Watchmen [ENDGAME]

[LoRab]

Until I just read MP's list, I kind of forgot LC was playing. So I checked the who's posted thingie, and he only has 1 post (only other person with 1 post, btw, is K-nuk, who isn't playing). And here's his 1 post:

If we are going to consider a policy lynch of any sort for Day 1, why not the person with the lowest posts?

You mean the player whose posts can be read with the deepest voice or the player who writes the low-down meanest posts?

I believe the word you are looking for is fewest.

G-Man is now on my list of people that I will not vote for on Day 1.

linki- are we doing a Golden Day 1 lynch? Is that what we're doing?

Statistics tell me leaving Golden alive is always bad for town. Never played a game where he didn't destroy the fuck out of the poor civs.

If it wasn't for Golden, the civilians wouldn't have won Biblical or Roger Rabbit, so... I can provide counterexamples for practically every example.

Is anyone here seriously considering a policy lynch option for Day 1? I just don't think it's wise.

Hey- Golden had a LOT of help behind the scenes. Never forget that. He was right and I was wrong about the final baddie but my lists helped serve up at least two baddies- one of which I handed to Golden on a silver platter from beyond the grave. I'd like to think that he would have had a much harder time winning that game without my help.

I will not stand for a closed-minded town on Day 1.

Then take a seat.

For the record... I was taking it all in stride. As in, I thought that everyone was pretty much joking, but I saw the potential for any of them to make it real just for fun as well. Although Metalmarsh and Golden are survival buddies right now, so I doubt either of them are inclined to lynch unless they're pretty convinced.

Anywho, I'll vote for Rorschach's Journal, because Rorschach is my favourite part of a story made of awesome parts. This quote I quoted is where I have read up to at this point, be back later.

Ironic that his first comment is on a comment (an awesome comment, btw) about fewest posts. Which manages to comment on the matter without commenting on the matter.

As importantly, he manages to say he will not vote for G-Man without having to defend him. Given the fact that I suspect G-Man, this strikes me as suspicious.

And the bulk of his post is about another game--nothing wrong with that in and of itself, but he barely makes comment on this game. Which isn't really like him.

I am still suspicious of G Man. But LC has just moved up on my suspiciometer (I guess I have 2 suspects now, lol). And I hope he posts more. I may throw him a vote just to get him to post more.

[Marmot]

So did anyone get anything from the day zero poll?

I did not.

I did.

ping on ninja's long post...

Her finding llama's adverb idea 'interesting' and suggesting she might be willing to vote sloonei, that whole latter part of her post felt quite bandwaggony to me and not quite sincere.

The opening segment, apologizing for a long post, bothered me more-so.

Epi do you consider saying " I'm a civ" to be role claiming or info dumping?

Golly, I hope not. Every player strives to look like a civilian, and saying so should not be against the rules.

But I know you would never hear Epignosis say it as a player.

[Ricochet]

So did anyone get anything from the day zero poll?

I did not.

I did.

Anything you can share with us?

[Marmot]

So did anyone get anything from the day zero poll?

I did not.

I did.

Anything you can share with us?

No.

[Scotty]

So did anyone get anything from the day zero poll?

I did not.

I did.

Anything you can share with us?

No.

There's the MM I remember from BoB. Intentionally vague and unhelpful when questioned about outside information.

Why even comment about it at all?

[Scotty]

If espers shows up, I want to know if he (she?) also received something, since they both voted for Manhattan's lab.

Bathroom break over, back to work.

[Marmot]

So did anyone get anything from the day zero poll?

I did not.

I did.

Anything you can share with us?

No.

There's the MM I remember from BoB. Intentionally vague and unhelpful when questioned about outside information.

Why even comment about it at all?

I want to see who else benefited from the poll and what I think of them.

Linki: That too, and I think espers is a he?

[Ricochet]

Did anyone else notice how Elo seemingly jumped onto a vibes-based suspicion of Sloonei (which I held), and then dropped it, after I dropped it? What do folks think of that? I'm not sure what to make of Elo right now.

It did stand out to me that she worded her suspicion roughly the same way you did, yes. Her backing out was also far less elaborate or reasoned than yours (which followed after some dialogue with Sloonei, at least): from "Just something about him reads scummy to me. Can't put my finger on it." to "I am failing to find anything that sticks out to me as scummy." with not even a post in between.

linki: I also await to see if espers got anything, due to the voting connection.

[Marmot]

Post Links complete with gender coloring (Female/Male).

Bass_the_Clever - Posts
Cookie - Posts
DharmaHelper - Posts
Dragon D. Luffy - Posts
Elohcin - Posts
espers - Posts
G-Man - Posts
Golden - Posts
Long Con - Posts
LoRab - Posts
Metalmarsh89 - Posts
MovingPictures07 - Posts
nijuukyugou - Posts
Ricochet - Posts
Russtifinko - Posts
Scotty - Posts
Sloonei - Posts
thellama73 - Posts
timmer - Posts

[Marmot]

EBWOP: I don't actually know Scotty's gender, but I listed Scotty as male, mainly because of the name.

[DharmaHelper]

Now begins my daily catch up..

[Marmot]

Why is everyone so hyped up on the lie-detector thing? As far as I know, there is only one role that can lie-detect, and even that role (Night Owl II) can only use it once in the game. Also, Epignosis is hosting this game, so I don't believe a lie detector would be permitted to check any of the statements made in this post.

[Sloonei]

I don't suspect Sloonei for the adverbs, but there's something off about him I can't quite put my finger on, though it's possible I am way off the mark here. He's playing to his meta, but he has made a couple of statements that have struck me as him trying too hard to meet his own meta.

I know that allegation sucks, since I've been hit with it before, and it's what sunk Golden in economics because the baddies wanted him gone, but I have pointed out a couple of posts previously, and for now I'm going to take a backseat and let the Day develop while I get some stuff done, so I'm officially pushing Sloonei back to my no read section.

I missed this before. Although you've expressed a slight change of mind since (or right here in the same post), I'd still like to know where this suspicion comes from. Which particular posts/statements gave you these vibes about me?

[Marmot]

I have also decided to combine gun-to-head reads with the Rainbow Lists to create my own Smiley-Infused list. I wrote each players name down, put them into a hat, shook it up, and began selecting names. As I drew names, I would gun-to-head assign a different smiley to each player. Here is my outcome.

Bass_the_Clever
Cookie
DharmaHelper
Dragon D. Luffy
Elohcin
espers
G-Man
Golden
Long Con
LoRab
Metalmarsh89
MovingPictures07
nijuukyugou
Ricochet
Russtifinko
Scotty
Sloonei
thellama73
timmer

[Ricochet]

^So you're buddying up to Golden?

[Golden]

I wonder what llama would have to say about all those smilies.

[Marmot]

I wonder what llama would have to say about all those smilies.

I thought about including a different adverb for each player as well.

Epignosis, is this a standard lynch poll we are voting in today?

[espers]

I didn't receive anything from the day 0 poll.

catching up with the rest of the thread now.

[Sloonei]

I have to go to work in a moment, and at this point the two strongest "pings" I've got have been frok Elo and Ninja.
Elo for how quickly she stated and abandoned a suspicion against me. She first listed me and G-man as her two early suspects. I very simply asked her to explain her suspicion of me and her response was essentially "never mind, i'm not suspicious of you." I can see this as a player (Elo) who wanted to cast suspicion on a vocal player (me) for the sake of having a suspect, but when I pressed her on it she was not prepared to back it up.

Ninja for that one big post of hers. I am not happy that the two people I've narrowed my vote down to have a combined 7 posts between them. But in ninja's posts she provided a wishy-washy fence-sitting read on G-man and also gave a suggested some pretty empty support of llama and the "adverb/smiley" theory without offering more of her own opinion beyond "I don't like Day 1s." I would like to hear a lot more from ninja on some reads and I know she is a capable player, but for now I think she's the player I feel most comfortable voting for, so I'm voting Ninjajuju.

This has been a pretty solid Day 1 but it still feels like there's a lot of people who have yet to weigh in. I hope to get some more voices in this discussion before he day's end, but I will not be able to take part in it. If anyone is having trouble coming up with things to say, just post the first thoughts that come to mind when you look at the thread. Literally anything is better than not posting.

[Sloonei]

I have also decided to combine gun-to-head reads with the Rainbow Lists to create my own Smiley-Infused list. I wrote each players name down, put them into a hat, shook it up, and began selecting names. As I drew names, I would gun-to-head assign a different smiley to each player. Here is my outcome.

Bass_the_Clever
Cookie
DharmaHelper
Dragon D. Luffy
Elohcin
espers
G-Man
Golden
Long Con
LoRab
Metalmarsh89
MovingPictures07
nijuukyugou
Ricochet
Russtifinko
Scotty
Sloonei
thellama73
timmer

am i canadian? :o
I see now that i am, hot damn

[Marmot]

I have to go to work in a moment, and at this point the two strongest "pings" I've got have been frok Elo and Ninja.
Elo for how quickly she stated and abandoned a suspicion against me. She first listed me and G-man as her two early suspects. I very simply asked her to explain her suspicion of me and her response was essentially "never mind, i'm not suspicious of you." I can see this as a player (Elo) who wanted to cast suspicion on a vocal player (me) for the sake of having a suspect, but when I pressed her on it she was not prepared to back it up.

MP commented on this as well, but perhaps you will see it later.

[Golden]

OK, so, here is my question in relation to people's Elo suspicion.

Do people agree, or disagree, with her assertion that DDL seems comfortable?

[Marmot]

I didn't receive anything from the day 0 poll.

catching up with the rest of the thread now.

That's interesting.

Linki: Let me take a look.

[Ricochet]

OK, so, here is my question in relation to people's Elo suspicion.

Do people agree, or disagree, with her assertion that DDL seems comfortable?

I can't say I understood too well what she meant by "comfortable", not to mention "too comfortable to be Mafia". Is it what Scotty said, i.e. laidback and responding with ease to heat?

[Sloonei]

Some other quick thoughts I have:
I have expressed vague support of G-man, but I don't necessarily have him as a town read. That said, I don't support any of the cases I have seen made against him thus far. That does not mean he should not be looked at further.

I do not wish to OMGUS thellama, but I find his case against me to be a bit weak and that is something that could become suspicious down the line, depending on how it progresses, but for now it's too early to make a judgment.

I am now 10 minutes late for work, woohoo

[Epignosis]

Epignosis, is this a standard lynch poll we are voting in today?

No. It's for a resurrection.

Jesus.

[Marmot]

Epignosis, is this a standard lynch poll we are voting in today?

No. It's for a resurrection.

Jesus.

I just wanted to be clear.

[Ricochet]

Some other quick thoughts I have:
I have expressed vague support of G-man, but I don't necessarily have him as a town read. That said, I don't support any of the cases I have seen made against him thus far. That does not mean he should not be looked at further.

I do not wish to OMGUS thellama, but I find his case against me to be a bit weak and that is something that could become suspicious down the line, depending on how it progresses, but for now it's too early to make a judgment.

I am now 10 minutes late for work, woohoo

Hmm, really? Only "vague support"? I'd say it more than that. This slightly feels like a fine tuning, for some reason.

[Marmot]

OK, so, here is my question in relation to people's Elo suspicion.

Do people agree, or disagree, with her assertion that DDL seems comfortable?

I would agree.

Looking over DDL's posts, he has enjoyed partaking in a lot of banter, and using a lot of smiley-smilies, such as and .

So yes, he certainly enjoys that, but he's not the only one. I don't think the choice of words incriminates Elohcin.

[Dragon D. Luffy]

I had a full day and now I have almost 5 pages to catch up. I'll see what I can do.

If we are going to consider a policy lynch of any sort for Day 1, why not the person with the lowest posts?

You mean the player whose posts can be read with the deepest voice or the player who writes the low-down meanest posts?

I believe the word you are looking for is fewest.

How did we not have a "reading posts in deep voices" contest in Economics?

Looking at you, DDL.

You could have suggested it to me too.

In response to MP's points toward me (my laptop is old and terrible and doing this thing where it takes a half hour just to start up, and I don't feel like waiting for that just so I can format a post more easily, so this is a messy phoned-in attempt at a post), I have so far only played with a G-man that is completely light and playful in all his posts (due to those reasons I mentioned earlier), so when I came in to the thread on Day 0 and saw him being perhaps the most active person in leading the discussion, regardless of how serious he says it was at the time, it was a very noticeable change in style for him. It is too minor a point to earn him a townie label just yet, but it was the strongest read I got in any direction after 3 pages of activity. "Sincere" was probably not the right word. "Active" or "aggressive"' would have been more accurate. I will hold off on commenting on the actual content of his posts until there's more of it.

Also I never expressed my suspicion of you while you were in BoB, I only mentioned it after Epi had subbed in for you. I can't find any of the posts (i made a lot of them in that game), but my point was essentially that I felt like your response to the fake truce banter on Day 0 felt a bit too preemptively defensive. Your behavior here reminded me vaguely of that.

I've played with G-Man on Guess Who and he reall really one of the most active people. He was town in that game too.

[Golden]

OK, so, here is my question in relation to people's Elo suspicion.

Do people agree, or disagree, with her assertion that DDL seems comfortable?

I can't say I understood too well what she meant by "comfortable", not to mention "too comfortable to be Mafia". Is it what Scotty said, i.e. laidback and responding with ease to heat?

Just your gut instinct would be fine - does DDL seem comfortable to YOU, as opposed to defining what Elo means.

[Marmot]

I have to leave for work, so I will vote now so to not risk missing the deadline.

I will vote nijuukyugou, but in reality I don't have any strong baddie reads on anyone.

[Ricochet]

OK, so, here is my question in relation to people's Elo suspicion.

Do people agree, or disagree, with her assertion that DDL seems comfortable?

I can't say I understood too well what she meant by "comfortable", not to mention "too comfortable to be Mafia". Is it what Scotty said, i.e. laidback and responding with ease to heat?

Just your gut instinct would be fine - does DDL seem comfortable to YOU, as opposed to defining what Elo means.

Comfortable doesn't mean anything to me, in terms of reading his/an alignment. But in terms of a comfortable playing, I'm seeing a more relaxed and jesting DDL compared to Guess Who, where he was more focused from the very start. But he was also bussed by his teammate before being suspected by others there, which busts a bit any meta read on him for me tbh.

[Bass_the_Clever]

Scotty why are you waiting to vote?

[Tangrowth]

Alright, I'm here. Who's around to discuss? I'm catching up now, shouldn't take long.

[LoRab]

I'm around...voting either GMan or possibly LC

[Tangrowth]

Okay, awesome. I'd like to bounce off of whoever is around, since I'm trying to sort through everything that's going on and all of the names being thrown around. Give me just a few minutes and I'll shoot off a couple of posts here.

[Golden]

OK, at this point I will say what I think.

I think Elo's read on DDL was genuine, and it makes me feel good about her.

DDL expressed in our chat room that he found being mafia difficult, particularly on this site, and we all essentially agreed that he was getting caught and looked bad because you could sense he wasn't as comfortable in the thread. Elo is aware of this because she was in that chat room.

From my perspective, her reading DDL as good because he seems comfortable is legit, based on how things went down in Guess Who.

That doesn't mean DDL is good, of course, but I do think Elo's read was legitimate and it made me feel good about her.

[Golden]

For the avoidance of doubt, I am not 'around' - I am exceedingly busy at work. I'm just catching up in any spare moment. But feel free to ask me questions, just don't expect a nice bouncy surface.

[Tangrowth]

LoRab, interesting point re: LC. He's not a no show, and we don't have any in this game, but he's the closest we have to one for sure. How long do you have to vote? How long are you willing to give LC a chance to post? What do you think of G-Man, ninja, and Sloonei?

Rico, thanks for answering. I'm glad I wasn't the only one who thought that, I figured maybe I was just being paranoid. I'm not sure what to make of it. Do you have any thoughts on Elo re: alignment and experience with her?

Scotty, you say such behavior makes MM unhelpful. Do you think it means he is mafia?

Metalmarsh, good point about the lie detector. That's something to keep in mind. I'm curious what G-Man will have to say when he has the chance to grace us with his presence once more.

Sloonei, I will gladly elaborate on the couple of posts I have noted as feeding my earlier very slight suspicion. Check out my post here. I noted one post I thought sounded forced, and later elucidated in a post here that it seemed like you were 'trying too hard' to fit your meta, but realized that was a difficult-to-defend and sucky allegation. Also, in that post I first linked, I asked you regarding you finding me suspicious early in BoB, and I was a bit disappointed and pinged by your inability to back up your claim, since I was thinking you meant while I was in the game (not Epi 2.0), but I was willing to chalk it up to "fair enough". Consequently, I do not suspect you, even very slightly, at this time. I think what I might be detecting in your behavior that's different here is that you were a bit more aggressive in Economics. Do you agree with that assertion?

I'll ISO you at some point if I feel so inclined; if I have specific points for you to address further, I'll let you know.

Everyone: what do you all think of this post by Sloonei? What do they think of the suspicions he cast against Elo and ninja? Does anyone think that Sloonei seemed more likely to vote for Elo or more likely to vote for ninja, at the time of his post (i.e., does his vote being cast for ninja seem logical, or do you believe he had a higher propensity to cast a vote for Elo, and thus you're left wondering, why ninja?) ?

I'll post again in a bit here.

[Tangrowth]

OK, so, here is my question in relation to people's Elo suspicion.

Do people agree, or disagree, with her assertion that DDL seems comfortable?

I think I agree, if I had to choose. DDL seems, like he did in Economics, willing to say whatever is on his mind, as if he has nothing to lose. In Guess Who?, he did seem more tense.

So I'll agree with your assessment here:

OK, at this point I will say what I think.

I think Elo's read on DDL was genuine, and it makes me feel good about her.

DDL expressed in our chat room that he found being mafia difficult, particularly on this site, and we all essentially agreed that he was getting caught and looked bad because you could sense he wasn't as comfortable in the thread. Elo is aware of this because she was in that chat room.

From my perspective, her reading DDL as good because he seems comfortable is legit, based on how things went down in Guess Who.

That doesn't mean DDL is good, of course, but I do think Elo's read was legitimate and it made me feel good about her.

Now that you mention it, it does influence my view of Elo. GTH town read, but it'd be very slight. I hope she can elaborate more on her thoughts soon though.

I'm glad you brought this up for discussion, since her calling DDL "comfortable" slipped my radar among the other conversation, and now I've managed to GTH town read another player.

That said, I find it eerie how we're on exactly the same page. Surely we will disagree about something.

[Tangrowth]

Some other quick thoughts I have:
I have expressed vague support of G-man, but I don't necessarily have him as a town read. That said, I don't support any of the cases I have seen made against him thus far. That does not mean he should not be looked at further.

I do not wish to OMGUS thellama, but I find his case against me to be a bit weak and that is something that could become suspicious down the line, depending on how it progresses, but for now it's too early to make a judgment.

I am now 10 minutes late for work, woohoo

Hmm, really? Only "vague support"? I'd say it more than that. This slightly feels like a fine tuning, for some reason.

Do you suspect Sloonei, even slightly, for this? I presume you believe it is a misrepresentation?

[Golden]

Well, I read Sloonei's responses to you differently than you did. I'm not sure which of us is wrong. I thought he was saying it was you he found suspicious in BoB, but he hasn't been able to determine whether or not it is relevant because Epi 2.0 is still alive and we don't know his role.

At this point, I'd say I'm highly likely to vote for Ninja today. The only other real issue I have is with G-Man, and I think I've talked myself out of that. I need to revisit the LoRab stuff about lie detectors more closely before I pursue that.

[Golden]

Also, I have literally zero suspicion of sloonei. I do not yet see any reason to think he is bad and I have not really agreed with any of the cases on him. I think he is the person who looks most at risk of suffering my econ day one fate - someone that no baddie is going to be sad to see lynched because he can be a threat to their chances of success later on. I'm much more wary of those who have simply jumped on the 'sloonei looks bad' bandwagon than I am of sloonei.

[Tangrowth]

Regarding where I am at this moment:

I have very slight suspicions of G-Man and Ninja. That being said, I think a lynch of Ninja right now would be "easy", and I'm consequently hesitant to cast my vote that way, or in G-Man's direction. I'm going to examine the players I have in my No Read section now.

That said, Ninja does have the highest propensity to receive my vote as well, but man, these lynch trains always make me nervous, and they do minimize the information we can gleam in subsequent Days from looking back at this lynch, especially if hardly anyone casts off.

[Ricochet]

Rico, thanks for answering. I'm glad I wasn't the only one who thought that, I figured maybe I was just being paranoid. I'm not sure what to make of it. Do you have any thoughts on Elo re: alignment and experience with her?

Can't say I do. With just four posts, it's mostly the mirroring of your suspicion on Sloonei (and rather poor quality of it) that stands out. I also thought she twisted a bit you saying you'd only support voting a no-shower by asking you if you've never voted for low posters (which is technically not the same thing), but then you gave her a full answer, so maybe it was just me. I'd also agree with Scotty that, for a player who encouraged people to post and play, her current post count is kinda ironic.

linki MP & Golden: well I suppose the comparisons of DDL between Economics, Guess and here and the fact that Eloh might have made a "meta" comment on someone she hosted are fair, but for some reason I never found he was tense on D1 of Guess Who. Then again, I failed to read him as mafia, so shame on me.

linki MP: I am slightly surprised, for sure. I don't think he's backing away from "not supporting the cases" against G-Man, for which I believe she argued against quite actively (and in lieu of G-Man whilst absent, on top of that), but my impression was that he did more than vaguely support him, yes.

linki

linki

linki

OH GOD WILL IT EVER SUBMIT

[Ricochet]

Also, I have literally zero suspicion of sloonei. I do not yet see any reason to think he is bad and I have not really agreed with any of the cases on him. I think he is the person who looks most at risk of suffering my econ day one fate - someone that no baddie is going to be sad to see lynched because he can be a threat to their chances of success later on. I'm much more wary of those who have simply jumped on the 'sloonei looks bad' bandwagon than I am of sloonei.

That includes Elo, though.

[Tangrowth]

Also, I have literally zero suspicion of sloonei. I do not yet see any reason to think he is bad and I have not really agreed with any of the cases on him. I think he is the person who looks most at risk of suffering my econ day one fate - someone that no baddie is going to be sad to see lynched because he can be a threat to their chances of success later on. I'm much more wary of those who have simply jumped on the 'sloonei looks bad' bandwagon than I am of sloonei.

I'm very glad you said this, because that's precisely the reason I backed off of my gut-based suspicion of Sloonei earlier. I started feeling like I was expecting too much of him, realizing that my thoughts on him were exactly "trying too hard to meet meta" and other vague feelings that are not logical or based on actual content. It's the same kind of vague poisonous suspicion that took you down in Economics.

Consequently, I will NOT be voting for Sloonei today.

[Tangrowth]

I really want to hear from Ninja again before even considering a vote in her direction, and I think anyone else that can wait to vote should do the same.

Rico, thanks for your answers; they are appreciated.

[Golden]

Also, I have literally zero suspicion of sloonei. I do not yet see any reason to think he is bad and I have not really agreed with any of the cases on him. I think he is the person who looks most at risk of suffering my econ day one fate - someone that no baddie is going to be sad to see lynched because he can be a threat to their chances of success later on. I'm much more wary of those who have simply jumped on the 'sloonei looks bad' bandwagon than I am of sloonei.

That includes Elo, though.

It does. And I recognise this. If Elo had not brought fresh thoughts to the table in the same post that she jumped on others suspicions, I'd be feeling differently about her right now.