PSY 2310 - Cognitive Psychology [END]

[staypositivefriend]

the last game I played with hally a few months ago (actually the last game i played before this one), we were v/v and they tinfoiled me a lot. I assume this is at least partly why they've been somewhat hesitant in voicing their concerns wrt me in this game. It's not unusual for people to express similar sentiments as you have and express a degree of consternation about my alignment.

doesn't your evaluation of hally here imply that you think that hally is a villager? but you were wolfreading hally up until this point, no?

is it really necessary for me to clarify "if they are a villager" every time I talk about someone like that?

I wouldn't say I was wolfreading them, though I did have a post or two that probably gave that impression, and I think they've also improved a bit since then.

weak "gotcha" post, 4/10, dubious basis and the open-ended nature of your question gave me too much wiggle room instead of going for my jugular

not really a "gotcha" - all of your posts about hally up until that point implied a strong level of suspicion against hally (if you changed your mind at some point and posted that in the thread, then i missed it), so seeing you talk about hally through a perspective that heavily implies they are a villager raised my eyebrows

[dyachei]

it's super frustrating to finally rand town in a game with visor and zack and have them not even explain their shitty reads on me

this is the post, I could have read into the wording wrong but it sounds kinda like implying they are town

I finally randed town in a game with them in it

it's not implying they're town

but the part about their reads on you kinda is

no it isn't. they have shitty reads on me they havent explained. I don't know if they're real or fake reads. I just know they're shitty

[bronana]

the last game I played with hally a few months ago (actually the last game i played before this one), we were v/v and they tinfoiled me a lot. I assume this is at least partly why they've been somewhat hesitant in voicing their concerns wrt me in this game. It's not unusual for people to express similar sentiments as you have and express a degree of consternation about my alignment.

doesn't your evaluation of hally here imply that you think that hally is a villager? but you were wolfreading hally up until this point, no?

is it really necessary for me to clarify "if they are a villager" every time I talk about someone like that?

I wouldn't say I was wolfreading them, though I did have a post or two that probably gave that impression, and I think they've also improved a bit since then.

weak "gotcha" post, 4/10, dubious basis and the open-ended nature of your question gave me too much wiggle room instead of going for my jugular

not really a "gotcha" - all of your posts about hally up until that point implied a strong level of suspicion against hally (if you changed your mind at some point and posted that in the thread, then i missed it), so seeing you talk about hally through a perspective that heavily implies they are a villager raised my eyebrows

oh? it read to me like "ha, nice TMI, I got you!"

that's just how i talk

[nutella]

it's super frustrating to finally rand town in a game with visor and zack and have them not even explain their shitty reads on me

this is the post, I could have read into the wording wrong but it sounds kinda like implying they are town

I finally randed town in a game with them in it

it's not implying they're town

but the part about their reads on you kinda is

I don't know why you're so hung up about this, and I'm still not sure how I feel about dya myself. The perspective in that post is perfectly normal from either alignment.

okay I'll drop it

what's your read on dya atm

[nutella]

vulgards confidence on gav flipping wolf solidifies mine as well, though I was already pretty confident based on how he's behaving

probably keeping symbolic vote on dya for the heck of it

Kza us probably just a wolf too atp

[dyachei]

i dont remember anything kza has posted

probably not a good sign

[bronana]

it's super frustrating to finally rand town in a game with visor and zack and have them not even explain their shitty reads on me

this is the post, I could have read into the wording wrong but it sounds kinda like implying they are town

I finally randed town in a game with them in it

it's not implying they're town

but the part about their reads on you kinda is

I don't know why you're so hung up about this, and I'm still not sure how I feel about dya myself. The perspective in that post is perfectly normal from either alignment.

okay I'll drop it

what's your read on dya atm

I'd kill gavial or kza. I acknowledge they are the most low hanging fruits, but I find their contributions extremely lacking regardless and don't feel remotely confident about killing off anyone else.

[Hally]

i think there’s a nonzero chance gavial flips villager here but i really can’t deal with this for another day phase so i’m choosing to not care

what do your reads look like outside of gavial, generally?

good question, i don’t really know

nutella
vulgard
arete
marl

^ these should all be villagers

sunbae
amy
spf
dizzy

^ i have positive feelings about these but wouldn’t be surprised if there’s a wolf playing well here given the names

c4
zack
visor
alison
dya
tangy

^ i don’t really have a concrete read on these so i assume a couple of them are wolves

kza

^ he’s probably just a wolf

as you can tell i don’t really have a firm handle on the game

[Marluxion]

HELP MY BRAIN SENDS THE BAD SIGNALS AGAIN

[Marluxion]

it's telling me seth's post on the other page are only made if seth and vulgard are w/w
I dont want this brain anymore someone take it back

[Marluxion]

sipped too much friggin wifom juice and now my scumsensor is out of whack

[bronana]

i think there’s a nonzero chance gavial flips villager here but i really can’t deal with this for another day phase so i’m choosing to not care

what do your reads look like outside of gavial, generally?

good question, i don’t really know

nutella
vulgard
arete
marl

^ these should all be villagers

sunbae
amy
spf
dizzy

^ i have positive feelings about these but wouldn’t be surprised if there’s a wolf playing well here given the names

c4
zack
visor
alison
dya
tangy

^ i don’t really have a concrete read on these so i assume a couple of them are wolves

kza

^ he’s probably just a wolf

as you can tell i don’t really have a firm handle on the game

re: marl - why?

I think me and visor/sunbae have brought up confusion on this several times and I don't remember seeing anyone bother to explain it. Surely his ranges are not so polarized that his posts in this game make him lock town, I find that hard to believe unless you all just think he's a terrible wolf.

[staypositivefriend]

i think there’s a nonzero chance gavial flips villager here but i really can’t deal with this for another day phase so i’m choosing to not care

what do your reads look like outside of gavial, generally?

good question, i don’t really know

nutella
vulgard
arete
marl

^ these should all be villagers

sunbae
amy
spf
dizzy

^ i have positive feelings about these but wouldn’t be surprised if there’s a wolf playing well here given the names

c4
zack
visor
alison
dya
tangy

^ i don’t really have a concrete read on these so i assume a couple of them are wolves

kza

^ he’s probably just a wolf

as you can tell i don’t really have a firm handle on the game

inch resting. our top townreads are more or less the same - i came around to arete being a villager over the last ~12 hours or so in the same way that you have, but i would probably swap them w/amy in your list. (i might be townreading amy too easily in the sense that i don't have a solid sense of what her wolfgame is like but i think she has consistently shown a high depth of thought while being overtly villagery so i'm not going to tinfoil her until i'm given a salient reason to do so). i would have c4 higher up too. maybe tangy as well

agreed on kza being wolfy. kza usually lacks presence regardless of alignment but their posts usually manage to pack a punch when theyre a villager - there's no such punch here

[staypositivefriend]

my attitude toward marl is similar to my attitude to amy: he is not outside of the range of a competent wolf, but he has been consistently villagery and consistently shown a depth of thought that is highly reminiscent of the townplay that i've seen from them. i think that they are villagers until i am given a reason to think otherwise

[bronana]

my attitude toward marl is similar to my attitude to amy: he is not outside of the range of a competent wolf, but he has been consistently villagery and consistently shown a depth of thought that is highly reminiscent of the townplay that i've seen from them. i think that they are villagers until i am given a reason to think otherwise

which posts did you think showed villagy depth of thought?

[Hally]

@bronana i explained it here:

page 13 especially gives me extreme wolves-trying-to-look-towny vibes
the way the entire poe turned on each other rather than outward makes me feel like our PoE is either mostly correct or completely wrong

it's mostly the vibes i get from hally and alison on that page
they control like 60% of the page's posts and they dont really interact at all

also the second bit
dya is on alison
galvial is on dya
tan and arete crossvoting
hally pushing seth

it justs feels like most of the poe is attacking the poe, whereas i'd expect the stronger villagers in the poe to have a significantly different perspective but that doesn't seem to be the case
whether it's w/w or wolves attacking the lhf in the poe i'm not sure yet

stuff like this gave me v!marl vibes

i think as a wolf he tends to play more straightforwardly and doesn’t usually have these pepe silvia theories about the gamestate as a whole

i can see the gears turning here, so to speak

up to this point i wasn’t completely sold on marl v even though i was leaning that way but with his recent posting i’m gonna say he’s probably a villager

[bronana]

ok

those posts seem fairly unremarkable to me (as do pmuch all of marls posts) hally but you know him better than i do

[Hally]

@Marluxion i’m gonna bite the bullet

why do you wolf read me?

[staypositivefriend]

If I can mrr as a wolf (and have done it in a past game), Arete can mrr as a wolf as well.

probably
arete jumping on hally for an early post is reminiscent of their approach to katze in the upick game on FoL where i white knighted them. despite this i think their town has been towny so far, but we'll see how that holds up

Do I actually need to do something proactive about spf

I kind of think she might be town

although a lot of that is that my brain is going 'SPF solving? SPF writing lots of words? writing words is villagery! that makes her a villager!' which is ... not a good read ......

The keys to the kingdom for reading SPF:

Scumread her the entire game, but dont vote her out early. If she's town she'll get frustrated and show it eventually like in HP Mafia 3 lol

Dyachei is tonally very similar to reflections but other than that not sure if i have much to read them on yet

it's mostly the vibes i get from hally and alison on that page
they control like 60% of the page's posts and they dont really interact at all

also the second bit
dya is on alison
galvial is on dya
tan and arete crossvoting
hally pushing seth

it justs feels like most of the poe is attacking the poe, whereas i'd expect the stronger villagers in the poe to have a significantly different perspective but that doesn't seem to be the case
whether it's w/w or wolves attacking the lhf in the poe i'm not sure yet

i thought the first three quotes were villagery because of how seamlessly they use marl's prior experiences as a villager to build a foundation for his reads in this game - it's a little bit harder for wolves to make these kinds of intuitive connections because theyre oftentimes playing in a mindset that is distinct from their village game, and i think that is something that absolutely holds true to the wolfgames i've seen from marl

fourth quote was villagery because it was a unique, thoughtful observation that stuck with me and helped me contextualize my own feelings about the dynamics happening in this game

i agree that nothing here is obviously villagery - there's just enough to think that marl is playing far closer to his villager game than to his wolf game

the only thing i'd like him to clarify more is his read on hally - he's been doing a lot of wheel spinning wrt to his thoughts on them, and the push means nothing to me if there's no substantiated reasoning behind it

[Marluxion]

@Marluxion i’m gonna bite the bullet

why do you wolf read me?

i actually dont remember specifically why
it was one of my first thoughts into the game and it just hasn't changed

i could probably reiso myself or you and figure it out but it's very similar to the past two games i've not townread you when you're town

if you are actually village this read will probably change a ton back and forth if i end up doubting my initial read

[bronana]

I have meta on like 5 people in this list and one of them is Gavial so it won't even help me

SPF saying "this is a wolf" at this stage feels pretty good and similar to how she did it in Fargo as town

Personally I have 0 confidence in reading Gavial tho

hot(?) take is that Gavial received way too much heat from too many directions for his 4 post entrance and is probably just town

[staypositivefriend]

SPF saying "this is a wolf" at this stage feels pretty good and similar to how she did it in Fargo as town

Personally I have 0 confidence in reading Gavial tho

oh, since zack quoted it, it's worth mentioning that this post makes zero sense to me and feels more like TMI than anything

KZA saw me as a wolf in CoV. they say me say "this is a wolf" at multiple times throughout the game, in the same way that i did in fargo mafia. i find it odd that they draw on their experience from fargo mafia without factoring in their experience from CoV - it felt like a Fake Read

[Marluxion]

spf, the short answer is nutella’s response to pressure has a fierceness and edge to it that she doesn’t have when she wolfs

ask me again in 12-24 hours if you still think nut is wolfing and i’ll go into more detail if i still v read her

there’s more to it than what i said but i don’t want to defend her too much right now because i’m not 100% sure and regardless of whether i’m correct i know people find meta reads like that unfun to play with

i’d rather let the game develop naturally

i mindmeld with you spf for whatever it's worth

fwiw i think spf’s interpretation of nut’s posts and everyone’s concerns w/her are perfectly valid and i was actually considering voting nutella earlier

but now i think she’s probably a villager

brain is extremely saying to townread hally for this post
but when they are a villager brain never wanted to townread hally before
is brain evolving or devolving

ironically i actually townread you when i first read and all my townreads saying you're in the poe caused me to doubt my read and poe you myself

My brain is bad

[Marluxion]

If Hally / SPF / Vulgard / Arete are all town and seth randed wolf i'm gonna feel like a bully in the postgame

that's like a squad of 5 professional wrestlers taking a high schooler's lunch money

[Hally]

@Marluxion i’m gonna bite the bullet

why do you wolf read me?

i actually dont remember specifically why
it was one of my first thoughts into the game and it just hasn't changed

i could probably reiso myself or you and figure it out but it's very similar to the past two games i've not townread you when you're town

if you are actually village this read will probably change a ton back and forth if i end up doubting my initial read

fair enough

[dyachei]

If Hally / SPF / Vulgard / Arete are all town and seth randed wolf i'm gonna feel like a bully in the postgame

that's like a squad of 5 professional wrestlers taking a high schooler's lunch money

kind of like his perspective in this post

[sunbae]

I guess I'm just used to vMarl burying wolf reads and maybe im just not used to light game post cap marl thats just laid back and chillin

Like, what are marls wolf reads? Outed Wolf for the vote on Nutella but he forgot about that for a bit, Hally but also not Hally but maybe Hally, he's the "eod ill have gav's alignment 100%" person and he's currently at "idk, theres worlds where hes v even then he'd get voted at lylo anyways", and now an associative Marl/Va w/w read.

I'm used to marl throwing down and letting his wolf reads know they are wolf reads and letting everyone else know that not only are they wolf reads but he's right.

And like, I understand ~ everyone else is just thinking "ya marl obv v" so it's a me thing and it's probably a case where wolves didn't wanna throw down with him so they just marked him v and moved on. But I still don't understand it.

[Marluxion]

Also if vulgard and seth somehow end up both being mafia i'm retiring the conscious part of my brain in regards to forum mafia and promoting the stupid instinct tinfoil part to the full time thinker

so i hope for all our sakes that tinfoil is wrong

[sunbae]

If Hally / SPF / Vulgard / Arete are all town and seth randed wolf i'm gonna feel like a bully in the postgame

that's like a squad of 5 professional wrestlers taking a high schooler's lunch money

and its xposted with this which just reads towny to me (as was the sleep brain post last night) so whatever ima just listen to others and move on lol

[dyachei]

If Hally / SPF / Vulgard / Arete are all town and seth randed wolf i'm gonna feel like a bully in the postgame

that's like a squad of 5 professional wrestlers taking a high schooler's lunch money

kind of like his perspective in this post

not really sure it's AI though

[sunbae]

I feel like the serious me would have thoughts on the Gav stuff by now but current me is just like "meh, whatever seems fine" and not wanting to bother spending more time on it

[Hally]

SPF saying "this is a wolf" at this stage feels pretty good and similar to how she did it in Fargo as town

Personally I have 0 confidence in reading Gavial tho

oh, since zack quoted it, it's worth mentioning that this post makes zero sense to me and feels more like TMI than anything

KZA saw me as a wolf in CoV. they say me say "this is a wolf" at multiple times throughout the game, in the same way that i did in fargo mafia. i find it odd that they draw on their experience from fargo mafia without factoring in their experience from CoV - it felt like a Fake Read

i thought the same thing when i iso’d him earlier and dropped my mini-case on him

he’s probably just a wolf. his entire iso sucks and isn’t anything like his posting in CoV or fargo (i checked)

no need to belabor it really

[sunbae]

Fwiw after sleeping on it I had the realization that Outed Wolf is a villager and that I feel good about this read even if I'll still be scared in the back of my mind

I'm gonna wait for his epiphany that I'm one too but it should come to him shortly

[dyachei]

why do you feel so weird to me hally?

[sunbae]

in the event i die in the night my legacy is "if Gav flips wolf, zero points are given to a single person for any reason and do not let anyone coast on it or anything"

[sunbae]

Now is the time for any questions to me cause im leaving in like 15-20 and wont return today.

[Marluxion]

I guess I'm just used to vMarl burying wolf reads and maybe im just not used to light game post cap marl thats just laid back and chillin

Like, what are marls wolf reads? Outed Wolf for the vote on Nutella but he forgot about that for a bit, Hally but also not Hally but maybe Hally, he's the "eod ill have gav's alignment 100%" person and he's currently at "idk, theres worlds where hes v even then he'd get voted at lylo anyways", and now an associative Marl/Va w/w read.

I'm used to marl throwing down and letting his wolf reads know they are wolf reads and letting everyone else know that not only are they wolf reads but he's right.

And like, I understand ~ everyone else is just thinking "ya marl obv v" so it's a me thing and it's probably a case where wolves didn't wanna throw down with him so they just marked him v and moved on. But I still don't understand it.

i work in a cycle
phase of the cycle 1 is pre tunnel marl where i'm still developing thoughts and reads on people, usually lasts only one day but in reflections this phase literally lasted the entire game. ends when i find something i think is blatantly wolfy and then i enter phase 2

tunneling marl
i try to bury the thing i think is blatantly wolfy until i flip or it does
it takes something extremely wolfy to get me to break out of a tunnel but it's happened in the past

and then if my tunnel was wrong i enter phase 1 again, if it was right i enter confbias hell mode where i care more about proving the rest of my idiotic tinfoil correct rather than following common sense logic

this lasts until the game ends and my ego goes up 2000000% (rare) or my tinfoil gets proven wrong and i go back to phase 1

the more experienced the lobby the longer i spend in phase 1 because there isn't going to be much that is blatantly wolfy, especially early, if at all

[staypositivefriend]

[VOTE: kza] aubergine

[Hally]

why do you feel so weird to me hally?

dunno

[Marluxion]

now with that being said i do think gavial has been blatantly wolfy
but i dont need to tunnel him for him to go over
that's like beating a dead horse

[sunbae]

I can understand that marl, thanks. I eagerly await you getting aggro on someone

[sunbae]

I feel like this will be the game where I defend someone for reasons I think are good, get explained why that's bad, grumble, and have them flip wolf

I think that person is Alison but I'm gonna call them a villager anyways because I want to. Might be Dya. Gonna let them chill too.

Prepare the good/bad chart bronana

[sunbae]

fwiw I also think marls "i aint getting killed during the day this game" post was towny and with the group of people defending him and his explanation making sense for why i might view his game differentl than he's playing here, ima just throw em into the v pile

[Hally]

i mean, i’m more laidback than usual. i’m just taking the game as it comes and not trying to force myself to have a read on everyone D1

if kza and gavial are wolves what i’m doing seems to be working pretty well so i don’t really feel like i have to try harder atm, shrug

[nutella]

SPF saying "this is a wolf" at this stage feels pretty good and similar to how she did it in Fargo as town

Personally I have 0 confidence in reading Gavial tho

oh, since zack quoted it, it's worth mentioning that this post makes zero sense to me and feels more like TMI than anything

KZA saw me as a wolf in CoV. they say me say "this is a wolf" at multiple times throughout the game, in the same way that i did in fargo mafia. i find it odd that they draw on their experience from fargo mafia without factoring in their experience from CoV - it felt like a Fake Read

i dont think he read cov after he died fwiw lol

[staypositivefriend]

im starting to townread hally but it's for the overly elaborate 4d chess reason that i dont feel like theyre trying to towntell or get people to townread them. they feel somewhat detached from the game and their posts don't feel cloying or focused on how they're getting perceived - gth i would lean on this coming from hally as a villager

[sunbae]

i have no read on hally one way or the other

[Hally]

i mean, i’m more laidback than usual. i’m just taking the game as it comes and not trying to force myself to have a read on everyone D1

if kza and gavial are wolves what i’m doing seems to be working pretty well so i don’t really feel like i have to try harder atm, shrug

inb4 they’re villagers and i look like an idiot for making this post

[KZA]

I didn't even read CoV while I was alive

[Hally]

[VOTE: kza] aubergine