The Syndicate

Urist wrote: ↑Sun Mar 07, 2021 10:34 pm

Long Con wrote: ↑Sun Mar 07, 2021 10:29 pm

tedxtr wrote: ↑Sun Mar 07, 2021 3:15 am so punish the fool seems like a pretty punishing ability for our team.

the best we can probably do is to make scum play whack-a-mole. we all need mana for something...

fix suggestion : everyone should ask for the mana they need (and that's it - just ask for the mana, don't say what it's for or that it needs priority, etc etc), irregardless of how good or bad their ability is.

loop holes : the mafia will target strong people this way, so we're a bit forced to spread the cards to someone they don't need dead. (PoEish targets that can reasonably be town)

my instinct is to say that 3 mana is a bit tough to gather? so let's not try to get caught up in an ability that takes quite a bit to use anyway.

thoughts / concerns about this?

I don't think that 3 mana is tough to gather. I can produce that much mana in a night. I don't know how many lands you have, but I have three. If that's standard, then this is probably somewhere near equivalent to a wolf giving up their personal ability in order to use Punish The Fool.

Actually, this kind of reads like ted is a wolf with 3 lands who thinks that townies start with fewer.
Why would a townie ever say "3 mana is a bit tough to gather" here?

Guillotine wrote: ↑Sun Mar 07, 2021 11:15 pm

hollowkatt wrote: ↑Sun Mar 07, 2021 11:08 pm A isn't always the logical choice yeah? That's the main point of the X to Doubt comment..

Long Con wrote: ↑Sun Mar 07, 2021 11:11 pm

falcon45ca wrote: ↑Sun Mar 07, 2021 11:06 pm

hollowkatt wrote: ↑Sun Mar 07, 2021 9:37 pm

falcon45ca wrote: ↑Sun Mar 07, 2021 9:30 pm

hollowkatt wrote: ↑Sun Mar 07, 2021 9:17 pm With some pressure on Falcon to start doing townie things pretty quickly I think adding some pressure to Urist makes sense here, yes?
I know your sus pool and I'm on board with that.

This is pretty scummy. Note that he supports others reads and encourages putting pressure on other players, but doesn't do so himself.

You mean the vote I have on Urist? I'm sorry, are you feeling peckish because I'm not actively pushing you or something? nah fam. What more pressure do you want than a legit vote? You think I need to case Urist or something?

What exactly is your read on Urist, why are you voting him? What's your read on me, why aren't you pushing me?

That original HK post in this chain doesn't sit right. You don't let someone know that a vote is just a pressure vote before you at least get some reactions from it. If I hear a vote on me is just for pressure, I assume then that it's not for serious, and I feel less pressure.

hollowkatt wrote: ↑Sun Mar 07, 2021 10:58 pm

Long Con wrote: ↑Sun Mar 07, 2021 10:38 pm

Urist wrote: ↑Sun Mar 07, 2021 10:34 pm

Long Con wrote: ↑Sun Mar 07, 2021 10:29 pm

tedxtr wrote: ↑Sun Mar 07, 2021 3:15 am so punish the fool seems like a pretty punishing ability for our team.

the best we can probably do is to make scum play whack-a-mole. we all need mana for something...

fix suggestion : everyone should ask for the mana they need (and that's it - just ask for the mana, don't say what it's for or that it needs priority, etc etc), irregardless of how good or bad their ability is.

loop holes : the mafia will target strong people this way, so we're a bit forced to spread the cards to someone they don't need dead. (PoEish targets that can reasonably be town)

my instinct is to say that 3 mana is a bit tough to gather? so let's not try to get caught up in an ability that takes quite a bit to use anyway.

thoughts / concerns about this?

I don't think that 3 mana is tough to gather. I can produce that much mana in a night. I don't know how many lands you have, but I have three. If that's standard, then this is probably somewhere near equivalent to a wolf giving up their personal ability in order to use Punish The Fool.

Actually, this kind of reads like ted is a wolf with 3 lands who thinks that townies start with fewer.
Why would a townie ever say "3 mana is a bit tough to gather" here?

When I read it with the idea that it "reads like ted is a wolf", tow things jump out at me. One, his use of "instinct" feels wild and wolfy... but that's just for laughs. Two, more serious, he's casually downplaying the concern about this ability.

This is a quote chain to sit on till later, mark my words

Long Con wrote: ↑Sun Mar 07, 2021 11:15 pm

falcon45ca wrote: ↑Sun Mar 07, 2021 11:13 pm

hollowkatt wrote: ↑Sun Mar 07, 2021 11:10 pm

falcon45ca wrote: ↑Sun Mar 07, 2021 11:06 pm

hollowkatt wrote: ↑Sun Mar 07, 2021 9:37 pm

falcon45ca wrote: ↑Sun Mar 07, 2021 9:30 pm

hollowkatt wrote: ↑Sun Mar 07, 2021 9:17 pm With some pressure on Falcon to start doing townie things pretty quickly I think adding some pressure to Urist makes sense here, yes?
I know your sus pool and I'm on board with that.

This is pretty scummy. Note that he supports others reads and encourages putting pressure on other players, but doesn't do so himself.

You mean the vote I have on Urist? I'm sorry, are you feeling peckish because I'm not actively pushing you or something? nah fam. What more pressure do you want than a legit vote? You think I need to case Urist or something?

What exactly is your read on Urist, why are you voting him? What's your read on me, why aren't you pushing me?

My read on Urist is wolf, and that's why I'm voting for him. My read on you is wolfy as well, for the D0 towncore stuff that I thought was nonsensical and unnecessary, and is reinforced by Guillotine who I town read.
I'm not pushing you b/c I'm currently focusing on Urist. Wait your turn.

Joke police and acting like it's scumhunting...now where have I heard this before?

Sounds rhetorical but I feel like there's an answer, which I don't know. Should I?

falcon45ca wrote: ↑Sun Mar 07, 2021 11:13 pm

hollowkatt wrote: ↑Sun Mar 07, 2021 11:10 pm

falcon45ca wrote: ↑Sun Mar 07, 2021 11:06 pm

hollowkatt wrote: ↑Sun Mar 07, 2021 9:37 pm

falcon45ca wrote: ↑Sun Mar 07, 2021 9:30 pm

hollowkatt wrote: ↑Sun Mar 07, 2021 9:17 pm With some pressure on Falcon to start doing townie things pretty quickly I think adding some pressure to Urist makes sense here, yes?
I know your sus pool and I'm on board with that.

This is pretty scummy. Note that he supports others reads and encourages putting pressure on other players, but doesn't do so himself.

You mean the vote I have on Urist? I'm sorry, are you feeling peckish because I'm not actively pushing you or something? nah fam. What more pressure do you want than a legit vote? You think I need to case Urist or something?

What exactly is your read on Urist, why are you voting him? What's your read on me, why aren't you pushing me?

My read on Urist is wolf, and that's why I'm voting for him. My read on you is wolfy as well, for the D0 towncore stuff that I thought was nonsensical and unnecessary, and is reinforced by Guillotine who I town read.
I'm not pushing you b/c I'm currently focusing on Urist. Wait your turn.

Joke police and acting like it's scumhunting...now where have I heard this before?

falcon45ca wrote: ↑Sun Mar 07, 2021 11:16 pm

Urist wrote: ↑Sun Mar 07, 2021 10:34 pm

Long Con wrote: ↑Sun Mar 07, 2021 10:29 pm

tedxtr wrote: ↑Sun Mar 07, 2021 3:15 am so punish the fool seems like a pretty punishing ability for our team.

the best we can probably do is to make scum play whack-a-mole. we all need mana for something...

fix suggestion : everyone should ask for the mana they need (and that's it - just ask for the mana, don't say what it's for or that it needs priority, etc etc), irregardless of how good or bad their ability is.

loop holes : the mafia will target strong people this way, so we're a bit forced to spread the cards to someone they don't need dead. (PoEish targets that can reasonably be town)

my instinct is to say that 3 mana is a bit tough to gather? so let's not try to get caught up in an ability that takes quite a bit to use anyway.

thoughts / concerns about this?

I don't think that 3 mana is tough to gather. I can produce that much mana in a night. I don't know how many lands you have, but I have three. If that's standard, then this is probably somewhere near equivalent to a wolf giving up their personal ability in order to use Punish The Fool.

Actually, this kind of reads like ted is a wolf with 3 lands who thinks that townies start with fewer.
Why would a townie ever say "3 mana is a bit tough to gather" here?

Or the wolves start with fewer than 3 mana each, which if Ted's scum, leads him to believe town also start with fewer than 3?

I have 3 as well, thought Ted assuming it tricky to acquire a bit unusual

falcon45ca wrote: ↑Sun Mar 07, 2021 11:16 pm

Urist wrote: ↑Sun Mar 07, 2021 10:34 pm

Long Con wrote: ↑Sun Mar 07, 2021 10:29 pm

tedxtr wrote: ↑Sun Mar 07, 2021 3:15 am so punish the fool seems like a pretty punishing ability for our team.

the best we can probably do is to make scum play whack-a-mole. we all need mana for something...

fix suggestion : everyone should ask for the mana they need (and that's it - just ask for the mana, don't say what it's for or that it needs priority, etc etc), irregardless of how good or bad their ability is.

loop holes : the mafia will target strong people this way, so we're a bit forced to spread the cards to someone they don't need dead. (PoEish targets that can reasonably be town)

my instinct is to say that 3 mana is a bit tough to gather? so let's not try to get caught up in an ability that takes quite a bit to use anyway.

thoughts / concerns about this?

I don't think that 3 mana is tough to gather. I can produce that much mana in a night. I don't know how many lands you have, but I have three. If that's standard, then this is probably somewhere near equivalent to a wolf giving up their personal ability in order to use Punish The Fool.

Actually, this kind of reads like ted is a wolf with 3 lands who thinks that townies start with fewer.
Why would a townie ever say "3 mana is a bit tough to gather" here?

Or the wolves start with fewer than 3 mana each, which if Ted's scum, leads him to believe town also start with fewer than 3?

I have 3 as well, thought Ted assuming it tricky to acquire a bit unusual

falcon45ca wrote: ↑Sun Mar 07, 2021 11:18 pm

Long Con wrote: ↑Sun Mar 07, 2021 11:15 pm

falcon45ca wrote: ↑Sun Mar 07, 2021 11:13 pm

hollowkatt wrote: ↑Sun Mar 07, 2021 11:10 pm

falcon45ca wrote: ↑Sun Mar 07, 2021 11:06 pm

hollowkatt wrote: ↑Sun Mar 07, 2021 9:37 pm

falcon45ca wrote: ↑Sun Mar 07, 2021 9:30 pm

This is pretty scummy. Note that he supports others reads and encourages putting pressure on other players, but doesn't do so himself.

You mean the vote I have on Urist? I'm sorry, are you feeling peckish because I'm not actively pushing you or something? nah fam. What more pressure do you want than a legit vote? You think I need to case Urist or something?

What exactly is your read on Urist, why are you voting him? What's your read on me, why aren't you pushing me?

My read on Urist is wolf, and that's why I'm voting for him. My read on you is wolfy as well, for the D0 towncore stuff that I thought was nonsensical and unnecessary, and is reinforced by Guillotine who I town read.
I'm not pushing you b/c I'm currently focusing on Urist. Wait your turn.

Joke police and acting like it's scumhunting...now where have I heard this before?

Sounds rhetorical but I feel like there's an answer, which I don't know. Should I?

Kylemii used that logic in he scum read me.

falcon45ca wrote: ↑Sun Mar 07, 2021 11:13 pm

hollowkatt wrote: ↑Sun Mar 07, 2021 11:10 pm

falcon45ca wrote: ↑Sun Mar 07, 2021 11:06 pm

hollowkatt wrote: ↑Sun Mar 07, 2021 9:37 pm

falcon45ca wrote: ↑Sun Mar 07, 2021 9:30 pm

hollowkatt wrote: ↑Sun Mar 07, 2021 9:17 pm With some pressure on Falcon to start doing townie things pretty quickly I think adding some pressure to Urist makes sense here, yes?
I know your sus pool and I'm on board with that.

This is pretty scummy. Note that he supports others reads and encourages putting pressure on other players, but doesn't do so himself.

You mean the vote I have on Urist? I'm sorry, are you feeling peckish because I'm not actively pushing you or something? nah fam. What more pressure do you want than a legit vote? You think I need to case Urist or something?

What exactly is your read on Urist, why are you voting him? What's your read on me, why aren't you pushing me?

My read on Urist is wolf, and that's why I'm voting for him. My read on you is wolfy as well, for the D0 towncore stuff that I thought was nonsensical and unnecessary, and is reinforced by Guillotine who I town read.
I'm not pushing you b/c I'm currently focusing on Urist. Wait your turn.

Joke police and acting like it's scumhunting...now where have I heard this before?

Urist wrote: ↑Sun Mar 07, 2021 12:36 pm

Nicol Bolas wrote: ↑Sun Mar 07, 2021 11:50 am

Urist wrote: ↑Sun Mar 07, 2021 11:48 am dunia, jack, esooa, kyle, falcon, longcon all seem town

Can you explain falcon and myself?

falcon's entrance to the game seemed town. asking for a town core, calling people scum for ignoring his town core post seemed like he wasn't afraid to step on peoples' toes.

falcon45ca wrote: ↑Sun Mar 07, 2021 11:16 pm

Urist wrote: ↑Sun Mar 07, 2021 10:34 pm

Long Con wrote: ↑Sun Mar 07, 2021 10:29 pm

tedxtr wrote: ↑Sun Mar 07, 2021 3:15 am so punish the fool seems like a pretty punishing ability for our team.

the best we can probably do is to make scum play whack-a-mole. we all need mana for something...

fix suggestion : everyone should ask for the mana they need (and that's it - just ask for the mana, don't say what it's for or that it needs priority, etc etc), irregardless of how good or bad their ability is.

loop holes : the mafia will target strong people this way, so we're a bit forced to spread the cards to someone they don't need dead. (PoEish targets that can reasonably be town)

my instinct is to say that 3 mana is a bit tough to gather? so let's not try to get caught up in an ability that takes quite a bit to use anyway.

thoughts / concerns about this?

I don't think that 3 mana is tough to gather. I can produce that much mana in a night. I don't know how many lands you have, but I have three. If that's standard, then this is probably somewhere near equivalent to a wolf giving up their personal ability in order to use Punish The Fool.

Actually, this kind of reads like ted is a wolf with 3 lands who thinks that townies start with fewer.
Why would a townie ever say "3 mana is a bit tough to gather" here?

Or the wolves start with fewer than 3 mana each, which if Ted's scum, leads him to believe town also start with fewer than 3?

I have 3 as well, thought Ted assuming it tricky to acquire a bit unusual

Urist wrote: ↑Sun Mar 07, 2021 11:19 pm

falcon45ca wrote: ↑Sun Mar 07, 2021 11:16 pm

Urist wrote: ↑Sun Mar 07, 2021 10:34 pm

Long Con wrote: ↑Sun Mar 07, 2021 10:29 pm

tedxtr wrote: ↑Sun Mar 07, 2021 3:15 am so punish the fool seems like a pretty punishing ability for our team.

the best we can probably do is to make scum play whack-a-mole. we all need mana for something...

fix suggestion : everyone should ask for the mana they need (and that's it - just ask for the mana, don't say what it's for or that it needs priority, etc etc), irregardless of how good or bad their ability is.

loop holes : the mafia will target strong people this way, so we're a bit forced to spread the cards to someone they don't need dead. (PoEish targets that can reasonably be town)

my instinct is to say that 3 mana is a bit tough to gather? so let's not try to get caught up in an ability that takes quite a bit to use anyway.

thoughts / concerns about this?

I don't think that 3 mana is tough to gather. I can produce that much mana in a night. I don't know how many lands you have, but I have three. If that's standard, then this is probably somewhere near equivalent to a wolf giving up their personal ability in order to use Punish The Fool.

Actually, this kind of reads like ted is a wolf with 3 lands who thinks that townies start with fewer.
Why would a townie ever say "3 mana is a bit tough to gather" here?

Or the wolves start with fewer than 3 mana each, which if Ted's scum, leads him to believe town also start with fewer than 3?

I have 3 as well, thought Ted assuming it tricky to acquire a bit unusual

Everyone has 3, it's mod-confirmed.

Urist wrote: ↑Sun Mar 07, 2021 11:18 pm

hollowkatt wrote: ↑Sun Mar 07, 2021 10:58 pm

Long Con wrote: ↑Sun Mar 07, 2021 10:38 pm

Urist wrote: ↑Sun Mar 07, 2021 10:34 pm

Long Con wrote: ↑Sun Mar 07, 2021 10:29 pm

tedxtr wrote: ↑Sun Mar 07, 2021 3:15 am so punish the fool seems like a pretty punishing ability for our team.

the best we can probably do is to make scum play whack-a-mole. we all need mana for something...

fix suggestion : everyone should ask for the mana they need (and that's it - just ask for the mana, don't say what it's for or that it needs priority, etc etc), irregardless of how good or bad their ability is.

loop holes : the mafia will target strong people this way, so we're a bit forced to spread the cards to someone they don't need dead. (PoEish targets that can reasonably be town)

my instinct is to say that 3 mana is a bit tough to gather? so let's not try to get caught up in an ability that takes quite a bit to use anyway.

thoughts / concerns about this?

I don't think that 3 mana is tough to gather. I can produce that much mana in a night. I don't know how many lands you have, but I have three. If that's standard, then this is probably somewhere near equivalent to a wolf giving up their personal ability in order to use Punish The Fool.

Actually, this kind of reads like ted is a wolf with 3 lands who thinks that townies start with fewer.
Why would a townie ever say "3 mana is a bit tough to gather" here?

When I read it with the idea that it "reads like ted is a wolf", tow things jump out at me. One, his use of "instinct" feels wild and wolfy... but that's just for laughs. Two, more serious, he's casually downplaying the concern about this ability.

This is a quote chain to sit on till later, mark my words

Why is that?

Long Con wrote: ↑Sun Mar 07, 2021 11:18 pm

falcon45ca wrote: ↑Sun Mar 07, 2021 11:16 pm

Urist wrote: ↑Sun Mar 07, 2021 10:34 pm

Long Con wrote: ↑Sun Mar 07, 2021 10:29 pm

tedxtr wrote: ↑Sun Mar 07, 2021 3:15 am so punish the fool seems like a pretty punishing ability for our team.

the best we can probably do is to make scum play whack-a-mole. we all need mana for something...

fix suggestion : everyone should ask for the mana they need (and that's it - just ask for the mana, don't say what it's for or that it needs priority, etc etc), irregardless of how good or bad their ability is.

loop holes : the mafia will target strong people this way, so we're a bit forced to spread the cards to someone they don't need dead. (PoEish targets that can reasonably be town)

my instinct is to say that 3 mana is a bit tough to gather? so let's not try to get caught up in an ability that takes quite a bit to use anyway.

thoughts / concerns about this?

I don't think that 3 mana is tough to gather. I can produce that much mana in a night. I don't know how many lands you have, but I have three. If that's standard, then this is probably somewhere near equivalent to a wolf giving up their personal ability in order to use Punish The Fool.

Actually, this kind of reads like ted is a wolf with 3 lands who thinks that townies start with fewer.
Why would a townie ever say "3 mana is a bit tough to gather" here?

Or the wolves start with fewer than 3 mana each, which if Ted's scum, leads him to believe town also start with fewer than 3?

I have 3 as well, thought Ted assuming it tricky to acquire a bit unusual

How familiar has he shown to be with the general way Magic works? Any Magic player with three lands doesn't doubt the ease with which they can access three mana.

Guillotine wrote: ↑Sun Mar 07, 2021 11:21 pm

falcon45ca wrote: ↑Sun Mar 07, 2021 11:13 pm

hollowkatt wrote: ↑Sun Mar 07, 2021 11:10 pm

falcon45ca wrote: ↑Sun Mar 07, 2021 11:06 pm

hollowkatt wrote: ↑Sun Mar 07, 2021 9:37 pm

falcon45ca wrote: ↑Sun Mar 07, 2021 9:30 pm

hollowkatt wrote: ↑Sun Mar 07, 2021 9:17 pm With some pressure on Falcon to start doing townie things pretty quickly I think adding some pressure to Urist makes sense here, yes?
I know your sus pool and I'm on board with that.

This is pretty scummy. Note that he supports others reads and encourages putting pressure on other players, but doesn't do so himself.

You mean the vote I have on Urist? I'm sorry, are you feeling peckish because I'm not actively pushing you or something? nah fam. What more pressure do you want than a legit vote? You think I need to case Urist or something?

What exactly is your read on Urist, why are you voting him? What's your read on me, why aren't you pushing me?

My read on Urist is wolf, and that's why I'm voting for him. My read on you is wolfy as well, for the D0 towncore stuff that I thought was nonsensical and unnecessary, and is reinforced by Guillotine who I town read.
I'm not pushing you b/c I'm currently focusing on Urist. Wait your turn.

Joke police and acting like it's scumhunting...now where have I heard this before?

Urist wrote: ↑Sun Mar 07, 2021 12:36 pm

Nicol Bolas wrote: ↑Sun Mar 07, 2021 11:50 am

Urist wrote: ↑Sun Mar 07, 2021 11:48 am dunia, jack, esooa, kyle, falcon, longcon all seem town

Can you explain falcon and myself?

falcon's entrance to the game seemed town. asking for a town core, calling people scum for ignoring his town core post seemed like he wasn't afraid to step on peoples' toes.

hollowkatt wrote: ↑Sun Mar 07, 2021 11:08 pm

Long Con wrote: ↑Sun Mar 07, 2021 10:56 pm

hollowkatt wrote: ↑Sun Mar 07, 2021 10:55 pm

Urist wrote: ↑Sun Mar 07, 2021 10:20 pm

hollowkatt wrote: ↑Sun Mar 07, 2021 10:04 pm So @Urist what is it you're saying then so that I can understand b/c clearly I don't

If a member of the town is unable to use their ability without getting a mana donation of a specific colour, it's better for them to claim that they need that colour than to sit silently and be effectively a VT.
Concrete example: let's say I have an ability that requires two red mana and two green mana, but I only have two green lands and a red land. Which is the more beneficial choice:
a) Claim that I need one red land for my ability, alerting the mafia that I have an ability with a damage component, but potentially allowing me to make use of it.
b) Don't claim anything and take no actions.
A is always the logical choice. B doesn't make much sense, because although it avoids a situation where you're revealing information, you're not able to use your ability anyway so what are you even gaining by being secretive?

press X to doubt

I thought is sounded logical. Why should we doubt?

Couple things that I super hate about that post:
The first is the red comment. Just read that and think about it for a minute, especially in the context of we don't actually know what "red" things do even if we can assume things from the existing MTG color pie.
Second is there are times when not claiming/asking for mana is going to be beneficial to you, A isn't always the logical choice yeah? That's the main point of the X to Doubt comment.
There are other things that concern me about the post that I'm sitting on for now. The last thing I really want to mention is that the post reads as if they're seeing town approval for something, not expressing ideas or thoughts they want to take a stand on.

falcon45ca wrote: ↑Sun Mar 07, 2021 11:21 pm

Urist wrote: ↑Sun Mar 07, 2021 11:19 pm

falcon45ca wrote: ↑Sun Mar 07, 2021 11:16 pm

Urist wrote: ↑Sun Mar 07, 2021 10:34 pm

Long Con wrote: ↑Sun Mar 07, 2021 10:29 pm

tedxtr wrote: ↑Sun Mar 07, 2021 3:15 am so punish the fool seems like a pretty punishing ability for our team.

the best we can probably do is to make scum play whack-a-mole. we all need mana for something...

fix suggestion : everyone should ask for the mana they need (and that's it - just ask for the mana, don't say what it's for or that it needs priority, etc etc), irregardless of how good or bad their ability is.

loop holes : the mafia will target strong people this way, so we're a bit forced to spread the cards to someone they don't need dead. (PoEish targets that can reasonably be town)

my instinct is to say that 3 mana is a bit tough to gather? so let's not try to get caught up in an ability that takes quite a bit to use anyway.

thoughts / concerns about this?

I don't think that 3 mana is tough to gather. I can produce that much mana in a night. I don't know how many lands you have, but I have three. If that's standard, then this is probably somewhere near equivalent to a wolf giving up their personal ability in order to use Punish The Fool.

Actually, this kind of reads like ted is a wolf with 3 lands who thinks that townies start with fewer.
Why would a townie ever say "3 mana is a bit tough to gather" here?

Or the wolves start with fewer than 3 mana each, which if Ted's scum, leads him to believe town also start with fewer than 3?

I have 3 as well, thought Ted assuming it tricky to acquire a bit unusual

Everyone has 3, it's mod-confirmed.

Then why does ted think gathering 3 mana is difficult?

Long Con wrote: ↑Sun Mar 07, 2021 11:28 pm

Guillotine wrote: ↑Sun Mar 07, 2021 11:21 pm

falcon45ca wrote: ↑Sun Mar 07, 2021 11:13 pm

hollowkatt wrote: ↑Sun Mar 07, 2021 11:10 pm

falcon45ca wrote: ↑Sun Mar 07, 2021 11:06 pm

hollowkatt wrote: ↑Sun Mar 07, 2021 9:37 pm

falcon45ca wrote: ↑Sun Mar 07, 2021 9:30 pm

This is pretty scummy. Note that he supports others reads and encourages putting pressure on other players, but doesn't do so himself.

You mean the vote I have on Urist? I'm sorry, are you feeling peckish because I'm not actively pushing you or something? nah fam. What more pressure do you want than a legit vote? You think I need to case Urist or something?

What exactly is your read on Urist, why are you voting him? What's your read on me, why aren't you pushing me?

My read on Urist is wolf, and that's why I'm voting for him. My read on you is wolfy as well, for the D0 towncore stuff that I thought was nonsensical and unnecessary, and is reinforced by Guillotine who I town read.
I'm not pushing you b/c I'm currently focusing on Urist. Wait your turn.

Joke police and acting like it's scumhunting...now where have I heard this before?

Urist wrote: ↑Sun Mar 07, 2021 12:36 pm

Nicol Bolas wrote: ↑Sun Mar 07, 2021 11:50 am

Urist wrote: ↑Sun Mar 07, 2021 11:48 am dunia, jack, esooa, kyle, falcon, longcon all seem town

Can you explain falcon and myself?

falcon's entrance to the game seemed town. asking for a town core, calling people scum for ignoring his town core post seemed like he wasn't afraid to step on peoples' toes.

Urist... doesn't take it as a joke?

Urist wrote: ↑Sun Mar 07, 2021 12:36 pmfalcon's entrance to the game seemed town. asking for a town core, calling people scum for ignoring his town core post seemed like he wasn't afraid to step on peoples' toes.

falcon45ca wrote: ↑Sun Mar 07, 2021 11:35 pm Is there a necessary reason Guillotine is posting with this lion?


It's kinda confusing, and def seems limiting in what he can share with town, and how he can answer questions

Guillotine wrote: ↑Sun Mar 07, 2021 11:34 pm [VOTE: DrWilgy] aubergine

falcon45ca wrote: ↑Sun Mar 07, 2021 11:38 pm

Guillotine wrote: ↑Sun Mar 07, 2021 11:34 pm [VOTE: DrWilgy] aubergine

I HAVE BIG FONTS TOO

Long Con wrote: ↑Sun Mar 07, 2021 11:17 pm

Guillotine wrote: ↑Sun Mar 07, 2021 11:15 pm

hollowkatt wrote: ↑Sun Mar 07, 2021 11:08 pm A isn't always the logical choice yeah? That's the main point of the X to Doubt comment..

When the choice is between remaining functionally vanilla, or asking for a red mana from someone, I have to agree with Urist.

tutuu wrote: ↑Sat Mar 06, 2021 6:38 pm Here is the second mafia factional artifact:



Elaborations:

• Note that both this and the Wolf Pack are night actions, you can't use them during the day (you would have no mana to do that anyway)

• The purpose of this artifact is to prevent the town from breaking the game by making public plans on how to handle everyone's mana.

• Counter (as seen in this card) means roleblock or more specifically just "block". I won't be using the word roleblock anymore, its synonymous with "counter".

• Exiling a player removes them from the game and does not reveal their alignment (as if they were janitored)

• Which reminds me that upon death, players will flip their planeswalker, all of their land cards and all of the artifacts in their possession. The thing that they will not reveal is the state of their cards (tapped or untapped) as well as their current life total. More on the mechanics later.

Epignosis wrote: ↑Sun Mar 07, 2021 11:30 pm [VOTE: Long Con] aubergine

Urist wrote: ↑Sun Mar 07, 2021 11:29 pm

hollowkatt wrote: ↑Sun Mar 07, 2021 11:08 pm

Long Con wrote: ↑Sun Mar 07, 2021 10:56 pm

hollowkatt wrote: ↑Sun Mar 07, 2021 10:55 pm

Urist wrote: ↑Sun Mar 07, 2021 10:20 pm

hollowkatt wrote: ↑Sun Mar 07, 2021 10:04 pm So @Urist what is it you're saying then so that I can understand b/c clearly I don't

If a member of the town is unable to use their ability without getting a mana donation of a specific colour, it's better for them to claim that they need that colour than to sit silently and be effectively a VT.
Concrete example: let's say I have an ability that requires two red mana and two green mana, but I only have two green lands and a red land. Which is the more beneficial choice:
a) Claim that I need one red land for my ability, alerting the mafia that I have an ability with a damage component, but potentially allowing me to make use of it.
b) Don't claim anything and take no actions.
A is always the logical choice. B doesn't make much sense, because although it avoids a situation where you're revealing information, you're not able to use your ability anyway so what are you even gaining by being secretive?

press X to doubt

I thought is sounded logical. Why should we doubt?

Couple things that I super hate about that post:
The first is the red comment. Just read that and think about it for a minute, especially in the context of we don't actually know what "red" things do even if we can assume things from the existing MTG color pie.
Second is there are times when not claiming/asking for mana is going to be beneficial to you, A isn't always the logical choice yeah? That's the main point of the X to Doubt comment.
There are other things that concern me about the post that I'm sitting on for now. The last thing I really want to mention is that the post reads as if they're seeing town approval for something, not expressing ideas or thoughts they want to take a stand on.

1) You'll have to explain to me why it would be scummy to assume that red mana can map to direct damage.
2) If you can think of a scenario where it's better to stay vanilla instead of revealing information about one of your colours, I'd be happy to hear it. Same to you @Guillotine.
3) Seeking town approval? You asked me to explain my thought process, so yes, my post is meant to read like I'm trying to get you on the same page as me. I don't understand why you would make this accusation.

Long Con wrote: ↑Mon Mar 08, 2021 12:36 am Yes, it's possible the mafia will activate Punish The Fool if there are any public mana-transfers.

Epignosis wrote: ↑Sun Mar 07, 2021 11:30 pm [VOTE: Long Con] aubergine

Just poppin' in?

Spoiler: show

Long Con wrote: ↑Sun Mar 07, 2021 10:29 pm

tedxtr wrote: ↑Sun Mar 07, 2021 3:15 am so punish the fool seems like a pretty punishing ability for our team.

the best we can probably do is to make scum play whack-a-mole. we all need mana for something...

fix suggestion : everyone should ask for the mana they need (and that's it - just ask for the mana, don't say what it's for or that it needs priority, etc etc), irregardless of how good or bad their ability is.

loop holes : the mafia will target strong people this way, so we're a bit forced to spread the cards to someone they don't need dead. (PoEish targets that can reasonably be town)

my instinct is to say that 3 mana is a bit tough to gather? so let's not try to get caught up in an ability that takes quite a bit to use anyway.

thoughts / concerns about this?

I don't think that 3 mana is tough to gather. I can produce that much mana in a night. I don't know how many lands you have, but I have three. If that's standard, then this is probably somewhere near equivalent to a wolf giving up their personal ability in order to use Punish The Fool.

Urist wrote: ↑Sun Mar 07, 2021 10:34 pm

Long Con wrote: ↑Sun Mar 07, 2021 10:29 pm

tedxtr wrote: ↑Sun Mar 07, 2021 3:15 am so punish the fool seems like a pretty punishing ability for our team.

the best we can probably do is to make scum play whack-a-mole. we all need mana for something...

fix suggestion : everyone should ask for the mana they need (and that's it - just ask for the mana, don't say what it's for or that it needs priority, etc etc), irregardless of how good or bad their ability is.

loop holes : the mafia will target strong people this way, so we're a bit forced to spread the cards to someone they don't need dead. (PoEish targets that can reasonably be town)

my instinct is to say that 3 mana is a bit tough to gather? so let's not try to get caught up in an ability that takes quite a bit to use anyway.

thoughts / concerns about this?

I don't think that 3 mana is tough to gather. I can produce that much mana in a night. I don't know how many lands you have, but I have three. If that's standard, then this is probably somewhere near equivalent to a wolf giving up their personal ability in order to use Punish The Fool.

Actually, this kind of reads like ted is a wolf with 3 lands who thinks that townies start with fewer.
Why would a townie ever say "3 mana is a bit tough to gather" here?

Marmot wrote: ↑Mon Mar 08, 2021 1:38 am <=== obv town here

tutuu wrote: ↑Mon Mar 08, 2021 4:54 am Reminder that the only votes written ITT with <vote> tags count, votes made in the poll do not

Guillotine wrote: ↑Sun Mar 07, 2021 9:36 pm

Urist wrote: ↑Sun Mar 07, 2021 9:30 pm

Guillotine wrote: ↑Sun Mar 07, 2021 9:01 pm

Urist wrote: ↑Sun Mar 07, 2021 11:18 am

Nicol Bolas wrote: ↑Sat Mar 06, 2021 9:55 pm The character claims are interesting to me. I find them NAI because we don't know what characters mafia will be, but I think it may actually be useful for us to claim the color of our abilities so that we don't waste mana giving it to others. I'd like some contribution on what extent town should share information relating to their role, but be wary that what you say can give scum info you don't intend to share on your role

colour is 100% tied to abilities, i don't recommend anyone claim colour.

Urist wrote: ↑Sun Mar 07, 2021 11:50 am

Long Con wrote: ↑Sun Mar 07, 2021 11:48 am

Nicol Bolas wrote: ↑Sun Mar 07, 2021 11:41 am

Long Con wrote: ↑Sun Mar 07, 2021 11:37 am I don't think it would hurt to share which colour you need.

Urist makes a valid point that colors are related to what your power is, though.

Ok... but say you need a blue mana. If you can't make it with your lands, then it's probably not your main thing. The ability could require blue-white-black, or it could be blue-red-green. I didn't think that revealing the one colour you can't make gives much usable info.

It's wise to err on the side of caution, but that has to balance out with actually being able to ever use your ability.

if you actually need someone to give specific mana to you, i don't think there's much harm in claiming it because otherwise you won't be able to use your ability anyway, it won't matter whether scum knows what it is lol.
i was more getting at the idea that people shouldn't be claiming colours for no reason.

Do you not understand why it's beneficial to claim your colour if you need donations to use your ability?

KZA wrote: ↑Tue Feb 16, 2021 9:48 pmrole hunting

Nicol Bolas wrote: ↑Sun Mar 07, 2021 9:38 pm

Urist wrote: ↑Sun Mar 07, 2021 9:32 pm

Nicol Bolas wrote: ↑Sun Mar 07, 2021 9:29 pm

Urist wrote: ↑Sun Mar 07, 2021 9:25 pm

hollowkatt wrote: ↑Sun Mar 07, 2021 8:28 pm what kind of policy is voting guillotina @Urist?

I'm a disgruntled old man and don't really care to play with someone who's making the game harder to read for no reason.

it's not actually for no reason

If you're suggesting it's a post restriction, I'm a little doubtful.

it's because guillotinas previous play style was not healthy and he's trying to change that. Easiest way to change it is to try to filter thoughts through images. That's what I think it probably is

Long Con wrote: ↑Sun Mar 07, 2021 10:29 pm

tedxtr wrote: ↑Sun Mar 07, 2021 3:15 am so punish the fool seems like a pretty punishing ability for our team.

the best we can probably do is to make scum play whack-a-mole. we all need mana for something...

fix suggestion : everyone should ask for the mana they need (and that's it - just ask for the mana, don't say what it's for or that it needs priority, etc etc), irregardless of how good or bad their ability is.

loop holes : the mafia will target strong people this way, so we're a bit forced to spread the cards to someone they don't need dead. (PoEish targets that can reasonably be town)

my instinct is to say that 3 mana is a bit tough to gather? so let's not try to get caught up in an ability that takes quite a bit to use anyway.

thoughts / concerns about this?

I don't think that 3 mana is tough to gather. I can produce that much mana in a night. I don't know how many lands you have, but I have three. If that's standard, then this is probably somewhere near equivalent to a wolf giving up their personal ability in order to use Punish The Fool.