Anniversary Game 2 - Moozik [MAFIA WIN]

[nutella]

wanted to GIVE MY VOTE A LITTLE BIT TO SEE WHAT HAPPENED AND IF PEOPLE WOULD TRAIL ON
being proactive is a curse this is why i never try

anyways whatever i said about creature is out the window because everyone's like "oh but what if creature" but where's the drive to manifest it. he's not like doing anything.

damn this posts actually howls hard as fuck, you should've posted this before tr'd you smh.

very strongly disagree. The drive to actually commit to a creature wagon when the thread has been handwaving around him is very protown

She voted dz on that same page or the one before it, dz asked for reasons she said to ask later in an hour to then proceed to unvote and vote creature with a reason thats wack imo. Doesnt help that i also dont like the fact that Creature is a wagon to begin with and based on the one game i played with him (big sample size) i dont feel like he would care much or feel pressured with being wagoned specially considering that in this game his playstyle has been not caring much imo.

jumping from dz then deciding fuck it creature is the better vote based on threadstate looks organically towny to me, shrug

[Valentine]

wanted to GIVE MY VOTE A LITTLE BIT TO SEE WHAT HAPPENED AND IF PEOPLE WOULD TRAIL ON
being proactive is a curse this is why i never try

anyways whatever i said about creature is out the window because everyone's like "oh but what if creature" but where's the drive to manifest it. he's not like doing anything.

damn this posts actually howls hard as fuck, you should've posted this before tr'd you smh.

very strongly disagree. The drive to actually commit to a creature wagon when the thread has been handwaving around him is very protown

She voted dz on that same page or the one before it, dz asked for reasons she said to ask later in an hour to then proceed to unvote and vote creature with a reason thats wack imo. Doesnt help that i also dont like the fact that Creature is a wagon to begin with and based on the one game i played with him (big sample size) i dont feel like he would care much or feel pressured with being wagoned specially considering that in this game his playstyle has been not caring much imo.

Okay then do something with ur vote rather than complain that u don't like the wagon my god
You have the power to change how things are going
counterwagon me or something

[Manny]

am i bussing now or am i pushing town and if you think the former: just help me bus for now and deal with me tomorrow or whatever, arguably something something bussing partner to save self blunder blah blah. If u think i am a wolf pushing town why do u think everyone's been so reticent about the slot all game

People can be reticent due to the fact that they tr him lol doesnt necessarily mean scum and that same argument would apply to you that have been sr'd a lot so far with 0 actual push or votes.

[Manny]

Okay then do something with ur vote rather than complain that u don't like the wagon my god
You have the power to change how things are going
counterwagon me or something

Why the absolute fuck should i vote you before the creature vote you were on my towniecore. Now im having doubts but not enough to actually jump off my current wagon, i only have one vote not 20.

[Valentine]

am i bussing now or am i pushing town and if you think the former: just help me bus for now and deal with me tomorrow or whatever, arguably something something bussing partner to save self blunder blah blah. If u think i am a wolf pushing town why do u think everyone's been so reticent about the slot all game

People can be reticent due to the fact that they tr him lol doesnt necessarily mean scum and that same argument would apply to you that have been sr'd a lot so far with 0 actual push or votes.

I want people to vote me!!!!!! if they think that i am a wolf rather than just say it and then sit there with the read that they don't actually manifest until like, endgame where i get pushed out because "why did we never deal with this slot lol"

like there's no drive to actually make wagons and it's so frustrating
even if it's me at least it's something i can't like do anything with whispers of reads lol

[nutella]

am i bussing now or am i pushing town and if you think the former: just help me bus for now and deal with me tomorrow or whatever, arguably something something bussing partner to save self blunder blah blah. If u think i am a wolf pushing town why do u think everyone's been so reticent about the slot all game

People can be reticent due to the fact that they tr him lol doesnt necessarily mean scum and that same argument would apply to you that have been sr'd a lot so far with 0 actual push or votes.

no, it's completely different as creature was top wagon for a large portion of the phase until people myself included got tired of sitting there and moved but still feel like hes a hit

i like that val was proactive about saying outright he should go back to being wagoned

[Manny]

wanted to GIVE MY VOTE A LITTLE BIT TO SEE WHAT HAPPENED AND IF PEOPLE WOULD TRAIL ON
being proactive is a curse this is why i never try

anyways whatever i said about creature is out the window because everyone's like "oh but what if creature" but where's the drive to manifest it. he's not like doing anything.

damn this posts actually howls hard as fuck, you should've posted this before tr'd you smh.

very strongly disagree. The drive to actually commit to a creature wagon when the thread has been handwaving around him is very protown

She voted dz on that same page or the one before it, dz asked for reasons she said to ask later in an hour to then proceed to unvote and vote creature with a reason thats wack imo. Doesnt help that i also dont like the fact that Creature is a wagon to begin with and based on the one game i played with him (big sample size) i dont feel like he would care much or feel pressured with being wagoned specially considering that in this game his playstyle has been not caring much imo.

jumping from dz then deciding fuck it creature is the better vote based on threadstate looks organically towny to me, shrug

Not without giving any actual proper reasoning for it. Then again this is arguing around circles so ill stop this thought train.

[Valentine]

Okay then do something with ur vote rather than complain that u don't like the wagon my god
You have the power to change how things are going
counterwagon me or something

Why the absolute fuck should i vote you before the creature vote you were on my towniecore. Now im having doubts but not enough to actually jump off my current wagon, i only have one vote not 20.

i'm sorry but i'm just like
very annoyed by this game rn lol
i want stuff to actually happen right now and it feels like everyone's going like "hheyyyyy there whoa whoa hold your horses"
i just want people to do stuff

[Sabiplz]

I really wanted to listen to the blue album from joni Mitchell but I forgot Spotify doesn't have her albums and I don't have the vinyl for it.

[nutella]

like I somewhat got cold feet on creature because of the complacency and sort of because of his claim (but what Wind said about him claiming as scum made me feel worse about that again). I moved votes to keep things exciting but I will probably move back because I still think he is a wolf

[Manny]

My brain wants to SR everything surrounding this creature wagon which will end up with a loop of being wrong if im wrong about Creature pain.

[Valentine]

i had to take cold medicine so i'm not going to have this energy in like ~30-45 minutes but i just
want stuff to happen more than words at this point i guess sorry if i am being grating

[Valentine]

If you don't want to talk about creature right now and deal with that what do you think about nutella defending me

I am wary because (especially in newer places) i am prone to being wolfread because my style is, frankly, completely insane and annoying to people and i'm aware of that and my logic doesn't always track for other people but i like having someone in my corner who's calling me town and defending me so my brain goes "no let's not read into that tooo much now"

[LordQuas]

not sure if i'll get the chance to catch up like I planned but I'm here for a bit

[Manny]

The fact that there is not a single unified wagon should actually be a good sign of the day, since if there was only one big one i would be a lot more inclined to believe its a misslynch.

[Manny]

If you don't want to talk about creature right now and deal with that what do you think about nutella defending me

It makes me want to SR Nut based on the reasons they are defending you for. I *think* you are still town-leaning but i heavily disagree with the creature wagon and the need to force a wagon to appear just for the sake of it.

[Manny]

My vote is in the best place it can be in aka the next most voted wagon that is not in my towniecore.

[LordQuas]

hm Creature might be in his rare low posting village meta but i can't actually with any confidence say he's not wolfing which is not a great sign for his alignment

[DeeZees]

OK so ISO'd cape and I like all of his first 50 posts. They do seem solvey, and I mind meld with his takes. he also does his research.

The worst thing about it is how he thinks you can't find someone off opening pages which is kinda bad.



But yh, his read list just seems strange because:

Did you know...

All the players minus the ones who haven't shown up yet, have at least 10 posts

Let's get'r Ranked:

TOWN:

risinnq - Lowest poster. I think this slot is definitely one of the towniest slots though. It seems like risinnq really put's a lot of thought (or at least a good amount) into her reads, examples include: #295, #314, #317, and #358. Surprisingly it's not only this but it also has to do with the way risinnq responded to me pushing Guillotina, like with this, it makes sense why risinnq would go me. Or the two posts risinnq made on Sabi.

Strawhenge - Still feels really independent with how he treats his reads and the words he says, they seem like genuine off the cuff thoughts. One thing I haven't already mentioned is bottom of #476, I don't think w!Strawhenge just makes that particular read on IAWY like that.

Chelsea - Knowing Chelsea, I do not think that she would have quite towntold to the degree that she has so far that she has already this game. Maybe the whole blah blah blah awkward discussion was just sheeping what I had said for no good reason. I like Chelsea's suspicion on nutella tbh. I feel like mafia wouldn't townread for #527. Not to mention that #552 is the complete opposite of not drawing attention to themselves.

LIGHT TOWN:

hollowkatt - I feel like #405 is where HK really starts towntelling for him, like I like the follow up question with asking IAWY about DZ. Also HK's explanation on Guillo. There is something that feels fairly towny about some other random shorter posts they say, but I can't put my finger on it. #521 is just a post that comes from town most of the time I would assume.

Le petit poussin - Okay I can admit feels awkward sometimes. Fairly formal with their introduction to the game and saying hello to everyone. Had read on Schiavetto about blatant inconsistency. Strange comment about DZ not being drunk and him being fake chaotic in the thread. #253 this catches me off guard not because of the message itself, but the context of the message if that makes sense. Randomly found the prods at #285 and #287 to be slightly towny prods at me.

Inawordyes - Someone who I consider to be towny sometimes. Like on #335 with Valentine and him asking about Valentine's read on IAWY. Perhaps overexplainy on something I wouldn't exactly consider AI. Like now with IAWY versus falcon, things took an unexpected personal turn I guess, one that I would never really find alignment indicative. #411 This read on DZ is pretty underwhelming.

Valentine - I think #361 is like a little bit towny especially with it tackling both sides, I wouldn't be so sure if it was just the first part. I kind of soulread #392 as towny awkwardness, but obviously it's probably NAI, but the fact they followed up on it though. Kind of extroverted posting I suppose? I do not frankly remember their town meta. Post questioning my post felt towny to me from Valentine.

LordQuas - Well, he felt solvy after my push on him and he felt like he was engaging in good faith with my arguments. I unvoted him for point on Schiavetto.

Creature - Probably leaning more town for me then not due to solving and not feeling awkward. If there is a gripe I have, I have absolutely no idea why they are on Valentine, they just voted them.

falcon45ca - I think is towny off of some of the solving they did around Valentine. As well as a posting style that has seemed pretty I guess off the cuff.

Sabiplz - I feel like is playing like normal Sabi, though I am usually not good at reading her too well. I think she is usually more AtE though but I could be confusing players in my head. Feels defensive of some slots that have received pressure at one point or another.

Schiavetto - I liked what Quas pointed out for the slot so lightly town for that reason, otherwise, logs are just alright. Not as shady as mash Schiavetto.

NULL:

Guillotine - Like what I think I expect with Guillo is just something that feels more substantial then what he provided. IDK I feel hungry for Guillo just providing more tbh. I mean I went to check up on the whole DZ/Le petit thing because Guillo as town ALWAYS has reasons for everything he does, and so when I inquired on this, Guillo passed the test. I don't really have too much of an opinion on their other callouts/content.

DaughterOfOmega - Second lowest poster right now, and they are vibing in the thread.

DeeZees - Hasn't really gone in on the solving and has felt relatively light there. But they were still in RVS. Had nutella as town and falcon as wolf and Creature didn't enter "Creaturey". The post on #234 does not inspire a lot of confidence in me. I cannot comprehend what DZ meant by #256, perhaps drunk after all, in fact imagine trying to read DZ off him saying that.

LIGHT MAFIA:

nutella - I feel like Chelsea is correct in saying nutella's arguments have felt particularly weak. I revisited their suspicion on DZ and was really confused by it, I mean I liked the bluntness of it originally. In 37 posts, they moved vote around 3 times, idk worth mentioning.

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Wow I sure am terrible at this thing called scumhunting aren't I? Especially if nutella is town. Obviously the people who haven't posted yet are lock wolf, this must be it! Also I do want to sleep. Yes.

Oh and I did most of this like 2 and a half hours ago so things may change.

My light towns, most of them are really not strong anyways, like I am surprised Rask is so high tbh

- Read on rising seems easy. I think she's an easy read when she's solving properly but what cape pulls out I disagree with. I struggle to get what is towny about the things he calls out, they seem a bit commentary esque.
- Townreadsing #527 seems weird as do the reasons "I feel like mafia wouldn't townread" kinda seems whack. Guessing how mafia wouldn't make reads seems really assumptive to me, and, I dont find cape to be that assumptive normally
- Feels like is making excuses to not wolf read Rask
- I disagree with creature take (obviously) but also think they are being too forgiving on things like naked voting and dropping
- and then yh I dont think Nutella really scum read me



So I find this a weird read list





Then after that they started getting pressured more and their solving becomes a bit harder to follow as everyone piles in to get him to defend some of his weirder points

I like #952 and was one of the things I scum read HK about (how he pulls reasoning too)
Things then get spikey after that


But then I get a bit weirded when he goes on to say he vibes and tr's him






So conclusion:
- I like Capes reads till his long post
- his long post has me
- his posts after decrease in qual significantly

want him back in thread to explain more tbh

[Manny]

Also i changed my mind if it comes to creature or cape ill vote cape mostly because his wagon feels better.

[DeeZees]

Harder to start well fwiw

[nutella]

If you don't want to talk about creature right now and deal with that what do you think about nutella defending me

It makes me want to SR Nut based on the reasons they are defending you for. I *think* you are still town-leaning but i heavily disagree with the creature wagon and the need to force a wagon to appear just for the sake of it.

I think your view here is exceptionally shallow and I think you should try and assess val and creature from a different pov. Val reminds me of a certain archetype and her devil may care attitude strikes me as hyper town. I've been trying to get it into your head that I strongly think creature is a hit based on meta and I want pressure to remain there so I'm glad val is knocking sense back into the thread after we kind of shrugged about him for a while. If youre town I hope you can think a couple levels beyond surface of this interaction and see it other ways

[Sabiplz]

I'm fine with wagons on cape, creature and dz

[nutella]

So conclusion:
- I like Capes reads till his long post
- his long post has me
- his posts after decrease in qual significantly

want him back in thread to explain more tbh

[Chelsea]

Oh ew Gulio is wolfing lol

[LordQuas]

i kinda thought cape was towny when i was real timing with him

[nutella]

Oh ew Gulio is wolfing lol

I was afraid to say it but ye

[Sabiplz]

Oh ew Gulio is wolfing lol

Expand on this

[Chelsea]

I legit forgot this game was 23 players given the wagons have not gone past 4 that's highkey impressive.

[LordQuas]

dz was suitably weird earlier, guillo i might just sheep hk on but lemme go read that. Def not an inspiring start

[Sabiplz]

i kinda thought cape was towny when i was real timing with him

Cape can do that as wolf.

He fooled me that way in a game he randed scum against me

[Manny]

I think your view here is exceptionally shallow and I think you should try and assess val and creature from a different pov. Val reminds me of a certain archetype and her devil may care attitude strikes me as hyper town. I've been trying to get it into your head that I strongly think creature is a hit based on meta and I want pressure to remain there so I'm glad val is knocking sense back into the thread after we kind of shrugged about him for a while. If youre town I hope you can think a couple levels beyond surface of this interaction and see it other ways

Why would you need to point me that her idgaf attitude is town, that was my reason to towniecore her before the Creature wagon. But the creature wagon does not match up on the idc vibe i was getting before from her she went from just vibeing going with the flow to now actually doing a full on 180 and trying to create and push wagons for the fuck of it? it just doesnt match up with what i had been vibeing with before.

As far as Creature being assesed from another PoV its just not that easy for me to do since my way of reading is 100% based on vibes and mindmelding people or agreeing with their plays or finding them funny. Like i wouldnt be absolutely shocked if he flipped wolf but the fact that im not reading him as one makes me wanna suspect the people forming a wagon against him.

[Manny]

Who is Gulio?

[LordQuas]

i kinda thought cape was towny when i was real timing with him

Cape can do that as wolf.

He fooled me that way in a game he randed scum against me

yeah i'm sure. Honestly cape's willingness to back off of me could be wolf indicative for him

[Chelsea]

Oh ew Gulio is wolfing lol

Expand on this

Gulio's entire come at me post was horrible. I'm very confident in my ability to read him and we're both aware of this fact. So it made me pause when he knows voting or calling me out will make me look at him (even though I already have been.)
He's also too reserved IMO.

Do I feel like fighting Gulio D1 with 4 hours left on the day expecting people to listen? No. :^) So my vote will stay on Cape

[Sabiplz]

i kinda thought cape was towny when i was real timing with him

Cape can do that as wolf.

He fooled me that way in a game he randed scum against me

yeah i'm sure. Honestly cape's willingness to back off of me could be wolf indicative for him

His post engagement has dipped as well but it's also Halloween weekend so idk if it's NAI

[Valentine]

i think ? i'd support a cape wagon

i feel like i've misread him in the past before though so i'm more wary
(fwiw i don't have experience with creature as a wolf, only town, but i don't think i've ever thought he was a wolf when he was town in those few games)

[Chelsea]

I should really try to get my own read on Creature but I genuinely look at his posts and get TV static and given most of the wagon is meta that does not help me so leshrug.jpg

[Sabiplz]

Oh ew Gulio is wolfing lol

Expand on this

Gulio's entire come at me post was horrible. I'm very confident in my ability to read him and we're both aware of this fact. So it made me pause when he knows voting or calling me out will make me look at him (even though I already have been.)
He's also too reserved IMO.

Do I feel like fighting Gulio D1 with 4 hours left on the day expecting people to listen? No. :^) So my vote will stay on Cape

OK so I kinda felt the same because when I made fun of him I expected more of his uncontrollable reaction and I got was a meow and not a roar like when he's town.

He's a lot more emotionally volatile as town and way more calmer as mafia.

[Chelsea]

DeeZees (DrZeus)=assuming the same MU guy?

Eh, need to iso but seem villa

[Manny]

DeeZees (DrZeus)=assuming the same MU guy?

yes

[Sabiplz]

We officially have more post than g1 @Marmot @MacDougall @Sloonei

[ColinIsCool]

wanted to GIVE MY VOTE A LITTLE BIT TO SEE WHAT HAPPENED AND IF PEOPLE WOULD TRAIL ON
being proactive is a curse this is why i never try

anyways whatever i said about creature is out the window because everyone's like "oh but what if creature" but where's the drive to manifest it. he's not like doing anything.

damn this posts actually howls hard as fuck, you should've posted this before tr'd you smh.

very strongly disagree. The drive to actually commit to a creature wagon when the thread has been handwaving around him is very protown

Kinda hard disagree with your disagree

I wanna see what Creature does

[VOTE: valentine] aubergine

[nutella]

I think your view here is exceptionally shallow and I think you should try and assess val and creature from a different pov. Val reminds me of a certain archetype and her devil may care attitude strikes me as hyper town. I've been trying to get it into your head that I strongly think creature is a hit based on meta and I want pressure to remain there so I'm glad val is knocking sense back into the thread after we kind of shrugged about him for a while. If youre town I hope you can think a couple levels beyond surface of this interaction and see it other ways

Why would you need to point me that her idgaf attitude is town, that was my reason to towniecore her before the Creature wagon. But the creature wagon does not match up on the idc vibe i was getting before from her she went from just vibeing going with the flow to now actually doing a full on 180 and trying to create and push wagons for the fuck of it? it just doesnt match up with what i had been vibeing with before.

As far as Creature being assesed from another PoV its just not that easy for me to do since my way of reading is 100% based on vibes and mindmelding people or agreeing with their plays or finding them funny. Like i wouldnt be absolutely shocked if he flipped wolf but the fact that im not reading him as one makes me wanna suspect the people forming a wagon against him.

I think it fits with her eagerness for stuff to happen in the game, I get not vibing with it in the same way but I liked it as a daring/unselfconscious move.

For creature it's really kinda a volume thing more than anything which feels a bit bad if he's just busy IRL but in my experience he cannot keep himself away from spamming thread when he's town and he really has comparatively low presence in this game to the point he seems uncomfortable. When he does post as wolf the content is usually similar to his town style, he's just not as in your face and less happy to be in thread

[Chelsea]

Oh ew Gulio is wolfing lol

Expand on this

Gulio's entire come at me post was horrible. I'm very confident in my ability to read him and we're both aware of this fact. So it made me pause when he knows voting or calling me out will make me look at him (even though I already have been.)
He's also too reserved IMO.

Do I feel like fighting Gulio D1 with 4 hours left on the day expecting people to listen? No. :^) So my vote will stay on Cape

OK so I kinda felt the same because when I made fun of him I expected more of his uncontrollable reaction and I got was a meow and not a roar like when he's town.

He's a lot more emotionally volatile as town and way more calmer as mafia.

Exactly this. I'm pretty sure Guilo is one of the people I can read with the most confidence and to me it felt almost transparent how obvious the change is but I'd like to think Guilo knew this so I was giving him BOTD because I don't like it when it feels that night and day.

[nutella]

Oh ew Gulio is wolfing lol

Expand on this

Gulio's entire come at me post was horrible. I'm very confident in my ability to read him and we're both aware of this fact. So it made me pause when he knows voting or calling me out will make me look at him (even though I already have been.)
He's also too reserved IMO.

Do I feel like fighting Gulio D1 with 4 hours left on the day expecting people to listen? No. :^) So my vote will stay on Cape

100%

honestly similar to what i just said about creature, town guillo is extremely in your face and aggressive and i haven't seen any of that this game

[Manny]

Oh Guilo = Guillotine im dumb. Im fine with wagoning him i sr him-

[Chelsea]

Cape wagon has my other biggest wolfread on it so this can only end well for me.

[LordQuas]

Quas not liking things for being awkward and hedgy seems so level 0 in general

seems to work though. you disagree that wolves struggle to post as naturally as town?

I think it's dependent on the person, I think in my scum game I won on this website I had a very awkward opener that townies acknowledged and brushed off.

It feels like too much stock is always put in those reads and it is really easy for mafia to take advantage of something that seems obvious like "player x's posts are awkward" it's why I am not vibing with nutella actually either

was your counter to "wolves have awkward openers >rand" really just "i had an awkward opener when i was a wolf so wolves don't have awkward openers"

I was trying to get at the fact that I wolves and town can be awkward in the beginning of their game so pushing on it seems easy and trivial and opportunistic. This is coming from a player who has less experience then a lot of forum mafia players

this whole interaction just came off to me as gut towny but its totally fakeable i suppose

[Cape90]

- Townreadsing #527 seems weird as do the reasons "I feel like mafia wouldn't townread" kinda seems whack. Guessing how mafia wouldn't make reads seems really assumptive to me, and, I dont find cape to be that assumptive normally

It's the fact Chelsea says "oh I am townreading x player for *insert reason I don't find good but I am gonna wagon them anyways lol" it's like you didn't read the message I said. I assumed that because I wouldn't assume mafia wouldn't be so upfront about waqgoning someone they townread.

Feels like is making excuses to not wolf read Rask

Honestly the only one I have is Rask prodding me to answer something, but that has been diminishing since I feel like they might have been avoiding the thread based on their own words

Then after that they started getting pressured more and their solving becomes a bit harder to follow as everyone piles in to get him to defend some of his weirder points

When has my solving ever got convoluted? Wow that never happens. I was literally called out by iaafr for this in a chat

So conclusion:
- I like Capes reads till his long post
- his long post has me
- his posts after decrease in qual significantly

now when has that last thing EVER HAPPENED in a game I am in

Trying to shade me for having bad posts again are we?