The Syndicate

Posted: **Mon Sep 16, 2019 11:28 am**

Jackofhearts2005 wrote: ↑Mon Sep 16, 2019 11:25 am
JaggedJimmyJay wrote: ↑Mon Sep 16, 2019 11:22 am
Jackofhearts2005 wrote: ↑Mon Sep 16, 2019 11:18 am Who was it again that tried to push the Rej lynch over TSP? And then switched to TSP after it was a foregone conclusion?

I forget.
shockedpikachumeme.jpg

Suspect me all you like, just ensure you don’t waste the night phase exclusively on that. Get a couple backup suspects. You’re going to need them.
Epi, Sprityo, Longcon.

If one of those players can self clear, we’re golden as Persona 4.

But it’s just you.

Those are a good start I think. I recommend you explore them in greater depth, even if as “it’s just you” foregone conclusions. Hell, if it’s just me, be prepared to find a possible number three as well.

Posted: **Mon Sep 16, 2019 11:29 am**

JaggedJimmyJay wrote: ↑Mon Sep 16, 2019 11:27 am
Jackofhearts2005 wrote: ↑Mon Sep 16, 2019 11:22 am All of Jay’s posts about Rej yesterday were primo garbo.

If there are only two baddies, this game is over.
This is all that stands between you and being a best-in-the-business kind of civilian. You’re right on the cusp, Jackofhearts2005. You just have to find that last layer of interpretive complexity. Maybe this game will push you there. I’m excited about that, genuinely. Whatever happens here, you’ll know in time that I’m a civilian, and you’ll have everything you need.

I forgive you in any event. I don’t expect you to trust me here. The real challenge will be next time.

It took me awhile but I correctly read TSP this game. I already leveled up. I just need to decide what to put my skill points into.

Posted: **Mon Sep 16, 2019 11:32 am**

I am not going to defend myself at all against the token accusations sure to flood in.

You tried to lynch Rej!

You moved your vote to Tony for credit when it was late!

Like, that’s ordinary shit. People will suspect it. That’s what civilians do, whatever. This is all you get:

Ask yourself if that’s how you handle business as a teammate Tony is the most likely lynch in a tiny game of 11.

If you think I did that, then lol okay. Sure. I hope you’ll (the general you) use this night phase for greater investigative effort and depth than just that.

I’m going to find Tony’s team. Fuck the rest.

Posted: **Mon Sep 16, 2019 11:36 am**

We can still talk during night? Damn.

TSP was eaten. They was JJJ desperately tried to strenghten my wagon makes me think JJJ is the next one.

Also epi gave me vibes of him giving up to form any other wagon.

I am busy at the mobile tho.

Has anyone an overview of the votes moved?

@epignosis what do you think about JJJ?

Mafia probably has a PR left. A theory:
We already had a wagon on the PR and TSP tried to move the vote away from the PR.

Just some thoughts I would like to mention.

Posted: **Mon Sep 16, 2019 11:39 am**

JaggedJimmyJay wrote: ↑Mon Sep 16, 2019 11:32 am I am not going to defend myself at all against the token accusations sure to flood in.

You tried to lynch Rej!

You moved your vote to Tony for credit when it was late!

Like, that’s ordinary shit. People will suspect it. That’s what civilians do, whatever. This is all you get:

Ask yourself if that’s how you handle business as a teammate Tony is the most likely lynch in a tiny game of 11.

If you think I did that, then lol okay. Sure. I hope you’ll (the general you) use this night phase for greater investigative effort and depth than just that.

I’m going to find Tony’s team. Fuck the rest.

You did so much nonsense last DP.

but I respect you for all the effort.

Posted: **Mon Sep 16, 2019 11:40 am**

Rej wrote: ↑Mon Sep 16, 2019 11:39 am
JaggedJimmyJay wrote: ↑Mon Sep 16, 2019 11:32 am I am not going to defend myself at all against the token accusations sure to flood in.

You tried to lynch Rej!

You moved your vote to Tony for credit when it was late!

Like, that’s ordinary shit. People will suspect it. That’s what civilians do, whatever. This is all you get:

Ask yourself if that’s how you handle business as a teammate Tony is the most likely lynch in a tiny game of 11.

If you think I did that, then lol okay. Sure. I hope you’ll (the general you) use this night phase for greater investigative effort and depth than just that.

I’m going to find Tony’s team. Fuck the rest.
You did so much nonsense last DP. but I respect you for all the effort.

I don’t mind my work being called nonsense while the game is active as long as it is treated with greater respect once I’m dead or the game ends.

Posted: **Mon Sep 16, 2019 11:43 am**

My first instinct is that if there’s only one teammate, they voted on the Tony wagon. Defending a guy that opened Day 1 with three instantaneous votes and actively trying to save him strikes me as so dumb that nobody here would really do that (inb4 cOnVeNiEnT). I’ll see where interactive analyses take me, probably after teacher time this afternoon.

Posted: **Mon Sep 16, 2019 11:50 am**

JaggedJimmyJay wrote: ↑Sun Sep 15, 2019 6:28 pm One base note: If the general premise that greater reads motion within a broader space of maneuverability is to be viewed as a sign of civilianhood, then I am encouraged that Dragomir emerges from this exercise as the one best suiting that idea. He has been all over the place by comparison to the others I reviewed, and he is also my strongest civilian read. Should he turn up mafia then oh golly, but I am encouraged right now.

One thing that drove me toward this effort was an expectation that Tony would not perform well. As it turns out, I think he's actually been more fluid than most players in this game. That may then serve as another point to his credit. He hasn't entirely sat on his initial reads as I had kind of expected based upon my general perception of his reads before the effort.

Some of these which might look bad by the numbers should be assessed for player and personality too. Epignosis's reads are highly static. I kinda figure they tend to be that way in most of his games. This isn't a reason to give him civilian credit, but it is a caution against allowing it to serve as a sole inspiration for pitchforks. Likewise with sprityo, there's no reason to expect reads fluidity when he has barely made any of them in the first place. I recommend reading both of these players on other bases.

Rej has been highly static in his reads, and even when there was some motion I struggled to follow it. He emerges as the worst look I think. Mac is also pretty rigid in his game theory -- there's not much motion in his play. I tend to expect more of that from him. Not my favorite thing.

I'm going to continue thinking things over. I have to drive home though which will take me 2+ hours. I should be back for the EOD period if there are no traffic problems. Keep the thread working while I am away please. Feedback is always welcome here too.

JaggedJimmyJay wrote: ↑Sun Sep 15, 2019 10:14 pm I think Tony's gripes with Rej here are valid.

JaggedJimmyJay wrote: ↑Sun Sep 15, 2019 10:26 pm Tony is talking while he's on the chopping block. He isn't frantic. He doesn't strike me as someone angling for opportunity. He's just answering questions as they come and saying his piece.

Rej is not talking while he's on the chopping block. He's frozen.

JaggedJimmyJay wrote: ↑Sun Sep 15, 2019 10:29 pm
Jackofhearts2005 wrote: ↑Sun Sep 15, 2019 10:29 pm
JaggedJimmyJay wrote: ↑Sun Sep 15, 2019 10:26 pm Tony is talking while he's on the chopping block. He isn't frantic. He doesn't strike me as someone angling for opportunity. He's just answering questions as they come and saying his piece.

Rej is not talking while he's on the chopping block. He's frozen.
He’s posting memes, dare jokes and trying to push a Rej lynch...
What is Rej doing other than let you defend him?

JaggedJimmyJay wrote: ↑Sun Sep 15, 2019 10:35 pm
Jackofhearts2005 wrote: ↑Sun Sep 15, 2019 10:34 pm
JaggedJimmyJay wrote: ↑Sun Sep 15, 2019 10:33 pm Jackofhearts2005 answer the question.

What is Rej doing right now other than allow you to defend him?
That’s not the criteria for lynching someone.
Fire Emblem

Late Day 1

nutella is on the chopping block. I am defending her. I realize she is letting me do that without interfering. She's bad.

JaggedJimmyJay wrote: ↑Sun Sep 15, 2019 10:41 pm
Jackofhearts2005 wrote: ↑Sun Sep 15, 2019 10:39 pm
JaggedJimmyJay wrote: ↑Sun Sep 15, 2019 10:37 pm
Jackofhearts2005 wrote: ↑Sun Sep 15, 2019 10:36 pm Don’t listen to you D1. Got it.
You're a better civilian than this and I hope you grow from it.
Convince me Tony is town.

Also Epi is like “Tony is a civ” but he isn’t doing anything about it. If Tony is a civ, that’s a problem.
I cannot convince you of something that I am not convinced of myself. Tony is a suspect. Rej is a suspect. Between the two I see one guy interacting with the game and the other sitting on his ass while you white knight him. I don't like that and I am trying to understand why you don't care.

JaggedJimmyJay wrote: ↑Sun Sep 15, 2019 10:39 pm nutella is also saying exactly nothing right now when it matters most.

Then the moment Rej votes Tony, Jay starts to scumread him.

JaggedJimmyJay wrote: ↑Sun Sep 15, 2019 10:45 pm Tony's explanation for Mac's vote and his read on Mac don't mesh well. The former implies town and the latter is mafia.

JaggedJimmyJay wrote: ↑Sun Sep 15, 2019 10:48 pm I don't have a good reason to say don't lynch Tony. He's having fun on the way out and that's easier to understand for a caught mafioso than a mislynched civilian.

JaggedJimmyJay wrote: ↑Sun Sep 15, 2019 10:50 pm sure [VOTE: Tony] aubergine

JaggedJimmyJay wrote: ↑Sun Sep 15, 2019 11:00 pm When "can we please have legacy" results in lolcat gifs, I feel pretty good.

Garbo.

Posted: **Mon Sep 16, 2019 11:54 am**

Ironically, my decision to just vote Tony came when I realized that despite him being around, he was basically just letting me defend him/yell about Rej instead of doing it himself.

Roundabout.

Posted: **Mon Sep 16, 2019 11:56 am**

JaggedJimmyJay wrote: ↑Mon Sep 16, 2019 11:54 am

Ironically, my decision to just vote Tony came when I realized that despite him being around, he was basically just letting me defend him/yell about Rej instead of doing it himself.

Roundabout.

So you were shouting to me that Rej had furry ears and then the camera panned over to Tony and his furry ears?

Posted: **Mon Sep 16, 2019 11:56 am**

Oh good.

Posted: **Mon Sep 16, 2019 11:58 am**

Jackofhearts2005 wrote: ↑Mon Sep 16, 2019 11:56 am
JaggedJimmyJay wrote: ↑Mon Sep 16, 2019 11:54 am

Ironically, my decision to just vote Tony came when I realized that despite him being around, he was basically just letting me defend him/yell about Rej instead of doing it himself.

Roundabout.
So you were shouting to me that Rej had furry ears and then the camera panned over to Tony and his furry ears?

Actually yes, that’s pretty accurate!

This dude is doing exactly what you’re saying Rej is doing. #rememberfireemblem2k18

Posted: **Mon Sep 16, 2019 12:04 pm**

cOnVeNiEnT

Posted: **Mon Sep 16, 2019 12:11 pm**

Hey [mention]Long Con[/mention] you have a unique advantage assuming you are town. You can read the thread for the first time with the knowledge that Tony is mafia. Tell us what impressions you get.

Posted: **Mon Sep 16, 2019 12:16 pm**

Somehow we still got scum.

Posted: **Mon Sep 16, 2019 12:17 pm**

though, just realized my read on TSP was complete bullshit. I didn't realize I had initially townread him and just assumed he seemed meh.

Posted: **Mon Sep 16, 2019 12:17 pm**

Ugh, forgot to move off Epignosis

atleast it didn't affect the EOD outcome

Posted: **Mon Sep 16, 2019 12:18 pm**

Should we wait the night out or shall we start pointing fingers?

Posted: **Mon Sep 16, 2019 12:38 pm**

Creature wrote: ↑Mon Sep 16, 2019 12:18 pm Should we wait the night out or shall we start pointing fingers?

Please point fingers as soon as possible and do not stop until you've no fingers left.

Posted: **Mon Sep 16, 2019 12:41 pm**

My only strong civilian reads at present are Dragomir and Jack.

Posted: **Mon Sep 16, 2019 1:37 pm**

Actually I'm not even going to call Jack a strong civilian read. Dude had no read at all on Tony until like 216 hours into the game.

Analyses after class.

Posted: **Mon Sep 16, 2019 1:46 pm**

JaggedJimmyJay wrote: ↑Mon Sep 16, 2019 1:37 pm Actually I'm not even going to call Jack a strong civilian read. Dude had no read at all on Tony until like 216 hours into the game.

Analyses after class.

Lol fight me hee ho!

Posted: **Mon Sep 16, 2019 2:04 pm**

[mention]nutella[/mention]
[mention]MacDougall[/mention]
[mention]Dragomir[/mention]
[mention]Rej[/mention]

Who was wolfin with Tony and why is the answer JaggedJimmyJay?

Posted: **Mon Sep 16, 2019 2:15 pm**

Jackofhearts2005 wrote: ↑Mon Sep 16, 2019 2:04 pm @nutella
@MacDougall
@Dragomir
@Rej

Who was wolfin with Tony and why is the answer JaggedJimmyJay?

I am with you, especially because it is easy to give townreads out to you and Dragomir for establishing the wagon on Tony. And suddenly his strongest townreads are you and Drago. LMAO.

Posted: **Mon Sep 16, 2019 2:26 pm**

JaggedJimmyJay wrote: ↑Mon Sep 16, 2019 11:58 am
Jackofhearts2005 wrote: ↑Mon Sep 16, 2019 11:56 am
JaggedJimmyJay wrote: ↑Mon Sep 16, 2019 11:54 am

Ironically, my decision to just vote Tony came when I realized that despite him being around, he was basically just letting me defend him/yell about Rej instead of doing it himself.

Roundabout.
So you were shouting to me that Rej had furry ears and then the camera panned over to Tony and his furry ears?
Actually yes, that’s pretty accurate!

This dude is doing exactly what you’re saying Rej is doing. #rememberfireemblem2k18

the only thing i remember about that game besides losing after trying really hard, was when mac, epi, and myself all had btsc and lynched jay only for him to be civilian

Posted: **Mon Sep 16, 2019 2:28 pm**

sprityo wrote: ↑Mon Sep 16, 2019 2:26 pm
JaggedJimmyJay wrote: ↑Mon Sep 16, 2019 11:58 am
Jackofhearts2005 wrote: ↑Mon Sep 16, 2019 11:56 am
JaggedJimmyJay wrote: ↑Mon Sep 16, 2019 11:54 am

Ironically, my decision to just vote Tony came when I realized that despite him being around, he was basically just letting me defend him/yell about Rej instead of doing it himself.

Roundabout.
So you were shouting to me that Rej had furry ears and then the camera panned over to Tony and his furry ears?
Actually yes, that’s pretty accurate!

This dude is doing exactly what you’re saying Rej is doing. #rememberfireemblem2k18
the only thing i remember about that game besides losing after trying really hard, was when mac, epi, and myself all had btsc and lynched jay only for him to be civilian

You were so obviously civ in that game (and in Mass Effect). I’m waiting for you to play like that again.

Posted: **Mon Sep 16, 2019 2:29 pm**

I loved writing a scene where Epi, Mac and Sprityo argued about who had stopped the mafia kill.

Posted: **Mon Sep 16, 2019 2:29 pm**

Jackofhearts2005 wrote: ↑Mon Sep 16, 2019 2:28 pm
sprityo wrote: ↑Mon Sep 16, 2019 2:26 pm
JaggedJimmyJay wrote: ↑Mon Sep 16, 2019 11:58 am
Jackofhearts2005 wrote: ↑Mon Sep 16, 2019 11:56 am
JaggedJimmyJay wrote: ↑Mon Sep 16, 2019 11:54 am

Ironically, my decision to just vote Tony came when I realized that despite him being around, he was basically just letting me defend him/yell about Rej instead of doing it himself.

Roundabout.
So you were shouting to me that Rej had furry ears and then the camera panned over to Tony and his furry ears?
Actually yes, that’s pretty accurate!

This dude is doing exactly what you’re saying Rej is doing. #rememberfireemblem2k18
the only thing i remember about that game besides losing after trying really hard, was when mac, epi, and myself all had btsc and lynched jay only for him to be civilian
You were so obviously civ in that game (and in Mass Effect). I’m waiting for you to play like that again.

the stars will align someday, mostly it just takes me surviving until mid game when i can do vote analysis'

early game has never been my strong suit

Posted: **Mon Sep 16, 2019 2:29 pm**

I'm like a cake, you gotta let it bake, then sit before it's delicious

Posted: **Mon Sep 16, 2019 2:34 pm**

sprityo wrote: ↑Fri Sep 13, 2019 12:27 pm -JaggedJimmyJay
-Dragomir
-nutella
-Rej
-Long Con

-MacDougall
-Epignosis
-Jackofhearts2005
-TonyStarkPrime
-Creature

also for some reason im unable to use the buttons for color or the emojis, anyone got any idea why?

New list following day 1:

Good
-Dragomir
-Rej
-Epignosis
Ugly
-JaggedJimmyJay
-nutella
-Jackofhearts2005
Bad
-MacDougall
-Long Con
-Creature

We'll divide it into 3 since that makes a pretty, round list.

Posted: **Mon Sep 16, 2019 2:41 pm**

The only argument I see for Mac being scum is him saying he thinks I’m bussing Tony, which could be tmi.

Otherwise, his play has aligned pretty well with what I expect from townMac and he helped lynch Tony and I agreed with some of his reads.

Mac would have to do something awful for me to consider lynching him tomorrow.

Posted: **Mon Sep 16, 2019 2:42 pm**

sprityo wrote: ↑Mon Sep 16, 2019 2:29 pm I'm like a cake, you gotta let it bake, then sit before it's delicious

I kinda want to test this but Sprityo coasted late into Sockvale and Girl Genius.

Posted: **Mon Sep 16, 2019 2:48 pm**

Jackofhearts2005 wrote: ↑Mon Sep 16, 2019 2:42 pm
sprityo wrote: ↑Mon Sep 16, 2019 2:29 pm I'm like a cake, you gotta let it bake, then sit before it's delicious
I kinda want to test this but Sprityo coasted late into Sockvale and Girl Genius.

girl genius i didnt even play really

sockville i was just late due to circumstances, but you can't say i didnt hop in and do a good job

Posted: **Mon Sep 16, 2019 2:50 pm**

sprityo wrote: ↑Mon Sep 16, 2019 2:34 pm Bad
-Long Con

Nope nope nope nope absolutely not. Lynching me would be very bad.

Posted: **Mon Sep 16, 2019 2:56 pm**

Long Con wrote: ↑Mon Sep 16, 2019 2:50 pm
sprityo wrote: ↑Mon Sep 16, 2019 2:34 pm Bad
-Long Con
Nope nope nope nope absolutely not. Lynching me would be very bad.

y

Posted: **Mon Sep 16, 2019 3:00 pm**

sprityo wrote: ↑Mon Sep 16, 2019 2:56 pm
Long Con wrote: ↑Mon Sep 16, 2019 2:50 pm
sprityo wrote: ↑Mon Sep 16, 2019 2:34 pm Bad
-Long Con
Nope nope nope nope absolutely not. Lynching me would be very bad.
y

Becoz I'm just a harmless li'l Civ, and you wanna lynch big bad baddies.

Posted: **Mon Sep 16, 2019 3:07 pm**

Long Con wrote: ↑Mon Sep 16, 2019 3:00 pm
sprityo wrote: ↑Mon Sep 16, 2019 2:56 pm
Long Con wrote: ↑Mon Sep 16, 2019 2:50 pm
sprityo wrote: ↑Mon Sep 16, 2019 2:34 pm Bad
-Long Con
Nope nope nope nope absolutely not. Lynching me would be very bad.
y
Becoz I'm just a harmless li'l Civ, and you wanna lynch big bad baddies.

Oh crap! I want to lynch big baddies!

Posted: **Mon Sep 16, 2019 3:09 pm**

k I will check the interactions now.

General request for our lovely player roster: if you suspect me, that's just gravy. Please please please though do not let that stop you from at least seeing what I have to say in these analyses. I don't care about your damned credit, but I do care about getting actual feedback and seeing how people feel about anything I may deem to be of interest. Okay super thanks.

Posted: **Mon Sep 16, 2019 3:36 pm**

TonyStarkPrime wrote: ↑Sun Sep 15, 2019 9:06 pm
nutella wrote: ↑Sun Sep 15, 2019 9:01 pm Mmmmmmm could mac and I both be right could it be Jay/Tony w/w
Hmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm
hmmmmmm

I'll take that dare

vote:JJJ

Posted: **Mon Sep 16, 2019 3:46 pm**

Interactions of Tony and Creature

Spoiler: show

Vague WIFOM hedging. My instinct tells me it's decent for creature since Tony had to wrap his brain in a pretzel to lean town (TMI). I'm hesitant to think too deeply about it.

Spoiler: show

k

[mention]Dragomir[/mention], the following spoiler explains why I like to say things like "k" in an ISO. Everyone else can move on unless you actually care.

Spoiler: show

--

Spoiler: show

I would like this exchange more from Creature if it featured more than just a response to Tony but also some kind of interpretation of Tony himself.

Spoiler: show

Town in the "curated" list. The WIFOM lean became concrete. On some level I wonder if this can be tied to a general propensity for Tony to generate reads contrary to consensus (like Dragomir as mafia). As such it'd say less about Creature and more about climate. It does nothing to harm or help his standing.

Spoiler: show

Did Tony include a/the teammate in this town core of three (Creature/Jack/Mac)? Could be. Among them, I would say Creature stands out simply for being lower in content. Mac stands out a bit less for having not been the "overlap on the lists" at this point. Jack does not stand out. If there is a teammate in this pile, I do think Creature looks like the guy just by the specific context of the post.

Spoiler: show

The only comment Tony felt like sharing here was that Creature is town. I kinda like this for Creature. Like, why?

Spoiler: show

Tony tried to build fake Drago mafia teams and one of them featured Creature. It's hardly an "accusation". It's pretty much nothing.

Second-last on lynch priority list

~~~~~

Spoiler: show

Meh. Tony did a derpy thing, and Creature felt the need to respond to it with dramatic question marks. A little yucky.

Spoiler: show

What?

Spoiler: show

Alrighty.

Spoiler: show

Except the last thing I guess.

Spoiler: show

More criticism. It's not severe.

Spoiler: show

lol

This is after Tony's death and flip, so consider that as you interpret. Transparency is great, though this is a lot of transparency. Complete bullshit.

~~~~~

Conclusion: It's a very mixed bag from Tony. Creature's own posts are hard to interpret. Overall I wouldn't feel comfortable pulling him from the suspect pool.

Posted: **Mon Sep 16, 2019 3:49 pm**

Spoiler: show

Posted: **Mon Sep 16, 2019 3:56 pm**

One must also consider Creature's final vote, which remained on Epignosis through the deadline. Sideline votes are not ideal at face value. I don't recall the position of the tally when the vote was made though. Later I might try to piece that together if time permits.

Posted: **Mon Sep 16, 2019 4:02 pm**

Interactions of Tony and Dragomir

Spoiler: show

TonyStarkPrime wrote: ↑Thu Sep 12, 2019 7:08 pm
nutella wrote: ↑Thu Sep 12, 2019 6:58 pm Ah you grouped them as both suspecting Jay. Drago came to it independently though while jack just sheeped me.
That’s worse. Scum puts in more effort. Drago came in, said something someone else had said, came up with basically the same reasoning, and that was it. I wouldn’t call that coming to it independently

TonyStarkPrime wrote: ↑Fri Sep 13, 2019 10:34 am “I said something stupid and you’re scum for pointing it out”

I don’t think it’s AI that you say it but Drago’s latch onto it seems opportunistic because it’s so obviously a blah argument

TonyStarkPrime wrote: ↑Fri Sep 13, 2019 10:44 am
Jackofhearts2005 wrote: ↑Fri Sep 13, 2019 10:41 am I townlean Rej for looking comfortable and cause Drago has not attempted to hadoken him yet.
(Also why Drago is scum)

TonyStarkPrime wrote: ↑Fri Sep 13, 2019 1:26 pm
JaggedJimmyJay wrote: ↑Fri Sep 13, 2019 11:25 am @
TonyStarkPrime, where are you at now in terms of reads? I reviewed your 53 posts and saw only a few:

[Creature lean town via WIFOM]
[Dragomir/Jack similar, slight orange]
[Epi GTH scum]

Do you still feel these reads? What about other people?
Well that’s a curated list feels like
Creature town, Rej slight town, Drago more scum than Jack or Epi, Nutella scummish Mac probably town no reads on anybody else

TonyStarkPrime wrote: ↑Fri Sep 13, 2019 1:27 pm
Dragomir wrote: ↑Fri Sep 13, 2019 1:07 pm Why am I in everyone's town reads? How am I in everyone's town reads?
Either you’re scum or scum decided that they want doctor bait is my guess

TonyStarkPrime wrote: ↑Fri Sep 13, 2019 1:34 pm
JaggedJimmyJay wrote: ↑Fri Sep 13, 2019 1:27 pm
TonyStarkPrime wrote: ↑Fri Sep 13, 2019 1:26 pmDrago more scum than [x]
Very against the grain.

If you could summarize your suspicion of Drago in a few words or a sentence, how might you do so?
Drago started with the “conveniently take the argument of someone else and then be surprised that you have the same argument” (town is disappointed to have the same argument as someone else)
Drago is behaving unlike he has in the two games I just played where he was town
Drago is doing the thing scum does when they get good day 1 reads and then try to compound on townie value by doing the exact same things

etc.

Tony chose Dragomir as his suspect to pursue all day. Dragomir was read as a civilian by nearly everyone else and was never getting lynched. Tony's move here strikes me as exclusively strategic -- go against the grain and hope it gets him some credit. In that regard I don't think this makes Dragomir look any better. Nor does it make him look any worse. I doubt he's Tony's teammate.

Posted: **Mon Sep 16, 2019 4:39 pm**

Interactions of Tony and Epignosis

Spoiler: show

Tony gripes at one of Epi's JJJ pokes. It's a gentle thing with no real follow-up. It does nothing for me.

Spoiler: show

Does it though?

Spoiler: show

Tony actually broadened that previous silly point to a mafia read. Fish, meet hook. Decent little look for Epignosis.

Spoiler: show

I have no idea why these reads were grouped this way. Someone else might draw something from it. At least I don't think it does Epi any favors.

"Sort out" GTH read -- weak.

Dead center in the voting priority

Spoiler: show

Stuck Epi on a potential mafia team with me, and it was the only such entry here that didn't feature a "but he's town" qualifier. Given that the climate around me was so negative, sticking anyone with me could by extension make their climate negative as well. Epi and I were both plausible enough counterwagons for much of the day, and this post indirectly promotes both. Another decent look, though I grant it requires layers.

Spoiler: show

This whole moment is of interest. Mac observed that Tony had briefly placed his vote on Epignosis before moving it to Rej. He never announced the Epi vote. This likely says something about one of the two, though I want to wait for the Rej analysis to decide how I feel.

~~~~~

Epi and Tony had an OT exchange about teaching. Click if you care.[/url]

Spoiler: show

Indeed. This is a comment.

Will have to revisit

Spoiler: show

Epi did revisit and landed on this -- a non-lynch read. It's not a stance on an alignment.

Spoiler: show

I don't like this one at all. All respect to Tony and the efforts he gives in Mafia games, but why is he (and only he) the guy in this game that is stuck next to me aboard the H.M.S. BadDay1Lynch? Keep in mind that Epignosis spent some time hounding MacDougall, who could also be said to belong aboard that boat. What? No bueno.

Spoiler: show

This continues from the previous point. Jack asked if anyone townread Tony. Nobody really did to my memory. Epignosis raised his hand. Jack asked him why. Epi said "oh ffs, read the shit I say" -- this implies that in Epi's mind, he had already covered this. That is, he'd already covered "Tony is a civilian", not "Tony is a bad Day 1 lynch".

He hadn't already covered that. He went hunting for a post that doesn't exist and go figure he couldn't find it. He brought back the "bad day 1 lynch" post instead. It says nothing about trusting Tony, and indeed says exactly "I didn't say I trust him".

I pressed Epignosis on the distinction, and he finally clarified a read of "civilian". I have no idea why. It's not in this content. Bad look.

Spoiler: show

By this point the tide wasn't moving elsewhere, so the granting of permission means little. It was 12 minutes to the deadline, and only one counterwagon existed -- one that was not gaining any steam apart from my own anti-Rej shouting (and I was hardly trusted anyway).

~~~~~

Conclusion: There are a few bits in Tony's posts that I thought looked nice for Epignosis. They tend to require some degree of WIFOM or layers. I highlighted in pink the point that stands out to me most, and I think it's a bad look. Epignosis can be Tony's teammate.

Posted: **Mon Sep 16, 2019 4:42 pm**

Also, Epi as a teammate of Tony makes further sense when recalling that awkward moment Mac caught -- Tony switched his vote off of me (after that goofy "I'll take that challenge" thing) to Rej and announced that. However, before voting Rej he had momentarily voted Epi and not announced it. I don't struggle to believe Tony was deciding between distance and counterwagon here, and opted in the end for counterwagon. I'll see if my Rej analysis gives me any reason to read that another way.

Posted: **Mon Sep 16, 2019 4:51 pm**

JaggedJimmyJay wrote: ↑Mon Sep 16, 2019 4:42 pm Also, Epi as a teammate of Tony makes further sense when recalling that awkward moment Mac caught -- Tony switched his vote off of me (after that goofy "I'll take that challenge" thing) to Rej and announced that. However, before voting Rej he had momentarily voted Epi and not announced it. I don't struggle to believe Tony was deciding between distance and counterwagon here, and opted in the end for counterwagon. I'll see if my Rej analysis gives me any reason to read that another way.

This and the pink thing have a nutella-approved amount of spice.

Posted: **Mon Sep 16, 2019 4:51 pm**

Meaning, yeah epi looks sketch af.

Posted: **Mon Sep 16, 2019 5:19 pm**

Interactions of Tony and Jack

Spoiler: show

Tony created this Jack/Drago dichotomy which turned into his semi-crusade against Dragomir. The reasoning was technically sound but not respectful of details or context. To me it looks like standard fake hunting, and as such I don't view either of the two better or worse inherently from it.

Spoiler: show

There are a few of these fun-related posts. Don't care.

Spoiler: show

We're back to this grouping. That Tony specifically opted for Dragomir as the better suspect than Jack from that dichotomy could be called protective. It's a reach, but yanno decide for yourselves.

Spoiler: show

Welp.

My immediate instinct here is to just believe Tony. Thanks for that.

Spoiler: show

I said earlier that Jack stands out least in this town core. It's kinda default following the previous comment. Whatever.

Spoiler: show

This exchange is a bit softball. Here's something to talk about, make a few posts why dontcha.

"Sort out" GTH read -- Weak. Also goofy after having called Jack town before. Maybe he wanted more suspects to work with.

Near the center of the voting priority / Slight drop

Spoiler: show

More fake hunting. Tony turned against Jack, but only on the basis of his contrarian suspicion of Dragomir. The vagueness of "it gives me bad vibes/gut feeling" are a decent look for Jack.

Spoiler: show

Town read as the phase winded down. Sure.

Spoiler: show

WIFOM.

~~~~~

Spoiler: show

Suspicion emoji. K.

Spoiler: show

If I'd said these, Jack would call it garbo.

Spoiler: show

In the POE. Cool beans. I think he was in nearly everyone's, at least those who provided reads that could be viewed as "POE".

Spoiler: show

This guy wanted a counterwagon too (his name was JJJ).

Spoiler: show

More hypothetical garbo.

*wears out grin emoji*

Spoiler: show

Tony knows his audience.

Spoiler: show

Things like this make me wish I really was mafia, because it'd be hilarious to compile a case comprised of these.

~~~~~

Conclusion: I had some fun in here. Don't interpret the emoji salad as "JJJ suspects Jack for this". I am inclined to dissociate him from Tony, frankly. Back into the good graces.

Posted: **Mon Sep 16, 2019 5:22 pm**

You civ read Jack for the distancey wafflebus eh?

Posted: **Mon Sep 16, 2019 5:23 pm**

MacDougall wrote: ↑Mon Sep 16, 2019 5:22 pm You civ read Jack for the distancey wafflebus eh?

I'd love to see your case. Go crazy.

The Syndicate

Persona 5 Mafia [Game End]

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