The Syndicate

Syn wrote: ↑Thu Mar 11, 2021 5:23 pm

Hyena wrote: ↑Thu Mar 11, 2021 5:22 pm Wait, is Dizzy one of Alison's bargainees?

yes

roleblock

Hyena wrote: ↑Thu Mar 11, 2021 5:26 pm

Syn wrote: ↑Thu Mar 11, 2021 5:23 pm

Hyena wrote: ↑Thu Mar 11, 2021 5:22 pm Wait, is Dizzy one of Alison's bargainees?

yes

roleblock

So, then, Dizzy isn't an option if we're trying to help Alison, right?

Alison wrote: ↑Wed Mar 10, 2021 11:53 am If you exe a non bargainee and hit mafia, I lose 4/4, unless tutuu accepts my bargain.

If you no exe and mafia kills a bargainee, and they're outed tomorrow like has been planned, I lose 3/4 even if mafia is a non-bargainee.

If you no exe and mafia kills a non bargainee and is outed, I win 4/3 if they're a non bargainee.

If you exe a non bargainee and hit town, and mafia kills a non bargainee, I win 4/3.

If you exe a non bargainee and hit town and mafia kills a bargainee I lose.

So no matter what I should rand my protect between bargainees (probably weighted by how juicy a kill they are for mafia) tonight. If tutuu would kindly accept my bargain, I have more assurance of winning, otherwise my win condition is essentially determined by the actions of other people (if you choose to exe/nightkill bargainees or non bargainees)

Dyslexicon wrote: ↑Thu Mar 11, 2021 2:54 pm Apart from just being obv town the most concrete reason based on facts in the thread is this:

For me to be scum you would have to believe that
- I have a 1-shot super protect role as mafia. This role is confirmed via Wilgy.
- I used that 1-shot protect on Nutella, confirmed town and likely to be a target N3. It’s confirmed that I did this via Martin, since his actions was half disrupted. Only my action could have done that.
- If your argument then is “you targeted Nut to gain town cred”, then that is impossible. I would not know at all that my role would interact with Martin in the way it did and thus be able to confirm that I targeted Nut indeed. That was pure coincidence.
- I claimed my role partly immediately when Martin explained what had happened to his actions. I did this because I knew this meant Martin was telling the truth and it cleared him for me. Martin was getting heat in the thread at that time and I outed my info only to back up Martin who I strongly believed to be town. I would have absolutely no incentive or need to do that as mafia, but every incentive to do it as town. (We also know some mafia tried to go for Martin as an easy target, which was in fact one of the things that ticked me off about Sloonei, who I felt should know better.
- Today I’ve come in with info that I believe clears two players reasonably (jpic and Michelle). I gave Michelle the opportunity to lie (if mafia) or tell the truth. She chose neither, but I feel she could’ve used her role to kill our outed cop or something at an earlier point in any case, and I’ve liked her handling of it. Jpic can only be mafia with someone who did the kill instead of him. Very very unlikely imo.
- I came up with a plan that would actually lock the game in a win AND give us control over Alison while at the same time allowing her to win if she is telling the full truth. Turns out it doesn’t work because mafia can holster (rip), but the intent should be clear.

If anyone cares. Actually they should. And explain around it if they still want to “scum read” me. That I’ve seen three people mention I’m top suspect is abysmal. I’m a pretty likely NK target because of the block if game doesn’t end. I would like to plan who I block with the whole of town, but I can’t because of this new plan. Would still like opinions on who I should block.

Hyena wrote: ↑Thu Mar 11, 2021 4:32 pm

Dyslexicon wrote: ↑Thu Mar 11, 2021 4:11 pm Inb4 Alison/Tutu 3p team.

Tinfoils getting tinfoilier.

This ^ is why I keep suspecting you. You made the same post ("getting cold feet") on Tim and 112 before they flipped non-mafia.

Justplayingitcool wrote: ↑Thu Mar 11, 2021 5:36 pm

Dyslexicon wrote: ↑Thu Mar 11, 2021 2:54 pm Apart from just being obv town the most concrete reason based on facts in the thread is this:

For me to be scum you would have to believe that
- I have a 1-shot super protect role as mafia. This role is confirmed via Wilgy.
- I used that 1-shot protect on Nutella, confirmed town and likely to be a target N3. It’s confirmed that I did this via Martin, since his actions was half disrupted. Only my action could have done that.
- If your argument then is “you targeted Nut to gain town cred”, then that is impossible. I would not know at all that my role would interact with Martin in the way it did and thus be able to confirm that I targeted Nut indeed. That was pure coincidence.
- I claimed my role partly immediately when Martin explained what had happened to his actions. I did this because I knew this meant Martin was telling the truth and it cleared him for me. Martin was getting heat in the thread at that time and I outed my info only to back up Martin who I strongly believed to be town. I would have absolutely no incentive or need to do that as mafia, but every incentive to do it as town. (We also know some mafia tried to go for Martin as an easy target, which was in fact one of the things that ticked me off about Sloonei, who I felt should know better.
- Today I’ve come in with info that I believe clears two players reasonably (jpic and Michelle). I gave Michelle the opportunity to lie (if mafia) or tell the truth. She chose neither, but I feel she could’ve used her role to kill our outed cop or something at an earlier point in any case, and I’ve liked her handling of it. Jpic can only be mafia with someone who did the kill instead of him. Very very unlikely imo.
- I came up with a plan that would actually lock the game in a win AND give us control over Alison while at the same time allowing her to win if she is telling the full truth. Turns out it doesn’t work because mafia can holster (rip), but the intent should be clear.

If anyone cares. Actually they should. And explain around it if they still want to “scum read” me. That I’ve seen three people mention I’m top suspect is abysmal. I’m a pretty likely NK target because of the block if game doesn’t end. I would like to plan who I block with the whole of town, but I can’t because of this new plan. Would still like opinions on who I should block.

@Hyena - please provide your counterpoints on why you think dizzy is scum

Dyslexicon wrote: ↑Thu Mar 11, 2021 5:36 pm

Hyena wrote: ↑Thu Mar 11, 2021 4:32 pm

Dyslexicon wrote: ↑Thu Mar 11, 2021 4:11 pm Inb4 Alison/Tutu 3p team.

Tinfoils getting tinfoilier.

This ^ is why I keep suspecting you. You made the same post ("getting cold feet") on Tim and 112 before they flipped non-mafia.

Yeah, so then now you’ve met me. Hi.
If you paid attention you could town me. Your choice

Justplayingitcool wrote: ↑Thu Mar 11, 2021 5:35 pm As funny as it would be to hero shoot, I think shooting in the PoE is probably better.

Out of all the "confirmed" people in the game, here is who I trust from most to least

Kyle
tutuu
dizzy
lc

Hyena wrote: ↑Thu Mar 11, 2021 5:38 pm

Justplayingitcool wrote: ↑Thu Mar 11, 2021 5:36 pm

Dyslexicon wrote: ↑Thu Mar 11, 2021 2:54 pm Apart from just being obv town the most concrete reason based on facts in the thread is this:

For me to be scum you would have to believe that
- I have a 1-shot super protect role as mafia. This role is confirmed via Wilgy.
- I used that 1-shot protect on Nutella, confirmed town and likely to be a target N3. It’s confirmed that I did this via Martin, since his actions was half disrupted. Only my action could have done that.
- If your argument then is “you targeted Nut to gain town cred”, then that is impossible. I would not know at all that my role would interact with Martin in the way it did and thus be able to confirm that I targeted Nut indeed. That was pure coincidence.
- I claimed my role partly immediately when Martin explained what had happened to his actions. I did this because I knew this meant Martin was telling the truth and it cleared him for me. Martin was getting heat in the thread at that time and I outed my info only to back up Martin who I strongly believed to be town. I would have absolutely no incentive or need to do that as mafia, but every incentive to do it as town. (We also know some mafia tried to go for Martin as an easy target, which was in fact one of the things that ticked me off about Sloonei, who I felt should know better.
- Today I’ve come in with info that I believe clears two players reasonably (jpic and Michelle). I gave Michelle the opportunity to lie (if mafia) or tell the truth. She chose neither, but I feel she could’ve used her role to kill our outed cop or something at an earlier point in any case, and I’ve liked her handling of it. Jpic can only be mafia with someone who did the kill instead of him. Very very unlikely imo.
- I came up with a plan that would actually lock the game in a win AND give us control over Alison while at the same time allowing her to win if she is telling the full truth. Turns out it doesn’t work because mafia can holster (rip), but the intent should be clear.

If anyone cares. Actually they should. And explain around it if they still want to “scum read” me. That I’ve seen three people mention I’m top suspect is abysmal. I’m a pretty likely NK target because of the block if game doesn’t end. I would like to plan who I block with the whole of town, but I can’t because of this new plan. Would still like opinions on who I should block.

@Hyena - please provide your counterpoints on why you think dizzy is scum

Why? I'm getting chopped today if Michelle doesn't hero shoot. And, by the looks of it, Alison doesn't want to go after Dizzy anyway, soooo we're going with my original plan of Michelle shooting me and Syn using my ability to clear himself.

Michelle wrote: ↑Thu Mar 11, 2021 5:39 pm

Justplayingitcool wrote: ↑Thu Mar 11, 2021 5:35 pm As funny as it would be to hero shoot, I think shooting in the PoE is probably better.

Out of all the "confirmed" people in the game, here is who I trust from most to least

Kyle
tutuu
dizzy
lc

There is no such thing as fun in the hero shot I would want, but I want it to be in fact a consensus shot of Syn, Hyena, you and me.

Michelle wrote: ↑Thu Mar 11, 2021 5:39 pm

Justplayingitcool wrote: ↑Thu Mar 11, 2021 5:35 pm As funny as it would be to hero shoot, I think shooting in the PoE is probably better.

Out of all the "confirmed" people in the game, here is who I trust from most to least

Kyle
tutuu
dizzy
lc

There is no such thing as fun in the hero shot I would want, but I want it to be in fact a consensus shot of Syn, Hyena, you and me.

Justplayingitcool wrote: ↑Thu Mar 11, 2021 5:41 pm And by that, if you flip town and I am alive to tell the tale, then I will take into consideration

Hyena wrote: ↑Thu Mar 11, 2021 5:42 pm

Justplayingitcool wrote: ↑Thu Mar 11, 2021 5:41 pm And by that, if you flip town and I am alive to tell the tale, then I will take into consideration

I've already stated countless times why I think Dizzy is scum. You have to ignore the mechanics.

Dyslexicon wrote: ↑Thu Mar 11, 2021 5:43 pm Not totally caught up. But hold the phone.

No. We are not killing Hyena. I strongly believe they are town. Do not do it.

LC saying that Hyena's plan clears Syn is absolutely wrong! It doesn't at all. Where did that come from?

Obviously, mafia can kill and use an action at the same time, that is totally normal in every game, and we know Ted did that.

If LC should track someone the only logical thing to do is for that person to NOT MAKE AN ACTION. Only that way can they be cleared.

Hello???

Justplayingitcool wrote: ↑Thu Mar 11, 2021 5:43 pm

Hyena wrote: ↑Thu Mar 11, 2021 5:42 pm

Justplayingitcool wrote: ↑Thu Mar 11, 2021 5:41 pm And by that, if you flip town and I am alive to tell the tale, then I will take into consideration

I've already stated countless times why I think Dizzy is scum. You have to ignore the mechanics.

Just say it again for me please, and counteracting each point

Dyslexicon wrote: ↑Thu Mar 11, 2021 5:46 pm It doesn't matter why Hyena thinks I'm scum. They just made it up for themselves and it's stuck. It happens. But I think they believe it. I really really don't read Hyena as scum here when they are trying to come up with a (logically extremely flawed) plan to try and clear Syn and trying to die themselves. They aren't scum.

I'm going to read more and see how Syn reacts to this.

Hyena wrote: ↑Thu Mar 11, 2021 5:44 pm

Dyslexicon wrote: ↑Thu Mar 11, 2021 5:43 pm Not totally caught up. But hold the phone.

No. We are not killing Hyena. I strongly believe they are town. Do not do it.

LC saying that Hyena's plan clears Syn is absolutely wrong! It doesn't at all. Where did that come from?

Obviously, mafia can kill and use an action at the same time, that is totally normal in every game, and we know Ted did that.

If LC should track someone the only logical thing to do is for that person to NOT MAKE AN ACTION. Only that way can they be cleared.

Hello???

If you don't chop me today, I'm not hearing any sort of argument from you that I'm possibly scum tomorrow or thereafter. I'm done being the designated last chop needed for mafia to win. Either do it now, or never.

Michelle wrote: ↑Thu Mar 11, 2021 5:46 pm Okay, so Hyena is?
@Hyena @Justplayingitcool @Syn
I will submit if you confirm and go to bed.

Dizzy. give a big thanks to Alison, my scum team is you and tutuu or Long Con and tutuu. Because you realised i am town only after you understood my power of today, i take it as pocketing. Or maybe is you and LC

Inb4 tutuu, Alison, kyle, LC and Dizzy are forming the second mafia team and Ted was the last of his team.
In this case we lost long ago

Dyslexicon wrote: ↑Thu Mar 11, 2021 5:44 pm Hyena is town. @Michelle Do not kill Hyena please-

Hyena holy shit can you just stop. If not just stop talking about me at all and vote me. It hurts my eyes.

Hyena wrote: ↑Thu Mar 11, 2021 5:47 pm

Dyslexicon wrote: ↑Thu Mar 11, 2021 5:46 pm It doesn't matter why Hyena thinks I'm scum. They just made it up for themselves and it's stuck. It happens. But I think they believe it. I really really don't read Hyena as scum here when they are trying to come up with a (logically extremely flawed) plan to try and clear Syn and trying to die themselves. They aren't scum.

I'm going to read more and see how Syn reacts to this.

How is it logically flawed? Explain it to me.

Dyslexicon wrote: ↑Thu Mar 11, 2021 3:43 pm It’s either Hyena or Alison.

Hyena wrote: ↑Thu Mar 11, 2021 5:47 pmHow is it logically flawed? Explain it to me.

Dyslexicon wrote: ↑Thu Mar 11, 2021 5:50 pm

Hyena wrote: ↑Thu Mar 11, 2021 5:47 pmHow is it logically flawed? Explain it to me.

Your plan is to give Syn your power, so that Syn can target a dead and alive player and be tracked? Yes?
What good would that do? Syn could kill at the same time as he uses your power. He could kill the "live person" he targets with your power, so double target them so it won't show up on a track.

In any case. He doesn't need your power to be tracked. If we should track someone to clear them they should not do an action at all. Only that would be clearing. If you want to clear Syn: Have him do no action and track him.

You don't need to die for us to track Syn. That doesn't make any sense.

Dyslexicon wrote: ↑Thu Mar 11, 2021 5:50 pm

Hyena wrote: ↑Thu Mar 11, 2021 5:47 pmHow is it logically flawed? Explain it to me.

Your plan is to give Syn your power, so that Syn can target a dead and alive player and be tracked? Yes?
What good would that do? Syn could kill at the same time as he uses your power. He could kill the "live person" he targets with your power, so double target them so it won't show up on a track.

In any case. He doesn't need your power to be tracked. If we should track someone to clear them they should not do an action at all. Only that would be clearing. If you want to clear Syn: Have him do no action and track him.

You don't need to die for us to track Syn. That doesn't make any sense.

Hyena wrote: ↑Thu Mar 11, 2021 5:50 pm

Dyslexicon wrote: ↑Thu Mar 11, 2021 3:43 pm It’s either Hyena or Alison.

I like it when people defend me like this.

Syn wrote: ↑Thu Mar 11, 2021 5:52 pmthat's why I'd be giving a chat to LC in this scenario

LC can't die

Hyena wrote: ↑Thu Mar 11, 2021 5:52 pmI thought mafia can't kill if they use their ability instead? Isn't that why we've been trying to use the tracker to clear town?

Dyslexicon wrote: ↑Thu Mar 11, 2021 5:54 pm

Hyena wrote: ↑Thu Mar 11, 2021 5:50 pm

Dyslexicon wrote: ↑Thu Mar 11, 2021 3:43 pm It’s either Hyena or Alison.

I like it when people defend me like this.

This is my whole problem. I've said it all the time now jeez. I don't scum read anyone in thread. This is why I'm worried about Alison, but nobody is. You weren't in thread and Syn was insisting on dying, so you were the only one left that made any sense to me (but event that has never sat right with me) When you started posting now, I'm once again convinced you are town.

This is me, I don't care if you don't like it. I change my mind, and now it's crunch time and I believe your reaction here is real. It has never sat right with me that you are scum either. And you have to actually be here in order to be read.

I really don't care to have a discussion with you were you are going to go "gotcha" with me like this because of your "gut" read. I'm very very over it.

Justplayingitcool wrote: ↑Thu Mar 11, 2021 5:56 pm lol, i still think dizzy is town

Hyena wrote: ↑Thu Mar 11, 2021 5:57 pmAnd I said, when I returned to the thread earlier, that I don't have the energy any more to play. What you got this dayphase is what you're going to get the next dayphase and thereafter, if not worse. Thus, if you're suspicious of it now and you're going to be suspicious of it later, then maybe you need to chop me today rather than wait until later.

Dyslexicon wrote: ↑Thu Mar 11, 2021 5:59 pm

Justplayingitcool wrote: ↑Thu Mar 11, 2021 5:56 pm lol, i still think dizzy is town

I'm like fucking pissed and in disbelief this is even a question right now. Like for real. I wish I was in a position to have people kill me I'd be so up for that right now.

I don't like the idea of killing Hyena here. If they are scum I suck at reading people, but I really really don't think so.
Killing Syn is hardly a better option. Maybe. I will quickly catch up to his reaction to Hyena taking over for him. It's possible he did a fancy ass play, but to be honest, I feel there are far far more arguments for Syn is just town here.

If I'm lucky, Alison wins and I can say told you so.

I don't know what to do in this scenario. I really don't.

Dyslexicon wrote: ↑Thu Mar 11, 2021 6:01 pm Actually, I don't really blame the "scum reads" on me, but I feel everyone should be able to tell how fucking insanely grasping at straws that is. There's a very very very clear line of reasoning why I'm always town here if anyone actually BOTHERS reading it and thinking it through. So if that is the best people can come up with now, then something is seriously fucked here.

Hyena wrote: ↑Thu Mar 11, 2021 6:00 pm

Dyslexicon wrote: ↑Thu Mar 11, 2021 5:59 pm

Justplayingitcool wrote: ↑Thu Mar 11, 2021 5:56 pm lol, i still think dizzy is town

I'm like fucking pissed and in disbelief this is even a question right now. Like for real. I wish I was in a position to have people kill me I'd be so up for that right now.

I don't like the idea of killing Hyena here. If they are scum I suck at reading people, but I really really don't think so.
Killing Syn is hardly a better option. Maybe. I will quickly catch up to his reaction to Hyena taking over for him. It's possible he did a fancy ass play, but to be honest, I feel there are far far more arguments for Syn is just town here.

If I'm lucky, Alison wins and I can say told you so.

I don't know what to do in this scenario. I really don't.

Why don't we just chop Alison? Why aren't we doing this?

Hyena wrote: ↑Thu Mar 11, 2021 6:00 pmWhy don't we just chop Alison? Why aren't we doing this?