up for other things.

Disagree

It’s a way to say something without having anything gained or lost.

That's not the definition of blatant.

[Gavial]

You could have done better but you choose not to.
Now maybe I’m overthinking this but I just think you could give more/better?

[falcon45ca]

I didn’t wanna say this earlier because it’s anti-town but at this point I’m not doing any better so I’ll come out.

Falcon Softed PR/Mafia

Just saw this now.



Dude, what the hell are you talking about?



Your tunneling of me is so ridiculous and nonstop from the beginning of the game, I'm having a hard time thinking you're not town, cuz only town are so so stupid and stuck in their initial read.



Wake the fuck up, I am town

[Seanzie]

@Urist @Esooa @Gavial

Can all of you explain your progressions on HK and Marmot, and what led you to vote Marmot when you did?

Also @Samusamu, can you explain why you moved from HK to Jessie at the last minute?

[Gavial]

Spoiler: show

why not take votes seriously though?

I mean, votes should always be considered for their meaning. I think the word "serious" isn't quite right. Samu's vote didn't look at all like it was meant to contribute to a TK of Falcon, and rarely are early D1 votes meant in that way. Instead they are more used to generate content and reactions. Samu naked voted Falcon, and then when pressed, asked Falcon what he thinks of that. That vote looks "non-serious" to be in the sense that I don't really think Samu was thinking about TKing Falcon there. If Samu is town, it was a reaction test, and if he is scum, I don't think he would cast a vote meant to stay there this early in D1.

Doing reaction tests like that IMO is >rand town, and Falcon taking the vote seriously enough to OMGUS Samu I think is >rand scum.

basically there's a difference between "I intend to kill you with this vote" and "I wonder what happens if I vote you here". There's also "this vote is literally for laughs" but that category is generally really obvs.

Can see how ppl are getting to wolfy falcon off of that.

ok thanks. I can see how he gets to "one of falcon, seanzie, samusamu is a wolf". Seems like that's a fairly reasonable stance to take. Not thrilled with his "don't want to hit wrong" take tho, it's still early.
His second post you quote is meh to me. Can grok why you don't like it.
Third post is a throw-away in my book.

I guess I get what concerns you, so thanks, I appreciate it.

I can't speak for DoO, but I assume it's the latter.
I do think that's more of a townie mindset for her though. I don't disagree with the points you're making about her *in general*, but I don't think they apply to DoO.

tbh I want to wolf read her for it. mostly b/c I've done what she's doing as wolf, and I've had it done to me. It's kinda effective b/c as long as you're not crossing the line from "annoyed and responding with snark and sarcasm" into "actually insulting people" it gets people who sus you to back off.

Outside of her interactions with me/Gavial what's your take on DoO? I know my read on her is currently clouded by my recent interactions.

You "want" to wolf read her? Are you wolf reading her, or no?

I wolf read AtE

Seanzie & Gavial are top scum for me.


[VOTE: VOTE SEANZIE] aubergine

spicy
why are they top scum?

Seanzie & Gavial are top scum for me.


[VOTE: VOTE SEANZIE] aubergine

spicy
why are they top scum?

Both of their reactions to Samu & I

Care to elaborate?

I found his approach to Samu's & I the most opphrtunistic

I'm taking sean out of my townreads. I was just reading through those posts again and I agree with this.

He didn't have a lot of conviction and I think it's because he was looking for an easy way to back out of the read.

soooo lets just murder seanz then
[VOTE: seanzie] aubergine

For anyone interested, here is HK's progression on sean up to his vote for sean

@hollowkatt what do you find scummy about sean?

Why aren't you voting sean?

This looks good for Sean IMO

No shit Sherlock.
Sean was the CW Bud.

[Gavial]

Do you have me on mute on something?
I covered this!

[BoKnows]

Esooa like lock town

Esooa like lock town

why?

HK with a pocket attempt on Esooa

That seemed like a blatant pocket attempt to me.

hk and esooa are just outed scum at this point.

Esooa like lock town

why?

If she's a wolf she doesn't argue vehemently to not chop me. She also doesn't keep working this close to the end of the day and she doesn't draw attention to herself like she's been doing with the other pushes she's doing

hk and esooa are just outed scum at this point.

depends on hk's flip

That seemed like a blatant pocket attempt to me.

nah, HK pocketing Esooa looks way different lol

Let's also keep in mind that there's literally no case against me accept that "I'm not hollowkat".

I think Hollow scum out of Esooa.
If your PR 1-Shot Day Vig then use it!

[Gavial]

@Urist @Esooa @Gavial

Can all of you explain your progressions on HK and Marmot, and what led you to vote Marmot when you did?

Also @Samusamu, can you explain why you moved from HK to Jessie at the last minute?

I trusted HK more, Did tell Marmot to shoot HK over Esooa.

[Gavial]

Pretty much had HK/Marmot almost TVS at that point.

[Gavial]

Esooa like lock town

Esooa like lock town

why?

HK with a pocket attempt on Esooa

That seemed like a blatant pocket attempt to me.

hk and esooa are just outed scum at this point.

Esooa like lock town

why?

If she's a wolf she doesn't argue vehemently to not chop me. She also doesn't keep working this close to the end of the day and she doesn't draw attention to herself like she's been doing with the other pushes she's doing

hk and esooa are just outed scum at this point.

depends on hk's flip

That seemed like a blatant pocket attempt to me.

nah, HK pocketing Esooa looks way different lol

Let's also keep in mind that there's literally no case against me accept that "I'm not hollowkat".

I think Hollow scum out of Esooa.
If your PR 1-Shot Day Vig then use it!

Yep!
Good Recap!

[BoKnows]

I think Gavial is town but just out to lunch with his reads.

[falcon45ca]

Seriously, let's solve Esooa. It far and away makes the most sense to solve her slot given last RD and HKs red flip

[falcon45ca]

I think Gavial is town but just out to lunch with his reads.

Basically

[BoKnows]

Yup. Esooa came in last second defended someone who couldn't back up their reads for any rhyme or reason and labelled that person as "obvious town", when they were in fact scum.

[Gavial]

I didn’t wanna say this earlier because it’s anti-town but at this point I’m not doing any better so I’ll come out.

Falcon Softed PR/Mafia

Just saw this now.



Dude, what the hell are you talking about?



Your tunneling of me is so ridiculous and nonstop from the beginning of the game, I'm having a hard time thinking you're not town, cuz only town are so so stupid and stuck in their initial read.



Wake the fuck up, I am town

You act as if everyone is suppose to think your town?
You ain’t claiming any IC as far as I can tell and you definitely haven’t done anything to prove your town.
Quite the opposite.
It should be obvious both me and Sean is town, if your scum you just wouldn’t wanna have that because you had both of us as ML options and you wouldn’t want it gone.
Now if your town stop complaining and do what you did last game a played with you. You know the game where you actually were town. You were pretty Townie in that game.

Also “I’m having a hard time believing your scum you might actually be weak town” I’ve heard that by many people in the past and most of the time in came from scum.
So if your town then your one of the lucky minority of that and hopefully I can see more Genuine and Villagery content out of you today.

[BoKnows]

I don't see a world where that isn't the next flip (unless something greater happens).

[Gavial]

Yup. Esooa came in last second defended someone who couldn't back up their reads for any rhyme or reason and labelled that person as "obvious town", when they were in fact scum.

They sorta Mech confirmed though in a way?

[Gavial]

Also I believe it was also Sloon’s slot that Mind Melted that with me.

[Gavial]

Aka Alisom

[Gavial]

I don't see a world where that isn't the next flip (unless something greater happens).

The world of which they claim PR I’m willing to accept.

[falcon45ca]

I didn’t wanna say this earlier because it’s anti-town but at this point I’m not doing any better so I’ll come out.

Falcon Softed PR/Mafia

Just saw this now.



Dude, what the hell are you talking about?



Your tunneling of me is so ridiculous and nonstop from the beginning of the game, I'm having a hard time thinking you're not town, cuz only town are so so stupid and stuck in their initial read.



Wake the fuck up, I am town

You act as if everyone is suppose to think your town?
You ain’t claiming any IC as far as I can tell and you definitely haven’t done anything to prove your town.
Quite the opposite.
It should be obvious both me and Sean is town, if your scum you just wouldn’t wanna have that because you had both of us as ML options and you wouldn’t want it gone.
Now if your town stop complaining and do what you did last game a played with you. You know the game where you actually were town. You were pretty Townie in that game.

Also “I’m having a hard time believing your scum you might actually be weak town” I’ve heard that by many people in the past and most of the time in came from scum.
So if your town then your one of the lucky minority of that and hopefully I can see more Genuine and Villagery content out of you today.

OK, sounds good.


Now let's flip Essoa

[Gavial]

Others should accept that too!

[Seanzie]

Yup. Esooa came in last second defended someone who couldn't back up their reads for any rhyme or reason and labelled that person as "obvious town", when they were in fact scum.

They sorta Mech confirmed though in a way?

How are they mech confirmed?

[falcon45ca]

Yup. Esooa came in last second defended someone who couldn't back up their reads for any rhyme or reason and labelled that person as "obvious town", when they were in fact scum.

They sorta Mech confirmed though in a way?

What? How? Must've missed that

[Gavial]

I didn’t wanna say this earlier because it’s anti-town but at this point I’m not doing any better so I’ll come out.

Falcon Softed PR/Mafia

Just saw this now.



Dude, what the hell are you talking about?



Your tunneling of me is so ridiculous and nonstop from the beginning of the game, I'm having a hard time thinking you're not town, cuz only town are so so stupid and stuck in their initial read.



Wake the fuck up, I am town

You act as if everyone is suppose to think your town?
You ain’t claiming any IC as far as I can tell and you definitely haven’t done anything to prove your town.
Quite the opposite.
It should be obvious both me and Sean is town, if your scum you just wouldn’t wanna have that because you had both of us as ML options and you wouldn’t want it gone.
Now if your town stop complaining and do what you did last game a played with you. You know the game where you actually were town. You were pretty Townie in that game.

Also “I’m having a hard time believing your scum you might actually be weak town” I’ve heard that by many people in the past and most of the time in came from scum.
So if your town then your one of the lucky minority of that and hopefully I can see more Genuine and Villagery content out of you today.

OK, sounds good.


Now let's flip Essoa

Give me an updated readslist of yours and tell me how you will go about tomorrow if a Esooa!Town flip occurs.

[Gavial]

Yup. Esooa came in last second defended someone who couldn't back up their reads for any rhyme or reason and labelled that person as "obvious town", when they were in fact scum.

They sorta Mech confirmed though in a way?

What? How? Must've missed that

They did the opposite of you.

[BoKnows]

that's not mech confirmed.

[Gavial]

I think I'm town which is a little disappointing

This post.
When I got the Mere Mortal card I was a little confused I was town as well.

[falcon45ca]

I don't see a world where that isn't the next flip (unless something greater happens).

The world of which they claim PR I’m willing to accept.

Others should accept that too!

Oh good God. .


You're literally telling Esooa what she can do to defend herself, and that you'll just believe it and others should too?


I can't even. Like, how many times have you sent money to free a Prince from Nigeria?

[Gavial]

I was legit the same.
I was like “so I’m VT?”
Nanook goes “Your what the card says you are”.

[falcon45ca]

I think I'm town which is a little disappointing

This post.
When I got the Mere Mortal card I was a little confused I was town as well.

[Gavial]

I don't see a world where that isn't the next flip (unless something greater happens).

The world of which they claim PR I’m willing to accept.

Others should accept that too!

Oh good God. .


You're literally telling Esooa what she can do to defend herself, and that you'll just believe it and others should too?


I can't even. Like, how many times have you sent money to free a Prince from Nigeria?

5437

[Gavial]

Nah I don’t fall for scams

[falcon45ca]

I didn’t wanna say this earlier because it’s anti-town but at this point I’m not doing any better so I’ll come out.

Falcon Softed PR/Mafia

Just saw this now.



Dude, what the hell are you talking about?



Your tunneling of me is so ridiculous and nonstop from the beginning of the game, I'm having a hard time thinking you're not town, cuz only town are so so stupid and stuck in their initial read.



Wake the fuck up, I am town

You act as if everyone is suppose to think your town?
You ain’t claiming any IC as far as I can tell and you definitely haven’t done anything to prove your town.
Quite the opposite.
It should be obvious both me and Sean is town, if your scum you just wouldn’t wanna have that because you had both of us as ML options and you wouldn’t want it gone.
Now if your town stop complaining and do what you did last game a played with you. You know the game where you actually were town. You were pretty Townie in that game.

Also “I’m having a hard time believing your scum you might actually be weak town” I’ve heard that by many people in the past and most of the time in came from scum.
So if your town then your one of the lucky minority of that and hopefully I can see more Genuine and Villagery content out of you today.

OK, sounds good.


Now let's flip Essoa

Give me an updated readslist of yours and tell me how you will go about tomorrow if a Esooa!Town flip occurs.

I dunno, I haven't planned that far ahead

[BoKnows]

I was legit the same.
I was like “so I’m VT?”
Nanook goes “Your what the card says you are”.

Still not mech confirmed.

[Gavial]

I think I'm town which is a little disappointing

This post.
When I got the Mere Mortal card I was a little confused I was town as well.

Exactly why you can’t be mere mortal and have to be either PR or Scum.
Technically I shouldn’t be pushing you because if you are town your PR, but Technically it’s hard for me to see a world where you are town.

[falcon45ca]

Nah I don’t fall for scams

Well, don't forget you said HK was pretty much lock town, so....

[Gavial]

I was legit the same.
I was like “so I’m VT?”
Nanook goes “Your what the card says you are”.

Still not mech confirmed.

I’m using the wrong term but now you get what I mean.
The only person I’ve seen do something like that and was actually scum, is Urist.

[Gavial]

Roughly a year ago

[Seanzie]

I think I'm town which is a little disappointing

This post.
When I got the Mere Mortal card I was a little confused I was town as well.

First off, there really isn't anything "mech" about this. If this is your reason for thinking Esooa is confirmed, this is an extremely weak reason. Are you aware the Nook put the VT rolecard in the setup posts?

[Gavial]

Nah I don’t fall for scams

Well, don't forget you said HK was pretty much lock town, so....

They also had the most Townie SoD other then Esooa IMO.

[Gavial]

I think I'm town which is a little disappointing

This post.
When I got the Mere Mortal card I was a little confused I was town as well.

First off, there really isn't anything "mech" about this. If this is your reason for thinking Esooa is confirmed, this is an extremely weak reason. Are you aware the Nook put the VT rolecard in the setup posts?

Yeah but only after it was mentioned during SoD1.

[Gavial]

I didn’t wanna say this earlier because it’s anti-town but at this point I’m not doing any better so I’ll come out.

Falcon Softed PR/Mafia

Just saw this now.



Dude, what the hell are you talking about?



Your tunneling of me is so ridiculous and nonstop from the beginning of the game, I'm having a hard time thinking you're not town, cuz only town are so so stupid and stuck in their initial read.



Wake the fuck up, I am town

You act as if everyone is suppose to think your town?
You ain’t claiming any IC as far as I can tell and you definitely haven’t done anything to prove your town.
Quite the opposite.
It should be obvious both me and Sean is town, if your scum you just wouldn’t wanna have that because you had both of us as ML options and you wouldn’t want it gone.
Now if your town stop complaining and do what you did last game a played with you. You know the game where you actually were town. You were pretty Townie in that game.

Also “I’m having a hard time believing your scum you might actually be weak town” I’ve heard that by many people in the past and most of the time in came from scum.
So if your town then your one of the lucky minority of that and hopefully I can see more Genuine and Villagery content out of you today.

OK, sounds good.


Now let's flip Essoa

Give me an updated readslist of yours and tell me how you will go about tomorrow if a Esooa!Town flip occurs.

I dunno, I haven't planned that far ahead

Damn pretty difficult to make an updated readslist eh?