Everyone's JOATED: Guillo's Roles (Town Wins)

[Dolby]

Listo, Scotty, C4, Nanook is a tough solve for an individual for me tbh

[Dolby]

For 100% clarity, I received Honeys card N3

[MacDougall]

A surviving mafia having my card is... not bad but worse than them not having it. Assuming that Nanook is town, TH might have a ability to force 2 or even 3 player swaps on even nights.

I am confused af by this post.

[MacDougall]

For 100% clarity, I received Honeys card N3

You received Honey's card N3 and Nanooks at dawn of the same phase?

[NANOOKTHEGREATANDFEARSOME]

N2 Honey gets Nook's card. Nook gets TH's card. Dolby gets Honey's card. Neither Nook or Dolby claim it. Honey didn't do it or she would have told HK in DVC. The default swap chance is very low so for all these to go off is odd.
N3 Nook swaps it with Listo and again succeeds against the odds.

TH therefore has Dolby's card?

Someone has an ability to make all card swaps succeed and used it n2? Possibly a passive of someone's?

@Dolby should we be concerned if TH has your card?

TH having my card isn't an issue given they die today and the next opportunity to pass it would have been tonight

Also, I received Nanook's card during N3/dawn leading into D4

That...doesn't seem possible? Didn't my card flip with honey?

[MacDougall]

I assume he meant to write Honey.

[MacDougall]

So TripleHaven is in a funny spot.

He has clearly gone belly up and is outed mafia.

However he is so resigned he hasn't bothered to get to 10 posts. He is on one post.

Which means if he survives today he is a vanilla wolf.

Which is why I was trying to find a 2nd wolf earlier. I intended to do this closer to EOD. But I kinda wanna open discussion here and now because like worst case scenario is TH comes back and makes some posts oh well big deal right.

Am I crazy or is this a good opportunity?

TH is there for us tomorrow anyway right?

Do we get any true information via his flip?

We could go a long way to winning if we chop the a non TH wolf and leave a vanilla TH behind.

Do we have anything to lose by chopping someone else in the POE here first?

[MacDougall]

@c4e5g3d5 ... I think you might be right about Lime Coke. I just read his ISO and he is scummy. If I had to point something out in particular it would be his dealing with your slot. He wanted to bury Creature but that slowly dissipated for no apparent reason and in the face of youn subbing into that slot he has refused to pick back up the suspicion.

Also his post count deteriorated every day. As the game has gone on his wim to solve has dried up.

Maybe you are just that good...

[Alison]

So TripleHaven is in a funny spot.

He has clearly gone belly up and is outed mafia.

However he is so resigned he hasn't bothered to get to 10 posts. He is on one post.

Which means if he survives today he is a vanilla wolf.

Which is why I was trying to find a 2nd wolf earlier. I intended to do this closer to EOD. But I kinda wanna open discussion here and now because like worst case scenario is TH comes back and makes some posts oh well big deal right.

Am I crazy or is this a good opportunity?

TH is there for us tomorrow anyway right?

Do we get any true information via his flip?

We could go a long way to winning if we chop the a non TH wolf and leave a vanilla TH behind.

Do we have anything to lose by chopping someone else in the POE here first?

If we're worried about losing the game to a big soup kill then missing on our attempt to find the other wolf would make it vastly easier. In fact if they have four roles identified (Mac, LC, Dolby, HK), then a misexe today wins them the game.

10 players, exe a town goes to 9 players, TH + buddy soup 4 and kill 1 goes to 4 players with two wolves = parity. I am unwilling to throw the game like that and would rather take the safe option.

[MacDougall]

Reasonable point.

[Alison]

@c4e5g3d5 ... I think you might be right about Lime Coke. I just read his ISO and he is scummy. If I had to point something out in particular it would be his dealing with your slot. He wanted to bury Creature but that slowly dissipated for no apparent reason and in the face of youn subbing into that slot he has refused to pick back up the suspicion.

Also his post count deteriorated every day. As the game has gone on his wim to solve has dried up.

Maybe you are just that good...

My read on LC is that his logs are bad and his presence in the soup kill is good.

Essentially if you believe the soup kill is a genuine attempt at murdering town then LC is cleared, if you harbor doubts about how real it is then LC should be POE'd. I believe the soup kill is real (see previous analysis) so I am comfortable clearing LC here.

[c4e5g3d5]

@c4e5g3d5 @Alison @Lime Coke @Scotty you all still have your original cards yes?

I don't know what this means

in the discord you will have a card at the top of the chan you have with guillo... it should be creatures card

It is

[c4e5g3d5]

So TripleHaven is in a funny spot.

He has clearly gone belly up and is outed mafia.

However he is so resigned he hasn't bothered to get to 10 posts. He is on one post.

Which means if he survives today he is a vanilla wolf.

Which is why I was trying to find a 2nd wolf earlier. I intended to do this closer to EOD. But I kinda wanna open discussion here and now because like worst case scenario is TH comes back and makes some posts oh well big deal right.

Am I crazy or is this a good opportunity?

TH is there for us tomorrow anyway right?

Do we get any true information via his flip?

We could go a long way to winning if we chop the a non TH wolf and leave a vanilla TH behind.

Do we have anything to lose by chopping someone else in the POE here first?

Compelling
But I in particular would vastly prefer a guaranteed wolf today

[c4e5g3d5]

The LC case is far from bulletproof, but I'm more than comfortable saying that if it's someone in the soup, it's him.

[Guillotine]

TripleHaven was eliminated!

They were Town

Town Jack Of All Trades.

You win when all mafia aligned players are eliminated. You may holster

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As Town Jack Of All Trades, you have access to one or more night actions. Don't have to use in any specific order

x3 Gun License Owner
This is a day action. When you activate this ability, it is valid for the day and following night. You can never be roleblocked when using a gun-flavored action and any guns you use can never backfire on you.

x3 Bullshitter
You are tired of all the bullshit in the thread. During the day, you may reply to one post with "**Bullshit.**", yes! In bold! If the post is accusing you of being a wolf, you gain the ability to track that player the following night only. If the post is calling you town, you gain the ability to redirect any actions made on that player to yourself for the following night. If the post is too ambiguous, nothing will happen.

x3 Traffic Controller
The Traffic Controller may at night target two players. Those two targeted players will as a result of this action target each other.

You got a limited amount of Gun License, Bullshitter and Traffic Controller uses.

[Guillotine]

Night 5 Begins

[Guillotine]

Three Players Have Died

Listo95 was Town

c4e5g3d5 was Town

Nanook was Mafia

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Listo95

► Show Spoiler

Town Jack Of All Trades.

You win when all mafia aligned players are eliminated.


As Town Jack Of All Trades, you have access to one or more night actions. Don't have to use in any specific order.

x3 Babysitter
The Babysitter may at night protect someone from being killed. However, if the Babysitter is killed, the Babysitter's target will die as well.

x3 Prison Warren
The Prison Warren may each night put a player in jail, which will prevent any actions against and from that player.

x2 Bodyguard
The Bodyguard may each night target a player and protect them from death by dying in their stead if they're targeted for death.

You got a limited amount of Babysitter, Prison warren and Bodyguard uses.

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c4e5g3d5

► Show Spoiler

Town Jack Of All Trades.

You win when all mafia aligned players are eliminated.


As Town Jack Of All Trades, you have access to one or more night actions. Don't have to use in any specific order.

x3 Babysitter
The Babysitter may at night protect someone from being killed. However, if the Babysitter is killed, the Babysitter's target will die as well.

x3 Prison Warren
The Prison Warren may each night put a player in jail, which will prevent any actions against and from that player.

x2 Bodyguard
The Bodyguard may each night target a player and protect them from death by dying in their stead if they're targeted for death.

You got a limited amount of Babysitter, Prison warren and Bodyguard uses.

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Nanook

► Show Spoiler

You win upon reaching parity to town and all other threats to your survival are dead.
You may not holster your actions

As Mafia, you have access to the Factional Night Kill Action. Players targeted with this action will die at the end of the Night unless protected. Submit your Night Action each night by private messaging any of the hosts. You may change your target as many times as you want. The last action submitted will be used. If no Mafia submit an action, a player will be picked at random from the living non-Mafia players.
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As Mafia Jack Of All Trades, you have access to one or more night actions. Don't have to use in any specific order.

x3 Vigilante
The Vigilante may kill a player at night.

x2 Killing Framer
The killing framer may at night target a player. The killing framer will kill one random person who targets that player with a night action on that same night (except for investigations), in addition to making your target immune to the person's actions that night. If targeted by investigation actions, your target will show as opposite alignment. If targeted by multiple people, no one dies.

x3 Watcher
The Watcher may watch a player at night and learn the names of all the players that used a night action on that player that same night.

You get a limited amount of Vigilante, Killing Framer and Watcher uses.

[Guillotine]

An Active Role Has Been Revealed!

► Show Spoiler

Mafia Jack Of All Trades.

You win upon reaching parity to town and all other threats to your survival are dead. You may holster your actions

As Mafia, you have access to the Factional Night Kill Action. Players targeted with this action will die at the end of the Night unless protected. Submit your Night Action each night by private messaging any of the hosts. You may change your target as many times as you want. The last action submitted will be used. If no Mafia submit an action, a player will be picked at random from the living non-Mafia players.
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As Mafia Jack Of All Trades, you have access to one or more night actions. Don't have to use in any specific order.

x3 Kidnapper

The player you target that night will be unable to post and vote the next day. Their absence and return will be announced by the mod.

x2 Izanoomi

You may choose a target during the day and cast “Izanoomi” on it, trapping the target in an eternal time-loop in its own mind. During the day the target will only be able to post the same last post it posted to the thread the previous day, except for the vote (if there was one). The target may vote as it normally would but always accompanied by the same post referred to in this role description.

And every night it’ll perform the same action it was targeted by from the night it was trapped with the Izanoomi, against a random non-mafia player. The target will not be informed of this. If it's a killing action and the random player is already dead, your target will still attempt the action but fail. If your target was targeted by more than one player that night, then the action will be randomized between those actions every night.

The curse will automatically be lifted upon your death.

x3 Factional Guillotine Enabler

The Factional Guillotine is a day action that replaces both the factional kill and the soup kill options.
As long as you are alive, your faction may choose to perform the factional guillotine, killing whoever places the last vote on the lynched player that day, disabling the factional night kill and soup kill the following night. You must submit this action at least 15 minutes before the elimination.

If successful, the host will post “A head rolls inadvertently” followed by the target's alignment flip only (without the role).

You got a limited amount of Kidnapper, Izanoomi and Factional Guillotine uses.

[Guillotine]

The Hammer has been activated

It takes 4 to hammer someone on Day 6

[Guillotine]

@Alison
@Dolby
@Lime Coke
@MacDougall
@Scotty
@hollowkatt

If there is an early hammer, night will begin immediately and the day will start at the closest SoD time available. (11:00 EST)

[MacDougall]

I am never making a read on Nanook again.

[hollowkatt]

I'm victim blaming TH.
I'm also not voting for a while

[MacDougall]

Okay soon

TH flipping town is nuts. I was stunned. His claim made no sense with his pushes.

This mafia role that got exposed looks to be false because none of those actions have been used since n2. I assume that Martin had the kidnap and the izanoomi because my curse lifted when he died. I assume that the Mafia used tactician to reassign a bunch of roles on n3. Which explains how Nanook flipped with no role that explains the shenanigans that occured on n2 with the card swapping which should now clearly be him.

I still think that the soup kill was probably real. This exposed role speaks of it as though it is a night action and it occurred during the day but that might just be missing info. I think the fact that the Mafia haven't used one and its now day 6 heavily implies it was real and used up.

Is Scotty just the last Mafia here?

[MacDougall]

I am a little paranoid there are two wolves alive.

[MacDougall]

Like it feels like there should be a janitor. There also needs an explanation for why c4 and listo flipped with the same roles which also looks like a mafia ability. If either of those are true and the exposed role card is actually in play and active then there are two wolves left.

That would mean fake soup or it would mean Hollowkatt's card is bogus info. Which... like bastard game so why not.

[hollowkatt]

Wheee I lost power

[MacDougall]

I was disloyal PGO last night so its plausible Listo or C4 weren't paying attention to my claim and targeted me and died fwiw.

I doubt they target each other. So it makes more sense that there was a BG save.

It'd be pretty cooked if they did somehow both have the same role. Maybe one of them was able to copy another players role originally or something.

[hollowkatt]

I highly doubt they had the same role, that doesn't make any sense.

[hollowkatt]

If the soup was real then who's clears off of that?
Alison
Dolby
Lime
Mac

Leaving me/scotty

Therefor Scotty

[hollowkatt]

Why not kill in the soup though

[hollowkatt]

power is back!

[Alison]

Why not kill in the soup though

Given both dead townies flipped Bodyguard I'll venture that they might very well have.

[Alison]

I am also considering the possibility that TH's flip was faked. His death was written on the walls far in advance, giving mafia plenty of time to prepare the death-godfather role or whatever it is. He also seemed weirdly okay with just flopping over and dying which further cements that possibility.

[hollowkatt]

Why not kill in the soup though

Given both dead townies flipped Bodyguard I'll venture that they might very well have.

How do we get two people with the same role though? Other than that yeah, I agree with you. C4 and Listo are never the kills here.

[Alison]

Nanook's flip also proves the soup is real. He had extra KP (a vigilante JOAT role), but no more than one townie died on any night before this. He is on a three action cycle, so we should expect to see 2 mafia KP on a night before Night 5 since he has vigilante.

Ergo the mafia's factional kill was taken from them as a result of the failed soup, and he used his vigilante shot to fill in for that night.

[Alison]

Why not kill in the soup though

Given both dead townies flipped Bodyguard I'll venture that they might very well have.

How do we get two people with the same role though? Other than that yeah, I agree with you. C4 and Listo are never the kills here.

In the Percy/Kate crossover game, which was closed role madness, there were multiple townies with the same role. This was in order to punish a massclaim as two townies would counterclaim each other and confuse the town. A similar thing could be going on here as a contingency in case mafia waste their soup early and town feels like they can massclaim. Listo/c4 counterclaiming each other here might well have lost the game for us in some worlds.

Another option is that one of them has a role that can copy the abilities of another.

[hollowkatt]

Nanook's flip also proves the soup is real. He had extra KP (a vigilante JOAT role), but no more than one townie died on any night before this. He is on a three action cycle, so we should expect to see 2 mafia KP on a night before Night 5 since he has vigilante.

Ergo the mafia's factional kill was taken from them as a result of the failed soup, and he used his vigilante shot to fill in for that night.

A Soup Kill Has Been Attempted!

The following soup kill has been submitted:

MacDougall - Ascetic
Dolby - Lie Detector
Lime Coke - Doctor
Alison - Bomb Giver

One or more of these players has been wrongly matched to their roles, as a result, the soup kill fails and the mafia team will lose their factional kill for tonight.

If we believe claims you're the only one they got wrong, yeah?
Mac already claimed Ascetic. Dolby 100% used Lie Detector to kill Ender, and Lime claimed Doctor.

So the last wolf is guaranteed to be within you, me, scotty.
I know I'm town, I believe you are town. Therefore Scotty. Your perspective may be different, if it is, talk to me about it.

The only reason I include you here is b/c you are unverified by action or claim vs the rest of the soup, and while I think it's highly unlikely it's possible you are the deep wolf and your presence in the soup was to ensure you go as deep as possible.

But that's my tinfoil for if chopping scotty doesn't end the game.

[hollowkatt]

Why not kill in the soup though

Given both dead townies flipped Bodyguard I'll venture that they might very well have.

How do we get two people with the same role though? Other than that yeah, I agree with you. C4 and Listo are never the kills here.

In the Percy/Kate crossover game, which was closed role madness, there were multiple townies with the same role. This was in order to punish a massclaim as two townies would counterclaim each other and confuse the town. A similar thing could be going on here as a contingency in case mafia waste their soup early and town feels like they can massclaim. Listo/c4 counterclaiming each other here might well have lost the game for us in some worlds.

Another option is that one of them has a role that can copy the abilities of another.

ok that makes more sense and does seem like something Guillo would do. That bastard ;-)

[Alison]

Yes, the mafia got my role wrong.

I know I am town, I also believe you are town, and I believe the last wolf is Scotty.

I am verified by action: I was responsible for Michelle's death. Nobody else has claimed responsibility. I have also been kidnapped on a day I'd be poised to completely control the town if I was a deepwolf.

[hollowkatt]

Yes, the mafia got my role wrong.

I know I am town, I also believe you are town, and I believe the last wolf is Scotty.

I am verified by action: I was responsible for Michelle's death. Nobody else has claimed responsibility. I have also been kidnapped on a day I'd be poised to completely control the town if I was a deepwolf.

yeah, that's right you did claim Michelle and nobody countered.
Yeah, we just kill scotty here.

[Alison]

I believe the soup is real (see my point about nanook's KP) so I am clearing LC/Mac/Dolby. HK is only scum if he was death-godfathered and pretended to be rezzed VT when he was in fact rezzed goon. I suppose the writing on the wall was there so they had time to setup but he has been townie on play and it would be weird for the mafia to just send HK barrelling in like that guns blazing to suicide and flip wrong. Especially since they might not have known a resurrector exists.

[hollowkatt]

I think we should wait for dolby and lime to check in with anything they want to add, but I'm planning on voting for scotty today

[hollowkatt]

I believe the soup is real (see my point about nanook's KP) so I am clearing LC/Mac/Dolby. HK is only scum if he was death-godfathered and pretended to be rezzed VT when he was in fact rezzed goon. I suppose the writing on the wall was there so they had time to setup but he has been townie on play and it would be weird for the mafia to just send HK barrelling in like that guns blazing to suicide and flip wrong. Especially since they might not have known a resurrector exists.

I resurrected based on my card, it's in the discord channel. Every day I am dead there's a 10% chance of resurrection but only once.

[Alison]

Oh right.

[Alison]

I am waiting for everyone else to check in because of possible night action results.

My current intent is to vote Scotty.

[Scotty]

I think we should wait for dolby and lime to check in with anything they want to add, but I'm planning on voting for scotty today

How kind of you to make up your mind without even hearing from me.

So! My whole POE has been annihilated. That’s whack.

After Th flipped town, which makes absolutely no sense, I started getting curious about the soup kill legitimacy. On one hand, I was sus of either listo or Nook, but figured they were not on the same team based on ISO’s. I’m confident that those flips are not fake unless they’re both fake, but that doesn’t sound right.

Thank you to whoever gave me that fabulous gift last night.

[Scotty]

How idiotic would I have to be to put myself in a position with a rezzed townie and the soup? I would try and ingratiate myself more as town, as I haven’t been able to clear myself. The only clearing I can do is outting my role, which I have no clear reason to do because soup.

[Scotty]

The logical move here is to vote me, but I am going to be town. This is possibly MYLO.

The other move here is to think of other options.
Here’s a few:

Why HK is bad:
He started as town, and was rezzed, but we don’t know that he was rezzed with his precious alignment. If someone can show me proof, otherwise this sounds like an easy way to coast to the end. Plus, Martin voted for him which made all of us put on our angry train conductor hats because ‘the nerve of this guy’. But that certainly makes HK look better.

The soup may actually be fake:
So hear me out on this possible gambit I was thinking about. Lime Coke is the one I’m most sus about in this soup. The other ones don’t have scum equity based on their actions and what has happened thus far in game to them.

But scenario: Lime Coke makes some despairing “soft claim” of doctor after honey dies. Put in soup. Factional kill is still in play. The vig shot in nook’s revealed role may be a red herring to legitimize the soup puzzle. He coasts. Because let’s be honest, what has LC done since honey died? Nothing.

Seeing that nook flipped with vig is curious and puts a slight wrinkle on the ‘fake soup kill’ option tho.

[hollowkatt]

The logical move here is to vote me, but I am going to be town. This is possibly MYLO.

The other move here is to think of other options.
Here’s a few:

Why HK is bad:
He started as town, and was rezzed, but we don’t know that he was rezzed with his precious alignment. If someone can show me proof, otherwise this sounds like an easy way to coast to the end. Plus, Martin voted for him which made all of us put on our angry train conductor hats because ‘the nerve of this guy’. But that certainly makes HK look better.

The soup may actually be fake:
So hear me out on this possible gambit I was thinking about. Lime Coke is the one I’m most sus about in this soup. The other ones don’t have scum equity based on their actions and what has happened thus far in game to them.

But scenario: Lime Coke makes some despairing “soft claim” of doctor after honey dies. Put in soup. Factional kill is still in play. The vig shot in nook’s revealed role may be a red herring to legitimize the soup puzzle. He coasts. Because let’s be honest, what has LC done since honey died? Nothing.

Seeing that nook flipped with vig is curious and puts a slight wrinkle on the ‘fake soup kill’ option tho.

I'm sorry, did you miss the part of my card that says I resurrect with the same alignment as I died with? Because that's the only thing I can think of that would get you walking down the "hk flipped town but came back wolf" trail unless you are a wolf and need to exe me to win.

It's in the main discord channel btw if you wanna go look at it.

So your wolf reads now would be me/Lime?

[Scotty]

It’s just so hard for me to believe that HK is bad tho. I don’t think he is a new faction. Seems pretty cut and dry that that’s not in this game.
It would HAVE to be a mafia role that can Rez a player on a whim. Makes sense to be HK after his flavor card as revealed, but is that a role that would even exist?