Team Fortress Mafia [END]

[NotAnAxehole]

Well, tbh if we're not killing Sabie, we should kill Mac for saving Sabie D1

You misspelt your name.

Yeah, I was taking a shot at myself, but I still think Mac is correct + I respect Seanzie as a player who thought Mac was a lock.

[TonyStarkPrime]

I'm honestly still partial to just taking the guaranteed Mafia lynch though.
Especially with the odds of there being 3 kills tonight. Majority could very easily slip.

Tbh I agree and/but also think in this case we should be writing up a mech plan anyways. Not sure what that entails. Makes spy double medic a bit harder to plan too

[LinearPoint]

Mafia Engy of any kind only really fucks us if Mafia also has a Pyro.

Because what, Mafia Engie doesn't let Pyro in.
Pyro airblasts the Demos off Sabie, and then Sabie uses their role to do some havoc.

To be honest Mafia probably just always kills Marmot in this situation just to create doubt on if a Medic or Heavy saved Sabie or if TSP was roleblocked.
if Mafia Soldier we never get the killers name (or they just say Sabie)

it might be best if we don't do the whole Medic Spy thing and let the Medics do their best to protect who they think the Mafia will try and kill tonight.

[Lime Coke]

(Marmot//Nanook/Lime Coke) - this is weird though because the only way Lime Coke is mafia is with Jack.
I suppose Nanook could be wolf as well, I’m not sure if he voted Sean or not I don’t remember.

How would I be with Jack when I've been saying "Jack should never end game, he should always die before LYLO because he keeps randing mafia" and I literally planted my vote on him for Day 1, like what world would I keep saying that if we're partners?

[NotAnAxehole]

@LinearPoint I was one of the first people to lead the wagon on Sabie yesterday, why would I do that only to rely on a last-second CFD if we're partners???

Also, fact... Last time I was mafia with Sabie, I spent 5+hrs arguing to make sure she didn't die in the night. Like, I'm obviously not mafia here.

[LinearPoint]

(Marmot//Nanook/Lime Coke) - this is weird though because the only way Lime Coke is mafia is with Jack.
I suppose Nanook could be wolf as well, I’m not sure if he voted Sean or not I don’t remember.

How would I be with Jack when I've been saying "Jack should never end game, he should always die before LYLO because he keeps randing mafia" and I literally planted my vote on him for Day 1, like what world would I keep saying that if we're partners?

Being honest with you, that's not enough to clear you. Jack is a PL to many so this means nothing for alignment.

[LinearPoint]

@LinearPoint I was one of the first people to lead the wagon on Sabie yesterday, why would I do that only to rely on a last-second CFD if we're partners???

Also, fact... Last time I was mafia with Sabie, I spent 5+hrs arguing to make sure she didn't die in the night. Like, I'm obviously not mafia here.

See, what you fail to realize is.
You're insane and can't be trusted with anything.

[NotAnAxehole]

@LinearPoint I was one of the first people to lead the wagon on Sabie yesterday, why would I do that only to rely on a last-second CFD if we're partners???

Also, fact... Last time I was mafia with Sabie, I spent 5+hrs arguing to make sure she didn't die in the night. Like, I'm obviously not mafia here.

See, what you fail to realize is.
You're insane and can't be trusted with anything.

I mean, yeah it's insane until you start to understand.

[LinearPoint]

The more i think about it thoguh, I think we just need to kill Sabie today.

If Sabie lives we are just in a really bad position.
We don't know which Medic, Demoman, or Heavy stopped the kill and that is assuming TSP is telling the trust.
So really we are left with 7 possible suspects if Sabie lives and that is just way too much for my comfort.

Not to mention, I'm not sure who to out atm. Probably Nanoook or NAA, but IDK.

[LinearPoint]

And really all of this is to confirm just TSP which I don't think is really a worthy tradeoff.

[Lime Coke]

(Marmot//Nanook/Lime Coke) - this is weird though because the only way Lime Coke is mafia is with Jack.
I suppose Nanook could be wolf as well, I’m not sure if he voted Sean or not I don’t remember.

How would I be with Jack when I've been saying "Jack should never end game, he should always die before LYLO because he keeps randing mafia" and I literally planted my vote on him for Day 1, like what world would I keep saying that if we're partners?

Being honest with you, that's not enough to clear you. Jack is a PL to many so this means nothing for alignment.

When is Jack a policy yeet? I've never actually seen him as town.

[Dolby]

And really all of this is to confirm just TSP which I don't think is really a worthy tradeoff.

eh, it's not to confirm TSP ime

for me it's to get actual wagons today rather than sleepwalk to a Sabie yeet

[Dolby]

also it wouldn't be 7 suspects, it would be 1-3 depending on who did the saving or roleblocking

assuming that heavy is tracked and there isn't a unfortunate heavy/scout w/w combo

or that soldier #2 isn't a w

[TonyStarkPrime]

I think we should pretend we’re doing this mech nonsense until like 8 pm tomorrow then we should give up

[NotAnAxehole]

I think we should pretend we’re doing this mech nonsense until like 8 pm tomorrow then we should give up

So we vote Mac, then CFD Sabie?

[TonyStarkPrime]

Yeah

[TonyStarkPrime]

Like the gods intende

[Guillotine]

Just don't think NAA is ever worth a lynch. He just acts like a Jester always.

He always wolf sides as town in every game i see him play. In the last one i played with him he was a town rolecop, he trolled the game then he outted another town pr in the thread which was what the wolves needed to soup kill almost the rest of the town as wolves figured out the rest of the prs thanks to him. I stopped playing here for a while after that, he lives to troll games, he does not play to towns wincon and the worse is that this board lets him get away with it.

[Guillotine]

So i really hope he is just a wolf here but if he is not, he deserves the axe.

[Guillotine]

I mean legitimately no one town read Dizzy from what I saw.

I might've been one of the select few to have voiced it at one point when they fussed at Gav.

I think read accuracy may have had less to do with Dizzy though as I could imagine the impression of witnessing a strong experienced player (who did like 100x more than Mac) while also potentially being a good doc dodge target.

I don't think its a good idea to nail down a single possibility as the "likeliest" possibility though as in my personal experience NKA is increasingly unreliable the larger a mafia team is. Or, at least, I don't remember NKA working very well for me.

This is a wolf trying to discredit the reads of their biggest threat whom they killed.

[Guillotine]

@falcon45ca

When you get on let me know your full thought process on Gavial.

I feel I've outlined my feelings on Gav's slot pretty clearly. Do you have a specific question in mind?


I'd put Gav at 72% scum

Yah, but Sabie and Sig first tbh

[DrWilgy]

Like the gods intende

Mhm

[Guillotine]

I do want to hear from Tony, Nanook, and Mac at some point as to why the fuck they even voted that.
Dolby was the only one, I think already on Seanzie, Sabie pretty much gets a pass for self preservation interests, and really doubt NAA will ever come in to explain why he did it other than for the lols.

She could have self preserve to Gavial or Sig. Why didnt she?

[LinearPoint]

I do want to hear from Tony, Nanook, and Mac at some point as to why the fuck they even voted that.
Dolby was the only one, I think already on Seanzie, Sabie pretty much gets a pass for self preservation interests, and really doubt NAA will ever come in to explain why he did it other than for the lols.

She could have self preserve to Gavial or Sig. Why didnt she?

Well she was until the CFD started. I think she was on Gav anyways.

[Guillotine]

@falcon45ca

When you get on let me know your full thought process on Gavial.

I feel I've outlined my feelings on Gav's slot pretty clearly. Do you have a specific question in mind?


I'd put Gav at 72% scum

My thing is that Gavial's mafia game is that his viewpoint is zoned in way more, as in we saw him just tunnel the hell out of Mac during our last game, and I remember him tunneling Alison all game in Baby Mafia.

I didn't keep up with the rest of the game after I died, how was he during the rest of the game when he was mafia? Did he give dichotomies like he's doing this game during Akemi Mafia?

Weren’t you the first to claim certainty that Gavial is a wolf? What changed?

[Guillotine]

I do want to hear from Tony, Nanook, and Mac at some point as to why the fuck they even voted that.
Dolby was the only one, I think already on Seanzie, Sabie pretty much gets a pass for self preservation interests, and really doubt NAA will ever come in to explain why he did it other than for the lols.

She could have self preserve to Gavial or Sig. Why didnt she?

Well she was until the CFD started. I think she was on Gav anyways.

If she was town she would have stayed on her scum read. I think she knew she was outed and an extra dead townie was good enough for her in exchange for having us to lose another trying to chop her again today.

[Marmot]

I don't really like the idea of waiting to shoot sabie. She's an outed wolf at this point, and if the kill fails, we have to elim her tomorrow, and she gets a chance to use an ability if we don't elim her now.

[Guillotine]

NAA dies either way and shouldn't be end gaming.

Didn’t everyone assure us that NAA was a wolf that one time? Or was that Dolby meta?

I remember people assuring me in a previous game that a NAA slot was a wolf when I knew it absolutely wasn’t because I was a wolf.

If i was a wolf i would love to keep NAA in the game.

[Guillotine]

Personally I would like to see one of the following flipped today. Assuming no Soldier or Scout comes out with a hard red check on who killed Dizzy.

Falcon, Mac, Marmot, Martin, Sabie, Sig, Tony, and Nanook.

Everyone else I see low priority at the moment and while I doubt there is more than 4 Mafia in that list I feel it likely contains 2-3. (NAA I didn't put on since I don't think lynching them is the play, but also can probably just die tbh their slot is a 50/50)

Of those I'm thinking Marti, and marmot I'm not too big of a fan of offing today.
Falcon I'm 50/50 on right now so probably a lower prio.
Sabie and Sig I'm pretty confident have at least 1 Mafia between them.
Tony, Nanook, and Mac, I didn't hard scum read, but the EOD looks really bad on all of them.

Sabie>Sig>Martin

[Lime Coke]

@falcon45ca

When you get on let me know your full thought process on Gavial.

I feel I've outlined my feelings on Gav's slot pretty clearly. Do you have a specific question in mind?


I'd put Gav at 72% scum

My thing is that Gavial's mafia game is that his viewpoint is zoned in way more, as in we saw him just tunnel the hell out of Mac during our last game, and I remember him tunneling Alison all game in Baby Mafia.

I didn't keep up with the rest of the game after I died, how was he during the rest of the game when he was mafia? Did he give dichotomies like he's doing this game during Akemi Mafia?

Weren’t you the first to claim certainty that Gavial is a wolf? What changed?

I did when he had weird posts to start, but then looking at his attempted solving he used the whole "One wolf in *names*" and started trying to teamread people, which I doubt he's capable of that type of world build attempting as mafia? I just remember his mafia game including one track minded things like tunneling. He isn't really doing that here, unless his "tunnel of the game" happens to be you for some reason.

[Guillotine]

Also thought about it leaning a wee bit less of mafia for Guillo, still throwing my vote there, he's another I plan to review since i can reverse tunnel at time.

Also really do need a solid reasoning why I'm mafia or suspected mafia beyond a post I made D0 my second, very obvious jokign post.

Nah, you just wait there until we axe you, your time will come,

[Guillotine]

@falcon45ca

When you get on let me know your full thought process on Gavial.

I feel I've outlined my feelings on Gav's slot pretty clearly. Do you have a specific question in mind?


I'd put Gav at 72% scum

My thing is that Gavial's mafia game is that his viewpoint is zoned in way more, as in we saw him just tunnel the hell out of Mac during our last game, and I remember him tunneling Alison all game in Baby Mafia.

I didn't keep up with the rest of the game after I died, how was he during the rest of the game when he was mafia? Did he give dichotomies like he's doing this game during Akemi Mafia?

Weren’t you the first to claim certainty that Gavial is a wolf? What changed?

I did when he had weird posts to start, but then looking at his attempted solving he used the whole "One wolf in *names*" and started trying to teamread people, which I doubt he's capable of that type of world build attempting as mafia? I just remember his mafia game including one track minded things like tunneling. He isn't really doing that here, unless his "tunnel of the game" happens to be you for some reason.

Oh no? Go back and read day 1, he continues to push Dyslexicon and I all of it.

[Lime Coke]

@falcon45ca

When you get on let me know your full thought process on Gavial.

I feel I've outlined my feelings on Gav's slot pretty clearly. Do you have a specific question in mind?


I'd put Gav at 72% scum

My thing is that Gavial's mafia game is that his viewpoint is zoned in way more, as in we saw him just tunnel the hell out of Mac during our last game, and I remember him tunneling Alison all game in Baby Mafia.

I didn't keep up with the rest of the game after I died, how was he during the rest of the game when he was mafia? Did he give dichotomies like he's doing this game during Akemi Mafia?

Weren’t you the first to claim certainty that Gavial is a wolf? What changed?

I did when he had weird posts to start, but then looking at his attempted solving he used the whole "One wolf in *names*" and started trying to teamread people, which I doubt he's capable of that type of world build attempting as mafia? I just remember his mafia game including one track minded things like tunneling. He isn't really doing that here, unless his "tunnel of the game" happens to be you for some reason.

Oh no? Go back and read day 1, he continues to push Dyslexicon and I all of it.

Yeah as I was writing that post I was realizing that.

I did take him out of my townlist and put Mac in there instead so yeah.

[Dolby]

@sabie12 December 28th at 6pm we're playing video mafia, you should come if you can, maybe you'll actually survive a game day lol

this is an incredibly bad read but I feel that Nanook showed that he was leaning towards a CFD away from Sabie to mafia here in a way that makes me feel like he's slightly villa. Like they pieced together that a Sabie cfd would be more successful than somebody ele (iirc they were tied at 3 vote with someone else pre cfd) and that could have influenced the direction the wagon took

the rest of his iso is just empty

[Guillotine]

Who all jumped on that Sean wagon?

nanook, naa, sabie, one or both of TSP and Macdougall. Tbh I don't remember which of the two was a previous voter

me if you count voting an hour before the CFD jumping on

I was the first voter and I feel bad

I dont believe this.

[Dolby]

I think I'm coming getting to NAA maf but I'm not understanding the Mac simping tbh

[NotAnAxehole]

Just don't think NAA is ever worth a lynch. He just acts like a Jester always.

He always wolf sides as town in every game i see him play. In the last one i played with him he was a town rolecop, he trolled the game then he outted another town pr in the thread which was what the wolves needed to soup kill almost the rest of the town as wolves figured out the rest of the prs thanks to him. I stopped playing here for a while after that, he lives to troll games, he does not play to towns wincon and the worse is that this board lets him get away with it.

I'm quite surprised you're still upset that I used your copy pasta-worthy take like 10 times in the other game. Like, how many people killed Seanzie? 1? I figured you experienced enough to know that is impossible.

[Dolby]

I'm gonna call LC town at least provisionally

[NotAnAxehole]

I think I'm coming getting to NAA maf but I'm not understanding the Mac simping tbh

If I'm mafia, I don't start the wagon on my mafia partner Sabie, there's no reason to. If you want to argue that I didn't, you can go back and see people saying that I was voting to "scare people off of the wagon"... Which clearly indicates that I started it.

[Dolby]

NAA can I get your takes distinct from the situation surrounding Sabie's D1 wagon?

[Guillotine]

Just don't think NAA is ever worth a lynch. He just acts like a Jester always.

He always wolf sides as town in every game i see him play. In the last one i played with him he was a town rolecop, he trolled the game then he outted another town pr in the thread which was what the wolves needed to soup kill almost the rest of the town as wolves figured out the rest of the prs thanks to him. I stopped playing here for a while after that, he lives to troll games, he does not play to towns wincon and the worse is that this board lets him get away with it.

I'm quite surprised you're still upset that I used your copy pasta-worthy take like 10 times in the other game. Like, how many people killed Seanzie? 1? I figured you experienced enough to know that is impossible.

If it was up to me i’d policy kill you in every game, lucky you i never rand a killing role.
You care more about trolling everyone than winning you are not a fit to play this game.

[NotAnAxehole]

NAA can I get your takes distinct from the situation surrounding Sabie's D1 wagon?

I thought Sabie was mafia, I voted Sabie, and the vote count/voters creeped me out. I also figured there was a very good chance one of Seanzie // Mac was mafia based on their interactions.

[Dolby]

I think I'm coming getting to NAA maf but I'm not understanding the Mac simping tbh

If I'm mafia, I don't start the wagon on my mafia partner Sabie, there's no reason to. If you want to argue that I didn't, you can go back and see people saying that I was voting to "scare people off of the wagon"... Which clearly indicates that I started it.

From what I saw you were the 6th vote on Sabie when the next closest wagon had 3 votes and jumped as soon as Seanzie became viable

that is...

not a good look

and does not constitute you starting a wagon

[Guillotine]

Just don't think NAA is ever worth a lynch. He just acts like a Jester always.

He always wolf sides as town in every game i see him play. In the last one i played with him he was a town rolecop, he trolled the game then he outted another town pr in the thread which was what the wolves needed to soup kill almost the rest of the town as wolves figured out the rest of the prs thanks to him. I stopped playing here for a while after that, he lives to troll games, he does not play to towns wincon and the worse is that this board lets him get away with it.

I'm quite surprised you're still upset that I used your copy pasta-worthy take like 10 times in the other game. Like, how many people killed Seanzie? 1? I figured you experienced enough to know that is impossible.

If it was up to me i’d policy kill you in every game, lucky you i never rand a killing role.
You care more about trolling everyone than winning you are not a fit to play this game.

The only way i’ll give you a pass is if you are a wolf because that is what wolves are supposed to do, create chaos and wreck townies

[NotAnAxehole]

Just don't think NAA is ever worth a lynch. He just acts like a Jester always.

He always wolf sides as town in every game i see him play. In the last one i played with him he was a town rolecop, he trolled the game then he outted another town pr in the thread which was what the wolves needed to soup kill almost the rest of the town as wolves figured out the rest of the prs thanks to him. I stopped playing here for a while after that, he lives to troll games, he does not play to towns wincon and the worse is that this board lets him get away with it.

I'm quite surprised you're still upset that I used your copy pasta-worthy take like 10 times in the other game. Like, how many people killed Seanzie? 1? I figured you experienced enough to know that is impossible.

If it was up to me i’d policy kill you in every game, lucky you i never rand a killing role.
You care more about trolling everyone than winning you are not a fit to play this game.

You're projecting, all I see is you're still crying about a fake cop claim in a game that's several months stale.

[NotAnAxehole]

I think I'm coming getting to NAA maf but I'm not understanding the Mac simping tbh

If I'm mafia, I don't start the wagon on my mafia partner Sabie, there's no reason to. If you want to argue that I didn't, you can go back and see people saying that I was voting to "scare people off of the wagon"... Which clearly indicates that I started it.

From what I saw you were the 6th vote on Sabie when the next closest wagon had 3 votes and jumped as soon as Seanzie became viable

that is...

not a good look

and does not constitute you starting a wagon

Yeah, I jumped back onto Marmot at some point for a couple of minutes to see if anyone noticed.

[Dolby]

Got a flat tire unable to be here sorry guys

vot Seanzie

this kinda seems like a non-w/w interaction but just the random "vote seanzie" going is so weird

[Dolby]

NAA can I get your takes distinct from the situation surrounding Sabie's D1 wagon?

I thought Sabie was mafia, I voted Sabie, and the vote count/voters creeped me out. I also figured there was a very good chance one of Seanzie // Mac was mafia based on their interactions.

ok cool

Can I get reads on people who are not Sabie, Guillo, and Mac

[NotAnAxehole]

Got a flat tire unable to be here sorry guys

vot Seanzie

this kinda seems like a non-w/w interaction but just the random "vote seanzie" going is so weird

Ok, so if we're going to have a discussion, we need to have it in good faith, which means you need to look at my point of view in the best light possible.

2 things existed at once that affected my judgement (well, 3 - but I'll touch on the 3rd at the end)

1) I thought Sabie was mafia, but was getting cold feet at the rapid growth of the wagon

2) I liked the idea of resolving Mac & Seanzie, which I thought almost certainly one was mafia. I still think Seanzie flipping town makes Mac REALLY HIGH PROBABILITY mafia

So, at a surface level, if you can accept this premise, and this alone, you should see the logic leading to the CFD...

Also, I like CFDs (I also didn't actually expect it to work - which again bodes for us not being partners - but you can't know that for sure.)

[NotAnAxehole]

NAA can I get your takes distinct from the situation surrounding Sabie's D1 wagon?

I thought Sabie was mafia, I voted Sabie, and the vote count/voters creeped me out. I also figured there was a very good chance one of Seanzie // Mac was mafia based on their interactions.

ok cool

Can I get reads on people who are not Sabie, Guillo, and Mac

I don't like LinearPoint or Falcon, I would kill either in a heartbeat.