basic mafia [END]

[NANOOKTHEGREATANDFEARSOME]

If you think star is town you should have me lock town, if i were mafia and he's town I wouldn't be sheeping him I'd be trolling the shit out of him

What if. Now hear me out. But what if I don't townread either of you?

Then you should reroll your dice, idk

[EnderWiggin]

If you think star is town you should have me lock town, if i were mafia and he's town I wouldn't be sheeping him I'd be trolling the shit out of him

What if. Now hear me out. But what if I don't townread either of you?

Then you should reroll your dice, idk

Lemme see. Hmm. Hmm. Snake eyes.

Still don't townread either of you.

[Alison]

If you think star is town you should have me lock town, if i were mafia and he's town I wouldn't be sheeping him I'd be trolling the shit out of him

If Axe is town and you're mafia and Axe has bad reads you can get an easy pocket + low accountability misexes by just sheeping him

And I know his scumread on me is bad so

[Alison]

Seanzie I don't even understand what you're saying right now

What's your scum case on any of the people you want to exe

[NANOOKTHEGREATANDFEARSOME]

If you think star is town you should have me lock town, if i were mafia and he's town I wouldn't be sheeping him I'd be trolling the shit out of him

If Axe is town and you're mafia and Axe has bad reads you can get an easy pocket + low accountability misexes by just sheeping him

And I know his scumread on me is bad so

Thats not how our relationship works

[NANOOKTHEGREATANDFEARSOME]

If you think star is town you should have me lock town, if i were mafia and he's town I wouldn't be sheeping him I'd be trolling the shit out of him

What if. Now hear me out. But what if I don't townread either of you?

Then you should reroll your dice, idk

Lemme see. Hmm. Hmm. Snake eyes.

Still don't townread either of you.

Get better dice then

[EnderWiggin]

If you think star is town you should have me lock town, if i were mafia and he's town I wouldn't be sheeping him I'd be trolling the shit out of him

What if. Now hear me out. But what if I don't townread either of you?

Then you should reroll your dice, idk

Lemme see. Hmm. Hmm. Snake eyes.

Still don't townread either of you.

Get better dice then

Can't be assed going to buy them.

[Alison]

If you think star is town you should have me lock town, if i were mafia and he's town I wouldn't be sheeping him I'd be trolling the shit out of him

If Axe is town and you're mafia and Axe has bad reads you can get an easy pocket + low accountability misexes by just sheeping him

And I know his scumread on me is bad so

Thats not how our relationship works

The way I described it is what would be most convenient for a mafia nook to do

Why should I believe that you wouldn't sheep axe as mafia?

[NotAnAxehole]

I'm adding @MacDougall to the town circle, never rescinding.

[NANOOKTHEGREATANDFEARSOME]

If you think star is town you should have me lock town, if i were mafia and he's town I wouldn't be sheeping him I'd be trolling the shit out of him

If Axe is town and you're mafia and Axe has bad reads you can get an easy pocket + low accountability misexes by just sheeping him

And I know his scumread on me is bad so

Thats not how our relationship works

The way I described it is what would be most convenient for a mafia nook to do

Why should I believe that you wouldn't sheep axe as mafia?

Cause if I were mafia and he were town in this specific game with this player list I would troll the shit out of him cause I'd be able to get away with it and it would be funny

Theres not really any utility to sheeping him as mafia cause nobody is really going to listen to him in a meaningful way so I wouldn't need to pocket him

[falcon45ca]

Work was busy, dinner was delicious.



Fux up, anybody got anything juicy?

[Seanzie]

Seanzie I don't even understand what you're saying right now

What's your scum case on any of the people you want to exe

What's to not understand? I think you're a wolf. End of case.

[NANOOKTHEGREATANDFEARSOME]

I guess the relevant question to ask yourself is "would nanook care enough about trying to win not to troll star?"

I think there's an obvious answer tbh

[NANOOKTHEGREATANDFEARSOME]

Anyways, im going to bed now, so this would be the ideal time to pickpocket me

[NotAnAxehole]

If you think star is town you should have me lock town, if i were mafia and he's town I wouldn't be sheeping him I'd be trolling the shit out of him

If Axe is town and you're mafia and Axe has bad reads you can get an easy pocket + low accountability misexes by just sheeping him

And I know his scumread on me is bad so

Thats not how our relationship works

The way I described it is what would be most convenient for a mafia nook to do

Why should I believe that you wouldn't sheep axe as mafia?

Cause if I were mafia and he were town in this specific game with this player list I would troll the shit out of him cause I'd be able to get away with it and it would be funny

Theres not really any utility to sheeping him as mafia cause nobody is really going to listen to him in a meaningful way so I wouldn't need to pocket him

This is accurate. I mostly try to play off of people that I know. I know Nanook pretty well and I've played video mafia with Esooa and Mac, so...

Also, to the people voting me, as mafia I would not kill one of the three players that I feel I have some sort of rapport with. If you want to continue voting me, may I suggest a career in meteorology, they can teach you how to throw dice.

[EnderWiggin]

If you think star is town you should have me lock town, if i were mafia and he's town I wouldn't be sheeping him I'd be trolling the shit out of him

If Axe is town and you're mafia and Axe has bad reads you can get an easy pocket + low accountability misexes by just sheeping him

And I know his scumread on me is bad so

Thats not how our relationship works

The way I described it is what would be most convenient for a mafia nook to do

Why should I believe that you wouldn't sheep axe as mafia?

Cause if I were mafia and he were town in this specific game with this player list I would troll the shit out of him cause I'd be able to get away with it and it would be funny

Theres not really any utility to sheeping him as mafia cause nobody is really going to listen to him in a meaningful way so I wouldn't need to pocket him

This is accurate. I mostly try to play off of people that I know. I know Nanook pretty well and I've played video mafia with Esooa and Mac, so...

Also, to the people voting me, as mafia I would not kill one of the three players that I feel I have some sort of rapport with. If you want to continue voting me, may I suggest a career in meteorology, they can teach you how to throw dice.

This wine tastes delicious btw.

[EnderWiggin]

If you think star is town you should have me lock town, if i were mafia and he's town I wouldn't be sheeping him I'd be trolling the shit out of him

If Axe is town and you're mafia and Axe has bad reads you can get an easy pocket + low accountability misexes by just sheeping him

And I know his scumread on me is bad so

Thats not how our relationship works

The way I described it is what would be most convenient for a mafia nook to do

Why should I believe that you wouldn't sheep axe as mafia?

Cause if I were mafia and he were town in this specific game with this player list I would troll the shit out of him cause I'd be able to get away with it and it would be funny

Theres not really any utility to sheeping him as mafia cause nobody is really going to listen to him in a meaningful way so I wouldn't need to pocket him

What if you were both scum?

[NotAnAxehole]

@MacDougall So you're reading Nanook and Seanzie as the mafia team? - I'm seeing Ender and Alison...

What's your level of confidence and how do we consolidate our reads?

[NotAnAxehole]

If you think star is town you should have me lock town, if i were mafia and he's town I wouldn't be sheeping him I'd be trolling the shit out of him

If Axe is town and you're mafia and Axe has bad reads you can get an easy pocket + low accountability misexes by just sheeping him

And I know his scumread on me is bad so

Thats not how our relationship works

The way I described it is what would be most convenient for a mafia nook to do

Why should I believe that you wouldn't sheep axe as mafia?

Cause if I were mafia and he were town in this specific game with this player list I would troll the shit out of him cause I'd be able to get away with it and it would be funny

Theres not really any utility to sheeping him as mafia cause nobody is really going to listen to him in a meaningful way so I wouldn't need to pocket him

What if you were both scum?

We don't kill Esooa?

[EnderWiggin]

@MacDougall So you're reading Nanook and Seanzie as the mafia team? - I'm seeing Ender and Alison...

What's your level of confidence and how do we consolidate our reads?

I like how you townread me for my play in AtLA but scumread me here.

Good consistency.

[EnderWiggin]

If you think star is town you should have me lock town, if i were mafia and he's town I wouldn't be sheeping him I'd be trolling the shit out of him

If Axe is town and you're mafia and Axe has bad reads you can get an easy pocket + low accountability misexes by just sheeping him

And I know his scumread on me is bad so

Thats not how our relationship works

The way I described it is what would be most convenient for a mafia nook to do

Why should I believe that you wouldn't sheep axe as mafia?

Cause if I were mafia and he were town in this specific game with this player list I would troll the shit out of him cause I'd be able to get away with it and it would be funny

Theres not really any utility to sheeping him as mafia cause nobody is really going to listen to him in a meaningful way so I wouldn't need to pocket him

What if you were both scum?

We don't kill Esooa?

Well I can clearly not choose the wine in front of me.

[Marmot]

Host Reminder

Please no discussion or reference to any ongoing mafia games, whether they be on this site or another site. Any further attempts to do so will result in a modkill.

Spoiler: show

@Alison
@BoKnows
@Dyslexicon
@EnderWiggin
@falcon45ca
@fingersplints
@Lu Ren
@Luckbox Inc
@MacDougall
@NANOOKTHEGREATANDFEARSOME
@NotAnAxehole
@Seanzie
@TonyStarkPrime

[EnderWiggin]

Hey Mac, any reason you swapped to Nanook silently?

[NotAnAxehole]

Here is where I'm at on PoE

Town:

Due to read:

Lu Ren
Luckbox
falcon

Due to Policy / Wagons:

Nanook
Dizzy

Almost town:

Seanzie

I have Seanzie in his own category because I think there's probably 2 mafia between alison, seanzie, mac, enderwagon... But Seanzie independently has played well.

That leaves me with a PoE of 6.5 which is not good enough

@NANOOKTHEGREATANDFEARSOME @MacDougall @Alison Mostly interested in your thoughts at the moment.

How has Seanzie played well? He seemed townie earlier but today he has had no depth to his solving and has been quite scummy.

Universally town read D1 (though I didn't get on that wagon for quite some time and mostly wanted him dead) - Today he hasn't been solvy, but really, who has? The day has just been an extension of day 1 which is part of the problem with people not taking D1 seriously or going for a policy kill on DOO day 1 (let's be real, no serious player had a scum read on her).

I feel like I'm the only person trying to consolidate my town reads onto a wagon that falls in the PoE, and for us to reach a consensus PoE. I mean, even you, what solving are you actively doing except OMGUS on Seanzie and silent voting Nanook? Who are your town and why should we be voting with you rather than you with us?

[EnderWiggin]

Here is where I'm at on PoE

Town:

Due to read:

Lu Ren
Luckbox
falcon

Due to Policy / Wagons:

Nanook
Dizzy

Almost town:

Seanzie

I have Seanzie in his own category because I think there's probably 2 mafia between alison, seanzie, mac, enderwagon... But Seanzie independently has played well.

That leaves me with a PoE of 6.5 which is not good enough

@NANOOKTHEGREATANDFEARSOME @MacDougall @Alison Mostly interested in your thoughts at the moment.

How has Seanzie played well? He seemed townie earlier but today he has had no depth to his solving and has been quite scummy.

Universally town read D1 (though I didn't get on that wagon for quite some time and mostly wanted him dead) - Today he hasn't been solvy, but really, who has? The day has just been an extension of day 1 which is part of the problem with people not taking D1 seriously or going for a policy kill on DOO day 1 (let's be real, no serious player had a scum read on her).

I feel like I'm the only person trying to consolidate my town reads onto a wagon that falls in the PoE, and for us to reach a consensus PoE. I mean, even you, what solving are you actively doing except OMGUS on Seanzie and silent voting Nanook? Who are your town and why should we be voting with you rather than you with us?

Okay, this is actually a good post too.

[Dyslexicon]

I actually read the thread.

Sometimes I don't make sense to people, but I hope some of this makes sense. If not, ask. And also please answer if I have questions (I've pinged you). Sorry to dump everything at once, but also not that sorry.

Luckbox

Spoiler: show

Yeah I do get that of course.....was being facetious in my post.

And yeah I had you as "strangely villagery" for D1 at least.

@Luckbox Inc If you recall, was the last line about DOO in this game or in a different game?

So I do prefer to village. But I'm not a bad wolf at all and was sort of mentally prepared to rand wolf for this game. Maybe next time though. I'm a pretty decent wolf though. I'll probably win my first wolf game here.

Green: I think for most (or almost everyone), this isn't something you say as wolf. It psychologically makes the stakes higher for you to win. It's a pre-boast that is rare for mafia imo.

(Also, Lucky do apparently actually prefer town lol)

No I'm doing all the right things. I'm interacting with everyone, thinking about players, making free flowing posts.

But what are you doing?

This is an objectively scummy post. However I feel the follow up with "I'm self aware" was good.

All in all I feel like Lucky has "good town/presence/flow/whatever" and that may not even be AI for him. However, I do think the specific boast is a town indicator. So I just think Lucky is probably town. Feels a bit weird for him to be teamed with Alison, and if Alison is town, feels weird to defend her so much, so he has that going for him as well.

Probably town.

Alison

Spoiler: show

[VOTE: NotAnAxehole] aubergine

DOO and Lunchbox tomorrow. Sheep my reads if I die.

Sheep my reads if I die on page 2. Gurl.

The frustration a bit upthread seems real.

Dizzy fakes emotion all the time as wolf.

I know this was prodded by Lucky mistaking Belzy for me.
However, I did ask "what emotion" to both Alison and Lucky, and Alison didn't comment.
I don't think I was at all emotional at the time, so Alison being eager to discredit whatever reason Lucky has for town reading me like this, without that being what actually even happened, I think just shows that Alison doesn't actually pay that close attention to what I'm posting. Seems more concerned with having a scum read on me than solving me in other words. Maybe this is a stretch tbh, but this doesn't sit well with me, and it's not just that post.

Let's say I flipped town on the spot.

What's your read on Dizzy?

This also. Sean had literally just said "If Alison is town Dizzy is scum". I think Alison is more concerned about putting things out there than taking things in, which is scummy for her.

Here's something for you to consider. Esooa wasn't particularly widely townread and wasn't that active or engaged in the thread. She had a couple of stubborn views, mainly that I was town and the people on my wagon were wolves.

She died in the night. There are two possible reasons why this could have happened. One is that she was right and was killed for her reads. The other is that she was wrong, Alison is mafia, and her death was WIFOM.

I know the second possibility is false, and if and when you flip me, you will also know this. Therefore if you flip me you should always take the first possibility as true and assume there's one or more mafia on my wagon yesterday.

Green: The fuck? There is obviously more than two possibilities for why Esooa died.

If anyone has arguments for me and dizzy being T/T make them now, else just promise to vote Dizzy if I ever flip

Yeah, we get it. You said this like five times now.

@Alison You are still not actually engaging with me. You've said I was scum from the get go. I've told you why I'm not. You haven't replied. So let me ask you: What experience do you have in reading me? I'm imagining you're town here. If you are, you're basically betting the game on me being mafia here by deliberately setting up a dichotomy between the two of us, insisting I should be killed after your alleged town flip. That's a lot of chill and confidence for a scum read that is basically "I don't like your read and Esooa died". Newsflash, I'm town. I don't really buy this position of yours. Also, why aren't you trying to solve for my teammates if you're so confident I'm scum?

Surely you realize that a lot of the last few pages have been me and Dizzy suspecting each other

Actually, I haven't been present for the last few pages, but feel free to speak for me I guess.

I do have at least some points where I agree with Alison in my notes. Also, to be fair, I should recognise a bias I have in suspecting/being extra harsh on strong players. If Alison is scum, I'm afraid she'll be able to talk herself out of any future situation and I won't be here to do anything about it (and even if I were, maybe I can't). I'm not actually sure I suspected Alison to that high of a degree before she reacted to my read. I do think the reaction is horrible, and I have a hard time seeing Alison act that way as town.

A thing that worries me is that I have at least soft reasons for thinking Alison is not teamed with quite a few people I don't town read. Nanook, maybe, but he did vote Alison D1 and now. Lu Ren seems too supportive/protective. Fingers had a piggy back that didn't seem like teammates (probably not impossible though). Alison + Ender + Someone is possible, and probably many other things. Maybe it doesn't really worry me that much tbh.

Anyway, I think there's a good chance Alison is just scum. Her read on me is stagnant and very much not well explained imo. Mismatch between apparent reason and confidence. There's places where I think she just fakes suspicion, especially in the beginning (worries/thoughts doesn't seem real), and also instances where it seems like she just doesn't care to pay attention (especially flat out saying I've said things I never have, or asking questions that's already answered), which is a mismatch to how strong she's repping her read and seems to care. If you care that much, why not care to get it right.

So that's the t on that. And if this is wrong, I'm sorry for doing my part of being sucked into a dichotomy I guess.

Scum lean

Fingers

Spoiler: show

I find that people more often have problems with how I post (“hedgy” as nanook says) especially early, but I usually seem to make it pretty obvious I’m town within the first few days.

Green: I like this from Fingers.

Counter point: This is pretty much the only thing I've liked from Fingers. My only other game I played with her, she was my top town read on D1. This game she's been barely present and lacklustre imo

I do think the one thing I pointed out is towny. Otherwise I've seen her being hedgy (which is apparently just her thing) and also softly landed support in different direction (on me as well). Town reads Alison, but admits she doesn't have much experience with her. Would fit with Alison both being mafia and town. I'll call it null on balance, but not really interested in chopping here now.

Null, but not worried right now.

Ender

Spoiler: show

Lu Ren is my townlock, no re

Ender's early town read on Lu is pretty weird to me. And this continues throughout the game.

@EnderWiggin Why exactly do you think Lu is town?

There's so much jokes and fluff in Ender's ISO! He's coming off really different than the one chance I've had to see him play (where he was town). Not sure if different game environment, site or alignment. I don't think one game is a good enough sample size, I also don't find his posts scummy per se, but I don't really love the overall vibe. Much more "light" than I'd expect. Where's the "let's do this" attitude? Cautious null.

Surprising null.

Nanook

Spoiler: show

Dizzy avoiding the thread is >rand mafia cmv

@NANOOKTHEGREATANDFEARSOME Why are you saying this? You've seen me as scum a few times. Did I avoid the thread?

Nanook is not really towny, and I've historically found him towny when he's town. Usually I see him trying to form a town core, but he has hardly had town reads or any reads this game. Seems lazy beyond normal Nanook. Comment about me is weird. Maybe less likely teamed with Alison because of vote, but actually not really, cause I've seen Nanook lean distancing and bus when scum. Kind of suss, wouldn't be surprised if scum.

Scum lean

Belzy/Mac

Spoiler: show

I have made 20+ posts, got my vote in, showed up today, learned the day is already in few hours. Done my job for today! Thank you all!!!!❤

Belzy very likely town. This is an example of a kind of "troll tone" I don't think they use on this site as mafia. She's capable of fake hunting and seeming "towny", and she's basically refusing this and instead gets upset by being suspected, which is also town for her. There are more posts like this. I feel there's more to this read, but I don't feel like explaining it.

Probably town

Lu Ren

Spoiler: show

Sorry, you'll have to settle for strong reads.

Omega and Alison are both just town because of their posts before/at the start of the argument. Omega posted about feeling differently as mafia vs town, saying that she feels a lot more pressured and nervous as mafia, and then immediately said "I might be struggling to engage this game". I think both of those posts could easily be made by mafia, but the progression is much more likely town. Her perspective is just pretty genuine, and that shows up in the way she reacts to Alison. For Alison, I think she's a very zealous player and is probably pretty aggressive even as mafia, but I don't think she'd pick the things she picked here to seize on, and the very quick and convinced conf-bias she went into that with felt organic and more intense than I think she'd be likely to do as mafia in that situation.

Axe is probably also town, not a ton to say here apart from shrugging my shoulder towards the votecount. I think the biggest thing I liked from him was how he reacted to the way people engaged with how he stepped into the argument when everyone else was standing back. Didn't feel like he was trying to get anything extra out of it either at the time or afterwards.

Falcon's entry post was so level 0 mafia that I'm tempted to just say burn it with fire, but I don't remember any of their other posts so I'm not going to commit here yet. The "what happened who can I sheep" at the particular point at which they entered made me cringe.

Luckbox just seems like mafia? The "haha I'm so pure nvm just taking the piss" probing, but especially the "axehole can be a wolf, voting him" is just the laziest and worst approach in the world and not in a towny way at all given thread momentum. He combined that take with saying "I was going to have Seanzie as a maybe, but he can be town sure" and it just feels very arbitrary and like there aren't actual thoughts behind any of what he's saying.

I don't know how to vote, apart from the poll.

Green: I don't have to squint that hard to see this as TMI. But actually, on reread I think I can more see what is possibly meant here.

@Lu Ren I know it's after the fact, but can you say why you thought the progression you referenced was much for likely town?

and the answer is "sure as hell hope not and regardless of my hopes probably not mafia don't make reads like she did there"

so if you don't want to get eliminated help us kill nook or someone like that

@Lu Ren Would you say that your read on Alison pushing DOO is for emotional/curtesy reasons? I don't know if I phrased that right.

Also, what name would I know you by?

I think this one could go either way. Honestly feel I have more questions than an actual read or lean. Kind of posts how I'd expect mafia to post tbh, but ultimately post style is probably NAI. How they went the detour around Esooa's early vote on me to justify their stance was hella weird and kind of can't get over that. Also doesn't seem to get a lot of attention? A cautious null, would want to know more.

Just null.

Falcon

Spoiler: show

This post was shortly before Syn subbed in for Grogu. BTSC maybe?

Upon reread, this post may not be as clearing as I first thought. Depends on what Falcon can fake, and I have limited experience with him. However, I don't really find anything wrong with his posts. They all seem fine and I get no pings, which is what has worked for me in reading him in my limited experience. So I'm pretty much fine with him, and this post is still probably > rand town.

Town lean.

Syn/Bo

Spoiler: show

that's a funny angleshoot, falcon can be town

If Falcon is town, Syn is more likely town imo. He reacts pretty simply by clearing Falcon off of his prod, which I don't think he has to as mafia. It would also be a weird w/w interaction, which seems unlikely.

I already feel like Alison needs to die to progress this game.

If and only if Alison is town, this is kind of weird though.

Very low content, but if I had to guess, I'd guess town mostly because of Syn.

Town lean

Sean

Spoiler: show

[VOTE: Alison] aubergine

@Seanzie Sorry if I'm incorrect, but I think you voted Alison in thread, but not actually in the poll. Any reason why?

According to my notes, Sean is the same alignment as Belzy. I probably had a reason. I do think Sean is most likely town, but I don't know if I have great justification for this tbh. Just his overall play "seems ok for Sean".

Town lean

Dizzy

Spoiler: show

I am still 100% fine with a dyslexicon vote btw

I'll NK you!

Lol if scum decided to NK Esooa because of this

SK

---

The two people not on the list is Axe and TSP.
My notes says one thing about Axe: - “Sheep my reads” but doesn’t have a (scum) read? I sometimes find him funny, I sometimes find him kind of rude, but I haven't found him to say anything AI.

TSP very null and I don't have any notes or comments.

This means that I actually have more nulls than other reads probably, which is pretty bad. I spent way too many hours reading and trying to form opinions and lay it out. I don't know if it makes any sense. I also have notes, but they probably make even less sense. But this where I be at the moment. Also, my not null reads are more lean-y than I would like them to be. I also don't really like the game state. If Alison is wolf, it's fine. However, there could still be more movement. And if Alison is town, it's very bad. In any case, please answer any questions I have, cause there's probably a reason I asked them.

[Dyslexicon]

I guess the easy version is

Town:
Belzy

Probably town:
Lucky

Town lean:
Falcon
Syn
Sean

Null:
Fingers
Ender
Lu Ren
Axe
TPS

Suss:
Alison
Nanook

I might move Fingers up if I'm generous.

[Dyslexicon]

Forgot to say about Alison: I see some people read her town for being aggressive or rather going aggressively at people. I've seen Alison do this as scum in Space Wars (or whatever that game was called). She's very capable of just going at people when scum. Basically, I think you're giving her too little credit if you think she can't. I don't want to come off as tunnelling Alison, but I don't think this is a reason to town read her.

That being said, I would like to hear any case for town reading my null people and below. I'm not really used to having this few and weak town reads. Scum the lot of you tbh tbh.

[Seanzie]

I actually read the thread.

Sometimes I don't make sense to people, but I hope some of this makes sense. If not, ask. And also please answer if I have questions (I've pinged you). Sorry to dump everything at once, but also not that sorry.

Luckbox

Spoiler: show

Yeah I do get that of course.....was being facetious in my post.

And yeah I had you as "strangely villagery" for D1 at least.

@Luckbox Inc If you recall, was the last line about DOO in this game or in a different game?

So I do prefer to village. But I'm not a bad wolf at all and was sort of mentally prepared to rand wolf for this game. Maybe next time though. I'm a pretty decent wolf though. I'll probably win my first wolf game here.

Green: I think for most (or almost everyone), this isn't something you say as wolf. It psychologically makes the stakes higher for you to win. It's a pre-boast that is rare for mafia imo.

(Also, Lucky do apparently actually prefer town lol)

No I'm doing all the right things. I'm interacting with everyone, thinking about players, making free flowing posts.

But what are you doing?

This is an objectively scummy post. However I feel the follow up with "I'm self aware" was good.

All in all I feel like Lucky has "good town/presence/flow/whatever" and that may not even be AI for him. However, I do think the specific boast is a town indicator. So I just think Lucky is probably town. Feels a bit weird for him to be teamed with Alison, and if Alison is town, feels weird to defend her so much, so he has that going for him as well.

Probably town.

Alison

Spoiler: show

[VOTE: NotAnAxehole] aubergine

DOO and Lunchbox tomorrow. Sheep my reads if I die.

Sheep my reads if I die on page 2. Gurl.

The frustration a bit upthread seems real.

Dizzy fakes emotion all the time as wolf.

I know this was prodded by Lucky mistaking Belzy for me.
However, I did ask "what emotion" to both Alison and Lucky, and Alison didn't comment.
I don't think I was at all emotional at the time, so Alison being eager to discredit whatever reason Lucky has for town reading me like this, without that being what actually even happened, I think just shows that Alison doesn't actually pay that close attention to what I'm posting. Seems more concerned with having a scum read on me than solving me in other words. Maybe this is a stretch tbh, but this doesn't sit well with me, and it's not just that post.

Let's say I flipped town on the spot.

What's your read on Dizzy?

This also. Sean had literally just said "If Alison is town Dizzy is scum". I think Alison is more concerned about putting things out there than taking things in, which is scummy for her.

Here's something for you to consider. Esooa wasn't particularly widely townread and wasn't that active or engaged in the thread. She had a couple of stubborn views, mainly that I was town and the people on my wagon were wolves.

She died in the night. There are two possible reasons why this could have happened. One is that she was right and was killed for her reads. The other is that she was wrong, Alison is mafia, and her death was WIFOM.

I know the second possibility is false, and if and when you flip me, you will also know this. Therefore if you flip me you should always take the first possibility as true and assume there's one or more mafia on my wagon yesterday.

Green: The fuck? There is obviously more than two possibilities for why Esooa died.

If anyone has arguments for me and dizzy being T/T make them now, else just promise to vote Dizzy if I ever flip

Yeah, we get it. You said this like five times now.

@Alison You are still not actually engaging with me. You've said I was scum from the get go. I've told you why I'm not. You haven't replied. So let me ask you: What experience do you have in reading me? I'm imagining you're town here. If you are, you're basically betting the game on me being mafia here by deliberately setting up a dichotomy between the two of us, insisting I should be killed after your alleged town flip. That's a lot of chill and confidence for a scum read that is basically "I don't like your read and Esooa died". Newsflash, I'm town. I don't really buy this position of yours. Also, why aren't you trying to solve for my teammates if you're so confident I'm scum?

Surely you realize that a lot of the last few pages have been me and Dizzy suspecting each other

Actually, I haven't been present for the last few pages, but feel free to speak for me I guess.

I do have at least some points where I agree with Alison in my notes. Also, to be fair, I should recognise a bias I have in suspecting/being extra harsh on strong players. If Alison is scum, I'm afraid she'll be able to talk herself out of any future situation and I won't be here to do anything about it (and even if I were, maybe I can't). I'm not actually sure I suspected Alison to that high of a degree before she reacted to my read. I do think the reaction is horrible, and I have a hard time seeing Alison act that way as town.

A thing that worries me is that I have at least soft reasons for thinking Alison is not teamed with quite a few people I don't town read. Nanook, maybe, but he did vote Alison D1 and now. Lu Ren seems too supportive/protective. Fingers had a piggy back that didn't seem like teammates (probably not impossible though). Alison + Ender + Someone is possible, and probably many other things. Maybe it doesn't really worry me that much tbh.

Anyway, I think there's a good chance Alison is just scum. Her read on me is stagnant and very much not well explained imo. Mismatch between apparent reason and confidence. There's places where I think she just fakes suspicion, especially in the beginning (worries/thoughts doesn't seem real), and also instances where it seems like she just doesn't care to pay attention (especially flat out saying I've said things I never have, or asking questions that's already answered), which is a mismatch to how strong she's repping her read and seems to care. If you care that much, why not care to get it right.

So that's the t on that. And if this is wrong, I'm sorry for doing my part of being sucked into a dichotomy I guess.

Scum lean

Fingers

Spoiler: show

I find that people more often have problems with how I post (“hedgy” as nanook says) especially early, but I usually seem to make it pretty obvious I’m town within the first few days.

Green: I like this from Fingers.

Counter point: This is pretty much the only thing I've liked from Fingers. My only other game I played with her, she was my top town read on D1. This game she's been barely present and lacklustre imo

I do think the one thing I pointed out is towny. Otherwise I've seen her being hedgy (which is apparently just her thing) and also softly landed support in different direction (on me as well). Town reads Alison, but admits she doesn't have much experience with her. Would fit with Alison both being mafia and town. I'll call it null on balance, but not really interested in chopping here now.

Null, but not worried right now.

Ender

Spoiler: show

Lu Ren is my townlock, no re

Ender's early town read on Lu is pretty weird to me. And this continues throughout the game.

@EnderWiggin Why exactly do you think Lu is town?

There's so much jokes and fluff in Ender's ISO! He's coming off really different than the one chance I've had to see him play (where he was town). Not sure if different game environment, site or alignment. I don't think one game is a good enough sample size, I also don't find his posts scummy per se, but I don't really love the overall vibe. Much more "light" than I'd expect. Where's the "let's do this" attitude? Cautious null.

Surprising null.

Nanook

Spoiler: show

Dizzy avoiding the thread is >rand mafia cmv

@NANOOKTHEGREATANDFEARSOME Why are you saying this? You've seen me as scum a few times. Did I avoid the thread?

Nanook is not really towny, and I've historically found him towny when he's town. Usually I see him trying to form a town core, but he has hardly had town reads or any reads this game. Seems lazy beyond normal Nanook. Comment about me is weird. Maybe less likely teamed with Alison because of vote, but actually not really, cause I've seen Nanook lean distancing and bus when scum. Kind of suss, wouldn't be surprised if scum.

Scum lean

Belzy/Mac

Spoiler: show

I have made 20+ posts, got my vote in, showed up today, learned the day is already in few hours. Done my job for today! Thank you all!!!!❤

Belzy very likely town. This is an example of a kind of "troll tone" I don't think they use on this site as mafia. She's capable of fake hunting and seeming "towny", and she's basically refusing this and instead gets upset by being suspected, which is also town for her. There are more posts like this. I feel there's more to this read, but I don't feel like explaining it.

Probably town

Lu Ren

Spoiler: show

Sorry, you'll have to settle for strong reads.

Omega and Alison are both just town because of their posts before/at the start of the argument. Omega posted about feeling differently as mafia vs town, saying that she feels a lot more pressured and nervous as mafia, and then immediately said "I might be struggling to engage this game". I think both of those posts could easily be made by mafia, but the progression is much more likely town. Her perspective is just pretty genuine, and that shows up in the way she reacts to Alison. For Alison, I think she's a very zealous player and is probably pretty aggressive even as mafia, but I don't think she'd pick the things she picked here to seize on, and the very quick and convinced conf-bias she went into that with felt organic and more intense than I think she'd be likely to do as mafia in that situation.

Axe is probably also town, not a ton to say here apart from shrugging my shoulder towards the votecount. I think the biggest thing I liked from him was how he reacted to the way people engaged with how he stepped into the argument when everyone else was standing back. Didn't feel like he was trying to get anything extra out of it either at the time or afterwards.

Falcon's entry post was so level 0 mafia that I'm tempted to just say burn it with fire, but I don't remember any of their other posts so I'm not going to commit here yet. The "what happened who can I sheep" at the particular point at which they entered made me cringe.

Luckbox just seems like mafia? The "haha I'm so pure nvm just taking the piss" probing, but especially the "axehole can be a wolf, voting him" is just the laziest and worst approach in the world and not in a towny way at all given thread momentum. He combined that take with saying "I was going to have Seanzie as a maybe, but he can be town sure" and it just feels very arbitrary and like there aren't actual thoughts behind any of what he's saying.

I don't know how to vote, apart from the poll.

Green: I don't have to squint that hard to see this as TMI. But actually, on reread I think I can more see what is possibly meant here.

@Lu Ren I know it's after the fact, but can you say why you thought the progression you referenced was much for likely town?

and the answer is "sure as hell hope not and regardless of my hopes probably not mafia don't make reads like she did there"

so if you don't want to get eliminated help us kill nook or someone like that

@Lu Ren Would you say that your read on Alison pushing DOO is for emotional/curtesy reasons? I don't know if I phrased that right.

Also, what name would I know you by?

I think this one could go either way. Honestly feel I have more questions than an actual read or lean. Kind of posts how I'd expect mafia to post tbh, but ultimately post style is probably NAI. How they went the detour around Esooa's early vote on me to justify their stance was hella weird and kind of can't get over that. Also doesn't seem to get a lot of attention? A cautious null, would want to know more.

Just null.

Falcon

Spoiler: show

This post was shortly before Syn subbed in for Grogu. BTSC maybe?

Upon reread, this post may not be as clearing as I first thought. Depends on what Falcon can fake, and I have limited experience with him. However, I don't really find anything wrong with his posts. They all seem fine and I get no pings, which is what has worked for me in reading him in my limited experience. So I'm pretty much fine with him, and this post is still probably > rand town.

Town lean.

Syn/Bo

Spoiler: show

that's a funny angleshoot, falcon can be town

If Falcon is town, Syn is more likely town imo. He reacts pretty simply by clearing Falcon off of his prod, which I don't think he has to as mafia. It would also be a weird w/w interaction, which seems unlikely.

I already feel like Alison needs to die to progress this game.

If and only if Alison is town, this is kind of weird though.

Very low content, but if I had to guess, I'd guess town mostly because of Syn.

Town lean

Sean

Spoiler: show

[VOTE: Alison] aubergine

@Seanzie Sorry if I'm incorrect, but I think you voted Alison in thread, but not actually in the poll. Any reason why?

According to my notes, Sean is the same alignment as Belzy. I probably had a reason. I do think Sean is most likely town, but I don't know if I have great justification for this tbh. Just his overall play "seems ok for Sean".

Town lean

Dizzy

Spoiler: show

I am still 100% fine with a dyslexicon vote btw

I'll NK you!

Lol if scum decided to NK Esooa because of this

SK

---

The two people not on the list is Axe and TSP.
My notes says one thing about Axe: - “Sheep my reads” but doesn’t have a (scum) read? I sometimes find him funny, I sometimes find him kind of rude, but I haven't found him to say anything AI.

TSP very null and I don't have any notes or comments.

This means that I actually have more nulls than other reads probably, which is pretty bad. I spent way too many hours reading and trying to form opinions and lay it out. I don't know if it makes any sense. I also have notes, but they probably make even less sense. But this where I be at the moment. Also, my not null reads are more lean-y than I would like them to be. I also don't really like the game state. If Alison is wolf, it's fine. However, there could still be more movement. And if Alison is town, it's very bad. In any case, please answer any questions I have, cause there's probably a reason I asked them.

I did vote Alison in the thread and not in the poll. That was intentional. I didn't want Alison to go over, and the thread was a bit stagnant moving into EoD, so I fake voted Alison to create some movement to try to help form reads.

[Dyslexicon]

I did vote Alison in the thread and not in the poll. That was intentional. I didn't want Alison to go over, and the thread was a bit stagnant moving into EoD, so I fake voted Alison to create some movement to try to help form reads.

But it was 2 minutes before EoD though. Not really much time for movement. I remember cause I wanted Alison to go over instead, and your "vote" maybe making it a slight possibility.

Where can I find the EoD VC btw, anyone?

[Seanzie]

I did vote Alison in the thread and not in the poll. That was intentional. I didn't want Alison to go over, and the thread was a bit stagnant moving into EoD, so I fake voted Alison to create some movement to try to help form reads.

But it was 2 minutes before EoD though. Not really much time for movement. I remember cause I wanted Alison to go over instead, and your "vote" maybe making it a slight possibility.

Where can I find the EoD VC btw, anyone?

The fact that you voted after me suggests that there was time for movement?

[Dyslexicon]

The fact that you voted after me suggests that there was time for movement?

Well, yeah, exactly two minutes.

[Seanzie]

The fact that you voted after me suggests that there was time for movement?

Well, yeah, exactly two minutes.

I mean, I'm not saying I always have the best plays.

[Dyslexicon]

The fact that you voted after me suggests that there was time for movement?

Well, yeah, exactly two minutes.

I mean, I'm not saying I always have the best plays.

Lol fair

[Dyslexicon]

Anyway, I'm going to bed. As it stands, I would vote Alison or Nanook today. Or convince me otherwise.

[MacDougall]

Hey Mac, any reason you swapped to Nanook silently?

Yes

[MacDougall]

@MacDougall So you're reading Nanook and Seanzie as the mafia team? - I'm seeing Ender and Alison...

What's your level of confidence and how do we consolidate our reads?

We probably vote elsewhere lol

[MacDougall]

[VOTE: Falcon] aubergine like here or something

[EnderWiggin]

I did vote Alison in the thread and not in the poll. That was intentional. I didn't want Alison to go over, and the thread was a bit stagnant moving into EoD, so I fake voted Alison to create some movement to try to help form reads.

But it was 2 minutes before EoD though. Not really much time for movement. I remember cause I wanted Alison to go over instead, and your "vote" maybe making it a slight possibility.

Where can I find the EoD VC btw, anyone?

First post in thread.

[EnderWiggin]

Lu Ren is my townlock, no re

Ender's early town read on Lu is pretty weird to me. And this continues throughout the game.

@EnderWiggin Why exactly do you think Lu is town?

There's so much jokes and fluff in Ender's ISO! He's coming off really different than the one chance I've had to see him play (where he was town). Not sure if different game environment, site or alignment. I don't think one game is a good enough sample size, I also don't find his posts scummy per se, but I don't really love the overall vibe. Much more "light" than I'd expect. Where's the "let's do this" attitude? Cautious null.

People going to have to get used to me playing how I play lmao.

As for Lu Ren, their attitude and progression has been town-lined. The "No re" is slightly a joke but I'd have to re-read and find a lot more scumminess than I've seen to reverse it.

Every time Lu has been in thread they've acted in a town manner. I can case it at some point maybe, but I've been tired-ish last few days.

[EnderWiggin]

[VOTE: Falcon] aubergine like here or something

What do you scumread about Falcon? Lemme know.

[EnderWiggin]

After dinner I might try setting aside time to re-read all the posts in this game so far. Will need to get some coffee for it.

[EnderWiggin]

Hey Mac, any reason you swapped to Nanook silently?

Yes

Lemme know

[TonyStarkPrime]

ok oops i'm back for real

[TonyStarkPrime]

i can probably do this in half a second

[TonyStarkPrime]

I guess the relevant question to ask yourself is "would nanook care enough about trying to win not to troll star?"

I think there's an obvious answer tbh

which one's star

[EnderWiggin]

Star = NotAnAxehole

[TonyStarkPrime]

the dude seems to usually troll himself, not that much work

[MacDougall]

[VOTE: Falcon] aubergine like here or something

What do you scumread about Falcon? Lemme know.

he has been ignored entirely while he's done sfa to deserve to be

[MacDougall]

Hey Mac, any reason you swapped to Nanook silently?

Yes

Lemme know

just downloading information