King of the Hill Mafia

[Alison]

Actually I kinda want to clear Porscha since two nightkills in a row hard townread her.

[Boquise]

[VOTE: Neon] aubergine

for now

i wonder if it is legit to town read Nanook (and at extent Rondo) with Mac's death. Given Mac was town reading both tbh

[arogame123]

Also, I was thinking about this more.

At first, when I was re-reading the thread EoD, I thought Lily's treatment of creature felt kinda wolfy esp seeing how Creature was town, since Lily was kind of just continuing to scum read and treating Creature like a "confirmed mafia," which gave me flashbacks to how Santy treated Jmwjmw in Champs Semi 1, when Santy was mafia.

But I was thinking of in addition to the sponge read from SPF on Lily, but also in the world with ALison being town or mafia.

Lily's movement of votes EoD 1 is less likely to come from a mafia esp if the wagons are v/v for the reasons I was explaining yesterday, and the more I thought about it, I am not sure if Lily is with Alison if she is mafia.

The reasoning is bc when Alison made the "slave" comment towards Lily, I felt like Lily was geniuilly pissed off and taken away by that and was pretty angry at Alison for even suggesting a thing. Like her comment of "I do what I want" felt somewhat townie but also livid towards Alison for her treatment. Now I wouldn't put it past Alison to speak like that to a partner if she is mafia, but I think Lily's reaction to it is a bit more telling and likely not w/w with Alison either.

Lmk if anyone has thoughts on this.

[arogame123]

[VOTE: Neon] aubergine

for now

i wonder if it is legit to town read Nanook (and at extent Rondo) with Mac's death. Given Mac was town reading both tbh

I am a bit confused with Rondo to say the least lol.

Like I don't understand them shading me and calling my reads "middle of consensus" when they had the exact same reads with the same tiers as well.

[☆Princess Abigail☆]

Alison can be the chop but we are not going to spend 48 hours just doing the same old pushes again. It is bad for the game state, it is lazy, it is anti-town. Yesterday sucked because we only had two options through the whole day

I'm fine with this as long as Alison goes over in the end. Saving Alison again is game losing at this point.

Explain to me why Alison is scum.

I dunno if Alison is scum. I know that Alison needs to be resolved.

Not a good answer.

Cool. It's the right answer though so oh well.

Give your full thoughts on Alison then, whatever they may be. Gth what do you think? What will resolving them do for us one way or the other?

That's my full thoughts. Irregardless of my feelings the slot must be resolved. Alison will be wagoned every single day until they are resolved no matter what at this point. It is a waste of time and energy as town to keep her alive. If she's town we eliminate a potential mislim woofers are keeping around for later. If she's scum good.

Either way we have further data about the wagon structure of each day and Alison is right in how we can read behaviors based on all wagons on d1 and 2 being T v T or not

We lose if we keep having this discussion every single day. Alison needs to be resolved today. Period.

[arogame123]

Also, if Alison is mafia, Porscha is likely v as well.

[Boquise]

i think me still being alive despite being town read by most players, except Seanzie, Neon and Porscha for ??? reasons, indicates that scum are not afraid of my reads and did not care about my threats to re-eval after last day

It also does give Alison scum points considering I am one of the few who is not sold on her being scum, thus she going over today and flipping wolf would mean that I am in permanent poe afterwards tbh

[arogame123]

I'm fine with this as long as Alison goes over in the end. Saving Alison again is game losing at this point.

Explain to me why Alison is scum.

I dunno if Alison is scum. I know that Alison needs to be resolved.

Not a good answer.

Cool. It's the right answer though so oh well.

Give your full thoughts on Alison then, whatever they may be. Gth what do you think? What will resolving them do for us one way or the other?

That's my full thoughts. Irregardless of my feelings the slot must be resolved. Alison will be wagoned every single day until they are resolved no matter what at this point. It is a waste of time and energy as town to keep her alive. If she's town we eliminate a potential mislim woofers are keeping around for later. If she's scum good.

Either way we have further data about the wagon structure of each day and Alison is right in how we can read behaviors based on all wagons on d1 and 2 being T v T or not

We lose if we keep having this discussion every single day. Alison needs to be resolved today. Period.

Just curious, why didn't you want Alison resolved yesterday? And why were you more on me than Creature (who you were sr)?

[robyn]

Boq, link me 2 town games and 2 mafia games

[arogame123]

i think me still being alive despite being town read by most players, except Seanzie, Neon and Porscha for ??? reasons, indicates that scum are not afraid of my reads and did not care about my threats to re-eval after last day

It also does give Alison scum points considering I am one of the few who is not sold on her being scum, thus she going over today and flipping wolf would mean that I am in permanent poe afterwards tbh

I will say Boq, when re-reading EoD2, it seemed like people started to sr you for your flip from Creature to Alison, so I feel like if you are town, mafia felt like they might be able to put some pressure on your slot as well.

[☆Princess Abigail☆]

Explain to me why Alison is scum.

I dunno if Alison is scum. I know that Alison needs to be resolved.

Not a good answer.

Cool. It's the right answer though so oh well.

Give your full thoughts on Alison then, whatever they may be. Gth what do you think? What will resolving them do for us one way or the other?

That's my full thoughts. Irregardless of my feelings the slot must be resolved. Alison will be wagoned every single day until they are resolved no matter what at this point. It is a waste of time and energy as town to keep her alive. If she's town we eliminate a potential mislim woofers are keeping around for later. If she's scum good.

Either way we have further data about the wagon structure of each day and Alison is right in how we can read behaviors based on all wagons on d1 and 2 being T v T or not

We lose if we keep having this discussion every single day. Alison needs to be resolved today. Period.

Just curious, why didn't you want Alison resolved yesterday? And why were you more on me than Creature (who you were sr)?

1. I did until I thought creature was outed and Alison made me doubt my thought process

2. I was on you because I think your scummy. Still do.

3. I would have ended on Creature if I was not driving to work at EoD.

[arogame123]

Pretty sure there are at least three wolves in Alison/Boq.

lol, I see you and Math have a complicated relationship

[Seanzie]

[VOTE: Neon] aubergine

for now

i wonder if it is legit to town read Nanook (and at extent Rondo) with Mac's death. Given Mac was town reading both tbh

"we can kill Alison, but let's discuss"

*naked votes Neon*

[robyn]

rondo/seanzie/porscha town

[Boquise]

I'm fine with this as long as Alison goes over in the end. Saving Alison again is game losing at this point.

Explain to me why Alison is scum.

I dunno if Alison is scum. I know that Alison needs to be resolved.

Not a good answer.

Cool. It's the right answer though so oh well.

Give your full thoughts on Alison then, whatever they may be. Gth what do you think? What will resolving them do for us one way or the other?

That's my full thoughts. Irregardless of my feelings the slot must be resolved. Alison will be wagoned every single day until they are resolved no matter what at this point. It is a waste of time and energy as town to keep her alive. If she's town we eliminate a potential mislim woofers are keeping around for later. If she's scum good.

Either way we have further data about the wagon structure of each day and Alison is right in how we can read behaviors based on all wagons on d1 and 2 being T v T or not

We lose if we keep having this discussion every single day. Alison needs to be resolved today. Period.

i think it is a skill issue not being able to even try to solve Alison by reading her posts and looking at her pushes tbh
Just how "Alison OR Creature needs to be solved today, btw Creature is an outed wolf!" was the agenda yesterday

if we had hammers, i could agree with just hammering Alison and move on, but now we have to play out the full 48 hours, and if we all have this debate, then this is a free day for the wolves. Like, hammering would be pro town here and keeping the day going on is more pro wolf - i am talking myself into just voting Alison and afk from the thread rn wtf

[☆Princess Abigail☆]

[VOTE: Neon] aubergine

for now

i wonder if it is legit to town read Nanook (and at extent Rondo) with Mac's death. Given Mac was town reading both tbh

"we can kill Alison, but let's discuss"

*naked votes Neon*

Well they got to set up my mischop for tomorrow. I'm the easy next mischop.

[arogame123]

I dunno if Alison is scum. I know that Alison needs to be resolved.

Not a good answer.

Cool. It's the right answer though so oh well.

Give your full thoughts on Alison then, whatever they may be. Gth what do you think? What will resolving them do for us one way or the other?

That's my full thoughts. Irregardless of my feelings the slot must be resolved. Alison will be wagoned every single day until they are resolved no matter what at this point. It is a waste of time and energy as town to keep her alive. If she's town we eliminate a potential mislim woofers are keeping around for later. If she's scum good.

Either way we have further data about the wagon structure of each day and Alison is right in how we can read behaviors based on all wagons on d1 and 2 being T v T or not

We lose if we keep having this discussion every single day. Alison needs to be resolved today. Period.

Just curious, why didn't you want Alison resolved yesterday? And why were you more on me than Creature (who you were sr)?

1. I did until I thought creature was outed and Alison made me doubt my thought process

2. I was on you because I think your scummy. Still do.

3. I would have ended on Creature if I was not driving to work at EoD.

Why do you think I am scummy? You have never really elaborated and have just said "I don't like Aro" which seems very similar to your mafia play from what I saw in ur mafia gc that I was checking last night.

[staypositivefriend]

Anyway I have some thoughts but it's obvious that my view of the game is hideously incorrect in some ways and I'm going to dedicate today to figuring out where I'm going wrong instead of trying to "lead" the game like I did in the first few dauphases

I'd like to hear the thoughts even if you think they are wrong.

Well I'm gonna start with the obvious: I'm definitely incorrectly townreading at least one player here, because my current POE (neon/nanook/seanzie/rondo) is almost exclusively players that I would describe as "low presence" or "low impact". the way this game has played out makes it improbable if not outright impossible that the game has been led by widely POEd players with almost zero impact on the game - things have been too contentious for that

and this is a read that applies regardless of whether Alison is town or mafia. on the subject of Alison though, I have to be totally honest in saying that I am struggling to see a logical world where Alison is mafia. The gamestate over the last couple of days makes almost zero sense to me in a world where Alison is a wolf with practically any combination of teams here, and I still struggle to find Alison's play individually wolfy even though I'm doubting my townread on her

So I'm kind of in that awkward position of feeling very strongly in my intuition that Alison is probably a villager but being reluctant to push for my worldview after the flips have proven that my view of the game is guaranteed to be upside down in some ways

As for what this means for my POE? Tbh I'm still working it out but I think my current POE is likely to contain one wolf maximum, if even that

[Seanzie]

Pretty sure there are at least three wolves in Alison/Boq.

lol, I see you and Math have a complicated relationship

We have an extremely complicated relationship. Math is my life.

[robyn]

one in boq and aro
one in Spf/Alison

[☆Princess Abigail☆]

Explain to me why Alison is scum.

I dunno if Alison is scum. I know that Alison needs to be resolved.

Not a good answer.

Cool. It's the right answer though so oh well.

Give your full thoughts on Alison then, whatever they may be. Gth what do you think? What will resolving them do for us one way or the other?

That's my full thoughts. Irregardless of my feelings the slot must be resolved. Alison will be wagoned every single day until they are resolved no matter what at this point. It is a waste of time and energy as town to keep her alive. If she's town we eliminate a potential mislim woofers are keeping around for later. If she's scum good.

Either way we have further data about the wagon structure of each day and Alison is right in how we can read behaviors based on all wagons on d1 and 2 being T v T or not

We lose if we keep having this discussion every single day. Alison needs to be resolved today. Period.

i think it is a skill issue not being able to even try to solve Alison by reading her posts and looking at her pushes tbh
Just how "Alison OR Creature needs to be solved today, btw Creature is an outed wolf!" was the agenda yesterday

if we had hammers, i could agree with just hammering Alison and move on, but now we have to play out the full 48 hours, and if we all have this debate, then this is a free day for the wolves. Like, hammering would be pro town here and keeping the day going on is more pro wolf - i am talking myself into just voting Alison and afk from the thread rn wtf

Oh good I can't wait to be told I have all issues all game again. That's my favorite way to play.

[staypositivefriend]

I feel like I'm in a similar position that SK was in in the spec chat invitational, and in that game SK loudly defended the wolf for multiple dayphases and was wrong and I'm pretty scared that I'm in the exact same position right now

[Lilypetal]

@Boquise What's your current opinion of spf and aro?

[Boquise]

[VOTE: Neon] aubergine

for now

i wonder if it is legit to town read Nanook (and at extent Rondo) with Mac's death. Given Mac was town reading both tbh

"we can kill Alison, but let's discuss"

*naked votes Neon*

"My name is Seanzie and I do selective reading tbh"

[arogame123]

one in boq and aro
one in Spf/Alison

ooh, explain these dichotomies please?

I believe that Boq is likely town, unless it's exactly Alison/Neon/Boq, but I don't think Neon and Boq are compatible.

[arogame123]

I feel like I'm in a similar position that SK was in in the spec chat invitational, and in that game SK loudly defended the wolf for multiple dayphases and was wrong and I'm pretty scared that I'm in the exact same position right now

So is this saying you believe Alison is mafia now?

[Boquise]

i have stated my reason to scum read Neon yesterday
I stated today that I was about to sleep

My reason to scum read Neon from yesterday are still relevant today tbh

[Seanzie]

[VOTE: Neon] aubergine

for now

i wonder if it is legit to town read Nanook (and at extent Rondo) with Mac's death. Given Mac was town reading both tbh

"we can kill Alison, but let's discuss"

*naked votes Neon*

"My name is Seanzie and I do selective reading tbh"

"My name is Boq and I'm a wolf"

[☆Princess Abigail☆]

Not a good answer.

Cool. It's the right answer though so oh well.

Give your full thoughts on Alison then, whatever they may be. Gth what do you think? What will resolving them do for us one way or the other?

That's my full thoughts. Irregardless of my feelings the slot must be resolved. Alison will be wagoned every single day until they are resolved no matter what at this point. It is a waste of time and energy as town to keep her alive. If she's town we eliminate a potential mislim woofers are keeping around for later. If she's scum good.

Either way we have further data about the wagon structure of each day and Alison is right in how we can read behaviors based on all wagons on d1 and 2 being T v T or not

We lose if we keep having this discussion every single day. Alison needs to be resolved today. Period.

Just curious, why didn't you want Alison resolved yesterday? And why were you more on me than Creature (who you were sr)?

1. I did until I thought creature was outed and Alison made me doubt my thought process

2. I was on you because I think your scummy. Still do.

3. I would have ended on Creature if I was not driving to work at EoD.

Why do you think I am scummy? You have never really elaborated and have just said "I don't like Aro" which seems very similar to your mafia play from what I saw in ur mafia gc that I was checking last night.

Probably should feel NAI in my experience since I've only recently started bothering to make cases on people.

Call it vibes.

[Boquise]

it feels like at D1, you seanzie, and some others, decided who their scum reads are by throwing darts and just going with it tbh

[Boquise]

[VOTE: Neon] aubergine

for now

i wonder if it is legit to town read Nanook (and at extent Rondo) with Mac's death. Given Mac was town reading both tbh

"we can kill Alison, but let's discuss"

*naked votes Neon*

"My name is Seanzie and I do selective reading tbh"

"My name is Boq and I'm a wolf"

i love me the death tunnellers when i am town tbh

[Seanzie]

it feels like at D1, you seanzie, and some others, decided who their scum reads are by throwing darts and just going with it tbh

Nah, I'm just good. Sorry you got caught so early.

[Seanzie]

Like, it is kind of funny how scarilya ccurate my D1 Boq/Alison read probably was.

I should have never let myself get diatracted D2.

[Boquise]

it feels like at D1, you seanzie, and some others, decided who their scum reads are by throwing darts and just going with it tbh

this is probably why i am hesitant to go for Alison. Because the scum reads on her were formed through ??? manners on D1 too.
It is too bad that eod is at 2 am my time, because I would have voten her over Falcon and we'd be done with this debate at least

[staypositivefriend]

Also @staypositivefriend , how were you town reading Alison for her read/progression on you?

Like I even pointed out that the way Alison was reading you as mafia was very weird esp in the world where you are town. Since Alison was sr you, despite how you were agreeing with her pov of creature being mafia and were defending her. It is very odd to me that you kind of dismissed that from Alison as her read on you did not feel organic in any way tbh.

Also, not only were some of Alison's reasonings for reads not good, she has also pushed on Jack (died town), pushed creature (died town), and from your perspective SPF, Alison has been pushing you as well.

So from your POV SPF, Alison has pushed on 3 town, so even if you want to give her the benefit of the doubt with "pelts," that argument also fails. So I am wondering why you were defending Alison yesterday and if you still believe she is town today despite this?

I'll give a lengthier response to this when I'm not on my phone but I thought Alison's push on me was/is towny because if she's a wolf then she:

A. Would almost certainly want me to be on her good side and continue defending and protecting her

B. Would almost certainly want to try to spew me as her partner and make me look bad after she flips

But the way she approached her read accomplished neither of those things and feels unstrategic in a way that made me feel like she was rand likely to be town just reading me badly

[arogame123]

@Boquise What's your current opinion of spf and aro?

I was going to ask you what you think of spf?

I see it seems we agreed SoD.

[staypositivefriend]

I feel like I'm in a similar position that SK was in in the spec chat invitational, and in that game SK loudly defended the wolf for multiple dayphases and was wrong and I'm pretty scared that I'm in the exact same position right now

So is this saying you believe Alison is mafia now?

No it means in my heart I honestly still think Alison is more likely to be town than not but I think I might just be bad at the game

[Boquise]

it feels like at D1, you seanzie, and some others, decided who their scum reads are by throwing darts and just going with it tbh

Nah, I'm just good. Sorry you got caught so early.

I am looking forward to post game and I hope your explanation won't be "but you were so scummy" tbh

[Lilypetal]

@Boquise What's your current opinion of spf and aro?

I was going to ask you what you think of spf?

I see it seems we agreed SoD.

I think you know exactly what I think lmao

[☆Princess Abigail☆]

I miss Mac

[Boquise]

I dunno if Alison is scum. I know that Alison needs to be resolved.

Not a good answer.

Cool. It's the right answer though so oh well.

Give your full thoughts on Alison then, whatever they may be. Gth what do you think? What will resolving them do for us one way or the other?

That's my full thoughts. Irregardless of my feelings the slot must be resolved. Alison will be wagoned every single day until they are resolved no matter what at this point. It is a waste of time and energy as town to keep her alive. If she's town we eliminate a potential mislim woofers are keeping around for later. If she's scum good.

Either way we have further data about the wagon structure of each day and Alison is right in how we can read behaviors based on all wagons on d1 and 2 being T v T or not

We lose if we keep having this discussion every single day. Alison needs to be resolved today. Period.

i think it is a skill issue not being able to even try to solve Alison by reading her posts and looking at her pushes tbh
Just how "Alison OR Creature needs to be solved today, btw Creature is an outed wolf!" was the agenda yesterday

if we had hammers, i could agree with just hammering Alison and move on, but now we have to play out the full 48 hours, and if we all have this debate, then this is a free day for the wolves. Like, hammering would be pro town here and keeping the day going on is more pro wolf - i am talking myself into just voting Alison and afk from the thread rn wtf

Oh good I can't wait to be told I have all issues all game again. That's my favorite way to play.

"Skill issue" is a meme, but I forgot it is only known on MU tbh
Either way, this is wolfy defensiveness tbh

[Lilypetal]

I miss Mac

Then why did you kill him?

[Boquise]

@Boquise What's your current opinion of spf and aro?

I think both can be wolves. Mac tinfoiled both, Aro harder than Spf.
I need to re-evaluate a little bit.

The only ones I feel sure are town are Seanzie and Porscha tbh

[Seanzie]

it feels like at D1, you seanzie, and some others, decided who their scum reads are by throwing darts and just going with it tbh

Nah, I'm just good. Sorry you got caught so early.

I am looking forward to post game and I hope your explanation won't be "but you were so scummy" tbh

I'm just looking forward to your flip. You can leave me lots of messages in dvc chat though, I'll likely get them the morning after you go over.

[staypositivefriend]

If boq is maf he's doing a good job at being the only person in the game replicating my exact thought process about Alison

[Lilypetal]

oh right cuz he was in his town meta and one of ur teammate is a player who should be NKed but couldn't be

[arogame123]

Also @staypositivefriend , how were you town reading Alison for her read/progression on you?

Like I even pointed out that the way Alison was reading you as mafia was very weird esp in the world where you are town. Since Alison was sr you, despite how you were agreeing with her pov of creature being mafia and were defending her. It is very odd to me that you kind of dismissed that from Alison as her read on you did not feel organic in any way tbh.

Also, not only were some of Alison's reasonings for reads not good, she has also pushed on Jack (died town), pushed creature (died town), and from your perspective SPF, Alison has been pushing you as well.

So from your POV SPF, Alison has pushed on 3 town, so even if you want to give her the benefit of the doubt with "pelts," that argument also fails. So I am wondering why you were defending Alison yesterday and if you still believe she is town today despite this?

I'll give a lengthier response to this when I'm not on my phone but I thought Alison's push on me was/is towny because if she's a wolf then she:

A. Would almost certainly want me to be on her good side and continue defending and protecting her

B. Would almost certainly want to try to spew me as her partner and make me look bad after she flips

But the way she approached her read accomplished neither of those things and feels unstrategic in a way that made me feel like she was rand likely to be town just reading me badly

Wait, "likely rand for just reading your badly"?

I thought you were judging Alison based off pelts, so why would a "wrong read" on you from your pov become dismissed as a bad one and then converted into "likely town reading badly"

And the thing is SPF, I feel like you didn't really evaluate Alison's progression/read on you from an objective standpoint and you more so did from a "stragetic" which gets you caught up in other stuff. Like, we know mafia tend to do a lot of "refuge to audacity" and I feel like evaluting Alison just solely based on that isn't correct.

[☆Princess Abigail☆]

Not a good answer.

Cool. It's the right answer though so oh well.

Give your full thoughts on Alison then, whatever they may be. Gth what do you think? What will resolving them do for us one way or the other?

That's my full thoughts. Irregardless of my feelings the slot must be resolved. Alison will be wagoned every single day until they are resolved no matter what at this point. It is a waste of time and energy as town to keep her alive. If she's town we eliminate a potential mislim woofers are keeping around for later. If she's scum good.

Either way we have further data about the wagon structure of each day and Alison is right in how we can read behaviors based on all wagons on d1 and 2 being T v T or not

We lose if we keep having this discussion every single day. Alison needs to be resolved today. Period.

i think it is a skill issue not being able to even try to solve Alison by reading her posts and looking at her pushes tbh
Just how "Alison OR Creature needs to be solved today, btw Creature is an outed wolf!" was the agenda yesterday

if we had hammers, i could agree with just hammering Alison and move on, but now we have to play out the full 48 hours, and if we all have this debate, then this is a free day for the wolves. Like, hammering would be pro town here and keeping the day going on is more pro wolf - i am talking myself into just voting Alison and afk from the thread rn wtf

Oh good I can't wait to be told I have all issues all game again. That's my favorite way to play.

"Skill issue" is a meme, but I forgot it is only known on MU tbh
Either way, this is wolfy defensiveness tbh

No this is I just played a game on this site being told I have skill issue all game.

[Lilypetal]

@Boquise What's your current opinion of spf and aro?

I think both can be wolves. Mac tinfoiled both, Aro harder than Spf.
I need to re-evaluate a little bit.

The only ones I feel sure are town are Seanzie and Porscha tbh

I find it interesting that mac died after pushing for 2 MLs. I don't see any other way to spin it then there being a wolf or wolves in spf/aro lol. mac is the spf tinfoiler after all

[Lilypetal]

i do think if aro is a wolf he is the designated deepwolf though, and I'm leaning more on him being town