The Syndicate

Samusamu wrote: ↑Tue Dec 22, 2020 5:21 am

Samusamu wrote: ↑Mon Dec 21, 2020 7:05 am Also, @mewtini can u explain your last push in the eod?

Well, @mewtini , if u can, then respond this also with the last question sloonei did.

um ... i might not be understanding what you mean by this question, i don't think i really pushed anyone - my eod felt way more like "wait wtf, not THIS wagon [cat]" and me resisting that than anything else really. if you're asking me to explain my wilgy vote then i guess i did sort of do that already, i'll also note that i had pretty much a null wilgy read and i'd iso'd him without feeling much of anything (ie caring less about him dying than cat, at that point) so i figured "fuck it"

mewtini wrote: ↑Tue Dec 22, 2020 6:39 am

Samusamu wrote: ↑Tue Dec 22, 2020 5:21 am

Samusamu wrote: ↑Mon Dec 21, 2020 7:05 am Also, @mewtini can u explain your last push in the eod?

Well, @mewtini , if u can, then respond this also with the last question sloonei did.

um ... i might not be understanding what you mean by this question, i don't think i really pushed anyone - my eod felt way more like "wait wtf, not THIS wagon [cat]" and me resisting that than anything else really. if you're asking me to explain my wilgy vote then i guess i did sort of do that already, i'll also note that i had pretty much a null wilgy read and i'd iso'd him without feeling much of anything (ie caring less about him dying than cat, at that point) so i figured "fuck it"

Its enough, then made is still your principal candidate?

Who do you think that are they buddies?

Samusamu wrote: ↑Tue Dec 22, 2020 6:59 am Its enough, then made is still your principal candidate?

Who do you think that are they buddies?

i haven't read any of d2 still; i skimmed through a page or two, saw my name come up and wrote that checkin post, and then decided i didn't feel like playing and closed the tab haha. so i don't think i can really answer this q in good faith because of that.

made was at the forefront of my mind just because i hadn't resolved my feelings about them from d1, but i just went to skim their d2 now so i could answer this question ... and i think that a good number of their reads (his TRs from marmot down to sig align a lot with my feelings about those people) feel fine so now of course i feel better about them (made) overall, at least in a superficial sense. i didn't/don't have a potential team, i'm kind of bad with preflip association reads and wasn't thinking about them at all d1 (and therefore have put no thought into them d2).

mewtini wrote: ↑Tue Dec 22, 2020 7:23 am TRs from marmot down to sig align a lot with my feelings about those people

(in their #454 readlist, forgot to say)

tbh it's very possible i just went "ohoho! they are townreading me, now i like them!" especially since i was going ?_? at sloonei's vaguepush on me (both because: it was about me, and because i thought it was a mischaracterization of my eod) and thought made's engagement with it was like ... rational, and iirc pretty close to the truth (insofar as "i'm not going to hardpush a new wagon when i get to thread 10min before eod, that's weird"). inb4 w/w read for that

tl;dr i have to actually iso and figure out my other feelings when it isn't 6 in the morning and i'm on 3 hours of sleep, but that is where i'm at for the time being

I didnt like what i felt eod d1 reading mewtini but cant see scumness from him right now.

I think we are not winning a thing pushing syn right now.

I will unvote a little bit a rethink

@sig who will u shoot this night at this moment?

sig wrote: ↑Mon Dec 21, 2020 10:05 pm If wilgy is town though mew would look bad and vice verse

hm, elaborate?

unless i'd gone no-vote (which didn't cross my mind tbqh) the only other impactful vote i could have placed, barring a semisubstantial shift, would have been a deciding vote on ... your wagon iirc

Samusamu wrote: ↑Tue Dec 22, 2020 7:35 am I didnt like what i felt eod d1 reading mewtini but cant see scumness from him right now.

what changed? (also i use she/her!)

anyway i will actually stop posting now and go back to sleep

mewtini wrote: ↑Tue Dec 22, 2020 7:37 am

Samusamu wrote: ↑Tue Dec 22, 2020 7:35 am I didnt like what i felt eod d1 reading mewtini but cant see scumness from him right now.

what changed? (also i use she/her!)

anyway i will actually stop posting now and go back to sleep

In the eod you seemed too oblivious to the lynching, not that you didn't take a stand. But you gave me the impression of being there to make a bump and a noise and not to decide what to do.

I didn't like it. But there are so many things I don't like about this game that I'm going to have to overlook several of them.

Alison wrote: ↑Sat Dec 19, 2020 3:29 am

mewtini wrote: ↑Fri Dec 18, 2020 11:15 pm

Alison wrote: ↑Fri Dec 18, 2020 10:31 pm This post is pretty townie.

why? the tmi comment? since i see you're doubting Made atm

Alison wrote: ↑Fri Dec 18, 2020 10:33 pm Kyle/mewtini, I'm having the hardest time reading you two. Weigh in on sig vs samu, please.

think samu is clear town for energy and genuineness. also appreciated him trying to preserve thread direction and eventually saying "maybe sig is just aggravated town," felt like he was acting in good faith

reluctant to slap a scumlean on sig out of personal policy (which is that it's d1 and i want to see more before SLing anyone); i think i'm sideeyeing made more at the moment, actually. sig's recent posting feels more genuine / less wordtwisty than earlier posting did (need to reread later, the language boundary was i think a nonnegligible part of it + made was a bit more strange about it than necessary)

i'm curious about any metareads that anyone else may have on made/sig tbh. i also find it pretty difficult to read much of anything from the current lowposters, e.g. i'm wondering where the syn reads are coming from

I think scum GS would have a hard time keeping up the gimmick while engaging with the game and giving reads. Your hedge on sig is noted.

Syn is pretty low energy as scum. His entrance was townie.

Well, syn is being like u said as scum alison. I still wanna lynch shoot syn.

But his lynch dont give a shit if town.

Alison wrote: ↑Fri Dec 18, 2020 10:33 pm Kyle/mewtini, I'm having the hardest time reading you two. Weigh in on sig vs samu, please.

I'm not a fan of Made suspecting Samu. I think Samu is pretty obviously town and it's very easy to see that.

Samu
GS
Syn
Wilgy
[everyone else]
Made
Sig

I'm off now.

I'm having problems reading wilgy and gs. For me they are nai, so lets be sheepped and and say they are town for the moment.

Also dont like Made, and i have been townreading sig for a while.

So lets see if alison is right with made.

[VOTE: Made] aubergine

Also, this are the reads from made d1:

made
sig
syn
kyle
sloonei

GS
mew
cat


alison
wilgy
samu

Samusamu wrote: ↑Tue Dec 22, 2020 7:54 am Also, this are the reads from made d1:

made
sig
syn
kyle
sloonei

GS
mew
cat


alison
wilgy
samu

I can see slooney and sig a little.

Gs, syn, wilgy and kyle were town for alison, i will consider that she can be 3/4 right in that town reads (or 1/4 of being mafia), and for that scumreads she has to be atleast 1/2 right.

Then i know this.

may it please the court:

made (1/2)
sig (1/2)
syn (1/4)
kyle (1/4)
sloonei

GS (1/4)
mew
cat (town)


alison (town)
wilgy (1/4)
samu (town)

Samusamu wrote: ↑Tue Dec 22, 2020 8:02 am

Samusamu wrote: ↑Tue Dec 22, 2020 7:54 am Also, this are the reads from made d1:

made
sig
syn
kyle
sloonei

GS
mew
cat


alison
wilgy
samu

I can see slooney and sig a little.

Gs, syn, wilgy and kyle were town for alison, i will consider that she can be 3/4 right in that town reads (or 1/4 of being mafia), and for that scumreads she has to be atleast 1/2 right.

Then i know this.

may it please the court:

made (1/2)
sig (1/2)
syn (1/4)
kyle (1/4)
sloonei

GS (1/4)
mew
cat (town)


alison (town)
wilgy (1/4)
samu (town)

And from my point of view without alison reads.

may it please the court:

made (scum vibes)
sig (town lean)
syn (scum lean)
kyle (nai)
sloonei (town for me)

GS (nai)
mew (townlean
cat (town confirmed)


alison (town confirmed)
wilgy (nai)
samu (town)

Well i confirm my push on made today, also i'm thinking who should i shoot.

Hey dudes am i playing alone?

Can everybody vote made?

Oh yes, of course we can samu, since at least we are touching our balls at least we will do something basic and essential like closing the day so you can't post anymore and I feel even more lonely.

Meh, probably i gonna drive my car for 3 hours meanwhile the eod, i will try to stop and see what happen two or three times. But dudes, there is not better gift for xmas than your participation to me.

Samusamu wrote: ↑Tue Dec 22, 2020 12:09 pm Meh, probably i gonna drive my car for 3 hours meanwhile the eod, i will try to stop and see what happen two or three times. But dudes, there is not better gift for xmas than your participation to me.

Try to move this a little before that*!

mewtini wrote: ↑Tue Dec 22, 2020 7:36 am

sig wrote: ↑Mon Dec 21, 2020 10:05 pm If wilgy is town though mew would look bad and vice verse

hm, elaborate?

unless i'd gone no-vote (which didn't cross my mind tbqh) the only other impactful vote i could have placed, barring a semisubstantial shift, would have been a deciding vote on ... your wagon iirc

So I'm torn, not wanting to direct the lynch to wilgy would maybe point to that imo, now you did end up voting for him but the hesitancy was a bit weird.

Samusamu wrote: ↑Tue Dec 22, 2020 7:35 am I didnt like what i felt eod d1 reading mewtini but cant see scumness from him right now.

I think we are not winning a thing pushing syn right now.

I will unvote a little bit a rethink

@sig who will u shoot this night at this moment?

Syn if he gets lynched and is mafia, wilgy.
If he gets lynched and is civ I'd need to reevaluate.

I'm leery of a Made lynch I'll review the cases today but he seems to be playing within his normal civ meta.

I'd say he'd be a good present target also (Made) but jd prefer to lynch syn/wilgy since if ones mafia I'm certain they both are

lol samu

mewtini wrote: ↑Tue Dec 22, 2020 6:37 am

Sloonei wrote: ↑Tue Dec 22, 2020 2:07 am

mewtini wrote: ↑Tue Dec 22, 2020 1:25 am i'm checking in quickly to say that i saw some stuff was said to me, i think, but that i haven't had time/energy to respond; i'll get to it tomorrow. i'm pretty much not caught up on this phase

My question for you is this: what was your mindset at the end of Day 1?

Answer whenever you feel up to it, no hurry.

mostly just lost lol, i didn't/don't feel like i have a great grasp of the gamestate nor a lot of various arguments for/against people

pretty discontented with the wagon options, i didn't really want to vote for anyone except made and it looked like that wasn't really an option by the time i got into the thread - and i wasn't thrilled about voting between wilgy/cat, i thought the cat wagon felt weird and maybe wolfdriven so i wanted to give them another day. granted i wanted sig to have another day moreso because i thought i could find him given more time so i guess the end result could have been worse

why didn't you even mention made's name at all? he had a vote. nothing seemed solid. If you did not like any of the available options, why not at least float Made as a possibility?

Why the absolute jingle bells are we scum reading Wilgy here?

And I'm also not inclined to vote for Syn.

We're voting for Made today. I will settle for nothing else.

Sloonei wrote: ↑Tue Dec 22, 2020 2:27 pm Why the absolute jingle bells are we scum reading Wilgy here?

Early d1 activity threw me off. Combined with a gut read. The main reason though is the save by syn.

I think syn threw down a distancing vote thinking it wouldn't go anywhere and then swooped in to save him last second.

sig wrote: ↑Tue Dec 22, 2020 2:30 pm

Sloonei wrote: ↑Tue Dec 22, 2020 2:27 pm Why the absolute jingle bells are we scum reading Wilgy here?

Early d1 activity threw me off. Combined with a gut read. The main reason though is the save by syn.

I think syn threw down a distancing vote thinking it wouldn't go anywhere and then swooped in to save him last second.

Oh man, wilgy was low key and aloof early on on Day 1!? Sound the Christmas alarms.

DrWilgy wrote: ↑Fri Dec 18, 2020 12:06 pm Who's telling cat things?

DrWilgy wrote: ↑Fri Dec 18, 2020 12:06 pm

cat wrote: ↑Fri Dec 18, 2020 2:18 am From what i've heard Wilgy isn't that dangerous of a player, so this coal is surprising.

The hell does this mean?

First two posts from Wilgy, he jumped into throwing shade and suspecting people this game. Then it's almost like he remembered to mess around and started doing it afterwards.

He also was scum reading Syn, which I again think is an instance of distancing.

On top of that the whole coal thing still makes me feel a bit off.

I'd say my mafia read of Wilgy is heavily dependent on Syn flipping mafia though.

sig wrote: ↑Tue Dec 22, 2020 2:34 pm I'd say my mafia read of Wilgy is heavily dependent on Syn flipping mafia though.

And marmot made some pretty good points on him. But, really I think Syn is the preferred lynch I just can't see his last second vote as anything other then scum sided.

Made would probably be my secondary counterwagon to Syn, Wilgy should only be lynched/shot if Syn is mafia. Otherwise alot of the reasoning for me would be gone.

Now I'd prefer to lynch Syn for the shot dynamics. If Syn is civ shoot Made. If Syn is mafia shoot Wilgy. Either way I'd say we'd be down 1-2 mafia members. Since I don't see a world where all 3 are civs based off the cases made.

@Kylemii @Grand Scheme Haven't heard much from you two this phase. What're your thoughts on the 3 cases we have?

Marmots on Wilgy
Sloonei's on Made
Mine on Syn

Which would you prefer to lynch and which would you shoot.

I'm also planning to put together another in depth read list before EoD, if I don't manage that it'll be up before D3

Also I know it's the holiday, but the thread is very stagnate. Which makes me wonder if we're going in the complete wrong direction here.

Sloonei wrote: ↑Tue Dec 22, 2020 2:27 pm Why the absolute jingle bells are we scum reading Wilgy here?

I also dont know it.

Sloonei/Sig power woof team

Made continues to be Mafia - Day 2 Edition:

I provided a big and fairly comprehensive argument for Made As Mafia yesterday afternoon. I am an experienced player. I have written a lot of cases in my mafia life. I know when I feel like they make sense, or at least when they're viable and easy to follow. This one on Made felt very self-evident. I talked about what he did and why his actions made me feel the way that I did. There was nothing, I felt, difficult or opaque about it. Everything you need to know about my read on Made is right there on the surface of my words.

Then when Made returned to the thread, this was his impassioned response:

Made wrote: ↑Mon Dec 21, 2020 7:07 pm Mr. Sloonei, what's ur take on Syn?

Made wrote: ↑Mon Dec 21, 2020 7:14 pm Ms. Syn same question but for sloonei.

Why does my read on Syn matter here? Why does Syn's read on me matter? The latter thought is what prompted me to point out that I am universalliy town-read (sans Made). Made asking Syn for a read on the player everybody has decided to read as town felt hollow. Made asking Syn for a readon the player everybody has decided to read as town when said player has just posted a big comprehensive case explaining why he reads Made as mafia, and Made has not touched it with a thirty-nine and a half foot pole, looks weak and almost impossible from an honest civilian mindset.

But then we get to Made's reads list, which has me and Syn both at the bottom. So maybe he feels there is a connection between us. His syn suspicion seems to hinge on wilgy being bad. I think the Wilgy suspicion is empty. I am not saying I read Wilgy's posts as town definitively. But I definitely don't read them as suspicious. I read them as posts coming from DrWilgy, and I challenge anyone here to make an argument for why those posts are bad. I'm willing to listen, but there is nothing out of the ordinary about this game's version of Wilgy, and Wilgy is everyone's favorite mischop bait. It's almost transparently bad.

Let's get tot he reasons Made lists for scum reading each of us:
"wilgy's talk looked bad yesterday, EOD vote around him look bad, silence today looks bad. iunnlikeem"
What "talk" looked bad? What votes looked bad and why? Why is his silence bad? Why can't his absence simply be absence? This is not the least bit uncommon for DrWilgy. So why is any of it bad?

"syn's end of day looks AWFUL. if wilgy is bad then syn is the teammate."
Why did Syn's end of day look AWFUL? Evidently because he switched a joke vote from Wilgy onto Sig at the last moment, which is apparently what the mafia team would want because it would create a tie... when we already had a civilian being chopped in cat. And no mafia member in their right mind would go out of their way to cast such a brazen and reckless vote at the last minute when people are on high alert about tie-creation. Why on all of Santa's wonderful Earth would a Mafia Syn leap to cast a vote on Town Sig to tie him up with Town Cat in the poll at the last second? No. That makes no sense. That is not an argument.

"sloonei insist that samu is obv town because and then argues i'm bad because and then argues mewtini is bad because all of it feels forced"
Okay, remember up above when Made's full arguments against Wilgy and Syn were "looked bad" and "looks AWFUL"? It's not even like those are summaries of previous reads he'd stated. If you search his ISO for mentions of either of those two, he never elaborates beyond similar observations of frank "badness".
I bring all of this up because I would like to direct your attention, dear reader, to Made's summary of my own cases against him and Mewtini. Made summarizes each of them via a confused2 emoji. That is to say, Made alleges that my cases against him and Mewtini are either insubstantial or make no sense. I remind you that the entirety of his top two cases are "looks bad" and "looks awful."
I direct your attention, once again, to my cases: Made & Mewtini.
Those are definitely not insubstantial. If they make no sense, I have not had anyone engage with me on them yet to determine what is lacking. I feel as though they both make very clear sense. That is not to say they're both correct. But they should definitely be readable. Made denies that they are and tosses a blanket of suspicion on me in the process. If that is a genuine read, I'm flabbergasted! Vexed! Dumbfounded!
I pressed him to expound on his stances a bit more and he, once again, failed to do so in a satisfying manner. This is the most we got:

Made wrote: ↑Mon Dec 21, 2020 8:22 pm nah, i saw them, they just don't really make sense to me. my issue with samu was the delivery, yes, but also the core message that sounded like a "no you, but also let's distract thread!". and mew showing up 13 minutes before deadline, and then throwing a new name in the mix i feel like would of been scummy af. reads like a team player imo

He touches briefly on one point (RE: samu) from his own case, and just hand waves at the entire case against Mewtini. The specific reference to "13 minutes" even suggests to me that the case resonated with Made, or else he wouldn't be as likely to specify the exact right number that I used in my analysis. I do not know if this points to Made + Mewtini as teammates (for what it's worth, Made lists mew as his top townread in his reads list), or if it's just Made working extra hard to discredit me. But I simply do not believe Made when he says that my arguments do not make sense to him.

[VOTE: made] aubergine

sig wrote: ↑Tue Dec 22, 2020 2:41 pm Also I know it's the holiday, but the thread is very stagnate. Which makes me wonder if we're going in the complete wrong direction here.

Talk about made.

Perhaps the thread is stagnant because we are going in the right direction but the mafia team is hoping we don't make any progress.

Sloonei wrote: ↑Tue Dec 22, 2020 3:14 pm Perhaps the thread is stagnant because we are going in the right direction but the mafia team is hoping we don't make any progress.

I cant answer you, but i read u and noddle.

damn I might actually have to sheep Sloonei

"I'm going to sign up for Nanook's Christmas game because it's light and festive and I can just play a game of mafia at a relaxed pace and not have to worry about doing all of the things I usually do." - Me, two weeks ago

Responding quick cuz doing Christmas things, but tldr, I think your likely mafia at this point because what ur saying first seemed plausible with a sig samu civvie situation. I didn’t like that syn and sloonei didn’t acknowledge each other. Feels like baddie team distancing. If you ask short questions I can answer them, but I can’t be glued to my phone right now.

Wilgy votes seem like the move to make syn look a lot better if wilgy is good, so I’m happy voting there cuz she’s more active than wilgy at this point

Sloonei wrote: ↑Tue Dec 22, 2020 3:23 pm "I'm going to sign up for Nanook's Christmas game because it's light and festive and I can just play a game of mafia at a relaxed pace and not have to worry about doing all of the things I usually do." - Me, two weeks ago

Relatable

Made wrote: ↑Tue Dec 22, 2020 3:26 pm Responding quick cuz doing Christmas things, but tldr, I think your likely mafia at this point because what ur saying first seemed plausible with a sig samu civvie situation. I didn’t like that syn and sloonei didn’t acknowledge each other. Feels like baddie team distancing. If you ask short questions I can answer them, but I can’t be glued to my phone right now.

Wilgy votes seem like the move to make syn look a lot better if wilgy is good, so I’m happy voting there cuz she’s more active than wilgy at this point

There are a number of people I didn’t interact with much. Why are singling out syn? What specifically makes the two of us look bad together?

Sloonei wrote: ↑Tue Dec 22, 2020 3:28 pm

Made wrote: ↑Tue Dec 22, 2020 3:26 pm Responding quick cuz doing Christmas things, but tldr, I think your likely mafia at this point because what ur saying first seemed plausible with a sig samu civvie situation. I didn’t like that syn and sloonei didn’t acknowledge each other. Feels like baddie team distancing. If you ask short questions I can answer them, but I can’t be glued to my phone right now.

Wilgy votes seem like the move to make syn look a lot better if wilgy is good, so I’m happy voting there cuz she’s more active than wilgy at this point

There are a number of people I didn’t interact with much. Why are singling out syn? What specifically makes the two of us look bad together?

I though u are bad and syn separate and noticed the lack of acknowledgments in iso. That’s why I think u wilgy syn together have big baddie energy

I have not interacted at all with Grand Scheme.
My only interaction with Kyle was a couple of jokes about swearing.
I did not interact with Mewtini prior to my case today.
I hadn’t said a word about wilgy until today.
I barely even talked to or about cat yesterday.
I’ve said little to night about the Marmot Falcon.

Really my only significant interactions on Day 1 were with sig, samu, and made himself.

Made has made the argument that I am specifically avoiding talking to or about Syn.