Halvøsen Ridge [MAFIA WIN]

[fingersplints]

I'm about to lose the rest of this evening to work, so I hope folks get engaged here. The game is kind of dead apart from my analysis and Sean hating it.

I like your guys little back and forth there

[fingersplints]

To anyone who is voting for fingersplints, here's a couple links to recent wolf games from her.

Fargo Mafia - ok this was from a year ago. This is one of fs's most active games I've seen, she spent a lot of time early on talking about pretty much anything but reads, and even her reads were not very strong at the start.
Mafia Syndicate Normal Game - this is from a few months ago, fs barely posted, and her posts were all very short, and she does seem stilted in this one.

I'm not seeing either of these things from her. Yes fingersplints doesn't post a lot, but that is normal for her (and really it's that the rest of us just post way too much). What I have seen here is an almost immediate attempt to generate reads, explain them, and she's also considering how the game will play out based on flips and looking ahead, an approach which appears to be lacking in her scum meta.

I'd call her town right now.

Does Finger tend to use aggressive phrasing as town when questioned?

Have I used aggressive phrasing?

[NateTheLesser]

Ok too many falcon votes already

[VOTE: EnderWiggin] aubergine

@NateTheLesser would it be possible in your vote compilation to determine approximately or precisely what the tally looked like as of this post?

Yep. Before Creature switched the count would have been:

falcon    7   (nate, jjj, finger, creature, marmot, dizzy, ender)
marmot    3   (boq, falcon, wilgy)
creature  2   (alison, mac)
wilgy     1   (sean)
dizzy     1   (rondo)

Ender voted for Falcon at around the same time though, so the poll could have said 7 votes for Falcon or 6 depending on whether Ender had actually voted in the poll yet.

[NateTheLesser]

In the process of catching up on what's gone down since last night.

[fingersplints]

JJJ votes on Falcon a quick scroll through the iso shows he doenst move off falcon

Spoiler: show

[VOTE: falcon45ca] aubergine

Nate the lesser jumps on after and doesnt move off falcon as well

Spoiler: show

Doing this for now
[VOTE: falcon] aubergine

Maybe a weird read. But the one game I have with him he was more pure shitpost-y and difficult for me to get a read either way on. Here it's "shitpost-y" interspersed with like actual reads, which is throwing me off.

Then Creature, who votes, moves around jumps on falcon a second time and ends up on Ender

Spoiler: show

[VOTE: falcon45ca] aubergine

[VOTE: falcon45ca] aubergine

After is Ender, who will jump onto Dizzy and back on later

Spoiler: show

[GIF]

what is the significance of those four Creature posts to you

They read like someone who's having trouble engaging in the game. Creature is far more assertive as town, those are pot stirring, wall flower posts

never mind

[VOTE: Falcon] aubergine

I just remembered thanks to Rondo that I disliked Falcon's Creature push.

[VOTE: Falcon] aubergine

Next is Seanzie who jumps off onto wiggly

Spoiler: show

[VOTE: Falcon45ca] aubergine

Then Naked vote by Fingersplints (I believe she explains later)

Spoiler: show

[VOTE: falcon] aubergine

Then Dizzy

Spoiler: show

Most likely, I won't vote anyone.

Jk

[VOTE: Falcon] aubergine

[Second creature here]
Marmot but ends on Ender

Spoiler: show

[VOTE: falcon] aubergine

I'm going to read his ISO, but I'm having trouble reading his current behavior as townie.

The picture of vote I took before vote madness

Spoiler: show

viewtopic.php?t=2389&start=1600#p928315

Dizzy

Spoiler: show

[VOTE: Falcon] aubergine

Now there’s enough votes for bussing to happen.

Gottem.

Ender

Spoiler: show

[VOTE: Falcon] aubergine

[Ender 2 is here]
Alison

Spoiler: show

I did not realize it was EOD already. Luckily I checked before heading off to breakfast.

It seems like Creature isn't going over today and I think falcon is more suspicious than Ender so I'm moving my vote accordingly.

[VOTE: falcon] aubergine

I'm ok with a falcon exe - the way he treated Mac was weird and seemed to have no purpose other than randomly discrediting and shading him.

Lucy

Spoiler: show

[VOTE: @falcon45ca ] aubergine

So Marmot is the last off, Lucy is the last on. Does a wolf who knows the Flip do that? This gets into WIFOM territory but I really am having a hard time seeing it. But Mac says murder Marmot. JJJ and Boq are on first and they really dont move Is that wolfy? I dunno they would have to deal with the flakk. So I would be looking towards the center of the pack for 1-2

This was a pain in the ass to format and search for so I might have missed something. You can reference Nakeds nice spreadsheet to double check I just noticed I have dizzy twice, Im not changing it

A) Creature, Ender, Finger, Dizzy, Alison - 1-2 of

B)Possibly one of JJJ, Nate, Lucy, Marmot if you think a wolf is that ballsy - 1 of and 1 of above

D)Or if you think we are way off it could be none of the above and 3 of
Boquise, Seanzie, DrWilgy, RondoDimBuckle

Which I dont think is really viable, at least from my point of view its unlikely that Boq/Seanzie/Wigly are all wolf. So it must be some sort of split of A:1-2 B:0-1 C:0-1

So we just need to find the most wolfy in those groups

Spoiler: show

In terms of suspicion around and votes for Falcon, this is a vote I'm interested in hearing more about. Offers a town perspective on Falcon early (not really a read, more "I would expect this from him as town"), and then later on has him as a scumlean but with an out of saying they always think he's scum and have been wrong before.

Alison looks towny, JJJ looks towny




Sean's a wolf

This post is scummy for Falcon... these reads are agenda laden regardless of what Alison and Jay's alignment is (can be t/w or t/t).

why why why

It's how I'm reading your playstyle, your vibes.



t's the approach Alison has, her posting has a questioning solvey method, that doesn't feel like it's pushing an agenda. You have a similar feel, like you're working on solving the game.



Sean feels...stiff, awkward.

words... that mean nothing

What really did it was his spree of just asking aimless questions of why people had the reads they had that I can already see he has no intent in following up on lol.

eg., town Falcon doesn't give a shit about why EnderWiggin would vote Fingersplints lol.

Town falcon pretty much always talks about/suspects me early. Him noticing and commenting on a vote of me isn’t at all surprising to me if he were town

Have you played with scum!Falcon?

Yes

Are you scumleaning Falcon due to that past experience, or what's feeding that scumlean?

Just a vibe based on past experiences and general tone in posts in this game.

It’s not great and completely vague, so I apologise to everyone and falcon. I wish I had more to go off of, but day 1 is rough

[VOTE: falcon] aubergine

I’m going to try and be around still for the rest of the EOD but I’m already getting tired.

We are currently tied falcon vs creature. If it stays like that I support a falcon vote more than a creature vote. I think he is the more suspicious of the two, and I think that we can form some decent connections with his flip given a lot of folks have given opinions or had interactions with him. More than anything though I don’t want it to end in the tie option. Again I’ll try to stay up

I'm good with a vote here for now.
[VOTE: fingersplints] aubergine

Well I wasn’t wrong that when I think he is scum, he is town. It was a weak day 1 vote based off of general vibes and tone, so I can see why my vote should be looked at because I think it was a pretty lame and vague vote but just because it’s a bad vote it doesn’t come from a bad/scum place. As I expressed in the post you linked, I didn’t want it to be a tie and no result. While this obviously wasn’t the desired result, at least we have something to work with.

At that time I really dont think we were at risk of a tie and many people had already voiced their concern at a tie myself included.

I think here is a good place to start, lets see if anything happens
[VOTE: Finger ] aubergine

More please Finger

You say “I really don’t think we were at risk of a tie” but as even mentioned in the post of mine you quoted the votes were tied when I wrote that. Sure it’s unlikely they would stay exactly that way the remainder of the day, but it’s really not that weird for me to have commented on the vote as it stood right then.

[fingersplints]

@NateTheLesser i can’t see whatever vote thing is everyone is taking about, so can you tell me who were the other main contenders for yesterday were other than falcon?
Creature, marmot, Ender? I’m trying to remember to think the likelihood of the falcon wagon being a save of anyone
Thank you

[NateTheLesser]

@NateTheLesser i can’t see whatever vote thing is everyone is taking about, so can you tell me who were the other main contenders for yesterday were other than falcon?
Creature, marmot, Ender? I’m trying to remember to think the likelihood of the falcon wagon being a save of anyone
Thank you

This is the vote history thing, and the info about what it is:

Vote Spreadsheet

This is something I do on my homesite because we don't have any sort of vote automation (and Ender will recognize it because I brought screenshots of it to our champs qualifier). If you want to see what the vote count was at any given point in time, this will help.

- There's a tab for each Day at the bottom. All votes from the thread are listed in chronological order, and on the right side is a running vote count that shows what the vote count was after each vote.
- Due to the vagaries of The Poll being separate from the thread, I'm using the timestamp from the vote post if I could find one. I also took poll screenshots occasionally and reconciled the vote counts (there are notes on the timestamps of when this was done), so at those points the count is definitely accurate. There were at least a few votes that I could tell happened from the screenshots but didn't see a vote post for, so that's what the "??:??" votes are.
- Waterfall: This tab shows, for each player, everyone that they voted for each day. Player alignments are colored in after they die.
- Wagons: Shows the final vote count from each day’s vote, with player alignments colored in as the game goes on.
- If you open the document you'll be anonymous to anyone else in there, so don't worry about doxxing yourself.
- I obviously won't be updating this anymore after I die.

Link removed in edit by mod

(I think that'll actually embed here..? Unless the preview is lying to me. It seems like it loses some of the formatting and doesn't show notes, so this is the actual link if you want to open the document:
Link removed in edit by mod

One item of note to start with regarding JJJ's idea to look at the Falcon votes: everyone except Boq/Rondo/Wilgy voted for Falcon at some point. So unless that's exactly the team, there are wolf fingerprints on the Falcon push.

Nate will be allowed to share this document by screenshot, but we can't utilize a shared, editable document outside the thread. Apologies for having to edit this post, but I couldn't see a good way around that.

It's back, in Pog screenshot form!

Day 1 Votes:

Spoiler: show

Waterfall:

Spoiler: show

EOD Wagons:

Spoiler: show

The main non-Falcon wagons were Creature/Marmot/Dizzy. Ender was also a wagon for a good portion of the day but never had more than a couple votes at a time until close to EOD.

[NateTheLesser]

G-Man didn't save the final vote count which is annoying. iirc Falcon was a pretty large runaway wagon with low accountability; I'd expect mafia to either casually pile on or hide on some vanity wagon so they don't get their hands dirty. Biased more towards the former if they had a teammate in danger.

Everyone voted Falcon except I and Falcon iirc

You/Rondo/Wilgy are the living players that didn't vote Falcon.

[Seanzie]

G-Man didn't save the final vote count which is annoying. iirc Falcon was a pretty large runaway wagon with low accountability; I'd expect mafia to either casually pile on or hide on some vanity wagon so they don't get their hands dirty. Biased more towards the former if they had a teammate in danger.

Everyone voted Falcon except I and Falcon iirc

You/Rondo/Wilgy are the living players that didn't vote Falcon.

I also wasn't on Falcon's EoD wagon, even though I voted for him earlier in the day IIRC.

[NateTheLesser]

Boq and Rondo actually can be cleared in a Marmot!Wolf world, as can Creature probably.

Mildly trusting Seanzie on the unpairing for Creature/Marmot tbh.

Walk me through this? How does Marmot Wolf clear me?

Magic.

But seriously your vote twice put Marmot from "One vote" to "Actual wagon territory" on D1. And chaos muppet that you are, I don't think that's w/w

Meh, the votes weren't that dangerous IMO. Twice he was the lone vote on Marmot for a while, and then the last one he was a second vote (when Falcon had 4 votes). I think I agree with your overall point though, since I don't think he'd vote for Marmot 3 times on day one if they were partners.

[NateTheLesser]

G-Man didn't save the final vote count which is annoying. iirc Falcon was a pretty large runaway wagon with low accountability; I'd expect mafia to either casually pile on or hide on some vanity wagon so they don't get their hands dirty. Biased more towards the former if they had a teammate in danger.

Everyone voted Falcon except I and Falcon iirc

You/Rondo/Wilgy are the living players that didn't vote Falcon.

I also wasn't on Falcon's EoD wagon, even though I voted for him earlier in the day IIRC.

Yeah that's what I meant, those are the three that never voted for Falcon at any point.

[NateTheLesser]

In terms of suspicion around and votes for Falcon, this is a vote I'm interested in hearing more about. Offers a town perspective on Falcon early (not really a read, more "I would expect this from him as town"), and then later on has him as a scumlean but with an out of saying they always think he's scum and have been wrong before.

Alison looks towny, JJJ looks towny




Sean's a wolf

This post is scummy for Falcon... these reads are agenda laden regardless of what Alison and Jay's alignment is (can be t/w or t/t).

Alison looks towny, JJJ looks towny




Sean's a wolf

why why why

It's how I'm reading your playstyle, your vibes.



t's the approach Alison has, her posting has a questioning solvey method, that doesn't feel like it's pushing an agenda. You have a similar feel, like you're working on solving the game.



Sean feels...stiff, awkward.

words... that mean nothing

What really did it was his spree of just asking aimless questions of why people had the reads they had that I can already see he has no intent in following up on lol.

eg., town Falcon doesn't give a shit about why EnderWiggin would vote Fingersplints lol.

Town falcon pretty much always talks about/suspects me early. Him noticing and commenting on a vote of me isn’t at all surprising to me if he were town

Can anyone vouch for Mac never being wrong as town about falcon?

Gth I’d say I’m townleaning mac, and scumleaning falcon so considering following that vote but I have reservations as I always think falcon is scum and have been wrong

Have you played with scum!Falcon?

Yes

👍

Are you scumleaning Falcon due to that past experience, or what's feeding that scumlean?

Just a vibe based on past experiences and general tone in posts in this game.

It’s not great and completely vague, so I apologise to everyone and falcon. I wish I had more to go off of, but day 1 is rough

[VOTE: falcon] aubergine

I’m going to try and be around still for the rest of the EOD but I’m already getting tired.

We are currently tied falcon vs creature. If it stays like that I support a falcon vote more than a creature vote. I think he is the more suspicious of the two, and I think that we can form some decent connections with his flip given a lot of folks have given opinions or had interactions with him. More than anything though I don’t want it to end in the tie option. Again I’ll try to stay up

I'm good with a vote here for now.
[VOTE: fingersplints] aubergine

Well I wasn’t wrong that when I think he is scum, he is town. :p It was a weak day 1 vote based off of general vibes and tone, so I can see why my vote should be looked at because I think it was a pretty lame and vague vote but just because it’s a bad vote it doesn’t come from a bad/scum place. As I expressed in the post you linked, I didn’t want it to be a tie and no result. While this obviously wasn’t the desired result, at least we have something to work with.

Do you remember why you preferred Falcon over Creature at this point?

[NateTheLesser]

Also back to this post

Sure

You are appreciated.

The last thing I was hoping to achieve is the classical night kill analysis. Many people balk at the very idea of trying this, and I think they're wrong. Wifom is wifom blah blah, but we're remiss if we don't at least take a look. Moreover, in a mountainous game, at least one of the layers of wifom does not exist -- there are no doctor dodges. So it'd behoove us to review Mac and see where he sat. What we do with that I don't know right now, but we honor his memory enough to give him a voice.

If that's something that tickles you, I'd love to see what you come up with.

I kinda expected to be the kill because I was during D1 consensus town read with no on-going conflicts with other players. Whereas Mac, also highly town read, had a thing with Wilgy that could be exploited and easier to tinfoil because of Falcon and of site history*.

*What I mean with site history is that I am an unknown variable whilst Mac is a tried gun.

This tells me that Mac's reads can have threatened the woofs tbh

Was Boquise “consensus town read”? I don’t have a read on them yet so to me this reads a lot like saying you are town to try and seem townier, but I don’t recall ever playing with Boquise or paying that much attention yet to others mentions of them

I base it off other players' read lists tbh. You didnt read those posts?

Nah I read them. I don’t remember every single mention of you though and my recollection of you was more as null over consensus town, so that’s why I’m asking others.

I don't think everyone answered JJJ's prompt to name their top 4 town, but at least a few of them were exactly Mac/JJJ/Boq/Lucy. I wouldn't really have been shocked for any of them to be the N1 (though a little surprised if it was Lucy over the other 3).

[Alison]

I'll be a little busy for the next 12 hours or so, my apologies. I have skimmed fingersplint's posts this page and been left with a generally good impression. Would like more elaboration on how Ender read Dizzy's entrance; which part of it was a towntell, etc.

If I elaborate it won't work anymore lol.

Keeping a read cryptic so you can use it in future games is dumb. You have already been extremely cagey this game; I would like you to please elaborate on the tell you used to read Dizzy.

[Alison]

Also back to this post

Sure

You are appreciated.

The last thing I was hoping to achieve is the classical night kill analysis. Many people balk at the very idea of trying this, and I think they're wrong. Wifom is wifom blah blah, but we're remiss if we don't at least take a look. Moreover, in a mountainous game, at least one of the layers of wifom does not exist -- there are no doctor dodges. So it'd behoove us to review Mac and see where he sat. What we do with that I don't know right now, but we honor his memory enough to give him a voice.

If that's something that tickles you, I'd love to see what you come up with.

I kinda expected to be the kill because I was during D1 consensus town read with no on-going conflicts with other players. Whereas Mac, also highly town read, had a thing with Wilgy that could be exploited and easier to tinfoil because of Falcon and of site history*.

*What I mean with site history is that I am an unknown variable whilst Mac is a tried gun.

This tells me that Mac's reads can have threatened the woofs tbh

Was Boquise “consensus town read”? I don’t have a read on them yet so to me this reads a lot like saying you are town to try and seem townier, but I don’t recall ever playing with Boquise or paying that much attention yet to others mentions of them

I base it off other players' read lists tbh. You didnt read those posts?

Nah I read them. I don’t remember every single mention of you though and my recollection of you was more as null over consensus town, so that’s why I’m asking others.

My recollection is that Boq is consensus town.

[Alison]

While I dig around these interactions, here's a good way for folks to engage: either with or without looking first, are their any pairings on the current roster that strike you as particularly probable mafia teammates or otherwise concerning? Or pairings that are definitely not teammates in your eyes?

Seanzie is probably not teammates with Ender or Wilgy. Ender is probably not teammates with Dizzy

[Alison]

I won't share my take on Creature/Wilgy yet. This one strikes me as important, and I want others to say their piece before I do. I have two posts for you that I think can be informative. Tell me what you think, folks. Are they compatible as mafia or not?

Spoiler: show

I could see it being Marmot + NaateTheLesser

Maybe DrWilgy for third

I feel good about:

Alison
Boquise
Creature
fingersplints
JaggedJimmyJay
MacDougall

Slightly worried those are the most experienced players here though

Ok I might consider adding DrWilgy in

That looks pretty compatible to me.

[NateTheLesser]

Spoiler: show

JJJ votes on Falcon a quick scroll through the iso shows he doenst move off falcon

Spoiler: show

[VOTE: falcon45ca] aubergine

Nate the lesser jumps on after and doesnt move off falcon as well

Spoiler: show

Doing this for now
[VOTE: falcon] aubergine

Maybe a weird read. But the one game I have with him he was more pure shitpost-y and difficult for me to get a read either way on. Here it's "shitpost-y" interspersed with like actual reads, which is throwing me off.

Then Creature, who votes, moves around jumps on falcon a second time and ends up on Ender

Spoiler: show

[VOTE: falcon45ca] aubergine

[VOTE: falcon45ca] aubergine

After is Ender, who will jump onto Dizzy and back on later

Spoiler: show

[GIF]

what is the significance of those four Creature posts to you

They read like someone who's having trouble engaging in the game. Creature is far more assertive as town, those are pot stirring, wall flower posts

never mind

[VOTE: Falcon] aubergine

I just remembered thanks to Rondo that I disliked Falcon's Creature push.

[VOTE: Falcon] aubergine

Next is Seanzie who jumps off onto wiggly

Spoiler: show

[VOTE: Falcon45ca] aubergine

Then Naked vote by Fingersplints (I believe she explains later)

Spoiler: show

[VOTE: falcon] aubergine

Then Dizzy

Spoiler: show

Most likely, I won't vote anyone.

Jk

[VOTE: Falcon] aubergine

[Second creature here]
Marmot but ends on Ender

Spoiler: show

[VOTE: falcon] aubergine

I'm going to read his ISO, but I'm having trouble reading his current behavior as townie.

The picture of vote I took before vote madness

Spoiler: show

viewtopic.php?t=2389&start=1600#p928315

Dizzy

Spoiler: show

[VOTE: Falcon] aubergine

Now there’s enough votes for bussing to happen.

Gottem.

Ender

Spoiler: show

[VOTE: Falcon] aubergine

[Ender 2 is here]
Alison

Spoiler: show

I did not realize it was EOD already. Luckily I checked before heading off to breakfast.

It seems like Creature isn't going over today and I think falcon is more suspicious than Ender so I'm moving my vote accordingly.

[VOTE: falcon] aubergine

I'm ok with a falcon exe - the way he treated Mac was weird and seemed to have no purpose other than randomly discrediting and shading him.

Lucy

Spoiler: show

[VOTE: @falcon45ca ] aubergine

So Marmot is the last off, Lucy is the last on. Does a wolf who knows the Flip do that? This gets into WIFOM territory but I really am having a hard time seeing it. But Mac says murder Marmot. JJJ and Boq are on first and they really dont move Is that wolfy? I dunno they would have to deal with the flakk. So I would be looking towards the center of the pack for 1-2

This was a pain in the ass to format and search for so I might have missed something. You can reference Nakeds nice spreadsheet to double check I just noticed I have dizzy twice, Im not changing it

A) Creature, Ender, Finger, Dizzy, Alison - 1-2 of

B)Possibly one of JJJ, Nate, Lucy, Marmot if you think a wolf is that ballsy - 1 of and 1 of above

D)Or if you think we are way off it could be none of the above and 3 of
Boquise, Seanzie, DrWilgy, RondoDimBuckle

Which I dont think is really viable, at least from my point of view its unlikely that Boq/Seanzie/Wigly are all wolf. So it must be some sort of split of A:1-2 B:0-1 C:0-1

So we just need to find the most wolfy in those groups

Spoiler: show

In terms of suspicion around and votes for Falcon, this is a vote I'm interested in hearing more about. Offers a town perspective on Falcon early (not really a read, more "I would expect this from him as town"), and then later on has him as a scumlean but with an out of saying they always think he's scum and have been wrong before.

Alison looks towny, JJJ looks towny




Sean's a wolf

This post is scummy for Falcon... these reads are agenda laden regardless of what Alison and Jay's alignment is (can be t/w or t/t).

why why why

It's how I'm reading your playstyle, your vibes.



t's the approach Alison has, her posting has a questioning solvey method, that doesn't feel like it's pushing an agenda. You have a similar feel, like you're working on solving the game.



Sean feels...stiff, awkward.

words... that mean nothing

What really did it was his spree of just asking aimless questions of why people had the reads they had that I can already see he has no intent in following up on lol.

eg., town Falcon doesn't give a shit about why EnderWiggin would vote Fingersplints lol.

Town falcon pretty much always talks about/suspects me early. Him noticing and commenting on a vote of me isn’t at all surprising to me if he were town

Have you played with scum!Falcon?

Yes

👍

Are you scumleaning Falcon due to that past experience, or what's feeding that scumlean?

Just a vibe based on past experiences and general tone in posts in this game.

It’s not great and completely vague, so I apologise to everyone and falcon. I wish I had more to go off of, but day 1 is rough

[VOTE: falcon] aubergine

I’m going to try and be around still for the rest of the EOD but I’m already getting tired.

We are currently tied falcon vs creature. If it stays like that I support a falcon vote more than a creature vote. I think he is the more suspicious of the two, and I think that we can form some decent connections with his flip given a lot of folks have given opinions or had interactions with him. More than anything though I don’t want it to end in the tie option. Again I’ll try to stay up

I'm good with a vote here for now.
[VOTE: fingersplints] aubergine

Well I wasn’t wrong that when I think he is scum, he is town. :p It was a weak day 1 vote based off of general vibes and tone, so I can see why my vote should be looked at because I think it was a pretty lame and vague vote but just because it’s a bad vote it doesn’t come from a bad/scum place. As I expressed in the post you linked, I didn’t want it to be a tie and no result. While this obviously wasn’t the desired result, at least we have something to work with.

At that time I really dont think we were at risk of a tie and many people had already voiced their concern at a tie myself included.

I think here is a good place to start, lets see if anything happens
[VOTE: Finger ] aubergine

More please Finger

This isn't quite right, order-wise. The full picture of Falcon's votes looks something like this:
nate👍, mac👍, ender👍, ender👎, jjj👍, creature👍, mac👎, ender👍, creature👎, ender👎, sean👍, sean👎, finger👍, dizzy👍, dizzy👎, creature👍, marmot👍, dizzy👍, ender👍, creature👎, mac👍, marmot👎, alison👍, lucy👍

Regardless, I agree that somewhere in the middle voters is where I'd expect to find a wolf. More than 1 I don't know, I think that depends more on whether any wolves were in danger and whether they needed to actually push Falcon or just nudge him along.

[Alison]

Not gonna lie, while I don't want to discourage anyone from doing analysis, I am kind of wary of your conclusions. You seem to be spending only a minute or two per pairing

There is, quite simply, no human alive that can do this stuff as fast as I can. Sometimes a couple of minutes is all it takes to search the key posts and interpret them.

and the reasons you're stating to anti-team people are extremely weak IMO. While this would be fine to help develop reads and worldbuild, the idea that you're suggesting a solid clear of a PoE based on anti-teams shoots up huge red flags in my mind. No, just no. Those "dissassociations" you've pointed out are NOT remotely strong enough to clear someone based off associations alone. Just no. That is bad.

Use a word softer than "clear" if you prefer. Everything will be, as ever before, subject to continuous evaluation and reevaluation. We need a starting point, however, and that is what I am building. The single most valuable application of this task, in my view given my numerous past experiences employing it, is the capacity to remove players from the immediate POE pool on the basis of narrow team fits. If you don't feel DrWilgy is there, then go point out my conclusions that you would protest and protest them (or for any other pairing). I actually have managed fewer dissociated relationships so far than I would like or than I often have in other games. I am not going to pittle around and call everything null, or else we're going to get nowhere. Judgment calls must be made.

The good news is that the two of you arguing about dissociation dissociates you two.

I, too, am dissociated. Not with anyone or in a mafia sense. I've just lost touch with reality.

[Seanzie]

I'm about to lose the rest of this evening to work, so I hope folks get engaged here. The game is kind of dead apart from my analysis and Sean hating it.

I like your guys little back and forth there

Do you have any thoughts on our alignments based on our little back and forth?

[Alison]

I feel good about Seanzie after his spat with JJJ. Getting really aggressive about wording ("clear", "opportunism") is something I associate with his town play. My opinion of JJJ hasn't really shifted much; I see Seanzie's concerns that he's pushing too hastily to clear people based off a lack of negative associations, but I don't necessarily think that's scummy for him specifically. Being eager to clear people from the POE purely through interactive analysis is an attitude that I associate with town JJJ, and I thought his use of the word "opportunism" was fine. I have used it in similar ways myself. "Two townies vote a third townie early D1, mafia casually hops on to put pressure on them" is a common situation.

[Alison]

@NateTheLesser I would like to hear some personal opinions from you, rather than simply reiterating data from the game like a human Modbot. What reads do you feel most strongly about? What do you think of the JJJ/Seanzie argument?

[Creature]

I'm really tired

[fingersplints]

I'm about to lose the rest of this evening to work, so I hope folks get engaged here. The game is kind of dead apart from my analysis and Sean hating it.

I like your guys little back and forth there

Do you have any thoughts on our alignments based on our little back and forth?

T/T

It’s important to not get to comfortable with town consensus, so while I don’t agree with your assessment of Jay but I really like where it’s coming from

[Creature]

If there's any wolf within Mac's list it's most likely Dyslexicon

[VOTE: Dyslexicon] aubergine

[Creature]

I can see what JJJ is doing, but it's not really helpful when there are no wolf flips. Preflip associations are useless because most of the time they could just be t/t and hence a waste of time.

[Seanzie]

If there's any wolf within Mac's list it's most likely Dyslexicon

[VOTE: Dyslexicon] aubergine

Why Dizzy? I don't necessarily disagree, but I'd like to hear your thoughts.

[fingersplints]

In terms of suspicion around and votes for Falcon, this is a vote I'm interested in hearing more about. Offers a town perspective on Falcon early (not really a read, more "I would expect this from him as town"), and then later on has him as a scumlean but with an out of saying they always think he's scum and have been wrong before.

Alison looks towny, JJJ looks towny




Sean's a wolf

This post is scummy for Falcon... these reads are agenda laden regardless of what Alison and Jay's alignment is (can be t/w or t/t).

why why why

It's how I'm reading your playstyle, your vibes.



t's the approach Alison has, her posting has a questioning solvey method, that doesn't feel like it's pushing an agenda. You have a similar feel, like you're working on solving the game.



Sean feels...stiff, awkward.

words... that mean nothing

What really did it was his spree of just asking aimless questions of why people had the reads they had that I can already see he has no intent in following up on lol.

eg., town Falcon doesn't give a shit about why EnderWiggin would vote Fingersplints lol.

Town falcon pretty much always talks about/suspects me early. Him noticing and commenting on a vote of me isn’t at all surprising to me if he were town

Have you played with scum!Falcon?

Yes

Are you scumleaning Falcon due to that past experience, or what's feeding that scumlean?

Just a vibe based on past experiences and general tone in posts in this game.

It’s not great and completely vague, so I apologise to everyone and falcon. I wish I had more to go off of, but day 1 is rough

[VOTE: falcon] aubergine

I’m going to try and be around still for the rest of the EOD but I’m already getting tired.

We are currently tied falcon vs creature. If it stays like that I support a falcon vote more than a creature vote. I think he is the more suspicious of the two, and I think that we can form some decent connections with his flip given a lot of folks have given opinions or had interactions with him. More than anything though I don’t want it to end in the tie option. Again I’ll try to stay up

I'm good with a vote here for now.
[VOTE: fingersplints] aubergine

Well I wasn’t wrong that when I think he is scum, he is town. It was a weak day 1 vote based off of general vibes and tone, so I can see why my vote should be looked at because I think it was a pretty lame and vague vote but just because it’s a bad vote it doesn’t come from a bad/scum place. As I expressed in the post you linked, I didn’t want it to be a tie and no result. While this obviously wasn’t the desired result, at least we have something to work with.

Do you remember why you preferred Falcon over Creature at this point?

I don’t have anything specific unfortunately just a vibe I was getting. Falcon stood out to me more. I’d like to have a closer look at Creature today

[Creature]

I will still trust Alison and JJJ because I expect wolves to kill them soon if they're town.

[fingersplints]

Also thanks to those who answered my question about Boq. The wording is less weird since they do seem to be considered town, however it does still ping me a little when anyone talks about them myself in terms of being so town.
They are still null for me I guess

[Dyslexicon]

Celebrating my 10000 posts anniversary by mentioning I'm happy to be a part of this community,
and to be floating around in the larger mafia community multiverse.

I still remember how welcoming everyone was when I played my first games here at Cindy Kate!

Hopefully, we can continue to have fun with this silly or deep game!

Maybe the real wolves were the friends we made along the way.

[Creature]

In terms of suspicion around and votes for Falcon, this is a vote I'm interested in hearing more about. Offers a town perspective on Falcon early (not really a read, more "I would expect this from him as town"), and then later on has him as a scumlean but with an out of saying they always think he's scum and have been wrong before.

Alison looks towny, JJJ looks towny




Sean's a wolf

This post is scummy for Falcon... these reads are agenda laden regardless of what Alison and Jay's alignment is (can be t/w or t/t).

It's how I'm reading your playstyle, your vibes.



t's the approach Alison has, her posting has a questioning solvey method, that doesn't feel like it's pushing an agenda. You have a similar feel, like you're working on solving the game.



Sean feels...stiff, awkward.

words... that mean nothing

What really did it was his spree of just asking aimless questions of why people had the reads they had that I can already see he has no intent in following up on lol.

eg., town Falcon doesn't give a shit about why EnderWiggin would vote Fingersplints lol.

Town falcon pretty much always talks about/suspects me early. Him noticing and commenting on a vote of me isn’t at all surprising to me if he were town

Yes

Are you scumleaning Falcon due to that past experience, or what's feeding that scumlean?

Just a vibe based on past experiences and general tone in posts in this game.

It’s not great and completely vague, so I apologise to everyone and falcon. I wish I had more to go off of, but day 1 is rough

[VOTE: falcon] aubergine

I’m going to try and be around still for the rest of the EOD but I’m already getting tired.

We are currently tied falcon vs creature. If it stays like that I support a falcon vote more than a creature vote. I think he is the more suspicious of the two, and I think that we can form some decent connections with his flip given a lot of folks have given opinions or had interactions with him. More than anything though I don’t want it to end in the tie option. Again I’ll try to stay up

I'm good with a vote here for now.
[VOTE: fingersplints] aubergine

Well I wasn’t wrong that when I think he is scum, he is town. It was a weak day 1 vote based off of general vibes and tone, so I can see why my vote should be looked at because I think it was a pretty lame and vague vote but just because it’s a bad vote it doesn’t come from a bad/scum place. As I expressed in the post you linked, I didn’t want it to be a tie and no result. While this obviously wasn’t the desired result, at least we have something to work with.

Do you remember why you preferred Falcon over Creature at this point?

I don’t have anything specific unfortunately just a vibe I was getting. Falcon stood out to me more. I’d like to have a closer look at Creature today

Ok take a closer look at me then

[fingersplints]

Celebrating my 10000 posts anniversary by mentioning I'm happy to be a part of this community,
and to be floating around in the larger mafia community multiverse.

I still remember how welcoming everyone was when I played my first games here at Cindy Kate!

Hopefully, we can continue to have fun with this silly or deep game!

Maybe the real wolves were the friends we made along the way.

Congrats

A vote for you to celebrate

[VOTE: Dizzy] aubergine

[Creature]

So my mood has just been ruined over computer problems

[Creature]

Let's see who I have as town/not for today's lynch:

Alison
JimmyJaggedJay

[Creature]

I guess I don't really have a good reason to townread fingersplints.

[Creature]

RondoDimBuckle still prob town

[Creature]

What are your all thoughts on Boquise now?

[DrWilgy]

Been vastly busy today.

See Dizzy as prime target? I accept this.

Ender/Marmot/Seanzie are also acceptable.

What's goin on in the thread?

[Alison]

[VOTE: Dizzy] aubergine

[Creature]

What's goin on in the thread?

Feels like we're on fire

A fire like this

[Creature]

Interesting I started the wagon on Dyslexicon

I'll take it

[Creature]

lucy and Boquise being both unnoticeable makes me a bit worried about them.

[DrWilgy]

What's goin on in the thread?

Feels like we're on fire

A fire like this

I see.

Tell me why Dizzy over Seanzie?

[Seanzie]

Been vastly busy today.

See Dizzy as prime target? I accept this.

Ender/Marmot/Seanzie are also acceptable.

What's goin on in the thread?

Tell me about Dizzy and Marmot.

[Creature]

What's goin on in the thread?

Feels like we're on fire

A fire like this

I see.

Tell me why Dizzy over Seanzie?

Mac's list + I get the feeling Dyslexicon is playing a wolfgame here

[DrWilgy]

Been vastly busy today.

See Dizzy as prime target? I accept this.

Ender/Marmot/Seanzie are also acceptable.

What's goin on in the thread?

Tell me about Dizzy and Marmot.

Dizzy seemed to be in contention with Wiggin who I read as scum, while at the same time is in a place of very fluffy gameplay to the point where I don't remember most of their presence. The fluffy gameplay I can see as W alignment. Worst case scenario I get to understand their read on Wiggin as being genuine.

Marmot had potential to be scum, I'd say in the same possibility percentage as Dizzy. I find that if Marmot was town, I'd be confident about that read currently. I do not have that inclination.

[NateTheLesser]

Currently, I think the following are various shades of town:

Town

Alison - town
Creature - light town
DrWilgy - strong town
Dyslexicon - light town
RondoDimBuckle - light town
fingersplints - light town
JaggedJimmyJay - strong town

Null

Boquise
lucy
NateTheLesser
Seanzie

Scum

EnderWiggin



I've never actually played with Boq, Nate, or lucy, nor have I put much thought into my read of them this game, which is why they are here. Sean, I don't recall having reason to believe is town (actually I did list one, but I no longer feel that reasoning exists), and Ender was the player I think looks most suspicious thus far.

I don't feel comfortable with the state of this read list, so I will put some effort into adjusting this, both in further informing my poor reads and also further pursuing if I still feel that my light town reads are still townie. I do feel confident on Wilgy and Jay at least.

You put Ender scum but dont point to anything specific? I know what I would point to as pretty suspicious behaviour but what do you see?

I talked about it at the end of Day 1, but his progression to a vote on falcon was non-existant after stating an early townread.

His progression on me today is basically the same. He placed a vote on me without reason. He also stated around that time that he would spend some time investigating a couple other players (I think lucy and fs). I suggested he investigate me given he was voting for me, and his response was "if I have time"

My concern with Ender Day 1 was that he was looking for a way to join the falcon wagon even though he couldn't nor hadn't found a reason to do so, and now that he's doing it to me today, I'm more convinced.

I know you were suspicious of Ender late yesterday due to his progression into voting Falcon, does Falcon flipping town change how you see that at all?

[DrWilgy]

What's goin on in the thread?

Feels like we're on fire

A fire like this

I see.

Tell me why Dizzy over Seanzie?

Mac's list + I get the feeling Dyslexicon is playing a wolfgame here

Understood. Now how about Wiggin?

[Creature]