The Elder Scrolls [GAME OVER]

[DaisyCloud]

btw I'm not eve. voting jack. like heaven forbid i do. because omgus.

vote me out if yiu think I'm scum. but it better not be because you actually are going to listen to lying jack lier scum lying wolf lier that is a proven lier.

[Nachomamma8]

nothing against her wolfrange but it's just town perspective slip after town perspective slip and also jack is probably just town and if we're gonna be productive we should split them up before someone makes an infographic

Definitely agree about both being town. Waiting for them to hash it out on their own right now. Why are you currently throwing your vote away on Scotty?

[Made]

Wait Gavial is cleared? Someone explain.

supposedly Gavial has a watcher ability. tracked dead Nanook nite 1. then nite 2 watched KZA and nothing happened. this supposedly makes him town. oh and he hates me. this is pro towner right here

This is exactly how Gavial cleared himself in modern family

[DaisyCloud]

Wait Gavial is cleared? Someone explain.

supposedly Gavial has a watcher ability. tracked dead Nanook nite 1. then nite 2 watched KZA and nothing happened. this supposedly makes him town. oh and he hates me. this is pro towner right here

This is exactly how Gavial cleared himself in modern family

what was his alignment that game? which faction won?

[Nachomamma8]

is no one going to ask that jack lied/is a lier

I see where Jack left out context from the conversation that you had from Syn. I see where Jack had missing information that changes the dynamic of your Qwags vote considerably.

I don't think it was done maliciously (especially since, if I'm understanding correctly, dead town did the same exact thing) and I don't even think the case with the lie still included is particularly convincing (so don't know why Jack would stick his neck out to bolster such a weak case on someone who isn't a popular target when there has to be slankers to hit elsewhere). I understand your frustrations in being misrepped but I don't think Jack is a hit here.

[Nachomamma8]

the only person who seems to have conviction in this game is Tim

we're fucked

Complaining about how hosed we are and just sort of flailing wildly isn't really doing anyone any good. There's scum in the lurker pool, I agree - do you really have no way to differentiate between them? What town pool are you looking at currently?

[Nachomamma8]

in fairness this wagon has kza and tim on it and the other one has wolves on it so meh

And worrying about wagon composition before you hit scum is futile.

[Nachomamma8]

@Nachomamma8 hi friend! Have we played together??

The dead player is voting you, and that’s prob a bad sign. Do you and Nanook have much history??

You are not a player I remember from my checkered past. Neither is Nanook.

[Nachomamma8]

if we flipped the below names

Enrique
lost monkey
made
master radiation
nacho

I'm calling 2 wolves at min and nothing of value lost.

Where's the mass kill button?

Honest, as a slanker pool, this isn’t half bad. It’s looking like MR is pushing rn which is great, Enri and Monkey don’t exist generally, I am supatown. That just leave nacho as a a fairly harder to ignore question mark in the slanker pool.

I am here today. What do you think of my posts today?

[Nachomamma8]

And plot twist I just read through Marmot's ISO and I really don't think he was scum based on the way that he was pushing back against the Qwags yeet when he was on the three way chopping block - think scum would show that self-prez instinct more than he had. I also like the way that he's reached out to people in bits and pieces (such as linking Tim posts for Daisy), I like the way he talked about his townreads early, etc.

I'll read Flanders in a bit but Mog's play today also seems townier than not - the defeatist attitude doesn't seem like it's coming from scum here (I think if Mog replaced in as scum and gave up it would include a lot more slanking and a lot less "if I must be a sacrifice to give the world more information so be it". We're headed in a bad direction right now.

[Nachomamma8]

I'm moving my vote to falcon for now not that I know anything about falcon but I'd really like for people on both of these main wagons to rehash/link to cases so I can have some vague sense of confidence that we're not missing a third time. I think the Daisy/Jack back and forth continues to go nowhere and is anti-town because it is two townies tying up their votes which gives scum a greater sense of agency. I think Tony Stark voting Scotty is very scummy - Scotty is strongly townread by most and he's doing nothing to actually push that suspicion which means he's just throwing his vote away.

[KZA]

I didn't say Gavial is clear. I just said it's highly unlikely he lied about watching me and seeing no visitors.

[KZA]

if we flipped the below names

Enrique
lost monkey
made
master radiation
nacho

I'm calling 2 wolves at min and nothing of value lost.

Where's the mass kill button?

good news made's been green checked

I thought kza said that he was bullshitting about that?

Um...no?

[Nachomamma8]

Enrique going "ahhh fuckkkk" and then piecing out despite hovering in thread for a good amount of time rubs me the wrong way. I don't think Gavial is the play today - the watcher weirdness is weird but I don't think most mafia players have the chutzpah to try to clear themselves with an ability like that.

[Nachomamma8]

KZA. Who do you suspect?

[Nachomamma8]

Why Mog?

[Nachomamma8]

Who else?

[DaisyCloud]

is no one going to ask that jack lied/is a lier

I see where Jack left out context from the conversation that you had from Syn. I see where Jack had missing information that changes the dynamic of your Qwags vote considerably.

I don't think it was done maliciously (especially since, if I'm understanding correctly, dead town did the same exact thing) and I don't even think the case with the lie still included is particularly convincing (so don't know why Jack would stick his neck out to bolster such a weak case on someone who isn't a popular target when there has to be slankers to hit elsewhere). I understand your frustrations in being misrepped but I don't think Jack is a hit here.

okay. but the dead player once he saw he was wrong and saw that it was incorrect how I voted said that he was wrong. Jack is sticking by what he claims. and that dead player also only had a bit of doubt and wasn't advocating for my lynch. where as Jack is.

but like you seem reasonable and the only one who seem to actually hear me out. so I'm dropping off on Jack. like idc about him at all now.

[DaisyCloud]

@Made is there a reason you went afk and not told me what Gavial's alignment was in that game?

[KZA]

Who else?

sorry I'm headed to work now, current wagons are fine

[Jackofhearts2005]

noting Jack not voting for mog like he said he would

Maybe I’m teamed with Mog and that’s why.

[Nachomamma8]

Who else?

sorry I'm headed to work now, current wagons are fine

I've talked about why I disliked both of them. Do you disagree with that reasoning/think that I'm completely off base here?

[Moghedien]

noting Jack not voting for mog like he said he would

Maybe I’m teamed with Mog and that’s why.

You weren't supposed to tell anyone!

[Jackofhearts2005]

[VOTE: No yeet] aubergine

[DaisyCloud]

mog- i didn't get alarm bells when thry wer Flanders. do not now either. but seems sus. this is guts. this is what I had fri. Flanders too.

tim- supposedly a merchant.

kyle- seems scum. they seemed more town at the beginning. idk if the catching up and checking in posts r rubbing me the wrong way or what. seems like an excuse to not post. thry seemed fine before? idk what the deal is now. expected moar.

nacho-

LC- lean scum. I thought town. but, day 3 thry seemed to change. idk what happened. seems like they are talking around something. I feeling they are trying hard not to reveal or say something.

jack- wash my hands of this. because he went at it with me anything I say here be considered biased.

falcon- null idk

monkey- null. nothing in posts that goes one way or the other.

Gavial- is lying or is what they claim . iso indicates they seem scumbly tho. but people might think I am biased so let others be the judge

MacDougall- seems town. need to iso. this does seem like meta wise he is town. more what I'm used to.

KZA- lying and open deep wolf is such a thing exists or is town and mech stuff happening and is why they r still alive

Enrique- probably scum or afk town. probably should have host handle this slot.

Made- supposedly is green

Marmot- seems town. but seems frozen now.

Scotty- not 3rd party. seems town aligned. makes controversial nite actions but still seems town motivated.

Bo- null. either he is town and telling the truth or scum. and is doing 0 to help figure him out

did I leave anyone out? hope not

[Nachomamma8]

[VOTE: No yeet] aubergine

?

Feeling okay?

[DaisyCloud]

oh oop my nacho read


where were they all game? seems like this is what all adk players should strive to do now. just jump in. make reads. make mistakes, hopefully nothing fatal and just talk.

if you need context then please just iso or ask.

could this lot be scum? I'm not stupid. of course. but positive reinforcement is better. reward behaviors you want to see not punish them.

not voting nacho today most likely. if they do get flipped and turn out scum by eod etc. well, that proves nothing on my alignment. that just shows me that scum can have multiple masks.

[DaisyCloud]

[VOTE: No yeet] aubergine

?

Feeling okay?

seems like he likes to copy his top scum read.

[Jackofhearts2005]

the fact that scotty and Jack r now saying the actual post that jack pinged me in and wanted me to reply to isn't Jack's case on me but another post is, and basically the second post is a summary of the first and is basically just minus the quotes is so messed up.

I'm being gaslighted.

the fact that I literally put in all the links to posts to show that jack lied about the syn thing and jack isn't acknowledging it is messed up. that he is waiting for players to draw their own conclusions.

like, no. u lied. you used that lie to spin a false narrative that I killed syn because of it. I showed where u was dead wrong and lied and now instead u and scotty are saying that wasn't even your case against me.

I sympathize. Like that underlined bit is 100% correct.

Truth is, I didn’t remember who you sused but avoided voting for and it turned out to be a flipped townie. So you’re like “Jack’s case on me has this huge hole. He is lying” and I’m like “You’re not wrong about half of that.”

And I honestly didn’t go back through all of Syn’s stuff to see if he turned around on you. I remembered agreeing with Syn in the moment.

My case on you was multifaceted. I’m convinced some of it was flat wrong and some of it is us talking past each other and some of it is play style differences.

For instance, just as you are saying “What Jack said is provably false (wrt Syn suspecting you, specifically at the time of his death) -> Jack is lying -> Jack is a wolf” I was having a similar thought process “What Daisy is saying is provably false (wrt not knowing why I suspect her) -> Daisy is lying -> Daisy is a wolf.”

It’s cheesy but I think we were both wrong.

[Jackofhearts2005]

[VOTE: No yeet] aubergine

?

Feeling okay?

It’s a meme.

Tony and I come from HCRealms, where it used to be tradition to vote no yeet D1 and sometimes as late as D3. “Wait for info.” “We don’t want to accidentally yeet a townie.” So I sometimes joke about going no yeet or vote no yeet as a placeholder vote. I’m only ever serious about that at mylo but not lylo and even then, I tend to think the wolf nk is pretty obvious and you’re generally not worse off just voting someone out at 3T vs 1M as opposed to going no yeet and making it 2T vs 1M.

What I’m actually doing is just removing my vote from Daisy without placing it anywhere else yet.

[Scotty]

Awwww wtf why is TSP off the poll AGAIN?
What tomfuckery is this

[Jackofhearts2005]

the fact that scotty and Jack r now saying the actual post that jack pinged me in and wanted me to reply to isn't Jack's case on me but another post is, and basically the second post is a summary of the first and is basically just minus the quotes is so messed up.

I'm being gaslighted.

the fact that I literally put in all the links to posts to show that jack lied about the syn thing and jack isn't acknowledging it is messed up. that he is waiting for players to draw their own conclusions.

like, no. u lied. you used that lie to spin a false narrative that I killed syn because of it. I showed where u was dead wrong and lied and now instead u and scotty are saying that wasn't even your case against me.

I sympathize. Like that underlined bit is 100% correct.

Truth is, I didn’t remember who you sused but avoided voting for and it turned out to be a flipped townie. So you’re like “Jack’s case on me has this huge hole. He is lying” and I’m like “You’re not wrong about half of that.”

And I honestly didn’t go back through all of Syn’s stuff to see if he turned around on you. I remembered agreeing with Syn in the moment.

My case on you was multifaceted. I’m convinced some of it was flat wrong and some of it is us talking past each other and some of it is play style differences.

For instance, just as you are saying “What Jack said is provably false (wrt Syn suspecting you, specifically at the time of his death) -> Jack is lying -> Jack is a wolf” I was having a similar thought process “What Daisy is saying is provably false (wrt not knowing why I suspect her) -> Daisy is lying -> Daisy is a wolf.”

It’s cheesy but I think we were both wrong.

Uh except it was Scotty and Tony that said that, not Scotty and me. So the underlined is like 90% correct.

Part of my decision to let things play out (which I haven’t caught up yet but my understanding is the people involved just went to bed) was that I found it #interesting that the exchange went

Daisy: *circles 75% of the case Jack made on her* Lies!
Tony: *circles 75% of the case Jack made ok Daisy, including all 25% Daisy did not circle* Daisy, you are misrepresenting Jack’s case on you and I forbid you to suspect Jack

So I’m coming at things from a perspective that maybe my suspicion on Daisy and Tim and Nacho are all incorrect. So who is a wolf? Well, Tony is on the “stupid townlean” list for agreeing with my minor previous suspicion of Scotty. Maybe Tony is a wolf. So then why is Tony trying to stop the mural Jack/Daisy t/t tunnel? Is that what he’s trying to do? What does that mean for Tony?

And I wanted to see where specifically you and Tony would go with that conversation and how that could advance my reads on you two.

But it is admittedly a bit of a dick move to leave someone feeling like they’re being gaslighted. (Less so because this is a game about lying and seeing through lies.)

[Jackofhearts2005]

Daisy, is lying a definite scum tell in your opinion?

Don’t answer that!

[Scotty]

Mac has made the comment twice now that town might as well take the L for the state of things. That’s sabotage-ic and defeatist, my man. Tending down again for me.

Nacho’s reads seem like they have a strong support to hold that head, though i disagree with most of em. It’s refreshing to hear him go counter to a lot of the consensus scum... then

And plot twist I just read through Marmot's ISO and I really don't think he was scum based on the way that he was pushing back against the Qwags yeet when he was on the three way chopping block - think scum would show that self-prez instinct more than he had.

Mmm I don’t know what you’re seeing.

Spoiler: show

@Marmot what are your thoughts on qwag?

@Marmot you've probably already responded to this given the climate but i am
still curious

Qwags is a wolf even if he isn't. Those are someone else's words.

We could just let a vig shoot him, but he's not playing like a useful town member at this point.

not a useful town member

[VOTE: Qwags] aubergine

Any of these wagons not named Marmot is fine.

He was fine with any vote not named him in the last few minutes. He chose to vote Quags over SSF, who was building at the time.

Also just looking at his behavior at EOD is looking at marmot’s game in a vaccuum. He’s sketch all day. So if you actually looked through his iso i feel like you’d come to a different conclusion

[Jackofhearts2005]

And plot twist I just read through Marmot's ISO and I really don't think he was scum based on the way that he was pushing back against the Qwags yeet when he was on the three way chopping block - think scum would show that self-prez instinct more than he had. I also like the way that he's reached out to people in bits and pieces (such as linking Tim posts for Daisy), I like the way he talked about his townreads early, etc.

I'll read Flanders in a bit but Mog's play today also seems townier than not - the defeatist attitude doesn't seem like it's coming from scum here (I think if Mog replaced in as scum and gave up it would include a lot more slanking and a lot less "if I must be a sacrifice to give the world more information so be it". We're headed in a bad direction right now.

In a world where we’re largely wrong on Marmot/Mog and I’ve been personally wrong on Daisy, scum team has to be like....

Monkey
Radishes
LC
...idk

And/or there’s 2ish really deep wolves.

Like I’m open to hearing cases outside the consensus suspects but if there’s no wolves in Marmot and Mog, we really are in a lot of trouble.

[Jackofhearts2005]

Marmot not posting for a whole day and Flanders replacing out is super unhelpful btw.

[Scotty]

Marmot not posting for a whole day and Flanders replacing out is super unhelpful btw.

I mean at this point if at least marmot isn’t a wolf I can’t feel too responsible for a town loss.
Our D1 had almost 40% slankers, and about as much on D2.

[Moghedien]

Marmot not posting for a whole day and Flanders replacing out is super unhelpful btw.

Does anyone know why Flanders replaced out?

[Jackofhearts2005]

Marmot not posting for a whole day and Flanders replacing out is super unhelpful btw.

Does anyone know why Flanders replaced out?

We’re not supposed to talk about it. It’s considered a bad form of angleshooting.

[Moghedien]

Marmot not posting for a whole day and Flanders replacing out is super unhelpful btw.

Does anyone know why Flanders replaced out?

We’re not supposed to talk about it. It’s considered a bad form of angleshooting.

[falcon45ca]

And plot twist I just read through Marmot's ISO and I really don't think he was scum based on the way that he was pushing back against the Qwags yeet when he was on the three way chopping block - think scum would show that self-prez instinct more than he had. I also like the way that he's reached out to people in bits and pieces (such as linking Tim posts for Daisy), I like the way he talked about his townreads early, etc.

I'll read Flanders in a bit but Mog's play today also seems townier than not - the defeatist attitude doesn't seem like it's coming from scum here (I think if Mog replaced in as scum and gave up it would include a lot more slanking and a lot less "if I must be a sacrifice to give the world more information so be it". We're headed in a bad direction right now.

Marmot's ISO is full of hello and greetings, soft pushes with no follow up, and scummy Masterpiece Theater.

What's towny about his ISO? Pushing back against the Qwags lynch? Can you quote what you saw?

Marmot reaching out to people in bits and pieces is exactly the soft push/soft engagement stuff I'm scum reading him for. Can you show me 1 instance of Marmot actually pushing a read and trying to solve a slot? It's all a bunch of lily dipping posts that are soft as baby shit.

SSF was town, ergo Mog is town. My read on SSF is based on uber meta and he's one of my best pals and a bit of angleshoot. I'm 90% on that slot

[falcon45ca]

Marmot not posting for a whole day and Flanders replacing out is super unhelpful btw.

Sure it is, that's like Scum Tactics 101.

[falcon45ca]

I just saw LCs name in the vote poll, and it made me realize I feel like I haven't heard from him in days.


@Long Con Fuck's up dude, where's your head at?

[Jackofhearts2005]

Marmot not posting for a whole day and Flanders replacing out is super unhelpful btw.

Does anyone know why Flanders replaced out?

We’re not supposed to talk about it. It’s considered a bad form of angleshooting.

I’m just...not gonna talk to you about it.

[Jackofhearts2005]

Marmot like...voted for Qwags in the end. I don’t remember his pushback against that wagon but it must have not been that strong.

[Nachomamma8]

It sucks that the two people at the forefront right now just straight up aren't here.

I agree with Scotty that Mac's behavior today sucks. Don't like that he's coming in with the defeatist attitude and talking about how we need to purge the slank group but there's no sense of urgency behind it - he's not interacting with the main wagons and seems to be voting Long Con because "no one has looked that way recently". If you're on the cusp of taking an L, you don't try to be cute.

[Scotty]

I just saw LCs name in the vote poll, and it made me realize I feel like I haven't heard from him in days.


@Long Con Fuck's up dude, where's your head at?

lol this isn’t gonna be a real wagon, mr. wolf

[falcon45ca]

I just saw LCs name in the vote poll, and it made me realize I feel like I haven't heard from him in days.


@Long Con Fuck's up dude, where's your head at?

lol this isn’t gonna be a real wagon, mr. wolf

Why does it seem like you don't want me to engage LC?

[falcon45ca]

I'm trying to get LC to play the game and give us his thoughts/reads, why don't you want to hear from him @Scotty?

[Scotty]

Spoiler: show

You may select 1 option


BoKnows
1
4%
Voters: BoKnows
DaisyCloud
0
No votes
Voters: None
Enrique
1
4%
Voters: Nachomamma8
falcon45ca
0
No votes
Voters: None
Gavial
0
No votes
Voters: None
Jackofhearts2005
0
No votes
Voters: None
Kylemii
0
No votes
Voters: None
KZA
0
No votes
Voters: None
Long Con
0
No votes
Voters: None
lost monkey
0
No votes
Voters: None
MacDougall
0
No votes
Voters: None
Made
4
15%
Voters: Marmot, KZA, DaisyCloud, Stupid Sexy Flanders
Marmot
3
11%
Voters: Kylemii, Made, Qwags
Nachomamma8
0
No votes
Voters: None
Quin
0
No votes
Voters: None
Qwags
4
15%
Voters: falcon45ca, Scotty, Gavial, Jackofhearts2005
Scotty
0
No votes
Voters: None
Stupid Sexy Flanders
4
15%
Voters: Timsup2nothin, Syn, MacDougall, Long Con
Syn
0
No votes
Voters: None
Timsup2nothin
0
No votes
Voters: None
No elimination
0
No votes
Voters: None
No current vote
1
4%
Voters: TonyStarkPrime

So the order of operations in the last 5 minutes, thanks to LC’s handy count, was this^
Except* I had just voted for Flanders the minute before so it wasn’t updated. The standings at that time were:
4 Made
5 SSF
3 Qwags
3 Marmot

Right after I changed from Qwags to Flanders, Marmot switched from Made to Qwags, to make it
3 Made
5 SSF
4 Qwags
3 Marmot

Which is where it should have remained until I jumped back to Qwags.

There is a chance that Marmot did not see my jump before he voted.
Regardless, his self preservation was enough that he was ready to put his vote on one of the other wagons to widen the gap. He chose Qwags over SSF who had more votes at the time