Team Fortress Mafia [END]

[NANOOKTHEGREATANDFEARSOME]

They'd also know if Jack isn't mafia and/or didn't carry the kill

[NANOOKTHEGREATANDFEARSOME]

Well fypov if neither of me/jack carried the kill, but I already know I didn't:p

[LinearPoint]

Anyone in that tier I don't feel like I have a confident read on socially

That said given two medic claims Sig/Falcon probably aren't w/w since there's a greater than 50% chance they stopped a kill imo

I honestly just wanna know whom @sig protected.

I don't think that that is neccessary

Like, yes it's great if they got a correct protect, but if they claim, mafia knows whether or not they can target Marmot tonight. I personally think that it's just likeliest that Marmot or Mac were targetted and knowing another protection probably wouldn't help

Yes but my theory is Marmot/Falcon/TSP wolf team.

Meaning if that is the case. (I as I said before can be wrong about that hunch but still) Falcon’s protect us Fake and Sig has the real clear.

Is this not just tmi that the kill wasn't block and it hit a protect?

If anything that would imply the opposite since he is saying that the kill wasn't stopped by Doctor and the Mafia just flat out chose not to kill.
Marmot/Falcon/TSP can literally never be a wolf team and the Mafia failed to kill last night.
Unless one of the Pyros redirected a roleblock to Marmot, Falcon, or TSP. I mean Wiggly will never tell us, and the other pyro either didn't redirect it or just doesn't care to say they did in which case probs just mafia.

[NANOOKTHEGREATANDFEARSOME]

I'm afraid I'm not articulating it well, sorry

The key point is that mafia would know with some certainty whether they were roleblocked or not since the block targets have been claimed

The nk could in theory have been delayed by the scout, but they'd still have a very good idea if it hit a protect or not given that 2/3 protect targets have been claimed

[LinearPoint]

If the kill wasn't Roleblocked then the Mafia definitely attacked Mac.
Mafia never goes for mechanically confirmed Town with known Medic on them.
Mac I can see them possibly seeing as a threat in some world I guess, but so many other good choices for kills I feel.

[LinearPoint]

I really didn't consider Scout delaying the kill, becuase that's kind of a silly thing to do when you have a Tracker ability.

[NANOOKTHEGREATANDFEARSOME]

Anyone in that tier I don't feel like I have a confident read on socially

That said given two medic claims Sig/Falcon probably aren't w/w since there's a greater than 50% chance they stopped a kill imo

I honestly just wanna know whom @sig protected.

I don't think that that is neccessary

Like, yes it's great if they got a correct protect, but if they claim, mafia knows whether or not they can target Marmot tonight. I personally think that it's just likeliest that Marmot or Mac were targetted and knowing another protection probably wouldn't help

Yes but my theory is Marmot/Falcon/TSP wolf team.

Meaning if that is the case. (I as I said before can be wrong about that hunch but still) Falcon’s protect us Fake and Sig has the real clear.

Is this not just tmi that the kill wasn't block and it hit a protect?

If anything that would imply the opposite since he is saying that the kill wasn't stopped by Doctor and the Mafia just flat out chose not to kill.
Marmot/Falcon/TSP can literally never be a wolf team and the Mafia failed to kill last night.
Unless one of the Pyros redirected a roleblock to Marmot, Falcon, or TSP. I mean Wiggly will never tell us, and the other pyro either didn't redirect it or just doesn't care to say they did in which case probs just mafia.

I don't think he's saying that mafia chose not to kill? He talks about a doc having a real clear, which can only happen if mafia tried to kill

[Guillotine]

I love coming back to multiple announcements of “you have been mentioned by Gavial”, it fills me with joy every time

Turn notifications off. It’s what i do.

[NANOOKTHEGREATANDFEARSOME]

Idk, it seems clear to me, granted I'm quite tired but

[Guillotine]

[VOTE: Nanook] aubergine

We should quit these asinine arguments based on NAI/mech fuckery and just kill everyone from the Seanzie wagon day 1 until we hit a wolf. If town saved mafia Sabie over town Seanzie I'll gladly just laugh and move on the next game. This game needs better direction.

Before some giant brain points out I was on that wagon, yes I know, feel free to flip me idc.

I said this before, you are finally sheeping me on this? What took you so long?

Let’s begin with [VOTE: Dolby] aubergine

[LinearPoint]

[VOTE: Nanook] aubergine

We should quit these asinine arguments based on NAI/mech fuckery and just kill everyone from the Seanzie wagon day 1 until we hit a wolf. If town saved mafia Sabie over town Seanzie I'll gladly just laugh and move on the next game. This game needs better direction.

Before some giant brain points out I was on that wagon, yes I know, feel free to flip me idc.

I said this before, you are finally sheeping me on this? What took you so long?

Let’s begin with [VOTE: Dolby] aubergine

But like NAA exists.

[Guillotine]

Or Nanook, why i keep forgetting he was part of that CFD

[Dolby]

[VOTE: Nanook] aubergine

We should quit these asinine arguments based on NAI/mech fuckery and just kill everyone from the Seanzie wagon day 1 until we hit a wolf. If town saved mafia Sabie over town Seanzie I'll gladly just laugh and move on the next game. This game needs better direction.

Before some giant brain points out I was on that wagon, yes I know, feel free to flip me idc.

I said this before, you are finally sheeping me on this? What took you so long?

Let’s begin with [VOTE: Dolby] aubergine

dude

why've you taken every chance to try to vote me today

[Dolby]

Or Nanook, why i keep forgetting he was part of that CFD

bro

I got on like

an hour before any of the rest of them did

I was on Seanzie before it was cool

[Guillotine]

[VOTE: Nanook] aubergine

We should quit these asinine arguments based on NAI/mech fuckery and just kill everyone from the Seanzie wagon day 1 until we hit a wolf. If town saved mafia Sabie over town Seanzie I'll gladly just laugh and move on the next game. This game needs better direction.

Before some giant brain points out I was on that wagon, yes I know, feel free to flip me idc.

I said this before, you are finally sheeping me on this? What took you so long?

Let’s begin with [VOTE: Dolby] aubergine

But like NAA exists.

I dont think NAA risks outing himself doing such a play to save Sabie tbh. If he is scum and actually did that, he’s either very dumb or very ballsy.

[Guillotine]

Or Nanook, why i keep forgetting he was part of that CFD

bro

I got on like

an hour before any of the rest of them did

I was on Seanzie before it was cool

Why did you get on Seanzie?

[LinearPoint]

[VOTE: Nanook] aubergine

We should quit these asinine arguments based on NAI/mech fuckery and just kill everyone from the Seanzie wagon day 1 until we hit a wolf. If town saved mafia Sabie over town Seanzie I'll gladly just laugh and move on the next game. This game needs better direction.

Before some giant brain points out I was on that wagon, yes I know, feel free to flip me idc.

I said this before, you are finally sheeping me on this? What took you so long?

Let’s begin with [VOTE: Dolby] aubergine

But like NAA exists.

I dont think NAA risks outing himself doing such a play to save Sabie tbh. If he is scum and actually did that, he’s either very dumb or very ballsy.

Ah, but this is NAA who will do anything in his power to find the suboptimal play and follow it through.

[Dolby]

Anyone in that tier I don't feel like I have a confident read on socially

That said given two medic claims Sig/Falcon probably aren't w/w since there's a greater than 50% chance they stopped a kill imo

I honestly just wanna know whom @sig protected.

I don't think that that is neccessary

Like, yes it's great if they got a correct protect, but if they claim, mafia knows whether or not they can target Marmot tonight. I personally think that it's just likeliest that Marmot or Mac were targetted and knowing another protection probably wouldn't help

Yes but my theory is Marmot/Falcon/TSP wolf team.

Meaning if that is the case. (I as I said before can be wrong about that hunch but still) Falcon’s protect us Fake and Sig has the real clear.

Is this not just tmi that the kill wasn't block and it hit a protect?

Mafia wouldn't know whether they hit a protect or RB would they?

...yes? That's the point? That gav is tmi-ing that the nk hit a protect and wasn't blocked...because there are currently two block claims out, two protects claimed, and a doc that hasn't claimed a target yet, so from town pov there isn't necessarily a clear in the doc protects

"if that is the case" referring to me saying that I think that a doc protection is more likely than me or LC having blocked the mafia kill

[Guillotine]

[VOTE: Nanook] aubergine

We should quit these asinine arguments based on NAI/mech fuckery and just kill everyone from the Seanzie wagon day 1 until we hit a wolf. If town saved mafia Sabie over town Seanzie I'll gladly just laugh and move on the next game. This game needs better direction.

Before some giant brain points out I was on that wagon, yes I know, feel free to flip me idc.

I said this before, you are finally sheeping me on this? What took you so long?

Let’s begin with [VOTE: Dolby] aubergine

dude

why've you taken every chance to try to vote me today

Because someone on Seanzie’s wagon gotta be a wolf besides Sabie or i’d be ashamed of being part of this town tbh.

[LinearPoint]

If Mafia failed the kill because they thought attacking Marmot without a crit canteen would be quite interesting.

[Dolby]

Or Nanook, why i keep forgetting he was part of that CFD

bro

I got on like

an hour before any of the rest of them did

I was on Seanzie before it was cool

Why did you get on Seanzie?

I didn't want to get on a pileon and I liked getting on Seanzie better than the others with votes

[Dolby]

[VOTE: Nanook] aubergine

We should quit these asinine arguments based on NAI/mech fuckery and just kill everyone from the Seanzie wagon day 1 until we hit a wolf. If town saved mafia Sabie over town Seanzie I'll gladly just laugh and move on the next game. This game needs better direction.

Before some giant brain points out I was on that wagon, yes I know, feel free to flip me idc.

I said this before, you are finally sheeping me on this? What took you so long?

Let’s begin with [VOTE: Dolby] aubergine

dude

why've you taken every chance to try to vote me today

Because someone on Seanzie’s wagon gotta be a wolf besides Sabie or i’d be ashamed of being part of this town tbh.

Yeah that's something that I've been thinking about

it's not TSP imo

Mac was on super early and wasn't a part of it

I'm v

and imo NAA looks better in terms of how the wagon actually got there for being town, and in content, than Nanook

[Dolby]

I honestly just wanna know whom @sig protected.

I don't think that that is neccessary

Like, yes it's great if they got a correct protect, but if they claim, mafia knows whether or not they can target Marmot tonight. I personally think that it's just likeliest that Marmot or Mac were targetted and knowing another protection probably wouldn't help

Yes but my theory is Marmot/Falcon/TSP wolf team.

Meaning if that is the case. (I as I said before can be wrong about that hunch but still) Falcon’s protect us Fake and Sig has the real clear.

Is this not just tmi that the kill wasn't block and it hit a protect?

Mafia wouldn't know whether they hit a protect or RB would they?

...yes? That's the point? That gav is tmi-ing that the nk hit a protect and wasn't blocked...because there are currently two block claims out, two protects claimed, and a doc that hasn't claimed a target yet, so from town pov there isn't necessarily a clear in the doc protects

"if that is the case" referring to me saying that I think that a doc protection is more likely than me or LC having blocked the mafia kill

basically, this isn't TMI

[Guillotine]

[VOTE: Nanook] aubergine

We should quit these asinine arguments based on NAI/mech fuckery and just kill everyone from the Seanzie wagon day 1 until we hit a wolf. If town saved mafia Sabie over town Seanzie I'll gladly just laugh and move on the next game. This game needs better direction.

Before some giant brain points out I was on that wagon, yes I know, feel free to flip me idc.

I said this before, you are finally sheeping me on this? What took you so long?

Let’s begin with [VOTE: Dolby] aubergine

But like NAA exists.

I dont think NAA risks outing himself doing such a play to save Sabie tbh. If he is scum and actually did that, he’s either very dumb or very ballsy.

Ah, but this is NAA who will do anything in his power to find the suboptimal play and follow it through.

Good point but ive seen him doing that only as town. I think…

[LinearPoint]

I mean if I'm being 100% honest. I don't know if it's Jack or Nanook, but I would personally feel better if it was Nanook just trying to desperately save Sabie.

[NANOOKTHEGREATANDFEARSOME]

Meh, I still think it was tmi

[Lime Coke]

Wait what is being considered TMI?

[Dolby]

Anyone in that tier I don't feel like I have a confident read on socially

That said given two medic claims Sig/Falcon probably aren't w/w since there's a greater than 50% chance they stopped a kill imo

I honestly just wanna know whom @sig protected.

I don't think that that is neccessary

Like, yes it's great if they got a correct protect, but if they claim, mafia knows whether or not they can target Marmot tonight. I personally think that it's just likeliest that Marmot or Mac were targetted and knowing another protection probably wouldn't help

Yes but my theory is Marmot/Falcon/TSP wolf team.

Meaning if that is the case. (I as I said before can be wrong about that hunch but still) Falcon’s protect us Fake and Sig has the real clear.

Nanook is saying that this is Gav TMIing that the mafia kill was protected last night

[LinearPoint]

I mean if Nanook flips green I would probably say Gav isn't a terrible lynch, but at least 1 Mafia was on Seanzie and like mac said we should probably get them out first.

[Guillotine]

@DrWilgy
@MacDougall
@LinearPoint
@Lime Coke
@Dolby
@NotAnAxehole

I want you 6 to remember something very important.
TSP being Mafia Sniper confirms Falcon as Mafia.

Mphh

How is this player allowed to just post this and get by in beyond comprehension.

When I tried to push him as outed mafia for his votes Gavial had some galaxy brain reason for gamestate reading him town.

That guys needs to get vigged.

[LinearPoint]

Maybe it is just Nanook and 2 of Wiggly, Sig, and Falcon.

[LinearPoint]

That almost feels too simple though.

[Dolby]

Maybe it is just Nanook and 2 of Wiggly, Sig, and Falcon.

I hope it is but

it's probably not

[Guillotine]

Or Nanook is just not Mafia, and Mac is peddling whatever LHF will get him to his next win.

Nanook? LHF? Pffff. Nanook is not LHF friendo

[Guillotine]

fwiw I was beginning to suspect Guilo last phase (as I couldn't see anything convincingly towny about them) but considering Sabie flipped Evil Engi and Guilo maintained and/or even furthered his suspicion of me on D2 despite the fact I claimed engi earlier and Sabie got checked

spews Guilo as town and cannot be possibly a wolf bussing unless he fully intended to indict himself as being a poor solver so far wrt my slot

This is scum. Townreads me while he discredits me as a poor solver, I rather be scumread to be honest that accept that suck ass townread to be frank.

I correctly scum read Sabie since day 1, yah I'm a poor solver alright.

1) I said wrt ("with respect to" or "with consideration to") my slot: Yes you were (or still are; I can't tell if you're serious about "This is scum" here since you haven't voted me) incorrectly solving my slot as scum when that is very much not the case.

2) I do not easily give town-reads over pushes on (or catching) scum. Anyone can do that and in fact I myself have yet to have a scum game where I didn't push or put serious pressure on at least one of my scummates afaik. I am in general very skeptical of giving credit for wolf flips (especially to experienced players) unless there is a nuance that I think makes it unlikely to have been a push by a wolf.

3) I found a nuance that I think makes your push actually look town-read worthy. Its because you've been carting the idea that I'm scum all around on day 2 while Sabie was caught and I claimed engi. This is very unlikely to be done by a wolf when bussing Sabie in this scenario because they are knowingly and willfully dooming one of their scum-reads to be discredited by the scum engi flip.

4) If you're serious about scum-reading me rn for that observation then you're discrediting your solving ability by yourself at this very moment; you only have yourself to blame at this point. its proven I'm town after sabie's evil engi flip and any consideration that I'm not should be viewed as being ridiculous and extremely tinfoil.

1) i didnt know you claimed your role.
2) Roles are NAI. To my understanding wolves coild have two copies of the same role no? Like, if you are hoping to get vleared by role claim, that can’t happen, can it?

[Guillotine]

I remember you trying to steer off pressure from Sabie. I have to ISO you.

[LinearPoint]

There isn't a way to confirm a role's alignment mechanically.
So all we really have to go off of is basically are the Doctors doing their job, are the vigi's choosing good targets, are the Watchers and Tracker's being useful, and are the roleblockers and redirectors not fucking the Town over.
Also I guess there are vote doublers, but like they don't do anything to LyLo anyways.

[Guillotine]

Why does wolf NAA ever post that to wolf Nanook?

brainfullof.png

I'm open to any thoughts on it. It seems everyone is content with "Mac posted some things that sound somewhat intelligent, he must be town". Mac himself in postgame will admit that nothing he's posted to this point is alignment indicative in the slightest, or the actual nuance that makes it alignment indicative actually isn't what he's being read for.

I don't know how anyone town reads this guy, it's about as crazy as people town reading me for being erratic at times and/or deliberately taking a few pages out of the game to go off on a tangent. It's just not the way to read the player.

I would care about this push if it was anyone other than NAA who nobody ever listens to anyway.

Inv4 this is some sweet hard distancing.

[Guillotine]

Why does wolf NAA ever post that to wolf Nanook?

brainfullof.png

I'm open to any thoughts on it. It seems everyone is content with "Mac posted some things that sound somewhat intelligent, he must be town". Mac himself in postgame will admit that nothing he's posted to this point is alignment indicative in the slightest, or the actual nuance that makes it alignment indicative actually isn't what he's being read for.

I don't know how anyone town reads this guy, it's about as crazy as people town reading me for being erratic at times and/or deliberately taking a few pages out of the game to go off on a tangent. It's just not the way to read the player.

You are just entirely outrageously wrong in your appraisal here.

I've been townie. If I hadn't been I'd be getting pushed a lot harder because that's what happens to me. I have a townie claim (that I am backed into a corner to use the way town forces me to use it) and I immediately tried to turbo Sabie when day 2 started well before Marmot outed the red check.

Your arguments that I am not town are confirmation bias, paranoia, tinfoil and StarV brand bad logic mixed together in a blender and out came this shit read.

I might be wrong about your alignment, and still you'll agree with what's in bold post-game.

I think the only players actively townreading me are like Jack, Linearpoint and Guillo and Jack and Linearpoint have outlined good reasons. Guillo might just be pocketing me.

Is it working?

When have i failed to read you correctly? Dont mention stormtossed.

[Guillotine]

yeah Gav I'll work with you for the moment

I'm like near collapse rn tbh

Also haven't read the most recent 400 or so posts

If TSP kills me tonight can you do me a favour and vote Falcon for me?

There is no way you believe you are night kill material after voicing intent to kill Marmot. Why would they night kill you if you are toen when you could end up doing some dirty work for them?

[Guillotine]

I hard claim Blue Heavy and I will use the self save tonight.

[VOTE: Nanook] aubergine

[Guillotine]

I hard claim Blue Heavy and I will use the self save tonight.

[VOTE: Nanook] aubergine

Or maybe i won’t

[Gavial]

Silly question Gav. Townspeople fake stuff all the time.

Yeah but this is Falcon we are talking about.


Why are you defending him anyway?

[Gavial]

Anyone in that tier I don't feel like I have a confident read on socially

That said given two medic claims Sig/Falcon probably aren't w/w since there's a greater than 50% chance they stopped a kill imo

I honestly just wanna know whom @sig protected.

I don't think that that is neccessary

Like, yes it's great if they got a correct protect, but if they claim, mafia knows whether or not they can target Marmot tonight. I personally think that it's just likeliest that Marmot or Mac were targetted and knowing another protection probably wouldn't help

Yes but my theory is Marmot/Falcon/TSP wolf team.

Meaning if that is the case. (I as I said before can be wrong about that hunch but still) Falcon’s protect us Fake and Sig has the real clear.

Is this not just tmi that the kill wasn't block and it hit a protect?

If anything that would imply the opposite since he is saying that the kill wasn't stopped by Doctor and the Mafia just flat out chose not to kill.
Marmot/Falcon/TSP can literally never be a wolf team and the Mafia failed to kill last night.
Unless one of the Pyros redirected a roleblock to Marmot, Falcon, or TSP. I mean Wiggly will never tell us, and the other pyro either didn't redirect it or just doesn't care to say they did in which case probs just mafia.

No trust me.
Marmot/TSP/Falcon is possible LP.

[Gavial]

I mean if Nanook flips green I would probably say Gav isn't a terrible lynch, but at least 1 Mafia was on Seanzie and like mac said we should probably get them out first.

Dude I’m telling you I’m town and there is a chance the other Sniper TSP is a Wolf.

[Gavial]

yeah Gav I'll work with you for the moment

I'm like near collapse rn tbh

Also haven't read the most recent 400 or so posts

If TSP kills me tonight can you do me a favour and vote Falcon for me?

There is no way you believe you are night kill material after voicing intent to kill Marmot. Why would they night kill you if you are toen when you could end up doing some dirty work for them?

TSP’s Sniper shot isn’t a Night Kill LMAO.

[Gavial]

Least not a factional one.

[Gavial]

What are the chances I’m wrong on Falcon and I can just never read Falcon because he keeps doing wolfy shit?

[Gavial]

Because for some reason Nanook seems to now most likely be aligned with TSP/Marmot over Falcon and Jack which is questionable.

[Gavial]

@Marmot
Hey just a consideration.
Target me tonight to see if TSP targeted me or not.