The Syndicate

Posted: **Tue May 12, 2020 2:31 pm**

Does anyone think that mafia sloonei would actually claim a role that he can never ever verify? Would he make that claim unprovoked to clear a player he just spent a considerable amount of time/posts painting as a suspect? Would he also have anticipated this well in advance with a random bread crumb hint to russtifinko?

mainly asking turnip head.

Posted: **Tue May 12, 2020 2:33 pm**

So I searched around on the watcher thing and found this discussion.

http://www.mafiathesyndicate.com/viewto ... er#p393470

It seems I was mistaking and it wasn't Jay who thought watcher was OP, it was Jack, although Jay agreed watcher is very powerful.

I'm sorry, my memory failed me here.

Still, I think that's a lot of info roles for a single faction.

Posted: **Tue May 12, 2020 2:35 pm**

How many vanilla roles have we had flipped/claimed?

Posted: **Tue May 12, 2020 2:40 pm**

Turnip Head wrote: ↑Tue May 12, 2020 2:06 pm Sloonei is the bad guy tho, did anyone even read my well reasoned case? I've spent a lot of energy trying to clear my townreads and build a case on the bad guy

You started your case by stating sloonei is being town read on the nutella thing and implying you missed the real reason he is being townread.

We won't read your posts if you aren't reading ours.

Posted: **Tue May 12, 2020 2:41 pm**

4 vanilla flips, and russ claims the 5th.

2 civ power roles and us 4 claimed 4 more, so 6 power roles (including TH's claim)

i think 4 vanilla x 6 PRs is a lot, especially when the PRs are nearly all in the "strong" category of jay's sheet.

Posted: **Tue May 12, 2020 2:48 pm**

Nanook's role is probably what I'd call a weaker one. It's pretty hard to produce a meaningful conclusion from it, as demonstrated by Nanook himself and his failed Sig case.

dunya's role I agree is a weaker one, at least for a townie. And she says it has a restriction so it's even weaker. It's that role you add in role madness games when you want everyone to have a role but don't want to overwhelm the mafia.

Vig depends on whether it's multi-shot or one-shot.

(but even multi-shot it's a step below cops, I'd say I agree with the assertion it's similar to a tracker or a doctor)

jailkeeper is equal to a roleblocker and a doctor imo. The two abilities nerf one another but at the same time it's two abilities so you have a very good range of utility that can come out from them.

Tracker starts out pretty weak but gets stronger in the endgame, becoming essentially a roleblocker. Watcher starts out being even more powerful than a cop but normalizes to a similar level as the tracker when you approach endgame.

Posted: **Tue May 12, 2020 2:50 pm**

you forgot sloonei's role.

Posted: **Tue May 12, 2020 2:53 pm**

We don't know all the details of my role. Who knows how powerful it might be?

Posted: **Tue May 12, 2020 2:58 pm**

In terms of information it's limited to confirming Sloonei and it kind of already did that, though it could confirm it better if someone actually got the damn item. It's the equivallent of a Fruit Vendor role.

https://wiki.mafiascum.net/index.php?title=Fruit_Vendor

Besides that, it depends on how good those items are.

Posted: **Tue May 12, 2020 3:01 pm**

If Sloonei says his failed again tomorrow because he tried to give the item to me, lynch him.

Posted: **Tue May 12, 2020 4:40 pm**

But I don't understand how sloonei's role clears him. He is towncleared for... Doing nothing?

Posted: **Tue May 12, 2020 4:43 pm**

Turnip Head wrote: ↑Tue May 12, 2020 4:40 pm But I don't understand how sloonei's role clears him. He is towncleared for... Doing nothing?

I believe it is the circumstances of my role claim, and not the claim itself, that clears me for everyone else.

Posted: **Tue May 12, 2020 5:05 pm**

What are the circumstances of your roleclaim?

Posted: **Tue May 12, 2020 5:07 pm**

Turnip Head wrote: ↑Tue May 12, 2020 5:05 pm What are the circumstances of your roleclaim?

I did it unprovoked to clear MP after having laid out the foundations of a case against him a few hours earlier. I had also dropped a hint to it about Russ much earlier in the game, before any of us had any way of knowing or suspecting that MP had inadvertently blocked me by jailkeeping russ the same night.
Also if I was going to use a fake claim, I would not go with something that would require me to manifest a result in someone else's inbox later in the game.

Posted: **Tue May 12, 2020 5:10 pm**

Sloonei wrote: ↑Tue May 12, 2020 5:07 pmAlso if I was going to use a fake claim, I would not go with something that would require me to manifest a result in someone else's inbox later in the game.

What does this mean? Please explain it in excruciating detail.

Posted: **Tue May 12, 2020 5:10 pm**

Does someone have something in their inbox that undoubtedly clears sloonei?

Posted: **Tue May 12, 2020 5:10 pm**

Turnip Head wrote: ↑Tue May 12, 2020 5:10 pm
Sloonei wrote: ↑Tue May 12, 2020 5:07 pmAlso if I was going to use a fake claim, I would not go with something that would require me to manifest a result in someone else's inbox later in the game.
What does this mean? Please explain it in excruciating detail.

I don't want to.

Posted: **Tue May 12, 2020 5:12 pm**

That's because you can't....

Posted: **Tue May 12, 2020 5:19 pm**

Turnip Head wrote: ↑Tue May 12, 2020 5:12 pm That's because you can't....

Do you... not understand what my claim is?

Posted: **Tue May 12, 2020 5:19 pm**

Not really, no

Posted: **Tue May 12, 2020 5:33 pm**

Turnip Head wrote: ↑Tue May 12, 2020 5:10 pm
Sloonei wrote: ↑Tue May 12, 2020 5:07 pmAlso if I was going to use a fake claim, I would not go with something that would require me to manifest a result in someone else's inbox later in the game.
What does this mean? Please explain it in excruciating detail.

lmao. love u boo

Posted: **Tue May 12, 2020 5:35 pm**

here's what I think will happen. sloon dies, turnip says they saw me kill him. russ goes frantic "seeee I told u she was bad". Russ and Turnip vote dunya, dunya and DDL vote turnip. Then a flip of a coin determines everything.

Posted: **Tue May 12, 2020 5:37 pm**

Or ddl dies. Makes more sense for turnip to claim to be watching ddl because they think sloonei is bad itt.

Posted: **Tue May 12, 2020 5:59 pm**

Turnip should probably not survive the night if they're town.

Posted: **Tue May 12, 2020 6:00 pm**

Night 4 has ended.

A protagonist is long gone
Get him right off of my lawn
He's no match for Grunty's brawn
Ever a bore and such a long yawn!

Dragon D. Luffy was killed. He was:

Spoiler: show

Day 5 is underway. You have 48 hours to lynch someone. I will update the post count ceilings shortly.

Posted: **Tue May 12, 2020 6:01 pm**

Groovy. Well played, DDL. Thank you for everything.

[mention]Turnip Head[/mention] what's the scoop?

Posted: **Tue May 12, 2020 6:08 pm**

RIP DDL. Fantastic effort, especially with that vig. I hope we can bring it home for you.

I basically took the last 24h off to reset and just skimmed the thread. While I thought about it more, TH, your case at least convinced me to do my due diligence on Sloon as well as you and dunya. I still think it's a very long shot that he's bad because of the breadcrumb he left me and because he basically pointed DDL at nutella to get her vigged. However, as far-fetched as it seems, it's at least possible he made up the gift-giver role. He's still the most civ-looking to me, but I don't want to lose because I just didn't even consider the possibility at all.

My plan for today is essentially:

1) wait for TH's info from last night
2) give all 3 of you a fresh reread
3) give nutella and Speed a fresh reread
4) decide

Posted: **Tue May 12, 2020 6:09 pm**

Thanks for the game, [mention]JaggedJimmyJay[/mention]!

Good luck, folks.

Posted: **Tue May 12, 2020 6:10 pm**

Post count ceilings for Day 5:

201 dunya
83 Russtifinko
215 Sloonei
166 Turnip Head

Posted: **Tue May 12, 2020 7:18 pm**

[VOTE: turnip head] aubergine

Posted: **Tue May 12, 2020 7:27 pm**

Posted: **Tue May 12, 2020 7:48 pm**

Do the part where you say things!

Posted: **Tue May 12, 2020 10:00 pm**

[mention]Sloonei[/mention] [mention]Turnip Head[/mention] who did both of you target last night?

sloonei, if you gave something to ddl im gonna throw this desk over.

Posted: **Tue May 12, 2020 10:02 pm**

dunya wrote: ↑Tue May 12, 2020 10:00 pm @Sloonei @Turnip Head who did both of you target last night?

sloonei, if you gave something to ddl im gonna throw this desk over.

Don't you worry. I gave something to turnip head.

Posted: **Tue May 12, 2020 10:09 pm**

dunya wrote: ↑Tue May 12, 2020 10:00 pm @Sloonei @Turnip Head who did both of you target last night?

sloonei, if you gave something to ddl im gonna throw this desk over.

I watched DDL and was given no result

Posted: **Tue May 12, 2020 10:20 pm**

Sloon/TH, what was given/received last night? (IF IT IS RELATED TO JIGGIES, DO NOT SAY AND GET MODKILLED!) Could that possibly explain the no result?

It probably was too optimistic, but I was kinda of hoping we'd just get the game handed to us to start the day.

Posted: **Tue May 12, 2020 10:25 pm**

Russtifinko wrote: ↑Tue May 12, 2020 10:20 pm Sloon/TH, what was given/received last night? (IF IT IS RELATED TO JIGGIES, DO NOT SAY AND GET MODKILLED!) Could that possibly explain the no result?

It probably was too optimistic, but I was kinda of hoping we'd just get the game handed to us to start the day.

I have five 1-shot items to give out. I can only choose my target, and not what item they get. I targeted TH. We now have temporary BTSC for the phase. There is no way that should have interfered with TH's claimed role that I know of.

Posted: **Tue May 12, 2020 10:40 pm**

Russtifinko wrote: ↑Tue May 12, 2020 6:08 pm RIP DDL. Fantastic effort, especially with that vig. I hope we can bring it home for you.

I basically took the last 24h off to reset and just skimmed the thread. While I thought about it more, TH, your case at least convinced me to do my due diligence on Sloon as well as you and dunya. I still think it's a very long shot that he's bad because of the breadcrumb he left me and because he basically pointed DDL at nutella to get her vigged. However, as far-fetched as it seems, it's at least possible he made up the gift-giver role. He's still the most civ-looking to me, but I don't want to lose because I just didn't even consider the possibility at all.

My plan for today is essentially:

1) wait for TH's info from last night
2) give all 3 of you a fresh reread
3) give nutella and Speed a fresh reread
4) decide

who is this person and where is russtifinko?

Posted: **Tue May 12, 2020 10:45 pm**

Sloonei wrote: ↑Tue May 12, 2020 10:25 pm
Russtifinko wrote: ↑Tue May 12, 2020 10:20 pm Sloon/TH, what was given/received last night? (IF IT IS RELATED TO JIGGIES, DO NOT SAY AND GET MODKILLED!) Could that possibly explain the no result?

It probably was too optimistic, but I was kinda of hoping we'd just get the game handed to us to start the day.
I have five 1-shot items to give out. I can only choose my target, and not what item they get. I targeted TH. We now have temporary BTSC for the phase. There is no way that should have interfered with TH's claimed role that I know of.

im jealous

i want btsc with you and TH

Posted: **Tue May 12, 2020 11:22 pm**

dunya wrote: ↑Tue May 12, 2020 10:45 pm
Sloonei wrote: ↑Tue May 12, 2020 10:25 pm
Russtifinko wrote: ↑Tue May 12, 2020 10:20 pm Sloon/TH, what was given/received last night? (IF IT IS RELATED TO JIGGIES, DO NOT SAY AND GET MODKILLED!) Could that possibly explain the no result?

It probably was too optimistic, but I was kinda of hoping we'd just get the game handed to us to start the day.
I have five 1-shot items to give out. I can only choose my target, and not what item they get. I targeted TH. We now have temporary BTSC for the phase. There is no way that should have interfered with TH's claimed role that I know of.
im jealous i want btsc with you and TH

i mean we'd basically just be excluding russ at that point.

What do we all think? TH claims to have got no result. TH's role is such that he would be the most sensible kill last night, unless the remaining mafia role is a rolebloacker.

I believe that I am officially confirmed now, no?

Posted: **Tue May 12, 2020 11:38 pm**

i believe i have to go over russ and TH again this phase and weigh the actions of each with what i believe to be townie behavior and what is likely all things considered.

do you believe in the claim of a town watcher, bringing total of PRs to 7, is likely, in this game? [mention]Sloonei[/mention]

1 1 shot vig - DDL
1 vanilla cop - nanook
1 tracker - gman
1 jailkeeper - MP
1 5-shot gift giver - you
1 double voter - me

1 2-shot watcher - TH

Posted: **Tue May 12, 2020 11:41 pm**

the post cap does favor mafia. but jiggies also severely lessened the impact of the cap as the game wore on. I'm not sure what I think of the balance. The flavor of TH's role as they described it initially seemed out of balance with the rest of the roles though.

Posted: **Tue May 12, 2020 11:44 pm**

Sloonei wrote: ↑Tue May 12, 2020 11:41 pm but jiggies also severely lessened the impact of the cap as the game wore on.

speak for yourself, this is the last racket game i play. i don't like not being able to post smaller posts in succession. sooooo not my style of game play lol.

what do you mean by their flavor seemed out of balance? it's a weird claim to make in the first place imo.

Posted: **Tue May 12, 2020 11:46 pm**

Turnip Head wrote: ↑Sun May 10, 2020 2:33 pm I am Leaky and my role could still be useful if we go to Lylo.

I select a player two nights in the game, and if that player is killed that night i learn who killed them. I didn't use it the first two nights and last night I selected DDL thinking they would kill him for sure, but they went with G-Man instead. I still have one watch left.

The limited utility of the role where it only works upon death does not mesh with anything else in the game, or with the style of role i'd expect to see in a jay game.

Posted: **Tue May 12, 2020 11:47 pm**

Also TH has gone almost completely silent today after having me confirmed as town. That's not particularly encouraging. I think the plan had to have been to keep pushing me.

Posted: **Wed May 13, 2020 2:10 am**

[VOTE: dunya] aubergine

Posted: **Wed May 13, 2020 8:06 am**

Sloonei wrote: ↑Tue May 12, 2020 11:46 pm
Turnip Head wrote: ↑Sun May 10, 2020 2:33 pm I am Leaky and my role could still be useful if we go to Lylo.

I select a player two nights in the game, and if that player is killed that night i learn who killed them. I didn't use it the first two nights and last night I selected DDL thinking they would kill him for sure, but they went with G-Man instead. I still have one watch left.
The limited utility of the role where it only works upon death does not mesh with anything else in the game, or with the style of role i'd expect to see in a jay game.

Why doesn't it mesh with the game? I think it fits fine, and more importantly, it is my actual role. I think sloonei's role is the one that doesn't fit, and the revealed mafia so far is noticeably missing a manipulator/disruptor role, which I think can fit for Sloonei.

[mention]Russtifinko[/mention], can you point me towards Sloonei's breadcrumb?

Posted: **Wed May 13, 2020 8:09 am**

Every other town role is basic and simple except for Sloonei's, which is wacky and chaotic.

Posted: **Wed May 13, 2020 8:15 am**

Turnip Head wrote: ↑Wed May 13, 2020 8:06 am
Sloonei wrote: ↑Tue May 12, 2020 11:46 pm
Turnip Head wrote: ↑Sun May 10, 2020 2:33 pm I am Leaky and my role could still be useful if we go to Lylo.

I select a player two nights in the game, and if that player is killed that night i learn who killed them. I didn't use it the first two nights and last night I selected DDL thinking they would kill him for sure, but they went with G-Man instead. I still have one watch left.
The limited utility of the role where it only works upon death does not mesh with anything else in the game, or with the style of role i'd expect to see in a jay game.
Why doesn't it mesh with the game? I think it fits fine, and more importantly, it is my actual role. I think sloonei's role is the one that doesn't fit, and the revealed mafia so far is noticeably missing a manipulator/disruptor role, which I think can fit for Sloonei.

@Russtifinko, can you point me towards Sloonei's breadcrumb?

Sure. The bolded part of Sloonei's post.

Sloonei wrote: ↑Mon May 04, 2020 10:04 pm
Russtifinko wrote: ↑Mon May 04, 2020 8:24 pm
nutella wrote: ↑Mon May 04, 2020 3:41 pm
Dragon D. Luffy wrote: ↑Mon May 04, 2020 3:30 pm I don't remember which game it was, but I think there was an instance where town Sig lost a game on purpose to make a point about being against claiming. Or maybe it was someone else (this happens a lot in the other forum I play in). Correct me if I'm wrong.

If this is true it makes me paranoid, though. There is a good chance nanook is telling the truth but his info isn't really conclusive, and Sig is gonna self destruct to make a point anyway.
Notably Nanook also faked a red peek in a recent game (the baseball one), though that person happened to be indeed mafia But from what he's said here I believe he's not lying this time and he is admitting that his info might not be 100% reliable. But yeah you make a point that goes against Nanook's plan to policy-lynch sig for refusing to claim.
I've been known to take pretty hard-line stances against claiming and infodumping, too. But it's in the rules for this game, so to the extent it helps us, we might as well. We're at a disadvantage to begin with because of post count restrictions, so we should use every (legal) advantage we have.

I wouldn't call it a policy lynch, though. Even with NANOOK's admittedly not-certain infodump, I probably wouldn't vote sig today if that was the only thing against him. There's also yesterday's lynch vote, which looked like a save to me, and his reaction to this read, which has been to stubbornly not claim and then make a bunch of false statements.

G-Man, I'm gonna ISO both you and Sloonei, with as open a mind as possible, but I probably won't get around to it until tomorrow at least. He pinged me very early on, and you're now one of my top suspects. I do think it's a good look that he put so much detail into that ISO before anyone followed your advice to ISO him. I never think an OMGUS is super inspiring, but I'm probably giving a little more leeway on this one than I usually would since I do think D1 points to you being bad.

nutella thanks for the help with "@"! That was driving me insane.
You should have a good reason not to suspect me, but I am unclear who you are saying is OMGUSing here?

Posted: **Wed May 13, 2020 8:18 am**

Sloonei can you give other items besides temporary BTSC? If so, what? And what did you try to give to me and dunya? (Again, assuming all of this doesn't relate to earning jiggies. If it does, don't answer.)

The Syndicate

Banjo-Kazooie Mafia [GAME OVER]

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