The Molly Maguires Mafia (ENDGAME)

[MacDougall]

ive alraedy begun justifying townlocking esooa by convincing myself i have a secret meta tell

also this post might be my most villagery post and i will be adding this to the list of sentiments i must remember to fake as wolf randomly when i roll wolf with none of you present

heh yeh u r town probly

[MacDougall]

I'm gonna start by noticing I have 2 votes on me and Alison omgused me so that locks her as mafia.

it doesn't tho

[MacDougall]

I actually hate Mac's end of page 1.

did u tho

[MacDougall]

luckbox/ender gg

Gonna need elaboration bruh.

this pretty decently exactly how a mafia would react to someone calling their exact team tbh

[MacDougall]

Alison scumslipped probably

Interesting.

While she's on my sus-list I wouldn't agree with this.

Elaborate?

Alison said above this that Luckbox will eventually towntell which isn't true if he's a wolf presumably

I think criticizing people for treating someone as town is poor personally

It's being nitpicky with phrasing.

Being nitpicky with Phrasing has been the worst read I've ever tried. Well not the worst but it was pretty unreliable.

this is a wolf post

[MacDougall]

Stop trolling and explain your case and vote me then.

that wouldn't be towny

Okay this is mildly towny from Mac.

Also made me laugh.

the addition of the adverb mildly is designed herein to not shift his position too strongly away from reasonable being able to never have to answer for shifting back to scumreading me if need be

[MacDougall]

[VOTE: Alison] aubergine
Wolfy and awkward tone the whole game tbh

like when this post came out i thought it was a meldy and villagery take and now im being stupid and questioning that maybe

but now im questioning questioning that

whatever

I am pretty confident Alison is town. I was just trying to bait a mafia to make a scumread on someone who was being obvious town tbh.

Counterpoint:

[VOTE: Alison] aubergine

refuge in audacity

however probably always a mafia between ender and Alison

about 80/20 that it's ender here

[MacDougall]

So I'm gonna make a formation of players.

In this corner of "No posts" I'll put 112.

In this corner we have the "I have a scumread and want to vote but they also need to do more and maybe I'm jumping the gun." duo of Luckbox and Kami.

Over here we have the "Pure unboxed town" of Esooa and LC.

Then we have the "Maybe towny but I also like have black spots" of Mac and iaafr.

Then there's the "I'm voting here for now" of Alison.

Good.

Sorted the game.

pure unboxed duo is such because suspecting those two players in particular is a massive chore and it's easier to just not to

suspect Alison who is actively pushing him is easy work and keeps him busy

[MacDougall]

Ender is just talking utter bs here

oh past mac already noticed all this

[MacDougall]

[VOTE: Kami] aubergine

I probably should change my playstyle back towards the tunnel approach just a touch tbh

[MacDougall]

im not totally sold on mac town because i could see him stepping it up to prove himself not a total walkover scumplayer but overall still lean town on him prolly

Anyone who thinks Mac is a walkover scum player hasn't seen him actively try.

He nearly outposted me as scum D1 once and I had 300 posts.

context is that lc and i just played a game (esooa was there too but subbed into a scum slot d2) where mac (and p much his entire scumteam, tbf) just kinda phoned it in d1 and got d2'd

(this game https://mafiathesyndicate.com/viewtopic.php?t=2237 )

Ah I see context.

What's your opinion on both Mac and Kami doing this weird dance where they sorta scumread Alison to start then come around to being more on scumreading me?

trying to get iaafr to scumread two town in a weasel like manner

[MacDougall]

damn my original scum team of 112 lc isn't valid huh

112 still can be

I amst not entirely le sold on lc at this point in my ketchup

[MacDougall]

ender is lock wolf for me, there is only 2 mafia so ill wait to find the last after he gets lynched

yeh

[MacDougall]

ender is lock wolf for me, there is only 2 mafia so ill wait to find the last after he gets lynched

Do you have anyone as town?

@Lime Coke talk me through why you chose this question please?

[MacDougall]

Do you have anyone as town?

luckbox confirmed town

Why?

do you have anyone as town?

Yes. Rabbit, Mac, and Esooa so far.

why

I already explained but TL:DR

Rabbit for how he was trying to solve Esooa and his thoughts were pretty much mirroring mine, Mac for serious solving tone and being totally different from Philo 2, and Esooa for her response to Alison on a read that I don't think she would do so in a way if she were mafia.

being honest none of these reasons are quality and the reason on me is particularly bad cuz Lime Coke knows full well that game is pure outlier and tbh up til this point in the game nothing I'd done here is outside my normal scumrange

[EnderWiggin]

not so much for ender but for luckbox

I'm glad you pointed this out because I was going to call you on it. =P

Also I actively did try solving, albeit kinda badly at first.

[MacDougall]

esooa hasn't done anything villagery and mac has played this exact game as wolf before too

I mean...I get that. At least Esooa is the worst person I can read based off of "tone" and stuff like that and I had a certain approach to her in Philo 2 which I ended up being correct on scumreading her, only to waver because my dumbass townreads AtE.
However I saw someone else that I townread basically saying the same thing and proceeding to just townread her, so I don't feel as bad outing a townread.

Mac I've sorta tilted the table multiple games in a row mainly because we've butted heads numerous times and it's lead to me scumreading/refusing to townread him for multiple games. I did get him twice when he was mafia at least with a confident enough read as opposed to "fuck it, just vote him out" annnnd figured him as town in a few games correctly?

This has kind of been a bit of a change in my approach to both how I play in general and how I read those 2, and a few others, in that instead of head hunting for when they're mafia I should just flat out try to achieve 100% accuracy in reading their alignments.

but alas... this is an ok explanation and checks out

[MacDougall]

I think Kami is a wolf now.

Ender's re-entrance has been yuck. His strongest read is that I am scum for pushing him for bad reasons on page 1.

I think wolf Alison would be more mindful not to make this read while kami is burying ender ... it doesn't serve the wolf agenda to scumread both both them

[MacDougall]

I'm also ignoring Kami because she's going to get stuck in her "I am right" for now and I got no clue what she wants from me.

I'm half tendant to think she's town because of her weirdness this game but also I'm moderately sure that one of Alison/Mac/Kami is wolf so.

kami flipped town... I'm town... where you going with this now?

[MacDougall]

iaafr is way more obviously town than LC

mmmm this is a good read for the point of the game and a good sized dose of wake up le town

[EnderWiggin]

So I'm gonna make a formation of players.

In this corner of "No posts" I'll put 112.

In this corner we have the "I have a scumread and want to vote but they also need to do more and maybe I'm jumping the gun." duo of Luckbox and Kami.

Over here we have the "Pure unboxed town" of Esooa and LC.

Then we have the "Maybe towny but I also like have black spots" of Mac and iaafr.

Then there's the "I'm voting here for now" of Alison.

Good.

Sorted the game.

pure unboxed duo is such because suspecting those two players in particular is a massive chore and it's easier to just not to

suspect Alison who is actively pushing him is easy work and keeps him busy

The funniest part is that Esooa is in my wolf pool now. Oh how the tables have turned.

[MacDougall]

[VOTE: Alison] aubergine

we really do play a very similar game lol

[EnderWiggin]

I'm also ignoring Kami because she's going to get stuck in her "I am right" for now and I got no clue what she wants from me.

I'm half tendant to think she's town because of her weirdness this game but also I'm moderately sure that one of Alison/Mac/Kami is wolf so.

kami flipped town... I'm town... where you going with this now?

The "I was maybe wrong" pit.

[MacDougall]

I think Kami is a wolf now.

Ender's re-entrance has been yuck. His strongest read is that I am scum for pushing him for bad reasons on page 1.

Doubling down on pushing me*

Also no, my strongest read is LC town.

LC has done nothing townie.

Except for play into his town meta, that is.

I believe ender to be unaligned with Alison and Lime Coke

[MacDougall]

hi luckbox what do you think of alisons current read of kami

You should know that I've read like 10% of the posts this game and have no idea what Alison's current read of Kami is-- and for me to have an opinion on this I would need to have an opinion on Kami myself-- which I do not

wolfy question imo

Try backreading before responding instead of snarking.

That's a fine question tbh.

You're right.

Just not sure if I'm actually ready for that unfortunately....but I think Kami is exactly the sort of person that Alison would find wolfy as a default-- since Kami's playstyle isn't exactly "pro village" in a vacuum and Alison can be super level 0 about that sort of stuff

I'll go actually look though and see what she's saying

quite an insightful read

[MacDougall]

I think Kami is a wolf now.

Ender's re-entrance has been yuck. His strongest read is that I am scum for pushing him for bad reasons on page 1.

why do you think kami is a wolf

I think the whole "I refuse to solve anyone except Ender" stuff is scummy. I think the continual refusal to acknowledge *anyone's* actions as townie is scummy.

Yeah I think this is basically both of their metas perfectly. Kami seems like Kami (assuming this is true which there is no reason to doubt) and Alison's reaction is v! Alison.

not the stance I would expect scum luckbox to take in the circumstances

[MacDougall]

have you ever seen her play wolf? do you not fear that shes the type to project that energy as both alignments?

truth be told im sort of resisting the urge to read that post as you TMIing kami town but its tough

probably iaafr's worst post to date

[MacDougall]

iaafr i think ur tming

kami got the same vibe that I did from that post

[MacDougall]

TMI reads early are rarely accurate ngl.

It's something I've actually been cutting from my scumhunting until some flips have been had.

ender seeing an opportunity to become the voice of reason

[MacDougall]

ender is also in commentary mode
outted wolf

dang I really could have prevented this chop ... vibing with Kami a lot

[iaafr]

ok sure I'll go ender first

[EnderWiggin]

I'm honestly debating if it's even worth the effort trying to stop Mac confbiasing himself onto killing me when I'm town.

[MacDougall]

ok

[VOTE: Kami] aubergine

Something something poll vote

But I'm willing to give this a shake.

[VOTE: Kami] aubergine

annoying

[iaafr]

changed my mind

[MacDougall]

I'm honestly debating if it's even worth the effort trying to stop Mac confbiasing himself onto killing me when I'm town.

it is worth the effort if you are town

I will be fair if you make valid arguments, avoid ate and avoid insulting me

[MacDougall]

actually you don't have to answer immediately if you don't want to

in any case my current wolfreads are Alison and luckbox, Alison because I find her turn on kami a bit unnatural and possibly opportunistic (not strong wolfread) and luckbox because of entrance, constantly highlighting lack of being caught up, and the articulation of the kami/Alison thing.

both very tentative

hmmm not vibes...

[MacDougall]

[VOTE: Alison] aubergine

I'mma be back later otherwise I'm going to cross out of snark territory.

ender voting Alison after iaafr outed a scumread on her reads opportunistic

[Alison]

probably we should just kill luckbox ender and wilgy and call it a game tbh

That is Esooa's exact POE and also my exact POE.

All three of us can't be wolves so it's probably just correct.

I am torn because I kinda feel like we are griefing if Esooa is scum and we ignore Kami's last wishes though.

But if Esooa/Mac/Alison all converge on the same POE separately there's a lot of sense in just following it.

[MacDougall]

Right.

Kami's argument process is "You're outed" on repeat I see.

Good talk.

Esooa voting Kami is interesting because Esooa pretty much taught me how to read Kami when I found Kami confusing and enigmatic

but this is exactly how Kami plays, fwiw

@Luckbox Inc had you backread enough to have seen esooa claim to not being able to read kami prior to making this post?

[MacDougall]

probably we should just kill luckbox ender and wilgy and call it a game tbh

That is Esooa's exact POE and also my exact POE.

All three of us can't be wolves so it's probably just correct.

I am torn because I kinda feel like we are griefing if Esooa is scum and we ignore Kami's last wishes though.

But if Esooa/Mac/Alison all converge on the same POE separately there's a lot of sense in just following it.

let me finish catch up first my reads have marginally shifted

[EnderWiggin]

I'm honestly debating if it's even worth the effort trying to stop Mac confbiasing himself onto killing me when I'm town.

it is worth the effort if you are town

I will be fair if you make valid arguments, avoid ate and avoid insulting me

It's more a "I have a headache and the log4j issue + other things means work is busy" which makes me low energy.

But I'll try to write up my change on Esooa and my current worldview.

Later though. I'm delirious from painkillers so my writeup would be bad.

[MacDougall]

The irritating thing is this is probably towny of Kami.

Mostly because I don't remember getting this annoyed at her in either of the wolf games she played when I've been in the game.

enders towniest moment to date

[EnderWiggin]

[VOTE: Alison] aubergine

I'mma be back later otherwise I'm going to cross out of snark territory.

ender voting Alison after iaafr outed a scumread on her reads opportunistic

You realise that I WAS voting Alison first.

Then I voted Kami out of annoyance.

Then I swapped BACK to Alison after I realised that I was letting my irritation take over?

[MacDougall]

I'm honestly debating if it's even worth the effort trying to stop Mac confbiasing himself onto killing me when I'm town.

it is worth the effort if you are town

I will be fair if you make valid arguments, avoid ate and avoid insulting me

It's more a "I have a headache and the log4j issue + other things means work is busy" which makes me low energy.

But I'll try to write up my change on Esooa and my current worldview.

Later though. I'm delirious from painkillers so my writeup would be bad.

you aren't dying tonight and I very well could so there's no rush on trying to get me on your side

[MacDougall]

[VOTE: Alison] aubergine

I'mma be back later otherwise I'm going to cross out of snark territory.

ender voting Alison after iaafr outed a scumread on her reads opportunistic

You realise that I WAS voting Alison first.

Then I voted Kami out of annoyance.

Then I swapped BACK to Alison after I realised that I was letting my irritation take over?

I don't see how that's relevant to the specific point I made re. the timing being immediately after iiafr outed a scumread on Alison.

[MacDougall]

Iaafr can I get a general tierlist? I've seen your towncore and a few other thoughts but would appreciate a confidence-ordered list

particularly given this post implies you were quite conscious of his reads

[EnderWiggin]

probably we should just kill luckbox ender and wilgy and call it a game tbh

That is Esooa's exact POE and also my exact POE.

All three of us can't be wolves so it's probably just correct.

I am torn because I kinda feel like we are griefing if Esooa is scum and we ignore Kami's last wishes though.

But if Esooa/Mac/Alison all converge on the same POE separately there's a lot of sense in just following it.

I'm pretty sure this is a losing POE Lmao.

[Esooa]

probably we should just kill luckbox ender and wilgy and call it a game tbh

That is Esooa's exact POE and also my exact POE.

All three of us can't be wolves so it's probably just correct.

I am torn because I kinda feel like we are griefing if Esooa is scum and we ignore Kami's last wishes though.

But if Esooa/Mac/Alison all converge on the same POE separately there's a lot of sense in just following it.

well you're also greifing if you kill me because the day 1 wolf read me for not having enough words in my first posts as town

[EnderWiggin]

[VOTE: Alison] aubergine

I'mma be back later otherwise I'm going to cross out of snark territory.

ender voting Alison after iaafr outed a scumread on her reads opportunistic

You realise that I WAS voting Alison first.

Then I voted Kami out of annoyance.

Then I swapped BACK to Alison after I realised that I was letting my irritation take over?

I don't see how that's relevant to the specific point I made re. the timing being immediately after iiafr outed a scumread on Alison.

The scumread was immaterial to the vote but I guess it can look like it is so meh.

[MacDougall]

If Kami is scum Ender is her most likely partner.

If Kami is town you should definitely dunk on Ender for being her top scumread that's trying to kill her.

Ender's sole sus list is people who sus him.

Vote Ender out.

this kami/ender w/w read is wild... what were you thinking here?