Halvøsen Ridge [MAFIA WIN]

[EnderWiggin]

I forgot to vote in the poll for a bit there. Geeze I'm tired.

[DrWilgy]

Someone argue for Splints being civ for me plz.

[EnderWiggin]

Someone argue for Splints being civ for me plz.

Fingersplints is an obvious civilian, honestly.

[JaggedJimmyJay]

Someone argue for Splints being civ for me plz.

Have a go at Marmot’s argument:

viewtopic.php?p=929178#p929178

[JaggedJimmyJay]

Why is Creature town

[JaggedJimmyJay]

Let's have an exercise
If you had an alignment check, who would be your first pick to check and why?

Wilgy

I think that sort would potentially break the game open

[JaggedJimmyJay]

Also Jay being on Creature gives me bad feels. I don't think Creature is a good vote.

Why

[NateTheLesser]

Nate is a scum lean, his read list is exactly what neutral territory is and what someone would put without their own thoughts, entirely public opinion. I don't think he put any effort into that read list himself

@NateTheLesser, I'd like to see you respond to this assertion in some capacity. I don't see it in your posts, but if it's there just point the way.

By the time I saw this it had become clear that she must have been thinking of a read list that wasn't actually mine (or if it was mine she couldn't find it). I hope she finds the post she was thinking of because I'd like to know who she's scum leaning.

It's almost assuredly Ender's list, which shows up in your ISO because of a post you quoted.

That's what I thought but I re-quoted it and she said it wasn't. Regardless I hope she figures out who she had in mind even if it's still me.

[DrWilgy]

Let's have an exercise
If you had an alignment check, who would be your first pick to check and why?

Wilgy

I think that sort would potentially break the game open

[VOTE: Wilgy] aubergine?

[DrWilgy]

Someone argue for Splints being civ for me plz.

Have a go at Marmot’s argument:

viewtopic.php?p=929178#p929178

a fair enough argument. Marmot is just two burritos 1 sneaker it seems.

[JaggedJimmyJay]

@RondoDimBuckle, I am trying to follow the thread of your play. I see that you did post come consolidated reads of a sort here, and that is appreciated. Two questions:

1) How did you decide on the tiers or groupings of possible mafia in that post?

2) As you play right now and respond to a ton of posts, is that impacting your present view of the game? Does it impact this reads post?

I dont remember putting out a read list? You might be confusing me with someone else?

Spoiler: show

My reads so far

Alison !rand
Boquise !rand
Creature !rand
DrWilgy !rand
Dyslexicon !rand
EnderWiggin wolf
falcon45ca !rand
fingersplints !rand
JaggedJimmyJay !rand
lucy !rand
MacDougall !rand
Marmot !rand
NateTheLesser !rand
RondoDimBuckle !rand
Seanzie !rand

[this is a meme brought to you by the tinfoil ender gang]

Unless you count this giant piece of shit

Please quote the read post you mean and I will respond

Please click here

I don’t want to quote the whole thing, too big.

[JaggedJimmyJay]

Someone argue for Splints being civ for me plz.

Have a go at Marmot’s argument:

viewtopic.php?p=929178#p929178

a fair enough argument. Marmot is just two burritos 1 sneaker it seems.

Yes, DrWilgy. Yes he is.

[Seanzie]

Also Jay being on Creature gives me bad feels. I don't think Creature is a good vote.

Why

His posts feel confortable, well... at least comfortable for the doomsayer that is Creature. I don't think he would come off this way with a stacked player list like this if he was wolf. He's also given reads contrary to some of the big names in the thread, which again, I don't see wolf!Creature doing; even if they aren't big pushes, their existence alone is telling.

Also, you know how you said someone specifically voting DrWilgy catches your eye because of miselim fodder? Well... something about talking cooking implements.

[Seanzie]

Thread died... :/

[robyn]

i’m here, kinda

[robyn]

thoughts on jjj? @Seanzie

[Seanzie]

thoughts on jjj? @Seanzie

You really should actually read my ISO.

I am wary of them. I have found some of their analysis questionable, and possibly having an agenda. Some of their takes seem overly generous, and early on I got the feeling that they were less worried about my alignment than they were about my reads. Them voting Creature is bad IMO as well, considering that Creature is sometimes an easy miselim, and I don't sense wolf!Creature here.

That being said, I think I am just naturally wary of anyone who has as much threadclout as Jay demands, and in the past it has taken me many days and wolf flips to really come to trust Jay, so I am not confident in pushing him too hard. Besides, it feels a bit moot as even if I wanted to push him, there isn't the threadsupport for that push, so I am more inclined to try to flip another wolf and see if their flip supports a scum!Jay world, in which then there might be threadsupport for it.

[NateTheLesser]

Let's have an exercise
If you had an alignment check, who would be your first pick to check and why?

Probably Seanzie? A lot of his pushes have been on people I town read, so I think that would tell me a lot about whether my worldview is largely correct or whether I need to do more reevaluating.

[robyn]

thoughts on jjj? @Seanzie

You really should actually read my ISO.

I am wary of them. I have found some of their analysis questionable, and possibly having an agenda. Some of their takes seem overly generous, and early on I got the feeling that they were less worried about my alignment than they were about my reads. Them voting Creature is bad IMO as well, considering that Creature is sometimes an easy miselim, and I don't sense wolf!Creature here.

That being said, I think I am just naturally wary of anyone who has as much threadclout as Jay demands, and in the past it has taken me many days and wolf flips to really come to trust Jay, so I am not confident in pushing him too hard. Besides, it feels a bit moot as even if I wanted to push him, there isn't the threadsupport for that push, so I am more inclined to try to flip another wolf and see if their flip supports a scum!Jay world, in which then there might be threadsupport for it.

i’ll need more time and to not watch kids to articulate what i’m trying to say, if ur not busy look at what marmot and jjj did together

but i found the “if i’m wrong about a top townread it’s lucy” message to be extremely strange

[NateTheLesser]

thoughts on jjj? @Seanzie

You really should actually read my ISO.

I am wary of them. I have found some of their analysis questionable, and possibly having an agenda. Some of their takes seem overly generous, and early on I got the feeling that they were less worried about my alignment than they were about my reads. Them voting Creature is bad IMO as well, considering that Creature is sometimes an easy miselim, and I don't sense wolf!Creature here.

That being said, I think I am just naturally wary of anyone who has as much threadclout as Jay demands, and in the past it has taken me many days and wolf flips to really come to trust Jay, so I am not confident in pushing him too hard. Besides, it feels a bit moot as even if I wanted to push him, there isn't the threadsupport for that push, so I am more inclined to try to flip another wolf and see if their flip supports a scum!Jay world, in which then there might be threadsupport for it.

I haven't actually played with Jay, but he hasn't been as strong of a "town leader with thread control" presence as I expected, though he's definitely still directing traffic. How does his clout here compare with other games you've played with him? Like, 1) is there a difference in activity level and 2) is that part of your wariness.

[Seanzie]

thoughts on jjj? @Seanzie

You really should actually read my ISO.

I am wary of them. I have found some of their analysis questionable, and possibly having an agenda. Some of their takes seem overly generous, and early on I got the feeling that they were less worried about my alignment than they were about my reads. Them voting Creature is bad IMO as well, considering that Creature is sometimes an easy miselim, and I don't sense wolf!Creature here.

That being said, I think I am just naturally wary of anyone who has as much threadclout as Jay demands, and in the past it has taken me many days and wolf flips to really come to trust Jay, so I am not confident in pushing him too hard. Besides, it feels a bit moot as even if I wanted to push him, there isn't the threadsupport for that push, so I am more inclined to try to flip another wolf and see if their flip supports a scum!Jay world, in which then there might be threadsupport for it.

i’ll need more time and to not watch kids to articulate what i’m trying to say, if ur not busy look at what marmot and jjj did together

but i found the “if i’m wrong about a top townread it’s lucy” message to be extremely strange

You'll have to point me to the "what" in "what Marmot abd JJJ did together" because I'm not sure what you're referring to.

[Boquise]

I think Ender's sporadic unwillingness to cooperate is rand>town tbh

no no no.

Ender's sporadic unwillingness to cooperate is rand>Ender tbh

smh sad

[Seanzie]

Let's have an exercise
If you had an alignment check, who would be your first pick to check and why?

Probably Seanzie? A lot of his pushes have been on people I town read, so I think that would tell me a lot about whether my worldview is largely correct or whether I need to do more reevaluating.

Aside from Jay, who I think most people have a contrary opinion to me, who are the people I'm pushing that you're townreading?

[Boquise]

@lucy why is it important in your opinion that Marmot and I today engage with each other?

Because interactions are positive, and you’ve been actively having minimal conversations/interactions with others, i reckon Marmot is a good place to dip your toes in

I see tbh!

[Boquise]

It just sounded like it was super important for the game itself that I and Marmot spoke with each other tbh

[Boquise]

Let's have an exercise
If you had an alignment check, who would be your first pick to check and why?

Wilgy

I think that sort would potentially break the game open

Huh hm
In your analysis of interactions, he is in the least amount of worlds though? Wouldn't it be better to pick someone who has equity with plenty of people?

[robyn]

It just sounded like it was super important for the game itself that I and Marmot spoke with each other tbh

if that were the case i’d get you two to talk without asking. but yeah it’s not necessary for anything at all really, just something i’m curious to see

[Boquise]

Let's have an exercise
If you had an alignment check, who would be your first pick to check and why?

Probably Seanzie? A lot of his pushes have been on people I town read, so I think that would tell me a lot about whether my worldview is largely correct or whether I need to do more reevaluating.

I see tbh.

Did you answer my other question directed towards you btw?

[robyn]

Alison
Boquise
Marmot
NateTheLesser
Seanzie

DrWilgy
lucy

Creature
Dyslexicon
EnderWiggin
fingersplints
RondoDimBuckle

This is about where I am right now. The names within tiers are not ordered other than alphabetically. The middle pair are two I think are high-priority sorts (as in it's important for folks to give current takes on them). Wilgy is a clash of fewer team fits with a post history that doesn't scream town to me. Lucy has fallen off considerably, and her interchanges with Marmot and Seanzie earlier were peculiar. Still not really a "mafia" read.

this

[Boquise]

Answering my own question:

Alison.

I think she is great at sounding townie. Her reads and pushes are atm textbook. I would want to see if that's a town or wolf, because if town that is a great asset and if wolf it would be hard to nab her

[robyn]

If I am wrong about a high town read, my first guess would be lucy.

this

[Boquise]

It just sounded like it was super important for the game itself that I and Marmot spoke with each other tbh

if that were the case i’d get you two to talk without asking. but yeah it’s not necessary for anything at all really, just something i’m curious to see

Mmmh I could swear you used stronger language there. Will have to check.

Btw, what do you think of my Finger take?

[Boquise]

If I am wrong about a high town read, my first guess would be lucy.

this

..what :wowee:

[robyn]

I'm having a hell of a time interpreting lucy's interactions. With many players she has a ton of engagement, often mutual engagement, but it doesn't often lead somewhere concrete or observable. It all just kind of exists. Those that suspect lucy, particularly the current voters @Seanzie and @Marmot, would be well advised to see what team fits they like and don't like. I think plenty can fit, but with very little degree of confidence given her unique posture in the game.

this doesn’t seem like real opposition to my vote, seanzie already said he didn’t trust/believe in the clearing possible teams thing as the main pusher. and marmot didn’t give any reasoning himself at all, still

[robyn]

It just sounded like it was super important for the game itself that I and Marmot spoke with each other tbh

if that were the case i’d get you two to talk without asking. but yeah it’s not necessary for anything at all really, just something i’m curious to see

Mmmh I could swear you used stronger language there. Will have to check.

Btw, what do you think of my Finger take?

give me a bit, i haven’t gotten around to properly reading that

[DrWilgy]

Lucy are you a wagon now?

[NateTheLesser]

Let's have an exercise
If you had an alignment check, who would be your first pick to check and why?

Probably Seanzie? A lot of his pushes have been on people I town read, so I think that would tell me a lot about whether my worldview is largely correct or whether I need to do more reevaluating.

Aside from Jay, who I think most people have a contrary opinion to me, who are the people I'm pushing that you're townreading?

Marmot and Lucy. Marmot especially is someone that I was feeling pretty good about since they got more engaged late D1, but you and Boq have been suspicious of them so it makes me wonder if I'm missing something.

[Boquise]

[VOTE: NateTheLesser] aubergine

Honestly don't feel like you care about the current gamestate, why's that?

I said this in more words in response to Alison, but people keep agreeing with my pushes, and it leaves me oddly directionless.

You're disquieted because you think there's a wolf in Alison/Lucy/Jay? Why those 3?

Because the sensation was "Wolves comfortable" which suggests a wolf in towncore and those 3 + Mac + Boq were that towncore. Mac is dead and I might be premature but I've loved Boq's content.

Hence those three.

Oooh why do you love it?

[Seanzie]

thoughts on jjj? @Seanzie

You really should actually read my ISO.

I am wary of them. I have found some of their analysis questionable, and possibly having an agenda. Some of their takes seem overly generous, and early on I got the feeling that they were less worried about my alignment than they were about my reads. Them voting Creature is bad IMO as well, considering that Creature is sometimes an easy miselim, and I don't sense wolf!Creature here.

That being said, I think I am just naturally wary of anyone who has as much threadclout as Jay demands, and in the past it has taken me many days and wolf flips to really come to trust Jay, so I am not confident in pushing him too hard. Besides, it feels a bit moot as even if I wanted to push him, there isn't the threadsupport for that push, so I am more inclined to try to flip another wolf and see if their flip supports a scum!Jay world, in which then there might be threadsupport for it.

I haven't actually played with Jay, but he hasn't been as strong of a "town leader with thread control" presence as I expected, though he's definitely still directing traffic. How does his clout here compare with other games you've played with him? Like, 1) is there a difference in activity level and 2) is that part of your wariness.

I actually haven't played with Jay as much as many others here, so you might be asking the wrong person. The one time I saw him when I was town, in terms of direct thread control he was probably similar to this. Jay is not overbearing as town leader, instead he wields a lot of indirect thread control due to the respect others (rightfully) have for him.

So no, I do not notice a major difference in activity (do you find him inactive?) and no this does not affect my read of him.

[robyn]

Lucy are you a wagon now?

no, i almost was

[DrWilgy]

Lucy are you a wagon now?

no, i almost was

Good. I'm sheeping you for the rest of the game as of now.

[Boquise]

Let's have an exercise
If you had an alignment check, who would be your first pick to check and why?

Probably Seanzie? A lot of his pushes have been on people I town read, so I think that would tell me a lot about whether my worldview is largely correct or whether I need to do more reevaluating.

Aside from Jay, who I think most people have a contrary opinion to me, who are the people I'm pushing that you're townreading?

Marmot and Lucy. Marmot especially is someone that I was feeling pretty good about since they got more engaged late D1, but you and Boq have been suspicious of them so it makes me wonder if I'm missing something.

Fwiw since I don't have much time to "play" interactively in this game, I am focusing on solving through thread politics and atmosphere, which I also use a lot now as a juror. Yesterday I felt like the thread pointed at Marmot. Today I am not as sure tbh

[Seanzie]

Let's have an exercise
If you had an alignment check, who would be your first pick to check and why?

Probably Seanzie? A lot of his pushes have been on people I town read, so I think that would tell me a lot about whether my worldview is largely correct or whether I need to do more reevaluating.

Aside from Jay, who I think most people have a contrary opinion to me, who are the people I'm pushing that you're townreading?

Marmot and Lucy. Marmot especially is someone that I was feeling pretty good about since they got more engaged late D1, but you and Boq have been suspicious of them so it makes me wonder if I'm missing something.

I am not pushing Lucy (okay, I did push her for a bit because I thought she slipped with something, but then once that was resolved, I dropped that push like it was a microphone and I just won a rap battle). Marmot though, yeah you should rethink there.

[Seanzie]

If I am wrong about a high town read, my first guess would be lucy.

this

Okay, well I'd prefer to hear your take on this before I say anything. I feel like you've been active, but not necessarily generating nuanced content, so here is a great opportunity. Talk to me about Jay and Marmot like I'm 5.

[Seanzie]

Let's have an exercise
If you had an alignment check, who would be your first pick to check and why?

Probably Seanzie? A lot of his pushes have been on people I town read, so I think that would tell me a lot about whether my worldview is largely correct or whether I need to do more reevaluating.

Aside from Jay, who I think most people have a contrary opinion to me, who are the people I'm pushing that you're townreading?

Marmot and Lucy. Marmot especially is someone that I was feeling pretty good about since they got more engaged late D1, but you and Boq have been suspicious of them so it makes me wonder if I'm missing something.

Fwiw since I don't have much time to "play" interactively in this game, I am focusing on solving through thread politics and atmosphere, which I also use a lot now as a juror. Yesterday I felt like the thread pointed at Marmot. Today I am not as sure tbh

Can you desscribe what has changed, re:Marmot?

[JaggedJimmyJay]

If I am wrong about a high town read, my first guess would be lucy.

this

Compared to some other town reads I have held much of the game, it is a greater struggle for me to describe to myself exactly what makes you town and why that is a convincing argument. We sometimes do exercises called "trustfalls" around here (think of or name the biggest reasons you can to call every player town), and earlier today I was kind of juggling around that kind of thing in my head -- including for you.

I think you look town again on this page.

[JaggedJimmyJay]

Let's have an exercise
If you had an alignment check, who would be your first pick to check and why?

Wilgy

I think that sort would potentially break the game open

Huh hm
In your analysis of interactions, he is in the least amount of worlds though? Wouldn't it be better to pick someone who has equity with plenty of people?

That's a low bar in this game, unfortunately (least amount of worlds). To know that DrWilgy is town would secure me more in my process and give me important insights about a number of folks that have interacted with his slot throughout the game, including those who've town read him. A mafia Wilgy might represent a narrow POE.

In any event, ain't no checks

[JaggedJimmyJay]

I don't endorse a lucy chop

[JaggedJimmyJay]

Seanzie gave me some perspective on Creature. I'd appreciate the same from others. What's Creature about, folks?

[JaggedJimmyJay]

Spoiler: show

thoughts on jjj? @Seanzie

thoughts on jjj? @Seanzie

You really should actually read my ISO.

I am wary of them. I have found some of their analysis questionable, and possibly having an agenda. Some of their takes seem overly generous, and early on I got the feeling that they were less worried about my alignment than they were about my reads. Them voting Creature is bad IMO as well, considering that Creature is sometimes an easy miselim, and I don't sense wolf!Creature here.

That being said, I think I am just naturally wary of anyone who has as much threadclout as Jay demands, and in the past it has taken me many days and wolf flips to really come to trust Jay, so I am not confident in pushing him too hard. Besides, it feels a bit moot as even if I wanted to push him, there isn't the threadsupport for that push, so I am more inclined to try to flip another wolf and see if their flip supports a scum!Jay world, in which then there might be threadsupport for it.

i’ll need more time and to not watch kids to articulate what i’m trying to say, if ur not busy look at what marmot and jjj did together

but i found the “if i’m wrong about a top townread it’s lucy” message to be extremely strange

I'm having a hell of a time interpreting lucy's interactions. With many players she has a ton of engagement, often mutual engagement, but it doesn't often lead somewhere concrete or observable. It all just kind of exists. Those that suspect lucy, particularly the current voters @Seanzie and @Marmot, would be well advised to see what team fits they like and don't like. I think plenty can fit, but with very little degree of confidence given her unique posture in the game.

this doesn’t seem like real opposition to my vote, seanzie already said he didn’t trust/believe in the clearing possible teams thing as the main pusher. and marmot didn’t give any reasoning himself at all, still

This progression looks authentic to me. lucy returned to the game to find [perhaps] the game's loudest mouth voicing new uncertainty about her, while at least one vote was on her (Marmot), and she went tinfoil. Moreover, she approached that tinfoil by addressing someone else available in the thread that has interacted with me a lot already in the game to discuss the matter of JJJ and get perspectives instead of just going straight to shade.