Game Over! Monty Python and the Holy Grail

[Bullzeye]

You're not the only one, Bullz. Of the things you mentioned, I'm most concerned by Dana's vouch. It's just so out of the blue, and Dana's absence in the last few game days (even before she was silenced) and then her sudden appearance to defend Boogs is just odd. I'm more and more beginning to see this as a recruitment game, and I think maybe the baddies have been persuing a "recruit the quiet and blendy"-type strategy while we tear all the talkative people apart in the thread. I think Dana might be the most recent recruit, and I think that might explain her out-of-nowhere defense of Boogs.

I see where you're coming from but with only one confirmed dead recruit 9 days in I feel like we'd have seen more. Unless maybe recruitments can only happen in certain circumstances?

I also think LoRab's point about the silencer possibly being civ is omsething we need to consider. Maybe people aren't being silenced becasue they're on to the baddies, maybe they're being silenced because a civ thinks they ARE a baddie?? Or maybe there is a bad silencer and a civ silencer, working on opposing nights? I dunno if that helps us narrow our thoughts any, but it is an interesting thing to keep in mind.

All I'll say is there's (what I think is) a pretty good reason for my belief that the silencer is bad. Not to mention the Boogs-related circumstances surrounding my own silencing.

[Canucklehead]

You're not the only one, Bullz. Of the things you mentioned, I'm most concerned by Dana's vouch. It's just so out of the blue, and Dana's absence in the last few game days (even before she was silenced) and then her sudden appearance to defend Boogs is just odd. I'm more and more beginning to see this as a recruitment game, and I think maybe the baddies have been persuing a "recruit the quiet and blendy"-type strategy while we tear all the talkative people apart in the thread. I think Dana might be the most recent recruit, and I think that might explain her out-of-nowhere defense of Boogs.

I see where you're coming from but with only one confirmed dead recruit 9 days in I feel like we'd have seen more. Unless maybe recruitments can only happen in certain circumstances?

Yeah, but Bullz, other than the recruit, we've only killed one team-affiliated baddie in those 9 days, too. It's not like our track record is stunning, and we've been killing loads of non-recruit baddies during that time. :P

But I understand what you're saying. There isn't a lot of evidence to support my theory based on lynches. TBH, I think the most convincing evidence that there is one baddie recruitment team (as opposed to two regular baddie teams) is that there have been no baddies killed in NK crossfire. That's weird to me, but maybe they've just been unlucky? Or only targeting civs? Or are as bad at reading alignment as the rest of us?

Regardless, I'm not entirely convinced that this speculation helps us out in practical terms for this particular lynch, so I'll stop thinking out loud now and start figuring out who the hell I'm going to vote for....

I also think LoRab's point about the silencer possibly being civ is omsething we need to consider. Maybe people aren't being silenced becasue they're on to the baddies, maybe they're being silenced because a civ thinks they ARE a baddie?? Or maybe there is a bad silencer and a civ silencer, working on opposing nights? I dunno if that helps us narrow our thoughts any, but it is an interesting thing to keep in mind.

All I'll say is there's (what I think is) a pretty good reason for my belief that the silencer is bad. Not to mention the Boogs-related circumstances surrounding my own silencing.[/quote]
OK. I'm assuming this is a reason that you can't share in the thread, so I'll let the civ-silencer thought take a backseat for the moment...not because I neccessarily trust you or your info (I'm really, really p in the air on you at this point), but because (again) I'm not sure that speculating about it is going to get me any closer to deciding who to vote for, and I need to focus on that.

[Canucklehead]

^^ Fucked up the second quote there...here it is, fixed:

I also think LoRab's point about the silencer possibly being civ is omsething we need to consider. Maybe people aren't being silenced becasue they're on to the baddies, maybe they're being silenced because a civ thinks they ARE a baddie?? Or maybe there is a bad silencer and a civ silencer, working on opposing nights? I dunno if that helps us narrow our thoughts any, but it is an interesting thing to keep in mind.

All I'll say is there's (what I think is) a pretty good reason for my belief that the silencer is bad. Not to mention the Boogs-related circumstances surrounding my own silencing.

OK. I'm assuming this is a reason that you can't share in the thread, so I'll let the civ-silencer thought take a backseat for the moment...not because I neccessarily trust you or your info (I'm really, really p in the air on you at this point), but because (again) I'm not sure that speculating about it is going to get me any closer to deciding who to vote for, and I need to focus on that.

[Bullzeye]

You're not the only one, Bullz. Of the things you mentioned, I'm most concerned by Dana's vouch. It's just so out of the blue, and Dana's absence in the last few game days (even before she was silenced) and then her sudden appearance to defend Boogs is just odd. I'm more and more beginning to see this as a recruitment game, and I think maybe the baddies have been persuing a "recruit the quiet and blendy"-type strategy while we tear all the talkative people apart in the thread. I think Dana might be the most recent recruit, and I think that might explain her out-of-nowhere defense of Boogs.

I see where you're coming from but with only one confirmed dead recruit 9 days in I feel like we'd have seen more. Unless maybe recruitments can only happen in certain circumstances?

Yeah, but Bullz, other than the recruit, we've only killed one team-affiliated baddie in those 9 days, too. It's not like our track record is stunning, and we've been killing loads of non-recruit baddies during that time. :P

Fair enough but what I meant was there aren't really a lot of us left that there'd be one big team of recruits and the game still ongoing IMO.

But I understand what you're saying. There isn't a lot of evidence to support my theory based on lynches. TBH, I think the most convincing evidence that there is one baddie recruitment team (as opposed to two regular baddie teams) is that there have been no baddies killed in NK crossfire. That's weird to me, but maybe they've just been unlucky? Or only targeting civs? Or are as bad at reading alignment as the rest of us?

I thought two baddies died on consecutive nights? DF as a baddie and then Enrique as a recruit? Perhaps I'm misremembering there.

[Long Con]

Canuck, I really don't think you should p in the air.

[Canucklehead]

DF died N1, Enrique N3.

.....but both your points are totally fair (I'd actually been misremembering and thought we'd lynched DF), especially the one about the numbers not really making sense.

linki: LC, It's a very special skill for ladies. I am proud of my abilities and I do not back down from that comment.

[bea]

Has there been any other night.crossfire? Would the sk have been a possible reason df died? Have we ruled out a potential ninja? I'm in waitingroom hell.

[Bullzeye]

Has there been any other night.crossfire? Would the sk have been a possible reason df died? Have we ruled out a potential ninja? I'm in waitingroom hell.

Epig's role killed on odd nights so it is possible that he was responsible for DF.

[Enrique]

So did anybody win a rezz the other night? Why am I still dead?

[Long Con]

So did anybody win a rezz the other night? Why am I still dead?

Could death have cured your recruitment?

[Enrique]

Duh, that's how it always works

[Boogs]

Dana trusting me when we have barely interacted is pingy. Also, Bullzeye i suggest we dont try to lynch me tpday so that we cant be manipulated. Hedge wasnt in suspicion before Day 9, Jc was. So Hedge "being silenced" could be a Civ doing it to her.

[Canucklehead]

Dana trusting me when we have barely interacted is pingy. Also, Bullzeye i suggest we dont try to lynch me tpday so that we cant be manipulated. Hedge wasnt in suspicion before Day 9, Jc was. So Hedge "being silenced" could be a Civ doing it to her.

Huh? Can you explain your rationale for this, Boogs. I don't understand what you mean by this.

(This is most likely a case of me being dense, not you being unclear......)

[Bullzeye]

Dana trusting me when we have barely interacted is pingy. Also, Bullzeye i suggest we dont try to lynch me tpday so that we cant be manipulated. Hedge wasnt in suspicion before Day 9, Jc was. So Hedge "being silenced" could be a Civ doing it to her.

Hedge was totally in suspicion. I called her out for her defensiveness and said it was suspicious regardless of Mongoose's aligment. As I've already said, I have reason to believe the silencer isn't civ and have no reason to think there's more than one silencer. If there were two trading off nights then it stands to reason Hedge should have been silenced by the same one as I was since we've both been silenced on odd days.

[bea]

So you don't think there.are.two.silencers but.if.there are.don't Lynch me? Are you advocating a.jc Lynch then?

[bea]

Ok wait I confused two posts in one.

Boots.are you saying we should look at jc?

[bea]

2ish hours to go.

It's sooo quiet.

I'm thinking if I've not heard anything to convince me otherwise, boogs or dana will get my vote. Dana's coming out of no where to defend boogs is odd. And well, I've never really competely let go of my boggs suspicion.

I really hope I hear more thoughts though.

[Bullzeye]

2ish hours to go.

It's sooo quiet.

I'm thinking if I've not heard anything to convince me otherwise, boogs or dana will get my vote. Dana's coming out of no where to defend boogs is odd. And well, I've never really competely let go of my boggs suspicion.

I really hope I hear more thoughts though.

I'm around but I don't really know what more to say. I've been convinced Boogs is bad for a while. Dana vouching for him is definitely suspicious. I also still think Hedge is bad and she did have plenty of time to respond to my reasons why before she got silenced but never did so I may even vote there still. All in all I'm just not sure enough yet and this lynch could be crucial. Hopefully others can come in with their thoughts.

[bea]

I hope some peeps come in soon too.

I am having a hard time thinking that boogz is actively taking advantage of the slienced players. He doesn't strike me as that ballzy of a player to be honest, but I had my doubts about him before he went after you or hedgie.

and unlike hedgie -he is able to defend.

[Canucklehead]

I agree that this lynch feels really crucial, which is why I'm hemming and hawing and going back and forth over and over and over again.

While I appreciate that you're here and engaged and thinking out loud, Bullz, I'm having a hard time making decisions based on your answers/thoughts because in my mind the conflict between you and Boogs is very much either he is bad, or you are.....so the opinion of either one of you is not helping me sort shit out. That was a very convoluted sentence, but I think/hope you catch my drift.

I need to hear more from Dana, because that will help me figure out my thoughts on Boogs (maybe). I need to hear from LC, because I think he's a civ and I trust him more than other players right now. I need to hear from juliets and LoRab, because I don't know what to think of either of them, except that they're both generally thoughtful and insighful.

[Canucklehead]

bea, if you had to vote right now, who would it be for?

[bea]

If I had to vote right now, I'd vote for boogs or dana.

If pushed dana. While I've not had the best feels about boogs, the very fact that even he thinks her vouch is odd makes me leary of her.

[Bullzeye]

If I had to vote right now, I'd vote for boogs or dana.

If pushed dana. While I've not had the best feels about boogs, the very fact that even he thinks her vouch is odd makes me leary of her.

I find this interesting. Her vouch is crazy and I find her to have been super blendy, but is there anything else making you think she's bad?

[Canucklehead]

I found her vouch for Boogs and his denial of it super odd, too....but what makes me most suspicious of Dana is her absenteeism. In Misfits (the only other game I've played with her, I think?) she was SUPER active and question-y and involved in the thread and in almost all conversations....and this game she seems to be just sitting back and only contributing when prodded. Perhaps because she's not been a baddie before and is uncomfortable? I dunno.

What gives me pause about her, however, is her mix-up/confusion about the silencing. I'd think that if she had teammates, they'd have clued her in to the fact that her silencing was over......but maybe it's all an elaborate ruse? I dunno.

She's very pingy to me.....but I do have reservations about those pings.

[bea]

and while I'm here - are you sure about LC canuck? You and lorab both seem pretty sure he's civ. And I'll admit - I've thought he was civ all game, but could could you be wrong?

I KNOW this is my paranoia speaking. I know it. He double crossed me in trev's star wars game, he double crossed me in wabbit's sword of truth game, he double crossed me in fight club. He's *really* good at starting out as civ and then doing the double cross. Are you SURE about him?

I keep thinking "this time for sure LC is civ!" and I keep being wrong. Is this the time I'm right? I'm unsure of lorab so IDK what to make of her vouch for him, but I've had good feels about you and bullz.

linkie - bullz -honestly - no. You know I play best by interacting with people and when I did interact with her at the beginning of the game, I didn't see anyting that set me off. Since then, I've found her to be super blendy as well. She has in several lynches before and after her silence said "I don't know maybe everyone I think is good is bad?" but not came back with anything. TBH - since at the beginning she said *I* was someone she was firm was civ, I kinda expected to be one of the people she looked at during her many "people I think are civ and may not be" posts.

linki - cannuck - to me whatever may or maynot happen bts is all WIOM to me. I've totes been in baddie bts with noobs and told them what was up and still let them do dumb stuff in the thread. It could have been a genuine mistake. It could have been a baddie being coached to take advantage of a noob mistake. IDK.

[Long Con]

I really find Boogs the most suspicious. I don't think it's a coincidence that two recently silenced people were attacked by him, it seems like an opportunistic baddie who is close to winning and getting brazen. Changing vote to Boogs, going to work now. Good luck Civvies!

Linki: sorry I can't respond.d to that huge post right now.

[bea]

lol - LC - I look forward to your "Yes, bea, this time you finally have it right, I'm a civ" post.

[juliets]

Canuck, I really don't know what to say. There are pluses and minuses on each of the people we're talking about. With Hedgie, she had time to answer Bullz but she chose not to, meanwhile making a comment to me that it sounded defensive that I responded to everything said about me (paraphrase). I wonder if she said that to confirm for everyone her belief that one didn't need to answer everything about them. She's also dead wrong about me and it bothers me that she presented a list where she marked off a lot of people in red that weren't even part of her point. When you look at it, it looks like something really bad. On the other hand, I try not to vote for people that are silenced though I have done it in a couple of cases where I felt is was warranted.

Boogs is hard for me. I suspected him earlier in the game for his brief appearances and not added anything to the conversation. He has improved quite a bit on that and is acting like the boogs I know as a civ. He went after Bullz but he relented after Bullz called him out and by the time it was over I got the idea Boogs wasn't really sure about Bullz being bad after all. Then though he recently talked about what he thought Hedgie was doing to me and he was exactly right about me. I know I have to watch out for people defending me when I'm not bad - they may be a baddie trying to look good after I flip civ - but he was actually soliciting votes away from me to Hedgie.

And then Dana. Dana is making me very uneasy. She's not voting, and I accepted her explanation to begin with but after we explained it to her I would have expected her to start voting. She did pop up out of nowhere to vouch for Boogs but I can think of a civ reason to do that. She was confused about the silencing, wouldn't her baddie teammates clued her in or made her contact Rox/DP for clarification? (Oh but I got linki and see now what bea is saying about that.) Other than that Canuck's comment about how she was last game as compared to this game furthers my uneasiness.

I still have a bad feeling that I may have to save myself so I am going to vote close to the end of the lynch or whenever it's safe. I am leaning toward Hedgie or Dana though I want to hear what everyone has to say.

[bea]

JC - so glad to see you pop back in.

srrsly - everyone not around is making me sketchy as all get out....


Do you think that this might be one of those times where voting the silenced person is the way to go?

Really - I've had hedgy in my ? category for like ever - I just hate voting silenced people. I've been voted as a civ and a baddie w/o a chance to defend before and it sucks regardless of allignment.

I'll ask you the same question sort of that canuck asked me: If you had to vote right now, and if your vote wasn't to save yourself (and I get why you are holding that vote btw) - who would you vote for and why?

Is your easing of your inital feelings on boogsy because of how vocal he's been since the bullz silence and his lifting of the smiley "curse?"

[Bullzeye]

linkie - bullz -honestly - no. You know I play best by interacting with people and when I did interact with her at the beginning of the game, I didn't see anyting that set me off. Since then, I've found her to be super blendy as well. She has in several lynches before and after her silence said "I don't know maybe everyone I think is good is bad?" but not came back with anything. TBH - since at the beginning she said *I* was someone she was firm was civ, I kinda expected to be one of the people she looked at during her many "people I think are civ and may not be" posts.

linki - cannuck - to me whatever may or maynot happen bts is all WIOM to me. I've totes been in baddie bts with noobs and told them what was up and still let them do dumb stuff in the thread. It could have been a genuine mistake. It could have been a baddie being coached to take advantage of a noob mistake. IDK.

You've made some good points. Maybe Dana's silencing was even an attempt to give her an excuse for her quiet, blendy behaviour? She was definitely more involved as a civ in Misfits than she is here. I'm not sure how to feel about her. Honestly I'm not sure how to feel about anyone. I think you're all bad and I think you're all civs.

Linki - I hate voting silenced people too but for my part it's not like my case on Hedge came out just today. I called her out a while before my vote in the last lynch and I voted a full 24 hours early that day. She never responded to my comments despite having half a day phase and a whole night to do so.

[bea]

so i guess what it comes down to is - Are we *that* sure that hedgy is bad to vote her even though she is silenced?

Or do we vote dana and - tbh she's not exactly been around to defend either.

Or do we vote someone else? and if so - who?

[LoRab]

@Bea: You had to remind me of LC in Trev's star wars game. Still mad at him for that game. DD and I were SO close to winning.

I keep going back and forth on Boogs. There are reasons I find him suspicious, but then I'm not certain and I don't know how ballsy a player he is. So I'm not sure. But more and more I'm considering him as possibly bad.

Dana I also find increasingly suspish. I might vote in that direction.

I also find Hedge suspicious, but I'm hesitant to lynch someone who is silenced in general, unless I know they are for sure bad with no uncertainty. And that's not the case here.

I'm a little out of it this afternoon so sorry for the short post. Long day. But on the up side, I did get to be on a conference call with the president this afternoon. Which is just cool.

And now remembering a time when I said sorry for the short post and then wrote a frigging novel in the thread. Back in LP mafia hey day, I think. Not the time that I discovered there was a word limit on posts on LP, but not a short post either. Can't remember what game it was.

linkitis: I think there's a difference between not been around and not able to post.

[Bullzeye]

so i guess what it comes down to is - Are we *that* sure that hedgy is bad to vote her even though she is silenced?

Or do we vote dana and - tbh she's not exactly been around to defend either.

Or do we vote someone else? and if so - who?

For me if it's not Hedge or Dana then Boogs. The thing with Dana not being around is that she's hardly ever been around and that's part of the case against her. Nothing is stopping her from defending today. With Hedge, she's suspicious and it's possible her team knew she was in danger today and silenced her hoping it'd be obvious with so few of us and so we'd leave her alone, or that the baddies silenced her to make it easy to push a bandwagon through. I'm not sure which I think is most likely.

[juliets]

bea I would vote for hedgie or dana.

[Canucklehead]

bea: I'm not SURE about LC.....and I'm becoming more unsure as the days go on.....but I feel that way about everybody. With LC, it's just a vibe thing. I usually feel like he's zanier when bad....but it's been along while since I've played regularly, so I may be very, very off on that.

As for Dana, I'm in support of a vote for her....except for the fact that now EVERYONE seems to be in support of a vote for her....which makes me think we might be about to do the Mongoose thing again.

I'm so uncertain now.

[juliets]

I'd like to hear what lorab has to say.

[juliets]

oh dang she posted and i missed it!

[bea]

lorab - it was the first time I saw the LC double cross. Sorry. He decimated the jedi's after he got rid of my search as soon as the link was found.

bullz - for me it's dana or boogs. I get that there's been suspish of hedgy before, but unless we can actually track back something that makes her bad, I just have *that* hard of a time voting someone who can't defend.

And - @ lorab as much as everyone else - while i realize that can't and don't are two different things, my paranioa radar about our track record is at about 12 now :sigh

soo much linki!!!

[Canucklehead]

What are people's thoughts on Bullz? Other than not wanting to vote for someone who has been info dumped on, does anyone have strong civ vibes from him?

[juliets]

What are people's thoughts on Bullz? Other than not wanting to vote for someone who has been info dumped on, does anyone have strong civ vibes from him?

I don't have strong baddie vibes or strong civ vibes but then I haven't done a re-read of him in quite a while. He's been kind of off my radar screen. Why, do you see something Canuck?

[Canucklehead]

Nothing specific. Similar to you, he's been pretty much a non-entity for me this game. Haven't re-read him at all.....

BUT!
(and this is a big, big but)

...If Dana is good (and the only reason I think she might be is that no one appears opposed to lynching her), then maybe her vouch for boogs is genuine....and maybe boogs' info on Bullz is genuine.

That's a LOT of "ifs"....but that's my thought process.

Like I said earlier, I think this is a crucial lynch, so I'm just trying to make sure we consider our options carefully and get a baddie.

[Bullzeye]

Nothing specific. Similar to you, he's been pretty much a non-entity for me this game. Haven't re-read him at all.....

BUT!
(and this is a big, big but)

...If Dana is good (and the only reason I think she might be is that no one appears opposed to lynching her), then maybe her vouch for boogs is genuine....and maybe boogs' info on Bullz is genuine.

That's a LOT of "ifs"....but that's my thought process.

Like I said earlier, I think this is a crucial lynch, so I'm just trying to make sure we consider our options carefully and get a baddie.

I can promise you Boogs has no info on me. If he did he wouldn't have backpedalled on it. I also already outlined reasons why he's probably not an info role based on his other behaviours.

[bea]

What are people's thoughts on Bullz? Other than not wanting to vote for someone who has been info dumped on, does anyone have strong civ vibes from him?

I thought early in the game that he was civ. It was just my read on him. He tends to always read civ to me though, so I could be wrong. I want to believe that his reaction to boggs was genuine though and it came from a civ place. That's my most current reason to believing him. I think if he was bad, he would have been more controlled in his responses to the silence and almost vote.


On the other hand, he looked at me and didn't see much. See - now I'm so paranoid that I'm suspecting people for *not* suspecting me more. I feel like - same as dana - I'm running in circles here. I'm so used to having to hard defend as a civ that the fact that I've not had to do it this game makes me paranoid about everyone who mentioned me in passing but never followed up.

linki - and all that stuff too. See - I genuinely believe bullz when he says boogs had no info on him based on how quickly boogs was willing to discredit the supposed info.

[Dana]

I've been more absent here compared to my first game because that one happened in the summer and I have school now. I'm in class at the moment until 6, so I'm not sure what I'll do for the vote. I know it seems odd that I think Boogs is good, but unless I made some mistake with math or unless Boogs was recruited then he isn't bad. I find it super suspicious that everyone is all agreeing that they'd vote for me one right after another. We have to think about this, guys. I'll be honest, I'm not as invested in this game as I was at the start, but I don't want to let the civs down by just giving up, so I'm attempting to defend.

I don't think I'd vote Hedge if she's silenced today because that's just mean in my opinion. I'll have to go back in the next few minutes and maybe make a really quick decision, and vote someone who seemed to agree too quickly with others.

[LoRab]

Dana's post actually riings true to me, as somewhat detached civ. ARGH!!!!!

Still don't want to vote Hedge. Boogs may get my vote.

[juliets]

Dana's post actually riings true to me, as somewhat detached civ. ARGH!!!!!

Still don't want to vote Hedge. Boogs may get my vote.

Her post rings true to me too for the same reason. Boogs isnt getting my vote so I'm back to Hedge. It is looking like I don't have to vote defensively.

[bea]

I said I wanted to hear what you had to say...

same question that all of us have had to answer - if not hedgy - and if not you - then who should we vote?

Who do you think is glomming along on the suspicion of you? and why?

I know you are in class and this is hard, I'm sorry.

linki - I know right lorab?

[Bullzeye]

I am actually just going to put my vote on Boogs because based on everything I've seen from him I see no reason he could possibly be a civ. The fake curse, the fake info, the going after silenced players. None of it adds up to anything but bad IMO.

[LoRab]

I'm thinking either Bullz or Boogs is bad. Just because of the way they've gone back and forth. Don't feel confident on either side. I doubt they are both civ. Mainly gut. And we are so frigging close to the lynch end.

[Canucklehead]

Fuck. I think Dana is telling the truth...

ONE MILLION LINKIS!